intresting comment by judge. its now a murder investigation?

[Autumn II]

ok fair enough cnn reported it first but its still not to be taken as gospel

True, enough. It's not gospel. But yet it was significant enough for a lot of people to take note of it. Right after that, the "reports" started coming in that Michael overdosed on Demerol. Not true. I still find it odd that the security tapes were not mentioned again. If the LAPD HAD them, that would feature strongly in the investigation. If they don't have them, then why not?

 

[bluetopez]

Michael always said it was a conspiracy against him to get what's his! So this does not surprise me! I felt he was murdered from day one, no matter what anyone says, that's what it was to me! This was no accident!

 

[WHES]

Just so you guys know, second degree murder does not require intent. One can be charged with second degree murder for acting with a depraved heart or a reckless disregard for human life, but not with malice aforethough (ie, intent to kill). My guess is that this is what we are seeing here. Murray acted so recklessly as to warrant a murder investigation.

 

[elusive moonwalker]

personally i believe it was murder 2 by negligence not some big conspiracy

 

[elusive moonwalker]

Just so you guys know, second degree murder does not require intent. One can be charged with second degree murder for acting with a depraved heart or a reckless disregard for human life. My guess is that this is what we are seeing here.

exactly reckless disregard covers its perfectly

 

[WHES]

exactly reckless disregard covers its perfectly

Yeah, sorry I missed your earlier post! I think we are in agreement here.

 

[Sirena]

how can this be a murder investigation if murray is allowed to go back to work... no murder suspect that is a doctor would be allowed to work patients unless their name is cleared.

Murray hasn't been technically and legally charged YET, so legally, no one can stop him from working as a doctor.

But he will be charged & when he does, I'm gonna do a holy spirit offering dance like Brother Franklin here (guy in green shirt & white pants - and CHECK the MJ moves!!!):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pp4BA0-lYtU


" Feel like dancing!!!!"

 

[MJMarty]

It's mind-boggling to me that someone could harm Michael on purpose...

 

[Sirena]

But right. . we do NOT know who was in that house. If this were a simple mistake, then the Security tapes would not have vanished. That is a gigantic red-flag. Isn't it?

I believe Murray is the easy target, and if that was all the LAPD knew, he would have been arrested months ago.

I believe that yes, some fans will have red-faces and will have to adjust belief-systems, as possible. If this was as simple as Murray giving an overdose of propofol, this would have been OVER already. We are approaching six months, so obviously this is NOT simple. We just do the best we can, all of us, in our different ways.

CORRECT. And everyone has to be ready for what's to come. Even if it's ugly. And it's getting there.

All I want is for the people (notice the plural) responsible for Michael's death to pay for what they did according to the law.

Nothing will ever replace a great father, nor a hero to millions of people around the world. But it will help to know that justice was served according to the law.

And I :angel: that it comes soon.

 

[souldreamer7]

Originally Posted by Victoria83
But right. . we do NOT know who was in that house. If this were a simple mistake, then the Security tapes would not have vanished. That is a gigantic red-flag. Isn't it?

I believe Murray is the easy target, and if that was all the LAPD knew, he would have been arrested months ago.

I believe that yes, some fans will have red-faces and will have to adjust belief-systems, as possible. If this was as simple as Murray giving an overdose of propofol, this would have been OVER already. We are approaching six months, so obviously this is NOT simple. We just do the best we can, all of us, in our different ways.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

:yes:
Also can anyone provide me with links etc about these missing tapes,as i watched tv have read etc. and I can't find alot of info. on the missing sercurity tapes.

 

[suzynyc]

Wow...it kind of makes you wonder if La Toya and tge rest of the family has been aware of this. She was the one days after to say he was murdered. Even Harvey from TMZ was questioning if she knew tge difference between manslaughter and murder. I guess now, all we can do is sit back and wait.

Latoya did state in her recent interview with Bonnie Hunt that the investigation is much more complicated and involves more than just Murray (or something to that effect).

Michael possibly murdered. How sad is that?

 

[Autumn II]

Originally Posted by Victoria83
But right. . we do NOT know who was in that house. If this were a simple mistake, then the Security tapes would not have vanished. That is a gigantic red-flag. Isn't it?

I believe Murray is the easy target, and if that was all the LAPD knew, he would have been arrested months ago.

I believe that yes, some fans will have red-faces and will have to adjust belief-systems, as possible. If this was as simple as Murray giving an overdose of propofol, this would have been OVER already. We are approaching six months, so obviously this is NOT simple. We just do the best we can, all of us, in our different ways.

:yes:
Also can anyone provide me with links etc about these missing tapes,as i watched tv have read etc. and I can't find alot of info. on the missing sercurity tapes.

There are many links about this. This one is from CNN. Unfortunately it's from Nancy Grace, who's been known as a hater. I'm sure that will give many people here an opportunity to discount it. But yet, she WAS a hater, and she has picked up on this. I'm sure folks here will fit this into whatever mind-set they already have. That's ok. Do what you will.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0907/15/ng.01.html

At this point it doesn't really matter what any of us here THINK? I do believe it's likely that there will be multiple arrests, and many will need to be very, very quiet after that.

 

[Sirena]

Latoya did state in her recent interview with Bonnie Hunt that the investigation is much more complicated and involves more than just Murray (or something to that effect).

Michael possibly murdered. How sad is that?

Very, but the family can do their part & not blame MJ for his death like they have in interviews - and let the cops & DA do their job in what forensic science has proven: that MJ was NOT an addict and not responsible for his death.

(Yes, I said it.)

 

[HemlockDevi]

Of course it's murder.

Michael Jackson was killed on purpose, and not just because of some accident-prone, lazy, cheating, pot-smoking doctor's negligence.

I truly believe that Dr. Murray DID NOT act alone.

I truly hope he'll be charged with 2nd degree murder as he truly deserves and whoever was Murray's puppeteer get capital murder charges.

Remember, whoever has the security tapes that were stolen from MJs house - is the murderer.

Also 1 million dollars in cash and millions in jewelry were also stolen.

So I say & pray: SEARCH WARRANT everybody who had access to the house, employees, family members, guests, EVERYONE.

Thanks for the info.

Those of us who regularly contribute in the MJJC Investigative Unit Thread, may not find this so shocking afterall.

We've been saying this and more since day one.

It's about time, we have some proof the Investigation is going in this direction!

It was reported by CNN, in the U.S., for a day-and-a-half after Michael's death, and then totally vanished from consideration. I know. I SAW the reports. Then, the N.E. followed up, but by then the news on mainstream media was totally gone. Do with that what you will, anyone.

Thank you all for these comments and posts. I since 06/25/09 thought it was murder. People (I know)who did not like MJ but remembered our past discussions about the way he was being systematically attacked(via Media and the Entertainment industry) since 1993 called me. I received more than 20 calls over the following days after Michael Jackson's death. They all thought something was wrong then and also like myself think it was murder. I later did a poll with over 300 people @ random(work, malls, neighborhood and the grocery) nearly 70% think it was murder; they are also suspicious of the Media version of events.

 

[hilliver]

This has me so blazing angry, how on earth can a Doctor be putting someone to sleep every night on a drip of such a potent drug, and after six weeks he then decides there might be an addiction, you don't have to be a doctor to know that this was a tragedy waiting to happen. And how come Murrey can phone a body guard and not 911. Those precious moments when Michael could have been saved were lost. With the amount of time he went without breathing he would have suffered brain death. Murrey is lying and witheld information.

I hope they throw the book at this murderer.

 

[souldreamer7]

There are many links about this. This one is from CNN. Unfortunately it's from Nancy Grace, who's been known as a hater. I'm sure that will give many people here an opportunity to discount it. But yet, she WAS a hater, and she has picked up on this. I'm sure folks here will fit this into whatever mind-set they already have. That's ok. Do what you will.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0907/15/ng.01.html

At this point it doesn't really matter what any of us here THINK? I do believe it's likely that there will be multiple arrests, and many will need to be very, very quiet after that.

Thanks Victoria.
I'll check out what Grace has to say.. I am well aware of her eating the forever crow pie.
I for one have always found the missing tapes a huge red flag. I remember june 25th and a couple wks. after there was mention of the missing tapes,but it tapered off and disappeared..atleast to me.

I'm waiting patiently as possible for what is to come out .. go down.. being 'prepared' is another thing,i guess.

 

[Soundmind]

It i really absurd to believe that MJ had a surveillance camera in his bedroom , like his privacy was not violated enough . the police have a video surveillance of that night and they mentioned in a search warrant that the video captured Murray's car entering at 1.00 am that day , they said in that search warrant that Murray "left the hospital against the objections of the investigation officers".



http://www.radaronline.com/sites/default/files/MichaelJacksonSearchWarrant.pdf

read the last 2 pages it's mentioned there .

 

[Sirena]

MISSING TAPES:

MJ - The Missing Tapes

Police searching from missing CCTV from the day he died

MJ - The Missing Tapes

• 

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Los Angeles police investigating the death of MICHAEL JACKSON are desperately searching for lost surveillance footage taken from the King of Pop's Hollywood home that could solve the mystery surrounding the final moments of his life.


The pop superstar suffered a cardiac arrest in one of the bedrooms in his rented Holmby Hills mansion on 25 June, and was found unconscious by members of his staff, including personal medic Dr. Conrad Murray.


Authorities seized vials of prescription drugs from Jackson's property immediately after his tragic passing as they searched for clues as to the cause of his death.


But detectives are reportedly missing the CCTV footage of that fateful morning - which they hope will prove to be a crucial piece of evidence in unravelling the timeline of events that led up to Jackson's passing.
A source tells the National Enquirer, "It was a very sophisticated and high-tech surveillance and security system. Not only were there cameras outside the house, but there were cameras inside as well - in private locations.


"Insiders close to the investigation say Michael's death - possibly his murder - was captured on camera, but the video has not been recovered. There are also gaps in some security camera footage stored on computer hard drives. Police are combing through personal computers recovered from the house."


On Wednesday, a police spokesperson dismissed reports the Jackson investigation had turned into a homicide case following claims on an online blog.


http://www.ahlanlive.com/13491-mj---the-missing-tapes

----------------------------



Again: Whoever has these tapes - IS THE MURDERER.

 

[Sirena]

It i really absurd to believe that MJ had a surveillance camera in his bedroom , like his privacy was not violated enough . the police have a video surveillance of that night and they mentioned in a search warrant that the video captured Murray's car entering at 1.00 am that day , they said in that search warrant that Murray "left the hospital against the objections of the investigation officers".



http://www.radaronline.com/sites/default/files/MichaelJacksonSearchWarrant.pdf

read the last 2 pages it's mentioned there .

If they were inside, they were probably hidden in plain view of the hallways & common areas inside the mansion, both upstairs & downstairs with time coded stamps on tape.

 

[Sirena]

This has me so blazing angry, how on earth can a Doctor be putting someone to sleep every night on a drip of such a potent drug, and after six weeks he then decides there might be an addiction, you don't have to be a doctor to know that this was a tragedy waiting to happen. And how come Murrey can phone a body guard and not 911. Those precious moments when Michael could have been saved were lost. With the amount of time he went without breathing he would have suffered brain death. Murrey is lying and witheld information.

I hope they throw the book at this murderer.

And when they do, I'm gonna do what Brother Franklin did here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8pUAnrVWUkk

 

[Sirena]

It i really absurd to believe that MJ had a surveillance camera in his bedroom , like his privacy was not violated enough . the police have a video surveillance of that night and they mentioned in a search warrant that the video captured Murray's car entering at 1.00 am that day , they said in that search warrant that Murray "left the hospital against the objections of the investigation officers".



http://www.radaronline.com/sites/default/files/MichaelJacksonSearchWarrant.pdf

read the last 2 pages it's mentioned there .

Soundmind, don't know if you remember this - but the police did report that all the surveillance tapes from 1am on forward are MISSING.

GONE.

They got Murray coming in - but everything that happened after Murray came in is MISSING.

Someone stole them - as well as 1 million dollars CASH, and millions of dollars in jewelry.

 

[Amy Jackson]

Dr Murray did something WRONG, and we all know that!

 

[8701girl]

I hope that murray gets what he deserves! :angry:

 

[Soundmind]

cause he never used it for 6 weeks.thats his defence to go with i was weaning him off cause he was addicted. the amounts found as others have said wouldnt have last even a month

no they were not enough for ONE NIGHT of eight hours of sleep.

 

[Angel]

Those missing tapes are definitely a big warning sign but I bet whoever took them was someone from the inside - i mean the house was watched, it wasn't like someone from the outside could have just come in and gone out easily.
Dunno if it was Murray himself or he had help. He had his hands full but then again he had a long time to do whatever he wanted before he pretended he just found Mike...
God this is like a CSI episode only worse.

 

[suzynyc]

Very, but the family can do their part & not blame MJ for his death like they have in interviews - and let the cops & DA do their job in what forensic science has proven: that MJ was NOT an addict and not responsible for his death.

(Yes, I said it.)

I agree, although to be fair Latoya in this same interview tells Bonnie Hunt that Michael was clean when he died and all they found in his system was what "they" gave him. It was Bonnie that couldn't drop the addiction thing (though Latoya went along). I have to admit that initially, right after Michael's death, I had the wrong idea too. But then that last partial autopsy report was released that showed he was healthy and I had a change of heart.

So sorry about that Michael.

 

[8701girl]

Those missing tapes are definitely a big warning sign but I bet whoever took them was someone from the inside - i mean the house was watched, it wasn't like someone from the outside could have just come in and gone out easily.
Dunno if it was Murray himself or he had help. He had his hands full but then again he had a long time to do whatever he wanted before he pretended he just found Mike...
God this is like a CSI episode only worse.

I reckon murray has help, it wouldnt surprise me!

 

[Soundmind]

Soundmind, don't know if you remember this - but the police did report that all the surveillance tapes from 1pm on forward are MISSING.

GONE.

They got Murray coming in - but everything that happened after Murray came in is MISSING.

Someone stole them - as well as 1 million dollars CASH, and millions of dollars in jewelry.

Not true at all , although I would not be surprised if that was the case .

there will be no way to determine how much cash and jewellery were there in the house, Only MJ knew what was there and he nolonger here to tell . who ever took them knew there would be no way to trace him/her .

getting propofol bottles out of the house was Murrya's top priority at the time and he could not do that , so I highly doubt he removed millions and jewellery , especially if he believed there were a possibility he might be arrested after mj was pronounced dead .

the person who came to the house after everyone went to the hospital was the one who probably took everything and maybe the surveillance camera , who was the man who asked the employees to leave that day ? that person might be under the LAPD's microscope right now .

 

[riviera1992]

Thanks Victoria.
I'll check out what Grace has to say.. I am well aware of her eating the forever crow pie.
I for one have always found the missing tapes a huge red flag. I remember june 25th and a couple wks. after there was mention of the missing tapes,but it tapered off and disappeared..atleast to me.

I'm waiting patiently as possible for what is to come out .. go down.. being 'prepared' is another thing,i guess.

Don't bother. it's all hogwash. She can't even get the name of the place right. She's says Neverland.

 

[Autumn II]

Soundmind, don't know if you remember this - but the police did report that all the surveillance tapes from 1pm on forward are MISSING.

GONE.

They got Murray coming in - but everything that happened after Murray came in is MISSING.

Someone stole them - as well as 1 million dollars CASH, and millions of dollars in jewelry.

Yes, they did report that tapes were missing. There was more than one entrance to the house. Murray was on tape arriving? Where are the rest of the tapes, from inside and outside the house? (and no, there wouldn't have been a camera in Michael's bedroom, but there were other cameras in the house.)

If this was just an accident, then why would anyone take the tapes????