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Did Michael Jackson die for our sins?

marialovesmjj said:
Maybe we can get a mod in here?
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The thread stays. If people simply stop posting in it, it will drift off the first page. People are trying to make meaning out of Michael's death, and the topic is clearly of interest.

If this offends anyone, no need to read here.

Journalists have enough to do. I wouldn't worry about it.

Thank you,

Victoria
 
If i see another thread compareing MJ with Jesus or religion i'm gonna end up dieing for our sins
 
Thriller_MJ said:
If i see another thread compareing MJ with Jesus or religion i'm gonna end up dieing for our sins
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I'm sorry! Not much at all, if anything has made me laugh, since June 25. Your post DID make me laugh, so thanks.

Seriously, if this offends anyone, just go somewhere else. Fans are trying to work things through and find meaning, and it's clearly of interest. I don't think anyone here believes that Michael was literally. . .. ."you know."

Carry on,

Vic
 
Victoria83 said:
I'm sorry! Not much at all, if anything has made me laugh, since June 25. Your post DID make me laugh, so thanks.

Seriously, if this offends anyone, just go somewhere else. Fans are trying to work things through and find meaning, and it's clearly of interest. I don't think anyone here believes that Michael was literally. . .. ."you know."

Carry on,

Vic
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Well as the saying goes "Laughing is the best cure" :tease:
 
AllTheLovelyFlowers said:
This really makes us look crazy as a whole. I know I can't make the call, but I truly believe that the title of this thread needs to be changed before some media fool comes in here, sees it, and writes a crazy story that puts all of us in a really bad light.
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I agree.
 
No. Jesus did that for us already.

I do believe Michael was a child of God who tried his best to live for God and follow His Son. That kind of devotion never goes unpunished by those who are too mentally, emotionally, and spiritually blocked to understand it. And that kind of devotion is ALWAYS tested by God himself. Look at the book of Job. Michael passed all these tests because the man gave God the glory when he was up and when he was down.

But the post from the woman is very telling. This was a truly wonderful woman who allowed envy, greed, and pride to usurp her natural kindness and understanding in dealing with people whom she allowed to intimidate her from afar. That spirit has left her and now she is looking with her spiritual eyes instead of her natural ones. Michael Jackson has gained another fan in death. And because Michael Jackson allowed God to use him to spread His love, the woman is going to let love shine through her from here on out. That's God at work.

Let's not be to hard on those that have these thoughts. Really the same has been thought about lots of other wonderful people soon after their deaths: Malcolm X, Martin Luther King, Princess Diana, Mother Theresa, ect. This will be the same for those who leave this earth after Michael Jackson. And there will be widespread opposition. This is the hardest to understand when people who seem to be making a huge effort at kindness get punished.
 
As funny as this post is, there are some real parallels. Michael was a misunderstood and persecuted man - he preached peace, his message went out to the world and undoubtedly will transcend generations. He was born poor in a small house among a persecuted class of people. But the most important parallel to me is to know that many people would like to have the memory, message and image of michael disappear even after his passing. It will take people who appreciate and understand his message to help address the lies and misrepresentations. His fans will spread the word for generations to come. Of course he is no God, but just like Michael saw God in the face of children, we saw God in him.
 
Somany people who have been preaching love, forgiving, non violence, fairness and so on has been prosecuted, ridiculed and even killed.
Makes me wonder about a lot of things.
I do not think Michael was Jesus, absolutely not. But this discussion does make me wonder how we would react if Jesus did return to this earth? Get him in to pscyciatric care and drug him, is my first guess.
Michaels ideals did not fit in to this world it seems. And his willingness to stand for what he tought was right did get him in to trouble.
The man is a great inspiration when it comes to his ideals and his courage. I don`t feel the need to call him a God, as it makes his efforts less "real" in a way. Being a human, flesh blood and weakness - makes his life and his effort even more admirable, because he had the same struggles as everyone else, the same insecurities and problems. He just had the strength to try to deal with them and be a good person no matter what the world threw at him. In my opinion, that is the true reason to admire him. Because he was human, and as weak and fragile as any of us. But he was strong enough not to become bitter and cynical. That takes an incredible inner strenght.
 
Everyone sees something so special in Michael.
They see how much he struggled with every day things we take for granted.
They see how he blessed people with his gifts.
They see how much pain other put him through.
There must be a reason for all of this.
I know angels walk amongst us. Who's to say if Michael wasn't one of them?
 
interesting... there are 25 people viewing this thread, and i'm the only member the rests are guests....:scratch:
 
lifeismagical said:
As funny as this post is, there are some real parallels. Michael was a misunderstood and persecuted man - he preached peace, his message went out to the world and undoubtedly will transcend generations. He was born poor in a small house among a persecuted class of people. But the most important parallel to me is to know that many people would like to have the memory, message and image of michael disappear even after his passing. It will take people who appreciate and understand his message to help address the lies and misrepresentations. His fans will spread the word for generations to come. Of course he is no God, but just like Michael saw God in the face of children, we saw God in him.
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Totally agree. There are parallels and while I don't believe he was anything than just the greatest human like someone said I can't help debate the subject.


movingcoolcat said:
Somany people who have been preaching love, forgiving, non violence, fairness and so on has been prosecuted, ridiculed and even killed.
Makes me wonder about a lot of things.
I do not think Michael was Jesus, absolutely not. But this discussion does make me wonder how we would react if Jesus did return to this earth? Get him in to pscyciatric care and drug him, is my first guess.
Michaels ideals did not fit in to this world it seems. And his willingness to stand for what he tought was right did get him in to trouble.
The man is a great inspiration when it comes to his ideals and his courage. I don`t feel the need to call him a God, as it makes his efforts less "real" in a way. Being a human, flesh blood and weakness - makes his life and his effort even more admirable, because he had the same struggles as everyone else, the same insecurities and problems. He just had the strength to try to deal with them and be a good person no matter what the world threw at him. In my opinion, that is the true reason to admire him. Because he was human, and as weak and fragile as any of us. But he was strong enough not to become bitter and cynical. That takes an incredible inner strenght.
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See that's the thing, this thread made me think of what would happen if Jesus did return. I mean... if you believe that what it's written in the Bible is true and that he will return one day... then would we recognize him? Would we believe it or would (alleged) history repeat itself? I am one of those ppl that need scientific proof before I believe things and it just makes me wonder what the truth is/was/will be.

Again... I don't believe Mike was 'different' in that way but the parallels remain.
 
Victoria83 said:
I'm sorry! Not much at all, if anything has made me laugh, since June 25. Your post DID make me laugh, so thanks.

Seriously, if this offends anyone, just go somewhere else. Fans are trying to work things through and find meaning, and it's clearly of interest. I don't think anyone here believes that Michael was literally. . .. ."you know."

Carry on,

Vic
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Um....

*looks at some of the posts*

Yeah. :mello:

I know you're telling us to ignore it, but this is why people (not just media) think that us fans are delusional and crazy. I'll ignore it, but it's frustrating as hell..
 
Angel said:
Totally agree. There are parallels and while I don't believe he was anything than just the greatest human like someone said I can't help debate the subject.





See that's the thing, this thread made me think of what would happen if Jesus did return. I mean... if you believe that what it's written in the Bible is true and that he will return one day... then would we recognize him? Would we believe it or would (alleged) history repeat itself? I am one of those ppl that need scientific proof before I believe things and it just makes me wonder what the truth is/was/will be.

Again... I don't believe Mike was 'different' in that way but the parallels remain.
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Yes, the parallels remain. . . .

I know this thread has upset some people, but then, they do NOT have to read here? This is good topic to discuss, because it makes us think? Thinking is a good thing. . . ? As much as some people don't want it, the thread STAYS. If it's upsetting, I say with all due respect, don't read it?

Is this End Times? Just wondering what you may think about that? But, carry on, and do the best you can to cope with this loss of a wonderful human-being.

Michael was much loved. He suffered, SO much. He loved, SO much. I think we should all learn from the examples of greatness, that we encounter. We can learn a lot from the lives of others, and that includes Michael. Especially, him, as a model of good behavior, and love. Isn't it LOVE, that matters.

carry on,

Vic
 
AllTheLovelyFlowers said:
Everytime I look at the title of this thread, I get this funny feeling. This feeling that says some fans are just....I don't know.

This really makes us look crazy as a whole. I know I can't make the call, but I truly believe that the title of this thread needs to be changed before some media fool comes in here, sees it, and writes a crazy story that puts all of us in a really bad light.

Michael is not God and he certainly didn't die for our sins. We all should know that. We shouldn't have to ask that question at all.

Sorry, but this is just my opinion.
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I agree. It really weirds me out how people view him as perfection, saint like, best human to ever live etc etc. Someone else compared Michael to Mother Teresa, in regards to the admiration she received after death. This seriously boggles the mind. Mother T lived a truly self-LESS, self-LESS life. Michael had a lust for material possesions, and he had other flaws too.

I love Michael for his kind nature and his love for the world, but I really think you dishonor him when you see him with with rose colored glasses on. Just saying, I do not believe Michael reached enlightenment. All this being said, I love Michael and miss him so much. :(

This thread makes us look crazy. I know it doesnt matter what I think, but it also turns me off to the community, it just seems there a lot of people here that are out of touch with the reality of who Michael really was. Sorry, not trying to be mean but I just disagree with the attitude that there was nothing wrong with this man. I just disagree with that type of enabling attitude and I think its that type of attitude that added to his demise.

*bends over and awaits her arse kicking*
 
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I must say that I've not really paid must attention to the media, I've always just listened to MJ's music and not knowing much about him as a person. This all changed after his death, I must say like many of you that he seemed to be one of the greatest human ever lived.

After reading and watching what the media has done to him... it makes me sick, his death has really made me look at life and the world with different eyes. I've lost my faith in humans, people are so ignorant. When I think of it I do think this hate and ignorance is everywhere. We are so pathetic...
 
I agree with everything you said, Harlow! I love Michael for his music, for the inspiration he's brought to my life, and I do believe he cared deeply about helping people, he had a very kind heart and wanted to help the world, loved his family, his children, his fans, and was an overall kind human being. However, like all of us, he was flawed, and he had his issues. I do believe he lost his way in recent years, yes, due in part to everything he had to go through, but he wasn't a perfect human being. None of us are. Even the greatest among us have our problems, our weaknesses, our faults. He wasn't always completely honest about things, and managed to hurt and cut off contact with several people around him who truly cared for him, I think probably mainly due to his addictions. All that aside, he was a good and kind human being, but all of that fame, the adoration, the money, the betrayals from people who he trusted, all of those things can change a person, and not for the better. I see both the good and the bad in him, and choose to focus on the good, but I can't get on board with some of the folks who think that absolutely everything he touched turned to gold and that everything that went wrong in his life was a conspiracy against him. There is unfortunately some negative stuff that is coming out and that will come out about different aspects of Michael's life, regarding his drug use and stuff - some of it will be fabricated or exaggerated, but some of it will be truth, and it's hard for people to hear, but he wasn't perfect and was as susceptible to mental/physical problems as the rest of us.

By the way - someone mentioned it a while back, but yes, there are many people reading this thread and commenting on it on other forums. I've seen it. Just giving people more fodder to say "MJ fans are crazy", etc.
 
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I'm the one who started this thread, and I must say that I am loving the discussion! I am not a believer myself, so that I made these comparisons May seem biased, but I just Think that it was an obvious topic to discuss. And I am grateful to mods for letting it stay open! *bows*

some fans need to let these feelings come out, and while I do not believe Michael was Jesus, I do believe he acted as a prophet for humanity. He was a preacher of love and 'togetherness', and that is what I will always remember him for.

I love you, Michael.
 
The problem here is that people need to wake up and look outside their bubble they call reality. Michael Jackson is not unique for who he was, he was unique for the life he led. There are millions of people out there who are shy, creative, misunderstood and kindhearted. People who are connected with their feelings and who cares for other people. And they to suffer from society and its cruel nature. But they are not famous pop stars with money so you never hear about them.

The fan clubs are shooting themselves in the conceptual foot by allowing all this none sense to roam free in the forums.

Many see the fan community as a cult, I know because I get shit like that thrown at me by people who view the fans from the outside.

The reason they do this is all the religion they find in the fan forums. All the nutters who think Michael is Jeebus or Muhammid or some other character from religion.

Why do you think I added the atheist thread and threw some shit at some people who said some bullshit? Damage control!

Geez get out and smell the roses, lol.

If Michael Jackson turns into some Messiah myth, I am done.

There is a limit as to how far I will take this being a fan thing. I love Michael Jackson but I have a limit as to how far I wan't to take it. If it turns into a religion I am out.
 
Thank you K.O.S! Lets inject some reality back into some fans.

He was a human being who was talented and very charitable. Yes he was a victim of the media, haters and shady prosecutors but lets not pretend that he had the hardest life of anyone on this planet.

Look at the civilians in Iraq who are killed everyday, the starving children in Africa, lets look at the holocaust victims.

It's an ugly world, and it didn't start becoming ugly when Michael Jackson was born :smilerolleyes:
 
I didn’t want to say anything, but what the heck.

Michael didn’t die for ours sins. He was just a human being, just like you and I. and his time was up that is all. We all going to die soon or later. ‘’Every soul will taste death’’

We Muslims believe Jesus didn’t not die for our sins and that he’s still alive. (Peace be upon him)
 
No no no no. I see why you are making those comparisons, but please...I wish people wouldn't talk like this. He was a popstar...an amazing popstar yes, but lets not compare him to the son of God. He didn't 'die for our sins' he died because of peoples sins and people are realising they were wrong now he has gone. He was a wonderful human being, tried to be christ-like in the way he lived and, the things he said..he quoted Jesus quite a lot.. but thinking that he was a Messiah is wrong though. We are all supposed to try to be christ-like in the way we live.
 
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I think some of these last comments were very disrespectful towards the MJ-semireligious fans. While I might agree on some points, be sure to behave yourselves.
 
Was Michael a new savior? nope. Was Michael Jesus? nope. Did Michael die for our sins? You'd might wish that but: nope.

I agree with the thread starter however that Michael was a gift to humanity.
But well humanity doesn't cherish eachother often. We tend to more kill eachother than to really care in general. At least it seems we'll make it to kill the planet we're living on... well that's a whole different book.

However to me every human being is a gift or a chance... just sometimes things just go the wrong way... cuz of decisions/choices done by only humans.

There were things Michael did right and there were for sure also things Michael did wrong, I'm sure. I could/would never judge him, not even the situation he was in, cuz of simply not knowing all the facts.
I am religious, so who's bothered by that, don't read on ok.
Still I believe Michael is with God now. God is his judge so he is where it's better for him. God is the one who has each and every fact straight, no doubt, there is no fairer existence possible. But Michael is not able to take any of our sins on himself. There's no such deal like that possible... as I said God is the fairest judge. I believe like Michael now we all will be held responsible for all our choices/decisions/actions (sins?!).
 
and yeah it really is interesting how many guests are like always reading here!

cheers to our guests! ;)
 
bjoernclausen said:
I've been thinking about this for a while, and since seeing these comments from a woman on a Larry King blog (posted by Victory2004 here on MJJC), I thought I'd share what I've been feeling since Michael's death.

This is the comment:

LINDA GUNNETT
July 7th, 2009 7:20 pm ET
I watch the Michael Jackson memorial today and was very ashamed of myself for my salacious participation in viewing and reading these attempts to hurt MJ. Today, I wanted to say “Michael come back, we will be nicer this time”, but that is not true. We are mean spirited people who enjoy watching the destruction of others….even our own friends, we enjoy seeing them fail. If jesus walked this earth today imagine what we would do to him…..again,,,,,,horrifying to think of it. This should be declared a National Day of Shame, with a vow from each of us to not participate in the destruction of others. We forget with celebrities that they are persons like us with feelings and families, just like us. We have enjoyed this bloodsport with Elvis, Marilyn, Anna Nicole and many others….WHAT IS WRONG WITH US? WHY ARE WE LIKE THIS. I am sick to my stomach at my own part in this. Shame on all of us. He was a lovely and talented individuals and I cried all day thinking about how mean we were to him….I cry now writing this. http://larrykinglive.blogs.cnn.com/2...days-memorial/Are you thinking, what I am thinking?

I mean, Michael was born on Earth as a gift to humanity from God. He was a gift, a humanitarian, a lover not a fighter, a uniter of all people, races, ages, etc.
But we, humanity, destroyed him. We tore him down. We gosspied about his talents, made up lies, threw him to the ground and kicked him 'till he was no more.

Think about it: Michael was a very religious man, even Jehova's Witness as a child - and ain't that what the Jewish Faith is about? Waiting for the new saviour?

I think it was the pressure from the tabloids that killed Michael in the end. He couldn't take it. He had a lifetime of pain, but endured it for our sake.
In conclusion, did Michael die for our sins? Or maybe even - was Michael Jackson actually Jesus? The new saviour?

I am not a religious man myself, and still couldn't help notice these similarities - don't tell me no one of you guys haven't given this a thought? :agree:
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He took too much medication, went to sleep and never woke up, End of story. Stop trying to make more out of it than what happened!:doh:
 
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