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Open General discussion - Katherine Jackson vs AEG

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it does have to do with treating Murray as a tour employee and it is a very unusual way to supervise a doctor.
 
Justthefacts;3854918 said:
What does any of this have to do with who hired Murray and who supervised him? This is exploitation at it&#8217;s worst.<o:p></o:p>
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bouee;3854919 said:
it does have to do with treating Murray as a tour employee and it is a very unusual way to supervise a doctor.
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IMO most of Prince's testimony will be because of damages.
 
it's conflicting info, unless it happend twice (Phillips being agressive with Murray)
 
ivy said:
IMO most of Prince's testimony will be because of damages.
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yes, but he did bring up new info (converstations with Phillips & incident(s) with Murray).
We'll see what happens when AEG cross examin him..... I'm a little scared of that.
 
How long until they take a break, so we have ABC's tweets ?
 
Justthefacts said:
Pressuring him to find out what in hell was going on with Michael? If I am spending millions and he is not well under your care then hell yeah I want to know what is going on. You say he is fine clearly he is not what is the deal
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I wish it was that. But if it was, with someone like Phillips, Murray would have been out of the picture, or he would have asked for a second opinion from another doctor.

I think he pressured him to get Michael on stage.
 
If anyone has twitter, can we get a confirmation if Prince was actually talking about the 24th ?
 
bouee said:
If anyone has twitter, can we get a confirmation if Prince was actually talking about the 24th ?
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Sorry, but may I answer like that:

Ivy ?@Ivy_4MJ 1m
@BLANAIDXLIVES CNN says it was June 24 however AP says Prince wasn't sure of the date.
 
Considering Prince said that was the last time he spoke to Michael, I suppose it was on the 24th.
 
bouee said:
I wish it was that. But if it was, with someone like Phillips, Murray would have been out of the picture, or he would have asked for a second opinion from another doctor.

I think he pressured him to get Michael on stage.
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And that part about getting Michael on the stage was thrown out. So even if he was it does not matter anway
 
ivy said:
updated AP

Prince said that he saw AEG Live CEO Randy Phillips at the family's rented mansion in a heated conversation with his father's doctor in days before his father's death. The teenager said he wasn't sure what day the conversation occurred, but that he saw Phillips grabbing former cardiologist Conrad Murray's elbow.

Phillips "looked aggressive to me," Prince said.

Michael Jackson wasn't at home at the time and was probably at rehearsals, Prince said.
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another update : the sentence saying Prince was not sure of the date is no longer there

http://bigstory.ap.org/article/jacksons-son-says-father-feared-concert-promoter

Prince testified that he saw AEG Live CEO Randy Phillips at the family's rented mansion in a heated conversation with Murray in the days before his father died. The teenager said he saw Phillips grabbing Murray's elbow.

Phillips "looked aggressive to me," Prince testified.

Michael Jackson wasn't at home at the time and was probably at rehearsals, Prince said.
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The part about getting Michael on stage was. And this still does not prove who hired Murray and who's job it was to supervise him
 
bouee said:
That would actually be good. But I can't see AEG not trying to impeach him. I'm hoping though...
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I guess they may call him later if they need to. I'm just surprised they didn't want to clarify some points with him.
 
This is the civil case. Geezzz With AEG'S email told Murray they are the one paying him, and now Prince's testimony Philips was aggressive to Murray and their conversations with no Michael's presence. If this is irrelevant, I don't know what is. I have seen many civil cases of people against big company easily win the case without even direct evidence. Things don't have to be black or white. You only need 51% pro from the jury.
 
bouee said:
Thanks for finding this (Metzger's testimony).
I'm back to square one, because I was just answering your post.
I believe propofol is irrelevant to this trial. The point is just to show that Murray was incompetent, and that AEG knew it, and still got into a contract with Murray. An icompetent doctor is potentially dangerous, especially after AEG saw Michael's health deterioring under his care. Honestly, I don't think the jacksons need to go any further than that to prove their claim.
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ok--you say CM was incompetent, and I agree, but how do we know that? B/c of the way he administered propofol. The fact that MJ was thin, losing physical and mental strength, etc, could have had other causes--such as flu or variety of possibilities, including anxiety and so on--we only know what the cause was after the event, not before. So yes, AEG knew MJ was deteriorating but they did not know why. Also--the last rehearsals were good--I think the Thriller reheatrsal was great--he looked very good, I think that was in the last 2 rehearsals. Earth Song and Thriller (I think) were the 24th.

One thing I did appreciate about Matheson's tretimony was that NO SYMPTOM should be ignored. But did they ignore it? I think they did not, but in my mind the question is--did they do enough?

Now what Prinvce is saying confirms something else that tjhe real estate guy who was friends with MJ (photos together in December 08) and the guy who built Carolwood (Hamid) said that MJ wanted to do a kind of MSQ concert--a few shows that would be broadcast globally, sell the video, DVD, film, making of--so his idea was to do fewer performances and film the shows for release as film, but AEG did not want that. I think this was MJ's solution and he did not want to get pushed into more shows. On the other hand, the kids said he was excited about a world tour. OMG. This is confusing! I hate to hear that MJ was crying though, so sad. He felt overwhelmed.
 
I'm beginning to wonder if Phillips did actually need a straight jacket at the time. What he did is just crazy.
 
loveforever said:
This is the civil case. Geezzz With AEG'S email told Murray they are the one paying him, and now Prince's testimony Philips was aggressive to Murray and their conversations with no Michael's presence. If this is irrelevant, I don't know what is. I have seen many civil cases of people against big company easily win the case without even direct evidence. Things don't have to be black or white. You only need 51% pro from the jury.
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Well with MJ health supposedly deteriorating, it's not unreasonable for Phillip to demand answers, wondering what was going on. I personally would have done the same if in the same position. That's the way I see it and certainly does not prove Jacksons case.
 
AP Update

Murray's attorney Valerie Wass and AEG defense attorney Marvin S. Putnam later denied outside court that the meeting Prince described ever happened.

Putnam said Prince would be re-called to the witness stand during the defense case later in the trial.

"I think as the testimony will show when he is called in our defense that's not what happened," Putnam said. "He was a 12-year-old boy who has had to endure this great tragedy."

Prince said he never saw Murray's treatments of his father.

"I was 12. To my understanding he was supposed to make sure my dad stayed healthy," Prince testified.

Prince said none of the household staff were allowed upstairs at the mansion, and the singer kept his bedroom locked while receiving treatments from Murray.

During cross-examination, Putnam played a clip from a deposition of Prince in which the teen said he discovered the bedroom was locked when he and his siblings were playing hide-and-seek and couldn't get inside.

Prince also said his father gave him and his sister Paris a stack of $100 bills on a few occasions to give to Murray. The teen said his father told him that Murray wouldn't take the money from him, and the doctor wouldn't take the full amount from the children.

The teenager said his understanding was that the money was meant to tide Murray over until he got paid by AEG Live.
 
jamba said:
ok--you say CM was incompetent, and I agree, but how do we know that? B/c of the way he administered propofol. The fact that MJ was thin, losing physical and mental strength, etc, could have had other causes--such as flu or variety of possibilities, including anxiety and so on--we only know what the cause was after the event, not before. So yes, AEG knew MJ was deteriorating but they did not know why. Also--the last rehearsals were good--I think the Thriller reheatrsal was great--he looked very good, I think that was in the last 2 rehearsals. Earth Song and Thriller (I think) were the 24th.

One thing I did appreciate about Matheson's tretimony was that NO SYMPTOM should be ignored. But did they ignore it? I think they did not, but in my mind the question is--did they do enough?

Now what Prinvce is saying confirms something else that tjhe real estate guy who was friends with MJ (photos together in December 08) and the guy who built Carolwood (Hamid) said that MJ wanted to do a kind of MSQ concert--a few shows that would be broadcast globally, sell the video, DVD, film, making of--so his idea was to do fewer performances and film the shows for release as film, but AEG did not want that. I think this was MJ's solution and he did not want to get pushed into more shows. On the other hand, the kids said he was excited about a world tour. OMG. This is confusing! I hate to hear that MJ was crying though, so sad. He felt overwhelmed.
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Murray said he would take care of nutrition, he did not, AEG ended up looking for a nutritionnist twice in 2 weeks.
Michael's health was declining and Murray kept saying Michael was fine.
I think 90% of the planet would have been worried and wondered about such a doctor. To me that's enough.
Frankly, I like people, and I think most people are good, and that you only have few phenomenons like Phillips. Really, it was bad luck for Michael to have Murray & Phillips at the same time in his life. It just makes me angry all over again.

If actually Prince was talking about the 24th, he is ALSO confirming what others (Sankey, Karen, and maybe Travis) were saying : Michael was not 100% well on 23rd, and on 24th he was less well than the 23rd, he only did 2 songs, was cold (blanket) So if he is talking about the 24th, he is also impeaching Phillips in a way (Phillips who said Staples center was cold).
 
Can you imagine the pressures Michael had to deal with? the broken heart and wounded soul from the allegations, the nonstop lawsuits from leeches, the bully and attack from media, the vicious lies from tabloids, the ignorance and prejudice from the public, the family's pressure of reunion tour, the two faced fake friends, the shady manager Thome Thome, the big shark AEG.....
 
loveforever said:
Can you imagine the pressures Michael had to deal with? the broken heart and wounded soul from the allegations, the nonstop lawsuits from leeches, the bully and attack from media, the vicious lies from tabloids, the ignorance and prejudice from the public, the family's pressure of reunion tour, the two faced fake friends, the shady manager Thome Thome, the big shark AEG.....
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You also forgot to mention the pressure from fans. I remember very well some fans in this forum and others accusing MJ of being lazy and washed up and so on.
 
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