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Michael - The Great Album Debate

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

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Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

drewhiggins said:
Earth Song isn't cheesy. It's about the earth and therefore, ask yourself - elephants are dying for no apparent reason except greed. So in a way, have we lost their trust?
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This lyric is in fact very deep. It goes back to I think the myth(?) that elephants trust men to be wise and to keep the world in balance. When they don't trust men anymore they kill them. I read this somewhere.
Michael was very wise and read a lot..So, NOT cheesy at all.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

"The elephant is dying.."
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Pompous Git said:
Something's wrong with the lyrics. Either he insulted the papparazzi (which he never did before) or he loved them.
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Eh? Michael has insulted the media before - "Tired of you telling the story your way, it's causing confusion, you think it's ok, damn it!" from Scream, "Slander! You say it's not a sword, but with your pen you torture men you'd crucify the Lord!" from Tabloid Junkie and "Paparazzi, get away from me, get away from me" plus "Ain't the pictures enough to get the story you need...You keep on stalking me, invading my privacy, won't you let me be?" from Privacy.

All of these carry an insulting tone towards the media - not forgetting Why You Wanna Trip On Me.
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Not to forget the infamous "Stop fuckin' with me" in the uncut version of SCREAM, the first song chosen to launch the album HIStory (which itself was a wordplay on what he went through - not only his successful career, but also the media bias and defamation). A clear message.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

MJearthsong said:
This lyric is in fact very deep. It goes back to I think the myth(?) that elephants trust men to be wise and to keep the world in balance. When they don't trust men anymore they kill them. I read this somewhere.
Michael was very wise and read a lot..So, NOT cheesy at all.
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Aniram said:
"The elephant is dying.."
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Before it was believed that elephants were carrying the Earth.
Turtle.06.jpg


But, I think that Michael was referring to the massacre of elephants only for their ivory (not for their meat) in order to make jewlery or other things and sell it for big money. That's why you see in the short video killed elephants with removed ivory.

Cheesy????

One-off-Ivory-Sale-to-China-4.jpg


How far are you going to go to equal poor lyrics of the Cascio songs with Michael's lyrics?
 
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Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Originally Posted by Korgenx

Originally Posted by Pompous Git
Eh? Michael has insulted the media before - "Tired of you telling the story your way, it's causing confusion, you think it's ok, damn it!" from Scream, "Slander! You say it's not a sword, but with your pen you torture men you'd crucify the Lord!" from Tabloid Junkie and "Paparazzi, get away from me, get away from me" plus "Ain't the pictures enough to get the story you need...You keep on stalking me, invading my privacy, won't you let me be?" from Privacy.

All of these carry an insulting tone towards the media - not forgetting Why You Wanna Trip On Me.
Click to expand...

Not to forget the infamous "Stop fuckin' with me" in the uncut version of SCREAM, the first song chosen to launch the album HIStory (which itself was a wordplay on what he went through - not only his successful career, but also the media bias and defamation). A clear message.
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You really haven't read this thread have you? We already discussed this.

First, Michael's tone in Privacy, Why you wanna trip on me and other songs is an expression of unhappiness about how media treated him. It's just a tone, not DIRECT insults! Simple negative remarks, nothing more. Movie critics do it all the time when they criticize movies. Slander is not an insult, it's an accusation! You really need to re-check the concept of an insult and of a negative remark and/or an accusation.

Second, when Michael says in the song Scream "stop fuckin' with me", "fuckin'" is clearly an impolite word, but it is not used as an insult. It simply replaces the word "pressurin'". Do you want a demonstration? Here it is:

"Stop pressurin' me" = "Stop fuckin' with me". It is exactly the same meaning. The only difference between the two sentences is the language REGISTER, the second sentence being in a lower/familiar/slang register. Nobody insulted anyone in those sentences.

An insult is when you call someone names or when you direct the impolite words to someone. Here a demonstration:
"f uck you!" "You're a montser!" You're an animal!" Those are insults.

Imagine I am saying one of the two to you. Which sentence would offend you more:

"Stop pressurin' me / stop fuckin' with me" (which is a complaint)
or
"You're a monster!" You're an animal" (which is clearly calling names, no complaint whatsoever)
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Aniram said:
No, Michael loved tabloid paparazzi! Remember how he felt about them after Diana's death? Yeah, nothing but l.o.v.e. for those paparazzi.
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That was my point earlier in this thread. Despite Lady Di's death caused by the chase, he did not call them names. He naturally expressed his unhappiness, sadness, frustration, but he did it as a gentleman. He is trying to wake them up of their misdeeds in his songs, not insult them. That's what some fail to see. Thus please do not compare the lyrics of MONSTER to the lyrics of real Michael's songs.
 
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Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

BUMPER SNIPPET said:
"f uck you!" "You're a montser!" You're an animal!" Those are insults.
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"He's a monster" / "He's an animal" are no insults as well. By your own logic the "he" is not confronting the person being talked about, it's a general complain.


Example:

Mr. ABC is a sucker. (general complain)
Mr. ABC, you're a sucker! (insult)


BUMPER_SNIPPET, you are beaten by your own logic. "Monster" isn't any different from previous MJ songs. "He's a monster" / "He's an animal" is not even considered rude language, they are declarative statements like in thousand other songs. Go and listen to some gangsta rap, that's where you'll most likely find actual insults.

There are no insults in "Monster". Nice try, but fail. You don't care about the lyrics of the Cascio songs (because you obviously hate them), you only try hard to interpret them wrongly. Prejudice is ignorance. People that take care of the lyrics know that what you've just claimed is not true...
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Korgnex said:
"He's a monster" / "He's an animal" are no insults as well. By your own logic the "he" is not confronting the person being talked about, it's a general complain.


Example:

Mr. ABC is a sucker. (general complain)
Mr. ABC, you're a sucker! (insult)


BUMPER_SNIPPET, you are beaten by your own logic. "Monster" isn't any different from previous MJ songs. "He's a monster" / "He's an animal" is not even considered rude language, they are declarative statements like in thousand other songs. Go and listen to some gangsta rap, that's where you'll most likely find actual insults.

There are no insults in "Monster". Nice try, but fail. You don't care about the lyrics of the Cascio songs (because you obviously hate them), you only try hard to interpret them wrongly. Prejudice is ignorance. People that take care of the lyrics know that what you've just claimed is not true...
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Are you trying to teach me my own specialization?

FYI, if I say "f uck you!" OR "f uck him!" It is an insult. Hence, "You 're an animal" or "He's an animal", it makes no difference, it still is an insult! The only thing that changed is the pronoun.


p.s. According to your own logic, when you say:

"You're a nigger" it is an insult, and "he's a nigger" it is a complaint? Well done! You've just made up a theory that suits only the lyrics of the song Monster.
 
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Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

BUMPER SNIPPET said:
How far are you going to go to equal poor lyrics of the Cascio songs with Michael's lyrics?
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Indeed. Completely desperate.

Everyone's heard the Barry Gibb and MJ snippet leak, right? Why is there absolutely no doubt about the vocals on that song? Funny that...
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

samhabib said:
Indeed. Completely desperate.

Everyone's heard the Barry Gibb and MJ snippet leak, right? Why is there absolutely no doubt about the vocals on that song? Funny that...
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Except that those who don't know very well Michael's voice (like people from SONY) can't say when Michael sings and when Barry Gibb sings :D
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

To kill up? That would mean to 'wipe out'. Murder or maybe genocide. When you 'kill up' it's like 'killing all'. Have you ever listened to rap music?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Aniram said:
To kill up? That would mean to 'wipe out'. Murder or maybe genocide. When you 'kill up' it's like 'killing all'. Have you ever listened to rap music?
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I have. I just haven't found the definition of "kill up" in the dictionary.

Now, let's say it is a gangsta hip hop rap urban slang, why would MJ use that particular verb in such a song as KYHU which has nothing to do with gangsta or hip hop attitude? Second, why didn't he simply use kill or a synonym?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Aniram said:
To kill up? That would mean to 'wipe out'. Murder or maybe genocide. When you 'kill up' it's like 'killing all'. Have you ever listened to rap music?
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That makes as much sense as your avatar.

Is that avatar supposed to be a piss-take?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

drewhiggins said:
''Kill up'' isn't proper English. ''Killing all...'' is but not ''Killing up''.

Since when did Michael ever sing lyrics that made no sense whatsoever on his official albums?
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The thing is, I can't even find the verb "to kill up" in the urban dictionary. So who uses such an expression? Which song? Which context? What does it mean?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

drewhiggins said:
''Kill up'' isn't proper English. ''Killing all...'' is but not ''Killing up''.

Since when did Michael ever sing lyrics that made no sense whatsoever on his official albums?
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I'm still waiting for someone to explain 'sucking up the air from the earth AND under me'. Air under me?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

samhabib said:
I'm still waiting for someone to explain 'sucking up the air from the earth AND under me'. Air under me?
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A fart?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

What the hell are you even going on about now, samhabib? My avatar? :lol: My avatar is a picture of Michael Jackson circa 1995 with my username on it. Quite shocking indeed.

And I never thought killing up sounded weird. Who really f ucking cares if he made up completely new words? He's Michael Jackson, he's an artist. You don't have to strictly stick to common English language. That's the fun of writing.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

samhabib said:
I'm still waiting for someone to explain 'sucking up the air from the earth AND under me'. Air under me?
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Actually it's: "We're sucking up the air in the earth from under me."
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Aniram said:
What the hell are you even going on about now, samhabib? My avatar? :lol: My avatar is a picture of Michael Jackson circa 1995 with my username on it. Quite shocking indeed.
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No it isn't. It's a distorted picture of Michael Jackson which looks like someone's drawn a clown's 'smiley face' over it.

Aniram said:
nd I never thought killing up sounded weird. Who really f ucking cares if he made up completely new words? He's Michael Jackson, he's an artist. You don't have to strictly stick to common English language. That's the fun of writing.
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But you've just been trying to claim it WAS real English. Now it isn't?

Who 'f.ucking' cares? On a Michael Jackson fansite, who 'f.ucking' cares? Have a guess.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Aniram said:
What the hell are you even going on about now, samhabib? My avatar? :lol: My avatar is a picture of Michael Jackson circa 1995 with my username on it. Quite shocking indeed.

And I never thought killing up sounded weird. Who really f ucking cares if he made up completely new words? He's Michael Jackson, he's an artist. You don't have to strictly stick to common English language. That's the fun of writing.
Click to expand...

I agree, unless the word already exists, so why bother making up a word which does not exist to replace a word that already exists?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

BUMPER SNIPPET said:
How about the verb "to kill up", have you found where and when it is used? I am curious to see that.
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*edit, OK, I didn't really read what I've just googled up*


BUMPER_SNIPPET, can't you google sth that simple?
 
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Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

BUMPER SNIPPET said:
The thing is, I can't even find the verb "to kill up" in the urban dictionary. So who uses such an expression? Which song? Which context? What does it mean?
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I just looked up ''kill up'' in a search. It comes up with:

Pakistani troops kill up to 15 militants

Yes you can ''kill up'' but it has to be a ''to'' or estimate of whatever you've killed up to - 15 militants in that case. You don't go killing up the birds. You might ''shooting up'' or ''killing off'' but not ''killing up''. Honestly, those lyrics would be laughed at - which surely Killing Up Your Head isn't about.
 
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Anna said:
Actually it's: "We're sucking up the air in the earth from under me."
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That's even worse.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Anna said:
Yeah... you might want to actually READ these "examples" you've posted. :lmao: They only contain the phrases "UP police" and "killing up to".
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Maybe YOU should really read them:

Man arrested in city for killing UP MLA's wife
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Man guilty of illegally killing UP wolf
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