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Re: One of those Vent Threads

oldmoon20 said:
Why does everyone hate DB so much? I heard she asked for money back because he didn't pay her but that's nothing compared to what LMP did.
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I don't get it either. I like Debbie. Loved what she told the paparazzi.
 
She gave Michael children than she let him have them and raise them. She took him to court for some money I think that's what people say but I don't get it! Why do people hate DR and bash her when she's the one who gave Michael his children and let him have them and never bashed him when yet LMP doesn't give him children even though she promised him and bashes him over and over again but yet some people act like she did nothing wrong.
Please tell me why this is. Again I'm not going to argue with people and I don't want people getting their feelings hurt but I want to know this stuff, I don't want to just go with the crowd and be la de da on my way. Tell me this stuff you know. Please, I want to know.
 
I will respectfully give my opinion. We can all agree to disagree and leave it at that.
I will start by saying that I am a huge MJ fan and will be till it's my turn to go.
-- I agree that NO ONE will ever know ALL that happened between MJ and LMP, ONLY they know. And it is really none of our business to know every single detail of his life. He gave us his gift of music and dance and gave it all freely with love in his heart. MJ TRULY LOVES HIS FANS, on that I think it is safe to assume that we will agree. Don't you think we as fans can give him the space he so deserves to have a little corner of his life not be disected?
--If what I have read is to be believed, that he never got over LMP, well then that tells me that she touched his heart in a way that no other woman had ever done. Further proof of that is that he never (to our knowledge) found that kind of connection with another woman. (I really wish he had). Yes, he may have dated, but nothing close to what he had with LMP. People forget that after the divorce and after the bashing, they continued to see each other, they still loved each other and appears that they were trying to make it work. It is said that she later realized how much she loved MJ & offered to have his children, but MJ's heart had closed by then. So maybe they both did a little bit of heart breaking. Sometimes life throws curves our way that are insurmountable, even for celebrities (go figure). I am sure many of us can relate to being in a relationship where we did not make the best choices, or in a state of hurt and pain, lashed out to the one we claimed to love. She is not perfect, none of us are. LMP and MJ are no different.
-- I do know this, that if MJ were right here participating in this conversation, he would not be allowing any of us to bad mouth LMP, because that is just who MJ is.
-- Plus only MJ & LMP know what they each contributed towards not being able to make it work, because it was not for lack of passion or love. Maybe stubborness, immaturity, we will never know. Her pain to me felt genuine since 6/25. We as fans proclaim to be in pain and hurt for him and I'm sure that none of us have even ever met or let alone been as close and intimate with him as LMP. So please don't bash her, because we don't know what happened between them.
I for one, will respect and honor him by not disecting or questioning how or why he loved her so deeply and why she was the only woman that ever touched him so profoundly.
It is our turn to give back to MJ. Stop disecting and hating. His message has always been one of love and unity. His journey in life is not determined by us.
-- My prayer is that MJ found true love again, and none of us ever knew about it. Imagine that !
-- He deserves that and more, he gave all he had to give, now it is our turn to give back.

Peace, love and positive energy to all who read this.

L.O.V.E. LIVES FOREVER.

Whatever happens, don't let go of my hand.
 
Maybe in her, he found that unconditional love. She wasn't with him for his money or fame, she had that on her own. She did not need him for financial reasons, he was not a commodity to her. Think about all of the people in his life, they have all wanted something from him. She never asked him for a dime. And in her he found someone that truly wanted to help him get through his difficult time with pain medication, she convinced him to go into rehab in 93. I believe her intentions were pure and out of love, but life took it's twist and turns, it is really sad.
 
mjlmpicons said:
Maybe in her, he found that unconditional love. She wasn't with him for his money or fame, she had that on her own. She did not need him for financial reasons, he was not a commodity to her. Think about all of the people in his life, they have all wanted something from him. She never asked him for a dime. And in her he found someone that truly wanted to help him get through his difficult time with pain medication, she convinced him to go into rehab in 93. I believe her intentions were pure and out of love, but life took it's twist and turns, it is really sad.
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Thank you for that post.
Though I'm still confused on why if she loved him so much why did she lie about giving him children?
I'm also still confused on if they ever made up after all that happened.
 
It is sad that they couldnt work things out though.
 
From what I have read, (and who knows if this is true, right) they had a very active intimate relationship and they both thought that she would be pregnant in no time, when she did not become pregnant right away, MJ became frustrated & could not understand why she wasn't pregnant yet. At this same time, MJ would disappear for weeks at a time and LMP could not find him. Resentment set it, then she felt that if he was not going to be present in the marriage, then how could she bring a child into a relationship with those issues. (Again, this is what has been written about their relationship, but only they know for sure).
- I do remember an article LMP gave after having her twins with her current husband, where she said she had a very hard time getting pregnant because it was discovered that she had an issue with her blood being too thick. Once she was put on blood thinners, she instantly became pregnant and ultimately had her twins (they are 1 yr old now).
-- Oh for what could have been.
 
mjlmpicons said:
From what I have read, (and who knows if this is true, right) they had a very active intimate relationship and they both thought that she would be pregnant in no time, when she did not become pregnant right away, MJ became frustrated & could not understand why she wasn't pregnant yet. At this same time, MJ would disappear for weeks at a time and LMP could not find him. Resentment set it, then she felt that if he was not going to be present in the marriage, then how could she bring a child into a relationship with those issues. (Again, this is what has been written about their relationship, but only they know for sure).
- I do remember an article LMP gave after having her twins with her current husband, where she said she had a very hard time getting pregnant because it was discovered that she had an issue with her blood being too thick. Once she was put on blood thinners, she instantly became pregnant and ultimately had her twins (they are 1 yr old now).
-- Oh for what could have been.
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:bugeyed
OK some insight now.
So the whole thing about her not wanting children and taking the pills was wrong?
So MJ left her for a few weeks or months at a time because he was upset that she wasn't getting pregnant?
Wow.
Now if someone told me that earlier on than I wouldn't have such hard feelings towards LMP.
 
mjlmpicons said:
From what I have read, (and who knows if this is true, right) they had a very active intimate relationship and they both thought that she would be pregnant in no time, when she did not become pregnant right away, MJ became frustrated & could not understand why she wasn't pregnant yet. At this same time, MJ would disappear for weeks at a time and LMP could not find him. Resentment set it, then she felt that if he was not going to be present in the marriage, then how could she bring a child into a relationship with those issues. (Again, this is what has been written about their relationship, but only they know for sure).
- I do remember an article LMP gave after having her twins with her current husband, where she said she had a very hard time getting pregnant because it was discovered that she had an issue with her blood being too thick. Once she was put on blood thinners, she instantly became pregnant and ultimately had her twins (they are 1 yr old now).
-- Oh for what could have been.
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LMP and MJ were not meant to be. They were destined for failure without genuine love(Lisa) and honesty. She should have known problems were going to arise once MJ found out she deceived him.
 
oldmoon20 said:
:bugeyed
OK some insight now.
So the whole thing about her not wanting children and taking the pills was wrong?
So MJ left her for a few weeks or months at a time because he was upset that she wasn't getting pregnant?
Wow.
Now if someone told me that earlier on than I wouldn't have such hard feelings towards LMP.
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Oldmoon, there are a lot of rumors and speculations. But, LMP wasn't upfront with MJ from the start. How does a woman that claims she wants children change her mind becuz of circumstances and issues that arise if she really wants the marriage and loves her husband? No. Issues will come up, but couples work through them, Lisa made up her mind that she didn't want her marriage. She stated MJ was not ready for fatherhood and he needed a parent. Having these doubts, she began to regret being married and was not getting pregnant becuz she had serious reservations about Michael's maturity and judgement. I think Lisa had no intention of bringing children into a marriage with a man she really didn't love, and she was about to walk out on. It was just a matter of time for her.
 
@foreverinmyheart, I respect your opinion. My take from my view, just a fan, was that they did genuinely love each other, all you have to do is look at photos of them together. Their personal photographer (Dick Zimmerman) recently gave an interview where he said that he never questioned the love between MJ and LMP, he said you could see it, they were constantly gazing into each others eyes, giggling and just carrying on as if no one else was in the room, he said that the photos he took of them did not require for him to pose them, they naturally held each other and were always holding hands or in a loving embrace. He said the photos I took of them were all them, genuine. I am only drawing from what I have read from people that actually knew them and witnessed first hand their love for each other.

-but again, I was not there.
 
mjlmpicons said:
@foreverinmyheart, I respect your opinion. My take from my view, just a fan, was that they did genuinely love each other, all you have to do is look at photos of them together. Their personal photographer (Dick Zimmerman) recently gave an interview where he said that he never questioned the love between MJ and LMP, he said you could see it, they were constantly gazing into each others eyes, giggling and just carrying on as if no one else was in the room, he said that the photos he took of them did not require for him to pose them, they naturally held each other and were always holding hands or in a loving embrace. He said the photos I took of them were all them, genuine. I am only drawing from what I have read from people that actually knew them and witnessed first hand their love for each other.

-but again, I was not there.
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mjlmpicons, We all have our opinions, and I will respectfully disagree. I've seen many photos of them together, but I still believe, LMP never loved MJ. She proved that by lying to him throughout the marriage, she bashed him to the media, and when he was practically on his death bed, she had to be advised to go to visit him. Love isn't deceitful, abusive, or bitter. Those emotions are from hate.
 
@forevernmyheart, we can agree to disagree. I will humbly bow out of this conversation, because my intent is not to bash anyone, especially the fine members of this forum.

Have a wonderful evening, what's left of it. Sending positive thoughts and energy to all that read this post.

L.O.V.E. LASTS FOREVER

Whatever happens, don't let go of my hand. :)
 
forevernmyheart said:
Oldmoon, there are a lot of rumors and speculations. But, LMP wasn't upfront with MJ from the start. How does a woman that claims she wants children change her mind becuz of circumstances and issues that arise if she really wants the marriage and loves her husband? No. Issues will come up, but couples work through them, Lisa made up her mind that she didn't want her marriage. She stated MJ was not ready for fatherhood and he needed a parent. Having these doubts, she began to regret being married and was not getting pregnant becuz she had serious reservations about Michael's maturity and judgement. I think Lisa had no intention of bringing children into a marriage with a man she really didn't love, and she was about to walk out on. It was just a matter of time for her.
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Yeah I know there were rumors and speculations.
I'm just confused on what to believe and what not to believe. One of the main reasons why I started the thread.
 
She told Oprah, Diane Sawyer, Howard Stern etc that she loved him yet she implies that maybe Michael only married her to look good to the public after the first allegations came out. It was a convenient thing for him. She made him look very bad when he was fighting for his life during the trial when everybody was against him. They were divorced like 10 years at that point. Her excuse of being angry doesn't fly with me. After the divorce maybe but she was seeing him in concerts and being with him after the divorce for awhile. No bad feelings there.

It was when she was promoting her album and such that she badmouthed him. She jumped on the lets hate Michael bandwagon so she wouldn't look bad. She acted ashamed and embarassed she was married to him and basically let these people make Michael look like a freak. The marriage didn't work and if she had bad feelings she didn't have to do what she did. If she did really love him then it would not matter what people thought. She couldn't handle what people were saying about Michael, how he looked and was portrayed even though she spent time with him and new what the truth was. Now he dies and everyone is praising Michael and she acts like his widow who tried to save him but couldn't. They have been divorced for a really long time now and had very different lives.
 
marebear said:
She told Oprah, Diane Sawyer, Howard Stern etc that she loved him yet she implies that maybe Michael only married her to look good to the public after the first allegations came out. It was a convenient thing for him. She made him look very bad when he was fighting for his life during the trial when everybody was against him. They were divorced like 10 years at that point. Her excuse of being angry doesn't fly with me. After the divorce maybe but she was seeing him in concerts and being with him after the divorce for awhile. No bad feelings there.

It was when she was promoting her album and such that she badmouthed him. She jumped on the lets hate Michael bandwagon so she wouldn't look bad. She acted ashamed and embarassed she was married to him and basically let these people make Michael look like a freak. The marriage didn't work and if she had bad feelings she didn't have to do what she did. If she did really love him then it would not matter what people thought. She couldn't handle what people were saying about Michael, how he looked and was portrayed even though she spent time with him and new what the truth was. Now he dies and everyone is praising Michael and she acts like his widow who tried to save him but couldn't. They have been divorced for a really long time now and had very different lives.
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:clapping::clapping::clapping::clapping::clapping:
 
marebear said:
She told Oprah, Diane Sawyer, Howard Stern etc that she loved him yet she implies that maybe Michael only married her to look good to the public after the first allegations came out. It was a convenient thing for him. She made him look very bad when he was fighting for his life during the trial when everybody was against him. They were divorced like 10 years at that point. Her excuse of being angry doesn't fly with me. After the divorce maybe but she was seeing him in concerts and being with him after the divorce for awhile. No bad feelings there.

It was when she was promoting her album and such that she badmouthed him. She jumped on the lets hate Michael bandwagon so she wouldn't look bad. She acted ashamed and embarassed she was married to him and basically let these people make Michael look like a freak. The marriage didn't work and if she had bad feelings she didn't have to do what she did. If she did really love him then it would not matter what people thought. She couldn't handle what people were saying about Michael, how he looked and was portrayed even though she spent time with him and new what the truth was. Now he dies and everyone is praising Michael and she acts like his widow who tried to save him but couldn't. They have been divorced for a really long time now and had very different lives.
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Lisa is nothing but a manipulator. MJ was the perfect guy to assist her with her musical career. And, as for MJ he was ready for a marriage and family. They both had something to gain from being married. MJ ended up being duped. After the divorce, and she was prospering with the musical career, she joined the bandwagon with others and bashed her ex- the man that assisted her with the career, the one she claimed to "love" If she was a person with integrity, she would've never bad-mouthed MJ to the media out of respect for him and the marriage. She had no regard for the pain he would suffer from her betrayal; but she did it anyway.Now MJ is gone, and she's manipulating again, seeking sympathy from the fans and the press. :(
 
I don't know Lisa and I will never meet her but that is my real beef with her. Who cares what people thought. I hope she did love him because I would think it would be terrible if Michael married her with love and she didn't. But if she did then shs should have had the guts to say "yeah I loved him and there was nothing wrong with that". What she did was "yeah I loved him but I must have been insane or I don't know what I was thinking". Acting ashamed and embarassed just at the same time the charges came and the trial.

As Michael Jackson fans we have heard it all. We know that Michael was judged a lot. His looks, his actions and just anything. I have heard people say horrible things and yet anytime I heard his music wherever I was, whoever I was with I said how much I loved him and that song. I am just a fan and I never acted ashamed or embarassed and she was his wife. People would say "Michael is weird". I would say "no he isn't". I don't have a guilty conscience. Maybe she does and that is what we are seeing.

We don't know what really happened between them. I just know that Michael had the respect to not say anything about her because it was private. She didn't do that. She kicked him when he was down to make herself look good. Now she does this 180 to make herself look good again. It's all about her.
 
marebear said:
I don't know Lisa and I will never meet her but that is my real beef with her. Who cares what people thought. I hope she did love him because I would think it would be terrible if Michael married her with love and she didn't. But if she did then shs should have had the guts to say "yeah I loved him and there was nothing wrong with that". What she did was "yeah I loved him but I must have been insane or I don't know what I was thinking". Acting ashamed and embarassed just at the same time the charges came and the trial.

As Michael Jackson fans we have heard it all. We know that Michael was judged a lot. His looks, his actions and just anything. I have heard people say horrible things and yet anytime I heard his music wherever I was, whoever I was with I said how much I loved him and that song. I am just a fan and I never acted ashamed or embarassed and she was his wife. People would say "Michael is weird". I would say "no he isn't". I don't have a guilty conscience. Maybe she does and that is what we are seeing.

We don't know what really happened between them. I just know that Michael had the respect to not say anything about her because it was private. She didn't do that. She kicked him when he was down to make herself look good. Now she does this 180 to make herself look good again. It's all about her.
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We probably will never know the truth, but her actions and comments are not those of a ex-wife that loved her husband.
 
forevernmyheart said:
We probably will never know the truth, but her actions and comments are not those of a ex-wife that loved her husband.
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People say she was angry. She said these things like almost 10 years after they divorced. I can see it being anger if the divorce just happened. When they got divorced she spent time with him and took her kids to see him in concert. Then she goes on these shows and badmouths him and hurts him during a bad time in his life. Now he dies and it's all I loved him and I feel bad I didn't try harder to save him. I don't believe she would be talking this way if he was still alive. She would still be like "I don't know what I was thinking when I married Michael". That's how I feel.
 
Confirm this for me: MJ tells Diane Sawyer that basically hes liked her since she was 18 years old, but they met while she saw him at a Jackson 5 concert but they hadn't stayed in touch with each other.

Did they really know each other for that long??? They met years before- but not talked until MJ got his agent to get in touch with her?




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=paMQXQzsJbc&feature=related



and 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Wi25VSTWMQ - why is she acting like a [BLEEEEEEP] that she is on Oprah? **I havent read all these threads / pages here**
 
marebear said:
People say she was angry. She said these things like almost 10 years after they divorced. I can see it being anger if the divorce just happened. When they got divorced she spent time with him and took her kids to see him in concert. Then she goes on these shows and badmouths him and hurts him during a bad time in his life. Now he dies and it's all I loved him and I feel bad I didn't try harder to save him. I don't believe she would be talking this way if he was still alive. She would still be like "I don't know what I was thinking when I married Michael". That's how I feel.
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Yes, some have that pov. She may have been angry, but, it's no excuse. She knows the media. How cruel they are. If she had any respect for Michael, she would've never bad-mouthed him. Furthermore, she knew how much trauma he went through during the false accusations and the toll it took on him. She knew the damage his reputation suffered, by the press, so why would she turn on him and do the very same thing to him??? Lisa plays games, and she loves publicity stunts to gain attention to herself in the media. I wonder, why would MJ reconsider and even want to have any thing to do with her after she betrayed him to the world??? :no:
 
That's what I'm trying to figure out. People say she loves him, she loved him like any women could and she helped him , blah blah blah. Well why than did she bash him constantly? Like someone said before, we understand if it was maybe a few months to a year after because of the divorce but when it's years after? I mean come on, that is just lame.
 
BillieJean84 said:
Confirm this for me: MJ tells Diane Sawyer that basically hes liked her since she was 18 years old, but they met while she saw him at a Jackson 5 concert but they hadn't stayed in touch with each other. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=paMQXQzsJbc&feature=related



and 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Wi25VSTWMQ - why is she acting like a [BLEEEEEEP] that she is on Oprah? **I havent read all these threads / pages here**
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Yes, MJ did say that. Lisa saw him at a J5 concert and he liked her. As for LMP on Oprah, oh well, she was showing her true feelings abot her marriage. "Holy Mother Of God" comment was sarcastic and un called for. As if her marriage was oh so bad. Marriage is what you make it. If she had the right intentions, and wanted to make things work with MJ maybe they could've had a marriage with some staying power.
 
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Oh & my other question is how did Priscella feel about it?? I think she was disappointed or was against the whole thing??? Did she like MJ??
 
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