The Jackson Family actions concerning Conrad Murray. [Discussion Thread]

[Ramona122003]

It has been a long time since I have posted on this forum, although I have been lurking for some time. I chose not to post mostly because other hear have voiced my feelings. I chose to post now because I wanted to say that I do think Katherine loved her son and her grand babies.

With that said, however, she did a grave and an unforgivable disservice to both Michael and his kids. To go after AEG and siding with scum, she left Michael's killer off the hook. Having compassion and forgiven are noble traits, but I always got the feeling that Katherine was never truly outraged by Murry's actions. She was in disbelief in what happened to Michael, but I never say any real disgust or anger. I have seen her more passionate, more outraged, and vindictive against AEG and the Estate in the early years after Michael's death. Her son is dead, but all she seemed to worry about is who has the deepest pockets. If Murray was rich, I would bet my eyes that she would have gone after Murry with the same vigor and anger she has shown against AEG.

It seems to me that none of them has wiped their minds around that Michael was killed and that Murry is the one who did it. Not AEG, Sony, or any of the other 'enemies', it was Murray. Maybe it is that they cannot accept that Michael died by someone's reckless and stupid actions that there has to be more. That their has to be some hidden depth that is not there. I see this same line of thinking among some fans. Michael could not have just died by recklessness. There has to be someone greater and more powerful pushing Murry to act stupid.

By denying reality the Jackson family gave Murray a free past. Now, until his death, we have to hear how Michael manipulated 'poor' Murray and entrapped him in his odd world. How 'poor' Murry lost his lively hood because of Michael's celebrity when Michael killed himself and lied about being an addict, something the family themselves pushed.

To be honest, I really cannot feel sorry for any of them. When and if Murray goes on his media tour to slander Michael, the family should be the last people to complain. By being greedy they not only lost their lawsuit, but they allow a murderer to get a slap on the hand. If it was not for the fact that Michael and his children would suffer, I would say that they got what they deserved.

 

[elusive moonwalker]

nice to see you ramona. a blast from the past!

 

[Ramona122003]

nice to see you ramona. a blast from the past!

Nice to hear from you too. After the last year Granny-Gate, I kind of threw my hands and walked away. I swear, the Jacksons are the ideal family for a reality show. Never a dull moment and more drama than All My Children and The Young and the Reckless put together.

At this point, I cannot even really get mad at the family. Just point and laugh.



Btw, another reason why I felt compel to post is because I was on Vindicating Michael site, reading several wonderful articles, when I decided to read their take on the Murry and AEG trial. I guess you guys know this already, the people on the blog hate all you guys' guts. Honestly, the person who runs Vindicating Michael has more anger and hate towards AEG than Murray. Although the Murray trial the person kept pinning everything on AEG and when the AEG verdict was read, they just exploded.

According to them, this site and others who felt the Jacksons deserved to lose or felt the verdict was fair given the evidence are all AEG plants or traitors to Michael. I could only roll my eyes and leave the site, which is sad since it has so much information. But after dealing with the TINI crap, fake songs crap, and Karen/Jackson family butt kisser, I just have no patience.

I support the verdict because AEG had no duty to Michael's health. AEG maybe run by a bunch of greedy jackasses who saw Michael as nothing more than a money machine, but really why would they expect AEG to act like they care for Michael? I certainly do not expect my boss to give a damn about me unless I personally knew them.

For all this talk about AEG should have done, X, Y, Z, at the end of the day Michael was the one responsibility for his health. If Michael was so ill that he could walk, why didn't he take his own self to the hospital? If his health got worse with Murray's care, why didn't he noticed and drop Murray? Why did Michael not ask for the equipment needed to monitor him? Michael was his own man and he is the one who should have fought for his health if he felt he was truly in danger, not AEG or his co-workers. To take away Michael's own responsibility is an insult to this man who survived so much. Despite what some fans, 'friends', and family members want us to believe Michael was not some frail flower who needed others to be his backbone. He can speak up for himself when he needed to. Bad 25 and This is It have shown us this.

Do I blame Michael for his death, no. He does holds some responsibility for what happened, but he paid for his mistake. The one I will always fully blame is Murray. He is the one who put himself before his patient for money and fame. He is the one who left Michael to die while he chat it up with his girlfriends and left emails talking about how healthy Michael was as he laid dying. He is the one who still denies any wrong doing and dares to say that Michael betrayed him. Michael died because Murray could not give a damn about his patient and that is the fact that the fans and family must come to accept. Chasing the 'others' and blaming AEG because they pressure poor defenseless Michael is taking guilt away from Murray, while insulting Michael as an adult.

Hopefully, with this lawsuit done we can all begin to heal. Hopefully, cooling heads will prevail and fans will give back Michael's manhood.

 

[Bubs]

For all this talk about AEG should have done, X, Y, Z, at the end of the day Michael was the one responsibility for his health. If Michael was so ill that he could walk, why didn't he take his own self to the hospital? If his health got worse with Murray's care, why didn't he noticed and drop Murray? Why did Michael not ask for the equipment needed to monitor him? Michael was his own man and he is the one who should have fought for his health if he felt he was truly in danger, not AEG or his co-workers. To take away Michael's own responsibility is an insult to this man who survived so much. Despite what some fans, 'friends', and family members want us to believe Michael was not some frail flower who needed others to be his backbone. He can speak up for himself when he needed to. Bad 25 and This is It have shown us this.

Do I blame Michael for his death, no. He does holds some responsibility for what happened, but he paid for his mistake. The one I will always fully blame is Murray. He is the one who put himself before his patient for money and fame. He is the one who left Michael to die while he chat it up with his girlfriends and left emails talking about how healthy Michael was as he laid dying. He is the one who still denies any wrong doing and dares to say that Michael betrayed him. Michael died because Murray could not give a damn about his patient and that is the fact that the fans and family must come to accept. Chasing the 'others' and blaming AEG because they pressure poor defenseless Michael is taking guilt away from Murray, while insulting Michael as an adult.

Hopefully, with this lawsuit done we can all begin to heal. Hopefully, cooling heads will prevail and fans will give back Michael's manhood.

I agree with all of your points and I want to highlight the bolded parts, which I agree with 1000%.

Unfortunately I don't think it is over yet as there is an appeal coming.

 

[jaydom7]

I agree Ramona.. I do wish MJ would've sought another alternative from a sleep expert or specialist. It's obvious Murray, Klein, Metzger and Hoefflin never had MJ's best interest at heart if they allowed him to think that using anesthesia was ok as a sleep aid. All of those men are medical doctors and had years of medical experience. They all knew better but they didn't care because all they were interested in was money. As for Katherine there is no way she can blame AEG for not caring about MJ's health, because she herself didn't care either. Did she ever take her son to a psychiatrist or sleep specialist or any professional when he was younger? She sat by and watched MJ go to these corrupt doctors for his skin issues, burns, back pain, pleurisy and other ailments and she did nothing when he wasn't getting better. If MJ was not getting better but worse why didn't his Mother intervene? she knew MJ was pretty much by himself and had no one else didn't she?

 

[Ashtanga]

I wish this was all a big lie ... this is all just a horrible nightmare we're having. But it is not .... All this shit is happening. And when you think nothing else can happen... arises other shit. When all will be at peace? I am always wondering.... We feel sorry for you Michael. *big sigh* And God take care of PPB. ray:

 

[Victory22]

I am still baffled at the amount of time and effort this 83 year old elderly woman is putting into hiring and meeting with lawyers and going to court to sue AEG for something she should've been doing for her son. She is blaming AEG for not caring about her son's health when she obviously didn't either. If Katherine would've put this much time and effort into helping MJ with his medical and emotional problems he would still be here today. She didn't do much to help him then because she 'didn't want to hear bad news' according to her own testimony in court. Her son was in rehab in 1993 and told the world he needed help, yet his own Mother didn't want to hear about it because it was 'bad news'.. She hired professional doctors, addiction specialists, pain specialists and sleep experts for this AEG trial, but she never hired anyone like that for her son when he was suffering with it for over 25 years

Her actions boggle the mind for sure Jaydom7. It’s totally incredible to witness the lengths she went to in order to gain a financial settlement from AEG. The woman moved heaven and earth to make sure almost every sleep and addiction specialist available in the United States was consulted in order to win her case but she never hired one to help MJ while he was alive. Knowing all of this makes me so horribly sad for MJ.

 

[AliCat]

In light of what we have learned about Katherine Jackson, in regards to the AEG Live trial, Jermaine Jackson is in trouble, financially speaking.

I can see why the latest mother of his 2 son's is taking Jermaine to court, so that she gets her money, via child support payments.

I truly believe Jermaine Jackson was looking forward to AEG Live to paying his mother several million dollars. Now that that is not happening I doubt Jermaine Jackson will be erecting hotel's in his youngest son's name.

Ever since Michael Jackson was a teenager, his mother looked upon Michael to support her til death do us part!

 

[jaydom7]

I agree.. Katherine depended on MJ taking care of her and her necessities instead of her husband Joe. It wasn't fair the pressure she and her husband put on a 6 year old. And when he began suffering both physically and emotionally, they act like they had no idea how to handle it. Katherine ignored MJ's issues it seems.

 

[jaydom7]

Her actions boggle the mind for sure Jaydom7. It’s totally incredible to witness the lengths she went to in order to gain a financial settlement from AEG. The woman moved heaven and earth to make sure almost every sleep and addiction specialist available in the United States was consulted in order to win her case but she never hired one to help MJ while he was alive. Knowing all of this makes me so horribly sad for MJ.

Isn't that amazing? suddenly she had experts in vitiligo, insomnia, lupus, pain, addiction, childhood trauma and everything else you can speak of, but never have we heard in 50 years of his life his Mother ever consulting anyone to help MJ. It was like MJ was put out there to fend for himself.

 

[Ramona122003]

Her actions boggle the mind for sure Jaydom7. It’s totally incredible to witness the lengths she went to in order to gain a financial settlement from AEG. The woman moved heaven and earth to make sure almost every sleep and addiction specialist available in the United States was consulted in order to win her case but she never hired one to help MJ while he was alive. Knowing all of this makes me so horribly sad for MJ.

I am almost certain that Katherine knew very little about how sever Michael's sleep problems were. No one really did accept for a few doctors. Even when Michael talked about having problems sleeping it was more of a side-note and seemed to be normal bouts that everyone goes through now and then. Given the life Michael led, I would have problems sleeping too. So, I do not blame Katherine for not knowing.

What I do blame her for is acting like everyone else should had known. The Jackson family is like the poster child for hypocrisy. AEG should have know, but they did not know despite being his family. Michael was an addict and needed help, but they hounded him to his death about touring. AEG was mean to Michael and saw him as nothing but a moneybag, but the family had him paying for his older brothers' child support and his own father climbing into his house to get business deals from him and take over his concerts.

Really, the entire family needs to really listen to Man in the Mirror.

 

[Snow White luvs Peter Pan]

The thing with Michael is that he was way TOO trusting and I still don't get way knowing he was deceived beyond comparison. I think DR mentioned Michael respected and trusted doctors because they went to school. They way he didn't trust in the music industry sharks, as he called them, he shouldn't had trust in shark doctors either. I thought the 2005 could had teach him a lesson on bastards not having the best interest at heart but I guess I was wrong.

 

[Ramona122003]

The thing with Michael is that he was way TOO trusting and I still don't get way knowing he was deceived beyond comparison. I think DR mentioned Michael respected and trusted doctors because they went to school. They way he didn't trust in the music industry sharks, as he called them, he shouldn't had trust in shark doctors either. I thought the 2005 could had teach him a lesson on bastards not having the best interest at heart but I guess I was wrong.

Most people trust doctors, especially their personal doctor, so Michael is not unusual. That is why convicting Murray was so hard because people had to accept that a doctor not only betrayed their patient, but ended up killing them. We put our lives in the hands of those who carry a PHD whether if it for medication or surgery.

Look at it this way, Michael knew Murray for three years. He had him take care of his kids and invited the man's family over. To Michael, Murray was not just his doctor, but a friend that he trusted the care to his children to. So, why would he believed that Murray could betray him the way he did? It is easy with 20/20 hindsight to say that Michael should have known better, especially given how Murray is acting now, but before his death, Murray had the trust and love of all of his patients. He had everyone fooled.

 

[Bubs]

I am almost certain that Katherine knew very little about how sever Michael's sleep problems were. No one really did accept for a few doctors. Even when Michael talked about having problems sleeping it was more of a side-note and seemed to be normal bouts that everyone goes through now and then. Given the life Michael led, I would have problems sleeping too. So, I do not blame Katherine for not knowing.

What I do blame her for is acting like everyone else should had known. The Jackson family is like the poster child for hypocrisy. AEG should have know, but they did not know despite being his family. Michael was an addict and needed help, but they hounded him to his death about touring. AEG was mean to Michael and saw him as nothing but a moneybag, but the family had him paying for his older brothers' child support and his own father climbing into his house to get business deals from him and take over his concerts.

Really, the entire family needs to really listen to Man in the Mirror.

I actually heard or read one of KJ's interview (could have been in her book), in which she mentioned that even as child Michael had troubles sleeping. She mentioned the time she woke up in the middle of the night and Michael was up making music, so KJ was aware of the problem. She just didn't do anything about it because it meant that there is more music (=money for the family) coming.

I have said it many times before and say it again that she (and family) are the biggest hypocrites on earth.
They say people were using MJ to make money. So did they. Hypocrites.
They say AEG should have done something to help Michael. They didn't do either. Hypocrites.

Meaning of the Man in the Mirror is not something they are able to comprehend.
They love to point fingers at all directions, but there are as many fingers pointing right back at them.

 

[Ramona122003]

I actually heard or read one of KJ's interview (could have been in her book), in which she mentioned that even as child Michael had troubles sleeping. She mentioned the time she woke up in the middle of the night and Michael was up making music, so KJ was aware of the problem. She just didn't do anything about it because it meant that there is more music (=money for the family) coming.

I have said it many times before and say it again that she (and family) are the biggest hypocrites on earth.
They say people were using MJ to make money. So did they. Hypocrites.
They say AEG should have done something to help Michael. They didn't do either. Hypocrites.

Meaning of the Man in the Mirror is not something they are able to comprehend.
They love to point fingers at all directions, but there are as many fingers pointing right back at them.

I cannot say I agree with the bold. It is true that Katherine and Toya talked about Michael not really sleeping. Toya in her book talked about how hard it was for her to sleep because Michael would be up all night making music, dancing, or watching movies. Michael did not even want a bed in his room when he was remodeling the house. He wanted a completely open room with a sleeping bag and his mother convinced him to at least have a Murphy bed.

The family did not do anything about his sleep problems because they problem did not think they were that sever and thought it was Michael having an overacting, creative mind. Most geniuses have problems resting because their minds are always active. Also, even if his family did ask about his sleeping habits, Michael would have most likely brush them off. By all accounts, he was an adult when his sleeping issues became noticeable.

So, I disagree about the family being able to do anything because Michael never told anyone, except doctors, how sever his sleeping problem was and it was not like they force him to go to a sleep clinic or something. I do agree that they are hypocrites and I find it ironic that Man in the Mirror is one of Katherine's favorite songs, along with Jermaine. Maybe it is their conscious speaking.

 

[Bubs]

I cannot say I agree with the bold. It is true that Katherine and Toya talked about Michael not really sleeping. Toya in her book talked about how hard it was for her to sleep because Michael would be up all night making music, dancing, or watching movies. Michael did not even want a bed in his room when he was remodeling the house. He wanted a completely open room with a sleeping bag and his mother convinced him to at least have a Murphy bed.

The family did not do anything about his sleep problems because they problem did not think they were that sever and thought it was Michael having an overacting, creative mind. Most geniuses have problems resting because their minds are always active. Also, even if his family did ask about his sleeping habits, Michael would have most likely brush them off. By all accounts, he was an adult when his sleeping issues became noticeable.

So, I disagree about the family being able to do anything because Michael never told anyone, except doctors, how sever his sleeping problem was and it was not like they force him to go to a sleep clinic or something. I do agree that they are hypocrites and I find it ironic that Man in the Mirror is one of Katherine's favorite songs, along with Jermaine. Maybe it is their conscious speaking.

This is from KJ's testimony:
Mrs. Jackson said Michael had been burned, badly burned, and was in a lot of pain. He had a balloon under the scalp. Mrs. Jackson: He took that money from Pepsi settlement and donated it to the children's burn center. He had back injury too, she said. He had vitiligo, a disease that turns the skin white. "He just wanted to get it over with" she explained. He didn't talk much about his insomnia, Mrs. Jackson said. He couldn't sleep at all at night when he was at home. (ABC7)

Perhaps Michael didn't talk much about his issues with KJ, because as she said, she doesn't want to hear bad news, but she cannot expect concert promoters to take motherly position in Michael's life.

 

[jaydom7]

Katherine contradicts herself so much... she says that MJ didn't talk about it, yet she also says he didn't sleep at all when he was living at home with her.. So that means she knew even if he didn't talk about it right?:bugeyed

 

[ivy]

Katherine contradicts herself so much... she says that MJ didn't talk about it, yet she also says he didn't sleep at all when he was living at home with her.. So that means she knew even if he didn't talk about it right?:bugeyed

well when you are living at the same house, you don't really need to talk to see if someone isn't sleeping and walking around the house at night. you can see and hear it.

 

[jaydom7]

well when you are living at the same house, you don't really need to talk to see if someone isn't sleeping and walking around the house at night. you can see and hear it.

Right... that's my point. That's why I don't understand how she can act like she doesn't know anything when it comes to him.

 

[jaydom7]

Re: Conrad Murray News and discussion thread [No media Llinks allowed]

Katherine should've fought tooth and nail to make sure he paid in restitution since he wasn't going to pay with jail time. Now he's out there free to live and make money off of MJ.. It's terrible.. MJ took care of Katherine for 45 years of his short 50 years of life, and this is how she repays him?:no:

 

[jaydom7]

Re: Conrad Murray News and discussion thread [No media Llinks allowed]

The family should've most definitely filed a medical malpractice suit against him.. They would've won 10 times over.. This 'doctor' gave a man anesthesia as a sleep aid in a house, there was no signed consent for anything and he wasn't monitoring him.. It was definitely criminal negligence. With his conviction, the family would've won a civil lawsuit easily.

 

[Kingofpop4ever3000]

Re: Conrad Murray News and discussion thread [No media Llinks allowed]

I wonder how Katherine feels now that Murray has done that interview and called her an "enabler". It's too bad for her that she can't get money from him about that. And in my opinion, it's her own fault.

 

[jaydom7]

well since Murray has bashed her too, I don't think she is too happy.. after losing to AEG she probably wishes she didn't 'care so much about Murray feeding his children'

 

[marebear]

Does she even know since she doesn't want to hear bad news. I am so angry right now.

 

[Kingofpop4ever3000]

well since Murray has bashed her too, I don't think she is too happy.. after losing to AEG she probably wishes she didn't 'care so much about Murray feeding his children'

I agree. She's going to find out what he said about her sooner or later if she hasn't heard already. In my opinion, she should have known it would come to something like this after Murray told her lawyers in no uncertain terms to not try to put him on the stand during the AEG lawsuit. She took a gamble going after AEG when the restitution was guaranteed. And when all was said and done, she got nothing.

 

[twinklEE]

I couldnt care less about how she feels in this mess. All I know is that her refusal to seek restitution makes everything so easy for Murray, she handed Michael over on a golden plate. I dont know how a person can live like that knowing full well that they are partly resposnsible why the killer of heir child is becoming rich off their crime. I know I coulsnt live with such a guilty conscience.. but then again I am not Kattie. I dont close my eyes and look the other way while demanding more and more money.

 

[jaydom7]

I couldnt care less about how she feels in this mess. All I know is the her refusal to seek restitution makes everything so easy for Murray, she handed Michael over on a golden plate. I dont know how a person can live like that knowing full well that they are partly resposnsible why the killer of heir child is becoming rich off their crime. I know I coulsnt live with such a guilty conscience.. but then again I am not Kattie. I dont close my eyes and look the other way while demanding more and more money.

Katherine didn't protect MJ while he was alive, we know good and well she is not going to do it when he is gone.. She obviously doesn't care as long as she is getting paid..

 

[Bubs]

After reading and hearing what CM said about MJ, I find it disgusting that KJ even thought of making deal with him. She was ready and willing to write nicely about him if he testifies against AEG.
There are some sick people out there and CM is not definitely the only one.

 

[GreenEyes]

This is all so predictable - with the Jackson bunch feigning disgust over this guy. She should have anticipated trouble with this idiot from the get go and protected her son's children - instead of worrying about Murray's kids.
---------------

Conrad Murray
Ignites War With Katherine Jackson
24 minutes ago
Exclusive

Katherine Jackson's lawyers think Conrad Murray is a coward who is trashing the man he killed for profit.

One of Katherine's lawyers tells TMZ, "Murray has refused to go under the OATH KNIFE and his attempt to exploit Michael are despicable and disgusting." Translation: He took the 5th because he's guilty as sin and now he's selling sordid stories about MJ to line his pockets.

Another lawyer sent Murray's attorney a scathing email, calling the doc "reprehensible."

But Murray's lawyer, Valerie Wass, quickly went on the counterattack, saying, "You and members of your client's family have been bad-mouthing my client for a long time. I don't blame him for talking, especially after ... you tried to portray him as an awful person."

What's unclear ... how Murray talking about holding MJ's penis clears up anything.

Source: TMZ

 

[Justthefacts]

don't be getting mad now he's just doing what you people have been doing since June 25th 2009