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Michael - The Great Album Debate

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Aniram said:
The Jason Malachi vocals sound younger, less dynamic, and his breath is shorter.
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This is exactly why I'm convinced it's not Michael on those songs...
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

jaXXXon said:
Listen to Blue Gangsta.... That song is years beyond any of the casico tracks musically and vocals. YOu would be saying the same if Mj actually sang those songs and you played them
Back to back with the mystery vocalist on the three casico tracks.
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I love Blue Gangsta, definitely one of my favorite Michael Jackson songs, but I disagree with you, and I understand why they left it off the album. It doesn't really build up and go anywhere. It's an amazing song, though, and I think it fit being released on that rap track.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Aniram said:
I love Blue Gangsta, definitely one of my favorite Michael Jackson songs, but I disagree with you, and I understand why they left it off the album. It doesn't really build up and go anywhere. It's an amazing song, though, and I think it fit being released on that rap track.
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I don't think any of the casico tracks were fit or release, Teddy Riley reworked or not, especially being that the vocalist sings with less takent thank mj's pinky toe!

When I mentioned BG, it was more vocal related but I would take that track over any of the casico tracks any day of the week.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

^ I know what you mean, and I would, but Michael was in super serious mode when he recorded Blue Gangsta. When he recorded the Cascio tracks was he in top shape? I highly doubt it.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Aniram said:
^ I know what you mean, and I would, but Michael was in super serious mode when he recorded Blue Gangsta. When he recorded the Cascio tracks was he in top shape? I highly doubt it.
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Why do you highly doubt it?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

I doubt it because,

A. The child molestation charges just having ended in 2005, and knowing how much pain he was in during that time, and he definitely needed at least a year to recover from that.

B. He was very secluded, and he was obviously taking shelter in the Cascio home for safety and privacy during this time. I doubt he had lost all his ability, but he wasn't training with vocal coaches there, rehearsing constantly, etc. You know what I mean? He wasn't in a completely professional environment and these songs seem slightly spontaneous. There was work put in to them, but it was an overall very different atmosphere than usual.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

...and that's why the vocals aren't very good?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

I don't think the vocals are that bad, I just think they're rough in a lot of places, but that's understandable, I think Michael would be somewhat horrified and very disappointed that these takes were used, it was never intended, but it's too late now.

edit: By the way, if this was Malachi, don't you think they would have been a little bit more professional with mixing these tracks? You can hear so many little noises and pops and background noise in them, why would they leave that in? Wouldn't they want to make them as professional sounding as they could?

The vocals are very raw sounding in a lot of places, but I kind of like that. I know, him being a crazy genius perfectionist, MJ wouldn't approve, though.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

There was some court case, maybe the Mexico Deposition, where he was on painkillers. He didn't look too well, and yet he sounded pretty good singing.

Also, during the MSG concerts in 2001, he sounded quite dosed up on the MTV cameras, yet he sounded exactly like MJ should in the shows.

These are just two examples I can think of where MJ wasn't in the best shape, but didn't at any point sound like anyone else when singing.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

You're talking 2001, though? He was rehearsing constantly, had just released an album, preparing for a major tour?

How does that compare to not even two years after the child molestation trials and he had been spending time with his kids?

Remember how much pain he was in in 2005? Do you remember? Do you remember his back pain, his arms, how couldn't sleep, barely walk? Went to the hospital several times, etc.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

What about the first example, was that in 93?

So because the pain crossed a certain threshold, it changed his voice? Can I just clarify that's what you're proposing?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Yes, I would say so. Several injuries, a massive trauma, 3 years out of the studio, in a terrible basement studio and you're sleeping in the corner of the room, no training. That wouldn't affect your voice whatsoever? You've got to be kidding.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

I agree it would affect your singing ability. It might make it harder to hit the right notes and sustain them. But would it change the tone of his voice?

By the way, some of the things you said just there, we have no way of verifying. We don't know whether he had any vocal training during that time, nor whether he had been in a studio.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

True, just speculation, but I'm just explaining my opinion and the situation I find most likely.
 
kopwatcher said:
Also, during the MSG concerts in 2001, he sounded quite dosed up on the MTV cameras, yet he sounded exactly like MJ should in the shows.

.
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He lip-synched most of those shows, you know.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

^ Yeah, he did that a lot. But wait, if he always sounded flawless why would he ever need to lipsync? Right? It's because he didn't ALWAYS sound perfect.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

^^No, he didn't always sound perfect, but he's always sounded like himself...
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

^ How do you know he sounded like himself when he's lipsyncing?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Because he sung songs live e.g Dangerous World Tour, History World Tour, but also lip synced songs. Of course he sounded like himself rather than actually sounding like Jason Malachi.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

I think he sounds like himself in the Cascio songs, too.

Aside from the early 80's, when have you ever heard the rough home demo recordings from Michael Jackson, and from the basement of his 'second family' less than two years after the trials are over, where he was outrageously ill?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

You seriously don't think he sounds like Jason? Have you taken a look at the comparison videos?

Look at this:
[youtube]mNZZOkelZXE[/youtube]

How can you say that "Michael Jackson" in these songs does NOT sound like Jason?

Being ill and all that doesn't change his "voice" this much. We have plenty of demos of MJ simply mumbling words here and there, not evey trying to sing, where he sounds 100% like himself.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

^ I have watched that video several times, and I think it's the most convincing, but I even have that song, Room 2 Breathe, and it's just not good. And his album, Critical, isn't good either!

AT LEAST, someone had to come up with the melodies and lyrics to these songs, and it definitely wasn't Jason Malachi. The guy has barely written two decent songs! There's no way you go from Tell It Like It Is, Don't Walk Away, How I Do, and Room 2 Breathe to All I Need, Keep Your Head Up, Breaking News, Stay, or Monster.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

I think that's irrelevant. It's the voice that matters, it's not Michael singing.

We don't know for sure who wrote the songs. James Porte, Jason, MJ, Cascios, whatever. "Stay" sounds like it has been taken straight out from Jason's album Critical. Just listen to How I Do and Critical. But from what I know, Sony bought 12 a cappella tracks from the Cascios and made the music. That could explain why you thinks it's huge that the songs doesn't sound like anything on Jason's album.

Of course you can go from the older Jason tracks to the new cascio tracks, why not?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

I'm talking about the vocal melodies, not the music production from Teddy and Tricky and the others, Malachi just doesn't do the same things with his voice, in my opinion, and why would the recordings need such processing and all the rough parts?

So they had Jason record in a bad atmosphere to have the illusion that Michael was recording in a bad studio? Why? Why not just say the studio was normal?

Or that's a lie to cover up the vocals sounding strange?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

I have all of Jason's songs, in CD quality and I've studied them. Everything he does in the Cascio songs, he has done in other of his songs. Why would the recordings need such processing? You're talking about Stay? Or BN? Because I can't really hear any "processed vocals" in KYHU, Monster (a few parts) and All I Need. The whole "processed vocals" statement is only a excuse to why it doesn't sound 100% like Michael.

We don't know if Jason recorded in a bad atmosphere (highly doubt...). We don't even know if Michael recorded stuff over at the Cascios at all. We have no proof other than a picture of the amateur studio.

Keep in mind that in these songs, Jason must have done everything he could to imitate Michael.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

^ I hear you. Good points. Right now, I feel Michael in these songs.

So, obviously, the team that put this album together has done a pretty good job at making it feel like Michael Jackson to some people.

Everything Jason has done, to me, sounds nothing like Michael Jackson in terms of songwriting ability.

Sounding LIKE Michael Jackson, though, I think the guy does a fantastic job at times. Never heard him sustain it through an entire song, however.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Pentum said:
You seriously don't think he sounds like Jason? Have you taken a look at the comparison videos?

Look at this:
[youtube]mNZZOkelZXE[/youtube]

How can you say that "Michael Jackson" in these songs does NOT sound like Jason?

Being ill and all that doesn't change his "voice" this much. We have plenty of demos of MJ simply mumbling words here and there, not evey trying to sing, where he sounds 100% like himself.
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This Is It, This is JM in those 3 tracks and the other ones from the cascios.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

Thank you for appreciating my video.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

samhabib said:
Again a completely ridiculous point. Comparing an opinion with a fact. Anyone who claims that 'Jam' is not political, doesn't know the meaning of the word.

Anyone who can say, with a straight face, that the following lyrics aren't political, needs to get a dictionary:

"Nation To Nation
All The World
Must Come Together
Face The Problems
That We See
Then Maybe Somehow We Can Work It Out
I Asked My Neighbor
For A Favor
She Said Later
What Has Come Of
All The People
Have We Lost Love
Of What It's About"

Not political? Really? "Nation to nation, all the world must come together" is NOT political? Absolutely pathetic. And a complete corruption of Michael Jackson's art.

Absolute nothing could be more political.
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No, the section you posted is not political at all. (At least to me)
It is social criticism in it's purest!
It is about sticking together (the world/countries, neighbors), helping eachother & holding eachothers hand. It's about asking why it is, that you can't ask your neighbor for a favour anymore.
That's not political. It's criticism of the peoples social behavior.

I already wanted to speak out on that matter, the last time you brought that topic and this quote up. I think you clearly got the difference, between what is social and what is political, wrong.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Cascio Controversy Thread)

MJJuniorSinceMW said:
No, the section you posted is not political at all. (At least to me)
It is social criticism in it's purest!
It is about sticking together (the world/countries, neighbors), helping eachother & holding eachothers hand. It's about asking why it is, that you can't ask your neighbor for a favour anymore.
That's not political. It's criticism of the peoples social behavior.

I already wanted to speak out on that matter, the last time you brought that topic and this quote up. I think you clearly got the difference, between what is social and what is political, wrong.
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You are right that it is more social than political, but let's not play with words. We all know that politics (international -nation to nation- or local)is closely related to to the social issues.

In other words, if you don't take care of politics, the politics takes care of you. Eventually it becomes social with neighbors forgetting neighbors, or political (neighbors)nations turning against (neighbors)nations.
 
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