Open General discussion - Katherine Jackson vs AEG

[Bubs]

AEG Live 'scared to death' by Michael Jackson treatments


The chief of AEG Live expressed concerns over Michael Jackson's medical treatment ahead of his planned comeback shows in London, a US court has heard.

In an email to Jackson's manager, after receiving a $48,000 bill (£31,000) from his dermatologist, Randy Phillips wrote: "He scares us to death because he is shooting him up with something."

Dr Arnold Klein's lawyer has defended the doctor's treatment of Jackson.

Live event promoter AEG is being sued by Jackson's mother over his death.

Katherine Jackson claims the company failed to properly investigate her son's personal doctor, Conrad Murray, and missed warning signs about his failing health.

Murray was convicted of involuntary manslaughter after giving Jackson a lethal dose of the anaesthetic propofol in 2009.

AEG denies any wrongdoing.

Giving evidence, Mr Phillips said the email to Jackson's manager, Michael Kane, was sent after a meeting was held at the singer's house to address his health and missed rehearsals.

The bill from Dr Klein, he added, included numerous shots of cosmetic drugs such as Restalyne and Botox, as well as other unidentified intramuscular shots.

Witness admonished
Mr Phillips and other AEG Live executives have testified during the trial that it would have been inappropriate to ask about or intervene in Jackson's medical care.

He previously told the court in Los Angeles that he believed the $40 billion (£26 billion) legal action to be a "baseless extortion" attempt.

Randy Phillips has been president and CEO of AEG Live since 2002
During his fourth day of giving evidence, the CEO was warned by the judge to answer questions posed by a lawyer for Katherine Jackson without arguing.

Jurors were sent out before Superior Court Judge Yvette Palazuelos admonished Mr Phillips, saying: "It's not going to help your case. It's not going to help anybody."

The warning came in response to an earlier exchange, when Ms Jackson's lawyer, Brian Panish, had asked Mr Phillips about characterisations of Murray that the executive had made in an email sent five days before the singer died.

Phillips acknowledged that some of his statements, including that AEG Live had "checked out Murray", had turned out not to be true.

When asked if that was the case, he replied: "Honestly, only to stop you from badgering me, yes."

The trial will enter its 25th day later and could last as long as four months.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-22853068
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When Panish is finally ready to finish with RP, I'm expecting Putnam to go back to this issue with Klien, and it ain't going to be pretty.

I'm trying think how is that Kane asking money from AEG to pay MJ's bills to Klein plays out.
Did AEG paid and why? As far as I can remember, Arnie put in creditors claim to estate.

 

[Big Apple2]

In an email to Jackson's manager, after receiving a $48,000 bill (£31,000) from his dermatologist, Randy Phillips wrote: "He scares us to death because he is shooting him up with something."

Dr Arnold Klein's lawyer has defended the doctor's treatment of Jackson.-----------------------------------------------------------------

When Panish is finally ready to finish whit RP, I'm expecting Putnam to go back to this issue with Klien, and it ain't going to be pretty.

Thanks for posting bubs.

While catching up on yesterday's testimony, that's the FIRST thing that caught my eye, i.e. $48,000 in medical fees coming from Arnold Klein! Was that fool PADDING his bills, or are those fees legitimate? It's hard to tell coming from Arnie. In my humble opinion, he was PROBABLY overcharging Michael for years, and years, and years. I'm sure they all knew that Michael didn't look at his bills, they just came in to some accountant and were paid - no questions asked.

I hate that this type of stuff is even being discussed. Like Michael would ever want his medical bills and/or medical procedures discussed in public. Thanks Mother!!!!

I also agree with you bubs, I can certainly see Mr. Putnam going back to those Klein bills, they will play very well with Janet's "you can't lead a horse to water" statement, all tied up in a neat little package.

 

[bouee]

It's not clear from the testimony, did RP say in the email that Brenda called him? Or only on the stand. She denies it but I don't understand why he would lie about it.

Obviously if he had any information that would exonerate Murray then it would have been presented at the wrongful death trial. This is obviously him thinking out loud again, before he has the facts, kinda like we do on here, only we have the mods to stop us name calling or being silly. lol

yes, my guess : he sent that e mail (that shows he was worried about murray's role), justifies it on on the stand saying Brenda called him with the cause of death, RP was hoping fore info that would exonerate Murray.
Panish point maybe is to show that RP was not so sure about Murray.

Anyway, Brenda is upset, and wants to be called to the stand. She doesn't like him AT ALL.

Brenda Harvey Richie ?@BrendaRichie 4 h

Prove it Randy Phillips! I want MJ's attorneys to call me to the stand!

 

[LastTear]

@Bouee yeah, as I said, I fully expect her name to be added today.

Point is that he was an interested party so he wanted to know. RP thinks out loud too much on emails. I think the reason he is getting frustrated is that he is not been given the chance to explain or put things into context, AEG cross might help us to understand these emails.

ETA Maybe Michael said to Klein that AEG are paying his bills. I need to re-read the contract to see what it says about expenses.

 

[Big Apple2]

Anyway, Brenda is upset, and wants to be called to the stand. She doesn't like him AT ALL.

Brenda Richie, is that the same woman who, during her divorce from Lionel, went to his girlfriend's home to beat her up? It was a long time ago, but I vaguely remember their divorce being a nightmare.

I guess that's her connection to Ms. Katherine, i.e. "beating up THE girlfriend." LOL!

 

[8701girl]

It is nice that brenda ritchie is sticking up for michael but i think it werid how she still keeps lionel's last name even though they have been divorced for many years

 

[ivy]

I thought she was simply telling him the conclusion of the coroner, that she had probably heard on the news.....It came out in early august 09 if I remember correctly.

no the timeline puts it before the coroner's report. She's close to the Jacksons including Katherine and Latoya. I would guess that she learned the cause of death from them and later told it to Phillips on the phone. Phillips then emailed someone saying he knows what the cause of death was.

Email on 3/13/09 from Leiweke to Phillips:
Phil (Anschutz) can be such a paranoid scrooge. He thinks he's smarter than everyone.

I don't know whether it was smart move from Panish to show that email in trial?
They have been trying desparately show to jurors how AEG employees are a-holes, trying to show how badly they talked about MJ in they emails (although some cases I don't agree to be bad as they want people to believe), but now they bring out that there was talk behing RP himself as well as the owner of AEG and Kenny. How the jurors are going to take that, not sure, but it made me think that all of the employees were like giggling school girls talking shite behind others back, not just MJ, but everybody. If I were juror, I couldn't fault them taking bad about MJ if they talked like that to everybody on sight.
This trial is not about are they stupid school girls, it is about whether they hired CM.

exactly what I thought. I actually called them equal opportunity insulters. Jacksons argument was AEG did not care about Michael and they treated him badly. However now they show an email that calls the big boss a paranoid scrooge. Suddenly AEG execs becomes this boys club who talk insulting fashion about everyone - including their boss.

Btw, ABC7 tweets are annoying as hell, they don't post them in order and are all over the place:angry:

actually I believe it's Jacksons lawyers that skip from topic to topic and then go back etc.

I think its been 6 weeks :bugeyed

I noticed that Panish didn't ask Randy P anything about AEG hiring CM. I suppose he finds it irrelevant as he has more pressing issues to take care, like asking whether RP and AEG are assholes .Why don't Panish just spend 5 minutes with RP and ask him directly whether he is asshole, and get over it, then he could concentrate the actual trial.

Exactly what I have been wondering. Phillips testimony almost had nothing to do with hiring of Murray. Even very brief mention of "we check everyone out" comment.

Obviously if he had any information that would exonerate Murray then it would have been presented at the wrongful death trial. This is obviously him thinking out loud again, before he has the facts, kinda like we do on here, only we have the mods to stop us name calling or being silly. lol

Lol. I think this is what happened. He was suspicious of Klein and what he was giving Michael. When he learned Michael had other drugs in addition to Propofol, he might have thought Klein was the reason and hence Murray was innocent. I believe Phillips's email, Gongaware saying he saw Michael under the influence after Klein, Dileo's voicemail telling Murray to test Michael - hence not suspecting Murray - tells us they suspected Klein.

I'm trying think how is that Kane asking money from AEG to pay MJ's bills to Klein plays out.
Did AEG paying and why? As far as I can remember, Arnie put in creditors claim to estate.

AEG was advancing Michael money, remember June 20 Kane asked for another $1 Million to pay Michael's debt and Phillips said no. I don't think Klein was paid and hence the creditors claim to MJ Estate.

 

[Big Apple2]

Suddenly AEG execs becomes this boys club who talk insulting fashion about everyone - including their boss.

Sounds familiar to EVERY company, corporation, and/or law firm in the world, i.e. talking about your boss behind his or her back. LOL!

We just don't do it in an e-mail, thereby leaving a paper trial.

I for one, as I said previously, don't like the email system, and NEVER send an email I don't want to come back and bite me in the butt, for that, I pick up the phone, which gives me plausible deniability.

I remember, I think it was Mr. Branca, who said something like "we should finish this conversation on the phone" (or words to that effect). In my opinion, he knows what time it is, when it comes to emails and the paper trail they leave in their wake.

 

[bouee]

no the timeline puts it before the coroner's report. She's close to the Jacksons including Katherine and Latoya. I would guess that she learned the cause of death from them and later told it to Phillips on the phone. Phillips then emailed someone saying he knows what the cause of death was.

thanks, that was already cleared up.

 

[ivy]

Sounds familiar to EVERY company, corporation, and/or law firm in the world, i.e. talking about your boss behind his or her back. LOL!

We just don't do it in an e-mail, thereby leaving a paper trial.

I for one, as I said previously, don't like the email system, and NEVER send an email I don't want to come back and bite me in the butt, for that, I pick up the phone, which gives me plausible deniability.

I remember, I think it was Mr. Branca, who said something like "we should finish this conversation on the phone" (or words to that effect). In my opinion, he knows what time it is, when it comes to emails and the paper trail they leave in their wake.

Well Branca is a lawyer so he would know not to leave a paper trail. The rest seems like they did not think these emails would see the light of day.

thanks, that was already cleared up.

sorry I was sleeping.

 

[bouee]

sorry I was sleeping.

ok, LOL !

I found this, I had forgotten about it. This is Murray talking about Phillips....

 

[Big Apple2]

I found this, I had forgotten about it. This is Murray talking about Phillips....

What does he say bouee?

I, for one, can't stand the sound of his voice, nor having to look at his mug! Thanks.

 

[Bubs]

Thanks Bouee for ruining my day by posting that clip of that narsissic sosiopath.

I had not seen that bit before as I cannot watch him without my bloodpressure going sky high, but I saw some document in which he was talking load of crap. Are we that desparate, that we have to start believing what CM says because it supports some claims that some people wants to believe?
What next, we take part of what Wade R says seriously, and skip other parts?

I cannot belive this.

 

[bouee]

What does he say bouee?

I, for one, can't stand the sound of his voice, nor having to look at his mug! Thanks.

He's talking about a meeting, says that RP took him apart at the end of the meeting, and told him it would be a financial disaster for Michael if he didn't do the shows. Murray says he was shocked. He quotes Phillips saying "he's next to skid row, he's going to be homeless, he doesn't have a f*cking cent, I'm paying fo his toilet paper- that was said in more colorful way- i'm paying for his kids popsicles...Still according to Murray, Phillips said that the shows were the last chance Michael had to earn money. He said that if Michael didn't do the shows, he would be over.

Then the video shows RP denying it on the stand, during CM's trial. The question was asked by Chernoff. RP says it didn't happen, that they all left together.

EDIT :

At the end of the Murrays doc video I postd above- go to 1mn27s if you don't want to hear Murray, Chernoff asks 2 questions :

- Did you go to Murray after the meeting to tell him anything ? RP says no.
- Do you know if Kenny Ortega did ? Rp says no , he doesn't think so because they all left together.

----

Note , I thought Kenny said during CM's trial he left before the end of the meeting (june 20th- this video is not clear about the date). I couldn' find that info CM's trial summary, so i'm not 100% sure.

 

[bouee]

Thanks Bouee for ruining my day by posting that clip of that narsissic sosiopath.

I had not seen that bit before as I cannot watch him without my bloodpressure going sky high, but I saw some document in which he was talking load of crap. Are we that desparate, that we have to start believing what CM says because it supports some claims that some people wants to believe?
What next, we take part of what Wade R says seriously, and skip other parts?

I cannot belive this.

I never said I believed Murray, did I ? My opinion : a liar talking about a truth twister/liar.

It's just interesting to know what he would probably say if he was called to testify, and intersting to know where this stuff comes from (toilet paper, skid row, etc..)

 

[Big Apple2]

He's talking about a meeting, says that RP took him apart at the end of the meeting, and told him it would be a financial disaster for Michael if he didn't do the shows. Murray says he was shocked. He quotes Phillips saying "he's next to skid row, he's going to be homeless, he doesn't have a f*cing cent, I'm paying fo his toilet paper- that was said in more colorful way- i'm paying for his kids popsicles...

Then the video shows RP denying it on the stand, during CM's trial. The question was asked by Chernoff. RP says it didn't happen, that they all left together.

----

Note , I thought Kenny said during CM's trial he left before the end of the meeting (june 20th- this video is not clear about the date). I couldn' find that info CM's trial summary, so i'm not 100% sure.

Thanks bouee!

At this point, anything is possible, BUT coming from The Killer Murray, I'll have to take it with MORE than a grain of salt. I mean, when he's not singing Christmas songs to Anderson Cooper, he's going around saying that "Michael had his OWN stash of propofol."

I STILL can't over that fool saying that "Michael had his own stash of propofol." I mean, where in the heck would Michael get his OWN stash of propofol?

 

[Big Apple2]

It's just interesting to know what he would probably say if he was called to testify, and intersting to know where this stuff comes from (toilet paper, skid row, etc..)

Oh honey, now THAT testimony would be worth reading about.

He's such a loony bird and loose cannon, Lord only knows what he would say on the stand. Talking. Singing. Talking Again. Singing Again. That fool needs to be placed in a STRAIGHT-JACKET, in my opinion.

Oh and I can ALSO see him testifying as to what Michael TOLD HIM about his family. Either way, it's just a matter of time before he starts running his mouth and at this point, he can say whatever he wants to say, Michael is no longer here to defend himself.

 

[ivy]

Murray's that interview is the basis of some of the questions asked yesterday as well

Panish: Did you have a meeting with MJ where you threatened to pull the plug and take everything he had? Phillips: No. Panish: Did you tell him he would lose everything, including his children, if the show didn't happen? Phillips:That's ridiculous, no. Phillips said MJ was a phenomenal father. Phillips denied ever saying to anyone at the meeting that MJ was on skid row or going to become homeless. Panish: Did you ever tell MJ you were paying for his toilet paper? Phillips: No. (ABC7) Phillips denied that Murray said during the June 20th meeting that he "couldn't take it anymore." Phillips denied that Murray's contract was discussed at the meeting, saying that would have been inappropriate. As to whether he threatened to pull the plug on "This Is It," Randy Phillips said, "Absolutely not." Among other statements Phillips denied making: that Jackson would be on Skid Row, and that AEG was paying for the toilet paper in MJ's home. (AP)

 

[Big Apple2]

Thanks for posting ivy!

Well we know that Murray is a big fat liar and "probably" makes stuff up as he goes along, when he feels it's needed.

Wasn't one of his defense points that Michael injected himself while Murray was out of the room? I didn't listen to his Anderson Cooper interview, but did he bring that up again? I "sort of" remember reading something along those lines.

Although I would love to hear about it, I doubt his crazy behind will make it to the witness stand. Or will he?

 

[Bubs]

I never said I believed Murray, did I ? My opinion : a liar talking about a truth twister/liar.

It's just interesting to know what he would probably say if he was called to testify, and intersting to know where this stuff comes from (toilet paper, skid row, etc..)

It comes from the same place as his claims that MJ had a secrest stash of propofol and he took it himself and died, or MJ was suffering demerol withdrawal and that killed MJ, take you pick.

 

[Bubs]

Murray's that interview is the basis of some of the questions asked yesterday as well

Panish: Did you have a meeting with MJ where you threatened to pull the plug and take everything he had? Phillips: No. Panish: Did you tell him he would lose everything, including his children, if the show didn't happen? Phillips:That's ridiculous, no. Phillips said MJ was a phenomenal father. Phillips denied ever saying to anyone at the meeting that MJ was on skid row or going to become homeless. Panish: Did you ever tell MJ you were paying for his toilet paper? Phillips: No. (ABC7) Phillips denied that Murray said during the June 20th meeting that he "couldn't take it anymore." Phillips denied that Murray's contract was discussed at the meeting, saying that would have been inappropriate. As to whether he threatened to pull the plug on "This Is It," Randy Phillips said, "Absolutely not." Among other statements Phillips denied making: that Jackson would be on Skid Row, and that AEG was paying for the toilet paper in MJ's home. (AP)

How come Paanish is allowed to use and ask part of his interview as evidence but judge didn't allow defence to use part of his lapd interview as evidence?

 

[Big Apple2]

Okay, ME, I'm ready for Mr. Panish to punch up his game. In my opinion, the so-called "Smoking Gun" emails are NOT smoking at all and have been more like a wet pack of matches, but hey, that's just me.

Case in point, Mr. Gongaware stating that "we are paying Murray" (or words to that effect), only to then find out that NOBODY was actually paying Murray. That whole thing just fizzled, in my opinion. Now had Murray been paid, this conversation would be going in a whole different direction.

Now I'm wondering when Mr. Panish is going to start calling Jackson family members to the stand, and what line of questioning he plans on introducing. I figure Mr. Putnam will focus on the family's many "intervention" stories and them being in the dark as to what Michael was doing up in his bedroom at night, but what's Mr. Panish's plan? I wonder.

 

[crillon]

Thanks for posting ivy!

Well we know that Murray is a big fat liar and "probably" makes stuff up as he goes along, when he feels it's needed.

Wasn't one of his defense points that Michael injected himself while Murray was out of the room? I didn't listen to his Anderson Cooper interview, but did he bring that up again? I "sort of" remember reading something along those lines.

Although I would love to hear about it, I doubt his crazy behind will make it to the witness stand. Or will he?

Exactly. Like his fuzzy memory about how long he was on the phone with his baby mama while Michael was gasping for breath in the other room with no monitoring equipment on. Every time I think about that moment in time, my blood boils.

Murray is a liar and a convicted felon. I say that gives him zero credibility. And, the CA courts/jail system should prohibit prisoners from having cell phones. That's how the felon calls the media. smh.

I don't think he'll make it to the witness stand--his lawyer has been fighting it--but if he does, he says he'll take the Fifth.

Okay, ME, I'm ready for Mr. Panish to punch up his game. In my opinion, the so-called "Smoking Gun" emails are NOT smoking and have been more like a wet pack of matches, but hey, that's just me.

I'm wondering when he is going to start calling Jackson family members to the stand, and what line of questioning he plans on introducing. I figure Mr. Putnam will focus on the family's many "intervention" stories and them being in the dark as to what Michael was doing up in his bedroom at night, but what's Mr. Panish's plan? I wonder.

Yea I agree--we've yet to see any proof of who hired Murray. Except for Paul Gongaware's email, there's nothing and this farce of a trial keeps dragging on. I don't see putting the Jacksons on the witness stand will shed any more light on the key legal questions. Panish will probably keep throwing mud at the wall to see if anything sticks, but these jurors will be savvy enough to see through his weak case. Thus far, anyway.

 

[Big Apple2]

I don't see putting the Jacksons on the witness stand will shed any more light on the key legal questions.

Yes, I can't think of anything off the top of my head either, aside from Jermaine's CONNECTION to Tohme-Tohme, which I'm sure will be glossed over, if it's even mentioned at all.

I mean, I'm sure Mother and her attorney's don't want to HIGHLIGHT Jermaine and Tohme-Tohme's relationship and what, if any, benefits Jermaine may have received by making that introduction.

You know they want to keep that on the low, if possible.

 

[LastTear]

The Jacksons can talk about their interventions and Michael's drug and alcohol use, plus anything Michael may have told them about the concerts and AEG.

 

[Big Apple2]

The Jacksons can talk about their interventions and Michael's drug and alcohol use, plus anything Michael may have told them about the concerts and AEG.

The many "interventions" for sure.

Not too sure about the concerts and AEG. I don't "think" Michael would discuss that sort of stuff with any of them, but we shall see. Did he ever invite any of them to a rehearsal, I don't know for sure, but PROBABLY NOT.

I remember when they all got that BMI (sp) Award, and Marlon was asked a question about why Michael was not there or whatever, and Marlon acted like he didn't even know where Michael was (Marlon said something like "oh he's probably off riding a camel somewhere), which leads me to believe NONE of them really knew (aside from possibly Mother).

 

[bouee]

How come Paanish is allowed to use and ask part of his interview as evidence but judge didn't allow defence to use part of his lapd interview as evidence?

he hasn't used the interview in itself. Now I think I remember, this thing comes from Murray's "documentary".

Panish just asked questions about that yesterday to Phillips, just as Chernoff did during Murray's trial.

But your point is interesting. Can he be allowed to use that interview, since it's Murray directly speaking, would it be hearsay ?It was also Murray directly speaking in the police interview Or will Panish have to get Murray on the stand if he wants to make that point ? according to this, it was only Murray & Phillips. Murray on the stand would be something... possibly a show. No one can know what can possibly come from Murray, he's half crazy. It would be desperate to use him IMO.

Panish may be be using Kai Chase also , indirectly. From Panish opening statement

Panish says Kai Chase will testify that the meeting was hostile, a vase got broken and Michael ended up leaving. Meeting continued for hours, Murray came to the kitchen and said “I can’t handle this” and Murray was very upset.

 

[Bubs]

Anthony McCartney ?@mccartneyAP 14h
Before court recessed for the day, Phillips was shown emails about Murray's medical records that the doctor was fielding on day MJ died.

Whose medical records? During the trial Shafer testified it to be 1 of 17 unconscionable errors he made that he didn't keep records, so is the above medical records Michael's or someone elses?

 

[bouee]

Anthony McCartney ‏@mccartneyAP 14h
Before court recessed for the day, Phillips was shown emails about Murray's medical records that the doctor was fielding on day MJ died.

Whose medical records? During the trial Shafer testified it to be 1 of 17 unconscionable errors he made that he didn't keep records, so is the above medical records Michael's or someone elses?

They must be talking about this :

from yesterday's testimony

On 6/25/09 the insurance broker wrote to Dr. Murray at 12:54:15 pm, probably London time (approximately 5 to 5am LA time): Email: We are dealing with a matter of great importance and your urgent attention would be greatly appreciated. The email talked about getting MJ's medical records. Phillips said he learned from the media that Dr. Murray had been treating MJ since 2006.Panish: This is Dr. Murray doing something to help AEG get insurance, fair enough? Phillips: Fair enough (ABC7)

from the e mails

Panish showed email from Gongaware to the insurance broker on June 24, 2009:
"Dr. Murray can comment on the availability of the records." (ABC7)

On June 25, 2009, at 5:54 a.m., London time, (that would be 24th june around 10pm LA time) Taylor sent an email to Dr. Conrad Murray, who had been brought onto the tour to tend to Jackson. The email, introduced as evidence in the case, read:

“The insurers have specifically requested information on the following:

Press reports on the artist at various times using a wheelchair, and whether any of these occasions were as a result of a medical issue.
Press reports that the artist had, or has, suffered a back injury.
Press reports that the artist is suffering, or has previously suffered from lupus.
Press reports that the artist is suffering, or has previously suffered from cancer.
Press reports that the artist was hospitalized in 2005.
Dates and brief details of any cosmetic procedures, and specific details of any complications.
Press reports that the artist has suffered from lung infection/emphysema and chronic gastrointestinal bleeding.
Press reports that the artist has minimal diet (is possibly anorexic).”

Murray's answer (from Murray trial)
SM states that the iPhone reflects that Murray responded to Bob Taylor in the UK on 6/25/09 at 11:17 am, and the body states "Dear Bob, I am in receipt of your email. I spoke with Mr. Jackson and requested release of his medical records in order for you to procure a cancellation policy for his show, however the request was denied. I therefore request that AEG consult with kindly with Mr. Jackson for its relevance because he is under the impression that he is already secured in the US. As far as the statements published by the press, let me say they're all fallacious to the best of my knowledge. Sincerely, Conrad Murray"

 

[crillon]

Yes, I can't think of anything off the top of my head either, aside from Jermaine's CONNECTION to Tohme-Tohme, which I'm sure will be glossed over, if it's even mentioned at all.

I mean, I'm sure Mother and her attorney's don't want to HIGHLIGHT Jermaine and Tohme-Tohme's relationship and what, if any, benefits Jermaine may have received by making that introduction.

You know they want to keep that on the low, if possible.

Exactly and none of that is central to the key legal questions--it's just more "side show" and playing of emotional cards to manipulate the jurors.

Jermaine is the one who introduced Tohme to Michael and I agree they don't want to highlight that fact. Also, there were rumors that Tohme was related to Jermaine's wife--a cousin, I thought. That could just be rumor, tho. Would love to know how Jermaine and Tohme met, however. Shady character that Tohme & would love to hear him under oath on that witness stand!