Thriller 40th Anniversary - Songs Discussion

The way I would describe Can’t Get Out of the Rain: Imagine if the Beatles released a song called “Hey Dude” and what it is is actually just the “Na na na” part of Hey Jude but the only thing the Beatles did was overdub it singing “Dude” over “Jude”.

Can’t Get Out of the Rain is that but with You Can’t Win.
 
It's awful. Not as bad as the "Michael " album but a very close second
I’ll insist to my dying breath that Michael is a damn solid album (minus the… y’know) and leagues superior to XSCAPE. The worst estate release thus far, in my eyes, is Off the Wall 2016, mostly because of that garbage documentary. Thriller 40 is definitely second.
 
The way I would describe Can’t Get Out of the Rain: Imagine if the Beatles released a song called “Hey Dude” and what it is is actually just the “Na na na” part of Hey Jude but the only thing the Beatles did was overdub it singing “Dude” over “Jude”.

Can’t Get Out of the Rain is that but with You Can’t Win.
Or maybe Queen in 1977 putting out a jam session called "We Will Knock You" with just this phrase sang over stomps and claps for 5 minutes.
 
I’ll insist to my dying breath that Michael is a damn solid album (minus the… y’know) and leagues superior to XSCAPE. The worst estate release thus far, in my eyes, is Off the Wall 2016, mostly because of that garbage documentary. Thriller 40 is definitely second.
I did not think it could be as bad as this after the chalk stuff. The songs are shit tbf. Well the unheard ones. The ones we already heard are ok but again nothing special . Chalk is all is forgiven lol , sorta haha
 
I’ll insist to my dying breath that Michael is a damn solid album (minus the… y’know) and leagues superior to XSCAPE.
So true. Those are producers who truly worked with MJ and remixed stuff based on the originals. It's much more faithful to MJs vision than Xscape.

The worst estate release thus far, in my eyes, is Off the Wall 2016, mostly because of that garbage documentary.
OTW 2016 is indeed the worst release for being pointless and presenting the worst sounding version of the album so far. In this sense, Bad 25 is the second for making the Bad album unlistenable.
I'm probably the only person who actually likes Spike Lee's docs as they're a mix of storytelling with people who were there sharing their experiences and showcasing the impact and accolades of the album on the vision of new/contemporary artists (they also had new concert footage and I love it lol). I'll defend them to my deathbed.

Thriller 40 is definitely second.
Hell no. OTW 2016 doesn't count for not presenting anything new. Thriller 40 takes the cake.
Bad 25 > Michael > Xscape > Thriller 40
 
I’ll insist to my dying breath that Michael is a damn solid album (minus the… y’know) and leagues superior to XSCAPE. The worst estate release thus far, in my eyes, is Off the Wall 2016, mostly because of that garbage documentary. Thriller 40 is definitely second.

That's the one with the chalk right? I think I have in storage...don't even know why I bought it.

I'm just in the middle of listening to the 2 cd deluxe edition of Lionel Richie's "Can't Slow Down", with the 12" singles and edits being bonus tracks on disc 1 and disc 2 consisting of outtakes from the vault...now why can't Thriller 40 be like this?
 
Who Do You Know
I ADORE THIS TRACK! This is a fantastic song. It sound very much like a Jacksons song, perhaps something from "The Jacksons" album, even. I really wish they had cleaned it up a little, remastered it and released it as a single a head of the release, however... I can recognize that it doesn't have much marketing power, there's not much is going on. It's definitely not a hit, but it a fantastic song.

Carousel
Yes, it's the full version!

Behind the Mask
Here we go.... I thought this and "The Toy" would change the way I prioritize MJ's music. I always liked to treat the posthumous albums as real albums and prioritized the "finished" versions. I thought that I would place this track on my phone under Thriller and never listen to the Michael version again because this is the true version. However, it really is rough. It sounds great but it sounds like an idea. The Michael version is actually much better in my opinion and those YouTube mixes of "the 80s version"... yep, they're much better too. For obvious reasons though, this is a demo, it's an idea. Just don't go in expecting something on par to the YouTube mixes. All that being said, I did enjoy this demo.

Can't Get Outta the Rain
I know there's a lot of hate for this being here and I understand why but oh my, is it gooooodddd. It sounds phenomenal and I adore this song. I'm always happy to play it.

The Toy
The same goes for this one as Behind the Mask. Best of Joy is SO much better (imo). However.... This demo, the harmonies are beautiful and I feel they're missing in Best of Joy. This working versions honestly inspire me to keep writing music my self. The piano in this track is gorgeous too. It's not simple triads, these a sus and 6 chords and the piano is very akin to Love Never Felt So Good. The vocals in this demo are incredible

What a Lovely Way to Go
ermmmm... again, its VERY rough. Trust me, stick with it. It starts off pretty weird but it gets better as you listen on. It's super interesting to hear these working versions of tracks. It is a great song. Just like Who Do You Know, it's a little out of character. It reminds me of a Prince or Queen song. I think it wouldn't be so abrasive if it was in a larger track list, if we had Night Line and Hot Street, etc. But in conclusion it is a really great addition to this album.


So....


In conclusion:

Could they have done better YES but I am super grateful for what we have. I think adding in tracks we haven't heard before as well as demos we haven't heard before makes this worth buying, like the Xscape Deluxe addition.


What did you guys think?
 
I'm currently listening to disc 2 through a vpn on their youtube channel. The distortion on the leak isn't there. It appears to be just a bad cd rip. Can anyone with CD copy of the album here be able to verify there is indeed no distortion?
 
Who Do You Know
I ADORE THIS TRACK! This is a fantastic song. It sound very much like a Jacksons song, perhaps something from "The Jacksons" album, even. I really wish they had cleaned it up a little, remastered it and released it as a single a head of the release, however... I can recognize that it doesn't have much marketing power, there's not much is going on. It's definitely not a hit, but it a fantastic song.

Carousel
Yes, it's the full version!

Behind the Mask
Here we go.... I thought this and "The Toy" would change the way I prioritize MJ's music. I always liked to treat the posthumous albums as real albums and prioritized the "finished" versions. I thought that I would place this track on my phone under Thriller and never listen to the Michael version again because this is the true version. However, it really is rough. It sounds great but it sounds like an idea. The Michael version is actually much better in my opinion and those YouTube mixes of "the 80s version"... yep, they're much better too. For obvious reasons though, this is a demo, it's an idea. Just don't go in expecting something on par to the YouTube mixes. All that being said, I did enjoy this demo.

Can't Get Outta the Rain
I know there's a lot of hate for this being here and I understand why but oh my, is it gooooodddd. It sounds phenomenal and I adore this song. I'm always happy to play it.

The Toy
The same goes for this one as Behind the Mask. Best of Joy is SO much better (imo). However.... This demo, the harmonies are beautiful and I feel they're missing in Best of Joy. This working versions honestly inspire me to keep writing music my self. The piano in this track is gorgeous too. It's not simple triads, these a sus and 6 chords and the piano is very akin to Love Never Felt So Good. The vocals in this demo are incredible

What a Lovely Way to Go
ermmmm... again, its VERY rough. Trust me, stick with it. It starts off pretty weird but it gets better as you listen on. It's super interesting to hear these working versions of tracks. It is a great song. Just like Who Do You Know, it's a little out of character. It reminds me of a Prince or Queen song. I think it wouldn't be so abrasive if it was in a larger track list, if we had Night Line and Hot Street, etc. But in conclusion it is a really great addition to this album.


So....


In conclusion:

Could they have done better YES but I am super grateful for what we have. I think adding in tracks we haven't heard before as well as demos we haven't heard before makes this worth buying, like the Xscape Deluxe addition.


What did you guys think?

I think one of the issues here is that there pretty loosey-goosey with the term "Demo", and I think it really should be used to help shape expectations.

Walk with me for a bit here: Starlight is not labelled as a demo, likely because it's actually the demo for Thriller. So calling it "Starlight (Demo)" could cause confusion, and calling it "Thriller (Demo)" equally so (not for us, but to the casual listener who might go "Where the hell are the Thriller lyrics"). So this one, okay, fair enough.

But then the next track is "Got The Hots (Demo)". But wait, we've never had a song called "Got The Hots" before. Is there a finished version out there, and this is just the demo version? It's unclear.

Then we get to Behind the Mask (Mike's Mix, Demo) - My goodness, word soup over here. But in this case the demo label makes sense. This is a demo, or early version, of a song we have a "finished" (albeit posthumously and without Jackson's involvedment) version of.

The Toy (Demo) makes sense, because it's clearly an early demo of Best of Joy. But if we apply the Starlight logic, why is this labelled demo and Starlight isn't. Oh god, this is getting out of hand...

So for whatever reason, Starlight, Carousel, and Can't Get Outta the Rain are the only ones not labelled as demos, and only one of those makes sense (Can't Get Out of the Rain being an officially released B-Side, albeit just the end hook of You Cant Win from THE WIZ and really shouldn't have been included in this collection).

So yeah, this weird naming convention that defies logic really doesn't help us.

To me: demo = early unfinished version of a song. "Billie Jean (Demo)", I understand what that is. But for these "unreleased" tracks it's pretty confusing.

And in fairness, this isn't exactly new. One only need look to THE ULTIMATE COLLECTION to see this bizarre naming scheme.
Fall Again (Demo), Beautiful Girl (Demo), while In The Back, The Way You Love Me, We've Had Enough all are not labelled as demos.

At any rate: I was hoping BEHIND THE MASK was more finished compared to this, but still cool to have. The one thing I was most interested in. The "Michael" version turned out to be pretty good after all; just way too many "hee hee" overdubs.
 
Agreed 100%, i don't get the absolute hate boner people have for Michael... well, technically, i obviously know why however, ignoring the existence of those 3 tracks, the Michael album is pretty great.
I love the cover. It's brilliant. Way better than the shiny stuff they put out now
 
Who Do You Know
I ADORE THIS TRACK! This is a fantastic song. It sound very much like a Jacksons song, perhaps something from "The Jacksons" album, even. I really wish they had cleaned it up a little, remastered it and released it as a single a head of the release, however... I can recognize that it doesn't have much marketing power, there's not much is going on. It's definitely not a hit, but it a fantastic song.

Carousel
Yes, it's the full version!

Behind the Mask
Here we go.... I thought this and "The Toy" would change the way I prioritize MJ's music. I always liked to treat the posthumous albums as real albums and prioritized the "finished" versions. I thought that I would place this track on my phone under Thriller and never listen to the Michael version again because this is the true version. However, it really is rough. It sounds great but it sounds like an idea. The Michael version is actually much better in my opinion and those YouTube mixes of "the 80s version"... yep, they're much better too. For obvious reasons though, this is a demo, it's an idea. Just don't go in expecting something on par to the YouTube mixes. All that being said, I did enjoy this demo.

Can't Get Outta the Rain
I know there's a lot of hate for this being here and I understand why but oh my, is it gooooodddd. It sounds phenomenal and I adore this song. I'm always happy to play it.

The Toy
The same goes for this one as Behind the Mask. Best of Joy is SO much better (imo). However.... This demo, the harmonies are beautiful and I feel they're missing in Best of Joy. This working versions honestly inspire me to keep writing music my self. The piano in this track is gorgeous too. It's not simple triads, these a sus and 6 chords and the piano is very akin to Love Never Felt So Good. The vocals in this demo are incredible

What a Lovely Way to Go
ermmmm... again, its VERY rough. Trust me, stick with it. It starts off pretty weird but it gets better as you listen on. It's super interesting to hear these working versions of tracks. It is a great song. Just like Who Do You Know, it's a little out of character. It reminds me of a Prince or Queen song. I think it wouldn't be so abrasive if it was in a larger track list, if we had Night Line and Hot Street, etc. But in conclusion it is a really great addition to this album.
I enjoyed reading this, it was helpful. I have only heard CGOOTR once or twice but I loved it. Looking forward to that one.

Any thoughts on Starlight? The hiss that has been mentioned?
 
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I enjoyed reading this, it was helpful. I have only heard CGOOTR once or twice but I loved it. Looking forward to that one.

Any thoughts on Starlight? The hiss that has been mentioned?
Thank you!

No noticeable hiss to me. Though it was recorded on tape and there really isn't much they could've done without noise reduction which also reduces quality. I like the hiss, it makes it feel real. Though, as mentioned there is no noticeable hiss to me (I'm not an audiophile though, just musician hobbiest). Starlight sounds amazing. It's not the rubbish YouTube quality you've heard before. I'd say it's remastered but it's likely that the leaked version is just a low rip of the original. It is a tad over compressed though, it's very very loud to the point of the low end over powering slightly (a lot of this album is like this) but its 100% better than the leaked version.
 
I think one of the issues here is that there pretty loosey-goosey with the term "Demo", and I think it really should be used to help shape expectations.

Walk with me for a bit here: Starlight is not labelled as a demo, likely because it's actually the demo for Thriller. So calling it "Starlight (Demo)" could cause confusion, and calling it "Thriller (Demo)" equally so (not for us, but to the casual listener who might go "Where the hell are the Thriller lyrics"). So this one, okay, fair enough.

But then the next track is "Got The Hots (Demo)". But wait, we've never had a song called "Got The Hots" before. Is there a finished version out there, and this is just the demo version? It's unclear.

Then we get to Behind the Mask (Mike's Mix, Demo) - My goodness, word soup over here. But in this case the demo label makes sense. This is a demo, or early version, of a song we have a "finished" (albeit posthumously and without Jackson's involvedment) version of.

The Toy (Demo) makes sense, because it's clearly an early demo of Best of Joy. But if we apply the Starlight logic, why is this labelled demo and Starlight isn't. Oh god, this is getting out of hand...

So for whatever reason, Starlight, Carousel, and Can't Get Outta the Rain are the only ones not labelled as demos, and only one of those makes sense (Can't Get Out of the Rain being an officially released B-Side, albeit just the end hook of You Cant Win from THE WIZ and really shouldn't have been included in this collection).

So yeah, this weird naming convention that defies logic really doesn't help us.

To me: demo = early unfinished version of a song. "Billie Jean (Demo)", I understand what that is. But for these "unreleased" tracks it's pretty confusing.

And in fairness, this isn't exactly new. One only need look to THE ULTIMATE COLLECTION to see this bizarre naming scheme.
Fall Again (Demo), Beautiful Girl (Demo), while In The Back, The Way You Love Me, We've Had Enough all are not labelled as demos.

At any rate: I was hoping BEHIND THE MASK was more finished compared to this, but still cool to have. The one thing I was most interested in. The "Michael" version turned out to be pretty good after all; just way too many "hee hee" overdubs.
Agreed.
 
Thank you!

No noticeable hiss to me. Though it was recorded on tape and there really isn't much they could've done without noise reduction which also reduces quality. I like the hiss, it makes it feel real. Though, as mentioned there is no noticeable hiss to me (I'm not an audiophile though, just musician hobbiest). Starlight sounds amazing. It's not the rubbish YouTube quality you've heard before. I'd say it's remastered but it's likely that the leaked version is just a low rip of the original. It is a tad over compressed though, it's very very loud to the point of the low end over powering slightly (a lot of this album is like this) but its 100% better than the leaked version.
It was mastered by Brian "Big Bass" Gardner after all, man lives up to his name lmao
 
Listening to a HQ rip now, and there is definitely a difference in quality to the first leak/s that was heavily compressed. Especially related to Starlight where it seemed that too much would be going on in the background.

My rating of the release goes one level up (+1) to 6/10 overall.
 
Thank you!

No noticeable hiss to me. Though it was recorded on tape and there really isn't much they could've done without noise reduction which also reduces quality. I like the hiss, it makes it feel real. Though, as mentioned there is no noticeable hiss to me (I'm not an audiophile though, just musician hobbiest).
I'm not an audiophile either. I like decent quality, especially for the bass, and I want to hear all the layers but I'm no expert. My listening equipment is just basic, lol. I grew up with vinyl so the hiss won't feel weird to me, if I even notice it, but I don't miss all the background stuff you got with vinyl, if I'm honest. So we'll see.

Starlight sounds amazing. It's not the rubbish YouTube quality you've heard before.
Oh, I haven't heard any of this stuff. Listened to CGOOTR, as I said. Heard Carousel once. That's it. All of Disc 2 is new to me.

I'd say it's remastered but it's likely that the leaked version is just a low rip of the original.
that is such a relief. Bc I'll be buying the CD. I don't do digital and it seemed as if the CD was gonna be much lower quality. I don't mind a bit of discrepancy in the quality between formats. That will always happen. But it sounded as if the gap was likely to be pretty big. Was not happy about that. Feel more relaxed about it now.

It is a tad over compressed though, it's very very loud to the point of the low end over powering slightly
OK, slightly less enthusiastic about this, lol. But we'll see.

(a lot of this album is like this) but its 100% better than the leaked version.
Can't do a comparison since I haven't heard the leaked version but this is all so useful. This is all making sense to me. Thanks so much.
 
that is such a relief. Bc I'll be buying the CD. I don't do digital and it seemed as if the CD was gonna be much lower quality. I don't mind a bit of discrepancy in the quality between formats. That will always happen. But it sounded as if the gap was likely to be pretty big. Was not happy about that. Feel more relaxed about it now.
Wow wow wow! let me stop you right there.
In this modern era, sadly CD and Streaming are always the exact same, pretty sad but yeah :(
 
Wow wow wow! let me stop you right there.
In this modern era, sadly CD and Streaming are always the exact same, pretty sad but yeah :(
oh, now, this is interesting. I've read conflicting accounts of this. Some say the CD quality is way better than streaming but other accounts I've seen say the opposite. I have no idea since I only go for CD.

So they are, in fact, exactly the same? I didn't expect that. I must say, I'm surprised. I think I assumed that streaming, surely, would be better. Cheers for the clarification!
 
I grew up with vinyl so the hiss won't feel weird to me
I really have to jump on this: I hate the misconception most people have about vinyl that it sounds dirty, noisy, full of clicks and pops. If you're playing a beat up record, maybe yes, but that is not the standard, at all. Vinyl records in good shape murder any CD counterparts 90% of the time.

If you've never listened to any of MJs albums (OTW to Dangerous) from the OG record copies in good/pristine condition, you've never heard them in their max potential. It's been almost four years since I started collecting records and, after I bought original vinyl pressings of Bad and Dangerous, my CDs have gone to waste. Bad, for example, has a unique punch to it that it's just not there on the CDs and further reissues/remasters.

Also, vinyl doesn't really have hiss. Cassettes do. Vinyl has surface noise.

Some say the CD quality is way better than streaming
It was true before streaming services offered lossless. Now, the lossless versions are virtually the CD files.
 
The way I would describe Can’t Get Out of the Rain: Imagine if the Beatles released a song called “Hey Dude” and what it is is actually just the “Na na na” part of Hey Jude but the only thing the Beatles did was overdub it singing “Dude” over “Jude”.

Can’t Get Out of the Rain is that but with You Can’t Win.
And imagine if they put that on the 50th anniversary of the White Album. Insane.
Edit: In fact, putting it on the 50th anniversary of Abbey Road would have been closer to what the Estate have done with CGOOTR.
 
oh, now, this is interesting. I've read conflicting accounts of this. Some say the CD quality is way better than streaming but other accounts I've seen say the opposite. I have no idea since I only go for CD.

So they are, in fact, exactly the same? I didn't expect that. I must say, I'm surprised. I think I assumed that streaming, surely, would be better. Cheers for the clarification!
Well, here's the thing, what you saw was most probably talking about literally, audio quality, so basically let me explain this:
You can have lossy audio and lossless audio, right?
Well, some streaming services (For example: Spotify) offer LOSSY audio, while some others (Deezer, Qobuz, Tidal [debatable], HDTracks, Apple Music) offer LOSSLESS audio.

Since the 2000s, streaming services that offer lossless audio have had the exact same audio quality and masterings as their CD counterparts. so yeah, streaming and CD are the same WHEN ONLY talking about lossless audio.
 
Wow wow wow! let me stop you right there.
In this modern era, sadly CD and Streaming are always the exact same, pretty sad but yeah :(

This isn't exactly true.

Bad 25 for example...I have a digital edition, CD and an itunes edition and all three are mastered differently from each other... iTunes being the best of the three. Apple have their own mastering engineers so when you see Apple Digital Master on their listing it's done in house.
 
This isn't exactly true.

Bad 25 for example...I have a digital edition, CD and an itunes edition and all three are mastered differently from each other... iTunes being the best of the three. Apple have their own mastering engineers so when you see Apple Digital Master on their listing it's done in house.
See!! I knew I'd seen these kind of assessments! Maybe the comments I saw related specifically to Apple. That would make total sense.

Just out of interest, if the iTunes is the best of the 3, which is the worst?
 
This isn't exactly true.

Bad 25 for example...I have a digital edition, CD and an itunes edition and all three are mastered differently from each other... iTunes being the best of the three. Apple have their own mastering engineers so when you see Apple Digital Master on their listing it's done in house.
You are right, however, please let's not confuse @zinniabooklover with the topic of audio quality.
Even what i said isn't exactly true either because, usually, streaming versions are offered in higher bitrates and sample rates, and yet i did not mention any of that because it really doesn't matter in the end. Maybe what Apple offers is different and perhaps slightly better, but in the end, it still sounds terrible because that's just modern day mastering.
I don't know if my point is getting across, but basically, what i mean is
Yeah, audio is complicated, but let's not make it even more complicated to understand to people that want to learn lmao
 
This isn't exactly true.

Bad 25 for example...I have a digital edition, CD and an itunes edition and all three are mastered differently from each other... iTunes being the best of the three. Apple have their own mastering engineers so when you see Apple Digital Master on their listing it's done in house.
Well, yeah. There's the "Mastered for iTunes" series, but is it done for every album available there?
 
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