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Michael - The Great Album Debate

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

If this is actual "Water", and if I were a Cascio track believer, I would rather re-question their way of making tracks than endlessly defending them. The question is not "do I like what I hear?", but "is this a MJ's song or a pure forgery, regardless the fact whose voice we hear?"

It would be really helpful if someone could leak the whole thing. This is unbearable.

All I can conclude from what I heard:

-Either a demo of "Heaven can wait" with additional and newer fake vocals serving to fabricate the song "Water"
-Or a joke made up by someone
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

Birchey was right! It sounds so much like Water from This Is It :D :D
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

I have a feeling it is a Joke, who must have sent it to Kapital. To show us fake believers up.

I think, this might be the best time to actually release the song, but the problem is, it is copyrighted. :/
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

Minimj said:
I have a feeling it is a Joke, who must have sent it to Kapital. To show us fake believers up.

I think, this might be the best time to actually release the song, but the problem is, it is copyrighted. :/
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We need an explanation and we need it FAST!
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

Ivy... don't leave us hanging like this.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

Jesta said:
My god. I mean, this is sickening. How could they!? How dare they use a pre-existing lyric in another song!? I mean, we all know Michael never, EVER --

Isitscary.jpg


Ghosts_MJ.jpg


Oh.
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Yes Jesta, it is clear that Is it scary and Ghosts are probably inspired from the same melody, sometimes some melodies indeed can give birth to two different songs. But what we heard is nothing much different to what we already know on Invincible.

You're too young to remember or to know, but this was also the case with BROS songs:

"Madly in love" and "Too much"

[youtube]aJ22sgPvsMo&feature=related[/youtube]

vs

[youtube]FzcGdBRjejw&feature=related[/youtube]


In both examples (Mike's and Bros) the songs sound more like a continuity of their inspiration, rather than a copy-pasted or resung vocals and melodies.

p.s. BROS were huge hitmakers in the late 80s and were MJ's fans.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

ivy said:
The "water" I know has it's own lyrics such as "I'm here for you and yes I need to cry. This is the water water drowning my song"
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Could that be another song or part of this song?

Have you listened to the full version which you have heard?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

ivy said:
The "water" I know has it's own lyrics such as "I'm here for you and yes I need to cry. This is the water water drowning my song"
Click to expand...

And from the snippet you heard you know that those lyrics are not included earlier or further in the song?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

Pentum, Ivy could have listened to a real MJ song, called 'Water', I swear there were two songs registered named Water, one being a Cascio track, and another different.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

Works here. Minimj, this is Water. Hold on.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

Minimj said:
Pentum, Ivy could have listened to a real MJ song, called 'Water', I swear there were two songs registered named Water, one being a Cascio track, and another different.
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Right, they'd better register two "Heaven can wait" songs then.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

BUMPER SNIPPET said:
And from the snippet you heard you know that those lyrics are not included earlier or further in the song?
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remember the earth song adlibs on previous leaks? It's the same case here.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

Now it's working.I thought it was a comparision between Heaven Can Wait and Water.

@Minimj that might be a possibility
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

ivy said:
remember the earth song adlibs on previous leaks? It's the same case here.
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Not the same case. The Earth Song ad-libs were genuine. Here I even don't know if it's the same version as on Invincible. The quality is bad.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

That's a good point Ivy. Earth song was used in the KYHU leak.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

Ok Pentum, can't wait!
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

I don't agree.
 
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Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

Why do I get such a watery vibe from this? :lol:
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

ivy said:
acceptable or not is a personal choice. if you don't approve such practices then you don't buy it. If someone else is okay with them , they it's their choice.

My point is again in regards to processing, finishing and release this is how the posthumous releases work , it was this way before Michael died, it will be this way after his death. So arguing about the methods is not really productive. However everyone has a personal choice to buy or not buy and it's not really correct to compare an album / song that he finished and released in his lifetime to a posthumous release as they are completely different in nature.

and the thing is they aren't selling you a porche, they never claimed to. They said these are the songs "recently brought to competition" by people that worked with Michael. so they are saying to you "the designer of porche put a few lines on a piece of paper but didn't finish it. we brought in people that we believe that can finish the porche and that's what we are selling to you".



No. and I bolded "in regards to the songs processing and finishing and release" to show that I wasn't addressing the vocals issue. Yes the one difference we have is the vocal authenticity but that's not proven. It's a personal opinion debate.

there's been a recent release of an Elvis Demo that raised an authenticity debate. So that also happens as well.

Plus if you agree that parts of those songs to be Michael, additional vocals can fall under the general practice of posthumous releases.
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It seems fans are told to accept the reality of posthumous release and give it up. The way Sony/the Estate handled this album, especially the Cascio tracks, is justified because it's the way posthumous release was done, is done and will be done. Furthermore, nothing they have done thus far is proven to be illegal. Fine.

But, can fans ask Michael's work be handled in a better way? We are talking about an artist who deserves more respect. Michael Jackson is an artist of historical significance and huge impact. Can we ask for an exception?

If people just accept the status quo, the official words and do not challenge "common practice", Barack Hussein Obama would not have been elected the President of USA.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

ivy said:
The "water" I know has it's own lyrics such as "I'm here for you and yes I need to cry. This is the water water drowning my song"
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I think this is correct, I remember earlier in the thread the doubters that heard these snippets first swore Water was just an Cry Me A River imitation. The lyrics match that description.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

ivy said:
look everyone "water" has its own lyrics. Isn't that what I told? How am I lying?
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Without having entirely heard the actual song and basing oneself on snippets it is impossible to know if what one heard is "Water" or not; The fact that "Water" has its own lyrics would mean that one had heard the entire song. If you haven't heard the entire song it is impossible to claim that those lyrics are absent from the song we just heard ...in two short snippets.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

ivy said:
look everyone "water" has its own lyrics. Isn't that what I told? How am I lying?
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You said it's not "real Water" which means you said the snippet with Heaven Can Wait singing isn't the real Water song. This is where you are wrong...

Water has its own lyrics, yes, and the Heaven Can Wait singing is some ad libs.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

Pentum said:
You said it's not "real Water" which means you said the snippet with Heaven Can Wait singing isn't the real Water song. This is where you are wrong...

Water has its own lyrics, yes, and the Heaven Can Wait singing is some ad libs.
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Read my following post to Bumper saying "It's the same as Earth song adlib on the previous leaks". I acknowledged the adlib. Is it really ethical to present an adlib as the "water" song? It's not. I made my point. People intentionally chose to release an adlib presented as the song to get you all rile up.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

ivy said:
Read my following post to Bumper saying "It's the same as Earth song adlib on the previous leaks". I acknowledged the adlib. Is it really ethical to present an adlib as the "water" song? It's not. I made my point. People intentionally chose to release an adlib presented as the song to get you all rile up.
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You still haven't answered how you know it is not WATER?

-Pentum leaked one snippet and told you that the lyrics you are referring to are not in the song.
-You however claimed that it is not WATER
-Pentum leaked another snippet proving you that he knows what he was talking about
-You haven't given any substantial proof except your word without explaining how you know it is not WATER, did you hear another song called WATER?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

I believe you ivy. What you say makes absolutely sense. I actually didn't mind the Earth song ad-libs and I don't really mind the sound of this, either. I just wish it was a full version and higher quality. Oh well... I can be patient. :)
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Conspiracy)

Can anyone please pm me the remaining 7 Cascio songs? I am fed up with those snippets. I'd like to hear the vocals. So far I have heard lots of vocals that sound more like a soundalike than MJ.
 
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