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Michael - The Great Album Debate

ivy said:
anyone interested in a long post from me in regards to my overall take in this situation...

if no one is going to read it I'm not going to write it :p
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Ivy I'm very interested, it's you that keeps me always interested!

add: oops, I skipped some pages, have some reading to do!! Yippie! Thank you!
 
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Garden said:
Ha OK, no problem, we can defend each other...
And Pentum, Jason or not... I'll never get used to the tone sometimes used in this thread.
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Well..

"Edited Thread title and description disclaimer:

Members coming into this thread you do so at you own responsibility, if you do not like the tone or what is being said here then you are duly asked to steer clear of this thread, as of now we will not accept any responsibility should members complain about what is written or if debates get out of hand. again it is your own responsibility as to whether you come in here and what your participation might be."


Anyway, movin' on..
 
Pentum said:
Well..

"Edited Thread title and description disclaimer:

Members coming into this thread you do so at you own responsibility, if you do not like the tone or what is being said here then you are duly asked to steer clear of this thread, as of now we will not accept any responsibility should members complain about what is written or if debates get out of hand. again it is your own responsibility as to whether you come in here and what your participation might be."

BTW, I didn't intend to take BUMPER side (although I agree with his counter post to Ivy), but I felt what you said was unfair.

Anyway, movin' on..
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OK, in fact you are right, that part of the disclaimer is a written permission to use whatever tone people want. The words date from before the thread was made open for general public. And sorry @ Gaz, I don't agree with you (seemingly) not caring about the tone on your board.

But there's also added later : "Edit: this thread is now open for discussion pro or con (believer or doubter) to tackle the topic not each other."

For me, people defending an opinion, OK no problem with that. Tone, I have problem with. And yes, I could stay away here, but that's no solution. In my opinion it was first of all the tone of some fans that made the feeling of great division between fans and not only the facts or not-facts. But yeah, I'm not really a psychologist...
The reason I read this thread is because I, like you, am interested in what's going on with this thing and the hope for a sort of a outcome... And I have the right to express my opinion, like you.

OK, I would not have reacted but something alarmed my feelings earlier today on the board. Now I have to go, see you!
 
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Sometimes I still debate with myself thinking “How on earth this sweet, quiet, loyal, loving Cascio kid could do such a thing, how can they have the courage to create 12 fake songs like that??” I understand the views of a believer BUT we still have no valid proof MJ worked on those songs.
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I still think bout that alot of the time cuz eddie (like his bro frank) were so close with michael and it's hard to comprehand they would use someone else voice to make out they were michael's voice. I guess its hard cuz michael is gone and it will be hard to make new material without michael and make it into michael's own style which we all know & love, but at the same time it would've been nice to find out the whole truth of this whole fiasco and finally put this matter to rest
 
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Now, going back the topic :)
 
I have a very different opinion about the history behind these songs. I'd like to type it up at some point but it will end up being very long. It's a more of a timeline really. I will say that the idea of bias is just wrong. People like me never came to this position because we don't like the Cascios, Estate etc. Many of us weren't even aware of any controversy and sure as hell didn't take the ideas of certain family members seriously. We are here because we have a dozen songs, three of which made it to an album, that sound extremely dissimilar to the Michael that we have been listening to for years (decades in some cases). Instead they sound identical to a soundalike. Right down to the fact that we have been able to identify countless matches in the songs to the vocals of the soundalike. Vibrato. Pronounciation. Accent. Timbre. Grit. Snorts. They all match Jason. Not Michael. We have never been offered any kind of official explanation for this beyond a vaguely worded statement that was not backed up by any proof. We still have nothing to suggest that Michael even knew about these songs, let alone recorded them. Just because the Estate/Sony are confident the vocals are real, doesn't make it so. It doesn't look like they even compared them to Jason. I don't believe they were in any way involved in making fake songs. It is far more logical that they simply messed up.

To me, this recent comment from Thad Nauden sums everything up:

Thad Nauden
I don't want fame or the spotlight. Just give me the Money!
 
StellaJackson said:
Thad Nauden
I don't want fame or the spotlight. Just give me the Money!
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Which money???

He could only get money if he had anything to do with producing what Jason allegedly recorded for Cascio.

You don't see a major issue with this? In order to have a claim for money, he must have worked first. He can't even prove that it's Jason on those songs. But he wants money???
For what? Because some people claim it's Jason on those songs? Where's his legal right for getting money then?

A producer doesn't get anything out of nothing. He must have done some work in the first place.

Thad Nauden actually only tried to get some spotlight - in the same way like Jason. He's not a big name, these conspiracy theories are pretty good for him.

If he thinks he deserves money just because he worked with Jason, then he's pretty much dumb. And guess, why you don't see him claiming sth like "hey, i produced these fakes with jason".
ROFL!

End of the story. Thad Nauden has always been irrelevant to this discussion.
 
Korgnex said:
Which money???

He could only get money if he had anything to do with producing what Jason allegedly recorded for Cascio.

You don't see a major issue with this? In order to have a claim for money, he must have worked first. He can't even prove that it's Jason on those songs. But he wants money???
For what? Because some people claim it's Jason on those songs? Where's his legal right for getting money then?

A producer doesn't get anything out of nothing. He must have done some work in the first place.

Thad Nauden actually only tried to get some spotlight - in the same way like Jason. He's not a big name, these conspiracy theories are pretty good for him.

If he thinks he deserves money just because he worked with Jason, then he's pretty much dumb. And guess, why you don't see him claiming sth like "hey, i produced these fakes with jason".
ROFL!

End of the story. Thad Nauden has always been irrelevant to this discussion.
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You do know who Thad Nauden is don't you? I think your getting confused with Tony Kurtis. It was just a quote to sum the whole situation up. Not just about TN. It's always been about money when controversy erupts around Michael. It is my opinion that Thad Nauden knew that his client was involved in recording the songs. I doubt Jason would have attempted to do it without him knowing. I believe he probably received a cut of the money that Jason was paid by Cascio in order to keep quiet. I also believe that he has since lied to both the Estate, Sony and fans. Why would he need to prove that it is Jason on the songs? That's the exact opposite of what he wants. Your right that a producer doesn't get anything out of nothing. Well firstly TN is not Jason's producer and secondly that would only be applicable in a normal situation where everything is above board, which is hardly criteria befitting of the Cascio tracks. As the manager of the artist who is alleged to be involved, and who was personally contacted by the Estate and Sony, he is very much relevant.

By the way you don't need to type in massive letters. I can read. Perhaps it is you who should double check what you read. You are clearly confusing Thad Nauden with Tony Kurtis.
 
Oops, yes, I meant Tony Kurtis and mixed his name up. xD

WHERE and in WHICH context did his manager, Thad Nauden, say "I don't want fame or the spotlight. Just give me the Money!"?
 
I got inspired:

S8amj.jpg
 
StellaJackson said:
You do know who Thad Nauden is don't you? I think your getting confused with Tony Kurtis. It was just a quote to sum the whole situation up. Not just about TN. It's always been about money when controversy erupts around Michael. It is my opinion that Thad Nauden knew that his client was involved in recording the songs. I doubt Jason would have attempted to do it without him knowing. I believe he probably received a cut of the money that Jason was paid by Cascio in order to keep quiet. I also believe that he has since lied to both the Estate, Sony and fans. Why would he need to prove that it is Jason on the songs? That's the exact opposite of what he wants. Your right that a producer doesn't get anything out of nothing. Well firstly TN is not Jason's producer and secondly that would only be applicable in a normal situation where everything is above board, which is hardly criteria befitting of the Cascio tracks. As the manager of the artist who is alleged to be involved, and who was personally contacted by the Estate and Sony, he is very much relevant.

By the way you don't need to type in massive letters. I can read. Perhaps it is you who should double check what you read. You are clearly confusing Thad Nauden with Tony Kurtis.
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Well seeing Jason still works as a security guard it couldn't have been a large amount of money.

Anyway I thought you said in an earlier post that Jason's motivation for doing this was not money but "other reasons".
 
^ he could still work as a sherif even though he got some extra cash you know. Also, I doubt cash was the main reason why he did agree to do this "deal". Jason always wanted to be on a Michael jackson record. He said it himself.
 
mynameiscande1 said:
Well seeing Jason still works as a security guard it couldn't have been a large amount of money.

Anyway I thought you said in an earlier post that Jason's motivation for doing this was not money but "other reasons".
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I believe the motivation was indeed what Pentum said, which is how I've always felt. With regards to the money issue, Jason works as a deputy sheriff, not a security guard. The worst thing he could have done, as far as getting exposed goes, would have been to have quit his job. It would have simply confirmed people's suspicions. The golden rule in any type of situation like that is to carry on as normal. Jason has a good job and is on good money (public record), it is unlikely he would have received millions that would justify him leaving such a job anyway.

If we look at all the things he ever said about himself and Michael, apart from being incredibly big headed, one thing is clear. He wanted to be Michael. He wanted to be in that world. He wanted to be on an MJ record. I look back at his comments now such as how he claims that he was channeling Michael and that fans would naturally go from MJ to him and his motive becomes clear to me.
 
Well Im thinking there are MJ backing vocals. Not many, though, and they are underneath the Jason Lead, should Jason be the lead singer.
 
StellaJackson said:
Huh???
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Well, Jasno is not of mental capacity to record unless he has guide vocals. They didn't want to use authentic vocal, they wanted to have the oh so talented Jasno on board. Hope that helps, and my source is "I was right there pushing buttons."
 
I also have a bit of a feeling there are hidden MJ demo vocals hidden under Jason's. Perhaps, in certain areas like the choruses of the songs. Other parts may have already been recorded by Porte or at least written out? But I do think Michael may have started to record some of the songs and that's why Eddie so smugly says that Michael wrote them.
 
Aniram said:
I also have a bit of a feeling there are hidden MJ demo vocals hidden under Jason's. Perhaps, in certain areas like the choruses of the songs. Other parts may have already been recorded by Porte or at least written out? But I do think Michael may have started to record some of the songs and that's why Eddie so smugly says that Michael wrote them.
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But, I mean, hidden MJ demo vocals?? Isn't it sad that we're led to believe that these lead vocals are that of Michael Jackson when we can't even commit to the feeling of hearing him clearly in the backing vocals?

Their explanations have been so flimsy, sneaky and messy that it's embarrassing to have them represent MJ.
 
Why hide any vocal? If it does exist, it would be pushed to the forefront of the song for all to hear, not in the back to a human goat.
 
[youtube]wBHpBYcCuCQ[/youtube]

Damn, Jean is getting better and better with the English and the singing. Let's pray the Fiascos don't contact him.
 
Pentum said:
[youtube]wBHpBYcCuCQ[/youtube]

Damn, Jean is getting better and better with the English and the singing. Let's pray the Fiascos don't contact him.
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Yes, his imitation is good, but I don't think he could really fool MJ's fans. Set aside his different voice from MJ's, his vibrato is even faster than Jasno's.
 
His vibrato varies, also, if Jason could fool MJ fans, this guy certainly can. IMO, he is the closest to MJ overall.

I dare to say that IF no one knew of Jean and the whole Taxi BJ thing, and he knew English perfectly, many people could think it was MJ (without seeing him OFC). It could've been MJ's "new voice".
 
Pentum said:
His vibrato varies, also, if Jasno could fool MJ fans, this guy certainly can. IMO, he is the closest to MJ overall.

I dare to say that IF no one knew of Jean and the whole Taxi BJ thing, and he knew English perfectly, many people could think it was MJ (without seeing him OFC). It could've been MJ's "new voice".
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Too many ifs :) Jean's good at some vocal range imitations, Jasno at other. If they had worked together, well, yeah, they could probably fool some people :D
 
Pentum said:
[youtube]wBHpBYcCuCQ[/youtube]

Damn, Jean is getting better and better with the English and the singing. Let's pray the Fiascos don't contact him.
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LMAO! He's very good at mimicking and I grant him the succes. Very special talent.

BUMPER SNIPPET said:
Yes, his imitation is good, but I don't think he could really fool MJ's fans. Set aside his different voice from MJ's, his vibrato is even faster than Jasno's.
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He fooled me with one sentence, but a whole song? Naahh...don't think so.

Pentum said:
His vibrato varies, also, if Jason could fool MJ fans, this guy certainly can. IMO, he is the closest to MJ overall.

I dare to say that IF no one knew of Jean and the whole Taxi BJ thing, and he knew English perfectly, many people could think it was MJ (without seeing him OFC). It could've been MJ's "new voice".
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Agree.
 
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