Latest on MJJC

Open General discussion - Katherine Jackson vs AEG

Status
Not open for further replies.
ivy said:
I would personally separate the general perception from his artistic aspect. For example I know many people who think Michael was an addict but a very talented person. So public perception about him might have been affected by this trial and any other negative story out there. It's just that his artistic legacy is so strong and so established that it doesn't get harmed
Click to expand...

beside paid experts who were paid to say he was an addict no witness said he was , at least none said he was getting anything not medically needed . We shall see what the jury thinks
 
Soundmind said:
beside paid experts who were paid to say he was an addict no witness said he was , at least none said he was getting anything not medically needed . We shall see what the jury thinks
Click to expand...

As far as I know, Randy testified for free that MJ was druggie and in need to so many interventions that he couldn't remember when and where those interventions were staged and who was or wasn't there.

Didn't Katherine too testify that mother is the last person to know if son is druggie :eyeroll:
 
Bubs said:
As far as I know, Randy testified for free that MJ was druggie and in need to so many interventions that he couldn't remember when and where those interventions were staged and who was or wasn't there.

Didn't Katherine too testify that mother is the last person to know if son is druggie :eyeroll:
Click to expand...

true... and if her son Steven did 10 interventions allegedly why didn't she know? she's full of it
 
jaydom7 said:
I think you are wrong.. it hasn't hurt anything. Did you see the recent sold out shows at MJ One in Vegas? during his birthday? this trial hasn't hurt anything. Most folks I speak to aren't even following it because the media really doesn't discuss it. Dental implants? are you kidding me??? The majority of my teeth are bridges and crowns so what does that have to do with anything? The coroner said MJ had his own natural teeth remember? so what if he had a crown or implant mostly everyone does if they've had root canals. And how is him being surrounded by bad doctors and enablers hurting him? if anything it garners sympathy that MJ couldn't trust anyone and doctors would violate their oaths for money. That doesn't hurt MJ, that hurts the bad doctors.
Click to expand...

I agree with you again. This trial will not affect his legacy to the point where it will take time to recover. NO WAY. Actually when I was watching One for Michael's birthday, there was this man next to me, and he asked the woman next to him what was happening with the trial. He sounded matter of fact, and she took a while to answer. It was nosy me who said something. I have heard no other people talking about this case. Most people know Michael died, but who is following this trial except Michael fans, I don't know.

Most Americans have dental work. Dental implants is a common thing, so that is not something that will impact his legacy. The Muarry trial and his death did make people aware of some prescription drug use. If people were listening to this trial, they will just get more information from doctors.

I still hear his music playing on the radio. I am sure One is still selling tickets. I think medical and mental issues, have no negative impacts on the legacy of dead pop stars. In fact, these things just make people more interested in them. Jimmy Hendrix is at the Grammy Museum and his music & t-shirts are still being sold. Elizabeth Taylor had several surgeries & drug & alcohol issues and we still buy her perfume. It remains a huge source of revenue. Look at all the things they said about Walt Disney, that he liked little boys which was not proven. People still buy things with his name on it. To me, the main people who will focus on negative information from the trial is the media, but they are not running all over with it, which may mean the public is not that interested.


Ivy ^^I know in reality the case was not about "learning what happened to my son/brother." I just brought up that reason because that is the explanation Katherine & Randy give when asked why they are suing AEG. It would have been so funny if after she gave that answer to Putnam he said something like, oh I thought this trial was for negligent hiring? Of course Panish would then object, and the judge will say a mother has the right to say she wants to know how her son died.

It seems that Gest doc on Michael with Katherine and family talking, is on CENTRIC now, from 1pm to 3pm.
 
Margaret Carrero ‏@MargaretCarrero 1h
Judge in the #Jackson negligence trial decides to move to a larger courtroom for closing arguments. Listen LIVE @KNX1070 @CBSLA

Margaret Carrero ‏@MargaretCarrero 2h
Lawyers for Katherine #Jackson to begin rebuttal this afternoon once #AEGLive rests. @KNX1070 http://cbsla.com



Snippet from LA times article (whole article in news section):
"After Metzger’s video deposition is played, AEG is expected to play a deposition from Prince Jackson, Michael’s oldest child. Prince Jackson, 16, testified for about 90 minutes earlier in the trial, detailing life with his father and the singer’s final moments."

I wonder what Prince said in his deposition that supports AEG's case, as they wouldn't play his deposition if it didn't help their case?
 
Last edited:
Re: Jacksons vs AEG- September 18, 2013 - News Only (no discussion)

Interesting.. Dr Metzger denied even knowing what MJ was given by the German doctors. Debbie Rowe put him on blast basically saying Metzger hired those doctors to give MJ propofol, so in essence it sounds like Metzger is the one that started this whole thing. He's a liar just like the rest of them.
 
@jaydom,

I agree what you said in the news thread. I mean, on one hand Dr. Metzger states that he advised Michael against using propofol as a solution to his sleep problems, on the OTHER hand he was the one who got the German doctors to give Michael propofol. What the heck kind of sense is that!!!!!!

ETA: Debbie said that Metzger was ONE of the doctors that she trusted. I wonder of Klein made her list of "trusted" doctors.
 
Big Apple2 said:
@jaydom,

I agree what you said in the news thread. I mean, on one hand Dr. Metzger states that he advised Michael against using propofol as a solution to his sleep problems, on the OTHER hand he was the one who got the German doctors to give Michael propofol. What the heck kind of sense is that!!!!!!

ETA: Debbie said that Metzger was ONE of the doctors that she trusted. I wonder of Klein made her list of "trusted" doctors.
Click to expand...

Yep! Debbie said that Klein was brilliant in his day but something happened to him, she mentioned his supposed 'illness' on twitter to some fans a while back. She had to know Klein was over medicating MJ or that MJ needed some help if she saw the medicine Klein was giving and it wasn't working. They were not making MJ healthy or better they were making him worse sounds like to me. I wouldn't be surprised if they intentionally did that to make him 'addicted' so he could continue coming back to them.
 
jaydom7 said:
I wouldn't be surprised if they intentionally did that to make him 'addicted' so he could continue coming back to them.
Click to expand...
I can definitely see Arnold Klein being that sort of person. AND:

if it's true, as one of the doctor's previously testified about Michael asking him "for a shot of Demerol for the road," I have no problem believing that Michael would have learned that type of behavior from none other then Arnold Klein.

I remember back in the day when fans from various fans sites would talk about "how Michael looked" when he left Klein's office.

In my opinion, Klein was just ONE on a long list of many doctors, who would have done anything Michael requested in order for Michael to remain their patient and/or friend. And all of those invitations to Neverland were just icing on the cake for some of those doctors. Just my opinion, of course.
 
Can they not make up their mind whether they play Prince's deposition or or. The latest is that they aren't.

Margaret Carrero ‏@MargaretCarrero 47m
Katherine #Jackson arrives at the courthouse for the first time in weeks; she will not be testifying in #AEGLive defense case. @KNX1070

Margaret Carrero ‏@MargaretCarrero 1h
#AEGLive lawyers will NOT play portions of Prince Jackson’s deposition as originally planned. @KNX1070 @CBSLA
 
Soundmind said:
beside paid experts who were paid to say he was an addict no witness said he was , at least none said he was getting anything not medically needed . We shall see what the jury thinks
Click to expand...

I wasn't talking about this trial specifically. I just know people who separate the artist from the person and listen to his music even thought they might not have positive perceptions about Michael. That has been my experience.
 
jaydom7 said:
I think you are wrong.. it hasn't hurt anything. Did you see the recent sold out shows at MJ One in Vegas? during his birthday? this trial hasn't hurt anything. Most folks I speak to aren't even following it because the media really doesn't discuss it. Dental implants? are you kidding me??? The majority of my teeth are bridges and crowns so what does that have to do with anything? The coroner said MJ had his own natural teeth remember? so what if he had a crown or implant mostly everyone does if they've had root canals. And how is him being surrounded by bad doctors and enablers hurting him? if anything it garners sympathy that MJ couldn't trust anyone and doctors would violate their oaths for money. That doesn't hurt MJ, that hurts the bad doctors.
Click to expand...

I referred to the dental implants as an example of how his privacy was violated--nothing else. Of course, there's nothing wrong with getting dental work and of course, no one would expect it to damage his legacy. That was not my point--just that the trial has stripped away his privacy. I think from the comments online (which may not be representative of the general 'take' on MJ from the public) but what I read is that people reject the idea of MJ as a "victim" and instead want to hold him responsible for the medical care he got.


I do hope that I am wrong, but if I give my opinion, I have to say I fear the trial has damaged his overall legacy for now--but hopefully, just short term. The problem is, there are already enough people out there who have negative opinions, so adding more negatives would not help matters.

I think the trial has damaged the standing of the Jackson family in the general public big time, so maybe they will be the biggest losers, even if they win a big award.
 
Last edited:
Margaret Carrero ‏@MargaretCarrero 1h
Katherine #Jackson arrives at the courthouse for the first time in weeks; she will not be testifying in #AEGLive defense case. @KNX1070
Expand Reply Retweet Favorite More
Margaret Carrero ‏@MargaretCarrero 1h
#AEGLive lawyers will NOT play portions of Prince Jackson’s deposition as originally planned. @KNX1070 @CBSLA
Expand
Margaret Carrero ‏@MargaretCarrero 3h
Judge in the #Jackson negligence trial decides to move to a larger courtroom for closing arguments. Listen LIVE @KNX1070 @CBSLA
Expand
Margaret Carrero ‏@MargaretCarrero 4h
Lawyers for Katherine #Jackson to begin rebuttal this afternoon once #AEGLive rests. @KNX1070 http://cbsla.com
 
ivy;3905962 said:
Margaret Carrero ‏@MargaretCarrero 1h
Katherine #Jackson arrives at the courthouse for the first time in weeks; she will not be testifying in #AEGLive defense case. @KNX1070
Expand Reply Retweet Favorite More
Margaret Carrero ‏@MargaretCarrero 1h
#AEGLive lawyers will NOT play portions of Prince Jackson’s deposition as originally planned. @KNX1070 @CBSLA
Expand
Margaret Carrero ‏@MargaretCarrero 3h
Judge in the #Jackson negligence trial decides to move to a larger courtroom for closing arguments. Listen LIVE @KNX1070 @CBSLA
Expand
Margaret Carrero ‏@MargaretCarrero 4h
Lawyers for Katherine #Jackson to begin rebuttal this afternoon once #AEGLive rests. @KNX1070 http://cbsla.com
Click to expand...

Well the last day of direct really ended on a dud after all the hoopla. I wonder what kept Katherine away. A bigger room means the judge expects more press or interested persons to tune in. Now who is up first for rebuttal--an expert?

KaRe when the court sends a message to say "we have a verdict," I could imagine how excited certain Jacksons will be.

Crillon where have you been?
 
Last edited:
A larger courtroom wow HISTory. Yes more ppls will be there this is big news.

Just maybe it will get on TV more press and media.
 
Petrarose said:
Well the last day of direct really ended on a dud after all the hoopla. I wonder what kept Katherine away. A bigger room means the judge expects more press or interested persons to tune in. Now who is up first for rebuttal--an expert?

KaRe when the court sends a message to say "we have a verdict," I could imagine how excited certain Jacksons will be.

Crillon where have you been?
Click to expand...

Petrarose, I was dealing with a few family issues...sweet of you to notice I was MIA. Just now catching up on what I missed. Sounds like this is finally the end and the jury will get the case this week. Hallelujah!
 
Last edited:
David Daniel @CNNLADavid
Via @AlanDukeCNN: AEG Live rests its defense case in Michael Jackson wrongful death trial. Jackson lawyers immediately began rebuttal. #CNN


Alan Duke @AlanDukeCNN
AEG Live rests defense in #MichaelJackson wrongful death trial. Jackson lawyers start rebuttal. Closing arguments to start Monday
 
crillon said:
Petrarose, I was dealing with a few family issues...sweet of you to notice I was MIA. Just now catching up on what I missed. Sounds like this is finally the end and the jury will get the case this week. Hallelujah!
Click to expand...

^^Ratner played it safe and mostly said "I don't recall." He could not recall where he was and what he really did. Right now if you ask him if he has a belly button, he will say "I don't recall." He is retired and decided to keep his mouth shut and enjoy his autumn years. He let Michael's dirt, if he knew of any, rest in the ridges of his mind. In other words, they got nothing from Ratner.

I wish they would say who the first rebuttal witness is and how many they intend to put on. Just saying several is not enough.
 
Petrarose said:
^^Ratner played it safe and mostly said "I don't recall." He could not recall where he was and what he really did. Right now if you ask him if he has a belly button, he will say "I don't recall." He is retired and decided to keep his mouth shut and enjoy his autumn years. He let Michael's dirt, if he knew of any, rest in the ridges of his mind. In other words, they got nothing from Ratner.

I wish they would say who the first rebuttal witness is and how many they intend to put on. Just saying several is not enough.
Click to expand...

I hate to say it, because Ratner perpetuated the notion with MJ that propofol can be a sleep aid likely giving him a high comfort level with it...but I don't blame Ratner for his "forgetfulness" one bit. At least, he kept Michael alive & competently & safely administered the propofol. As an anesthesiologist, he knew what he was doing. Keeping Michael's private business to himself--I totally respect that. Good for him.
 
Anthony McCartney @mccartneyAP
It sounds like based on the current schedule, the jury will get the Jackson vs. AEG Live case on Wednesday. Then the waiting begins...

Anthony McCartney ?@mccartneyAP 2m
It sounds like the rebuttal case will be wrapped up tomorrow and the jury will be given its instructions on Friday morning.

Anthony McCartney ?@mccartneyAP 2m
Dr. Metzger will be called by the plaintiffs as a live witness tomorrow to give additional testimony about his treatments on Jackson.

Anthony McCartney ?@mccartneyAP 3m
Plaintiffs started their rebuttal case and called LAPD Detective Scott Smith, whose testimony was brief.

Anthony McCartney ?@mccartneyAP 5m
AEG's final witness was Dr. Allan Metzger, whose videotaped testimony was played for the jury.

Anthony McCartney ?@mccartneyAP 8m
AEG Live rested its defense case this afternoon in the Jackson civil trial. They did not call Katherine Jackson back to the stand.
 
About Metzger: He shows Michael was happy, excited about the upcoming tour, but like Randy said he still was scared:
Metzger's testimony contradicted many accounts of Jackson as a tortured figure in his last months, forced to commit to more concerts than he was capable of doing and turning to prescription drugs to chase away his demons and find the elusive sleep he craved.

Metzger said the star was energized — and scared — by the prospect of the shows.

He said their conversation in February 2009 began with "an anxiety call" from Jackson.

"I think he was fearful because this was it and he needed to do a lot of perfectionalizing," Metzger testified. "He wanted it to be something that had never been done before."

One thing that scared Jackson, he said, was the prospect that he would not be able to sleep when he got to London to kick off the concerts.


Is Metzger telling the truth here. He still did not say yet that he sent docs to give Michael prof in Germany.
Metzger said he suggested putting him in touch with sleep therapists in London, but Jackson resisted.

In his last meeting with Jackson in April, 2009, the singer asked Metzger for intravenous sleep medication, but the doctor said he refused, telling Jackson it was dangerous and potentially life-threatening.

Basically all the doctors are acting as though they were not the ones who were giving Michael drugs. It is always some other doctor that Michael found while doctor shopping. Meanwhile the deposed doctors are the ones Michael see the most.

What could Detective Smith have said to help the defense for a rebuttal? Is it something about what he found out about Muarry?
 
qbee said:
Ivy - When are closing arguments ? does Jury get get instructions Friday before that ?
Click to expand...

from AP's tweets

tomorrow - rebuttal continues with Metzger
Friday - jury instructions
monday - closing arguments by jacksons
tuesday- closing arguments by AEG
wednesday morning - rebuttal closing by jacksons
wednesday afternoon - deliberations start.

of course if they stay on schedule
 
Severus Snape said:
Thank god this awful trial is finally going to end.

What a nightmare.
Click to expand...

I don't know but I just feel after all the hype that direct ended was such a letdown--no last witness giving a big punch to turn the case back to the fundamentals. It reminds me of when we all buy candles, water, food, etc. for Y2K, and when we wake in the morning, the world is still intact and nothing happened.
 
Snow White luvs Peter Pan said:
Whatever the result may be, I just care those vultures leave the children alone stopping going after their money or using them to make it.
Click to expand...

I think they are so greedy that even if they got awarded the full amount, it STILL wouldn't be enough. The family might even be encouraged (should they win this case) to go after the Estate again. Having money is one thing, but getting control over their brother's Estate is the elusive prize they dream about. imo
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top