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Thriller 40th Anniversary - Songs Discussion

zinniabooklover said:
See!! I knew I'd seen these kind of assessments! Maybe the comments I saw related specifically to Apple. That would make total sense.

Just out of interest, if the iTunes is the best of the 3, which is the worst?
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The CD. Brian Gardner did the cd...and there were errors:

1. Too bass heavy
2. I Just Can't Stop Loving You had it's intro cut.
3. I'm So Blue faded out too early.
 
I got blasted here by some for suggesting The Toy or the BTM demo would probably be the kind of thing you listen to once, go, "ah, interesting", and then never listen to again. Looks like I was right.
 
NeoGardiV8 said:
You are right, however, please let's not confuse @zinniabooklover with the topic of audio quality.
Even what i said isn't exactly true either because, usually, streaming versions are offered in higher bitrates and sample rates, and yet i did not mention any of that because it really doesn't matter in the end.
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The average music listener wouldn't notice. It's the hardcore listener that will look at bitrates and waveforms, etc.
 
farlnd said:
The CD. Brian Gardner did the cd...and there were errors:

1. Too bass heavy
2. I Just Can't Stop Loving You had it's intro cut.
3. I'm So Blue faded out too early.
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oh, that's so interesting. And too bass heavy, that never works. And I love the bass but it can distort so much if it's not done right. I'm no expert (she said, hastily), that's just my impression.
 
farlnd said:
This isn't exactly true.

Bad 25 for example...I have a digital edition, CD and an itunes edition and all three are mastered differently from each other... iTunes being the best of the three. Apple have their own mastering engineers so when you see Apple Digital Master on their listing it's done in house.
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to sum up, there are releases where Apple audio files instead of WAV/flac ones should be kept for a personal digital music archive , if I want to collect the best quality? that is new to me. also that there a different mastering engineers for releases related to Apple vs. rest.
 
farlnd said:
The average music listener wouldn't notice. It's the hardcore listener that will look at bitrates and waveforms, etc.
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Glad we agree then, that's my point. We shouldn't confuse people because "Orange Music's Digital Mastering in 99bits" is an slight improvement over other streaming services or even CD.
 
NeoGardiV8 said:
You are right, however, please let's not confuse @zinniabooklover with the topic of audio quality.
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Well spotted, lol.

NeoGardiV8 said:
Even what i said isn't exactly true either because, usually, streaming versions are offered in higher bitrates and sample rates, and yet i did not mention any of that because it really doesn't matter in the end. Maybe what Apple offers is different and perhaps slightly better, but in the end, it still sounds terrible because that's just modern day mastering.
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Now that I do understand. Modern day mastering? 🙁 Or do I mean? :eek:

NeoGardiV8 said:
I don't know if my point is getting across, but basically, what i mean is
Yeah, audio is complicated, but let's not make it even more complicated to understand to people that want to learn lmao
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You did get your point across. I do find this confusing but I did understand what you said here. So thanks for that.
 
MJ5 said:
to sum up, there are releases where Apple audio files should be kept instead of WAV/flac files, if I want to collect the best quality?
that is new to me. also that there a different mastering engineers for releases related to Apple vs. rest.
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Yes absolutely look into the apple files too. Xscape is also a better release than the cd.

"Chicago" comparison. Top is my cd rip, iTunes on the bottom:

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I'm waiting for the day when they start putting up apple lossless files for sale. Right now they're only streaming with apple music but I hope that'll change.
 
farlnd said:
Yes absolutely look into the apple files too. Xscape is also a better release than the cd.

"Chicago" comparison. Top is my cd rip, iTunes on the bottom:

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It’s probably made -2/3db more silent and eq ed.
 
Fuzball said:
Aren't itunes files lossy?
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Lossy yes, but their AAC tech is so good that if you run it through spectral analysis you can't tell. I have never seen a lossy file look this clean.

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I think apple lossless will be sold eventually, but for now I'm really happy with this.
 
farlnd said:
Lossy yes, but their AAC tech is so good that if you run it through spectral analysis you can't tell. I have never seen a lossy file look this clean.

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I think apple lossless will be sold eventually, but for now I'm really happy with this.
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It's honestly annoying at times, because AAC is probably the best lossy format, however, AAC itself as a codec has like, at least 4 entirely different versions of itself, and the best version (the one that produces those amazing looking spectrograms), that one, is owned and can only be used by Apple themselves lol
 
NeoGardiV8 said:
It's honestly annoying at times, because AAC is probably the best lossy format, however, AAC itself as a codec has like, at least 4 entirely different versions of itself, and the best version (the one that produces those amazing looking spectrograms), that one, is owned and can only be used by Apple themselves lol
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There is an m4a codec available for dbpoweramp that let's you use it as long as you have itunes installed. It's at the bottom when you enter the link.

https://www.dbpoweramp.com/codec-central-m4a.htm
 
farlnd said:
Yes absolutely look into the apple files too. Xscape is also a better release than the cd.

"Chicago" comparison. Top is my cd rip, iTunes on the bottom:

imgbox.com

imgbox - fast, simple image host

Use imgbox to upload, host and share all your images. It's simple, free and blazing fast!
imgbox.com imgbox.com

I'm waiting for the day when they start putting up apple lossless files for sale. Right now they're only streaming with apple music but I hope that'll change.
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So since what release do you recommend keeping the apple sourced files (aac, m4a) instead of WAV/FLACs?
As I try to keep my digital collection in shape, I might need to exchange some files. It's a bit confusing now.
 
MJ5 said:
So since what release do you recommend keeping the apple sourced files (aac, m4a) instead of WAV/FLACs?
As I try to keep my digital collection in shape, I might need to exchange some files. It's a bit confusing now.
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The ones I own are Bad 25 and Xscape with Thriller 40 coming tonight. Those are keepers. I haven't actually purchased the rest of the digital masters but I may out of my own curiosity.
 
farlnd said:
The ones I own are Bad 25 and Xscape with Thriller 40 coming tonight. Those are keepers. I haven't actually purchased the rest of the digital masters but I may out of my own curiosity.
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Highly doubt they'll beat the originals for the first 4 albums.
 
farlnd said:
The ones I own are Bad 25 and Xscape with Thriller 40 coming tonight. Those are keepers. I haven't actually purchased the rest of the digital masters but I may out of my own curiosity.
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I'll save you some money here, HIStory is the 2007 mastering, and no, it isn't even slightly better than the versions found in other streaming services, ignore that one exists.
Dangerous is the 2014 remaster, ignore that one exists too
And well, OTW, Thriller and Bad are all a million times better on their original pressings
 
NeoGardiV8 said:
I'll save you some money here, HIStory is the 2007 mastering, and no, it isn't even slightly better than the versions found in other streaming services, ignore that one exists.
Dangerous is the 2014 remaster, ignore that one exists too
And well, OTW, Thriller and Bad are all a million times better on their original pressings
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HIStory was remastered in 2007? I didn't know there was a remaster done of it.
 
AlwaysThere said:
  1. “Behind the Mask (Mike’s Mix)” — As expected, this is just the Greg Phillinganes instrumental (with weaker drums) with MJ’s vocals. It has a completely different arrangement than the 2010 mix though: the first verse is longer (but the second half is unusable), the second verse is scratch vocals, the chorus doesn’t show up until after the second verse, the two “bridges” are flipped, the “hee hee hee” background vocals are sourced from the end of the song, and there are some extra ad-libs. For me, this is painfully average (except for the last 10 seconds or so, which suddenly becomes f**king awesome). John McClain saved this one. 2/5
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McClain obviously didn't remix this version. He probably remixed the last version Michael worked on - the version with almost full vocals and that beat-boxing. The version released on T40 has completely different vocal take and very very rough scratch vocals. So I don't think "McClain saved it", he just remixed almost finished song. With this rough demo he wouldn't be able to do, remix or save anything. It's un-savable and I'm shocked they decided to release that over that version McClain remixed.
 
MJbr2 said:
I really have to jump on this: I hate the misconception most people have about vinyl that it sounds dirty, noisy, full of clicks and pops. If you're playing a beat up record, maybe yes, but that is not the standard, at all. Vinyl records in good shape murder any CD counterparts 90% of the time.
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Have only just caught this. I agree that vinyl gets a bad rap. I always looked after my vinyl (erm, except some of them, the ones I played with my fingernails, lol) and was brilliant at dropping the needle exactly into the groove (should have been a DJ, lol). My records sounded fine. I was being a bit lazy there. I can't be bothered to do a history lesson each time and I don't miss vinyl. I'm happy with CD so I usually just let it go. But if vinyl is your thing, I can understand you wanting to clear up the misconceptions.

MJbr2 said:
If you've never listened to any of MJs albums (OTW to Dangerous) from the OG record copies in good/pristine condition, you've never heard them in their max potential.
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Oh, I have. I didn't buy Michael's records until after he died but I heard them on vinyl loads at the time. That was all we had, after all, and I never really liked cassettes.

MJbr2 said:
It's been almost four years since I started collecting records and, after I bought original vinyl pressings of Bad and Dangerous, my CDs have gone to waste. Bad, for example, has a unique punch to it that it's just not there on the CDs and further reissues/remasters.
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Yeah, but I'm lazy and I want an easy life. Vinyl, to me, is too high maintenance. Can't be bothered. Takes up too much space. Too expensive. I'm so pleased to see the revival of vinyl - it's been great for the indie record shops - but it's not for me. Not any more. Been there, done that.

I love my CD's. They are rubbish for the artwork, sleeve notes, booklets etc. Total crap. But as a way of delivering my music to me in a really easy way, they work just fine.

MJbr2 said:
Also, vinyl doesn't really have hiss. Cassettes do. Vinyl has surface noise.
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Agreed. Surface noise can be a pain, tho'.

MJbr2 said:
It was true before streaming services offered lossless. Now, the lossless versions are virtually the CD files.
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Um ... :eek:
 
I'd just like to say that the statement that Vinyl murders CD is just not true. It's a case by case basis and even then most vinyl nowadays is pretty much the same master that's on the CD.

If a cd is mastered properly it can sound amazing, most master nowadays are compressed to all hell though, and those masters usually end up on the vinyl as well, just at a lower volume level.
 
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