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Monster - The Great Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

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Re: Monster - The Great Debate

JacksonMan said:
On this I have to agree, not counting the ad lybs. I love the song Monster, but the vocals are not too impressive in terms of skill level.
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Which is pretty logical, since a effin' amateur named JM is singing it. It all makes sense. Breaking News is just as weak in terms of vocals and well...Keep your head up too, it's a very simple ballad and lacks MJ's magic totally.
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

Staffordshire Bullterrier said:
Which is pretty logical, since a effin' amateur named JM is singing it. It all makes sense. Breaking News is just as weak in terms of vocals and well...Keep your head up too, it's a very simple ballad and lacks MJ's magic totally.
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well I think the vocals are kind of weak on shout as well not counting the chorus. I believe it's MJ, trying to sound different from himself. When MJ doesn't sound like himself, he doesn't sound as good.
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

Michael's vocals in the chorus of Shout is not weak IMO. He is rapping the song, we can't expect him to do his typial stuff in such style.

"How can we preach, when all we make...." lines are NOT weak at all.
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

Pentum said:
Michael's vocals in the chorus of Shout is not weak IMO. He is rapping the song, we can't expect him to do his typial stuff in such style.

"How can we preach, when all we make...." lines are NOT weak at all.
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No I said the vocals were weak, not counting the chorus. The chorus sounds amazing. That's just regular MJ with the pitch lowered.

I do however think the "how can we preach" is pretty weak. I think it sounds just like the way he's singing in Breaking News during the verses.

I thin in Mj's later years he was having trouble with the more feminine vocals. I don't think he could hit certain notes or note combinations anymore. You notice that on Invincible all feminine back up vocals were sung by somebody else.

I'm not saying he completely lost his ability to sing the more feminine vocals. I just think he lost some of it. but as far as sounding growly and masculine he still had it completely.

When I listen to Blue Gangster I think he sounds terrible untill he hits the "look what you done to me baby, I can no longer smile baby." From that point forward he sounds incredible. Same on We Already Had Enough. Untill you hit the last couple minutes where he gets raspy, I think his voice sounds actually irritatingly awful. At this point in time he was still in a league of his own. He was still better than anybody else alive. He lost certain abilities and gained new abilities. His voice was simply becoming more masculine in his old age.

I still say his peak in terms of vocal abilities was late 80's and the early 90's though.
 
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Re: Monster - The Great Debate

I just have a hard time hearing Michael on Monster. The vocals are so weak and boyband-y, my ears reject it everytime. Same with Breaking News. The only thing that can convince me that this is just an over-processed MJ is if the Cascios produce those outtakes. 'Coz only a moron would buy their excuse that Michael was so satisfied with what they had, he told them to delete everything. And yet, Teddy Riley had to use Melodyne to correct off-key MJ. LOL... I can't believe Sony and the Estate got duped by the Cascios.
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

KenYeSeeChesss said:
I just have a hard time hearing Michael on Monster. The vocals are so weak and boyband-y, my ears reject it everytime. Same with Breaking News. The only thing that can convince me that this is just an over-processed MJ is if the Cascios produce those outtakes. 'Coz only a moron would buy their excuse that Michael was so satisfied with what they had, he told them to delete everything. And yet, Teddy Riley had to use Melodyne to correct off-key MJ. LOL... I can't believe Sony and the Estate got duped by the Cascios.
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the instruments sounds boy bandish, but not the vocals at all. It's not nasally or girly or anythinig like what boy bands do.
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

Even my brother who rarely listens to MJ's music went "Hey, it's true...that doesn't sound like him" after the first line of Monster.
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

Staffordshire Bullterrier said:
The way the singer says Michael Jackson in BN is very off. The way words are pronounced, that would never change.. i don't believe it for a second.
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This is James Porte singing. Can't you hear the difference between the voices?
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

@KenYeSeeChesss: how can he know his voice if he rarely listens to him?
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

Yeah that is James Porte. He sings along with a lot of the back up vocals on BN, and I think Monster as well. This probably only added to the confusion.

If it does turn out that we've been duped, I will feel very very very angry. And if we have been duped it will be proven in the next few weeks. It probably would have happened already, which is the biggest reason I think it's MJ.
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

ivy said:
If I can answer this - we kinda discussed this on the other thread as well.

when you listen to Jason Malachi songs , YES you find a line, a sentence, a word that DOES sound like Michael (or Cascio songs like you call it). and that youtube videos pick and choose those parts and compare it to Cascio songs to make a point. (so it's a selective comparison not an objective one by the way)

However if you listen to whole Jason Malachi songs you see that some parts actually do not sound like Michael (or Cascio songs like you call it) at all.

It's kinda finding a E'Casonava picture with the correct lighting and angle etc and say it's Michael when hundred other pictures of him look obviously nothing like him.
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It's absolutely NOTHING like looking at a picture of E'Cas. Absolutely nothing like that.

Like I posted before, none of the 'believers' can post ONE vocal line, sentence, word or ANYTHING from Michael Jackson's back catalogue that sounds anything like anything in these abominations.

The vocal comparisons posted earlier are identical. They're not 'close'. They're not 'similar'. They are identical. Absolutely identical. That's the issue.

And at no stage have the 'believers' posted anything from Michael's VAST back catalogue to prove otherwise.
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

samhabib said:
It's absolutely NOTHING like looking at a picture of E'Cas. Absolutely nothing like that.

Like I posted before, none of the 'believers' can post ONE vocal line, sentence, word or ANYTHING from Michael Jackson's back catalogue that sounds anything like anything in these abominations.
.
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there isn't any other MJ track which sound like SHOUT, 2000 watts, Threatened or Best of Joy or Hollywood Tonight.

MJ loved to play with his voice more and more...

Listen again Threatened...you'll see.

the vocals on thretened like in SHout appear weak and over porocessed
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

Why the hell is Best of Joy even mentioned in this thread!? The people who believe it doesn't sound like Michael on Best of Joy has not heard a lot of MJ music. I dare to say this.
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

Pentum said:
Why the hell is Best of Joy even mentioned in this thread!? The people who believe it doesn't sound like Michael on Best of Joy has not heard a lot of MJ music. I dare to say this.
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come on...

there are not many songs where he sounds like "best of joy"

perhaps butterflies ?
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

loka said:
there isn't any other MJ track which sound like SHOUT, 2000 watts, Threatened or Best of Joy or Hollywood Tonight.

MJ loved to play with his voice more and more...

Listen again Threatened...you'll see.
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Completely incorrect. 2,000 Watts sounds like Shout. Threatened sounds like any number of Michael Jackson songs - like any of the Jerkins tracks that prop-up the front-end of Invincible. Best of Joy's falsetto is identical to his falsetto in Someone Put Your Hand Out. Absolutely identical.

Hollywood Tonight sounds like quintessential Michael. The vocal track has been ruined by Teddy Riley in an effort to make it sound like the ridiculous Cascio tracks. But it's quintessential Michael Jackson.

Michael liked to play with his voice? Not to the extent that he wanted to sound like a weak, limp amateur he didn't.
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

Korgnex said:
This is James Porte singing. Can't you hear the difference between the voices?
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James Porte? So they claim...i don't hear him anywhere. I heard a song of his, i don''t hear his vocals on BN at all, i do hear Jason though.

samhabib said:
It's absolutely NOTHING like looking at a picture of E'Cas. Absolutely nothing like that.

Like I posted before, none of the 'believers' can post ONE vocal line, sentence, word or ANYTHING from Michael Jackson's back catalogue that sounds anything like anything in these abominations.

The vocal comparisons posted earlier are identical. They're not 'close'. They're not 'similar'. They are identical. Absolutely identical. That's the issue.

And at no stage have the 'believers' posted anything from Michael's VAST back catalogue to prove otherwise.
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Exactly, abominations is the right word for it as well, i agree.And indeed....identical.

loka said:
there isn't any other MJ track which sound like SHOUT, 2000 watts, Threatened or Best of Joy or Hollywood Tonight.

MJ loved to play with his voice more and more...

Listen again Threatened...you'll see.

the vocals on thretened like in SHout appear weak and over porocessed
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Why Best of Joy and Hollywood Tonight? HT only has been autotuned and you can clearly hear MJ...again, why is Best of joy being mentioned? That is as crystal clear as it can get that its Michael. In terms of vocals, there's plenty of songs that sound like it.

Pentum said:
Why the hell is Best of Joy even mentioned in this thread!? The people who believe it doesn't sound like Michael on Best of Joy has not heard a lot of MJ music. I dare to say this.
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I whole heartedly agree, i haven't got the slightest clue why people are bringing that song up.
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

samhabib said:
Completely incorrect. 2,000 Watts sounds like Shout. Threatened sounds like any number of Michael Jackson songs - like any of the Jerkins tracks that prop-up the front-end of Invincible. Best of Joy's falsetto is identical to his falsetto in Someone Put Your Hand Out. Absolutely identical.

Hollywood Tonight sounds like quintessential Michael. The vocal track has been ruined by Teddy Riley in an effort to make it sound like the ridiculous Cascio tracks. But it's quintessential Michael Jackson.

Michael liked to play with his voice? Not to the extent that he wanted to sound like a weak, limp amateur he didn't.
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come on...

try to understand our point...

let's take invincible

Mj's voice is different on Threatened and on Unbreakable

listen again Threatened

listen again the verses of SHOUT...The verses of Monster sound more like MJ than the verses on SHOUT

give it a try !
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

loka said:
come on...

there are not many songs where he sounds like "best of joy"

perhaps butterflies ?
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??????????????

Someone Put Your Hand Out - go listen to it and forget about BoJ.
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

Pentum said:
??????????????

Someone Put Your Hand Out - go listen to it and forget about BoJ.
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I know this track since 1992 and you're right.

the falsetto is the same but the prononciation is not exactly the same

on BOJ, you have the "bee gees" feeling that is unique in MLJ's career imo...

just an other example of what MJ was able to do with his voice.
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

loka said:
come on...

try to understand our point...

let's take invincible

Mj's voice is different on Threatened and on Unbreakable

listen again Threatened

listen again the verses of SHOUT...The verses of Monster sound more like MJ than the verses on SHOUT

give it a try !
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Try to understand your point? Your point is, in a nutshell:

"Michael Jackson sounds completely different on the Cascio songs. Hence, that is proof that it's Michael Jackson."

Forgive me for not wanting to agree with that.

Monster sounds absolutely nothing like Michael Jackson. Absolutely nothing like him. Shout is undoubtedly Michael Jackson. It's a ridiculous comparison. One sounds like a weak, limp amateur. One sounds like the greatest vocalist of the 20th century. That's how big the discrepancy is. You have to have some knowledge of his spoken voice to decipher who the vocalist is on Shout. Anyone who knows what he sounds like when he talks knows it's him.

Monster, on the other hand, is performed by a completely different human being. He suddenly sounds 30 years younger? With a higher voice than he's had for the best part of 20 years of his career? With a vibrato that flies all over the place?! You believe that if you want to. I don't.
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

loka said:
I know this track since 1992 and you're right.

the falsetto is the same but the prononciation is not exactly the same

on BOJ, you have the "bee gees" feeling that is unique in MLJ's career imo...

just an other example of what MJ was able to do with his voice.
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The term is 'phrasing'. Not 'pronunciation'. His pronunciation is ALWAYS the same. His phrasing changes from track to track. But it's CLEARLY the same voice.
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

loka said:
I know this track since 1992 and you're right.

the falsetto is the same but the prononciation is not exactly the same

on BOJ, you have the "bee gees" feeling that is unique in MLJ's career imo...

just an other example of what MJ was able to do with his voice.
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WOO, i thought I was the only one who felt a Bee Gees feel to the song :D
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

God I'm just listening to Monster on Spotify to remind myself how disgusting it is. The ridiculous high note at 3.50 where he sings 'Say you wanna be a starrrr...' - people are claiming that that is Michael Jackson? Unbelievable. Absolutely unbelievable.

I tell you what... find me one track in the whole of Michael Jackson's incredible VAST back catalogue that sounds ANYTHING like that and I'll stop posting.
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

samhabib said:
God I'm just listening to Monster on Spotify to remind myself how disgusting it is. The ridiculous high note at 3.50 where he sings 'Say you wanna be a starrrr...' - people are claiming that that is Michael Jackson? Unbelievable. Absolutely unbelievable.

I tell you what... find me one track in the whole of Michael Jackson's incredible VAST back catalogue that sounds ANYTHING like that and I'll stop posting.
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yeah, that bit you are talking about at 3:50 there is no way that's him, it suggests he was onto the addlibs stage if that was really him, like hell he was or they wouldn't need to post in other addlibbs from old tracks. Not only the vocals but i actually believe the music and the whole works is totally fake and all 100% created after june 25th. Michael may well have recorded some stuff there, as it's said, but i don't believe this is that stuff. It's a shame people are saying this is there favorite song on the album, which they can do it's their opinion, but songs like hollywood tonight, BOJ etc are far stronger compositions, and are in the same musical style as the MJ classics that changed the world, but people prefer these boy band style songs out of the album, oh dear...........
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

I don't know what to think after reading this thread :S
I did like the song, not my fave on MICHAEL, but i thought it was good. But now i don't know.
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

MJultimatemusiclegen said:
yeah, that bit you are talking about at 3:50 there is no way that's him, it suggests he was onto the addlibs stage if that was really him, like hell he was or they wouldn't need to post in other addlibbs from old tracks. Not only the vocals but i actually believe the music and the whole works is totally fake and all 100% created after june 25th. Michael may well have recorded some stuff there, as it's said, but i don't believe this is that stuff. It's a shame people are saying this is there favorite song on the album, which they can do it's their opinion, but songs like hollywood tonight, BOJ etc are far stronger compositions, and are in the same musical style as the MJ classics that changed the world, but people prefer these boy band style songs out of the album, oh dear...........
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i know. it's quite sad sony has to drag down the standard that michael set so high in his life in order to fit into today's music scene.

whose music tops the chart these days? katy perry? rihanna? kesha? justin bieber?
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

Wow! Amazing discussion... I'm speechless!

But a few minutes ago I fell almost off my chair by laughing so hard :
when people are emotional they say the funniest things :
someone (I will not reveal who it was ;) ) said : 2000 Watts sound exactly like Shout!!!
That is .... no words, I am KO.
 
Re: Monster - The Great Debate

Garden said:
someone (I will not reveal who it was ;) ) said : 200 Watts sound exactly like Shout!!!
That is .... no words, I am KO.
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The production is nearly identical. The vocals are nearly identical. And anyone who claims otherwise is lying through their teeth. They were recorded during the same session and sound like two songs recorded by the same man.

But you can listen to 'Monster' and dance around listening to the 'King of Pop' once again. Or Jason Malachi, as I call him.
 
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