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Michael - The Great Album Debate

kreen said:
I don't want 9 MJ songs to be lost to history forever because of some conspiracy theorists : when it comes to the artists I like, I'm a completist, and I want EVERYTHING released, even the sub-par stuff. As for the big uproar that would surely follow, we can all make it disappear by not coming on these fan forums, which are the only place where any uproar exists; in the "real" world, the debate lasted about 2 days...
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I agree with your post. I too want to hear what else was in the works and what direction Michael took with them.


After reading in some posts about Cascio tracks caused fan division.
It's nothing new, there has been fan division before: Jackson tribute concert, boycott Sony - don't boycott Sony, hate estate - don't hate estate, no more new books about MJ- more books about MJ etc etc etc, the list is long. It depends how we look at the things, but division is something that will always be there. I don't think there is a one thing that everybody (the whole fan base) agrees with?
 
Bubs said:
I agree with your post. I too want to hear what else was in the works and what direction Michael took with them.


After reading in some posts about Cascio tracks caused fan division.
It's nothing new, there has been fan division before: Jackson tribute concert, boycott Sony - don't boycott Sony, hate estate - don't hate estate, no more new books about MJ- more books about MJ etc etc etc, the list is long. It depends how we look at the things, but division is something that will always be there. I don't think there is a one thing that everybody (the whole fan base) agrees with?
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Imo, the Cascio tracks caused the worst Fan division.
 
Bubs said:
I agree with your post. I too want to hear what else was in the works and what direction Michael took with them. After reading in some posts about Cascio tracks caused fan division. It's nothing new, there has been fan division before: Jackson tribute concert, boycott Sony - don't boycott Sony, hate estate - don't hate estate, no more new books about MJ- more books about MJ etc etc etc, the list is long. It depends how we look at the things, but division is something that will always be there. I don't think there is a one thing that everybody (the whole fan base) agrees with?
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That a Bad Tour 88 concert should be released? That is the thing: it is definitely true that there is always division in the fanbase, but the one thing that connects all of us is our love for Michael's work. And that is why, imo, these tracks have caused a much bigger rift than any of the things you mention. It is Michael's music we are talking about here, not a concert organized by his family, or the way his record label used to treat him. What used to be the glue that held us together has become a topic for debate now. If you think these tracks are authentic, then you are annoyed because the other side is criticizing what you think is Michael's work. If you are a doubter, you are annoyed because you cannot comprehend why people cannot hear that it is not Michael's work. The issue cuts to the core of our fandom. Furthermore, this is not a topic where both sides can be right: it is not a subject on which people can have different opinions, based on whatever their values, attitudes and perceptions are, like all the other things you mention. There can only be one truth here; it's either Michael or it is not.
 
Bubs said:
I agree with your post. I too want to hear what else was in the works and what direction Michael took with them.


After reading in some posts about Cascio tracks caused fan division.
It's nothing new, there has been fan division before: Jackson tribute concert, boycott Sony - don't boycott Sony, hate estate - don't hate estate, no more new books about MJ- more books about MJ etc etc etc, the list is long. It depends how we look at the things, but division is something that will always be there. I don't think there is a one thing that everybody (the whole fan base) agrees with?
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The Cascio songs have leaked and i'm sure you can find them somewhere around and listen to them.What i don't understand is why some people want them so much released under MJ's name when there is so much controversy surrounding them. We don't even know if MJ had anything to do at all with those songs.

I do understand the need for new MJ songs, i wanted too to hear what Mike was doing concerning music in his latest years, i'm not going to deny that but i wanted to be with respect to the man and his work. Something that was not done with the Michael album.

By the way, fans are not so irrational, come on. They react when there is a reason. Why wasn't there any reaction, or any division concerning the Immortal tour? Maybe because it was done like it was supposed to?

And as i have already posted in a previous comment, this whole debate actually is not what we the fans want but it is what it would be best for MJ's legacy now on. We the fans would probably want lots of things released concerning MJ's work and private life but i don't think those things would benefit his legacy much.
 
kreen said:
I don't want 9 MJ songs to be lost to history forever because of some conspiracy theorists : when it comes to the artists I like, I'm a completist, and I want EVERYTHING released, even the sub-par stuff. As for the big uproar that would surely follow, we can all make it disappear by not coming on these fan forums, which are the only place where any uproar exists; in the "real" world, the debate lasted about 2 days...
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StellaJackson said:
You know this is actually really offensive. If that's truly how you feel then maybe you should just stop coming here? It's no more a theory that the songs are fake than it is they are real. It may be your opinion that they are 9 MJ songs but many fans have an equally valid opinion that they aren't and neither side has been explicitly proven to be right. You are talking about doubters like they are lower than you. It isn't about believing some conspiracy theory. It is about the fact that we don't hear MJ. And the debate certainly lasted longer than two days. If that was the case then they wouldn't have taken us seriously by removing Monster from Cirque. You need to stop belittling people. Please.

I also think it is somewhat hypocritical when you used to say things like this: "As for me, my position regarding the Cascio tracks, when all is said and done, is this : "I'm not convinced they're authentic, but until proof emerges that they are not, I'll reluctantly treat them as MJ tracks"." And I don't get why you support the Cascio tracks so much when you have made statements like the one below:

"Michael Jackson - Invincible
I second this choice : still my choice for the worst album of all time, based on the time it took to record andthe number of talented people involved."
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The question whether it's Michael or not is too important to make it (and any uproar) 'just disappear'. I think we all can agree on that.

Can I ask you something Kreen? Is there something you read, saw or heard that made you change your mind about the authenticity? I'm not talking about what you hear personally, but maybe you know something we don't and that contributed to the way you feel about the songs now?
 
SoCav said:
That a Bad Tour 88 concert should be released?
There can only be one truth here; it's either Michael or it is not.
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I didn't mention Bad tour in my post?

I think the truth is somewhere in the middle, and I can accept it.
 
Bubs said:
I didn't mention Bad tour in my post?

I think the truth is somewhere in the middle, and I can accept it.
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Sorry, I wrote that post rather haphazardly on my phone and could not bold the part of your post I wanted to. I meant to say that the release of a Bad Tour 88 dvd is an issue the entire fanbase seems to agree on. This is an example of the shared appreciation we all have here for Michael's work and of how it normally brings the fanbase, as divided as it may be on all kinds of issues, together. The exception to this are, of course, the Cascio tracks.
 
Korgnex said:
All fake CD-Rs/bootlegged Vinyls, most prominently from the scammer "brazilcds" on eBay. The files were leaked and they burnt them on CD, that's it.
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Oh okay thank you :)

Cause I have Hold My Hand (CD), Hollywood Tonight (CD), Behind The Mask (7" Vinyl), and I wanted to have them all.
 
qbee said:
I didnt mean belivers would want fake songs - I mistated that

meaning they belive the songs are real not fake. = they are not saying MJ wants want fake songs

BTW I edited my post for clarification it was confusing
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Oh okay thank you QBee for clarifying it :)
 
There's also "Behind The Mask" and "(I Like) The Way You Love Me" on promo CDs. Some believed the BTM CD to be fake because only one known seller used to sell them on eBay but even though the song was distributed digitally mainly, Jive Records, a sub-division of Sony Music has pressed them for the French market. The playtime is listed incorrectly on the sleeve and CD as 3:35 but it goes 3:39 minutes, of course. Maybe that's also a reason why some considered it to be fake when it's not. The CDs were manufactured weeks before the Radio Edit leaked. I have one of them.

"(I Like) The Way You Love Me" was also an airplay single in France, MONTHS BEFORE fans learnt that it was to become one in Italy, too. On Wikipedia e.g. no contributor seems to know this as there's no mentioning of it being played in France in early 2011.


All these so-called promo CDs from Brazil are fake though. The scammer "brazilcds" even sold "Hollywood Tonight" CDs containing the same tracks several times on a CD under different names. LOL!
 
Korgnex said:
There's also "Behind The Mask" and "(I Like) The Way You Love Me" on promo CDs. Some believed the BTM CD to be fake because only one known seller used to sell them on eBay but even though the song was distributed digitally mainly, Jive Records, a sub-division of Sony Music has pressed them for the French market. The playtime is listed incorrectly on the sleeve and CD as 3:35 but it goes 3:39 minutes, of course. Maybe that's also a reason why some considered it to be fake when it's not. The CDs were manufactured weeks before the Radio Edit leaked. I have one of them.

"(I Like) The Way You Love Me" was also an airplay single in France, MONTHS BEFORE fans learnt that it was to become one in Italy, too. On Wikipedia e.g. no contributor seems to know this as there's no mentioning of it being played in France in early 2011.


All these so-called promo CDs from Brazil are fake though. The scammer "brazilcds" even sold "Hollywood Tonight" CDs containing the same tracks several times on a CD under different names. LOL!
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Really?

Time to search for them lol I like buying singles from all his albums.

Thanks !



Do you know if (I Like) The Way You Love Me has a single cover ?
 
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Thought I'd share this :)






Lol
8f9650d89e982eae0b5ccb9b7db7a427.png
 
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ADKIc3mAnX said:
Do you know if (I Like) The Way You Love Me has a single cover ?
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No, it has the MICHAEL album cover. They used the same design for all 4 singles. I would have to look up which country these promos are from, I can't remember it right now. I don't think they are from Italy.
 
Korgnex said:
No, it has the MICHAEL album cover. They used the same design for all 4 singles. I would have to look up which country these promos are from, I can't remember it right now. I don't think they are from Italy.
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Not really Breaking News, Hold My Hand, Hollywood Tonight, and Behind The Mask, have their own covers that's why I was thinking (I Like) The Way You Love Me would have it's own too.

I made this with all the covers of "Michael" :)
http://i1184.photobucket.com/albums/z332/ADKIc3mAnX36O/MICHAELALBUMANDSINGLESGIF.gif




BTW today I see some Bad activity going on http://www.facebook.com/michaeljackson
 
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[youtube]0GYsRC-7_S0[/youtube]

All alone wishing on stars
Waiting for you to find me
One sweet night I knew I would see
A stranger who'd be my friend

When someone in the dark reaches out to you
And touches off a spark that comes shining through
It tells you never be afraid
Then somewhere in your heart you can feel the glow
A light to keep you warm when the night winds blow
Like it was written in the stars I knew
My friend, my someone in the dark was you

Oh, I believe you and I
Could never really say goodbye
Wherever you may be
I'll look up and see
Someone in the dark for me
Wherever you may be
I'll look up and see
Someone in the dark for me

Thank you Michael, for the escapism, the dreams, the magic; You taught me what music can do and no other artist has or will ever have that special place in my heart.
 
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ADKIc3mAnX said:
Not really Breaking News, Hold My Hand, Hollywood Tonight, and Behind The Mask, have their own covers
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I meant that these specific promo CDs all have the MICHAEL album cover, no individual ones.
 
Korgnex said:
"(I Like) The Way You Love Me" was also an airplay single in France, MONTHS BEFORE fans learnt that it was to become one in Italy, too. On Wikipedia e.g. no contributor seems to know this as there's no mentioning of it being played in France in early 2011.
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Yes, exact !

Proof here : http://www.mjdatabank.com/memo/news/2011/janvier/20110128_single_fr.htm

Korgnex said:
All these so-called promo CDs from Brazil are fake though. The scammer "brazilcds" even sold "Hollywood Tonight" CDs containing the same tracks several times on a CD under different names. LOL!
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I had made a list of real and fake CDs : http://www.mjjcommunity.com/forum/threads/118347-Hollywood-Tonight-Promo-CDs-Fake-or-not
 
p.s. to my post regarding accents and dialects on page +/- 1700 on this thread. MJ definitely had (end of 70s) what is in linguistics called "Black English" accent when pronouncing some of the words such as "have".

I base my opinion on this video:

[youtube]YW9cIvgFcTI&feature=related[/youtube]
 
So many rare footages showing work in progress... :)

[youtube]rdhlhAbCWrU[/youtube]

[youtube]kUzE3ZYm6yk&feature=related[/youtube]

[youtube]bgnZFZmRLxE[/youtube]

[youtube]xroGkKjVNS8[/youtube]
 
And here is the whole song "State of Independence". Catchy tune typically from the 80s with MJ in the background among others. :)

[youtube]01gpp3WyeP0&feature=related[/youtube]
 
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