Forbes magazine writer saw them, I'm not clear as to whether they are part of court documents, but it seems like they may be so it should be published. If Branca has nothing to hide, why not?
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Information about Michael's previous wills / Scandalously Boring Truth About Michael Jackson's Will
- Thread starter ivy
- Start date
Forbes magazine writer saw them, I'm not clear as to whether they are part of court documents, but it seems like they may be so it should be published. If Branca has nothing to hide, why not?
MIST
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They still have no legal standard and there is still the older almost identical will
Don't Be Messin' 'Round Jacksons
IMO implying that the Jacksons had anything to do with Michael's death is outrageous & there are no facts that came out in trial to support that at all. LAPD (Det Martinez) did limit the investigation, I think purposefully to conceal who was there at the house that morning by erasing & not collecting surveillance footage. Good blog here about the missing surveillance footage here:
http://whathappenedjune25.wordpress.com/
Although I feel that we learned alot from the trial, there are many unanswered questions.
The Jacksons did not hire Murray, AEG did. Hopefully Lloyds of London pays them nothing. The Jacksons had nothing to do with giving Michael propofol every night.
Bubs
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It is as outrageous as than implying someone else murdered Michael, other than Murray.
What I meant that Jackson's have as much to gain than anyone else if Michael was murdered by............
After all, they are fighting tooth and nail that MJ died instate (LaToya) or current Will is fake (Randy & Co).
Btw, you seem to look for info that ONLY supports your theory of conspiracy and leave out/ignore FACTS.
Btw, as far as I know, Michael wanted Murray and AEG were to pay his salary from Michael's share of the money.
Basically Michael hired Murray, just like he hired Kenny Ortega for TII.
Memefan
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The Jacksons are betting MJ put them in this imaginary 2005 will in exchange for them showing up in Santa Maria. That's the basis of their defaming campaign.
But they are not just claiming there's a more recent will, they are accusing Branca & co of faking the 2002 will
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You know, this is very flawed logic. This sounds exactly like people who pop up under every article about PPB and demand the DNA test. "If they are Michael children, why not?" Simple. Because it is not public's business.
In case of the wills, these documents have nothing to do with me, you and public in general. They were submitted in court. These are not the wills that were taken into probation. Thus, the documentation stays private. Exactly like Estate's accounting will state private after the probate is over, because the Estate is not a public company.
Honestly this conspiracy theories are getting crazier by the minute
It's really really important to understand that there's 30 day to file a will and 120 days to challenge a will. On the 121th day it doesn't matter, it was over. So there's no reason to "kill" Peter Lopez after that time period. So "they killed Peter Lopez because he had a new will" can easily be debunked by "it was after 120 days, Peter Lopez's death would have made no difference because the deadlines was already over".
It's also important to point out that it's only a bunch of fans that dreamed this theory. You haven't seen Catherine Bach being suspicious of her husbands death or Jacksons saying similar stuff. It's simply in the heads of some people.
Furthermore as it's pointed out any new will would have 3 witnesses and a bunch of new executors but no one ever came forward with such knowledge. The claims of bribe etc is also again the imagination of some people with no basis. I mean similarly I can say "green martians abducted the will". The Lopez will theory is as baseless as green Martians theory.
Also don't forget Raymone Bain who said she asked twice after the Sony / ATV loan structure & custody deal with Debbie Rowe if Michael needed to update his will and Michael said her no. This is the time period that Lopez was working for Michael and this is the time period that Michael supposedly updated his will. You have Michael's manager Raymone Bain saying that he already had a will that he was happy with and twice turned down the offer to update / draft a new will. Now Raymone Bain who is still suing the Estate for $44 Million is being paid of or blackmailed to say that? Of course not she's butting heads with the Estate with no fear and she believes she's not being paid for her work.
So yeah this is just a fantasy of some people with no basis whatsoever.
Plus Jacksons ever changing claims is making this like it's an attempt to throw anything and hoping that something will stick. I mean look "he had a newer will", "the 2002 will was forged", "he wanted to die intestate". I mean which is it? Jacksons is flip flopping and losing every claim. Wills going back to the 80s or at least 95 shows he didn't want to die intestate, 3 older similar wills as well as the trust documents that say the same shows that 2002 will was not forged or there was no need to forge it as the 3 older wills were the same. "He had a newer will" is just the wishful thinking or conspiracy theory of some with nothing even remotely to support it.
It's really really important to understand that there's 30 day to file a will and 120 days to challenge a will. On the 121th day it doesn't matter, it was over. So there's no reason to "kill" Peter Lopez after that time period. So "they killed Peter Lopez because he had a new will" can easily be debunked by "it was after 120 days, Peter Lopez's death would have made no difference because the deadlines was already over".
It's also important to point out that it's only a bunch of fans that dreamed this theory. You haven't seen Catherine Bach being suspicious of her husbands death or Jacksons saying similar stuff. It's simply in the heads of some people.
Furthermore as it's pointed out any new will would have 3 witnesses and a bunch of new executors but no one ever came forward with such knowledge. The claims of bribe etc is also again the imagination of some people with no basis. I mean similarly I can say "green martians abducted the will". The Lopez will theory is as baseless as green Martians theory.
Also don't forget Raymone Bain who said she asked twice after the Sony / ATV loan structure & custody deal with Debbie Rowe if Michael needed to update his will and Michael said her no. This is the time period that Lopez was working for Michael and this is the time period that Michael supposedly updated his will. You have Michael's manager Raymone Bain saying that he already had a will that he was happy with and twice turned down the offer to update / draft a new will. Now Raymone Bain who is still suing the Estate for $44 Million is being paid of or blackmailed to say that? Of course not she's butting heads with the Estate with no fear and she believes she's not being paid for her work.
So yeah this is just a fantasy of some people with no basis whatsoever.
Plus Jacksons ever changing claims is making this like it's an attempt to throw anything and hoping that something will stick. I mean look "he had a newer will", "the 2002 will was forged", "he wanted to die intestate". I mean which is it? Jacksons is flip flopping and losing every claim. Wills going back to the 80s or at least 95 shows he didn't want to die intestate, 3 older similar wills as well as the trust documents that say the same shows that 2002 will was not forged or there was no need to forge it as the 3 older wills were the same. "He had a newer will" is just the wishful thinking or conspiracy theory of some with nothing even remotely to support it.
la_cienega
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BTW does anyone have a link to the stories about this 2005 will stuff? I've only seen it pop up recently and I can't remember the source. I believe it, but I'd be interested to track when this sudden thing came up because I don't remember it coming up before this whole abduction saga, or correct me if I'm wrong.
You had Latoya saying "Michael updated his will every 5 years" (the same Latoya didn't see Michael for years and later claimed he didn't have a will". It hinted that there could be a newer will, although didn't say it explicitly.
You had Raymone Bain debunk that saying she asked Michael twice and he said he had a will he was happy with.
After Peter Lopez's suicide , conspiracy theorists started to say "OMG Lopez had Michael's newer will that's why he was killed".
Randy Jackson and Howard Mann thinking there was a will done after the 2005 has been quite recently mentioned. During the kidnapping of Katherine, media mentioned discover of a newer will and it's effects, Forbes article that this thread is about also mentioned a similar theory and how unlikely it is and Radar Online Editor and the Write or this article on twitter confirmed that they heard such rumors but there is nothing to support it.
Nadia1981
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Honestly, i'm getting so sick of these conspiracy theories. You present them with fact after fact backed up with actual proof and still they see a conspiracy behind freaking everything! I just can't get the total disregard of the facts. So please, stop listening to Taaj or whoever is feeding you this crap and start using your own brain.
No, Branca was not fired. No, Branca was not on Sony's payroll. No, Branca did not write up the will/trust himself.
Yes, there are 4 basically identical wills all naming Branca as executor. Yes, the family contacted Branca right after MJ passed to get the will so YES, they knew there was a will and they new Branca had it. Oh no wait, now Peter Lopez has the latest will, even though no Jackson has said that, even though Lopez wasn't contacted by anyone about the will and even though he didn't present them with a will. But just in case "they" murdered Peter Lopez almost a year after MJ's death.
And i still do not get the obsession with the whole "we need to get this will invalidated" because 1. there are at least 3 other wills saying the same thing and 2. the trust is more important than the will. The trust was made in 1995 so... that one is fake too?
The 2002 will is 'fake' because the place of signing is not correct. Why are the other 3 wills fake? Hmmmm, we haven't thought about that but let me talk to my siblings and i'm sure we'll come up with some ridiculous excuse.
By the way, Jermaine is on record saying how brilliant the will/trust is and he went on and on about how Branca is a good friend and how he is totally handling according to Michael's wishes. Oh yeah, but I'm sure the evil Branca made him say all these things.
And Randy is delusional if the thinks Michael would leave him in charge of his Estate after Michael himself told in court how Randy tried to get his greedy hands on his money and catalogue. But hey, i'm pretty sure Branca could see into the future, knew what was gonna happen and therefor made Michael say all these things in court. You know, Branca is known for making people do things. He's making me go all nuts over BAD25!!!! The scumbag!!!! :doh:
No, Branca was not fired. No, Branca was not on Sony's payroll. No, Branca did not write up the will/trust himself.
Yes, there are 4 basically identical wills all naming Branca as executor. Yes, the family contacted Branca right after MJ passed to get the will so YES, they knew there was a will and they new Branca had it. Oh no wait, now Peter Lopez has the latest will, even though no Jackson has said that, even though Lopez wasn't contacted by anyone about the will and even though he didn't present them with a will. But just in case "they" murdered Peter Lopez almost a year after MJ's death.
And i still do not get the obsession with the whole "we need to get this will invalidated" because 1. there are at least 3 other wills saying the same thing and 2. the trust is more important than the will. The trust was made in 1995 so... that one is fake too?
The 2002 will is 'fake' because the place of signing is not correct. Why are the other 3 wills fake? Hmmmm, we haven't thought about that but let me talk to my siblings and i'm sure we'll come up with some ridiculous excuse.
By the way, Jermaine is on record saying how brilliant the will/trust is and he went on and on about how Branca is a good friend and how he is totally handling according to Michael's wishes. Oh yeah, but I'm sure the evil Branca made him say all these things.
And Randy is delusional if the thinks Michael would leave him in charge of his Estate after Michael himself told in court how Randy tried to get his greedy hands on his money and catalogue. But hey, i'm pretty sure Branca could see into the future, knew what was gonna happen and therefor made Michael say all these things in court. You know, Branca is known for making people do things. He's making me go all nuts over BAD25!!!! The scumbag!!!! :doh:
First of all the writer said "they are not publicly available" which means they are either not filed with the court or under seal. So no one would be able to get them or publish them.
Secondly Branca has no requirement to show anything to you or to us in this regard. MJ Estate is the business of the beneficiaries. As long as he answer their questions and respond to the probate judge , it's okay.
and finally I have to say I'm amused how some see Branca. The most he was accused of mishandling money / embezzlement which wasn't proven. Now the conspiracy theorist accuse him or forgery, bribe and even scaring people and "murder". Do people realize that white collar crimes such as mishandling money / embezzlement etc. is quite different from violence such as threats of bodily harm and murder? I can't help but laugh because I think some people imagine Branca as a super villain out of Marvel comics like he has a secret lair and petting a cat while he plots his next evil plan with all the intelligence and violence.
Soundmind
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One of the siblings said after his death the family did believe he was going to jail when he faced the 2005 trial. my believe they were competting among each other to win his trust hoping he would have been forced eventually to trust one of them to run his empire while he's in jail.
I followed the trial back then very closely , there were reports in 2004 about power struggle among the siblings .Tito and jackie getting into physical fights with each other over matters related to mj.
How could Randy even believe MJ would change his will in 2005 to put him in charge of his estate? a week after he was pronounced innocent Randy was using Roger to attack him , apparently he stopped communicating with them immediately after the trial , that was a real indication what he really thought of their so called support.
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Well, he did see them so Branca or team must have shared them. They must have felt a need to do so. Things do get leaked all the time especially when it concerns Michael Jackson;D, I think the public should see them. I think they're hiding something. The more they hide things like this, the more the conspiracies will grow. Hurts their reputations which is valuable especially if you are a lawyer, I would think.
shelly_webster
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"One of the siblings said after his death the family did believe he was going to jail when he faced the 2005 trial. my believe they were competing among each other to win his trust hoping he would have been forced to put his trust in one of them and eventually put him in charge of his money."
Who said that?
Who said that?
I will be brutally honest here. It doesn't hurt their reputation because all of these conspiracy theories are limited to the minds of a small number of MJ fans. Both Branca and Weitzman has been on top lawyers list for multiple years, just this year Branca got 2 awards, Estate is getting glowing reviews. So as far as the public and the industry concerned these are the highly respected people that does wonderful job.
Branca and his firm did and still do represent superstars of music and entertainment industry. They aren't losing any clients.
Meanwhile a bunch of people think Branca is the reincarnation of devil, write and repeat "stale" conspiracy theories and imagine that they are scaring Branca or having an effect on his life or executor position. They don't, not even a little bit. As Roger Friedman put it the media sees such as "crazy conspiracy theorists" and ignores them as well.
With no "hurt" of their reputation there's no need to even address such claims. Just look to the latest saga, between the Jacksons and MJ Estate. Who got hurt out of it? It surely wasn't the executors.
shelly_webster
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"With no "hurt" of their reputation there's no need to even address such claims. Just look to the latest saga, between the Jacksons and MJ Estate. Who got hurt out of it? It surely wasn't the executors. "
I believe the image of the executors was stronger after that.
I believe the image of the executors was stronger after that.
Petrarose
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jrsfan;3692728 said:
Haaaa at some point it is best to look at facts.
What I admire about you is that once you get an idea in your mind, facts that show the idea is unsound, does not change your mind. You read all the evidence that show your conspiracy theories are flawed, and yet you hold on to them, asking for more evidence. Then you get the evidence which again show your theories are unsound, and again you state back the same theory and ignore the information that you asked for. I noticed that in the other will thread and here, so your thinking is consistent in the same way that Michael's wishes spelled out in the trusts were consistent. These consistencies are already outlined here.
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la_cienega
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Whereas the Jackson's reputation... as Spike Lee said something like, "Who wants to deal with them?" recently when asked.
Then the tribute guy Andy's book really cemented that their reputation in the business is negative, especially Jermaine's.
Why not ask the Jacksons to make them public?
That's the best part about a conspiracy theory: All the evidence against the theory, is just part of the conspiracy.
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Petrarose
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Lacienega I loved it ^^. It is so appropriate and I think will make a good verbal smilie (if there is such a thing). I copied the key statement:
"A MAN WITH A CONVICTION is a hard man to change. Tell him you disagree and he turns away. Show him facts or figures and he questions your sources. Appeal to logic and he fails to see your point." So wrote the celebrated Stanford University psychologist Leon Festinger
So what have we learned: If you are convinced the will is fake, facts won't change your mind.
If you are convinced that Lopez was threatened because he had a will and the people waited after no one could challenge the will and then killed him, facts won't change your mind.
If you are convinced that Branca forged at least 2 wills and he is not showing the wills because he has something to hide, then facts won't change your mind.
If you keep citing wiki and you are convinced it is a scholarly publication, then facts won't change your mind.
If you are convinced that Jacksons are the rightful heirs of Michael's legacy and fortune, then facts won't change your mind.
"A MAN WITH A CONVICTION is a hard man to change. Tell him you disagree and he turns away. Show him facts or figures and he questions your sources. Appeal to logic and he fails to see your point." So wrote the celebrated Stanford University psychologist Leon Festinger
So what have we learned: If you are convinced the will is fake, facts won't change your mind.
If you are convinced that Lopez was threatened because he had a will and the people waited after no one could challenge the will and then killed him, facts won't change your mind.
If you are convinced that Branca forged at least 2 wills and he is not showing the wills because he has something to hide, then facts won't change your mind.
If you keep citing wiki and you are convinced it is a scholarly publication, then facts won't change your mind.
If you are convinced that Jacksons are the rightful heirs of Michael's legacy and fortune, then facts won't change your mind.
Ashtanga
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:wacko:
loveforever
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Weitzman is one of the hottest and best lawyer in Hollywood. He represents many Hollywood A-listers as recent as Justin bieber and jennifer Lopez.
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Bonnie Blue
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[youtube]8nqQgI9ollc[/youtube]
I thought that this thread was about mj's scandalously boring will, but it seems to be choc full of mysterious suicides, fraud and wiretapping, explosives, 9/11 conspiracies and dead fish. It's like walking into the twilight zone.
I thought that this thread was about mj's scandalously boring will, but it seems to be choc full of mysterious suicides, fraud and wiretapping, explosives, 9/11 conspiracies and dead fish. It's like walking into the twilight zone.
qbee
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Mod Note Thread cleaned
Please stay on topic this thead is going way beyond discussion of the Will
Take the unrelated conspiracy theory discussions to Controversy forum where they belong
Please stay on topic this thead is going way beyond discussion of the Will
Take the unrelated conspiracy theory discussions to Controversy forum where they belong
Ashtanga
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Petrarose
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haa^^.
Memefan
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Fully agree with this statement.
Definitely. When even tabloids are defending the executors' work....well you know you've lost the fight. The 2nd accounting report speaks for itself....they are doing a banging job.
EXACTLY. Casual fans are asking me the same. I am pretty blunt and tell them the Jacksons are all crazy...MJ was the only good one.
Mod Note Thread cleaned
Please stay on topic this thead is going way beyond discussion of the Will
Take the unrelated conspiracy theory discussions to Controversy forum where they belong
Funny