Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25 Interview Post 208

[Moulin Rouge]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

They might look into it. Prince has been put on the board of directors of a charity that the estate has said is fraudulent, and has NOTHING to do with Michael Jackson. If donations are collected for this charity, fraud could be charged. That could, potentially, be seen as involving a minor in a CRIME.

I just went to the website today, it's very amature but they posted this.

Please Note: Heal The World Foundation is NOT affiliated with the Executors of the Michael Jackson Estate, neither are any products sold on this site endorsed by the Jackson Estate.

While the charity has nothing to do with Michael Jackson directly, his mother and children are involved and are participating because they want to continue is philanthropic work which makes it akward because that indirectly includes him. I feel Katherine's heart is in the right place but Mann's history is not good. Prince being head of the youth board seems like it's supposed to be more of an honorable title. Anyone can start a charity, this charity hasn't been proven to be illegal as of yet. The estates problem is that they don't want Michael's image used and feel his kids are being exploited and thats why they have gone to court. It's all up to a judge now to decide what to do next.

 

[chanel05]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

A mess is what they are in right now. And BTW did you see anyone here say they were going to call DCFS? And who you calling crazy?

1) it's a figure of speech.
2) if it doesn't apply to you there is no need to feel offended by what I said.
Even if you don't call them, just to want them to get involved is crazy within itself. I don't agree with what she is doing but I'm not gonna DCFS need to investigate.

 

[classic]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

It's Michael that deserves all the credit for his children. Remember when he was alive the media kept saying the kids were going to freaks and weirdos. Think they're going to apologise, nah, didn't think so. This world would be a better place with more kids like them in it.

I keep reading about the "normal" comments. Please tell me that Mrs. Jackson at least stepped up for Michael and flat out stated that the children are the way they are because of their father and the way he was as a parent.

By the way, I think people can stop being surprised by anything at this point.

 

[chanel05]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

I went to the website today, it's very amature and they posted this.



Please Note: Heal The World Foundation is NOT affiliated with the Executors of the Michael Jackson Estate, neither are any products sold on this site endorsed by the Jackson Estate.



While the charity has nothing to do with Michael Jackson directly, his mother and children are involved and are participating because they want to continue is philanthropic work which is what makes it akward because that indirectly includes him. I feel Katherine's heart is in the right place but Mann's history is not good. Prince being head of the youth board seems like it's supposed to be more of an honorable title. Anyone can start a charity, this charity hasn't been proven to be illegal as of yet. The estates problem is that they don't want Michael's image used and feel his kids are being exploited and thats why they have gone to court. It's all up to a judge now to decide what to do next.

Yea you said it right.. This is one of the reasons why I'm saying nothing is illegal. We may Not like it but that doesn't mean it's illegal.

 

[souldreamer7]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

oh goshhh.

SMDH

 

[twinklEE]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

Just because he produced porn doesn't make the contract illegal. Katherine didn't sign a contract for them to do porn or something illegal for a minor to take part of. There is nothing illegal about a guardian signing a contract on behalf of minor children. Just because we dint agree doesn't make it illegal. There are lots of things that are legal that we may not agree with, but that doesn't make it illegal. Now please tell me how it is illegal?!?

So it's perfectly normal to bind children to a porn producer as long as the contract is not about porn? Would you bind your own children to a contract with a guy like Mann as long as it isn't porn? The contract may not be illegal but it's immoral and unethical for damn sure.
Katherine JAckson NEVER EVER had the authority to bind them to a LIFE LONG CONTRACt with anybody let alone Mann. The fact that she had the audacity to do it anyway SPEAKS volumes, and is extremely alarming.

 

[twinklEE]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

I keep reading about the "normal" comments. Please tell me that Mrs. Jackson at least stepped up for Michael and flat out stated that the children are the way they are because of their father and the way he was as a parent.

By the way, I think people can stop being surprised by anything at this point.

No she did not she just said 'yes they are' as if she'd deserve credit for them being normal.

 

[Ashtanga]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

God.... :sigh:


How some people can not see anything wrong/illegal about it? :bugeyed Unbelievable... :doh:

*Leaving this thread.... NOW!!!*

 

[Moulin Rouge]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

Just because he produced porn doesn't make the contract illegal. Katherine didn't sign a contract for them to do porn or something illegal for a minor to take part of. There is nothing illegal about a guardian signing a contract on behalf of minor children. Just because we dint agree doesn't make it illegal. There are lots of things that are legal that we may not agree with, but that doesn't make it illegal. Now please tell me how it is illegal?!?

Yea you said it right.. This is one of the reasons why I'm saying nothing is illegal. We may Not like it but that doesn't mean it's illegal.

Exactly. I don't like Mann's past or that Katherine is associating with him but it's not my business whom she chooses to involve herself and grandkis with. Other than the issue with the estate the charity hasn't been proven to be illegal, they probably went theough all the steps to get it running and i hope it really is benefiting underprivilaged people. At this point the only thing we can control is whether you want to participate or not.

God.... :sigh:


How some people can not see anything wrong/illegal about it? :bugeyed Unbelievable... :doh:

*Leaving this thread*

Wrong and illegal are two different things. This is why the estate has taken them to court, if it's illegal then the proper authorities will shut it down.

 

[twinklEE]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

Funny how the kids being used for this fraudulent charity set up by a true lunatic is being completely left out. Why am I not surprised to read the same bs by the same people again and again.

 

[prettygirlmj]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

Know what...? I understand this admiration, but it is what Michael's wouldn't like, what no normal parent would want: and that is speaking on public boards about their looks and talent and all that, even though they are children only. That's inappropriate. The fact that they got fansites now after Michael died is one of the most sick things that could happen, after all the effort and Pain even their father put in to protect them.

Better bite your tongue about that horrendous Disney Channel and their mind-control twisted techniques they're having on kids there. Miley Cyrus and Britney Spears and Christina Aguilera are just 3 of the many unfortunate victims of Disney Chanel. I'd suggest getting informed, especially these days, before fancying children being exposed to the world, with the creepy hell that Hollywood is.


*prayers for these wonderful children... and all the others*

Don't be so melodramatic. I didn't say a damn bad thing about the kids. I merely said Paris was beautiful - which many members on this website have said thousand's of time. I wasn't talking about her looks. I said she was beautiful and charimatic, which is damn true. lol

Michael kid's are being pimped anyway by their own grandmother, so she is no different from the Disney Exec's. Do I like that the kids have fansites now? No. But there is nothing any of us can do and the people who could do something aren't doing a damn thing. And not everyone who came out of Disney are all f**ked up. Hillary Duff is doing fine and has never been in trouble. JustineTimberlake is successful and no trouble in his part. Ryan Gosling has a booming film career. These are all Disney kids who have grown up. People focus on the bad but they forget the good. The reason why Miley and company are hot messes lies on the people who raised them, not Disney.

Their grandma is exploiting them - the one person Michael trusted before Diana Ross. And to make matters worst she is associated herself with porn people, thieves and frauds. Makes Disney look like a church choir.

The kids are going to be in show biz anyway. Prince is getting offer's already and Paris is starting to act. No one could do anything for these kids but pray and hope for the best, unless Diana Ross decides to step in - which she won't do because she's busy being on Oprah singing her oldies.

Not trying to fight, but clarifying what I said.

Yes *pray*, that is all we can do because we don't have the power to run these kids life.

 

[LindavG]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

Is the woman who announces the $10.000 donation the one who set up this fake HTW charity?

Edit: and where do they get $10.000 from anyway? Have people really been donating that much? :mello:

 

[Diplomate]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

That's strange that the medias serious and TMShit don't speak about this porn producer who makes shit business with Katherine.

Strange.

 

[chanel05]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

So it's perfectly normal to bind children to a porn producer as long as the contract is not about porn? Would you bind your own children to a contract with a guy like Mann as long as it isn't porn? The contract may not be illegal but it's immoral and unethical for damn sure.
Katherine JAckson NEVER EVER had the authority to bind them to a LIFE LONG CONTRACt with anybody let alone Mann. The fact that she had the audacity to do it anyway SPEAKS volumes, and is extremely alarming.

No one said anything about it being normal or okay to do. We just pointed out that it isn't illegal. You keep going on and on about him producing porn and that has nothing to do with the contract they are signed to. I understand that you don't agree with him producing porn but that doesn't make the contract illegal. He isn't shooting PP OR B in porn or using their names or images to sell, produce or promote it. So him producing porn doesn't matter. I wouldn't bind my future kids to anything and I don't think Katherine can bind them to anything for life either. I'm sure when they come of age they can get it thrown out.

 

[TheChosenOne]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

As always, we have started to get personal!

Let us debate the issues and not bash each other.

As it relates to the legality of the contract, there was a thread here that discussed that in great detail. It included some analysis by a lawyer and had nothing to do with Mr Mann's porn propensity and everything about the wording and content of the contract.

 

[LindavG]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

Funny how the kids being used for this fraudulent charity set up by a true lunatic is being completely left out. Why am I not surprised to read the same bs by the same people again and again.

My God I know right...it really is exhausting....Those that want to stick up for Katherine and make her sound stupid...hey..let them do it...they also make themselves look not so intelligent in the process.

yeah let them worship the fake saint, I rather stick to worshiping God as opposed to worshiping someone who's got a history of selling out children for personal gain.

This is exactly the kind of attitude that's ruining the board. Why can't you respect other people's opinions even if they differ from yours? Why these constant snide remarks about "those people" who are "not very intelligent" and "worship" anything the family does? Is that really necessary? I don't understand why moderators never say anything about this, I checked the rules and rule #1 clearly states: "1. MJJCommunity is about respecting one another. When engaging in discussion, please remember to treat others the way you would like to be treated. Our discussion forum is moderated and posts that violate the following rules will be reviewed and moderated accordingly." This place would be so much better if we let go of the bitterness and accusations towards each other and just communicate in a civil manner. We are all here because we are fans of Michael Jackson. People shouldn't be ridiculed for sharing their opinions. If you don't agree with it, then explain why. If all you have to respond is a ":doh:" or some eye-rolling gif then don't bother.

 

[chanel05]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

God.... :sigh:


How some people can not see anything wrong/illegal about it? :bugeyed Unbelievable... :doh:

*Leaving this thread.... NOW!!!*

No one said it was right. I think we all agree it's wrong but that doesn't make it illegal.
Just because it's wrong doesn't make it illegal.

Exactly. I don't like Mann's past or that Katherine is associating with him but it's not my business whom she chooses to involve herself and grandkis with. Other than the issue with the estate the charity hasn't been proven to be illegal, they probably went theough all the steps to get it running and i hope it really is benefiting underprivilaged people. At this point the only thing we can control is whether you want to participate or not.



Wrong and illegal are two different things. This is why the estate has taken them to court, if it's illegal then the proper authorities will shut it down.

I agree. Some are not being rational and comprehending what we are saying.

 

[Autumn II]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

To return to the topic. D.C.F.S. deals not only with the obviously illegal (which this very well might be), but with the welfare of minor children. They have already investigated this household ONCE, which would have completely appalled Michael! I do think this clear exploitation of the children needs to be investigated. The fact that this involves a porn producer is relevant to the entire picture of the climate in which these children are being raised.

The estate has already made a statement about Katherine's "contract" with Mann, and is in the process of suing him. Whatever else happens, this charity needs to be investigated thoroughly. Katherine has continued to forge ahead with the "events and products" detailed in the "contract," and in doing so has placed herself in an adversarial position with the estate. It is the ESTATE charged with looking after the children's financial interests, and they have already stated their position on the Mann contract.

That this is clear and apparent exploitation of Michael's children should be entirely obvious. Also, we can tell by their demeanor on GMA that they were very uncomfortable with what they were doing.

This needs to be investigated, by SOMEONE, and some action taken so this does not happen again in the future.

 

[LindavG]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

Memefan, yes you did, but I need to thank you for reminding of that ignore button again. It's definitely a blessing at times like these especially when you have random posters interfering for the heck of it while completely ignoring everything else.

If you're referring to me, I didn't interfere "for the heck of it". If you read back you'll see that xThunderx'2s post is clearly directed at me and I've told her before to have a little bit of respect for other people's views. I put thought and effort into my posts, believe it or not, so it's a bit disappointing when all I get is a ":doh:" in response as if I'm some sort of idiot. People may not agree with me and that's fine, but you don't have to ridicule me.

Sorry if I sound like I'm overreacting but I've seen this type of behavior time and time again and it almost makes me want to stop coming to this board altogether, as it's so filled with hate and bitterness nowadays. It's just sad. This place used to be nice and understanding, now you see people attacking each other just because they have a slightly different opinion on something.

 

[xthunderx2]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

If you're referring to me, I didn't interfere "for the heck of it". If you read back you'll see that xThunderx'2s post is clearly directed at me and I've told her before to have a little bit of respect for other people's views. I put thought and effort into my posts, believe it or not, so it's a bit disappointing when all I get is a ":doh:" in response as if I'm some sort of idiot. People may not agree with me and that's fine, but you don't have to ridicule me.

Sorry if I sound like I'm overreacting but I've seen this type of behavior time and time again and it almost makes me want to stop coming to this board altogether, as it's so filled with hate and bitterness nowadays. It's just sad. This place used to be nice and understanding, now you see people attacking each other just because they have a slightly different opinion on something.

I have stated multiple times that you are entitled to your own opinion....I even said I want going to argue with you..but you kept on. This thread is about the Katharine and the children..and their interview on GMA...I would like for it to get back on topic....I am sorry if I dont agree with your views..that is my right.... will not address you again..I would appreciative it if you would do the same...all I care about is Price Paris and blanket.

 

[chanel05]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

Again completely ignoring the point. I will mention PORN until either Mann, Katherine or I take my last breath, because that is what the guy is all about. So if it;s not normal why downplay and keep on excusing it? It does not matter if they can get it thrown out or not, FFS the point is her binding them to such a contract for HER personal gain, It's not too hard to grasp is it? And no, ignoring this KEY FACTOR does not make Katherine Jackson's phuckery okay or go away.
Since denial seems to be the Jackson's favorite word, and since you are the big Jackson fam fan that you are, have fun being in denial about what those beloved Jackson's of urs, including Katherine are all about.


I'm outta this thread I can't take this blatant hypocrisy anymore.

Katherine Jackson has outdone herself this time, there was a time when I actually cared about this woman I can't believe how stupid and naive I was to even care about her, out of all people. I feel ashamed of myself for having cared for someone like her. When I was little my mother taught me that greed was a bad thing guess nobody gave the memo to her though. I'm over 60 years younger than her and know this and yet she doesn't seem to be aware of it. SMDH

You just need to chill. No one is excusing Or downplaying anything. As I said earlier we all disagree with the whole situation but that doesn't make it illegal. You love the word hypocrisy but you're one of the most hypocritical members on MJJC. Also just because I don't bash the and attack the family like you do, doesn't make me a fam supporter or in denial. You see and hear what you want to. So of course by the standards of your little world I will be in denial. Once again you have resorted to name calling and trying to be little others when they don't see things your way. We are supposed to be adults that can engage in civilized conversations with different people whose opinions may be totally opposite of ours.... But you don't seem to have the capability to act as such. Your opinions aren't facts that are set in stone and you need to realize that. Everyone here has different opinions and no one is ANY MORE OR LESS FOR HAVING A DIFFERENT VEIW ON THINGS!!!

This is exactly the kind of attitude that's ruining the board. Why can't you respect other people's opinions even if they differ from yours? Why these constant snide remarks about "those people" who are "not very intelligent" and "worship" anything the family does? Is that really necessary? I don't understand why moderators never say anything about this, I checked the rules and rule #1 clearly states: "1. MJJCommunity is about respecting one another. When engaging in discussion, please remember to treat others the way you would like to be treated. Our discussion forum is moderated and posts that violate the following rules will be reviewed and moderated accordingly." This place would be so much better if we let go of the bitterness and accusations towards each other and just communicate in a civil manner. We are all here because we are fans of Michael Jackson. People shouldn't be ridiculed for sharing their opinions. If you don't agree with it, then explain why. If all you have to respond is a ":doh:" or some eye-rolling gif then don't bother.

I agree that attitude is ruining this board. Instead of engaging in civil conversations, they come in here just to bash posters who don't agree with them. They think a certain way and if you don't think that way then you're wrong. I honestly think the mods agree with their views so they don't say anything unless they start personal attacks(which in my opinion they let them have one too many. N I know they aren't calling anybody a worshipper of anything, they really don't want to bark up that tree). If you're just starting mess, don't come. N if you hate the family sooooo much stay off 2300 Jackson street

 

[marebear]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

After reading all the posts here I don't think I want to see this interview. Michael would hate all of this and his children being used like that and everyone knows it. Including his family.

I hope when the kids get older they will have more control and do what they want. I hope they will put people in their places when they show disrespect to their father. Little comments about being normal may seem harmless but we all know that the media think badly of Michael and still take little shots at him. If it means nothing then why do they make a big deal about them being normal? Hopefully someday Michael will get the credit he deserves in being a good father to those kids. He loved them and did the best job in protecting them.

 

[xthunderx2]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

After reading all the posts here I don't think I want to see this interview. Michael would hate all of this and his children being used like that and everyone knows it. Including his family.

I hope when the kids get older they will have more control and do what they want. I hope they will put people in their places when they show disrespect to their father. Little comments about being normal may seem harmless but we all know that the media think badly of Michael and still take little shots at him. If it means nothing then why do they make a big deal about them being normal? Hopefully someday Michael will get the credit he deserves in being a good father to those kids. He loved them and did the best job in protecting them.

yes..Michael does deserve ALL the credit for how wonderful his children are...why it is so difficult for the media to admit that is beyond me. It is about time Michael starts getting recognized for the great dad that he really was...after all Katherine has only had the children for 19 months..Michael had them for 12 years. he put all the love and hard work into those children..that is why they are they way they are....bless their little hearts.

 

[chanel05]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

To return to the topic. D.C.F.S. deals not only with the obviously illegal (which this very well might be), but with the welfare of minor children. They have already investigated this household ONCE, which would have completely appalled Michael! I do think this clear exploitation of the children needs to be investigated. The fact that this involves a porn producer is relevant to the entire picture of the climate in which these children are being raised.

The estate has already made a statement about Katherine's "contract" with Mann, and is in the process of suing him. Whatever else happens, this charity needs to be investigated thoroughly. Katherine has continued to forge ahead with the "events and products" detailed in the "contract," and in doing so has placed herself in an adversarial position with the estate. It is the ESTATE charged with looking after the children's financial interests, and they have already stated their position on the Mann contract.

That this is clear and apparent exploitation of Michael's children should be entirely obvious. Also, we can tell by their demeanor on GMA that they were very uncomfortable with what they were doing.

This needs to be investigated, by SOMEONE, and some action taken so this does not happen again in the future.

The house was investigated the 1st time because the thought a child was in immediate harm or danger(stun gun). While i dont agree with it, This contract isn't putting them in harm or danger(physically). Exploitation can be looked at in many different ways. In that case all of the kids parents that are on toddlers and tiaras, nanny 911, John and Kate plus 8 and any show like that should be looked at by DCFS for exploitation but they are not. I don't even think they investigate for that. So with PP&B being famous just by virtue of who there father is, they probably wouldn't even get a look for this matter. Also she isnt binding them to anything illegal. Do I agree with it NO, but that doesn't change the way things are/work. N from the I interview I didnt get "I'm uncomfortable". To me they were just nonchalant like "okay, whatever". Also they are suing Mann for using MJ image to promote things which is illegal. The estate never said what Katherine doing is illegal even though I'm sure they may not agree, just like many on here don't.

After reading all the posts here I don't think I want to see this interview. Michael would hate all of this and his children being used like that and everyone knows it. Including his family.

I hope when the kids get older they will have more control and do what they want. I hope they will put people in their places when they show disrespect to their father. Little comments about being normal may seem harmless but we all know that the media think badly of Michael and still take little shots at him. If it means nothing then why do they make a big deal about them being normal? Hopefully someday Michael will get the credit he deserves in being a good father to those kids. He loved them and did the best job in protecting them.

The interview isn't bad. Don't let the bs that is being spewed by some on here dictate you. You have to watch everything for yourself. I watched the I interview and it was actually pretty good.

 

[Mechi]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

The only way to stop Katherine exploiting the kids is not to support the business she and Mann try to push with the kids names.

By what I've read I also don't think DCFS would have a legal stand in this... and they are overworked with too many even worse cases than this while not having enough finances at all but to fight with cuts of those... ridiculous... maybe one could call Gloria Allred into this?... but only seeing her face still makes me throwing up still honestly.

However as a Michael Jackson fan I have a very clear opinion about Mrs. Jacksons doing here which I'd only say to her face but not here... out of respect for Michael.

That foundation has nothing to do with Michael... and I'll not support a charity ever making the wrong ppl earn from it.

It's a shame. They could push the three kids no better way into the mud!

 

[prettygirlmj]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

You know, from what I heard, Prince is always on ichat talking to his dad's fans. Maybe someone can talk to him and show him all this information he doesn't know. Just an idea.

 

[chanel05]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

The only way to stop Katherine exploiting the kids is not to support the business she and Mann try to push with the kids names.

By what I've read I also don't think DCFS would have a legal stand in this... and they are overworked with too many even worse cases than this while not having enough finances at all but to fight with cuts of those... ridiculous... however...

........mud!

Thank you for saying this, I agree. People have to stop getting caught up in emotions and think rationally. My older sister works for DCFS so I hear alot about how things work and operate in their offices. I wasn't saying I agree, it's normal, or I accept it. I was just stating whats what. No matter how any of us feel about a situation, it doesn't change what's illegal/legal or how things operate no matter how we ay try to twist it. They have large caseloads that they have to try to navigate through, with furloughs, long work hours and pay cuts because everyone is broke. So unless they think PP&B are in I mediate harm or danger(physically) or that Katherine is an incapable guardian, I don't think they are gonna come.

 

[chanel05]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

Those of you who have children, I wonder how many of YOUR houses have ever been investigated by child-protective services, for ANYTHING? Mine sure hasn't.

Let's not let the thread digress into a pointless and personal argument, ok? Just ignore certain comments.

The point is, we all saw for ourselves the demeanor of those children, and most of us know the background of Mann, that he not only STOLE things (IMO) from Michael, but got Katherine to sign a contract (which will not hold water), subjecting the children to bondage for the rest of their lives. And we know that the estate is SUING Mann, and has disavowed any connection with that charity. Those are facts, and there's really nothing to be said in support of Katherine's actions.

It remains to be seen, for those of us who CARE, what we are going to do about it/what sort of action will be taken?

No one on here is supporting Katherine or saying she is right. N none of us can do anything about it but cause harm to the situation. All we can do is not support Mann and his endeavors.

 

[Autumn II]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

No one on here is supporting Katherine or saying she is right. N none of us can do anything about it but cause harm to the situation. All we can do is not support Mann and his endeavors.

Yes, we CAN help, and we will, and if you choose not to participate, that is certainly your right.

There will be an M.J.A.N. (Michael Jackson Accountability Network) statement and a press-release issued soon. Link will be posted here, for your comments. Those who choose to care and try to make a difference about Michael's children and the life he wanted for them (and there is NO question about that), let your voices be heard.

 

[xthunderx2]

Re: Katherine PP&B on GMA 2/25

Yes, we CAN help, and we will, and if you choose not to participate, that is certainly your right.

There will be an M.J.A.N. (Michael Jackson Accountability Network) statement and a press-release issued soon. Link will be posted here, for your comments. Those who choose to care and try to make a difference about Michael's children and the life he wanted for them (and there is NO question about that), let your voices be heard.

I DEFINITELY support this!!..:clapping::clapping::clapping: