[Discussion] Sexual Abuse Claims Against MJ Estate - Robson/ Safechuck/ Doe

[HIStory]

Obviously this is just a short summary of what happened in court, but I hope the Estate also pointed out the fallacy in this argument:

Safechuck’s attorneys maintain he did not fully comprehend what happened until he obtained therapy and that therefore he is not bound by the 60-day statute.

Like I said this argument is a total misinterpretation of Probate Code 9103 which by definition states that the 60 days period STARTS when the Plaintiff says he "fully comprehended what happened" (says he realized he was abused and the resulting injury etc.), so the argument that he could not file within those 60 days because he did not "fully comprehended what happened" does not even make sense. He says he realized abuse/injury in May 2013. So he cannot claim he did not file within 60 days (which would be until July 2013) because he did not realize abuse/injury. Their argument simply does not make any logical sense.

 

[HIStory]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

I think what the judge said isn't really pro-MJ, it looks like he doesn't believe their reasons to the late claims.

The Judge will not make any decisions because he is "pro-MJ". He did point out earlier that his task is not to decide about the truthfulness of these allegations but about whether they are within statutes of limitations. So do not expect any "I don't believe these allegations are true" statements from him. That's not his task.

 

[InvincibleMJ]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

^Yes, I definitely understand that. I think it actually indicates what his decision is going to be, because his comments only reffered to what we've been talking about for the past months - the illogical reasoning for the late claims. I hope he thinks the same about Wade.

 

[barbee0715]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

^^
This is extremely good news IMO. I would LOVE to read the whole exchange but to me it looks like judge isn't buying "I didn't realize I was abused until 2013 but I told my mother I was abused in 2005" BS. Also Safechuck's ability to break his ties with Michael does show that he wasn't brainwashed or afraid of Michael. Simply put even if he was abused, he could have pursued it in 2005.

This is really great news. The judge is pointing out the same problems with their stories that this thread has from the beginning. Wade has even more problems with his "stories." Hope this is a good sign for everything.

 

[HIStory]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

I also find this interesting:

Safechuck did not file his petition for a late claim against the Jackson estate until August.

Because he filed something in May (just in time to interfere with Xscape) but it seems he filed his full complaint only in August. It already took long for him and his lawyers to put together a lawsuit between September 2013 and May 2013 (eight months - and one year from May 2013 when he saw Wade), but it seems that to file the full complaint took even longer. I always found it interesting (and kind of telling) how long it took them to put together a complaint for him.

 

[passy001]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

It will be interesting to see whether Robson managed to file his amendment to his frivolous civil suit. isn't the deadline today?

 

[HIStory]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

It will be interesting to see whether Robson managed to file his amendment to his frivolous civil suit. isn't the deadline today?

Yes, it is, so I don't think there will be any decisions about that today. That's again the start of a longer process - Estate answers possibly with another demurrer, hearings about that etc. and then the decision.

I don't know if there is any decision today about Robson's creditor's claim though.

 

[passy001]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

Yes, it is, so I don't think there will be any decisions about that today. That's again the start of a longer process - Estate answers possibly with another demurrer, hearings about that etc. and then the decision.

I don't know if there is any decision today about Robson's creditor's claim though.

Neither do i expect any imminent decision on that. was simply wondering whether the dude even bothered filing an amended complaint.

 

[ivy]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

It will be interesting to see whether Robson managed to file his amendment to his frivolous civil suit. isn't the deadline today?

yes deadline is today but based on previous documents in my experience it would take at least 2 days for it to show up on the online system. it would be longer if it needs to be redacted or he wants to file it sealed.

I'll check it regularly and post the document as soon as /if it shows up on the online system.

Ps: IF he filed it, media can get paper copies instantly. So I guess if there's anything interesting(meaning attacking Michael) Radar will report it shortly.

 

[InvincibleMJ]

Maybe I'm too hopeful but what the judge said about Safejunk should be even more interesting with Wade.

"The judge also noted that Safechuck that year rejected Jackson’s request to testify on his behalf when the singer was on trial on sexual abuse charges involving another young man — allegations for which the entertainer was acquitted.

“Mr. Safechuck said, ‘No, I won’t testify in your criminal trial and don’t call me again,”‘ Beckloff said."

Not only Wade took the stand, he talked for Michael's defense. Looks like the judge is giving the 2005 case some weight that have an influence on his decisions. If that's indeed the case, I hope he'll be as harsh with Wade once all the bureaucracy and the stalling are done.

 

[passy001]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

^^
This is extremely good news IMO. I would LOVE to read the whole exchange but to me it looks like judge isn't buying "I didn't realize I was abused until 2013 but I told my mother I was abused in 2005" BS. Also Safechuck's ability to break his ties with Michael does show that he wasn't brainwashed or afraid of Michael. Simply put even if he was abused, he could have pursued it in 2005.

This is also bad news for Robson because if the judge makes a ruling based on the above, he also undercuts the whole modis operandis argument Robson lawyers like throwing around. in other words robson lawyers won't be able to use safechuck case to support the whole modis operandi nonsense they have been trying.

 

[passy001]

Maybe I'm too hopeful but what the judge said about Safejunk should be even more interesting with Wade.

"The judge also noted that Safechuck that year rejected Jackson’s request to testify on his behalf when the singer was on trial on sexual abuse charges involving another young man — allegations for which the entertainer was acquitted.

“Mr. Safechuck said, ‘No, I won’t testify in your criminal trial and don’t call me again,”‘ Beckloff said."

Not only Wade took the stand, he talked for Michael's defense. Looks like the judge is giving the 2005 case some weight that have an influence on his decisions. If that's indeed the case, I hope he'll be as harsh with Wade once all the bureaucracy and the stalling are done.

Absolutely. Well spotted.

It's even worse for Robson because he's on record categorically denying MJ did any wrong to him. he did so consciously as an adult - he was 22 at the time and on the verge of getting married according to some reports.

 

[MJresearcher]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

The judge can clearly see the contradictory statements Safechuck has made, that's a very good thing!

 

[Vici]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

i had no idea that Safechuck told MJ he would not testify and told him to never call him ever again. asshole

 

[LindavG]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

i had no idea that Safechuck told MJ he would not testify and told him to never call him ever again. asshole

I don't believe for a second this actually happened though.

 

[barbee0715]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

I am trying not to get my hopes up too high yet. Trying to think of worse case scenario.
Could the judge saying this to Safechuck refusing to testify and yet Wade did, make him think somehow that Wade was still under Michael's "spell"? Until he got therapy?
Or is that hopefully too far fetched??

 

[dannyboy72]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

Why would MJ have Safechuck's number in the first place if they broke off all ties when he was 17? and why would MJ even bother to call him when he was excluded from the 1108 evidence?

 

[barbee0715]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

I don't think that conversation ever happened at all. I don't know why Safechuck thought that would help his case. It just showed that he knew all the way back in 2005 that it was wrong. So you miss the statute right there.

 

[Vici]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

T-Mez would know if that conversation ever took place

 

[mjsdangerousgurl]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

Barbee0715 That's why I'm so invested in these new cases-I want it to stop and I want truth to prevail. I want to see total vindication before I die.

I am right there with you i am also so glue to these two cases i would love to to see the truth finally prevail here it would be a small victory for us but i will take it. Just pray that that God will lead the judge in the right direction and end this. What nice early Christmas present.


My heart just keep telling me this is so wrong and so unfair Michael is not here to defend himself and for something like this that can drag Michael name through the mud again it just break my heart.:no:

I did a lot of praying as well asking God for justice to prevail and for this horrible ordeal to just end already. That's what I want for Christmas, that's what I need. Hasn't Michael gone through enough pain in life? And now it's still happening after death where he can't even defend himself. I cried last night :teary_eyed:

This is affecting me emotionally so much right now. Like today at work I was worried the whole time as to what the outcome would be for today. I did not check any news on it until coming home from work just now, cuz I didn't want to fall to pieces there. I had scenarios in my mind, such as a big media circus like in 2005 happening again, crucifying Michael all over again
After coming home, the pit in my stomach became worse right before getting to my computer :worried:...but to my surprise, I expected to have more details on what happened at today's hearing. I found the "Judge Skeptical" article---where are more of the latest resources as to what happened today??? :question:

 

[ivy]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

T-Mez would know if that conversation ever took place

He might but It could be a call between MJ and Safechuck. I don't find it unrealistic that Michael would have called his friends to see if they would testify for him. It's also probable that Safechuck might not have wanted anything to do with that trial hence refusing to testify. However I don't see it happening as Safechuck claims it happened.

 

[SarahJ]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

I believe Sneddon & Co. in '05 wanted to introduce "evidence" (part of the 1108 evidence) that Safechuck and Jonathan Spence had been victims but due to their denials that anything had happened and the fact there were not witnesses to any physical sexual contact between them the judge wouldn't allow it in. The judges decision is in the transcripts re: the arguments involving the 1108 evidence. So I doubt very much if Safechuck ever refused to testify at all. Just spin for his attorneys.

 

[#MJforever57]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

This is good news very good news i think the judge is begin to see the picture now Wade/James had the chance to take care of this while Michael was alive why wait 5 years after Michael has pass away. I know the judge job is to not to decide weather Wade or James are telling the true his job is to decide weather there late claims fall under the statute of limitations now we have see the laws in this thread you must file a claim in a certain time frame which Wade and James did not do so by law they have miss every deadline so these cases just like the Estate said has been file late and should be throw out.


I do not think Wade want this to be seal and to protect Michael's privacy he was hoping that the Estate would settle and make this go away but when the Estate refuse to settle then Wade went public he felt the world needing to know the truth that he was sexual abuse by Michael for 7 years. Now this is the same man who took the stand in 2005 and told the world that Michael never sexual abuse him i find that odd to that Wade has change his story now. So was he lying all this time was he saying that Michael was control him here too who know. I really believe Wade and James plan this nothing was go well in the life and they saw a chance to get quick money by makeup this so call alleged abuse that they claim happen to them and this mind you happen 2 decades ago.

The truth will come out both have change they stories and that is what will get them. Wade claim he could not file because he was being control by Michael and was told in 1993 if he told they both can go to jail remember this is the same man who defend Michael in 2005 James claim he was not aware of this but yet he told him mom in 2005 that Michael sexual abuse him and he was a bad man. I hope the judge will look at this and see that both men had a chance to take care of this while Michael was still alive if this happen.

As for Wade amended complaint that was due Dec 16 we might not see it just like the judge told Wade to go back redo it it look like negligence so far Wade has yet to find anyone in MJ companies who knew or were aware that this was happen no one has came forward yet and like i mention before if these ppls who use to work for MJ companies if still around i would sue Wade for accuse them of something they knew nothing about. So his civil lawsuit against MJ and the companies just might get dismiss also because you can not sue a dead man Michael is not here to defend himself against these allegations.

The judge did mention that there is a chance if he decide that this can happen.


Everytime something good happen for Michael and the Estate here come the neagtive anything to get the ppls mind off of the good never fails. That why i really feel in my heart that Wade and James set this up just to cast another shadow over the legacy of Michael Jackson.

 

[#MJforever57]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

I did a lot of praying as well asking God for justice to prevail and for this horrible ordeal to just end already. That's what I want for Christmas, that's what I need. Hasn't Michael gone through enough pain in life? And now it's still happening after death where he can't even defend himself. I cried last night :teary_eyed:

This is affecting me emotionally so much right now. Like today at work I was worried the whole time as to what the outcome would be for today. I did not check any news on it until coming home from work just now, cuz I didn't want to fall to pieces there. I had scenarios in my mind, such as a big media circus like in 2005 happening again, crucifying Michael all over again
After coming home, the pit in my stomach became worse right before getting to my computer :worried:...but to my surprise, I expected to have more details on what happened at today's hearing. I found the "Judge Skeptical" article---where are more of the latest resources as to what happened today??? :question:

Like it was mention not much was going to be decide.

 

[#MJforever57]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

I hope that the judge will see that these claims have been file late just like the Estate said and that the statute of limitations has ran out.

 

[HIStory]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

I am trying not to get my hopes up too high yet. Trying to think of worse case scenario.
Could the judge saying this to Safechuck refusing to testify and yet Wade did, make him think somehow that Wade was still under Michael's "spell"? Until he got therapy?
Or is that hopefully too far fetched??

Wade's case is different and he too missed the 60 days deadline in PC 9103. He says he went to therapy and discovered his alleged abuse in May 2012. But he did not file a lawsuit until a year later, so he too missed the 60 days deadline in PC 9103 through no one's fault but his own. That's why I hope the Estate will realize this logical fallacy in Safechuck/Robson's argument about not being able to file within the 60 days of PC 9103 because they were still under MJ's spell and did not know it was abuse bla-bla-bla. That's twisting the law and twisting their own story. Their initial claim is that the "spell" ended for Wade in May 2012. So from then he had 60 days to file under PC 9103. He did not. And he tries to claim that was because he was under MJ's spell. Realize how it does not make logical sense! If the spell ended in May 2012 and that is what triggers the start of the 60 days period given in PC 9103 then they cannot claim they could not file within those 60 days because of the spell. By that time the spell ended acc. to their own story.

I think for Wade the only possibility is to exploit the other part of PC 9103 which says you have to file within 60 days of learning about the administration of the Estate. And that's why he claims he did not know about the Estate until March 2013. That would put his May 2013 filing within 60 days. Well, provided the Judge buys it. Interestingly I have not seen arguments about this point in their papers, so either such arguments are going on only in the probate court docs that we can't see or the argument has been totally shut down by the Estate. (There was a rumour about the Estate getting Wade admit in deposition that he did know about the Estate before March 2013.) Hopefully it's the latter.

And in civil court there is the issue of the companies about which we do not know yet what he cooked up.

He might but It could be a call between MJ and Safechuck. I don't find it unrealistic that Michael would have called his friends to see if they would testify for him. It's also probable that Safechuck might not have wanted anything to do with that trial hence refusing to testify. However I don't see it happening as Safechuck claims it happened.

Yes, I can imagine a call happened but of course not the way Safechuck represents it now. In one of the articles it was written that Safechuck claims MJ threatened him to try to get him testify. Please.... :smilerolleyes:
While I can imagine MJ called him to check if he would testify for him, but (apart from the fact he was not the threatening type) he did not need to be that desperate about it, since testimony re. Safechuck was not allowed. If this call happened I would imagine it happened before the Judge made his decision about what will and what will not be introduced under 1108 evidence. Also, why would MJ be so desperate to get a guy on the stand that he supposedly abused over 100 times? Would not that be extremely risky? Even more risky than calling Robson to testify since he has not met Safechuck for almost a decade at the time. Would not he rather try to convince him to keep away from the court room?

So in short, while I think it's possible a call happened but I'm sure Safechuck is twisting it now to support his current story (of course, it's also possible that he totally made up the WHOLE call story).

 

[HIStory]

BTW, in other news. Stacy Brown caught lying again. Last weekend a so called "interview" he claimed he made with Bill Cosby went viral all over the media. See for example: http://edition.cnn.com/2014/12/14/u.../index.html?sr=tw121414cosbyspeaks2pstorylink

As you can see it does not really sound like an “interview”. It seems like Brown just called him and Cosby gave him a short comment. Brown was always very manipulative in how to represent himself and he always could sell himself for more than who he is. He’s just a stalker and not a journalist. He did the same (calling and stalking people) in the MJ case as well.

And now Cosby called him out on his claims of an "interview":

However, the Cosby camp is refuting how the supposed brief interview went down. A lawyer for the actor released the following statement on Monday:
“On Saturday, the New York Post published an article by Stacy Brown indicating that Bill Cosby ‘broke his silence’ Friday in a discussion with Mr. Brown. Various media outlets have reported on the story with the headline ‘Bill Cosby Speaks Out.’ Mr. Cosby and Mr. Brown did in fact have a telephone conversation. Mr. Brown identified himself as a free-lance reporter for a number of African-American media outlets, which prompted Mr. Cosby’s comment regarding the African-American media. Mr. Brown did not indicate that he was interviewing Mr. Cosby for publication, did not say that he was reporting for the New York Post, and did not tell Mr. Cosby that the conversation was being recorded. In a discussion of journalistic standards, Mr. Brown failed to adhere to the most basic standards of his profession.”
So far, no comment from Brown or the Post.

https://celebrity.yahoo.com/blogs/c...-out--defends-bill-the--victim-225205358.html

 

[#MJforever57]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

Well it look like to me that the first part of PC 9103 Wade has miss also and as far as the other part of PC 9103 James has already said he knew about the Estate so i find it hard to believe that Wade did not know until 2013 and if the Estate does have a deposition admin that Wade knew about the Estate before 2013 then that is the end of that because the 60 days was miss there too.


As far as Wade amended complaint that was to be file on Dec 16 we do not know if Wade did this or if he did and seal it. The judge did tell Wade to go back and redo your case it look like negligence here he has to prove that MJ or someone in his companies knew or were aware this was going on and did nothing to protect him he has yet to prove this and no one has came forward.

So like the judge said there is a possible that if he decide to remove MJ and his companies then there going civil lawsuit against MJ and the companies so mostly Wade will go after the Estate because you can not sue a dead and his companies because MJ is not here to defend himself against these alleged allegations.

 

[#MJforever57]

A small little interview and Brown made it look big. I wonder if we are going to get a comment from him or the Post. That why Michael did not like journalist you have to be careful what you say around them because their will twist your words and write something totally different.


My radio station that i listen too just said that Cosby owe the truth to the black media because of what he said that the black media of all ppls should not have judge him so quickly and believe these allegations.


Mr. Brown identified himself as a free-lance reporter for a number of African-American media outlets, which prompted Mr. Cosby’s comment regarding the African-American media.

So this is where this came from thanks alot Mr. Brown what a can of worms you have open.

 

[#MJforever57]

Re: [Discussion] Wade Robson files claim of sexual abuse against MJ-Estate

Why do ppls feel because a person remind silence that they are guilty why is that can anybody answer that question?

If they did break they silence and tell they side of the story will the ppls believe them?