The Jackson Family actions concerning Conrad Murray. [Discussion Thread]

[Tygger]

delete

 

[marebear]

So everytime Katherine does something we have to just agree with it or justify it because she is Michael's mother? I can't do that. I didn't always agree with what Michael did at times.

I believe she loved Michael and she loves those kids. That's why it's hard to understand the things she says and does. It's not black and white. She is 83 and should not be worried about court cases and appeals. Live life and be there emotionally for those kids like Michael wanted her to. Also let her ADULT children fend for themselves. I believe in helping each other out in a family but they have to take care of themselves.

 

[jaydom7]

Katherine is real concerned with taking care of her older cubs and their children but she never did the same for MJ did she? remember she said she didn't want to know about MJ's 1993 rehab stint because she didn't want to hear 'bad news' Why wasn't she there helping her son get through that ordeal and his other medical issues? she is so willing and able to hire lawyers, go to court, and do interviews now, but when MJ needed help with his med issues and his pain she was no where to be found.

 

[Victory22]

Katherine is real concerned with taking care of her older cubs and their children but she never did the same for MJ did she? remember she said she didn't want to know about MJ's 1993 rehab stint because she didn't want to hear 'bad news' Why wasn't she there helping her son get through that ordeal and his other medical issues? she is so willing and able to hire lawyers, go to court, and do interviews now, but when MJ needed help with his med issues and his pain she was no where to be found.

Exactly Jaydom7! Katherine didn't want to hear any of Michael's bad news but she is just fine with coming to the rescue whenever the other cubs call. That's what makes me angry with her.

 

[Snow White luvs Peter Pan]

To clarify, I have TONS of respect, love and admiration towards Michael but I don't have any for people who have used him or hurt him and that includes his parents and most of his siblings. The fact KJ is Michael's mother doesn't qualify to respect her and/or cr call her names if her actions concerning him or his children are absolute outrageous and revolve around getting money using all of them.

People who weren't even family members showed more sensitivity and compassion to help him when he was in his darkest moments like Elizabeth Taylor. She was one of his true friends who never stabbed him in the back, used him or took advantage of him. I could never say the same about the Jacksons.

 

[serendipity]

Not one profitable action this killer has performed using the name of the man he killed since that fatal crime would have been protected by restitution. Not ONE.

There's no way of knowing that for a fact, not unless they tried. And there's no reason why they shouldn't have tried.

That reality does not support the theory that Katherine rejected restitution solely so she could extort monies from AEG.

Really? What other logical theory is there?

 

[Ashtanga]

*big sigh* >

 

[krikzil]

There's no way of knowing that for a fact, not unless they tried. And there's no reason why they shouldn't have tried.

Exactly. Fred Goldman outsmarted OJ in the end and he had no where near the resources KJ has at her disposal.

Really? What other logical theory is there?

Yes, I'd like to know too.

All she had to do was say "yes" since the CA Constitution guarantees a Victim's right to Criminal Restitution for full economic losses suffered -- regardless of the defendant's ability to pay, the Judge will issue the Order. There's even a system in place that goes about collecting it, along with the ability of the Victim(s) to collect as if it were a civil judgment on their own. (She's certainly got enough attorneys on the payroll to spare for a few hours.) But nope.... suing for BILLIONS but unwilling to lose the $100M (or whatever figure Pastor would have settled on) that would have been deducted. Pretty clear maximizing the bottom line trumphed everything.

 

[Kingofpop4ever3000]

I thought Katherine said she dropped the restitution because she wanted Murray's money to go to his children. But it still doesn't make sense because he could still get a regular job to support himself and his family without trying to make money off of Michael's death, in my opinion. I just don't understand this.

 

[Tygger]

There's no way of knowing that for a fact, not unless they tried. And there's no reason why they shouldn't have tried.

Not true. All monies for the documentary went to the killer’s lawyers and TMZ paid Alvarez. CNN and NBC did not pay the killer for those interviews.

Really? What other logical theory is there?

Nothing more than perception here. No one here knows for fact why Katherine, Joe, and the lawyers for Michael’s parents and children agreed to reject restitution.

 

[krikzil]

Not true. All monies for the documentary went to the killer’s lawyers and TMZ paid Alvarez. CNN and NBC did not pay the killer for those interviews.

Citing things which occurred before conviction -- the documentary (the deal being made before or during the trial) -- as a reason not to seek restitution isn't a valid argument. And no one has ever said that criminal restitution would be able to stop everything. It's meant to try to hinder profiting from his crime. If a guarantee of success is required, well then KJ shouldn't have sued AEG since she couldn't be certain a jury would decide in her favor.

 

[Virre]

Not true. All monies for the documentary went to the killer’s lawyers and TMZ paid Alvarez. CNN and NBC did not pay the killer for those interviews.



Nothing more than perception here. No one here knows for fact why Katherine, Joe, and the lawyers for Michael’s parents and children agreed to reject restitution.

?? Katherine said why, didn´t she? Have I missed something here now.. huh..??

And wasn´t the restitution to get Murray to not make any money from books, interviews etc? I don´t think anyone here expected him to not say a word because of a restitution, it was to make him not earn a penny from doing it. No one expected him to be quiet.. or? It´s being argued back and forth about how a restitution wouldn´t stop him, but it´s not there to stop him is it, just no not make money?

 

[la_cienega]

Nothing more than perception here. No one here knows for fact why Katherine, Joe, and the lawyers for Michael’s parents and children agreed to reject restitution.

They already stated it was for financial reasons.

 

[sfosteredi]

California does not have a "Son of Sam Law" which is why KJ needed to seek restitution. A Son of Sam Law would have automatically prevented CM from profit:
A Son of Sam law is any American law designed to keep criminals from profiting from the publicity of their crimes, often by selling their stories to publishers. Son of Sam laws are designed so that criminals are unable to take advantage of the notoriety of their crimes. In certain cases a Son of Sam law can be extended beyond the criminals themselves to include friends, neighbors, and family members of the lawbreaker who seek to profit by telling publishers and filmmakers of their relation to the criminal.

Most people won't take the time to write a book or get up early in the morning and fly from place to place to give interviews if every dime they make is taken from them by law. Money is the incentive, take it away and you won't hear from the criminal.

 

[Tygger]

Krizkil, I do not want to participate in the discussion regarding rejection of restitution for the reasons I already stated. My response was only to negate the comment I was responding to. Other posters are free to list any action the doctor took to directly profit from his fatal crime after release that restitution would successfully hinder.

As for success as a reason for an action, I mentioned that previously regarding the AEG trial. As there was NO realistic guarantee AEG could successfully be extorted for billions as some believe, what was the true purpose of the lawsuit? I do not remember reading a response.

Virre, La_Cienega, yes, Katherine gave a reason. Does anyone know for fact it is the full story? Katherine, Joe, and the lawyers for Michael’s parents and children agreed to the rejection. I never saw a statement from all of these parties about their reasoning.

 

[serendipity]

Tygger, that's a cop out IMO. You can't give any logical reason as to why Katherine rejected restitution, because there is none - other than bigger damages from AEG. I think you should leave MJ's kids out of this - they were very small and were not even asked about that trial they were dragged into. No way anyone bothered asking small kids about restitution (or explaining what it means to them).

Yes, you are right - there was no guarantee they would win the AEG trial, but she stil TRIED hard! And even after losing, SHE IS STILL TRYING TO GET THAT MONEY! So why couldn't she DO THE SAME to prevent her son's killer from profiting?!? If other people succeeded I don't see why Katherine Jackson wouldn't have a chance!

But clearly, other things are more important for her, unfortunately.

 

[Virre]

The children had no say in this. I know that for sure.

 

[Tygger]

Serendipity, call it what you want. I answered similar questions many times before. I am not going to participate in the tirade against Katherine because “she rejected restitution” among other grievances others here have against her.

As for logical reasons for rejection, repeating: Katherine, Joe, and the lawyers for Michael’s parents and children agreed to the rejection. I never saw a statement from all of these parties about their reasoning. We have Katherine’s deposition and trial testimony and we do not know if that was the sole reasoning for this group who agreed to the rejection.

 

[xosweetseducingsighsxo]

Not true. All monies for the documentary went to the killer’s lawyers and TMZ paid Alvarez. CNN and NBC did not pay the killer for those interviews.



Nothing more than perception here. No one here knows for fact why Katherine, Joe, and the lawyers for Michael’s parents and children agreed to reject restitution.

The only reason they rejected the restitution was because they knew that Conrad Murray was broke as broke can be. Now that? Everyone knows it's a true fact. The Jacksons are super shady, and the amount of suck that they bring with them is ridiculous. Michael was the only trustworthy, and smart one.

 

[Victory22]

Katherine has made her reasons for rejecting restitution from the broke doctor loud and clear and they had nothing to do with either love or justice. Her reasons were money, money and money.

 

[jaydom7]

I am still baffled at the amount of time and effort this 83 year old elderly woman is putting into hiring and meeting with lawyers and going to court to sue AEG for something she should've been doing for her son. She is blaming AEG for not caring about her son's health when she obviously didn't either. If Katherine would've put this much time and effort into helping MJ with his medical and emotional problems he would still be here today. She didn't do much to help him then because she 'didn't want to hear bad news' according to her own testimony in court. Her son was in rehab in 1993 and told the world he needed help, yet his own Mother didn't want to hear about it because it was 'bad news'.. She hired professional doctors, addiction specialists, pain specialists and sleep experts for this AEG trial, but she never hired anyone like that for her son when he was suffering with it for over 25 years

 

[jaydom7]

Katherine claims she 'heard' Murray had 7 or 8 kids and thought his money should go to his kids.. that was a cop out excuse. She is well aware he has no current medical license, so how else would he be making this money to support his kids if not capitalizing off his crime?

 

[serendipity]

Lol, Tygger. Yea, Katherine was going to release a statement that she rejects restitution because she wants bigger damages. Lol

Anyway, the kids didn't agree to anything, they weren't even asked.

 

[elusive moonwalker]

Excuses excuses excuses. very tiring and ruining all these threads. its like groundhog day "where do your loyalties lie"

 

[Virre]

Kids were never asked.

And what do troubles me is.. Calabasas isn´t next door to court in DownTown LA. Katherine should have been home with the kids instead of going back and forth to court, takes at least 1 hour to get there with Los Angeles traffic. It´s been taken a lot of quality time from the children because of that, when they needed her the most.

 

[serendipity]

Kids were never asked.

And what do troubles me is.. Calabasas isn´t next door to court in DownTown LA. Katherine should have been home with the kids instead of going back and forth to court, takes at least 1 hour to get there with Los Angeles traffic. It´s been taken a lot of quality time from the children because of that, when they needed her the most.

Yes, especially considering what happened with Paris.

 

[marebear]

Restitution should not have been dropped. I feel bad for the kids because whatever Murray tries to do it will be them that will suffer the most. They don't need to see their father's killer do books or interviews or whatever sick thing he has in his head. He only served 2 years. This was the only way to stop him from profiting of killing Michael. The man thinks he did nothing wrong.

People always say that fans put Michael on a pedestal and that he can do no wrong. That people need to see that he had flaws and he was a human being like all of us. Well people need to stop looking at Katherine as someone who can do no wrong. Not getting restitution was a big mistake. If things are not about money as they say at least it would have been like a protection for Michael in the future. It's like nobody is interested in doing that. Just because Michael is not here doesn't mean his rights and integrity should not be protected.

It's not about hating the Jacksons. I don't want to see Murray make a dime off of killing Michael. It's wrong.

 

[Bubs]

Kids were never asked.

And what do troubles me is.. Calabasas isn´t next door to court in DownTown LA. Katherine should have been home with the kids instead of going back and forth to court, takes at least 1 hour to get there with Los Angeles traffic. It´s been taken a lot of quality time from the children because of that, when they needed her the most.

She has put so much effort on this AEG case. She is supposed to be kids guardian, but she spends her time, if not plotting against the estate, then trying to extort money out of people who didn't kill her son. I so wish she had put all that effort getting CM, but unfortunately he has no money, even thou he is killer of her son.

I don't know about that quality time, as she has never be seen with them outside other than when kids are made to support those shady Jackson deals, and she has her rooms in different wing than kids so they don't bother her.

 

[krikzil]

Krizkil, I do not want to participate in the discussion regarding rejection of restitution for the reasons I already stated. My response was only to negate the comment I was responding to. Other posters are free to list any action the doctor took to directly profit from his fatal crime after release that restitution would successfully hinder.

As for success as a reason for an action, I mentioned that previously regarding the AEG trial. As there was NO realistic guarantee AEG could successfully be extorted for billions as some believe, what was the true purpose of the lawsuit? I do not remember reading a response.

Can't think of a reason either? As to the latter, huh?

 

[twinklEE]

She has put so much effort on this AEG case. She is supposed to be kids guardian, but she spends her time, if not plotting against the estate, then trying to extort money out of people who didn't kill her son. I so wish she had put all that effort getting CM, but unfortunately he has no money, even thou he is killer of her son.

I don't know about that quality time, as she has never be seen with them outside other than when kids are made to support those shady Jackson deals, and she has her rooms in different wing than kids so they don't bother her.

Considering the fact that she has her room in a whole different area of the house, and the events that took place in summer of 2012, dont be fooled into thinking that she was dragged to Arizona against her free will and held there. The fact that it didnt even occur to her to let those three children know where she was speaks volumes. Unless she was held at gunpoint/knifepoint and drugged by her cubs, there is no excuse for why she thought it was okay to stay away for as long as she did, without calling them once.
Considering all these things I think it's safe to say she is a guardian on paper only. She is certainly no parent to them, nor does she wanna be bothered by them. I wonder how often those kids are being told they are loved since Michael died? My guess is not so often, if at all. This sort of detachment is one of the reasons that drove Paris into Debbie. In the hopes of "finding" something in her she was missing at home. Keep in mind that Deborah was merely a stranger to her but the girl still went ahead and sought her out, to fill the void that was left by Michael. The void that Katherine couldn't and wouldn't fill.
Can you imagine going from having a parent like Michael who made sure he told those kids they were his life every single hour, to living with someone like Katherine who lives in a separate area of the house, because she doesnt want to be bothered? No wonder a sensitive young giel tried to take her life 4 months ago admist of this type of a foolery.