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Coroners Report released - GRAPHIC CONTENT (Threads merged)

ivy said:
Apparently MJ was complaining about his lungs since 70-80s. Therefore I think that lung situation could be a lifetime situation related to his lupus.
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In LaToya's book she mentioned that Michael has always had problems with his lungs, ever since OTW. During a OTW session Michael had a breathing attack and when they drove him to the hospital he was eventually diagnosed with a small lung capacity. He continued to have quite a few of these attacks, mostly stress related, throughout his life.
 
Victoria83 said:
It's just too invasive. It's like the final invasion, and insult, for such a private man. Michael, I am SO sorry. . for everything. . .
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"Final invasion" :( it REALLY felt like this... :sad:

MarielovesMJ said:
Okay to tell the truth, I did'nt read. I'm just to afraid to read the details and the PDF reader I had did'nt work.
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So don't read then, trust your instincts, you are not ready probably... :flowers:

sloride said:
In LaToya's book she mentioned that Michael has always had problems with his lungs, ever since OTW. During a OTW session Michael had a breathing attack and when they drove him to the hospital he was eventually diagnosed with a small lung capacity. He continued to have quite a few of these attacks, mostly stress related, throughout his life.
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Yeah, but we need to distinguish between a panic attack that might FEEL like he was short of breath (I had those I know what I'm talking about) -
and the real short of breath situation.
He probably experienced both but we can't take every reported incident of a 'breathing' attack and immediately assume this is a proof of the problem with lungs.
Just my 2 cents.
 
GinnyJackson said:
Again i ask

Now that you have read the report. Does this change how you feel towards Michael?

My answer. No...
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No, why would it? I love him so much! :heart: :wub:
But it's causing the worst pain that I've felt since 25-06, because it makes me realize he really isn't here any more... :cry: :weeping:
 
sloride said:
In LaToya's book she mentioned that Michael has always had problems with his lungs, ever since OTW. During a OTW session Michael had a breathing attack and when they drove him to the hospital he was eventually diagnosed with a small lung capacity. He continued to have quite a few of these attacks, mostly stress related, throughout his life.
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He wrote about it in his book Moonwalk too. :yes: That he was on the beach at Jermaine's house and suddenly he couldn't breathe anymore. So they rushed him to the hospital.
 
Stranger said:
Question

I too read the report and felt a bit ashamed at the end..especially reading the truth about his hair. Its like for years we speculated about it, but it wasnt our right to know. MJ and his body were about mystery and now theres nothing left.
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The mystery about MJ was not his body, but his personality. That still remains a mystery.

So how the hell can he weight 16lbs more than in 2003? Do you think the arrest details are false. Maybe they didnt weigh him and someone just supplied the information e.g. from a passport or something?

What do you all think?
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Possibly.
 
StaceyMJ said:
I've just sat and read through this entire thread. Thankyou to all who have shared knowledge. I haven't read the whole report, I think I made it to page 6 and had to stop. But I will work my way through it sometime I guess.

I can't help but think Michael would be mortified to have this made public. It's terrible...to be honest I am shocked that so much information has the need to be made public. It's a shocking world we live in.
I feel so very sad, love and miss you more than ever Michael.
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I agree with you Stacey, Michael would have never wanted us or even worse the entire world to know all this, it feels wrong reading this on many levels. If it was my report I wouldn't have wanted anyone reading this, and given what a private person Michael was, it's just not right :no: :cry:
 
under External Examination :

Over the lower back are several 1/4-1/2 perimortem abraisons. ( Comment scene photographs show beads on the bed )

what does that say ?
 
sloride said:
In LaToya's book she mentioned that Michael has always had problems with his lungs, ever since OTW. During a OTW session Michael had a breathing attack and when they drove him to the hospital he was eventually diagnosed with a small lung capacity. He continued to have quite a few of these attacks, mostly stress related, throughout his life.
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Hocus said:
He wrote about it in his book Moonwalk too. :yes: That he was on the beach at Jermaine's house and suddenly he couldn't breathe anymore. So they rushed him to the hospital.
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Here's the paragraph from Moonwalk:

"I was messing around in the surf, and all of a sudden I couldn't breathe. No air. Nothing. I asked myself what's wrong? I tried not to panic, but I ran back to the house to find Jermaine, who took me to the hospital. It was wild. A blood vessel had burst in my lung. It has never reoccured, although I used to feel little pinches and jerks in there that were probably my imagination. I later learned that this condition was related to pleurisy. It was suggested by my doctor that I try to take things a little slower, but my schedule would not permit it. Hard work continued to be the name of the game."
 
AnnieRUOkay89 said:
The Autopsy basically claims he was healthy, aside from the inflammation of the lungs, which isn't exactly life threatening if you know how to handle it. I have a mitral valve prolaspe which basically means I have an enlarged heart and my lungs can become inflamed or blocked at times. Only thing I really have a hard time doing is running because I get winded very fast due to this disorder, I can sing and dance, but also need breaks in between performances. And I'm just your ordinary Joe who enjoys to perform in his free time, Michael was the greatest entertainer in the world, and I doubt he would've let his lungs stop him from doing what he loved best. Point is, because he has chronic inflammation, it doesn't mean that he wasn't healthy,
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I have read the 51pg report and I agree with the above post.

The report states that ACUTE PROPOFOL INTOXICATION was the MAIN CAUSE OF DEATH.
The benzodiazepine effect was listed as a contributing factor.
Thank goodness for FOI, I needed to see this with my own eyes.

If the coroner thought anything else was a major problem that caused his death, it would have been stated.
I believe that MJ was in fair health (not including the way his body reacted to the drugs in the last hours of his life) apart from the inflammed lungs (we already knew something about that anyway) and apart from the fact that he had some very minor problems most older men have.

The report demonstrates that Murray did not provide the proper care for Michael in his final hours.
 
I hate the media. I hate the media. I hate the media.
Our darling Michael should have been left in peace.
He is eternally beautiful.
Ashes to ashes, dust to dust, but Michael's spirit will live forever.
 
Victoria83 said:
This was truly the most difficult thing I've ever read. It was so terribly invasive. I am SO sorry.

With that said, these are my initial impressions.

There was an empty oxygen tank. Why was there no oxygen available? Did he need MORE, and it was not there?

There was a blood-pressure cuff in the CLOSET? Would not that be important???? Why was it not available?

He was NOT healthy. The lung inflammation was chronic, long-term, and would have caused breathing problems with exercise. Such as.. . . fifty concerts.

The broken ribs and sternum (breastbone) were probably caused by (pointless) CPR.

He was on a maintenance-dose of antibiotics. Why?

He was already gone when paramedics got there, and any CPR after that was just for "show."

His height was WRONG. What else is wrong about this report?

The autopsy confirmed vitiligo, and everyone who says differently should forever STFU.

I'm sure there is more. I'm still processing this devastating report.
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Ok. Working with oxygen tanks (those green ones thy had there) all the time I can tell you that likely since it was 2 days later (thats when the tank was checked) it was empty. Even at the scene it would have been empty as no one woud have turned it off and they run out pretty fast. Nothing suspicious to me there at all.

I imagine the B/P cuff and other stuff was hidden? Or just not used. And also, as a nurse, I can tell you that I would not think to check his blood pressure either. What for?

Antibiotics was Amoxicillin 500 QUD by Cherlyn Lee. That antibiotic could have been when his kids got sick as the name is blocked out. It woud work for Upper Respiratory or Sinus.

Height wrong? How wrong?

Lungs. Chronic but not like he had a collapsed lung, cancer or any other major gross disease. Don't know what you're thinking there? I see people with some of their lung removed and they manage to exercise too. It can be done. I would not speculate on the 50 concert thing because it goes with the conspiracy theory and we know how I hate those.

And they said he was asystolic when they got there but there is no mention of 'time of asystole' We don't know for sure about that. It didn't mention anything about liver mortis by the EMT's. It was mentioned on the exam table after the fact.

There is more on the report that I noted but I have to read it again. Quite frankly, since I have first hand seen this type of procedure I was sick to my stomach and having trouble getting that visual now out of my head.

I didn't see anything 'unusual' or glaring for a 50 year old man.
 
Soundmind said:
under External Examination :

Over the lower back are several 1/4-1/2 perimortem abraisons. ( Comment scene photographs show beads on the bed )

what does that say ?
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He was laying on the beads and they left an indent and red marks. Perimortem is at or around the time of death

We had a patient lose his bottom teeth and they were in his bed all night and it looked like someone bit his arse in the morning.
 
callmerose said:
I don't think you should read it. I think it would upset you a lot. I think you will hear about all of the important information from others. There is no reason to force yourself to do something that will upset you so much.
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Thank you. I feel so sad. I really can't read it. And I don't need to know about the most intimate details of Michael's body. No one does! And he wouldn't want us to know either! The fact that things like the above are picked out just goes to show that this document is being used to further humiliate him, even in death, instead of showing why he died or how healthy he was - which is it's only real purpose! :depressed:

Just from reading a summary or comments I know there is nothing in that document that we didn't already know, so, for me, there is no need to read it enless I want to know how much a certain organ weighed or the size of his penis! I also don't need the mental image of him on that table... Christ sake...! He would be mortified by this! :weeping:
 
Beachlover said:
He was laying on the beads and they left an indent and red marks. Perimortem is at or around the time of death

We had a patient lose his bottom teeth and they were in his bed all night and it looked like someone bit his arse in the morning.
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I know that , but for them to rule it as perimortem they determined there was no process of healing . So MJ died on that BED , else a healing process would have started immediatley after he was removed from the bed . PLus the propofol concentration in his blood is an indication he died while he was hooked to propofol and that was at least half an hour before the paramedics arrived . there was no time for the concentration to drop in his blood .

I want to know why they did not classify the injurie caused by the CPR and the attempts to revive him like with the beads . also no mention of time of death or even estimated one , why ?
 
twinklEE said:
I think they were unable to determine a TOD?
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I don't think so...cause you have to read between the lines here...we are dealing with two different times of death...the time that his brain was death...and the time the machines got turned of to stop the blood circulating.(sorry to say it like this but this is the way it is)

Michael died on that bed within seconds after he got the propofol. If we put this report next to the first timeline we heard. Than it's pretty save to assume michael was gone somewhere between 10.40 and 10.45. I know not many of you believe this timeline Murray give..but the best lies are always the once that have some truth in them...
 
esther1972 said:
I don't think so...cause you have to read between the lines here...we are dealing with two different times of death...the time that his brain was death...and the time the machines got turned of to stop the blood circulating.(sorry to say it like this but this is the way it is)

Michael died on that bed within seconds after he got the propofol. If we put this report next to the first timeline we heard. Than it's pretty save to assume michael was gone somewhere between 10.40 and 10.45. I know not many of you believe this timeline Murray give..but the best lies are always the once that have some truth in them...
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Thanks a lot for this info, seems to make sense.
 
and the propofol concentration in urine were very small 0.15 in the last 12 hours of his life (550 urine bladder) . Then why did he even take propofol ??? There is something very very wrong with this story . 50 /25 mg daily to sleep for hours and he slept !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
I think Michael stoped breathing very shortly after he got the propofol
-> no oxygen anymore so the brain shuts off after around 6-7 minutes
-> no brain activity anymore so the heart shuts off after another... well let's say 8 minutes.
The nurses here can might say it more exactly about the minutes but I think I'm not too wrong?

Now you can keep blood circulation for some time by just making the heart pumping on through cpr for example... that long you're might able to also still feel some pulse for some time.

But that explains for example why the concentration of propofol didn't really make it completely also to the urine etc.

To me it's clear... Michael died on that bed. Those marks seem to be indeed perimortem.
Still a person is officially dead only legally I think when a doctor makes the official declaration? Which was done only much later in the hospital by Dr. Brown? 2 something pm.
 
Michael Jackson's Guitarist Manager Bruce Edwin Reports on Autopsy Summary

Bruce Edwin, who is CEO of the celebrity talent management firm Starpower Management, who managed guitarist David Williams (guitarist on Thriller, Off the Wall, etc., who also passed on last year), states, "I have reviewed over twenty pages of the coroners and criminalist report of Michael today, and what fans of Michael should know from these findings are the following; Number one, Michael Jackson was, although too thin, at nearly six foot and 136 pounds, generally in good health.
Secondly, details Mr. Edwin, 7 drugs were found in his system, and two in particular, propofol, and benzodiazepine, caused his death due to creating the inability to breath and undue strain being put on his heart due to these drugs.
Thirdly, Bruce Edwin continues, the autopsy, which involved many biopsies of various parts of the body and organs, concluded the experts' findings that Michael most likely did not administer these drugs into himself.
It is suspected, Bruce Edwin goes on, that Dr. Conrad Murray was reportedly the one present who administered these drugs into Michael. The autopsy report further details that the person who presumably gave Michael these drugs through an I.V. in to his leg, did so without following proper safety procedure, and did so reportedly for the reason of insomnia, and that these drugs are not supposed to be used to treat insomnia.
Bruce Edwin adds, Michael's guitarist, David Willliams confided to me early last year that Michael had been addicted to pills and drugs for some time, and that the Jackson family was aware of this, and that there was at least one person in Michael's home that was enabling him, and possibly more, and that one particular person who generally answered the phone was the person attempting to block the family from communicating with their son Michael. The talent manager further states that David Williams and at least one of the other Jackson brothers were attempting to do an intervention to save Michael, but that their efforts were being blocked by a person in the house to save him.
Mr. Edwin, who is also a producer, and attended the repass of Mr. Jackson, lastly states, I feel that the family knows who is responsible for the tragic loss of life of the world's biggest star, and music's legend. I feel they know who did it, and they are going after him. It won't bring Michael back, but it will help them with some closure, and they deserve it.
 
esther1972 said:
I don't think so...cause you have to read between the lines here...we are dealing with two different times of death...the time that his brain was death...and the time the machines got turned of to stop the blood circulating.(sorry to say it like this but this is the way it is)

Michael died on that bed within seconds after he got the propofol. If we put this report next to the first timeline we heard. Than it's pretty save to assume michael was gone somewhere between 10.40 and 10.45. I know not many of you believe this timeline Murray give..but the best lies are always the once that have some truth in them...
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If Michael died within seconds of the propofol shot, I do not understand why he was given it around 10.00 am 10.30. am? That was the time for him to wake up usually. . idk?
 
Mechi , if the survival time after propofol was for 8 minutes the blood concentration would have dropped to near 1 or even less . the blood concentraion indicates when MJ DIED which means DIED he was still hooked to propofol and when propofol stopped there was NO TIME for the concentration to drop . They detected propofol , lidocaine and flumazenil in a syringe , they detected propofol , lidocaine and flumazenil in a a short section of IV tubing attached to a Y connecter . They did not detect any drug in a long tube attached to an IV bag nor in the bag . That means Murray was pushing the drugs into the IV and not in the bag . so no IV drip as he claimed , all of these were recovered from his bag which he found the time to hide " in a closet in the next room"

why no flumazenil was detected in MJ's system ? was it too late ? probably .
 
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