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Controversial MJ Documentary Leaving Neverland [GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD]

terrell said:
Where there is smoke there is fire is true in some case; however, where there is smoke, it can be Dry ICE or FOG is also true just like if it walk like a duck, quack like a duck, it must be duck; but it can also be a PLATTAPUS.
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exactly. i'm actually a person who does that sometimes. none of us are perfect but if the truth is there and it's right in your face then people need to stop denied it. for example people keep saying none of us was there so how do we know. this right here really bothers me. when michael was a child he was use to sleeping with all his brothers in one bed room in one bed. Michael family was poor and lived in the hood. lol! if no one knows this probably means they never lived in hood or was poor.

Michael is innocent. but people,haters, and the media twist it up to make it sounds wrong.

one thing for sure this world love to twist things up to something it's not. bad or good. but it's really bothers me when people take innocent sweet stuff and make it to something evil just like Michael said.

i mean as an child Michael was told to lie about things he knew wasn't true.

we live in a twisted fallen world. everyone be careful.
 
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also kids is teach to lie. just like i said at the post up top. even Michael was told to lie as an child which he knew it was not right. Michael saw kids as innocent but sadly not all kids are innocent.

heck children lie because they scare they gonna get trouble if they tell the truth. it's a fact and i'm pretty sure we all told lies as children. we all sinners. bad seeds exists.

not all children are innocent as Michael thought that.
 
People who keep denying Michael are people who want him to be guilty. they can't stand the fact a black man owned and still sort of own this world. it's bothers them and did when he became an superstar.

Michael is and always was innocent. not innocent as an human being but innocent with this case. michael was heterosexual man who liked women. all his love songs are about women.
 
even Michael didn't have an childhood,went though trumra, and was childlike agree with everyone saying he shouldn't called himself peter pan. he should of retired from that name and called himself something else.
 
i take that back. i think he could of kept the peter pan image for the children. but when it came to his "adult" self he shouldn't used it.
 
Chrissy Teigen is enraged!!! lol

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">they&#8217;ve taken to Instagram! most Q people are trumpers. But the Michael Jackson Q people, oh, they exist too and let me tell you, it&#8217;s almost weirder. <a href="https://t.co/bihNq6hXrt">pic.twitter.com/bihNq6hXrt</a></p>&mdash; christine teigen (@chrissyteigen) <a href="https://twitter.com/chrissyteigen/status/1187429563325747200?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 24, 2019</a></blockquote>
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Such a vile hypocrite:
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">WATER SLIDE THAT GOES THROUGH A SHARK TANK!? eff yea time to get my pedo on!! <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/solorider?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#solorider</a></p>&mdash; christine teigen (@chrissyteigen) <a href="https://twitter.com/chrissyteigen/status/57547187638386689?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">April 11, 2011</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Right side of the history&#55357;&#56881;&#55358;&#56618; <a href="https://t.co/xcR1vU2xEm">pic.twitter.com/xcR1vU2xEm</a></p>&mdash; Mr. Bean (@AnanyaShree9) <a href="https://twitter.com/AnanyaShree9/status/1186795516555694080?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 23, 2019</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">People are so crazy.... &#55357;&#56900; <a href="https://t.co/e5CiNEIpI0">pic.twitter.com/e5CiNEIpI0</a></p>&mdash; Susan OBrien (@AuntShueForReal) <a href="https://twitter.com/AuntShueForReal/status/1186707365569146880?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 22, 2019</a></blockquote>
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Patricia Arquette's just as enraged!!! lol She blocked all #MJFam members she came across.
 
These fools dont realise that commenting on a subject without knowing the facts at best makes them look ignorant and uneducated and at worst makes them look like a member of a lynchmob.

They are prob too stupid to either know or care.
 
I can&#8217;t believe this is really a thing!

I am not always for taking the high road but I think in this instance it would have been better. Teigen and Legend have their view on Michael. That is their right. Just as we have our right to ours.

But for us to be lumped in with the Trump cult members saddens me.

Whatever is being said about Teigen and Legend does not seem to be credible and we did not need to latch on to it. Their true &#8216;fall&#8217; will come, and when it does we can let the public draw its own conclusions without piling on. It does not help us.
 
Okay can we please not put politics in this. this don't have crap do with it and wish some fans stop doing that.
 
Big Apple NYC said:
Apparently, they are being "accused" of being a part of Jeffrey Epstein's Island. She said that she has to read SEVERAL times a day on social media, about her, John AND whatever was going on, on Epstein's Island.

A lot of folks are responding to her "anguish and hurt," by repeating John's words, those words being:

"I have no reason to not believe the people accusing you!" (Similar to the remarks John Legend made regarding LN.) Now homegirl is getting a SMALL taste as to how it feels to be falsely accused and she doesn't like it one bit!!!
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I'm sorry they are being falsely accused. But, those words from Legend were very cynical and cruel, beside being fundamentally wrong. I can't blame the fans who are quoting them TBH.

And it looks stupid that Teigen is enraged with people for quoting something Legend actually meant. It's quite obvious the fans are just being ironic in order to point out their hypocrisy (and the dangers of rushing to judgement). The couple had no problem judging others without asking for evidence or credibility (or reason...), but they want fair and reasonable treatment for themselves when they are in a similar situation.

You know what, they could also take this opportunity to learn from it, admit to having been wrong, emphasise the universal importance of reason and presumption of innocence, perhaps even say sorry.
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="de"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Cut to the chase: it's all about the money. Always has been, always will be. Looking for any and all loopholes, just like when Wade committed perjury by claiming he didn't know MJ had an estate after he had met with them to discuss Cirque. &quot;Victim&quot; portrayal is disingenuous. <a href="https://t.co/UFfKHK9kO0">https://t.co/UFfKHK9kO0</a></p>&mdash; Leaving Neverland Facts (@NeverlandFacts) <a href="https://twitter.com/NeverlandFacts/status/1187787100323635201?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">25. Oktober 2019</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="de"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Mute who? <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/MichaelJackson?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#MichaelJackson</a>. This is what people love to do for Halloween. They couldn't care less what woke mob thinks. <a href="https://t.co/xEIR45DdsB">https://t.co/xEIR45DdsB</a></p>&mdash; Leaving Neverland Facts (@NeverlandFacts) <a href="https://twitter.com/NeverlandFacts/status/1187784399930064897?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">25. Oktober 2019</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="de"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Yes!!! 3+ decades later and Michael Jackson is still king! <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/BuyThriller?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#BuyThriller</a> <a href="https://t.co/wXIYd4D3Px">https://t.co/wXIYd4D3Px</a></p>&mdash; andjustice4some (@andjustice4some) <a href="https://twitter.com/andjustice4some/status/1187810829074223104?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">25. Oktober 2019</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="de"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Amen <a href="https://twitter.com/HereWeGoAgain58?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@HereWeGoAgain58</a> &#128591;&#127995; <a href="https://t.co/YSDX2ED4wt">https://t.co/YSDX2ED4wt</a> <a href="https://t.co/2s3QAtsJMX">pic.twitter.com/2s3QAtsJMX</a></p>&mdash; MJJJusticeProject (@MJJJusticePrjct) <a href="https://twitter.com/MJJJusticePrjct/status/1187787652398903296?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">25. Oktober 2019</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="de"><p lang="en" dir="ltr"><a href="https://twitter.com/jmoffettmjm?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@jmoffettmjm</a>... ‘Jonathan ‘Sugarfoot’ Moffett: Michael and Me’ <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/MichaelJackson?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#MichaelJackson</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/MJInnocent?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#MJInnocent</a> <a href="https://t.co/WaYIOEeTPF">https://t.co/WaYIOEeTPF</a></p>&mdash; MartyFlan (@invinciblekop) <a href="https://twitter.com/invinciblekop/status/1187113032423542789?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">23. Oktober 2019</a></blockquote>
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ozemouze said:
I'm sorry they are being falsely accused. But, those words from Legend were very cynical and cruel, beside being fundamentally wrong. I can't blame the fans who are quoting them TBH.

And it looks stupid that Teigen is enraged with people for quoting something Legend actually meant. It's quite obvious the fans are just being ironic in order to point out their hypocrisy (and the dangers of rushing to judgement). The couple had no problem judging others without asking for evidence or credibility (or reason...), but they want fair and reasonable treatment for themselves when they are in a similar situation.

You know what, they could also take this opportunity to learn from it, admit to having been wrong, emphasise the universal importance of reason and presumption of innocence, perhaps even say sorry.
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Falsely accused or not, the rumour is out there! "If there's smoke, there must be fire.", they say. Well, we're using the same measure they used for Michael, so it's good for them. I've told myself earlier this year that if I read anything negative about any of those Michael Jackson detractors, I'd automatically believe it without asking myself any question. I know this might sound babish or vindictive, but that's exactly what they've all done to Michael earlier this year. Using the same balance they've used for Michael is therefore appropriate and understandable. Maybe some of them will grow from that.
 
Arckangel;4272850 said:
Falsely accused or not, the rumour is out there! "If there's smoke, there must be fire.", they say. Well, we're using the same measure they used for Michael, so it's good for them. I've told myself earlier this year that if I read anything negative about any of those Michael Jackson detractors, I'd automatically believe it without asking myself any question. I know this might sound babish or vindictive, but that's exactly what they've all done to Michael earlier this year. Using the same balance they've used for Michael is therefore appropriate and understandable. Maybe some of them will grow from that.
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You see Lisa Boom being sued by Rose McGown. Karma.

//www.shockya.com/news/2019/10/24/lisa-bloom-named-federal-racketeering-suit-weinstein/

[FONT=&amp]In an earthshaking suit filed in U.S. district court in California, Harvey Weinstein and Lisa Bloom are named, and are charged with conspiring &#8220;to seek and suppress information about other women who might reveal his misconduct, harm his reputation, and potentially report his sexual misconduct,&#8221; the lawsuit claims. &#8220;Together, they worked in concert for more than a year to silence Weinstein&#8217;s victims and the journalists who were reporting Weinstein&#8217;s abuses.&#8221;​
[FONT=&amp]According to the L.A. Times, the suit quotes heavily from the two Lisa Bloom and Harvey Weinstein books, She Said and Catch and Release, and the books corroborate her claims.[/FONT][FONT=&amp]The book She Said detailed a memo from Lisa Bloom to Harvey Weinstein in which she mocked her past clients for being &#8220;crazy liars&#8221; and said, &#8220;I&#8217;m your Girl!&#8221; for destroying Rose McGowan&#8217;s reputation ahead of her going public with her claims that Weinstein raped her. Bloom was working for Weinstein at a rate of $895 per hour and is believed to have been hoping for a TV deal as well.[/FONT][FONT=&amp]In the more recent book Catch and Release, Ronan Farrow described Bloom misrepresenting the fact that she was working for Weinstein, and ratting him out to Weinstein who than got his story killed at NBC. (The story eventually ran in The New Yorker and won a Pulitzer Prize.)[/FONT]​
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="de"><p lang="und" dir="ltr">- &#127802;&#127802;&#127802; <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/MJ?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#MJ</a> <a href="https://t.co/6x5LhPw1AI">pic.twitter.com/6x5LhPw1AI</a></p>&mdash; loripetty (@loripetty) <a href="https://twitter.com/loripetty/status/1187957844470984704?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">26. Oktober 2019</a></blockquote>
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CaptainEoLove85 said:
Sent Teigen the Square One doc. Even if she doesn't watch it, maybe others will see it and check it out.
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Yep, that's a good idea to use their platform to advertise Square One, thanks!

The funny thing is many people only quoted Legend's words to them ("I have no reason not to believe them") and said nothing else. Why get furious about others because of your own words? You can just admit you were wrong if it doesn't feel right anyomore.
 
Since LN was announced I have been watching social media posts from fans and how they have challenged not only the views expressed in LN but also haters, ignorant people or frankly stupid people. I don't do social media but I have to admire the incredible fight for MJ.

However there is one thing I take away from reading those posts. Any discussion always descends into abusive arguments and it is difficult to get beyond it. I would love for a MJ fan who knows all the facts to team up with a person who passionately believe he is guilty to make a YouTube video where they debate it, but debate it sensibly without descending into any nastiness.
 
Bink said:
Since LN was announced I have been watching social media posts from fans and how they have challenged not only the views expressed in LN but also haters, ignorant people or frankly stupid people. I don't do social media but I have to admire the incredible fight for MJ.

However there is one thing I take away from reading those posts. Any discussion always descends into abusive arguments and it is difficult to get beyond it. I would love for a MJ fan who knows all the facts to team up with a person who passionately believe he is guilty to make a YouTube video where they debate it, but debate it sensibly without descending into any nastiness.
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I agree; however, I do not want someone who think he is guilty based on "well, I was abused" or trying to judge MJ based on someone's else case . That does not make MJ guilty due to what happen that person or someone else case; if so, We can bring up cases of people who have falsely accused and someone who have experienced being falsely accused as well. debate the facts of the case and people involved and leave out BS that has nothing to do with the claims.
 
terrell said:
I agree; however, I do not want someone who think he is guilty based on "well, I was abused" or trying to judge MJ based on someone's else case . That does not make MJ guilty due to what happen that person or someone else case; if so, We can bring up cases of people who have falsely accused and someone who have experienced being falsely accused as well. debate the facts of the case and people involved and leave out BS that has nothing to do with the claims.
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Absolutely. It would need to be strictly evidence based. A calm, professional discussion about the facts of the case.
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="de"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">The Ziegler girls were thrilled to attend the Michael Jackson family Halloween party tonight at the Jackson estate. There they got to meet the awesome <a href="https://twitter.com/BJackson82?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@BJackson82</a> &amp; have dinner with the great Tom Mesereau &amp; his family. Grace also introduced herself to Paris and Blanket Jackson. <a href="https://t.co/kXYQGWocjT">pic.twitter.com/kXYQGWocjT</a></p>&mdash; John Ziegler (@Zigmanfreud) <a href="https://twitter.com/Zigmanfreud/status/1188322799372259330?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">27. Oktober 2019</a></blockquote>
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Go to John's Page for his podcast...

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="de"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Had an amazing time last night at Hayvenhurst <a href="https://t.co/VbhreliNVb">pic.twitter.com/VbhreliNVb</a></p>&mdash; Danny Wu (@dannywuyue) <a href="https://twitter.com/dannywuyue/status/1188528407954350080?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">27. Oktober 2019</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="de"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">I can sense a photobomb from a mile away. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Halloween?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Halloween</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/PugsyAdams?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#PugsyAdams</a> <a href="https://t.co/VWU1QpM3ux">pic.twitter.com/VWU1QpM3ux</a></p>&mdash; Danny Wu (@dannywuyue) <a href="https://twitter.com/dannywuyue/status/1188353397952352260?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">27. Oktober 2019</a></blockquote>
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all the right people together...
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="de"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Thrill The World, Moscow - 2019. Central Children's Store on Lubyanka. October 26, 2019 <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/MJInnocent?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#MJInnocent</a> &#127875; &#128123;.<a href="https://twitter.com/michaeljackson?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@michaeljackson</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/tajjackson3?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@tajjackson3</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/MJJJusticePrjct?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@MJJJusticePrjct</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/Pezjax?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@Pezjax</a><a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/MichaelJackson?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#MichaelJackson</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/MJFam?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#MJFam</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/ThrillTheWorld2019?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#ThrillTheWorld2019</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/MJForever?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#MJForever</a> <a href="https://t.co/EP6p9siJ4L">pic.twitter.com/EP6p9siJ4L</a></p>&mdash; Elena Orlovskaya (@ElenaOrlovskay2) <a href="https://twitter.com/ElenaOrlovskay2/status/1188586894403223552?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">27. Oktober 2019</a></blockquote>
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John's podcasts are fine to post. They don't fall under the competing MJ site policy.
 
one thing i can say about this MJinnocent thing is that we have social media. back in the day we didn't. though i still would say that even though we didn't have social media we all fight it for Michael. i'm not sure which is best. i guess you can say social media is somewhat even more helpful for this just as posting it everywhere outside in the world.

i always knew Michael was innocent. this thing really need to stop and let him rest. it just feel it being drag on for 3 lairs who want some gosh darn money. also the haters too.

it's really time for all of this to rest so Michael can rest and everyone in his family and fans can move on with their lives.

it's ridiculous i hope next year will be better. that's all we can hope for.
 
More possible financial motivations for the Robson family to participate in LN, thread by the great TSCM:
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="hu"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">The 3 beLIEvers were, for many viewers, more impressionable than Wade. Although their most emotional moments came not from speaking of the alleged abuse, but of their abandoned father/husband.<br><br>Do they have any heightened reason to buy into Wade's newfound abuse narrative? <a href="https://t.co/WHVXYaYVvu">pic.twitter.com/WHVXYaYVvu</a></p>&mdash; TSCM (@MJJRepository) <a href="https://twitter.com/MJJRepository/status/1188669291161370624?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">2019. október 28.</a></blockquote>
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Thread reader version of the information:
https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1188669291161370624.html
 
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="de"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Hand in Hand for Michael. Stay strong. <a href="https://t.co/N37z7OTWXw">pic.twitter.com/N37z7OTWXw</a></p>&mdash; Keen Zhang (@mkgenie) <a href="https://twitter.com/mkgenie/status/1189027476946784256?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">29. Oktober 2019</a></blockquote>
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