Randall Sullivan's book "Untouchable"

Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

That thought crossed my mind as well.

I mean, what precisely is it that makes him endorse someone who throws the whole "shadow of a doubt" thing into the room?? I just can't see it.

It just looks to me he is reading some sort of script cuz t mez just seems different now

A friend of mine on twitter said she reckons he only became mjs lawyer in 2005 for the $$$$ and not cuz he cared for mj.......sadly i am begininng to think that could be true
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

lol at Mesereau reading a script. I believe you.

Only in MJ Land... The ****ery gets more ridiculous by the day. A week doesn't go by without some nonsense. Exhausting.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

...
A friend of mine on twitter said she reckons he only became mjs lawyer in 2005 for the $$$$ and not cuz he cared for mj.......sadly i am begininng to think that could be true

I actually do not think that at all. So please, while I am totally losing my mind saying ???????????, I don't think AT ALL that he was there in 2005 to take advantage of Michael. Nonononono. They put Mesereau through the ringer, too, btw. So no, please don't confuse my current questioning marks with questioning practically saving Michael's live back in 2005. Those are different things to me.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

He did continue to defend Michael long after the trial and even after Michael died. I just don't know what is going on here.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

Seriously, sullivan is cancelling booksignings over 'security concerns' and is reeling from the ferocity of fan attacks. What a big girl's blouse - it's only some fan reviews on amazon. He's implying mj fans are a bunch of dangerous nutcases capable of physical violence - i'm sure some of us are nutcases but ddimond, sneddon, gavin and jordan etc all seem to be walking around with no black eyes. I really hope he has taken the time to read some of the reviews - katerina's review gives chapter and verse of all the problems, and morinen (i'm assuming it's the same morinen as here)'s review is fabulous in showing how disappointing it was.

He's terrified for his own safety, except in Portland where our MJ terror camps have yet to take hold.

My guess is he can't ride this book around book shops because there's nobody buying it, so why would they want him there? When have MJ fans ever attacked anyone at a book shop signing?

He keeps focusing on this "shadow of doubt" blah blah, and how fans haven't read the book and are organizing campaigns against it. He seems to hope that by dismissing us all as being crazy and irrational it'll help mean that those long reviews which break down the problems with the book can also be dismissed.

It's funny considering, he wants those types of things dismissed, and yet he was so believing of every story someone like Schaffel shared with him. Some people have their blinders about MJ turned up so far they really can't understand why it's them who are deluded in the face of evidence, and not the fans.
It's a problem with the publishers. It's sad, riding high in the charts is a biog of bruce springstein. It's written by an unabashed fan, who has had access to all family and friends. He's meant to have taken a good hard look at springstien but all the reviews say this is a must for any bruce fan and they all love it. If anything like that was published about mj, it wd be dismissed as hagiography, like i've seen bad25 dismissed as.

It's interesting because that book does raise some things about Springsteen, like the fact that he apparently was physically abusive with one girlfriend in the 80s. I saw someone really upset about that book after reading it - upset because they understood it was a credible biography and that it was almost likely something that Springsteen did. They weren't upset with the bio, they were upset with Springsteen.

The problem with Michael is that people believe he was a monster. Springsteen doesn't have that problem. Nobody's ever sold him out or taken him to court repeatedly throughout the years, as far as I know. There isn't this huge stigma forced onto Springsteen. So when people share stories about him, though I'm sure some will exaggerate or lie or be self serving, there's not this whole other agenda at play.

I was thinking that if Bad25 had been released when he was alive, it would've been ripped to shreds as being MJ hyping up his own self, as not addressing the real problems with his life, as hoping people would forget about them - same old same old. It would've been impossible for him to have had a documentary made like that about him, even if he wasn't directly involved himself.

It's funny that he's been gone three years and in his absence people can create these documentaries, like This Is It, or Bad25, or even the Gary Indiana video, videos that if he'd released himself would've been slated, so without him people perhaps can be forced to accept that they may actually just be showing who he was. Though obviously they get dismissed too...

I'm wondering if we can finally progress beyond books like this one though. I'd honestly thought we'd never have to talk about fake noses again after the autopsy report, and that we'd never have to hear about bleaching his blackness out of him from Stacy Brown or Blanca Francia again.

I disagree. People are often influenced by these amazon reviews. I buy a lot there, and i do take the time to heck the reviews.

I always take note of the Amazon reviews.

If I read a review which says the book is full of errors and has easily disproven facts, I won't touch it. Why waste my time? But I'd only want to read reviews from people who had read the book and could list the problems.


If Mes took the 2005 trial for money and fame, why didn't he try and sell stories during the trial when journalists were trying to get him to? He's supported many other projects before, flew out to be there for David Gest's documentary, gave many interviews to William Wagner. I'm not suspicious of Mes having an ulterior motive at all, I believe the reasons he's supporting the book are for the reasons he has given.

I'm only suspicious of Sullivan.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

well Sullivan lost... his book is a disaster and no one but MJ fans is paying any attention to him or that book.. It will be in dollar tree in couple of weeks...
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

I also think Tom believed in Michael's innocense in the trial but I just don't get why supporting a shit book where there are inuendos Jordan was Michael's "partner"and deshumanizes him completely. By making that inuendo, that book it doesn't vindicate him from those horrendous false charges at all.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

Mesereau doesn't sound scripted to me, he sounds angry. He seems to think there is some sort of conspiracy around this book which he is trying to break. This is a fight against windmills. That's why I'm saying someone from the fandom who read the book and can discuss it on a factual level should talk to him and explain what's going on. Can we organize a live chat or something?

The farther it goes the worse it gets - look, now he is already accused of greed motives at the trial (btw, don't forget that he was only paid by the estate in 2009-10, and he never complained in those 4 years about not having been compensated for his services). If we don't establish a dialog with him, he'll end up on fans' hate list over this stupid book. You know how it is in MJ fandom, you misstep once - you are hated forever. Tom of all people should not be in that category.
 
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Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

I actually do not think that at all. So please, while I am totally losing my mind saying ???????????, I don't think AT ALL that he was there in 2005 to take advantage of Michael. Nonononono. They put Mesereau through the ringer, too, btw. So no, please don't confuse my current questioning marks with questioning practically saving Michael's live back in 2005. Those are different things to me.


I mean i hope that isnt the case but like i was saying before for someone like t mez who fought for & with mj against those horrible allegations to side along someone who thinks mj is a pedophile just isnt right
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

Mesereau doesn't sound scripted to me, he sounds angry. He seems to think there is some sort of conspiracy around this book which he is trying to break. This is a fight against windmills. That's why I'm saying someone from the fandom who read the book and can discuss it on a factual level should talk to him and explain what's going on. Can we organize a live chat or something?

The farther it goes the worse it gets - look, now he is already accused of greed motives at the trial (btw, don't forget that he was only paid by the estate in 2009-10, and he never complained in those 4 years for not having been compensated for his services). If we don't establish a dialog with him, he'll end up on fans' hate list over this stupid book. You know how it is in MJ fandom, you misstep once - you are hated forever. Tom of all people should not be in that category.

I agree this is getting out of control, but I don't know whether it's better to talk to TM or just let it die down. He uses very strong language in his YT vid--'vicious, disgusting' so he does seem to have his mind made up, and then he uses very favorable terms to describe Sullivan's book, saying it's 'sympathetic.' I wonder if he is going to read the YT comments, some are good and some are a bit strong themselves. BTW, William Wagener made a comment agreeing with TM about how the 'fans' can go against someone.

Maybe someone could put together a list of problems that Michael's fans and supporters have with the book? He needs to consider too that the NYTimes reviewer Michiko Kakutani said the book did not add anything new and was bloated and dispensable, so it's not just Michael's fans.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

Mesereau doesn't sound scripted to me, he sounds angry. He seems to think there is some sort of conspiracy around this book which he is trying to break. This is a fight against windmills. That's why I'm saying someone from the fandom who read the book and can discuss it on a factual level should talk to him and explain what's going on. Can we organize a live chat or something?

The farther it goes the worse it gets - look, now he is already accused of greed motives at the trial (btw, don't forget that he was only paid by the estate in 2009-10, and he never complained in those 4 years for not having been compensated for his services). If we don't establish a dialog with him, he'll end up on fans' hate list over this stupid book. You know how it is in MJ fandom, you misstep once - you are hated forever. Tom of all people should not be in that category.

Not true. He did receive payments while MJ was with us...but there was an outstanding balance which the estate paid after he submitted his papers.

He did not work pro-bono until 2009.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

Not true. He did receive payments while MJ was with us...but there was an outstanding balance which the estate paid after he submitted his papers.

He did not work pro-bono until 2009.

Yes, I think he was owed a bit--maybe 200k? Also I think Sullivan says that the whole bill was 2.2M. Maybe we should ask TM if that is right? (kidding)
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

I agree this is getting out of control, but I don't know whether it's better to talk to TM or just let it die down. He uses very strong language in his YT vid--'vicious, disgusting' so he does seem to have his mind made up, and then he uses very favorable terms to describe Sullivan's book, saying it's 'sympathetic.' I wonder if he is going to read the YT comments, some are good and some are a bit strong themselves. BTW, William Wagener made a comment agreeing with TM about how the 'fans' can go against someone.

Maybe someone could put together a list of problems that Michael's fans and supporters have with the book? He needs to consider too that the NYTimes reviewer Michiko Kakutani said the book did not add anything new and was bloated and dispensable, so it's not just Michael's fans.

He's been messaging Deborah from Reflectionsofthedance back and forth, so seems to have heard a lot of our concerns.

But he seems to feel this is the best thing right now.

I think he's also got Sullivan telling him about how the fans are doing this campaign, sending the book for free to each other, not reading it, that we're just angry because of the shadow of doubt/nose/virgin stuff, and making it seem like he's a victim of lies. It seems obvious Sullivan realizes Mes is an important respectable figure and if he can support the book, it should be enough to get the fans on his side.

I don't believe Mes has an agenda at play here, he never has before and I refuse to believe Sullivan is the one to make him go to the dark side.

I agree, we should let this die down for the moment.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

^ his agenda is clear: help sell Sullivan's book.

Do we still think Mesereau doesn't understand what he is doing?
This has nothing to do with MJ but everything to do with him trying to salvage this book.

Read the PR they released today:

http://www.digitaljournal.com/pr/956443
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

Honestly this is becoming more and more insulting by the second.

T Mez acting like Michael Jackson fans are uninformed people that rush to give negative reviews without reading or that we are brainless that if any evil powers to be tells us to do something we will just do it.

I don't want to burst anyone's bubble but we are actually highly knowledgeable and highly informed people. I read every book about Michael - good and bad. I also bought and read this book - as soon as it was available on my kindle.

Then T Mez insults our intelligence saying that this is a book that's "fully vindicating" Michael. Seriously who do you think he's fooling? Not only Sullivan cannot commit to say Michael's 100% innocent but in his book and in his interviews he continues to portray the handsome Jordie being a possible sex partner for the very selective Michael. And T Mez wants us to think that this is "fully vindication". There's NO - let me repeat again- NO vindication in saying that it's possible that Michael had sex with any boy. However it seems that for T Mez it is good enough as long as you don't say he molested Gavin. Well that was the trial that T-Mez was involved in and seems to be only thing he cares.

Anyway this is highly disturbing and it will not help Sullivan or Mesereau. I will forever grateful for what T Mez did for Michael in 2005 but his endorsements are worthless in my book from now on. And no this is not limited to Sullivan's book. T Mez did involve himself with Wagener who is banking on his picture with T-Mez and signed ties by T-Mez to scam fans all around the world. T- Mez also endorsed Moriatry's book which happens to be equally poorly researched as Sullivans. In other words Thank you for being a good lawyer but Mr. Mesereau you aren't really that good or knowledgeable or informed about who / what to endorse.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

I think this might be Sullivan & Co tactic to get his book hyped up, and people to buy it. I mean, they are making a fuss about fans fighting tooth and nail against this book, in order to create curiosity towards his book. That kind of tactic might sell few extra books.

The more we fans and TMezz talking about the book, the more he gets free publicity.
If there is no talk, I doubt his book would've sold more than few thousand copies.
I say we forget this guy and his book.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
I saw Spike's BAD 25 last night and I figured out something.
In the end, Sullivan and his kind of people don't matter.
His kind of people come and go, and will be forgotten tomorrow, but Michael is here forever and never forgotten.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

^T Mez also endorsed David Gest's 2011 Michael doc, Life of an Icon. He went up to UK for the premier and did a Q&A. Does he get paid for endorsements?
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

Honestly this is becoming more and more insulting by the second.

T Mez acting like Michael Jackson fans are uninformed people that rush to give negative reviews without reading or that we are brainless that if any evil powers to be tells us to do something we will just do it.

I don't want to burst anyone's bubble but we are actually highly knowledgeable and highly informed people. I read every book about Michael - good and bad. I also bought and read this book - as soon as it was available on my kindle.

Then T Mez insults our intelligence saying that this is a book that's "fully vindicating" Michael. Seriously who do you think he's fooling? Not only Sullivan cannot commit to say Michael's 100% innocent but in his book and in his interviews he continues to portray the handsome Jordie being a possible sex partner for the very selective Michael. And T Mez wants us to think that this is "fully vindication". There's NO - let me repeat again- NO vindication in saying that it's possible that Michael had sex with any boy. However it seems that for T Mez it is good enough as long as you don't say he molested Gavin. Well that was the trial that T-Mez was involved in and seems to be only thing he cares.

Anyway this is highly disturbing and it will not help Sullivan or Mesereau. I will forever grateful for what T Mez did for Michael in 2005 but his endorsements are worthless in my book from now on. And no this is not limited to Sullivan's book. T Mez did involve himself with Wagener who is banking on his picture with T-Mez and signed ties by T-Mez to scam fans all around the world. T- Mez also endorsed Moriatry's book which happens to be equally poorly researched as Sullivans. In other words Thank you for being a good lawyer but Mr. Mesereau you aren't really that good or knowledgeable or informed about who / what to endorse.

What about a detailed rebuttal of this book sent to TM? On YT the comments are limited as to length so that's not the place, and if he is texting some fans, obviously, he is not getting the message.

Here are the main points of disagreement I have with what I have read of this book and what the author says in interviews:

1) RS does not vindicate Michael of the allegations 'fully" or "100%" b/c there is "a shadow of doubt." unacceptable conclusion.

2) as an artist, RS portrays Michael as unable to go beyond the Thriller album, artistically "stuck" and even saying "he lost interest in authenticity" and kept polishing an "overproduced" sound with "an increasingly hollow core." unacceptable.

3) RS thinks that Michael embraced "flawless artifice" not only in music but in regard to his face, resulting in a massively disfigured nose requiring a prosthesis. unacceptable.

4) RS questions whether Michael had normal married sexual relations with his wife LMP even though she said repeatedly they did. Unacceptable.

5) RS repeats tabloid lies, such as the false claim that Michael was booed off the stage at the 2006 WMA ceremony in London. unacceptable.

6) RS uses unreliable, biased sources, including tabloids. unacceptable.

7) RS in interviews and in his writing shows he has no respect for Michael as an artist or a human being. unacceptable.

conclusion: this book is not acceptable to anyone who wants an accurate, well-researched book. RS is too close to his tabloid peers, having worked at Rolling Stone for 20 years. He writes with such certainty about Michael: "Along the way, he lost interest in authenticity. What he wanted was flawless artifice. It was the same goal he pursued in the reconstruction of his face." These conclusions are too sweeping from someone who never met Michael and who has done minimal in-depth research. He speaks as if he is inside Michael's head and can see his thoughts. No one can do that. Let Michael speak for himself, as he did so well in his own words, in his music, films, books, interviews.

I am starting to think TM does not know Michael as an artist and doesn't get how important this is to supporters and fans. If you denigrate Michael as an artist, as RS does, you have lost the fans right there. Maybe TM actually knew Michael very little. He worked on the trial hard, and Michael came, sat, listened, and left. How much interaction did they really have? After the trial Michael left USA. I think TM does not know Michael except as an innocent man; he does not know him as the artist and person we love. Something is missing in his understanding--I think it's Michael the artist.
 
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Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

^T Mez also endorsed David Gest's 2011 Michael doc, Life of an Icon. He went up to UK for the premier and did a Q&A. Does he get paid for endorsements?

In the UK, attorneys are called Solicitors, so yes Thomas Mesereau is a Solicitor and he is always soliciting (one that solicits) for business, because his livelihood depends on it. He need new clients to continue his practice. Thomas Mesereau's calling card would be to endorse these different Michael Jackson projects, as it will remind the General Public that he once defended Michael Jackson against these allegations, being inappropriate with a child, in a Court of Law and won!

(Solicitors provide expert legal support and advice to clients. They take instructions from clients and advise on necessary courses of legal action. Clients can be individuals, groups, public sector organisations or private companies.)

http://www.prospects.ac.uk/solicitor_job_description.htm
 
Tmez mentioned something about the people who might be behind not wanting people to read this book. Tmez is smart and probably read all the garbage about MJs nose, etc., but instead of concentrating mainly on the tabloid stuff, Tmez might want us to see who has always been behind MJ stabbing him in the back over and over again. I'm trying to give Tmez the benefit of the doubt and remain open minded.

Chapter 21:
an all-day schedule of television interviews. Neither Mesereau’s triumph nor
Jackson’s deliverance were greeted with much enthusiasm, though, by either the
American media or the American public. “ You cost the worldwide media billions,”
Berry Gordy told Mesereau. “We have a less interesting story now,” CNN head
Jonathan Klein said to his lieutenants on the afternoon of the verdicts. Klein was
proven correct that very evening, when three broadcast networks rushed Michael
Jackson acquittal specials onto the air only to see them outperformed in ratings by
Fox's rerun of Nanny 911.
----------------

Berry Gordy now needs to either call Tmez a liar or if he won't do that, we now know that Berry Gordy is a hater of the worst kind, and wanted MJ to be found guilty for costing the media billions ie: "Money". Which is it?

(The way I am reading this, Berry Gordy has chastised Tmez for winning...not guilty verdicts. Berry Gordy lost a ton of money when MJ left Motown) I may be going in the wrong direction, but I am going to read more carefully now for what Tmez might be trying to point out to us without naming names)
 
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Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

Tmez was really mad in that video - i think we'll have to accept that he's read that book, unless there's a gun held to his head by sullivan off camera, a la mrs j at the spa. I really dislike the escalation of feelings between tmez and the fans though and this view of the book being sabotaged by a sophisticated fan campagin. The msm gave it pretty dire reviews too - calling it dreary and bloated, it's not just amazon reviewers.

I'm one of those that think the most important obstacle to mj's legacy and reputation are the allegations, not dodgy vocals on an album, or all the drug talk, or all the jokes about plastic surgery and weirdness. Apart from mj blogsites, there is noone out there trying to change people's perceptions about this, apart from tmez. He is always defending mj in the media about these allegations and does it in an amazingly eloquent way. The jacksons are hopeless in this regard, they just talk about that fake confession. Branca and the estate have decided to stay clear of the allegations and keep the focus on the music, which is fair enough. So i really hope this incident won't destroy the massive respect from fans to tmez, he is really needed in any attempt to vindicate mj because of his media presence and i think he's done enough in the 05 trial and ever since then to earn some credit in the mj fanbank for us to accept that his intentions are sincere, even if we don't agree with them.

I don't know what is best to do right now - whether to let it die down or like jamba and morinen, get some type of statement together to outline our concerns. The thing is, the 2 top amazon reviews, katerina and morinen, are just excellent in showing tmez what the fan feelings are - i can't believe that tmez hasn't read them if he's referring to amazon reviews in his video. His strong approval for this book is definitely odd - just apart from anything else, it's poorly written and organised and sullivan is swayed by whoever he is talking to and so exercises incredibly poor judgement in what he writes. But in no way does this book make mj out to be a pedo, can't remember what poster said that. That shadow of a doubt phrase was from his tv interviews - pity he worded it like that, if only he had said something like, 'i used to think mj was guilty of those allegations but researching the book i found that in fact it's very likely that he was completely innocent which was a massive surprise to me'. The book is better on this issue than jrt. JRT might admit mj and lmp had a sexlife but his section of the book on jordan and mj is completely neutral, def 50/50.
 
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Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess


----------------

[/SIZE]Berry Gordy now needs to either call Tmez a liar or if he won't do that, we now know that Berry Gordy is a hater of the worst kind, and wanted MJ to be found guilty for costing the media billions ie: "Money". Which is it?

(The way I am reading this, Berry Gordy has chastised Tmez for winning...not guilty verdicts.

I certainly didn't read it as berry gordy being annoyed mj was acquitted and i'm sure tmez didn't say it to suggest that. I took it to mean gordy was just making an astute observation about how the media was going to lose out on what wd have been a massive news story with mj in jail.
 
@Bonnie Blue-----That's a possibility. It's something that I am not sure of. It can be read in more than one way.

Next Tmez is telling MJ to leave Neverland. He fears Sneddon is drumming up drug/prescription charges against MJ, so Tmez talks with Grace Rwarmba:
[FONT=TimesNewRoman???????][FONT=TimesNewRoman???????]Sneddon and his associates were already
discussing how they might charge Jackson for obtaining prescription drugs under
false names. A preliminary investigation of this possibility would last well into the
next autumn. After a series of phone conversations with Grace Rwaramba and other
intermediaries, Mesereau spoke to Michael on the evening of June 15: “ I told him,
‘Michael, I know how much Neverland means to you. And that it’s a glorious,
enchanted place, and that you’ve known real peace there. But I really believe that
its time in your life is passed. We all have to move on. You have to move on. I
don’t think you’ll ever be really safe there again. Go somewhere else.’”

------------------------------

I recall that Grace (she denied this I believe) had given an interview to a female British journalist and accused MJ of taking drugs...mixing too much and not eating enough??.....and saying that she had to pump MJs stomach and things like that but Grace does deny this I think. But, according to Tmez, it was after talking with Grace and maybe some others, he told MJ to leave. Was Grace saying that she would testify against MJ about drugs?? (the wrath of a woman scorned....oh no, not again). Again, I'm just wondering about what I'm reading.

Sullivan earlier in the book talked about Frank Dileo and Frank claiming to be MJs manager when he was not, and signing MJ to those Allgood (or whatever the name) concerts?

Was MJ completely surrounded by enemies?? The idea of that is scary.

[/FONT]
[/FONT]
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

It's one thing that Mez endorses the book, but he seems really passionate about endorsing it - not just saying it's a good book and then moving on, but actually arguing with fans about it, making an Amazon account to give a 5-star review, making a YT video etc. And that's the thing that is surprising to me.

Anyway, I think we should just agree to disagree with him about the book and move on. It won't become a big seller, thankfully, so I think we should just let the whole thing die.

I still respect Mez enormously and I agree with Bonnie that we shouldn't be myopic: even if he's wrong about this book, he's still a great ally in fighting the allegations. Let's not forget he is not obliged to go out there and give interviews about Michael being innocent or go to conferences like that Frozen in Time seminar, where he faced a number of people who were on the other side (like the Chandlers' lawyer, Larry Feldman) and defended Michael against them. He's human and as such he sometimes makes mistakes, but I have no doubt about that he truly believes Michael was innocent and he's passionate about showing it to people.

As for Sullivan:


He's terrified for his own safety, except in Portland where our MJ terror camps have yet to take hold.

My guess is he can't ride this book around book shops because there's nobody buying it, so why would they want him there? When have MJ fans ever attacked anyone at a book shop signing?

He keeps focusing on this "shadow of doubt" blah blah, and how fans haven't read the book and are organizing campaigns against it. He seems to hope that by dismissing us all as being crazy and irrational it'll help mean that those long reviews which break down the problems with the book can also be dismissed.

It's funny considering, he wants those types of things dismissed, and yet he was so believing of every story someone like Schaffel shared with him. Some people have their blinders about MJ turned up so far they really can't understand why it's them who are deluded in the face of evidence, and not the fans.

It's a usual tactic of anyone who writes or says crap about MJ and gets called out on it. Dimond whines about crazy fans, Ray Chandler whines about crazy fans etc. While there are fans who take things too far, but the "danger" these people face from MJ fans is very exeggarated. And it's usually used as a type of ad hominem attack: if you are a fan then you should automatically be dismissed as a crazy fanatic, instead of them having to address the points you raise. It's very convenient. The Chandlers themselves claimed that they settled out of court because they were so afraid of these crazy and dangerous MJ fans. Apparently Sullivan took this example from Ray Chandler now. In the book he goes to Internet forums and quotes fans writing hateful comments about the Chandlers. But it's very one-sided, because he doesn't quote all the haters with their hateful posts about MJ... It's the Internet, for God's sake, you can find any kind of quotes from any group to support your agenda! I bet I could go out and find Catholics spewing hate somewhere against someone (I say this because Sullivan is a devout Catholic). So what does it mean generally about Catholics? Nothing. It would be just quote mining - exactly what Sullivan is doing.

And before he believed Ray's crap about them settling out of court because of crazy fans, he should have asked him, why then was it OK for the Chandlers to shop a book just within days of the settlement (it's in a motion of Ray from 2005 that he was shopping his book "within days" of the settlement in 1994!), if they were soooooo afraid of fans? It was not OK to go to court, but it was OK to publish a book. Yeah, right... The only person who ever posed a danger to Jordan's life and health was his own father, not an MJ fan. Keep this in mind, Randall!
 
Joyce;3747049 said:
@Bonnie Blue-----That's a possibility. It's something that I am not sure of. It can be read in more than one way.

Next Tmez is telling MJ to leave Neverland. He fears Sneddon is drumming up drug/prescription charges against MJ, so Tmez talks with Grace Rwarmba:
[FONT=TimesNewRoman???????][FONT=TimesNewRoman???????]Sneddon and his associates were already
discussing how they might charge Jackson for obtaining prescription drugs under
false names. A preliminary investigation of this possibility would last well into the
next autumn. After a series of phone conversations with Grace Rwaramba and other
intermediaries, Mesereau spoke to Michael on the evening of June 15: “ I told him,
‘Michael, I know how much Neverland means to you. And that it’s a glorious,
enchanted place, and that you’ve known real peace there. But I really believe that
its time in your life is passed. We all have to move on. You have to move on. I
don’t think you’ll ever be really safe there again. Go somewhere else.’”

------------------------------

I recall that Grace (she denied this I believe) had given an interview to a female British journalist and accused MJ of taking drugs...mixing too much and not eating enough??.....and saying that she had to pump MJs stomach and things like that but Grace does deny this I think. But, according to Tmez, it was after talking with Grace and maybe some others, he told MJ to leave. Was Grace saying that she would testify against MJ about drugs?? (the wrath of a woman scorned....oh no, not again). Again, I'm just wondering about what I'm reading.


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I'm not sure what you are talking about here. That false stomach-pumping story has nothing to do with Mez's advise to MJ. Mez was talking about the fact that during the house search there were prescription drugs found in Neverland those were prescribed to other people or to false names, but apparently taken by Michael. Many celebrities do this to protect their privacy, but I think it's not really legal. So what Mez meant that if Sneddon could not get him convicted with these false allegations of child abuse, then he would try to convict him for something else. Anything. He was very vindictive.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

why is it always michael had sex with LMP and never the fact the Michael have 2 childrens by Debbie Row. The only way RS would know any thing about Michael's sex life he would have had to be there or a fly on the wall. From what I can see Michael was more Man than RS could ever be. he is a P****Y for talking about what another man's sex life like is he is an F/N expert.
 
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Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

I've already suggested this in the appropriate thread but I'll say it here as well. If possible, I think we'd all appreciate an MJJC Q&A with Tom Mesereau.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

I don't think we owe TM anything--he did a great job for Michael and he got paid well and he earned a lot of respect. Yes, we can be grateful for that, I agree. BUT that does not give him a pass forever. Everyone makes mistakes and no one is immune to being called out. He is going overboard on this book. He started out with a very respectful tone in his comments to the fans, but this last video is NOT respectful at all when it uses words like "vicious, malicious, disgusting." That is not recognizing that there are legitimate failings in this book. This where he lost me when he stopped believing that the fans, and the reviewers like Michiko Kakutani of the NYTimes, have a case to make.

Just my opinion but I wish Michael had not left Neverland, as it was a place for him to get back together after the trial. Instead he went to Bahrain, which would be the total opposite of Neverland as far as a milieu. Ireland was more like Neverland, and that's why Michael loved it IMO. I don't know how realistic the threats to go after Michael for the prescription drug thing was. In Defending A King, Moriarty says TM said he thought they would go after Michael if a child had an accvident on the property, so that is a different reason than the one given in RS's book. Personally, I think Michael should have stayed at Neverland, as I said. And I think Sneddon and team had been sufficiently humiliated that they would not have launched a new attack. I also think Michael should have sued them for malicious prosecution and especially if they had tried some more charges.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

I say just let this book die off. It's already doomed, let's just leave it there and move on. I respect T-Mez for what he did. But, I don't need to buy a book full of so much tabloid lies just for one fair part about the 03 allegations/05 trial. Where the author conclusions being that he isn't sure about MJs innocence in the end. If he can't convince himself then why does he think he can someone else? Would like to ask T-mez that. -_-
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable" Tabloid Mess

I couldn't watch T-Mez video yesterday but now that I watch it, I'm absolutely disgusted and disappointed about it. I bet any of us aren't part of that disgusting PR campaign he said to not read that thing and I just don't know what's the possitive thing about it if it's full of lies. :rant: He's teating us like stupid uninformed people which is not the case!
 
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