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Reuters: Michael Jackson Fans Says Film Covers Up Grim Truth

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bouee said:
I understand the TINI fans and their concerns, although sometimes it seems to me that things go too far. But they raise interesting issues.
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You mean it would go as far as to bring out the TRUTH.
I think so, you agree TINI raise interesting questions. That's the success.
 
AmberR said:
Yes I'm denying that..his weight was reported selectively.

His 136 pounds were in the acceptable range for a 5-foot-9 man.

'They' didn't want to tell that he weighed more than 136 (obviously would've been a lie) and not below 136 (it would go below healthy range)

Doctor said ...but he wasn't the sickly skeleton of a man portrayed by tabloids

So that report was LEAKED to tell that "HE WAS HEALTHY" based on his weight ONLY and that weight was fabricated with WORDINGS.
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You can not just choose to select certain things to believe from the autopsy report just because they corroborate with what you are saying, and then say that certain things are lies because they go against your beliefs. You are so consumed by consipracy theories and gossip, you are blinding yourself to the facts that are right in front of your face.
 
xXMJJXx said:
you know maybe there is some truth to what these fans are saying but they weren't with him 24/7 they only saw him a few hours a day they don't know the whole story
I don't understand why there doing this I mean what do they want to accomplish?
Murray is the one who killed Micheal why aren't ppl mad at him? why are they so mad at AEG and Sony what could they have done?and how do these fans know that they didn't try to help out?
here is what these fans are doing right now:
*there scaring ppl and making them feel guilty by watching the movie
*there avoiding very important questions
*there calling fans who believe the official report blind and stupid
*there spreading hate without any proof to there claims
*there making them selfs and other MJ fans look ignorant and crazy
*they are only hurting MJ's legacy and thats the only thing I'm sure they will accomplish
*they are focusing on the wrong ppl Murray is the one that killed Micheal and fans should fight to make that well known and that Micheal was not a hopeless drug addict
*they snap at every person who disagrees with them and use weird tactics to get there message out
I believe that Micheal was healthy I'm not blind nor am I in denial and no one has the right to accuse me of that yes maybe Micheal was tired and yes maybe he was a little underweight but overall he was healthy and Murray's stupidity is the coz of his death
no one pointed a gun to Micheal's head and told him not to eat he was a 50yr old man
and he also didn't eat in other tours and lost a lot of weight before that didn't kill him
this is my opinion about the subject and it will not change till I see medical or official proof to there claims
I'm out of here.
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You have not read TINI fans testimonies and their press release.
They have got answers to ALL OF YOUR QUESTIONS.

Also you should read every single posts that support TINI campaign.
You will have a good idea about the campaign, who these follower fans, why they are doing this campaign...etc.
 
AmberR said:
You mean it would go as far as to bring out the TRUTH.
I think so, you agree TINI raise interesting questions. That's the success.
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Yes they raise interesting questions. It goes too far, in my opinion, when certain people start accusing NOW. We don't know enough to make accusations now.

As someone posted earlier, if things were that simple, Dr Murray would have been arrested already.
 
^^^^I wasn't talking about your conspiracy theory, and I told what written in the autopsy report and also in that article it is written the reason behind the autopsy report.
If you want to keep your head in the sand...you are welcome to do so.
 
AmberR said:
^^^^I wasn't talking about your conspiracy theory, and I told what written in the autopsy report and also in that article it is written the reason behind the autopsy report.
If you want to keep your head in the sand...you are welcome to do so.
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My head is not in the sand. I am just going by the FACTS instead of selectively ignoring them like you are to support your theories. MJ's weight was healthy. And he does not look ill or frail in footage I've seen from This Is It.
 
Here comes all the negativity again. They can’t handle the positivity from Kenny’s recent interviews.
 
Nonsense!

When will these people learn MJ's weight did not kill him? The freakin' drug did.
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When will people realise that is NOT what they are saying!

When something is wrong it is often visible on the outside. Something was OBVIOUSLY wrong, if not physically then mentally. How many people need propofol a HOSPITAL OPERATING ROOM ANAESTHETIC to help them 'sleep'?!!! Its NOT NORMAL. Stop pretending it is! Listen to any doctor who has commented on it.

EVERYONE in the public eye, presenters on tv, and objective fans who have seen the footage say that he looks VERY SKINNY. There is no denying that. These fans were there and saw it for themselves, they have nothing to gain by lying. What they are saying goes along with what the costume designers and make up artists say too.

Incase you didn't know - a drug was found in his system which is an APPITITE SUPPRESSANT. There are studies which show this drug is administered WITH PROPOFOL in order to keep blood pressure up. If he was being given propofol for 6 weeks like Murray said that can explain the weightloss.

OH and they heard Michael's concerns from HIS OWN MOUTH. Remember the thread from back in the day when someone came and told us that Michael was stressed out and nobody believed him, well, these follower fans say the same.

Just so you know, before you jump on me, I KNOW propofol killed him and not his weight.
 
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Nova said:
My head is not in the sand. I am just going by the FACTS instead of selectively ignoring them like you are to support your theories. MJ's weight was healthy. And he does not look ill or frail in footage I've seen from This Is It.
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We do not have the FACTS.... we have a supposed leaked autopsy report which hasn't been confirmed or denied. Until we see the official report we do not have the facts at our disposal. What we do have, is footage and photogrpahs of Michael showing that he was indeed, extremely thin. We also have testimonies from fans that saw Michael; hugged Michael. We also have corroboration from Karen Faye and Michael Bush that he was getting thinner & thinner. I don't for one minute believe Michael weighed 136lbs. I also don't belive he lost 2 inches in height since 2003. So, if those 2 'facts' are incorrect, how do we know the rest of the report is accurate?
 
bowen9999 said:
We do not have the FACTS.... we have a supposed leaked autopsy report which hasn't been confirmed or denied. Until we see the official report we do not have the facts at our disposal. What we do have, is footage and photogrpahs of Michael showing that he was indeed, extremely thin. We also have testimonies from fans that saw Michael; hugged Michael. We also have corroboration from Karen Faye and Michael Bush that he was getting thinner & thinner. I don't for one minute believe Michael weighed 136lbs. I also don't belive he lost 2 inches in height since 2003. So, if those 2 'facts' are incorrect, how do we know the rest of the report is accurate?
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You are assuming they are incorrect because you are determined that MJ could not have been healthy because he looked thin. Well the weight they have disclosed seems reasonable to me. It is thin for someone his height and age, but it is still healthy. It is the same weight as me and I am a skinny woman, so of course the same weight on a taller guy would look thin. But it's still healthy.
I do not see this sickly frail person you people are trying to shove in our faces in anything I've seen from This Is It. If Michael was that ill, he would not be able to dance like he does. He looks thin, yes. But he does not look at death's door as you people seem to be convinced of.
 
In the end the TINI people want the truth, they want justice for Michael.. how can anyone be against that?

They are getting off their butts and asking questions.

AGAIN, THEY ARE NOT SAYING HIS WEIGHT KILLED HIM SO YOU DON'T NEED TO CARRY ON DEBATING ABOUT THAT.

WHAT THEY ARE SAYING IS SOMETHING WAS WRONG AND HIS WEIGHT WAS A VISIBLE SIGN THAT SOMETHING WAS WRONG.

AND THEY ARE RIGHT, HE WAS BEING GIVEN PROPOFOL FOR 6 WEEKS AND THEN HE DIED.

THEY ARE SAYING THAT PEOPLE AROUND HIM MUST HAVE KNOWN SOMETHING WAS WRONG AND HIS DEATH COULD HAVE BEEN AVOIDED.
 
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We who support TINI team have chosen to stand by follower fans who saw Michael day and night, and spoke to him and cared for him many many years.

Some so called fans have chosen to support AEG who had forced Michael to rehearse, ignored even when they knew he wasn't eating or sleeping, and had hired a doctor that KILLED Michael.
 
Nova said:
You are assuming they are incorrect because you are determined that MJ could not have been healthy because he looked thin. Well the weight they have disclosed seems reasonable to me. It is thin for someone his height and age, but it is still healthy. It is the same weight as me and I am a skinny woman, so of course the same weight on a taller guy would look thin. But it's still healthy.
I do not see this sickly frail person you people are trying to shove in our faces in anything I've seen from This Is It. If Michael was that ill, he would not be able to dance like he does. He looks thin, yes. But he does not look at death's door as you people seem to be convinced of.
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"you people"? Nice!

Taking his weight out of the picture then, how do you explain Michael's height quoted in the leaked report? They said he was 5' 9... in 2003, he was measured by the police at 5' 11. No-one drops 2 inches in 6 years!
 
Are people forgetting that these people KNEW something was wrong BEFORE he died, they emailed each other and wrote him letters, then guess what - he died. They were right. It wasn't quite a big shock for them as it was for us, it confirmed their concerns.

I wish people would stop worrying about how this will affect his 'legacy' and instead be more concerned about the truth being outed of what lead to Michael being taken from his fans, family and his children. It doesn't begin and end with Murray's action on the 25th.
 
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I think the biggest problem was the doctor! Who knows what he was giving him during those weeks.
 
bowen9999 said:
"you people"? Nice!

Taking his weight out of the picture then, how do you explain Michael's height quoted in the leaked report? They said he was 5' 9... in 2003, he was measured by the police at 5' 11. No-one drops 2 inches in 6 years!
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People shrink as they get older due to bone mineral loss and compression of the cartilidge between the joints. This is especially evident in the discs between the vertebrae of the spine because they support a lot of our weight.
 
aliana101 said:
I think the biggest problem was the doctor! Who knows what he was giving him during those weeks.
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Doctor was on AEG's payroll. Michael didn't go to some rehearsals, he showed up late, Kenny Ortega asked Michael why can't you deliver that man who could deliver?????

Jackson family couldn't see Michael, AEG had Michael isolated and as hostage. Who should have taken him to hospital???????????

Did they do it????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

Did they postpone the concerts?????????????????????????????

Did they call the family?????????????????????????????????????
 
Ok Guys: First I wish we keep the respect on the thread and the discussion. Remember we all here love Michael and we may have diferent oppinions but we have to respect each other.
Also I want to say I will watch the movie several times and I am not 100% in any part of the discussion.
Now I have read all the thread and I have read all the testimonies of the fan followers.
I think there is a lot of miss conceptions from both parts.

* This girls dont win anything, and want nothing. If any they are getting a lot of attacks form other fans and some bad attention.

* This is not a boicot against This is It movie. In fact some of this girls will go and watch. Is not about doing something agains the movie. Is about the truth.

* They were not 24/7 with Michael they are just saying what they watch and they are asking for answers, that is all.

**THEY ARE NOT ACUSSING NO ONE OF MURDER, OR SAYING THER WAS A CONSPIRACY OR SAYING THAT SOMEONE ELSE IS RESPONSABLE FOR MICHAEL.

*Michael did tell them in person he was forced to do the 50 shows, not that he will not efford and try his best to do them, cause we all know that was his nature. But he wasnt happy about it either.

*They saw Michael getting thinner and they were consern about his health. They did try to do something. They talk with several ppl, including K. Faye, who told them not to do much cause it would be bad press for Michael.

*K. Faye has also talk about her conscern about Michael health before, so maybe is not all fake and there was a serious issue.

* I think is not about making bad press for Michael or for the movie or even AEG, is about what really happend.

I am not sure about the hole thing, but I am not close minded about it. Lets remember we are talking about lots of money here and you just have to hear Michael's Money song to know how it is in the showbiz.

For me is about Michael beeing threated like merchindise insted of a human, not like this havent happend before, right?

If this is truth and he was not as healthy as they say, this hole thing is about putting money before Michael and his well beeing.

I just my oppinion.

Remember to keep the respect ok? :)
 
Again and again.......being thin didn't kill Michael, and propofil killed him.
TINI team knows that the fans who support them are aware of that.

There is a difference between 'healthy' thin and 'sickly' thin.

As far as I have done research and others who agree and say Michael was thin and sick, we are aware what made Michael thin and weak, and what kind of illnesses he had been suffering from last few years.
 
AmberR said:
Those footage was edited and picked out of 135 hours of film which was taped over couple of months.

Let me ask the jury...would that man able to dance and sing for 2-3 hours consistently at 50 concerts??????????????????????????????????
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maybe not 50 shows i was just saying he wasnt that ill.....or he couldnt have done it or looked that happy at the end of the day or could he i'm not sure.. something was wrong though for him to have that drug..i think there's possible alot of factors involved...anyway whats done is done lets enjoy what he gave us!! awesome entertainment!!! he would want us to be happy..
 
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dangerously thin and without his wig and blitzed on anaesthetic – weeps directly into the camera for 35 minutes
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that is the stuff the tabloids waiting for ...
I think Michael would jump for joy there from where he can follow the activities of his TRUEST and most loyal fans.

*there scaring ppl and making them feel guilty by watching the movie
*there avoiding very important questions
*there calling fans who believe the official report blind and stupid
*there spreading hate without any proof to there claims
*there making them selfs and other MJ fans look ignorant and crazy
*they are only hurting MJ's legacy and thats the only thing I'm sure they will accomplish
*they are focusing on the wrong ppl Murray is the one that killed Micheal and fans should fight to make that well known and that Micheal was not a hopeless drug addict
*they snap at every person who disagrees with them and use weird tactics to get there message out


Propofol and a negligent doctor who didn't monitor him properly killed Michael. And that could have happened EVEN if Michael was 200 pounds and the picture of health. Pump propofol AND benzos into anyone improperly and without proper monitoring and resusitation and they will die. Healthy, sick, fat, skinny, drug addicted or clean. Whether Michael was 108 pounds, 136 pounds or 160 pounds, if he stopped breathing and no one was around to assist him, he could not survive. Point blank.
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THANK YOU!

I have decided for myself to avoid in the next days, until I've seen the movie, this forum and boards where I have to endure furthermore claims which are bording on insults for those fans, like me, who want to see the movie.
 
*there scaring ppl and making them feel guilty by watching the movie
*there avoiding very important questions
*there calling fans who believe the official report blind and stupid
*there spreading hate without any proof to there claims
*there making them selfs and other MJ fans look ignorant and crazy
*they are only hurting MJ's legacy and thats the only thing I'm sure they will accomplish
*they are focusing on the wrong ppl Murray is the one that killed Micheal and fans should fight to make that well known and that Micheal was not a hopeless drug addict
*they snap at every person who disagrees with them and use weird tactics to get there message out
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WRONG.

there is a lot of miss conceptions from both parts.

* This girls dont win anything, and want nothing. If any they are getting a lot of attacks form other fans and some bad attention.

* This is not a boicot against This is It movie. In fact some of this girls will go and watch. Is not about doing something agains the movie. Is about the truth.

* They were not 24/7 with Michael they are just saying what they watch and they are asking for answers, that is all.

**THEY ARE NOT ACUSSING NO ONE OF MURDER, OR SAYING THER WAS A CONSPIRACY OR SAYING THAT SOMEONE ELSE IS RESPONSABLE FOR MICHAEL.

*Michael did tell them in person he was forced to do the 50 shows, not that he will not efford and try his best to do them, cause we all know that was his nature. But he wasnt happy about it either.

*They saw Michael getting thinner and they were consern about his health. They did try to do something. They talk with several ppl, including K. Faye, who told them not to do much cause it would be bad press for Michael.

*K. Faye has also talk about her conscern about Michael health before, so maybe is not all fake and there was a serious issue.

* I think is not about making bad press for Michael or for the movie or even AEG, it is about what really happend.
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RIGHT.

Oh and if you care more about feeling guilty about seeing the film than about what lead to Michael's death what does that say.
 
By the way my opinion on This Is Not It and follower fans: I can understand where they are coming from, and we can't jump to criticism, as many have said on this thread - we were not there. Unfortunately we were not with him in those final days. On the other hand when we are deeply hurt and grieving it is easy to lash out at those we think are responsible, it is easy to be angry and to be blinded by anger. I am not saying they are worng, because I am not an ignorant person and I have always and will always keep an open mind to these issues. I do think that his weight loss may have been associated with the actions of Dr Murray - as mentioned earlier what if Murray hadn't adjusted the dosage due to lack of consideration of his proper weight and like another said - stress and losing weight from pressures and stress can lead to wanting anasthetic in the first place. It is important to keep an open mind and to not focus too closely on one aspects. Yes I agree the properful was the primary cause but I believe there may have been many factors leading to Michael taking propfol in the first place.
 
bowen9999 said:
"you people"? Nice!

Taking his weight out of the picture then, how do you explain Michael's height quoted in the leaked report? They said he was 5' 9... in 2003, he was measured by the police at 5' 11. No-one drops 2 inches in 6 years!
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Oh please... he NEVER was 5' 11"... he was measured with his boots on.

Michael was about 5' 9 1/2"... so the 5' 9" height at the time of his death seems totally correct.
 
Rockin. said:
, I KNOW propofol killed him and not his weight.
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Exactly!
Skinniness does not kill a person,
Neither does perfectionism and being overworked!
Your body tell will you to stop! Ouch! that's hurts! Pain!
And that’s how you stop. Period!

This is what detractor’s of the King of Pop Michael Jackson
want you to play into their hands.
Create a stir,
fragment the consolidation and unity of fans,
cause factions (TINI),
that’s how they weaken the fan base.
If TINI wants the truth, lobby LAPD to prosecute Conrad Murray without dragging their feet.
Tear the transcripts apart OR attend the freaking trial!
 
m26uk said:
maybe not 50 shows i was just saying he wasnt that ill.....or he couldnt have done it or looked that happy at the end of the day or could he i'm not sure.. something was wrong though for him to have that drug..i think there's possible alot of factors involved...anyway whats done is done lets enjoy what he gave us!! awesome entertainment!!! he would want us to be happy..
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Thank you :)
Why didn't AEG cancel the concerts or postpone the concerts????

Why didn't they hospitalize Michael???

Michael only had his children with him and others are 'staff' paid by AEG and he lived in mansion AEG rented for him which was guarded by AEG's security guards and Michael was guarded by AEG's security guards.

So AEG should've cared about Michael.

That is what the campaign about.

Again, Michael never released any rehearsal films and he never wanted TII rehearsal footage to be seen by anyone...

Did Michael have any concert on DVD when he was alive except Dangerous concert which shown by HBO???????????

Why TII????

I would say Michael wouldn't have been happy about TII movie.

Again TINI not saying the fans not to watch the movie.
 
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