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MJ Estate Sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme Countersues / Tohme's Complaint [Merged]

Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

This is so sad, no one will ever know how much Tohme has taken from Michael's estate. One thing for sure, he never had Michael's back, he used him. I don't know how this case will go. Michael was an adult with many years experience in the business he knew the risks of giving someone Power of Attorney. The documents are clear in that Tohme took advantage of Michael in an extreme manner, but Michael signed them......

Hopefully the Court will rule in favor the expectation of fairness in an agreement and not just the binding facts of an agreement.
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

^^^^^ But isn't that the whole point of this lawsuit? He should have had Michael's back, whether he was advising or acting as manager, he should have been working on Michael's best interests and not filling his pockets at a time his client was vulnerable.
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

I always wondered why he came forward and say he had the millions & returned it to the estate in 09. Maybe he knew someone knew about it and would tell, or he wanted to set the stage where the estate would see him as an honest person & would not come after him later on. If the latter is the case, it clearly did not work. Whatever his motives he is clearly in the right place, i.e., fighting in a court of law.
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

Aquarius said:
That man is scary. How did he get Michael to sign all those papers? I can't believe Michael or anyone will give someone the right to make decisions on all his assets. I wonder if Michael really signed those papers or if someone else did it for him.
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I wish that the courts could try the case on 'ethics' as well as 'law'. It is surely unethical to use a Power of Attorney to the detriment of the person who granted that power. Why would anyone grant a power that would result in harm to themselves (eg financial loss). It doesn't make sense. I find it hard to believe that Michael cannot have understood what he was granting, as he had a good business brain. So what kind of coercion was in place?
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

^^Who knows!! I think that is something many have asked themselves so many times, including how come thieves gravitated to him, while other artists have less thieves in their camps. Maybe it had something to do with his indifference towards money. Money did not have a hold on him, where it was the end all of his existence, so he was OK with people having some of it. I guess thieves saw that in him and came calling. Have you read the story Bush wrote about the money jacket. To me that is the way Michael see money.
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

My word, if the court could prosecute anyone for being unethical the jails would be full. I take your point though.
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

Why there was a need to 2 POA's? Wouldn't one be enough?

I have a feeling that the estate has strong point in their case against Tohme. Certainly the judge should see that it was not up to Tohme to gift away Michael's property at any way, and certainly he should see that Tohme wasn't looking after his client benefit, he was looking after himself and how much he would get out of his deal with Michael.

@Myotis
"I find it hard to believe that Michael cannot have understood what he was granting, as he had a good business brain. So what kind of coercion was in place?"

Good question.


Petrarose said:
I always wondered why he came forward and say he had the millions & returned it to the estate in 09. Maybe he knew someone knew about it and would tell, or he wanted to set the stage where the estate would see him as an honest person & would not come after him later on. If the latter is the case, it clearly did not work. Whatever his motives he is clearly in the right place, i.e., fighting in a court of law.
Click to expand...

Maybe he had more than 5 million? Lets say he had 10 mill and decided to show his honest side and return half of it? Certainly he has something else as estate is very much firm about that they know he has something else too.
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

Mj had a history of giving away p.o.a. .he got burned but seemed to make the same mistakes over again. him seeing the good in everyone and being naive (sp) was his worst enemy
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

^^ I guess in MJ world it was hard to find 1 honest man. Eventually nearly all people in the circle all got the taste of dollars and turned out to b crooks:-(
Well, Jermaine got his payback (Mj taking his producers) to Michael when he introduced this crook to MJ.
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

It's a shame that Michael's own family introduced Tohme Tohme to Michael. But not really a surprise, since they've been doing shady businesses all the time, just look at Joe and Katherine's recent business partners and you'll see why his own family has always been trouble for Michael. (Not to mention the Randy Jackson / MJJSource fan rip-off...)
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

elusive moonwalker said:
Mj had a history of giving away p.o.a. .he got burned but seemed to make the same mistakes over again. him seeing the good in everyone and being naive (sp) was his worst enemy
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His handing over PoA to Tohme just feels like such an act of desperation to me..like a gambler on a losing streak, throwing his last resources at a final bet, risking it all, win or lose. It's as if he had had so much bad luck with trusting people, that he felt it couldn't happen again, and this time he might 'win'....but poor Michael couldn't seem to win with so many of his associates, and it is heartbreaking that so many have sewn him up or sold him out.
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

There was this lady who was on tv after Michael's passing saying Michael was afraid of Tohme. She also had a recording where Michael said he didn't know how much he had on his accounts. What kind of person was this parasite that thought he can just decide what to do with Michael's assets. It'll be a blessing if he ends up in jail for fraud.
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

This is a civil lawsuit so jail is not an option.
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

Aquarius said:
There was this lady who was on tv after Michael's passing saying Michael was afraid of Tohme. She also had a recording where Michael said he didn't know how much he had on his accounts. What kind of person was this parasite that thought he can just decide what to do with Michael's assets. It'll be a blessing if he ends up in jail for fraud.
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One of my friends told me about this ^^. It seems the woman told Michael that was not good that he did not know what was in his accounts. Oh well, the only thing to be done now is what they estate is doing. I want all the art back where it is supposed to be, all the money back, & all property back. Did they check that country he is from & see what his property & assets look like there. He must be hiding things somewhere.
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

Jermaine should be called to testify, he probably know more than just the introduction of thom thome to Michael.
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

Petrarose said:
One of my friends told me about this ^^. It seems the woman told Michael that was not good that he did not know what was in his accounts. Oh well, the only thing to be done now is what they estate is doing. I want all the art back where it is supposed to be, all the money back, & all property back. Did they check that country he is from & see what his property & assets look like there. He must be hiding things somewhere.
Click to expand...


June Gatlin (sp?) one of MJ's advisers, a psychic, supposedly, I think.
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

Aquarius said:
There was this lady who was on tv after Michael's passing saying Michael was afraid of Tohme. She also had a recording where Michael said he didn't know how much he had on his accounts. What kind of person was this parasite that thought he can just decide what to do with Michael's assets. It'll be a blessing if he ends up in jail for fraud.
Click to expand...
Petrarose said:
One of my friends told me about this ^^. It seems the woman told Michael that was not good that he did not know what was in his accounts. Oh well, the only thing to be done now is what they estate is doing. I want all the art back where it is supposed to be, all the money back, & all property back. Did they check that country he is from & see what his property & assets look like there. He must be hiding things somewhere.
Click to expand...
jamba said:
June Gatlin (sp?) one of MJ's advisers, a psychic, supposedly, I think.
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In 1:12:


[youtube]xUoA4k9XTnE[/youtube]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xUoA4k9XTnE
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

i dont think it was an act of desperation as mj had a history of doing this. i just think in the practical sense he wasnt a good business man.he trusted ppl to much.let others have to much control because maybe in the scheme of things he didnt see it as important compaired to creating.

myosotis said:
His handing over PoA to Tohme just feels like such an act of desperation to me..like a gambler on a losing streak, throwing his last resources at a final bet, risking it all, win or lose. It's as if he had had so much bad luck with trusting people, that he felt it couldn't happen again, and this time he might 'win'....but poor Michael couldn't seem to win with so many of his associates, and it is heartbreaking that so many have sewn him up or sold him out.
Click to expand...
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

I never knew Jermaine introduced him to that .Okay thanks for sharing this ...
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

wendijane said:
I never knew Jermaine introduced him to that .Okay thanks for sharing this ...
Click to expand...
From Q&A thread, Jermaine's polished reply:
MJJC: What made you feel that Tohme Tohme was someone worthy of meeting Michael and to be in business with? What were your thoughts of Michael being on tape saying he doesn't like Tohme and how he controls everything Michael does including his money and keeping him from seeing anyone he didn't want Michael to see?

Jermaine Jackson: I've explained this over many pages in the book because I know how concerned fans have been and I wanted to explain everything from the very beginning. The full story is in there. I can't go over it all again. But the biggest misunderstanding is that I introduced him to Michael as some kind of partner or manager. That's not true.

I first met Tohme-Tohme as someone who could help fund the Crystal City project (described in the book) which I was working on with Michael around 2007 time. I had four meetings with Michael to get down our vision on paper. He was all about it.

I met with Tohme-Tohme to find a consortium to raise the $5-6 billion we needed. Not once did I mention to him that Michael was involved in this project. Not once.

Soon afterwards, I heard that Neverland was in trouble. There was talk of foreclosure. That was the first time I went to Tohme-Tohme about Michael (April 13 2008) because if this guy could find billions for a leisure project, he probably knew businessmen who had $23-24 million to save Neverland. That was my thinking.

Long story short, Tohme-Tohme introduced me to Tom Barrack at Colony Capital. Make no mistake; Tom saved my brother's financial ass. Folk out there have no idea how close to the wire things got.

From that moment on, I wasn't part of the equation and Tohme-Tohme turned against me. He was no friend of mine and I know that he became no friend of Michael's. But, from April 2008, the choices and the appointments that were made had nothing to do with me. Michael was his own man with his own mind.

:puke:
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

:shuriken::assassin::beee:
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

Petrarose said:
One of my friends told me about this ^^. It seems the woman told Michael that was not good that he did not know what was in his accounts. Oh well, the only thing to be done now is what they estate is doing. I want all the art back where it is supposed to be, all the money back, & all property back. Did they check that country he is from & see what his property & assets look like there. He must be hiding things somewhere.
Click to expand...


What would happen if he doesn't have Michael's art anymore and he claims he doesn't have any money?
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

Bubs said:
From Q&A thread, Jermaine's polished reply:
MJJC: What made you feel that Tohme Tohme was someone worthy of meeting Michael and to be in business with? What were your thoughts of Michael being on tape saying he doesn't like Tohme and how he controls everything Michael does including his money and keeping him from seeing anyone he didn't want Michael to see?

Jermaine Jackson: I've explained this over many pages in the book because I know how concerned fans have been and I wanted to explain everything from the very beginning. The full story is in there. I can't go over it all again. But the biggest misunderstanding is that I introduced him to Michael as some kind of partner or manager. That's not true.

I first met Tohme-Tohme as someone who could help fund the Crystal City project (described in the book) which I was working on with Michael around 2007 time. I had four meetings with Michael to get down our vision on paper. He was all about it.

I met with Tohme-Tohme to find a consortium to raise the $5-6 billion we needed. Not once did I mention to him that Michael was involved in this project. Not once.
Soon afterwards, I heard that Neverland was in trouble. There was talk of foreclosure. That was the first time I went to Tohme-Tohme about Michael (April 13 2008) because if this guy could find billions for a leisure project, he probably knew businessmen who had $23-24 million to save Neverland. That was my thinking.

Long story short, Tohme-Tohme introduced me to Tom Barrack at Colony Capital. Make no mistake; Tom saved my brother's financial ass. Folk out there have no idea how close to the wire things got.

From that moment on, I wasn't part of the equation and Tohme-Tohme turned against me. He was no friend of mine and I know that he became no friend of Michael's. But, from April 2008, the choices and the appointments that were made had nothing to do with me. Michael was his own man with his own mind.

:puke:
Click to expand...

Wasn't the Crystal City a design for buildings in Las Vegas, designed by Livingstone Strong? I'm sure that Tohme would have known that BLS was a friend of MJ's (having painted a rather well-known portrait of him) , that MJ had a home in Vegas and given Jermaine's involvement, it wouldn't take a genius to make 1+1=2.
(I expect that BLS would have told Tohme of the MJ connection, even if Jermaine did not).
 
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Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

One of the reasons I did not read the Jermaine Q&A is because I knew he would have his usual justifications in it. Like this one Long story short, Tohme-Tohme introduced me to Tom Barrack at Colony Capital. Make no mistake; Tom saved my brother's financial ass. Folk out there have no idea how close to the wire things got. So Tom saved his brothers ass by hooking up with someone who already had ties to Colony Capital--enter Tohme, who got a hefty fee for making a deal that was not in Michael's best interest. Notice, Jermaine never said if he got money for bringing in Tohme.

Jermaine, things got close to the wire ^^ because Michael had to take care of you, your children, & your women, take care of your housing & food, take care of his parents, take care of his siblings, pay back people who you & family defrauded, & pay back crooks you introduced to him, rather than putting all these millions into some safe investments.
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

look what can be seen from case summary at the probate court

03/06/2013 Reply/Response (IN SUPPORT OF PETITIONERS' MOTION FOR ORDER COMPELLING DEPOSITION OF RESPONDENT TOHME R. TOHME ) Filed by Attorney for Petitioner
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

^^Maybe now we will hear something interesting.
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

one of the most disgusting things is that he actually was at the conference when JJ annouced Michael's death. How disgusting is that, really.

Honestly, I can't say he had 1% pride nor dignity for coming and DARING to talk about anything MJ related after he got 'fired'.:puke:
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

mdiegee210 said:
Jermaine should be called to testify, he probably know more than just the introduction of thom thome to Michael.
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He'll probably will ask them to read his book cause he aint going all over with it again
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

Jermaine suffers from CRS everytime his feet are put to the fire.
 
Re: MJ Estate sues Tohme Tohme / Tohme countersues / Tohme's complaint @pg 14

We need to get the actual testimony of the day Tohme gives evidence & the cross examination. I want to read all his shady answers.
 
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