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Randall Sullivan's book "Untouchable"

Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable"

We were contacted today by a Canadian reporter by pm on our Rapid Response page. This is what he said: Chris Dela Torre,

Hello there -
My name is Chris dela Torre, I'm a reporter with the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation, based in Calgary AB Canada. Would anyone with your page be interested in commenting further on the NY Times article RE: Randall Sullivan's 'Untouchable' book? I'm working on a radio piece about the affect of online commenting on product marketing and would love to speak to an admin from this page for my radio story.

We have not communicated with him at all.

I just pulled this up on the guy: http://www.cbc.ca/eyeopener/about/
 
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Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable"

This book just needs to be pulled off of bookshevles FULL STOP
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable"

Victory22 said:
We were contacted today by a Canadian reporter by pm on our Rapid Response page. This is what he said: Chris Dela Torre,

Hello there -
My name is Chris dela Torre, I'm a reporter with the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation, based in Calgary AB Canada. Would anyone with your page be interested in commenting further on the NY Times article RE: Randall Sullivan's 'Untouchable' book? I'm working on a radio piece about the affect of online commenting on product marketing and would love to speak to an admin from this page for my radio story.

We have not communicated with him at all.

I just pulled this up on the guy: http://www.cbc.ca/eyeopener/about/
Click to expand...
I wouldn't do it. It will only give the book more attention. Their only interested in product marketing. Not in us defending Michael.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable"

Victory22 said:
We were contacted today by a Canadian reporter by pm on our Rapid Response page. This is what he said: Chris Dela Torre,

Hello there -
My name is Chris dela Torre, I'm a reporter with the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation, based in Calgary AB Canada. Would anyone with your page be interested in commenting further on the NY Times article RE: Randall Sullivan's 'Untouchable' book? I'm working on a radio piece about the affect of online commenting on product marketing and would love to speak to an admin from this page for my radio story.

We have not communicated with him at all.

I just pulled this up on the guy: http://www.cbc.ca/eyeopener/about/
Click to expand...

Might be a chance to get your side out? Maybe in Canada they have more integrity than the NYT? Maybe check out another story this guy has done and see how it feels to you as far as his approach and fairness. Good luck!

P.S. This guy looks very young. He has a radio show, or is part of a radio show, so it's not like he has a huge platform, like the NYT. I get the feeling he is a relatively small fry guy, not with the reach of the NYT for sure.
 
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Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable"

Fans have to decide what their goal is. IMO the main goal should be that Sullivan's book flops and no one buys it. Currently it's down in the #30,000s on Amazon. IMO discussing it further with the media only gives it more attention and more sales - and probably that is the goal of the media, too. I would not feed the media on it any longer. Let it sink into obscurity.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable"

respect77 said:
Fans have to decide what their goal is. IMO the main goal should be that Sullivan's book flops and no one buys it. Currently it's down in the #30,000s on Amazon. IMO discussing it further with the media only gives it more attention and more sales - and probably that is the goal of the media, too. I would not feed the media on it any longer. Let it sink into obscurity.
Click to expand...

EXACTLY!!! That is the best way to go as we prepare for the book's funeral.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable"

I agree with you girls, it mustn't receive more coverage and if Victory discusses with the reporter, it'd be a way to give it attention.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable"

CaptainEoLove85 said:
lol should it be old fashion style or cremated? Yeah, I wouldn't give this book any more attention to the media, big or small press.
Click to expand...

I say we burn frankincense & oil the thing down with the oils they used in biblical times to take care of the dead, like myrrh. We then wrap it in used NYT newspaper & dirty pages from Vanity Fair magazine. Then we did a hole near a swamp, and throw the whole thing in.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable"

Petrarose said:
EXACTLY!!! That is the best way to go as we prepare for the book's funeral.
Click to expand...

May Untouchable rest in piece. It will be soon forgotten:)

Dust to dust, ashes to ashes.


@Victory, I agree with others that it just draws more attention to garbage.
It is up to you, but if you decide to call it off, perhaps you could explain to her that you do not want this book to get any more attention that it already got.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable"

The problem is the writer is probably going to write about it and make the MJ fans look like crazies anyway.

If you tell him anything, I think Raven Woods comment to Streitfield sums it up:

Raven Woods
USA

Mr. Streitfeld, I am going to ask you why-even after the letter I emailed to you, which you have chosen to ignore-you are taking such pride in condoning the censorship of free speech, and boasting about the fact that you have encouraged little more than a reverse strategy? Are empty, meaningless 5 star reviews from people who have not read the book any better than empty, meaningless 1 star reviews from people who haven't read it? How does the one offset the other, since neither are actually a fair assessment of the book?

Also, please explain how the number of reviewers clicking down negative reviews that were nevertheless informative and very insightful as to breaking down the book's many inaccuracies can in any way be presumed as a victory for free speech? All you are doing is promoting the exact opposite! As a result, many very informed reviews have been buried.

This entire campaign is defeating the very purpose of what the Amazon book review feature is supposed to be all about, which is to allow potential readers to be able to make an INFORMED and EDUCATED decision about the product. How are they supposed to be able to do this when you now have a flock of "reviewers" purposely blindsiding buyers just because they are trying to "get back" at a few fans' negative reviews. The end result is that many genuine reviews from people who read the book and STILL found fault with it are not being allowed to have a voice.

As I was stating, it seems to me that your condoning of this kind of behavior and the encouraging of it can only mean one thing-it reveals where your own bias lies. Apparently it is okay when people who do not like Jackson and/or who know nothing about him give this book 5 stars and a rave review. Yet it is NOT okay for those who like him and are knowledgable about his life to find fault with it, and to rank it accordingly. That is the message your hit piece is sending. A very hypocritical one, Mr. Streitfeld, don't you think?

I agree very much with the poster below. Whatever good Mr. Sullivan may have hoped to achieve with this book has now been completely derailed as this has dissolved into nothing more now than a haters vs. fans war, which I suspect was never Sullivan's intent.

It's funny that The New York Times itself did not give this book a favorable review. Yet its downfall is supposed to be due to a few irate fans' reviews? I doubt the NYT review was written by a rabid fan-and yet they were not very impressed, either!

Mr. Sullivan, you need to take a graceful bow, own up, and allow your book to stand or fall on its own merits. Encouraging censorship and encouraging the Amazon review forum to become nothing but a manipulative playing field is not helping your cause.

Get a grip, people, while you are patting yourselves on your righteous backs. You have not encouraged free speech; you have incited its very opposite.

I'll just add that most intelligent people are savvy enough to know that 85+ people did not suddenly jump up, run out, purchase, and read a 700 page book in one days' time.
Click to expand...
http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/...son-bio-evening-the-score/?comments#permid=13
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable"

That's a very popular scheme on behalf of 'journalists'. (btw, not implying that the Canadian station is engaging in such thing...just stating observations from the past).

I can think of at least 5 or 6 instances where MJ associates and even fans were first approached and if they didn't participate they were threatened with 'well, if you don't participate the article might end up sounding be rather negatively toward you." Beyond unethical.

That kind of extortion has happened to a number of fans and it simply needs to be exposed, not serviced with compliance. The Rapid Response team was already once coerced into media participation if I understand that correctly. Given the horrible experience in this matter and the fact that this might be just another way to give more PR to this unfortunate 'book', I would politely either ignore, or reply with a uber-polite 2 liner that the interview request must be declined.

ANY 'journalist' out there needs to understand that coercion and threads such as have happened in the past are not acceptable - and certainly nothing that should be rewarded out of fear of 'bad publicity'.
And honestly, small local stations have largely nothing to report about and tend to focus on their 'local nuts', interviewing people first and then broadcasting hit pieces and ridiculing people. Whenever I turn my local stations on, I am appalled by the desire to display the 'freak incident of the day".

Btw, if anyone wants to ridicule the Rapid Response team ("What kind of unprofessional response team are you if you don't want to talk to me, I am offering you such an opportunity to get your viewpoint" out - sort of like a car dealership wants to make you buy a car by acting like they are doing you a favor...) - I'd mentally prepare myself for that, too. Just because such team exists, doesn't mean they shouldn't be able to chose who kind of issues they respond to and it what way. Just saying, just in case somebody wants to shame anyone into participation.
 
A friend sent this to me and we are working on it in the Underground group:

Just went through a few of the latest PHONEY 5 star reviews .. and made a list of the ones who clearly do not adhere to the Amazon guidelins .. Please REPORT them and give a brief explanation as to why -

Best book ever, January 27, 2013
By
Eric C. Schwartz (Los Angeles, CA)

I am glad that someone finally addressed Michael Jackson. I hope on day people fully recognize his art. Oh and his fanboys need to relax.

REPORT as breaking Amazon rule: Spiteful
Objectionable material:
• Obscene or distasteful content
• Profanity or spiteful remarks
• Promotion of illegal or immoral conduct

5.0 out of 5 stars
A Protest!, January 26, 2013
By
David K. Woods

I purchases this book primarily because I do not appreciate the organized effort by fans of the subject to dictate what is available for me to read. Even the attempt is a very bad precedent. If you do not like the book do not buy it but do not try to eliminate it from the market via a digital book burning.

REPORT doenst meet Amazon Guidelines

• Include the "why": The best reviews include not only whether you liked or disliked a product, but also why. Feel free to talk about related products and how this item compares to them.
• Be specific: Your review should focus on specific features of the product and your experience with it. For video reviews, we recommend that you write a brief introduction.

This Book is Being Trashed by Jackson Fans, January 25, 2013
By
Gray Wolfe (Palo Alto, CA) -
: The Strange Life and Tragic Death of Michael Jackson (Hardcover)
I have not read this book, but have read some honest reviews of it and of the campaign by Jackson fans to unfairly trash the book because it presents some unflattering information about Michael Jackson. See [...]
for more information on the smear campaign. Michael Jackson was an incredibly talented individual, but it is clear that he had a deeply troubled and troubling life. I rated the book five stars because I believe it deserves a fair airing and I want to negate some of the damage done by the cadre of sock puppets who are unfairly attacking the book.

Amazon needs to do a better job at protecting this forum from these highly biased attacks. Reading a number of the highly negative reviews of this book it becomes clear that many of the reviewers have no interests besides censoring any negative information on their idol. If these kinds of attacks are permitted then any politically or socially sensitive material will be driven from the marketplace. When it stops being possible to criticize our entertainers, or our religious and political leaders then we will have lost a fundamental freedom. If we cannot tolerate negative commentary of Michael Jackson, imagine how hard it could become to publish material on the president (Bush or Obama).

REPORT- Can't give opinion, cite book or give reason for review - HAS not read the book so how can he review?

Great read about a messed up pedophile star, January 22, 2013
By
mj is a raging pedo - Pretty decent read, some things might be wrong, but most key points are right on. Way too many people bitc**** and whining about this book because of the truth it tells about Michael Jackson being messed up mentally, ran around after little boys and kept their underwear in his nightstand as keepsakes in his "special" secret room which was decorated like a child's room.[...]

People need to stop being so stupid, giving this book false ratings because of what it says about MJ and the messed up things he did

REPORT as spiteful and profane

Don't bother listening to the angry hoards..., January 22, 2013
By
Brad Greenwood

The negative reviewers are out in force to cause the book to tank because their "hero" is painted in an unflattering light.

Read UNBIASED reviews elsewhere.

REPORT – Doesn’t follow guideline for stating WHY they read or reiewed the book. Instead attack with SPITE “hero”
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable"

Pace said:
That's a very popular scheme on behalf of 'journalists'. (btw, not implying that the Canadian station is engaging in such thing...just stating observations from the past).

I can think of at least 5 or 6 instances where MJ associates and even fans were first approached and if they didn't participate they were threatened with 'well, if you don't participate the article might end up sounding be rather negatively toward you." Beyond unethical.

That kind of extortion has happened to a number of fans and it simply needs to be exposed, not serviced with compliance. The Rapid Response team was already once coerced into media participation if I understand that correctly. Given the horrible experience in this matter and the fact that this might be just another way to give more PR to this unfortunate 'book', I would politely either ignore, or reply with a uber-polite 2 liner that the interview request must be declined.

ANY 'journalist' out there needs to understand that coercion and threads such as have happened in the past are not acceptable - and certainly nothing that should be rewarded out of fear of 'bad publicity'.
And honestly, small local stations have largely nothing to report about and tend to focus on their 'local nuts', interviewing people first and then broadcasting hit pieces and ridiculing people. Whenever I turn my local stations on, I am appalled by the desire to display the 'freak incident of the day".

Btw, if anyone wants to ridicule the Rapid Response team ("What kind of unprofessional response team are you if you don't want to talk to me, I am offering you such an opportunity to get your viewpoint" out - sort of like a car dealership wants to make you buy a car by acting like they are doing you a favor...) - I'd mentally prepare myself for that, too. Just because such team exists, doesn't mean they shouldn't be able to chose who kind of issues they respond to and it what way. Just saying, just in case somebody wants to shame anyone into participation.
Click to expand...

Rest assured we will not be talking to this man or any others in media.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable"

Waw those reviews are getting sicker. Now it is becoming a comment board to bash Michael & mention sick stuff. The one about the puppets sounds like Wyman or his friend.
 
Victory22;3771421 said:
A friend sent this to me and we are working on it in the Underground group:

Just went through a few of the latest PHONEY 5 star reviews .. and made a list of the ones who clearly do not adhere to the Amazon guidelins .. Please REPORT them and give a brief explanation as to why -

Best book ever, January 27, 2013
By
Eric C. Schwartz (Los Angeles, CA)

I am glad that someone finally addressed Michael Jackson. I hope on day people fully recognize his art. Oh and his fanboys need to relax.

REPORT as breaking Amazon rule: Spiteful
Objectionable material:
• Obscene or distasteful content
• Profanity or spiteful remarks
• Promotion of illegal or immoral conduct

5.0 out of 5 stars
A Protest!, January 26, 2013
By
David K. Woods

I purchases this book primarily because I do not appreciate the organized effort by fans of the subject to dictate what is available for me to read. Even the attempt is a very bad precedent. If you do not like the book do not buy it but do not try to eliminate it from the market via a digital book burning.

REPORT doenst meet Amazon Guidelines

• Include the "why": The best reviews include not only whether you liked or disliked a product, but also why. Feel free to talk about related products and how this item compares to them.
• Be specific: Your review should focus on specific features of the product and your experience with it. For video reviews, we recommend that you write a brief introduction.

This Book is Being Trashed by Jackson Fans, January 25, 2013
By
Gray Wolfe (Palo Alto, CA) -
: The Strange Life and Tragic Death of Michael Jackson (Hardcover)
I have not read this book, but have read some honest reviews of it and of the campaign by Jackson fans to unfairly trash the book because it presents some unflattering information about Michael Jackson. See [...]
for more information on the smear campaign. Michael Jackson was an incredibly talented individual, but it is clear that he had a deeply troubled and troubling life. I rated the book five stars because I believe it deserves a fair airing and I want to negate some of the damage done by the cadre of sock puppets who are unfairly attacking the book.

Amazon needs to do a better job at protecting this forum from these highly biased attacks. Reading a number of the highly negative reviews of this book it becomes clear that many of the reviewers have no interests besides censoring any negative information on their idol. If these kinds of attacks are permitted then any politically or socially sensitive material will be driven from the marketplace. When it stops being possible to criticize our entertainers, or our religious and political leaders then we will have lost a fundamental freedom. If we cannot tolerate negative commentary of Michael Jackson, imagine how hard it could become to publish material on the president (Bush or Obama).

REPORT- Can't give opinion, cite book or give reason for review - HAS not read the book so how can he review?

Great read about a messed up pedophile star, January 22, 2013
By
mj is a raging pedo - Pretty decent read, some things might be wrong, but most key points are right on. Way too many people bitc**** and whining about this book because of the truth it tells about Michael Jackson being messed up mentally, ran around after little boys and kept their underwear in his nightstand as keepsakes in his "special" secret room which was decorated like a child's room.[...]

People need to stop being so stupid, giving this book false ratings because of what it says about MJ and the messed up things he did

REPORT as spiteful and profane

Don't bother listening to the angry hoards..., January 22, 2013
By
Brad Greenwood

The negative reviewers are out in force to cause the book to tank because their "hero" is painted in an unflattering light.

Read UNBIASED reviews elsewhere.

REPORT – Doesn’t follow guideline for stating WHY they read or reiewed the book. Instead attack with SPITE “hero”
Click to expand...

I reported a whole bunch of those for not following Amazon's own guidelines and Amazon refused to do anything about it. I think it's b/c Sara Nelson is the new review editor and she is a friend of Sullivan. Anyway, they don't care and let these reviews stand. I tried and got the wall in my face.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable"

Jamba don't worry, because we are winning. At least you get the satisfaction of knowing that you did your best and it made a difference in the way Nelson, Sullivan & Wyman did not expect.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable"

Lots of people who didn't buy the game Sim City have been spamming 1 star reviews on to Amazon about it because of a huge campaign involving thousands of people (and not some some facebook group by a small percentage of fans)

http://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/19wqhb/sim_city_is_on_pace_to_be_the_worst_rated_product/

I'm just posting that because I want to see if The New York Times will write a story about those fake reviews, or if it's only some weird agenda they have with MJ fans being allowed to accurately review books.
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable"

that book was a flop... Good job MJ fans for stopping that mess in it's tracks
 
Re: Randall Sullivan's new book "Untouchable"

This book - run of the mill crap!
 
any book that is full of lies will flop because Michael's fans know the truth and no one will buy a shark's book!
 
I've just found out this book will be published in Poland next month. Hopefully nobody buys it.
 
What did Randall Sullivan say about Jordan Chandler in his book? I listened to him on an old interview saying how there's reason to doubt Michael's innocence in that case and that he talked to some of the chandler family about Jordan ( he talked to Ray and Jordy's brother) apparently Jordy's brother does believe Michael molested Jordy and how it ruined their family. Also Aphrodite Jones admitted she has her doubts about his innocence with Jordan Chandler because of June Chandlers testimony.
 
freakinuhmazin said:
What did Randall Sullivan say about Jordan Chandler in his book? I listened to him on an old interview saying how there's reason to doubt Michael's innocence in that case and that he talked to some of the chandler family about Jordan ( he talked to Ray and Jordy's brother) apparently Jordy's brother does believe Michael molested Jordy and how it ruined their family. Also Aphrodite Jones admitted she has her doubts about his innocence with Jordan Chandler because of June Chandlers testimony.
Click to expand...

What on Earth are you talking about?

Aphrodite Jones does not doubt Michael's innocence!!

Why did you make this your very first post on the forum, in a thread that is nine years old?!?!
 
Mikky Dee said:
What on Earth are you talking about?

Aphrodite Jones does not doubt Michael's innocence!!

Why did you make this your very first post on the forum, in a thread that is nine years old?!?!
Click to expand...

Wanna be startin' somethin'
 
I personally doubt the prosthetic noses story. If Michael had multiple different prosthetic noses (why would he not have just one, or multiple of the same one?) Karen Faye would've known about it and mentioned it by now. But instead she mentions him being horrified and insulted at a director implying he should have a prosthetic nose for the "You Rock My World" music video. He ran into a room and had a emotional meltdown, and if I'm not wrong said, "They think I'm a monster". If Michael had been using fake noses for years then there would be no reason for him to be insulted at someone implying he needs one (since according to this story, he could've just put another one on).

I also doubt the stories about his family. They were leeching off his success somewhat, but I highly doubt that Janet would be involved in this. She's always been supportive and defending Michael, more than any other sibling. I might be able to see LaToya involved in some scheme, but even then that might be unwillingly. Now Joseph? Joseph I could see trying to guilt MJ out of money time after time.
 
I agree I didn't like how he left the Jordan Chandler situation open. Also if Randall truly interviewed Jordy's family then why did he say that Jordy's brother's hate Michael and believe that he did molest Jordy when Jordy has one brother. Also did he even ask why they thought he did it, was it Jordy himself that told them that? Hell why didn't he interview Jordy himself? It's odd that Randall didn't even give a reason as to why Jordy and Evan fell out in 2005?
 
I understand that the post is 9 years old, I just recently came across an old radio interview on YouTube when Aphrodite Jones was on King Jordan Radio and she talked about June Chandler's testimony, how she was unnerved by it while she was testifying and that she doubted Michael's innocence in the Jordan Chandler case, don't get me wrong she didn't say he was guilty but what June said on the stand made Aphrodite feel uncomfortable but in the end she said "I guess we'll never know" if you don't believe me, look for a Youtube video called Aphrodite Jones about Jordan Chandler/Michael Jackson case 1993 at King Jordan Radio, be sure to type it exactly how I did, it's a 3 minute video.

I am not trying to start anything I was just asking a question and yeah I get it's an old post but I felt like I could trust the fans to answer in a civil way since this is a fan page.
 
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