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To mods: Will the authenticity deniers continue to be allowed to disrupt all threads?

deano said:
As usual, a great, reasoned post from JMie.

I would also be happy to go to a corner, with all the 'positive' MJ fans, and not have to listen to the same comments from the 'FAKE!' 'fans' over and over again.

I wouldn't mind but it's so bloody repetative;

Posi fan 1 - "I love the new advert for the upcoming album!"

Negi fan - "Yes. But the vocals are 'FAKE!"

Posi fan 2 - "I love the advert as well, the way the new album cover comes alive!"

Negi fan - "Yes, But the voclas are 'FAKE'!"

Posi fan 3 - "I hope we get to see the advert in our country!"

Negi fan - "But the vocals are FAKE!"


The problem is, this is a forum to discuss an artist and his latest album. Once you have said "It is fake and I'm not going to buy it", what else is there for you to contribute? Nothing! Just repeating the same thing, but in a slightly different way each time, adds absolutely nothing to a discussion.

Surely if you are not going to buy the album, you go to the threads regarding the album, you say "I'm not buying it because it's fake!", and then off you go? Why keep coming back to repeat the same thing?

Leave the rest of us to discuss the 'detail' of what you have decided not to buy.
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THANK YOU!!! I'd love the same thing, because all of this negativity is getting me down, and seeing fans be cruel to each other because they don't agree about the Cascio tracks is despicable. I just want to go to a place where I can discuss what I love about "Breaking News" and "Monster", 'cause I've got a lot of good things to say about those songs!!!
 
We cant quess what Michael would want or not want at this point. I suppose if the music makes
people happy Michael will love it. MJ did have a part in creating the music regardless if SOME fans
think he is not singing 100% on 3 tracks. He very well may be. Regardless his heart is in there when
he originaly started working on them.

The album is going out regardless so I feel fans should support it for the songs that
they all agree are Michael on it. Myself I think all songs are Michael now and so
goes the argument back and forth. a never ending loop causing hurt and division

Let the world hear the music and see what happens
its NOT going to harm Michael's Legacy or anyone _

The music will inspire people to unite and love.
even the songs some fans feel are not 100% Michael
what is Michael in them will bring abou the desired results
Michael would love _

fans hating on sony or the family or the estate is not
going to help anything regarding this album or bring any
love into this situation for Michael for the fans or anyone
That just how I see it

We all need to back off and allow the MUSIC to speak now
for itself _ All we know for sure MJ wants the world to unite in
love so if the MUSIC can do that _Its served its pupose regardless
of 3 questionable track _ I hope im make sense

“Many people have been asking me about this whole thing for a few days now and very passionately
I might add. Although I was there with MJ during his final days, I can't say for sure if this song is MJ or not.
I do know that MJ always wanted his music represented in the highest light possible. The truth is there is no
way for any of us to know unless we were there when it was created.

I think the higher truth should be: how does the song make you feel when you listen to it? If you feel
love after you listen to it, then there is value to it. If you don't feel love, never listen to it again.

We all miss MJ but we should try to hold dear the principals he tried to portray in his music.
Embrace what is good, embrace love.”

Michael Bearden
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wolfrevenant said:
I'm thinking that maybe there should be 3 sub-forums for the album. One for the supporters to discuss in bliss, one for the non-supporters to discuss about authenticity, and one for debate between the two sides. That way, the community isn't exactly 100% divided. I mean, they can debate/discuss anytime the two sides want to.

Though, I get the feeling the debate section will be the most popular, and may quite possibly be the most heated. But at least, there shouldn't be anymore concerns over the hijacking of threads.
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JMie said:
I am a peaceful person. And I don't want to argue with people. When I come to this board, I am not looking for an argument. I am looking for a civil and friendly discussion with people who are supposed to be one big global MJ fan family. I have enough arguments outside the fandom, I don't need it here, especially since for me as a fan the blissfully happy time was over when Michael passed and there are very few chances for joy now. This album for me is one of these few chances. I know I won't be able to enjoy it like I enjoyed HIStory, or BOTD, or Invincible, but whatever amount of joy I can get out of this, I want. And it's being ruined every day :(
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I agree. I'm at the point now where I'm seriously thinking about leaving the board forever because of all the negativity going on. I am almost afraid to come here every day. And it shouldn't be like that. I never have argued with anyone here as I tend to stay out of heated discussions. But to see what's happening is making me not want to be here at all.
 
Well instead of people working together, and they are going to be separated, why stop at the album? Let's make a separate forum for those who love the family verses those who hate them and one in between for people to argue it out?

Also, one for people love his music but hate certain aspects in his life and one for people who think he was saintly and one for the inbetweens?

Also for the trial we are going to need a forum for those who think Sony did it versus Murray made a mistake.


Why have one MJ board at all. He was so controversial and was so mulifaceted, it is impossible to fans to be mature and learn to live and let live so why not coddle them and put them in so many facets that we end up with the "I love MJ Pre Invinceable with Lisa When he had Curls and was away from his family and I don't like "Michael" but I think Murray was working with Sony Forum.


I mean when is it going to end? The solution for everything is not to just split it up.
 
ginvid said:
I love MJ Pre Invinceable with Lisa When he had Curls and was away from his family and I don't like "Michael" but I think Murray was working with Sony Forum.
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I demand to have this forum instated right now.
 
I agree with you all!
I'm very bittered with the current circumstances and because I can sense that things will get worse once the album is released, I think I may not post so frequently!
 
The solution is to be respectful of opinions. I've seen posters from both sides who debate topics by sticking to points. And that is what should be allowed. The boards are half and half on this issue. I could see if a large majority was on one side or the other - but not with the current votes.
 
You can't do that i'm afraid. It's called blocking freedom of speach and by creating sub forums you would essentially be blocking opinions out of the original threads and blocking freedom of speech. People have there right to express there opinions and you shouldn't be feeling down about it unless they are doing so in a hateful way. Most are just expressing concern about the way this whole thing is being handled.
 
oh god

honestly I'm not a big fan of the idea of sub forum(s) as I think that we should be able to discuss how we feel (and I'm quite active in doing that and I have no problems with opposing ideas as long as they are respectful).

I think personally we should come up with a more detailed thread cleaning policy for the new album threads such as

- delete any post that simply says "this song is fake/real" without any other explanation of opinions
- if multiple posts from the same person repeats the same thing over and over again (without adding anything new to the discussion) keep one and delete the rest
- delete any post in full that introduces any "real/ better/longer" fans argument in anyway
 
ginvid said:
Well instead of people working together, and they are going to be separated, why stop at the album? Let's make a separate forum for those who love the family verses those who hate them and one in between for people to argue it out?

Also, one for people love his music but hate certain aspects in his life and one for people who think he was saintly and one for the inbetweens?

Also for the trial we are going to need a forum for those who think Sony did it versus Murray made a mistake.


Why have one MJ board at all. He was so controversial and was so mulifaceted, it is impossible to fans to be mature and learn to live and let live so why not coddle them and put them in so many facets that we end up with the "I love MJ Pre Invinceable with Lisa When he had Curls and was away from his family and I don't like "Michael" but I think Murray was working with Sony Forum.


I mean when is it going to end? The solution for everything is not to just split it up.
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In that case, we're going to have to instill in ourselves some bit of tolerance and respect. No more of this name-calling, belittling, sarcastic and smart ass remarks.

Deleting posts is very easy, but it won't solve the main problem, which I feel is the conduct of the posters.
 
ivy said:
oh god

honestly I'm not a big fan of the idea of sub forum(s) as I think that we should be able to discuss how we feel (and I'm quite active in doing that and I have no problems with opposing ideas as long as they are respectful).

I think personally we should come up with a more detailed thread cleaning policy for the new album threads such as

- delete any post that simply says "this song is fake/real" without any other explanation of opinions
- if multiple posts from the same person repeats the same thing over and over again (without adding anything new to the discussion) keep one and delete the rest
- delete any post in full that introduces any "real/ better/longer" fans argument in anyway
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Yes, especially the last point. Questioning people's fan status is a pretty low and cheap trick that some people are using. Sure it's ok to think that, but to say it to others can be very offensive and we don't want new fans to be put off thinking Michael's fans are bitter in any way. MJ's death is still playing on a lot of our minds, we are still getting used to how it's gonna be from now on.
 
ivy said:
oh god

honestly I'm not a big fan of the idea of sub forum(s) as I think that we should be able to discuss how we feel (and I'm quite active in doing that and I have no problems with opposing ideas as long as they are respectful).

I think personally we should come up with a more detailed thread cleaning policy for the new album threads such as

- delete any post that simply says "this song is fake/real" without any other explanation of opinions
- if multiple posts from the same person repeats the same thing over and over again (without adding anything new to the discussion) keep one and delete the rest
- delete any post in full that introduces any "real/ better/longer" fans argument in anyway
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I agree Ivy. I think it has to be a matter of what can we do to promote a better feeling amongst fans and what can we do to moderate more effectively, as opposed to just separating the forum. Maybe that is something staff can discuss further after getting some ideas from this thread.
 
imho, thread like this one and the idea of categorizing fans into groups are more hurtful than discussions on songs in the album.

why can't people just agree to disagree? why it is not okay for people to voice their concerns? why every fan has to be excited about the new album?

face it, fans who support the tracks said something very hurtful as well. some fans are accusing people who are not buying the album ruining Michael's legacy or being hateful, which is totally not true.

it just shows how some here cannot tolerate different opinions.

this is a forum, a place where people have discussions. one cannot expect everyone to share the same point of view. one cannot ask everyone to be "friendly" all the time. a discussion cannot avoid to get "heated", but as long as nobody said something disrespectuful or engage in personal attack, the discussion should be allowed to carry on.

based on my observation thus far, the people who don't support the album are not hateful or disrespecful. some are able to elaborate their points eloquently in a civilzied manner.

if you really don't find any pleasure coming here to read fan posts, then take a break, buy the album and enjoy it.

gaz and his team of staff have been doing a great job in maintaining a healthy discussion atmosphere, to ask them to separate this forum into subforums or enforce a higher degree of thread cleansing or monitoring doesn't sound right. are we looking for censorship?
 
There are both respectful and disrespectful members in both sides of the camp...so let's not pretend it's all coming from the doubters.

Secondly, and most importantly, we're all here because we're complete fanatics of Michael Jackson; a man who is now dead and who has no control over his legacy. The people who think the tracks are fake are actually trying to do something positive (the way we see it) with respect to his legacy. The real villain here is Sony who has done this.

I have no doubt that all the fights here stem from people who genuinely believe they're trying to do their best for MJ's legacy. So this labelling of 'haters' and so forth has got to stop. It IS possible to have a civilised discussion without resorting to namecalling.
 
I think instead of trying to come up with ways to divide us, we should try to come up with ways to unite us.

I remember after June 25, 2009 things were a bit hectic around here. But after a while things were back to normal. So that's why I believe this is only temporary.
 
Thanks everyone, including the staff that replied - I'm not in support of sub-forums, definitely. My opinion aligns closer to what ivy suggested.
 
If you don't want a sub-forum, fine, but can we at least have ONE topic, just ONE, where people excited about the new album can discuss it and the songs without any negative comments from doubters, or intrusions of "Fake!" or "You're stupid if you think it's real!". I'm sick of coming here and finding nothing but arguments, insults and negativity. This should be an exciting time for us, but whatever excitement people have is being ruined.
 
Really would not like to see the forum divided at all. We all have our own opiniions and are entitled to them provided we stick to the rules and are respectful of one another.
I am so looking forward to the new album and disregard comments from people who are being nagative, I don't get into a dispute with them, I just skip those posts and read the positive ones. Things will settle down I'm sure.
 
ivy said:
[highlight]- delete any post that simply says "this song is fake/real" without any other explanation of opinions[/highlight]
- if multiple posts from the same person repeats the same thing over and over again (without adding anything new to the discussion) keep one and delete the rest
- delete any post in full that introduces any "real/ better/longer" fans argument in anyway
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:clapping:
 
Everybody has the right to express themselves, so i think this thread is rubbish.
The whole album controversy will never be solved, you will always have non-believers and believers. Just the way it is.

And I think Sony=Phony!
 
Thanks for all your input guys and I agree its very frustrating. You have to remember that obviously we cant be here all the time and whilst we try and deal with as much disruption as we can obviously it is going to missed at times. Obviously we dont want to stifle anyone's opinion but yes there are issues with people randomly coming into threads just to cause trouble. So if anyone sees anything like that report it straight away and we'll deal with it as soon as we can

Thanks everyone.
 
Sophielo said:
Thanks for all your input guys and I agree its very frustrating. You have to remember that obviously we cant be here all the time and whilst we try and deal with as much disruption as we can obviously it is going to missed at times. Obviously we dont want to stifle anyone's opinion but yes there are issues with people randomly coming into threads just to cause trouble. So if anyone sees anything like that report it straight away and we'll deal with it as soon as we can

Thanks everyone.
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I agree with you. That's why I don't think it's a good idea to ask the mod to monitor the threads more frequently or moderate it more closely.

If we all have more self discipline, tolerate different opinions and respect others, this forum will still be a place for people to have open and enlightening discussion. Of course, sometimes, people wanna be startin' somethin', then we can always report the posts.

There is no reason for people to feel sad or unwelcomed.
 
I have just had to clean a couple of posts. That is part of the problem. Its not the different opinions at the end of the day its the lack of respect that is causing the friction. Disagreeing and having a discussion, no problem at all, but its when people will post those little digs at the end of their posts which cause the arguments. We simply wont tolerate it and it doesn't matter what side of the fence you're in, the respect here needs to be addressed. Think before you post, don't deliberatly make a dig at someone. If we see it its being deleted.
 
The King lives on! said:
Everybody has the right to express themselves, so i think this thread is rubbish.
The whole album controversy will never be solved, you will always have non-believers and believers. Just the way it is.

And I think Sony=Phony!
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This to me is part of what the problem is. Why would you put that totally off topic comment this thread? This is the kind of thing that ticks me off. It's like some of you people have no self control. Do we really need stuff like that in this thread? It's not like you don't have a place to write this stuff, expressing how you feel in numerous threads. And I mean numerous ones. But that is not enough for you. You have to bring it in every thread on this forum. It is childish and it needs to stop.

This is your warning. Post the right stuff in the right thread. And yes, I am slamming down on my keyboard as I write this just so you know how tired of this I am.
 
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It's a forum. Nobody is forcing anybody to go on rants.

Censorship ain't cool, but neither is repeated provocation.

I like Ivy's idea. It's more like an attempt to keep things on topic.

There are plenty of threads to chose from.

And sometimes, yes, just sit on your fingers. Conserve the energy, some people disrupt on purpose and not just in the album debate. There's also an ignore function that will come in handy when you notice that somebody in particular is ALWAYS taking "offense" with just about anything you say, even if you didn't address them at all.
 
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MusicMan26 said:
I think instead of trying to come up with ways to divide us, we should try to come up with ways to unite us.

I remember after June 25, 2009 things were a bit hectic around here. But after a while things were back to normal. So that's why I believe this is only temporary.
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:clapping::clapping::clapping:
 
I wonder how far it will go? Sub forum for different opinions? Hmmmmm …. What’s next? That way I wish “believers” would never enter or create disrespectful threads addressed to the fans with different opinions. The policy is always been agree/and disagree. Did it change already?
 
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