Decision on Criminal Charges in Michael Jackson Case 'Months' Away

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ofcourse you don't agree beachlover , because this explanation nails murray even more , your explanation is Lee used to give mj propofol , that's what murray is claiming . lee records were delievered when she was asked to deliever them by the way.

Soundmind, don't put assumptions or words in my mouth. I never claimed that not once and you can search every single post of mine. It is my understanding she gave him "Myers Cocktail" which is an intravenous vitamin supplement, but I don't know that for sure either. (Now go look that up and the side effects of the drugs in that IV particularly Magnesium which can cause a 'warm flushed' effect in some patients) Also look up the affects of IV Calcium and what it is used for.

Regarding the records, I read all the search warrants and her records were not delivered as quickly as others and that is a fact on record documented by the LAPD in their search warrant. If you don't remember, go read them again. I read the report and thats where I got this information.
 
It could be possible that what Michael was feeling was more mentally base. People who suffer from extreme insomnia and haven't slept in a long time are known to have increase sensitivity of hot/cold, other stimulates and can hallucinate.

But, I am not medicate, so I really have no clue.

I know someone who had cronic insomnia to the point where he would hallucinate, he had to use strong medicine to help him sleep. but the fact that MJ kept asking for advice shows he was concerned about his own health and safety he did not intend to play around with his life the way people say
the fans who were with him in the last weeks of his life did say he had severe mood changes sometimes and that can be caused by lack of sleep, I suffered from insomnia too and I used to have high blood pressure and palpitations and severe mood swings
 
Soundmind, don't put assumptions or words in my mouth. I never claimed that not once and you can search every single post of mine. It is my understanding she gave him "Myers Cocktail" which is an intravenous vitamin supplement, but I don't know that for sure either. (Now go look that up and the side effects of the drugs in that IV particularly Magnesium which can cause a 'warm flushed' effect in some patients) Also look up the affects of IV Calcium and what it is used for.

Regarding the records, I read all the search warrants and her records were not delivered as quickly as others and that is a fact on record documented by the LAPD in their search warrant. If you don't remember, go read them again. I read the report and thats where I got this information.

no it was klien who was late not Lee, lee records were subpoened BY FAX on the same day Murray's office and storage in Houston were searched , she was paid a visit by two detectives that day , they asked her what she thought of the needle marks on mj's body , she said he had a very thin veins and that's where the marks came from , she said they told her he was addict and she insisted he was not she said her medical records and the tests she performed on him convinced her he was completely free , then she was asked to deliever them , she went to the LA police department the very next day and delievered everything .
 
I know someone who had cronic insomnia to the point where he would hallucinate, he had to use strong medicine to help him sleep. but the fact that MJ kept asking for advice shows he was concerned about his own health and safety he did not intend to play around with his life the way people say
the fans who were with him in the last weeks of his life did say he had severe mood changes sometimes and that can be caused by lack of sleep, I suffered from insomnia too and I used to have high blood pressure and palpitations and severe mood swings


That is along the lines I was thinking of. I only read about sever insomnia, so I wasn't too sure if these were true or urban legends to an extent. Thank you for you input.

That is why I am sure that all of Michael's problems during his last months were not all drug related. It is entirely possible that alot of Michael's problems streamed from his insomnia. However, we may never know for sure since insomnia is such a mental issue.

Right now, however, I am thinking that Michael wanted to wait to find someone who was train to give propofol to him safely and Murray was hire as the reviver as well as the second pair of eyes. However, Michael couldn't find anyone and his insomnia got steadily worst. Murray say this and offer to give Michael the propofol himself, if he increased his pay. Michael, being abit desperate at this point, decided to take Murray on his offer only if he learned how to give propofol from a train doctor. Murray did that and Michael checked that he did, so he allow Murray to give him propofol.

This would as explain why he was not eating well as he should, because insomnia does cause a lack of appetite in some people. This is added to the fact that Michael was never a big eater. This would also explain why Murray's contract with AEG was not fulfill despite the fact he was working with Michael for months.

Until more facts come, this is all theory, of course.
 
no it was klien who was late not Lee, lee records were subpoened BY FAX on the same day Murray's office and storage in Houston were searched , she was paid a visit by two detectives that day , they asked her what she thought of the needle marks on mj's body , she said he had a very thin veins and that's where the marks came from , she said they told her he was addict and she insisted he was not she said her medical records and the tests she performed on him convinced her he was completely free , then she was asked to deliever them , she went to the LA police department the very next day and delievered everything .

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/10347735/Michael-Jackson-Search-Warrant-Affidavit

Read page 13 of 23 (or 22 of 32 of the actual documentation) where it says her records had not been received at the time of the warrant. Also, it says that she told them she put him on a "Good food diet with a protein drink" and nowhere does it say she mentioned any IV vitamin supplement.

Also, you said "she said he had a very thin veins and that's where the marks came from , she said they told her he was addict and she insisted he was not she said her medical records and the tests she performed on him convinced her he was completely free" which leads me to believe he did have needle marks because someone with thin veins would not have needle marks just out of the blue. They don't just appear out of nowhere.

I don't know where you got that statement from.
 
I didn't think at any time that it was not a murder investigation. I am wondering if there are any 'other' people involved besides Murray here. Perhaps other doctors or even other people involved that we may not even realize?

Just thinking here cause it seems that they are doing a lot of research here.



I have the exact same feeling as you after reading that.
 
Thank you Ramona. True, we may not always agree, but it is still only fair to be respectful. There are many things I don't know but I am not a stupid person and I have a medical background and have some knowledge to bring to the table.

I am also a huge MJ fan my whole life. (well.....his whole life too)



Perfect! You have a medical backround, I knew somebody here did but I couldn't remember who....

Many older members of my family said, when a person is hot on one side and cold on another( as MJ allegedly said to the nurse), this could mean he was having or about to have a stroke? Is that true?

The answer to this question freightens me.
 
Lawyer: Manslaughter evidence sought at Jackson doctor's office
NEW: Jackson's former nurse says investigators asked her for files


updated 9:22 p.m. EDT, Wed July 22, 2009

By Alan Duke
CNN

(CNN) -- Detectives searched the Houston, Texas, medical office of one of Michael Jackson's doctors on Wednesday for "evidence of the offense of manslaughter," the doctor's lawyer said.

The search warrant at Dr. Conrad Murray's office "services part of the ongoing investigation into the death of Michael Jackson," Los Angeles Police Department spokesman Gus Villanueva said.

Murray was the doctor who was at Jackson's home when the pop star died on June 25.

Jackson's former nurse, Cherilynn Lee, was also approached by investigators who wanted copies of medical files she had on the singer, Lee told CNN's Nancy Grace on Wednesday. Lee said she handed over the files to officials with the coroner's office.

Ed Chernoff, a Houston lawyer hired by Murray soon after Jackson's death, confirmed that Los Angeles Police detectives and federal Drug Enforcement Administration agents used a search warrant to enter Murray's office in northeast Houston on Wednesday morning,

"The search warrant authorized law enforcement to search for and seize items, including documents, they believed constituted evidence of the offense of manslaughter," Chernoff said in a written statement Wednesday.

Chernoff said members of Murray's legal team were at the medical office during the search, which he said was conducted by members of the DEA, two robbery-homicide detectives from the Los Angeles Police Department and Houston police officers.

"Law enforcement concluded their search around 12:30 p.m., and left with a forensic image of a business computer hard drive and 21 documents. None of the documents taken had previously been requested by law enforcement or the L.A. coroner's office," Chernoff said.

Tammy Kidd, a spokeswoman at Chernoff's office, told CNN the raid "was absolutely a surprise to us, because we've had open lines of communication this whole time." DEA, cops search offices of Dr. Conrad Murray »

"Based on Dr. Murray's minute-by-minute and item-by-item description of Michael Jackson's last days, he should not be a target of criminal charges," Chernoff said Tuesday. "Dr. Murray was the last doctor standing when Michael Jackson died and it seems all the fury is directed toward him."

Los Angeles investigators have interviewed Murray twice, Chernoff said. A third interview has not been scheduled, he said.

Police impounded his car, which had been parked at Jackson's Holmby Hills home, the night after Jackson's death. It was released to Murray several days later.

"Dr. Murray is frustrated by negative and often erroneous media reports. He has to walk around 24-7 with a bodyguard," Chernoff said. "He can't operate his practice. He can't go to work because he is harassed no matter where he goes."

At least two investigations are under way into Jackson's death.

The Los Angeles County coroner is waiting for toxicology results to determine a cause of death, while the city police department, with assistance from the Drug Enforcement Administration, is looking at the possibility of criminal charges.


A coroner's office spokesman said the autopsy findings could be released in the next week or more.

Los Angeles Police Chief William Bratton told CNN he would wait for the coroner to determine the exact cause of Jackson's death. "And based on those, we will have an idea of what it is we are dealing (with): Are we dealing with a homicide, or are we dealing with an accidental overdose?" he said.
http://www.cnn.com/2009/SHOWBIZ/Music/07/22/jackson.murray.search/index.html





Jackson Nurse Subpoenaed
Posted on July 23, 2009
Cherilyn Lee, Michael Jackson's former nurse and nutritionist, has been served a subpoena to hand over records related to her treatment of Jackson.

Lee's spokeswoman, Belinda Foster, confirms to AP that the L.A. County Coroner's officials visited Lee's office today to obtain Jackson's confidential records. Foster confirms that Lee is fully cooperating with officials, but a subpoena was necessary because Michael's medical records are protected by the law. Lee treated Jackson from January to April 2009.

Cherilyn came forward after Michael's death with reports that the pop icon had begged her for the powerful drug Diprivan, but she refused to administer it. Just days before Jackson's death, Lee received another call from a member of Michael's entourage who was worried about the singer's condition. Cherilyn urged them to take Jackson to the hospital, but they did not.


http://extratv.warnerbros.com/2009/07/jackson_nurse_subpoenaed.php


A registered nurse named Cherilyn Lee spoke with members of the media yesterday about her encounters with Michael Jackson. She says he wanted a certain powerful drug in order to sleep.

Via AP:

Michael Jackson was so distraught over persistent insomnia in recent months that he pleaded for a powerful sedative despite warnings it could be harmful, says a nutritionist who was working with the singer as he prepared his comeback bid.

Cherilyn Lee, a registered nurse whose specialty includes nutritional counseling, said Tuesday that she repeatedly rejected his demands for the drug, Diprivan, which is given intravenously.

But a frantic phone call she received from Jackson four days before his death made her fear that he somehow obtained Diprivan or another drug to induce sleep, Lee said.

While in Florida on June 21, Lee was contacted by a member of Jackson’s staff.

“He called and was very frantic and said, `Michael needs to see you right away.’ I said, ‘What’s wrong?’ And I could hear Michael in the background …, ‘One side of my body is hot, it’s hot, and one side of my body is cold. It’s very cold,’” Lee said.

“I said, `Tell him he needs to go the hospital. I don’t know what’s going on, but he needs to go to the hospital … right away.”

“At that point, I knew that somebody had given him something that hit the central nervous system,” she said, adding, “He was in trouble Sunday and he was crying out.”

Jackson did not go to the hospital. He died June 25 after suffering cardiac arrest, his family said. Autopsies have been conducted, but an official cause of death is not expected for several weeks.

“I don’t know what happened there. The only thing I can say is he was adamant about this drug,” Lee said.

Following Jackson’s death, allegations emerged that the 50-year-old King of Pop had been consuming painkillers, sedatives and antidepressants. But Lee said she encountered a man tortured by sleep deprivation and one who expressed opposition to recreational drug use.

“He wasn’t looking to get high or feel good and sedated from drugs,” she said. “This was a person who was not on drugs. This was a person who was seeking help, desperately, to get some sleep, to get some rest.”

Jackson was rehearsing hard for what would have been his big comeback — his “This Is It” tour, a series of performances that would have strained his aging dancer’s body. Also, pain had been a part of his life since 1984, when his scalp was severely burned during a Pepsi commercial shoot.

“The Incredible Hulk” star Lou Ferrigno, who’s been working out with Jackson for the past several months, said Jackson was focused on health.

“When he was with me, he wasn’t different. He wasn’t stoned. He wasn’t high. He wasn’t being aloof or speedy. Never talked about drugs,” Ferrigno said. “I’ve never seen him take drugs. He was always talking about nutrition.”

Several months ago, Jackson had begun badgering Lee about Diprivan, also known as Propofol, Lee said. It is an intravenous anesthetic drug widely used in operating rooms to induce unconsciousness. It is generally given through an IV needle in the hand.

Patients given Propofol take less time to regain consciousness than those administered certain other drugs, and they report waking up more clear-headed and refreshed, said University of Chicago psychopharmacologist James Zacny.

It has also been implicated in drug abuse, with people using it to “chill out” or to commit suicide, Zacny said. Accidental deaths linked to abuse have been reported. The powerful drug has a very narrow therapeutic window, meaning it doesn’t take doses much larger than the medically recommended amount to stop a person’s breathing.

An overdose that stops breathing can result in a buildup of carbon dioxide, causing the heart to beat erratically and leading to cardiac arrest, said Dr. John Dombrowski, a member of the board of directors of the American Society of Anesthesiologists.

Because it is given intravenously and is not the kind of prescription drug typically available from pharmacists, abuse cases have involved anesthesiologists, nurses and other hospital staffers with easy access to the drug, Zacny said.

In recent months, Lee said, Jackson waved away her warnings about it.

“I had an IV and when it hit my vein, I was sleeping. That’s what I want,” Lee said Jackson told her.

“I said, ‘Michael, the only problem with you taking this medication’ — and I had a chill in my body and tears in my eyes three months ago — ‘the only problem is you’re going to take it and you’re not going to wake up,” she recalled.

According to Lee, Jackson said it had been given to him before but he didn’t want to discuss the circumstances or identify the doctor involved.

Londell McMillan, attorney for Katherine and Joe Jackson, talked about Lee’s disclosures Tuesday on CNN.

“It’s a hearsay comment. It would be inadmissible anywhere in a court of law,” he said. “I also wonder why anyone would make a comment about something that they don’t have much knowledge about. They didn’t see the drug administered. It’s again because of the Michael Jackson factor.”

Lee said the singer drew his own distinctions when it came to drugs versus prescription medicine.

“He said, `I don’t like drugs. I don’t want any drugs. My doctor told me this is a safe medicine,’” Lee said. The next day, she said she brought a copy of the Physician’s Desk Reference to show him the section on Diprivan.

“He said, ‘No, my doctor said it’s safe. It works quick and it’s safe as long as somebody’s here to monitor me and wake me up. It’s going be OK,’” Lee said. She said he did not give the doctor’s name.

Lee said at one point, she spent the night with Jackson to monitor him while he slept. She said she gave him herbal remedies and stayed in a corner chair in his vast bedroom.

After he settled in bed, Lee told Jackson to turn down the lights and music — he had classical music playing in the house. “He also had a computer on the bed because he loved Walt Disney,” she said. “He was watching Donald Duck and it was ongoing. I said, `Maybe if we put on softer music,’ and he said, `No, this is how I go to sleep.’”

Three and a half hours later, Jackson jumped up and looked at Lee, eyes wide open, according to Lee. “This is what happens to me,” she quoted him as saying. “All I want is to be able to sleep. I want to be able to sleep eight hours. I know I’ll feel better the next day.”


Lee, 56, is licensed as a registered nurse and nurse practitioner in California, according to the state Board of Registered Nursing’s Web site. She attended Los Angeles Southwest College and the Charles Drew University of Medicine and Sciences in Los Angeles.

Comedian Dick Gregory, who knows Lee and her work, said he believes Jackson’s insomnia had its roots in the pop star’s 2005 trial on child molestation charges. Jackson’s health had deteriorated so much that his parents called Gregory, a natural foods proponent, for help.

Gregory said Jackson wasn’t eating or drinking at the time and, after he was persuaded by Gregory to undergo testing, ended up hospitalized for severe dehydration.

But Jackson obviously was healthy enough to withstand the level of medical scrutiny needed to insure him for the upcoming high-stakes London concerts, Gregory said. “That you don’t trick,” he said of the exams.

Lee, who has also worked with Stevie Wonder, Marla Gibbs, Reynaldo Rey and other celebrities, said she was introduced to Jackson by the mother of one of his staff members. Jackson’s three children had minor cold symptoms and their pediatrician was out of town.

Lee said she went to the house in January, the first of about 10 visits there through April, and treated the children with vitamins. Michael, intrigued, asked what else she did and took her up on her claim she could boost his energy.

After running blood tests, she devised protein shakes for him and gave him an intravenous vitamin and mineral mixture — known as a “Myers tail,” after Dr. John Myers — which Lee said she uses routinely in her practice.

“It wasn’t that he felt sick,” she said. “He just wanted more energy.”

Lee said she decided to speak out to protect Jackson’s reputation from what she considers unfounded allegations of drug abuse or shortcomings as a parent.

“I think it’s so wrong for people to say these things about him,” she said. “He was a wonderful, loving father who wanted the best for his children.”

http://www.theinsider.com/news/2354530_Registered_Nurse_Michael_Jackson_Begged_For_Drug
 
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This would as explain why he was not eating well as he should, because insomnia does cause a lack of appetite in some people. This is added to the fact that Michael was never a big eater. This would also explain why Murray's contract with AEG was not fulfill despite the fact he was working with Michael for months.

Until more facts come, this is all theory, of course.

I think the lack of appetite was also related to stress just like insomnia, in the rabbi tapes he said during the Dangerous tour he wouldn't eat and they had to feed him intravenously, and he always had problems with his appetite. I have the same habits, when I'm upset I barely eat and I lose weight very fast
the lack of appetite might've been caused by ephedrine too I heard it's used to treat side effects associated with anesthesia some say it was used to revive MJ but we still don't know exactly what Murray put in MJ's system in those 6 weeks
 
this article really tells us nothing more than the older ones. its just the way its worded january is still the given month. we all know it is gonna be next year year based on old reports so this "months rather than weeks" comment is telling us no different
 
I think the lack of appetite was also related to stress just like insomnia, in the rabbi tapes he said during the Dangerous tour he wouldn't eat and they had to feed him intravenously, and he always had problems with his appetite. I have the same habits, when I'm upset I barely eat and I lose weight very fast
the lack of appetite might've been caused by ephedrine too I heard it's used to treat side effects associated with anesthesia some say it was used to revive MJ but we still don't know exactly what Murray put in MJ's system in those 6 weeks


The 6 weeks is Murray's word and not fact, I would like to point out. So, Michael may not have taken anything except during his last days. Until the full tox, this is a guess, but as Soundmind has stated there was not enough propofol found for him to be taking it for 6 weeks. The other drugs pumped into his system has more dramatic effects than propofol and stays in the system longer, but Michael looked cleared minded in TII. However, we will have to wait and see on that.

The Dangerous Tour, in my opinion, is not a very good example for this situation. Michael said he had sever eating problems because of the allegations against him in 93. This caused him to stop eating and form a dependancy on painkillers. Before the allegations, he was fine during that tour. The same thing happen in 2005 if you have read Soundmind's article, except without the drug use. Michael was not stress in that way during his final months, so they don't see comparable to me.

As for the ephedrine, you might be right on that one, but we also do not know how long he was on it. It is also hard to say how it effected him anyway because of his insomnia and his already low eating habit.
 
Soundmind, thank you for posting all of that but it does not change my thoughts or position or facts I have given here. I did post the warrant and you can see that on line. That is an official document of her statement to the police. All you posted is what she 'said' and as I stated earlier, I still have my own thoughts and suspicions regarding why he called Nurse Lee. It doesn't add up.

Moddie777 - Signs and Symptoms of a Stroke (or CVA-Cerebral Vascular Accident) are usually associated with numbness. A stroke is usually a broken blood vessel in the brain that pushes on parts of your body that affect motor coordination. Sometimes numbness and tingling down an arm or leg. I have dealt with stoke victims and have never heard the hot/cold sensation. I have seen this with certain medications, pinched nerves in the neck or spine, and it can happen if someone is receiving medication directly injected into the spinal column (which I doubt was the case here).
 
The 6 weeks is Murray's word and not fact, I would like to point out. So, Michael may not have taken anything except during his last days. Until the full tox, this is a guess, but as Soundmind has stated there was not enough propofol found for him to be taking it for 6 weeks. The other drugs pumped into his system has more dramatic effects than propofol and stays in the system longer, but Michael looked cleared minded in TII. However, we will have to wait and see on that.

The Dangerous Tour, in my opinion, is not a very good example for this situation. Michael said he had sever eating problems because of the allegations against him in 93. This caused him to stop eating and form a dependancy on painkillers. Before the allegations, he was fine during that tour. The same thing happen in 2005 if you have read Soundmind's article, except without the drug use. Michael was not stress in that way during his final months, so they don't see comparable to me.

As for the ephedrine, you might be right on that one, but we also do not know how long he was on it. It is also hard to say how it effected him anyway because of his insomnia and his already low eating habit.

Also keep in mind that he did go to a hospital and we don't know what they in fact gave him as part of resuscitation efforts. (and these drugs would also have been found in his system)

Ramona, I tend to agree with you (yes...I said that lol) regarding the insomnia. Insomnia/lack of sleep can cause severe mood disturbances. Lack of sleep can also cause you to feel chilled to the bones, which I understand was always a problem for MJ anyway and thats why he wore jackets on stage and even on hot days.

Lack of sleep can cause you to feel very edgy and irrational and can even cause paranoia.

I don't know how MJ reacted to any of that. I'm 'guessing' there. Also, I don't know if he did or did not sleep his last few nights. We don't really know that.

We read what people say and then there is the truth factor. Who is telling the truth and who is not? Seriously, we do not know. Some people here are blaming other doctors for introducing him to Propofol and saying it was safe but we have no proof on this. Some are blaming Klein for a lot of things. I blame him only for being a big mouth and saying stupid things. Some hate Deepak Chopra because of what he said after Michaels death.

I don't in fact know what is true or not. I just know when something does not sit right with me and it seems suspicious in my head.

I would love to have all the facts but we just don't.
 
this is what murray told investigators :

At one time MURRAY noticed and inquired about injection marks on JACKSON's hands and feet. JACKSON stated that DoctorCHERILYN LEE had been giving him a "cocktail" to help him. MURRAY believed the cocktail to be aPROPOFOL (DIPRIVAN) mix.

but the leaked autopsy report said HIS ARMS were riddled with injection marks not his feet and hands :

The autopsy did, however, reveal that Jackson's arms were indeed riddled with punctures, that he had scarring of the face and neck, and that his lips and eyebrows were tattooed. The AP also reports that a bald area of the top of his head was tattooed from ear to ear.

murray also Blamed Dr.Adams from Las vegas , he claimed Dr.adams gave mj propofol in march and he was present when that happened , Dr.adams denied it , said he gave mj propofol four times in 2008 when mj had a very serious tooth procedures and murray was never ever present .

Beachlover i'm not here to convince you to change your thoughts, i'm sure you are only here to make us change our thoughts, you don't want to hear the facts, you have your own "facts" and you want us to believe them , all you seem to believe is what murray told the investigators and everyone who contradicts murray's statement looks very suspicious to you .



Jackson Nurse: I Did Not Give Michael Propofol

Posted Aug 26th 2009 1:45AM by TMZ Staff
One of Michael Jackson's nurses is calling BS on Dr. Conrad Murray -- after a search warrant affidavit showed Murray told law enforcement he believed the nurse gave Michael a Propofol "cocktail."

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.tmz.com/m...08/murraty.jpg

Cherilyn Lee told us she never gave Michael Propofol or Diprivan. Lee said she gives people "nutritional cocktails" and Dr. Murray must have jumped to conclusions.

And this is interesting ... Lee also said she saw Michael back in April, and there were "no injection marks" on his body. Our law enforcement sources say Jackson was riddled with injection sites at the time of his death.

Lee said she did inject Michael with a "nutritional IV" of "basically vitamin C." She says, "Mr. Jackson had very small veins."



Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2009/08/26/jackson-nurse-i-did-not-give-michael-propofol/#ixzz0PGlwnw6l


mj's arms were riddled with injections , murray himself confirm the injections he "observed" were on mj's hands and feet not arms . Lee was not lying , he's the one who lied .
 
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this is what murray told investigators :



but the leaked autopsy report said HIS ARMS were riddled with injection marks not his feet and hands :



murray also Blamed Dr.Adams from Las vegas , he claimed Dr.adams gave mj propofol in march and he was present when that happened , Dr.adams denied it , said he gave mj propofol four times in 2008 when mj had a very serious tooth procedures and murray was never ever present .

Beachlover i'm not here to convince you to change your thoughts, i'm sure you are only here to make us change our thoughts, you don't want to hear the facts, you have your own "facts" and you want us to believe them , all you seem to believe is what murray told the investigators and everyone who contradicts murray's statement looks very suspicious to you .

On no. I haven't presented my own facts at all. I read the search warrant and thats where I got my information. You can believe anything you want. I already stated that we don't know all the facts and I also state when something is my opinion. Facts to me are what is proven. What someone says is not always proof.

You seem to think I am defending Murray and I have said over and over again that I believe him to be guilty. However, many things that people say are fact are not in fact...factual. We don't know what happened in that house that morning because we weren't there in the room. I don't know for a fact what was said on the phone to Nurse Lee or why after months and having a doctor on staff there would be a need to call Nurse Lee when a hospital was a short distance away.

I would appreciate it if you would just stop assuming what I am saying. I am being quite clear here and even gave you the link to the search warrant that shows that she did not in fact give her records in at the time of that warrant. Its on record with the police, I didn't type it up myself.
 
Well, if anything, I think the time delay is a good thing actually, because it is a hugely complex case, beyond Murray's involvement, and it should take time to sort out. So I think it is probably an indication that there will be charges, and it won't just be Murray. Of course, I am not overly optimistic either...

But it's not a case where time is of the essence, where you have to be very quick because tracks will be covered, people's memories will cloud etc.

The thing is we don't really know much about what happened or what is going on with the investigation. So, even if we find it very hard, we'll just have to be patient there (and not jump to each other's throats all over the place!)
 
Michael Jackson's Nurse 'On the Record'
Wednesday, July 08, 2009


This is a rush transcript from "On the Record," July 6, 2009. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, FOX NEWS HOST: So how did Michael Jackson suddenly die, at the age 50 and on the verge of an expected spectacular comeback? Michael Jackson's nurse, Cherilyn Lee, goes "On the Record."

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

VAN SUSTEREN: Nice to see you.

CHERILYN LEE, REGISTERED NURSE: It's a blessing to be here. Nice to see you, also.

VAN SUSTEREN: I appreciate you doing this. Michael Jackson -- when did you first meet him?

LEE: I met Michael Jackson in January of 2009 at his home.

VAN SUSTEREN: How did you happen to meet him?

LEE: Through a very dear friend, a very dear friend. He had a concern. His children had -- some of them were coughing, a little runny nose going on. And he's the type person, after meeting him, that's very concerned about his children and want to make sure they stay healthy.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did you examine him at all? Was he -- did he need any medical care at that time, back in January '09?

LEE: On January '09, no. When I finished with the children, he said, Well, you know, what do you do? And I said, Well, you know, what's going on with you? And he said, Well, I'm just feeling a little tired. You know, I'm getting ready for this concert that we're setting up, and the traveling. And he said, I'm just a little tired because I'm getting ready to start performing -- practicing and getting myself ready for that. So he said, I'm just tired.

So I said, Well, you know, before, you know, giving you anything, let's just do some lab work, you know, see what's going on, because there's many reasons why he could be tired. And so I did -- I said, Well, I can't do it today. So he said, Well, can you come back tomorrow? And I said, Well, sure. I mean, I find it an honor to come back, you know?

And I went back the next day and did -- asked him, prior to, to fast for me and don't eat any food after 12:00 midnight and I'll see him the next morning. So I went back the next morning. I drew his blood. And has very small veins, so it took a little minute. So I drew his blood and told him that once I had the results back, then I'll set up a nutritional program for him.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did he complain about not being able to sleep in those first couple months?

LEE: He kind of said, you know, he wanted -- he mentioned it, but it was kind of like "by the way" kind of thing. It wasn't, like, you know, I have just chronic insomnia and I just can't sleep. It was moreso toward April. That's when he asked me what -- Well, do you mind spending the night with me? I have to show you that I can't sleep, and I don't think you really believe me. I said, I believe you. But he said, Well, can you just come? That was around April when he started bring this up. So he said, why don't you come watch me sleep? And I said, OK, I'm going to bring you some tea. And I had another homeopath, I'm going to bring some other things -- actually this was more of an herbal supplement, which is very good for sleep.

And it already mentioned, he said I can't take anything with melatonin because it just doesn't work very well for me. I said OK, I'll make sure it doesn't have that in it
.

And Michael is very smart, very smart man, very articulate, as you know. But very smart, and very well read. So he knew.

And so I said well, Michael, I said, I'll come. And maybe team. I said why don't you get in bed? And he said, why don't you come check my room, and everything. And so when I arrived in this room, I said the one thing that I was concerned about was I don't see how you can sleep. There is just too much lighting.

VAN SUSTEREN: Was this artificial light, Coors is like sleeping in the daytime.

LEE: It was evening.

VAN SUSTEREN: So he had lights on in his room?

LEE: Yes. There a lot of lights on.

VAN SUSTEREN: How many lights to have on in his room? Could you read a book? Was it that led in the room?

LEE: Yes, you could read a book with all the lights.

VAN SUSTEREN: But was he opposed a trying to do it with the lights off, because a lot of people stay in bed with the lights off.

LEE: I tried. I said, let's just dim the lights. Let's cut down on some of the music, because he had classical music that was ongoing in the house itself.

VAN SUSTEREN: He played classical music?

LEE: Yes, he did. It stayed on all day.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did he ever say why he wanted the lights on when asleep?

LEE: I asked him. He said, "I have always slept with lights on."

VAN SUSTEREN: Was afraid of the dark?

LEE: I asked him that too, and he said no. This is not afraid with the lights off, but I like my lights on. And he likes to have his DVD there and watching, he loved all the work, the fascinating work by Walt Disney.

Suite had one of the tapes on, watching that, along with the other music that was going on. It was a little over stimulating, but he said, "I always sleep like this." Some people feel they can sleep with the TV on. But I said, "This is not a healthy way to sleep."

VAN SUSTEREN: What Walt Disney's stuff was he watching?

LEE: Donald Duck.

VAN SUSTEREN: Cartoons?

LEE: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: Is a 50-year-old man watching cartoons with the lights on, was it unusual to you?

LEE: No.

VAN SUSTEREN: Not at all.

LEE: No, it wasn't. I have been dealing with all sorts of people for a long time, and he liked the work. He liked the behind the camera. That's what he found fascinating.

VAN SUSTEREN: So he was intrigued with the artistry.

LEE: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: So did he said just refuse to turn the music and the lights on, he wouldn't try that?

LEE: No. He said he is done everything. He said I've done meditation, I've done this, I've done that. And he just went on the list, and he said nothing worked. He said the only thing I know will work is this IV and the Diprivan.

VAN SUSTEREN: That was the first time, in April, that he mentions it to you?

LEE: He mentions it to me. I said, well, let's just try this. And furthermore, I didn't know what it was. But he said he was an IV. I said that whatever this is that's IV is not something I know you should be doing at home.

And he said, well, it's a safe medicine. I said I don't think it's safe, we'll let me just find out. Even when I went back to his house and taken him the PDR, the physician desk reference, and said, look this is something that is very dangerous, and you don't want to do this at home.

VAN SUSTEREN: So you showed it to him?

LEE: I showed it to him. He didn't want to look at it. It's a real thick, heavy book. I was trying to put it on his lap and let him watch it, look at it. And he was busy with his DVD, looking at something else.

And I said, OK, Michael. I will read you the symptoms. You have to know. I'm telling you the truth, I need you to believe me, trust me on this.

He said, Can you find me an anesthesiologist then to put me to sleep? To put me to sleep so I can get at least eight hours of sleep.

And I said, "You do not want to do this." And at that point, I was sitting there, actually we were having a meal together, and I sat there, I just had the worst feeling, the worst feeling. The sensation came over my body, and I said don't do this, because if you want to be knocked out to go to sleep, my concern is, will you wake up?

VAN SUSTEREN: June rolls around, and did you hear from him between June and, let's say, five days before he died. Did you hear from him at all?

LEE: Father's Day.

VAN SUSTEREN: He called you, or you called him?

LEE: He called me.

VAN SUSTEREN: And what time of day did he call you?

LEE: It was in the afternoon. That's when I received a call, when I was in Florida.

VAN SUSTEREN: Does he make these calls himself, or does he somebody else make them?

LEE: Somebody makes the calls.

VAN SUSTEREN: And says, what, hold for Mike?

LEE: He might physically, himself, or someone just called and said he's going to be calling you, but is calling from a blocked number. I said that's fine in a couple of minutes, and I was put to speak with him.

This time someone else called. And another person, so he called, and I showed her my caller ID, I'm an ER myself in Florida. And so I picked up the phone and answered it.

And he said -- he said, "You know, Michael need you to come see him. We want to know if you could please come today, right away." I said I really can't. I'm in Florida. I said "What's going on?"

And he said, and I could hear Michael in the background saying, "Please, just tell her, tell her what's going on with me. Just tell her."

He said one side of my body is hot and one side of my body is cold, and what should I do?

VAN SUSTEREN: Have you ever head symptom before?

LEE: No. And I worked in emergency medicine, and so, no, I have not heard that symptom before.

VAN SUSTEREN: So you thought that was unusual.

LEE: I know it was very unusual. And I was very concerned based on the facts of what I told him about the medicine.

VAN SUSTEREN: Is there any chance that he would have given himself an IV himself?

LEE: No. He was afraid of needles. And he never comes towards his body with anything like that. There's no way.

VAN SUSTEREN: There is no way he would have gotten the Diprivan and done it himself in your mind?

LEE: No.

VAN SUSTEREN: You're certain?

LEE: I am certain about that. He didn't want anything that was going to cause him pain.

I had a cream called shae (ph) butter. And I said, come on, Michael, let me just massage your hands because they are really dry and cracked. And let me just do that. And we started that back in February.

And he was saying that it was a little painful because it was so dry. And then after that, I said, come on, let me do your feet. And he would no, you're not going to see my feet.

As far as anything dealing with pain, no, never. I can't ever see him doing anything like that.

VAN SUSTEREN: So he would let you do it as a professional, do the IV with the vitamin C?

LEE: Right.

VAN SUSTEREN: But you don't think that he would have freelanced in the sense of giving himself an IV himself or something else?

LEE: Oh, no. No.

VAN SUSTEREN: Someone else did?

LEE: Actually, he would close his eyes for me to give him the vitamin C.

VAN SUSTEREN: So you think if that is the cause of death, the IV, somebody else did it?

LEE: Yes. He would close his eyes. He didn't want to look and -- no. No.

Because he said, "please find a doctor to give me this medication so they can monitor me."


VAN SUSTEREN: Some have said that they thought he was trying to avoid doing to concerts. Did he ever give you any indication that he --

LEE: No, not at all. He was so happy the night that he received a lot of the awards for the "Thriller." It was either that night or later the night before, because a lot of things came in from Holland and all these different companies.

He was so excited. He was so excited. He was so excited about during the concert. They were faxing him over the music they wanted to hear, or emailing one, but he had copies of it in his hand. He said, "Wow, this many people want to hear the song. This many people want to hear that song."

Was really excited, really looking forward. And more so, because he said, "This is the first time my children" -- and they would sit there and just smile -- he said, "The first time I children are going to see me perform."

(END VIDEOTAPE)




PART 2 - July 7, 2009


GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, FOX NEWS HOST: What have we learned about Michael Jackson's relationship with his children? Kind of father was he? Michael Jackson's nurse, Cherilyn Lee, spoke about their relationship.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CHERILYN LEE, REGISTERED NURSE: I was really surprised when I arrived there (INAUDIBLE) to see his children. So I'm thinking, OK, I'm going to see his children, and they probably have a nanny there or something. But then he came downstairs. And I'm, like, Wow, he's actually here. So I was really shocked to see him because I'd only seen him on television.

VAN SUSTEREN: What did he look like when you saw him?

LEE: When I saw him, he looked great. He looked healthy. He was very casual, and you know, just comfortable, and the most humble human being I've ever met. And he just said -- he was so gracious and said, Thank you, thank you, thank you for coming out. Thank you for taking the time to come see my children.

VAN SUSTEREN: What did you think about the inside of the house? What...

LEE: Oh, it was absolutely gorgeous. It was just gorgeous. But it was a home that you walk in and you know this is a home of love. You know, you can walk into a home that could be beautiful, but you don't feel the love there. There was just a warm sense of love that was in that home, that permeated that home. It just was wonderful.

VAN SUSTEREN: What did you think of the three children? How were they with him?

LEE: Wonderful. Wonderful.

VAN SUSTEREN: How would you describe the different personalities?

LEE: The oldest child is very, very -- they're very intelligent, very intelligent, very knowledgeable children. He worked with them, even with their history. They were home schooled, but he -- they even knew black history, very good with black history. He would ask them questions back and forth.

The oldest child was -- loved computers and was very involved with a lot of different things. But he was just -- he did a lot of things with his dad, too (INAUDIBLE) set up the DVD for him and different things. I mean, he was loving. I mean, he would come and ask for dinner, want to have dinner like he was a chef and read off the menu, memorize it and said, Do you want to have this? And I said, Oh, no, no, no. You guys go ahead and I'll just wait until you're finished. But just his personality -- outgoing. Outgoing.

VAN SUSTEREN: You know, because it's interesting because, you know, they seemed to live the cloistered life. You know, we never got to see Michael Jackson because of who he was. He didn't seem to go out much. He didn't (INAUDIBLE) you see a lot of celebrities on the street in Los Angeles, but this family, you know, seemed to be behind that wall almost.

LEE: No. These kids are very, very talented also, extremely talented. We had so much time we spent with each other. In February -- because I know I saw him a couple of times in February because I know -- something came up about my birthday, which is February 21st. And I saw him the week after, and he and the children had purchased me a birthday gift. And they had it all wrapped up with a nice, beautiful bow on it and they were all excited and helped me to unwrap it. And when I opened it up, his son -- you know, it was a computer. And his son -- Come on over here. I'll set it up for you. Let me show you how to do this and do that. And I said, Thank you so much.

But I was so grateful for the fact that he took the time to go and do this for me. And I just kept thanking him, and I had little tears in my eyes. You know, it was so wonderful. And I gave the kids a hug and gave him a hug. He was big on hugs, too.

VAN SUSTEREN: Michael was.

LEE: Yes. Big on hugs, and matter of fact, he even mentioned to the children, you know, love and hugs are free. That's something you don't have to pay for. You guys always remember that. But he was telling the children, Look at her. She is so grateful about having this gift. And he said, More people need to be grateful. And it kind of -- I took a step back when he said that. I mean, it's, like, What type of people, you know, he's done (ph) for that wasn't? I just found him a very giving and loving person.

(END VIDEOTAPE)





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This is getting very frustrating for me. This is a discussion, people have researched and each comes to his own conclusions. Those conclusions may conflict with another's. It's a 2 way street. To say one person is trying to change another person's mind while doing the same thing at the same time is preposterous.

I am just as open to reading what all members have to say and decide for myself how to interpret them. No one is forcing me to believe one way or another. Personally, to throw accusations at someone because one doesn't agree with aspects of the discussion is insulting. I respect reading Beachlover's thoughts on things and do not feel any pressure to change my mind about anything.

Please, can we leave personal accusations towards other members at the door-
 
Honestly, I don't see anything worthwhile coming from MJ's death in regards to this investigation.

I really just see a negligence charge coming for Dr. Murray and thats it. From the mere fact that not even the medical board has even found it necessary to call a hearing on whether or not his license should be revoked is very telling to me. He gets to continue practicing medicine and no one seems to care if he kills someone else or not.
i totally agree.i was going to say the same thing,i mean surely if someone is under investigation,and murray is supposed to be the prime suspect as far as we know,surely this is the first thing the medical board should have done,
 
a hearing means reasons would be announced , reasons means evidence , the DA and LAPD don't want to reveal anything at this point .
 
Thread cleaned, please carry on but there's no need to bring personal issues into it. :)

I posted this just earlier today. Can we please respect each others opinions? Agree to disagree and move on. Discussion is great, and healthy, but calling each other out all the time doesn't make great reading for anyone else. Respect one another please.
 
This is getting very frustrating for me. This is a discussion, people have researched and each comes to his own conclusions. Those conclusions may conflict with another's. It's a 2 way street. To say one person is trying to change another person's mind while doing the same thing at the same time is preposterous.

I am just as open to reading what all members have to say and decide for myself how to interpret them. No one is forcing me to believe one way or another. Personally, to throw accusations at someone because one doesn't agree with aspects of the discussion is insulting. I respect reading Beachlover's thoughts on things and do not feel any pressure to change my mind about anything.

Please, can we leave personal accusations towards other members at the door-

Thank you very much. I do realize that this is a very sensitive subject for all of us here because we all lost someone we truly cared about and we all deal with that pain differently and there are real stages of grief that we all must go through but the pain does get better over time. This is a fact of life that people will die who are close to us.

I am not an expert on everything and I appreciate hearing others points of view on different matters. Just because Nurse Lee says something doesn't mean it is fact and just because Murray said something does not mean it is fact. There are many things being said by many people and even family members that make me roll my eyes and scream!!!!

I happen to be in the medical field and sometimes I read things that are flat out wrong and these are sometimes quotes from physicians.

Soundmind, I have presented that Michael received an IV supplement from Nurse Lee and said to look up the side effects of these supplements. I can only assume you don't want to do that but if you want me to post the possible known side effects I would do so. One of them is neuro toxicity and another is cardiac toxicity.

Again, you have no explanation as to why Michael or his assistant would call Nurse Lee after months of not being seen by her and having a doctor on staff. I don't either but it makes me think harder.
 
what Makes u think they got it by now? iM not sure about that... bet they aint never gonna be any charges ever..

:bugeyedI think they are waiting for The Good socalled Doc to take the easy way out so he can avoid prosecution like someone else that left so suddenly.

NO JUSTICE NO PEACE !!!!!!!!!
 
Let them take their time.
I rather see them looking into every possible piece of evidence and investigate every little detail before they press charges than seeing them rush trough everything.


Mire, I agree and I do love that Avitar. Michael still had that Groove when they played Threatened.He did it better than a guy half his age. I wish we could have seen more of it though.:clapping::punk:
He is sorely missed.:angel:
 
from TMZ and the search warrant it seems the propofol supply did not match the six weeks of propofol .i do believe must of the injections were caused by murray when he was creating the overdose scene plus the paramedics and the doctors at UCLA.

needle marks vs punctures. Needle marks are what is left when the puncture heals itself. On Michael they would be red and hard to miss. Puncture marks are small holes left by the needles. The fact that there wwere still puncture wounds on Michael's arms means that they never got a chance to heal and were prob made post mortem. And the fact that his arm was covered with them means that the emts and doctors left them.
yeah sound very logical to me,
 
Lee said the singer drew his own distinctions when it came to drugs versus prescription medicine.

“He said, `I don’t like drugs. I don’t want any drugs. My doctor told me this is a safe medicine,’” Lee said. The next day, she said she brought a copy of the Physician’s Desk Reference to show him the section on Diprivan.

“He said, ‘No, my doctor said it’s safe. It works quick and it’s safe as long as somebody’s here to monitor me and wake me up. It’s going be OK,’” Lee said. She said he did not give the doctor’s name.
To me this sounds very much like Michael, very trusting. It's heartbreaking how much he trusted that "dr."

Lee said at one point, she spent the night with Jackson to monitor him while he slept. She said she gave him herbal remedies and stayed in a corner chair in his vast bedroom.

After he settled in bed, Lee told Jackson to turn down the lights and music — he had classical music playing in the house. “He also had a computer on the bed because he loved Walt Disney,” she said. “He was watching Donald Duck and it was ongoing. I said, `Maybe if we put on softer music,’ and he said, `No, this is how I go to sleep.’”

Three and a half hours later, Jackson jumped up and looked at Lee, eyes wide open, according to Lee. “This is what happens to me,” she quoted him as saying. “All I want is to be able to sleep. I want to be able to sleep eight hours. I know I’ll feel better the next day.”
This all seems very truthful and plausible. Very sad too. :(
 
from TMZ and the search warrant it seems the propofol supply did not match the six weeks of propofol .i do believe must of the injections were caused by murray when he was creating the overdose scene plus the paramedics and the doctors at UCLA.

yeah sound very logical to me,

Except for one important thing any medical professional will tell you. You do not give life saving drugs by injection in the arm. You would give them through an IV. Propofol is also given by IV.

The fact that there wwere still puncture wounds on Michael's arms means that they never got a chance to heal which clearly means to me these were recent injections given IM. (intramuscular)
 
and the LAPD were thorough with his arrest for the molestation allegations
the LAPD were never involved in the arrest they were only involved in 93

fter he settled in bed, Lee told Jackson to turn down the lights and music — he had classical music playing in the house. “He also had a computer on the bed because he loved Walt Disney,” she said. “He was watching Donald Duck and it was ongoing. I said, `Maybe if we put on softer music,’ and he said, `No, this is how I go to sleep.’”
thats not even logical.no wonder u cant sleep with stuff like that playing.hard to believe
 
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