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MJ Defaults in Raymone Bain Case ($44m)

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rsw22 said:
For those criticizing MJ, maybe this is his lawyer's tactic. Rather than wasting time responding to a $44million lawsuit, let the judge hold a hearing and Ramone proves she's owed.

Then based on the judgement that the judge enters, MJ lawyers can appeal that.

Otherwise, if they try to fight the lawsuit from $44million, Ramone has a right to subpoena all documents relating to MJ's deal and then make them public, as well as deposition each and everyone, Randy Phillips, MJ, etc.

By letting her prove her own case, MJ team saves time, money and intrusion.

Let's not forget

$44 million is based on $400 million story
$4 million Ramone belives she's entitled to for Thriller and other stuff

Recently, Phillips said MJ has only committed to 50 shows, and if MJ is to earn about $50 million from those shows, Ramone gets only $5million, before MJ files any defence.

Therefore, the true amount Ramone should have in her lawsuit is

$5 Million for AEG deal
$4 Million for Thriller and other stuff

$9 Million altogether.

The judge therefore has tro knock her down from $44 million to $9million, which will be embarrassing for her without an MJ defence even being filed.

Then she has to prove the $9million, which is a whole other story.

After she has been reducted, MJ can appeal and prove that she never introduced AEG to him or argue the terms and her entitlement, but when the sum is no longer astronomical.

Also then, Ramone's lawyers will be willing to negotiate at a lower amount.

Right now, any negotiations, Ramone's lawyers will start at a half.

But when reduced, they will be forced to start at way lower when MJ appeals.

Let's see what MJ does. He may file a defence or let it run, but let no fans think they are wiser than MJ's lawyers. His lawyer knows what is going on and the lawyer is the one to make decisions accordingly as how to pursue this.
Otherwise it's like fans trying to advise T-Mez why he doesn't do this or that. He knows best his strategy
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What lawyers though? Right now, as far as the court is concerned, there aren't any. He is not represented. If this whole thing is a tactic, it's the worst one ever. You just don't play around like this.
 
Rather than wasting time responding to a $44million lawsuit, let the judge hold a hearing and Ramone proves she's owed.
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Once again: Raymone doesn't have to prove anything if Michael stays defaulted. Then the money is hers.
 
Originally Posted by AllTheLovelyFlowers
The judge is not gonna just give Raymone Bain $44 mil of Michael's money. That is too much money. The judge is gonna look at that amount and he is gonna ask her for prove that this money is owed to her. And when she doesn't give that prove, he is gonna reduce her lawsuit greatly. She has claim to monies Michael hasn't decided to earn yet.

And this is shown in the information that MJJMod posted about default judgments. If Michael continues to ignore it, a hearing will be scheduled and Raymone will have to show the judge that she is owed this money. And that shot gun contract she has is not gonna do it. She needs to show specifically how she is owed this amount of money. And that is where the judge is gonna start chipping away at her lawsuit.

Now do I think Michael should have responded? Yes. But maybe he KNOWS that this lawsuit is so ridiculously overblown, he didn't want to even give it his time. Who knows. But I think that Michael knows something....a lot of things....about this issue that the media is not telling us. I am gonna just hold my judgement and see what the outcome will be. But I doubt if Raymone Bain is gonna get $44 mil awarded to her. It just aint gonna happen.-------------------------------------------------------------


I agree. She is NOT going to get it. Like I said, people ask for alot but it is chipped away if they can not prove it they deserve the full amount. I agree with the post who said this is a tactic. yes, it is a tactic that is played often when people sue. My friend just went through this and she asked for $500,000 in her lawsuit but in the end, my friend got $30,000. No, we may not like it but that is the way it goes. I believe Michael owes her money but I do not believe it is $44 million. I do agree with poster who say MJ should have responded. Ignoring it is NOT going to make it go away otherwise many folks will do that. handle it and move on.
 
Hoofmark said:
Once again: Raymone doesn't have to prove anything if Michael stays defaulted. Then the money is hers.
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Have to bump this post because I don't think some people are understanding that something needs to be done before it actually goes formally into default. Once default is determined/filed, it's too late, Raymone does not have to prove anything.

What I'm not sure about is just how much time it will be before the formal default is determined; ie, what time frame before it gets that far. It may be somewhere in the thread, but can't remember if I read that. Going to go back and look-

Found it, Michael's team has 2 weeks to respond from the time the motion was filed (which was earlier this week), so by June 14th or so. Surely his legal team is on this by now, or so I would presume, time will tell.
 
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Michael needs to stick his finger out otherwise that freak of incompetance is gonna walk away with ALOT of money
 
gee vnc...u'd have a point except no one is doing their job, hence people's criticism of them.

and y can't people understand that raymone ain't gotta prove a damn thing now. it's in default...MICHAEL HAS TO PROVE WHY HE WASN'T ABLE TO ANSWER. if it's not sufficient, whether she deserves it or not, she gets themoney.

IF HE CAN SOMEHOW TALK HIS WAY OUT OF THIS ONE then they go to court...it's a longshot that didn't have to happen and it only happened cuz people weren't doing their jobs
 
"Default judgment is a binding judgment in favor of the plaintiff when the defendant has not responded to a summons or has failed to appear before a court of law.

In a civil trial involving damages, a default judgment will enter the amount of damages pled in the original complaint. If proof of damages is required, the court may schedule another hearing on that issue.

A defendant can have a default judgment vacated, or set aside, by filing a motion, after the judgment is entered, by showing of a proper excuse.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Default_judgment"


As I understand it, it is a notice of default and there is not acturally a default judgement yet. He has atleast two weeks to answer before that happens. Also as All the lovely flowers said a case such as this should be such a case there proof of damages is required so there would be a hearing first. But ofcourse he has to answer to this as soon as possible.
 
I think he defaulted because he counted that he earns that amount by his music. Because he has important moments going on. I mean if he had answered and had gone to court instead of making business and art he would have lost more money than just by defaulting.
 
Topflux said:
I think he defaulted because he counted that he earns that amount by his music. Because he has important moments going on. I mean if he had answered and had gone to court instead of making business and art he would have lost more money than just by defaulting.
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But like I said he hasn´t actually defaulted yet anyway.
 
soso deaf said:
gee vnc...u'd have a point except no one is doing their job, hence people's criticism of them.

and y can't people understand that raymone ain't gotta prove a damn thing now. it's in default...MICHAEL HAS TO PROVE WHY HE WASN'T ABLE TO ANSWER. if it's not sufficient, whether she deserves it or not, she gets themoney.

IF HE CAN SOMEHOW TALK HIS WAY OUT OF THIS ONE then they go to court...it's a longshot that didn't have to happen and it only happened cuz people weren't doing their jobs
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but that's my point. WE think..well..not me..but YOU think people are not doing their jobs..which usually is waht a person thinks when they think there is room for improvement before the person being chastised tells the stranger where to go.

naturally, if, like i said, someone is doing something in a way that YOU think is unorthodox, then, you will think they are not doing their job.

the reality is, in life, there is usually more than one way to solve a problem. it might not be the way you like, but there's nothing that you can do about it, especially if the end result is coming out unscathed. MJ has been doing his job well for more than 40 years, in a way that too many people think is unorthodox. and those people treat 'unorthodox' as if it is a four letter word.

let me simplify it even more. you may not like the way your husband is mowing the lawn, but if he gets the desired result, it wasn't worth sweating the small ish.

if a batter in a baseball game uses an unorthodox swing to hit a home run, and all the sports media gets up in shit about it, then the media has wasted their time.

if MJ gets Bain out of his hair in an unorthodox way, then this thread was a waste of time and too many pages. we may not like what MJ is doing, and how he is doing it, but...tough ish for us. because he always gets out, unscathed.

so...sometimes, bellyaching does nothing but add to the global warming problem:)

why can't we wait till MJ falls on his ass in a way that he can't get up, before we tell him 'i told you so'.

and i'll bet you all the money you have, you will never get a chance to say 'i told you so'.


there may be many stipulations and territorial technicalities and different laws in different states, and different ways california handles things..and all kinds of things we don't know about. and every time we think we know what's up, something else comes up to embarrass our supposed knowledge. things evolve.

as many have said on here, MJ is probably not sweating this as much as we are. cus he has more confidence in himself than some of us do.

and, in the end, that's all that matters.

let me bring this home to you, so so def. if you are doing something a certain way, and you are getting your desired results, and someone tells you you are not doing your job, what are you gunna tell em?

that's a rhetorical question cus i know what ur gunna say. lol.

this is Linda 74's quote:

"But like I said he hasn´t actually defaulted yet anyway".

haha..u know, MJ is the wealthy one for 40 years. we're not. it looks kinda silly, us giving him advice. if anything HE should be giving US advice.
 
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Saying green is actually red doesn't change the fact that green is actually just green.

I'm officially out of this thread. I feel like I'm walking around in the Twilight Zone here.
 
Hoofmark said:
Saying green is actually red doesn't change the fact that green is actually just green.

I'm officially out of this thread. I feel like I'm walking around in the Twilight Zone here.
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well...if u want outta here, then, my guess is, u would NEVER wanna be in MJ's world. lol.

actually some people look in a woman's eyes, and call them green, while she calls them blue.:). i've seen it on many occasions. lol
 
reality check people ... regardless who is at fault is irrelevant.

eventually, somebody is going to get Mike so far in it, that he won't be able to come out unscathed.

that is what is concerning some people ... it is not about being right or wrong about any given situation. It is about listening to one another and understanding the other side.

It is great to have a strong faith in a person and their abilities but we are all human and flawed.
 
MJJChichi said:
reality check people ... regardless who is at fault is irrelevant.

eventually, somebody is going to get Mike so far in it, that he won't be able to come out unscathed.

that is what is concerning some people ... it is not about being right or wrong about any given situation. It is about listening to one another and understanding the other side.

It is great to have a strong faith in a person and their abilities but we are all human and flawed.
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you may be right in what you say, or wrong, but one thing is common to all of us...

none of us wants to be told what to do.

that's what makes the criticism of Mike so hard to take.

it feels like hyprocrisy.

that is the most real thing i can say.

everybody here has an edge to them. and none of em would be able to take criticism. but it's so easy to give it to Mike.
 
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you are correct :yes: it is always easier to give than to take advice or critique

however, i think what some are seeing as people's 'criticism', is actually worry for Michael. Maybe coming out or across as simply a critique and the concern for Mike is being lost. It seems the criticism is the only thing that is being heard or focused on. Then when someone responds to just the criticism, others become defensive, reply in kind and the loop begins.

No headway is being gained, we are simply griping at one another. if people have a genuine concern or worry in them, as a community all in the same boat of being a fan, we should try to support each other. We do not have to agree with said 'worry' to try and understand it. Not that anyone is wrong in their opinion but what is the point of griping back and forth??
 
MJJChichi said:
you are correct :yes: it is always easier to give than to take advice or critique

however, i think what some are seeing as people's 'criticism', is actually worry for Michael. Maybe coming out or across as simply a critique and the concern for Mike is being lost. It seems the criticism is the only thing that is being heard or focused on. Then when someone responds to just the criticism, others become defensive, reply in kind and the loop begins.

No headway is being gained, we are simply griping at one another. if people have a genuine concern or worry in them, as a community all in the same boat of being a fan, we should try to support each other. We do not have to agree with said 'worry' to try and understand it. Not that anyone is wrong in their opinion but what is the point of griping back and forth??
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ur right about that, Chi Chi.
:)

i guess tho, a lot of the 'critique' is cloaked in harshness, and slamming, and judgement. naturally, that's the first thing ur gunna see.

and someone else once said, why are certain points being repeated on threads?

well, usually, it's because a lot of people don't see em, as they come in at certain sections. but, for me, the one thing i saw repeated the most, that people didn't seem to see is that we don't know what's going on on MJ's side, or behind closed doors.

and, then again, the people that are trying to balance this all out with suggestions of patience, and understanding, and reserving of judgement, are also concerned for Mike, too. those people don't want to see him fall, either. but they've learned, that MJ handles things with an air of patience. and usually, the other side hangs themselves. patience is a virtue.

and there's a third thing that's really important, that keeps getting repeated that people don't see. it's the state of the media, today. shoot first, ask questions and investigate, later, and then call themselves the innocent messenger. we may be getting the wrong info, in a time when certain celebs get more favorable treatment than others...uh..than one. uh...Michael Jackson.

i've seen so many threads where they start out black and end up white...as in...we got some info that had peeps damning Michael, only to end the thread with info that had peeps not appearing on the thread anymore, or eating their words.

in other words, they come to find that he was no 'further deep down in it' than he was in the trial of the century...where he was as far from committing that act as the east is from the west.

the problem here is, Michael simply does things differently

and like the idea of an 'extraterrestrial creature'...the idea of different invokes fear. whether different is right..or wrong.

the fact is, the track record of those black to white threads makes it easy to be patient, and see what happens.
 
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MJJChichi said:
reality check people ... regardless who is at fault is irrelevant.

eventually, somebody is going to get Mike so far in it, that he won't be able to come out unscathed.

that is what is concerning some people ... it is not about being right or wrong about any given situation. It is about listening to one another and understanding the other side.

It is great to have a strong faith in a person and their abilities but we are all human and flawed.
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IMO

This is what the objective is.It is all by design. There is a conspiracy against Michael Jackson. We need to understand this. This is bigger than Raymond; everyone who ever works(indivisual deals) for him are contacted and PAID to do these things. The media is the "hand maiden" and bull-horn of this "events". The power structure in Hollywood is directly involved in this. We need to understand this people.

I hope this is not to heavy for some of you; but Michael Jackson in many ways is big business; serious business.

Mark these words; until he "loses" that masive 50% control of SONY/ATV(worth billion$$$/ Yes he is actually richer than Oprah and many many others) this is scheduled to continue. Mistakes and mix-ups happen from time to time; but this far too systematic & synchronized.
Learn what the mass media is and is about.

A good read on this subject: The Hidden Persuaders by Vance Packard
http://www.ditext.com/packard/toc.html

The art of mind control is begun with the creation of a conditioned response. Second is endless propaganda and negative repetition. This is where we are now;tomorrow we will hear & see more severe attacks on him. By then even his most supportive fans and some friends will be numb and apathetic. At that point he will "lose" everything.

As seen from the comments here the continuous media "negative reports" "problems" and lawsuits are having their effects.

Years ago when this was becoming the strategy to break Mr. Jackson most knew something was not right with one person being sued, accussed of horrible crimes, being "investigated" by multiple police departments, FBI and even bugged(note what little happened to the accused with that case)
Something most of you do not know is that Neverland was also saturated with bugs aswell; this of coarse was not aired by the media(who were all invested and active to make everyone believe he was "guilty". Ask yourselves seriously(do not write this off as non-sense) why???

He is an extremely successfull entertainer and business man who is the most famous person on the planet in the past millennium.

Unanswered questions:

How much is Michael Jackson really worth?

What would happen if Michael Jackson is able to pass his legacy $$$ to his family and children?

Why is this concert and possible world tour being sabotaged and threatened; before it even begins?

How independent is he; can he finance a music studio?

Green-light a movie?

The names of the people behind the scenes?

Will other "suprises" suddenly happen when the concerts begin in the UK?










PEACE:angel:
 
MJJChichi said:
reality check people ... regardless who is at fault is irrelevant.

eventually, somebody is going to get Mike so far in it, that he won't be able to come out unscathed.

that is what is concerning some people ... it is not about being right or wrong about any given situation. It is about listening to one another and understanding the other side.

It is great to have a strong faith in a person and their abilities but we are all human and flawed.
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And in the grand scheme of things, is this truly that important? Really....think about it. It's not worth losing friends over!
 
I dont understand all the critisism
to me it seems clear why they would stall
and not respond .. there is nothing wrong or illegal
in using this tactic of stalling till the last minute

Myself I believe Michael and his attorneys are very aware and
know exactly whats going on and how they want to proceed

They are diliberatly not responding to this case untill Michael is
out of the country and in London _ There is nothing to critisise or
wrong with them using this tactic to their advantage _That way
this case can not delay his trip or concerts and they will have to
wait untill MJ returns from London _ before the case will be heard
This is a WISE move on his part :)

also its isnt that Michael has no intention of paying Raymone
he is just not agreeing to her terms and the amount she
asked him for and - so he is allowing her to take him to court
to settle on a fair amount - they may very well settle on a fair
amount _ that usually how it goes down _ the court is just
used as a bargainign chip .. It how business is done ..

But not untill he has his concert in the bag so to speak

I will bet money on it
that this is how it is going down
and Im always right :D LOL
 
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qbee said:
Myself I believe Michael and his attorneys are very aware and
know exactly whats going on and how they want to proceed

They are diliberatly not responding to this case untill Michale is
out of the country and in London _ There is nothing to critisise or
wrong with them using this tatcic to their advantage _That way
this case can not delay his trip or concerts and they will have to
wait untill MJ returns from London _ before the case will be heard
This is a WISE move on his part :)

also its isnt that Michael has no intention of paying Raymone
he is just not agreeing to her terms and the amount she
asked him for and - so he is allowing her to take him to court
to settle on a fair amount - thay may very well settle on a fair
amount _ that usually how it goes down _ the court is just
used as a bargainign chip .. It how business is done ..

But not untill he has his concert in the bag so to speak

I will bet money on it
that this is how it is going down
and Im always right :D LOL
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From what I understand the only problem with that is that if Michael doesn't respond then she gets everything she asks for and he's s.o.l. So...I don't think I'll get wrapped up in the spectulation of trying to understand it all. Patience will give the answers :yes:
 
MJJC Momma said:
From what I understand the only problem with that is that if Michael doesn't respond then she gets everything she asks for and he's s.o.l. So...I don't think I'll get wrapped up in the spectulation of trying to understand it all. Patience will give the answers :yes:
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Yes I understand peoples concern
but to attack him as if he did something wrong
is just unsettlling to me _ There are reasons for this

Im sure they will respond- but not untill MJ is in london
they will still have time to do that. I dont understand why
people think they wouldn't respond and let this default -
They are certainly not idiots :) MJ and his attorneys have
been down this road enough to know how to use the system
to thier advantage.



TSCM said:
To be perfectly clear, there is no "default judgment" yet, only the notice of default. If no concise action happens soon, then the next step would be the filing of the official judgment against him.
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I believe They are going to wait till the last minute
and use it to thier advantage. MJ will be in London by
that time - safe and sound :) and the case will have to
wait to be heard utill he gets back
 
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From looking at the court document that was initially filed by Raymone, it does not seem like she will get what she is asking for. What she is asking for is unreasonable.

But, it does look like she IS entitled to something. Exactly how much is the question.
 
AllForMJ said:
From looking at the court document that was initially filed by Raymone, it does not seem like she will get what she is asking for. What she is asking for is unreasonable.
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No she wont becuase it hasnt defaulted yet
just a notice of default _ thay have so much time to respond to this notice
and they will respond _ once MJ is in London :) a couple more weeks _

StephluvsMJ said:
So how long does MJ have to respond?
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I believe they have aprox 2 weeks to respond but not sure _
it should state that on the notice

that would make it the 18th of June
that they have to respond _ I believe MJ will be in london
by that time and thats why they are waiting to respond -
they may use the defense that MJ was never served also.
I dont believe for a second they will let this go into default
They know what to do and how to do it _ they are not as
stupid as some here seem to make them out to be :doh:
If thay havent responded YET then it is for a GOOD reason

There is nothing wrong with them waiting
Its a wise business decision to wait untill
MJ is in London before they respond
 
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At the risk of speaking on 'Michael's favour' always...this looks like yet another case of the Julien's auction that was getting some of your knickers twisted...in the end all your catalogues and Michael-is-an-uninformed-man-rubbish went out the door without a hmmm noise.

With this Raymone business too you've all cried rivers already saying how he will be ........ (in the space add - loosing obscene amounts of money/lossing earnings from This IS It tour / damned as he has ignored a court case brought against him --what a misinformed fool). Throwing about legal jargon when the court documents merely shows that MJ has been served and he has now a stipulated time to respond to them...makes me think thankgod some of you are not lawyers.

get over it...Michael Jackson lived his success, that's saying more than your arm chair management techniques.

sick of it. I expect this to be sorted in true jackson style.
 
qbee said:
No she wont becuase it hasnt defaulted yet
just a notice of default _ thay have so much time to respond to this notice
and they will respond _ once MJ is in London :) a couple more weeks _
I believe thay have 30 days to respond but not sure _
it should state that on the notice
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And...

From looking at the court document and exhibits, a lot of what she wants to be compensated for falls outside of the agreement.

Plus, the work that she did is not commensurate with the amount of money that she is asking for in her lawsuit. It's nowhere near $44,000,000.

MJ and his lawyers will have to figure out exactly how amount she is entitled to for the work that she did, but it won't be the amount she's claiming she should get.

I'll show you all what's jumping out of her court docs.
 
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