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Controversial MJ Documentary Leaving Neverland [GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD]

For this doc I am creating..

I know Wade spoke of this anal attempt (being their last sexual incounter), is there (my memory wants to state this but I am not sure) contradictory regarding anal penatration and ATTEMPTED anal penatration? in the doc I know he said attempted, but I am trying to remember if in court if it was attempt or said he was penatrated.


Damn it feels strange even speaking of this type of sh** with Michael.. agh!


If anyone can remind me if the 'sex tape' James talked about ws entered into court AND the doc or just one? I know he stated he was told to rid of it.. butttt! trying to cross referene things.
 
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Alright I said before that I wanted to rant a bit about the whole situation and now I finally have time to sit down and collect my thoughts.

Before I heard about the documentary I was in an MJ mood listening mostly to the bad album. To my surprise I found out about this whole debacle on a local news site that headlines "evidence finally proves the allegations regarding the late Michael Jackson" in late feb. You could probably imagine how an MJ fan with no awareness about the documentary would react to such news. I was absolutely floored and baffled. I clicked the link and the article was mainly about the wedding ring. Suffice to say, the article, as well as the news that new accusers speak up against Michael did a number on me.

I stopped listening to his music instantly. And I reflected on why allegations regarding a deceased man - a man who, as much as I admired, never knew personally- would be such a burden on me. Then I realized that the simple thought that I was defending a guilty man all these years was a sickening one. And I said to myself that I will look into this story a renewed open mind. To judge for myself if these allegations make sense, and if they do then... well..

I began my research with the local news paper, the one that highlights this ring in a new groundbreaking documentary that would shed new light on the King of Pop. The article did not mention any names so I took to twitter and another fan board to learn more about them. As soon as I saw Robson being one of the primary accusers I sighed in relief that at least 90% of what he will say will be BS. Yet I restrained myself from throwing the whole thing out, as even 1% of the allegation, should they be true, is horrible enough for me. As usual, most articles rang of doom while the opinions of average people (on twitter at least) seemed skeptical. It was then that I began to follow RazorFist and visit this board, and after reading 200-300 pages of this mega thread, I think I came to a conclusion regarding the allegations of these two accusers:

- Robson is speaking out of his behind and I have zero doubt in that. This man was not molested by MJ and his story is just absurd. I could go into why I think that but I guess you guys all know the details of his story by now. But basically it was the dinner contradiction that did it for me. The man is a fool and I feel no remorse in saying that.

- Safechuck, on the other hand, I honestly thought was far more sincere. Probably because he wasn't in the limelight as much as wade was, and his relationship with MJ didn't seem as close as the other kids. His story, at face value, made a lot of sense and I felt gutted listening to the details. His scenarios were extremely hard to disprove which makes him seem more genuine. The Money motive also made perfect sense to me because ,if the guy was truly molested, then he absolutely has the right to feel entitled for at least monetary compensation. Then, the timeline discrepancies started showing up. At first they didn't pose a solid counter-point. But when stacked up it really puts a dent on his story (like, an extremely big dent), the latest one regarding the train station is probably the nail in the coffin. But I'm sure more contradictions will arise once we put his story through further scrutiny.

I still have an open mind regarding the subject, and there are still a few elements that needs further examination - For instance, Dan Reed said in an interview that Robson quit the Cirque show rather than being fired. Despite me highly doubting it, I still think this is a point worth investigating - But for now I still do believe that Michael was innocent, and I'm back to listening to his music. And it's thanks to the amazing work of this community that is working tirelessly to uncover the truth, the objective truth. I also want to give a thank you to Raz0rfist cause that guy is doing an amazing job defending MJ. Who would have thought a metal head would be such a good defence force?

So yes, Thank you all so much.
 
Finally got around to watching "Debunking Neverland" by Razorfist with Taj and Brandi. This was fantastic. Anyone in their right mind can't possibly side with these liars anymore after watching that. Except, of course unless they are hellbent on believing Taj and Brandi make money off this, which they don't.

The part when they talk about how MJ would have been teaching Wade to be against women, the disbelief in their faces and how they reacted said it all. The more research you do on him, the more you will start to realize the man was innocent. Something that can't be said about Saville for example. That was a very strong part.

Also the part about how MJ's childlike behavior was real, not an act and how Taj tried to be like that as much as possible because it's a good way to live. Adults being all cynical and questioning why someone wants to be their friend. I really get him there.

Or how about that Dan claims that MJ ran the most sophisticated child trafficking ring in history..... I mean..... what?!!!! LOL

I also noticed how very well spoken both Taj and Brandi are and Taj knows all the facts too. I wish he talked like this during some interviews with TV shows but on the other hand.... they probably never gave him that chance.

Lastly, he wants to make the rebuttal documentary as Iron clad as it can be and that's really good. It does sound like it's gonna be a while before we get it, but it should be worth it. A theatrical release is an idea but I would say Netflix is better, if they are interested. I think a big amount of people won't bother with a theater release.
 
ASIS said:
Alright I said before that I wanted to rant a bit about the whole situation and now I finally have time to sit down and collect my thoughts.

Before I heard about the documentary I was in an MJ mood listening mostly to the bad album. To my surprise I found out about this whole debacle on a local news site that headlines "evidence finally proves the allegations regarding the late Michael Jackson" in late feb. You could probably imagine how an MJ fan with no awareness about the documentary would react to such news. I was absolutely floored and baffled. I clicked the link and the article was mainly about the wedding ring. Suffice to say, the article, as well as the news that new accusers speak up against Michael did a number on me.

I stopped listening to his music instantly. And I reflected on why allegations regarding a deceased man - a man who, as much as I admired, never knew personally- would be such a burden on me. Then I realized that the simple thought that I was defending a guilty man all these years was a sickening one. And I said to myself that I will look into this story a renewed open mind. To judge for myself if these allegations make sense, and if they do then... well..

I began my research with the local news paper, the one that highlights this ring in a new groundbreaking documentary that would shed new light on the King of Pop. The article did not mention any names so I took to twitter and another fan board to learn more about them. As soon as I saw Robson being one of the primary accusers I sighed in relief that at least 90% of what he will say will be BS. Yet I restrained myself from throwing the whole thing out, as even 1% of the allegation, should they be true, is horrible enough for me. As usual, most articles rang of doom while the opinions of average people (on twitter at least) seemed skeptical. It was then that I began to follow RazorFist and visit this board, and after reading 200-300 pages of this mega thread, I think I came to a conclusion regarding the allegations of these two accusers:

- Robson is speaking out of his behind and I have zero doubt in that. This man was not molested by MJ and his story is just absurd. I could go into why I think that but I guess you guys all know the details of his story by now. But basically it was the dinner contradiction that did it for me. The man is a fool and I feel no remorse in saying that.

- Safechuck, on the other hand, I honestly thought was far more sincere. Probably because he wasn't in the limelight as much as wade was, and his relationship with MJ didn't seem as close as the other kids. His story, at face value, made a lot of sense and I felt gutted listening to the details. His scenarios were extremely hard to disprove which makes him seem more genuine. The Money motive also made perfect sense to me because ,if the guy was truly molested, then he absolutely has the right to feel entitled for at least monetary compensation. Then, the timeline discrepancies started showing up. At first they didn't pose a solid counter-point. But when stacked up it really puts a dent on his story (like, an extremely big dent), the latest one regarding the train station is probably the nail in the coffin. But I'm sure more contradictions will arise once we put his story through further scrutiny.

I still have an open mind regarding the subject, and there are still a few elements that needs further examination - For instance, Dan Reed said in an interview that Robson quit the Cirque show rather than being fired. Despite me highly doubting it, I still think this is a point worth investigating - But for now I still do believe that Michael was innocent, and I'm back to listening to his music. And it's thanks to the amazing work of this community that is working tirelessly to uncover the truth, the objective truth. I also want to give a thank you to Raz0rfist cause that guy is doing an amazing job defending MJ. Who would have thought a metal head would be such a good defence force?

So yes, Thank you all so much.
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Then it seems to me you didn't check all the very important information that is out there. Safechuck actually has a very clear motive for doing this, as with so many things it's money. His father's family business was being sued.

And during LN, can you truly say he looks sincere? Emotionless he explains all these horrible acts but then right at the end he puts on this horrible annoying grin, right before putting back on that fake victim face again. He's incredibly easy to see through actually.

You really have to see that one video where we see actual abuse victims being compared to these two opportunists. The difference is striking, it's just insane. But for some reason the video doesn't work for a lot of people, I can still see it though.

https://youtu.be/hFdnhmRpdFE

Count on that all his lies, his changing stories, messed up timelines, nah man.

If you've also see Debunking Neverland, then I genuinely cannot understand that someone would still be even having slight doubts. Not saying that about you, just in general.
 
After I watched this great video about Victor Gutierrez the third time.....


I finally came to the conclusion:
VICTOR GUTIRREZ (AND MAYBE NAMBLA) CAN BE BEHIND MJ FACTS!

Who else who know this page and its History comes to this conclusion also after watching the whole video I posted above?

It can also be people like Dian Dimand...
 
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Just as a small update on the project I am working on, I have officially finalized all the details that were in the current fact sheet and have added a couple tidbits that were not originally there.. Next, (maybe tomorrow) I will work on digging up more details that you guys have sent over to me and/or I have discovered along the way. Currently the doc is 4.5 pages!

I was hoping to fit it all in 4 pages to say "If you can spend 4 hours on the documentary, you can give the truth 4 pages of reading" BUTTT, I think when all is said and done it will be 5-6 pages (not including various links at the end for sources etc)..

it's fairly clean though, after I share it with Taj - I will ask him if he prefers for him to keep some details private so it does not get major attention until the docuseries. IF he just wants the doc out, I will post it here and share it.

I have asked a few questions between the 'MJ fact sheet thread', '
The Leaving Neverland - Lie Collection (No comments)', and here in the
Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland" thread.

If you have any of those answers please let me know, I'll try to find your response. If you want to make it easier for me and you see any of my unanswered questions, feel free to PM me. It would be easier to find.

:)
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analogue;4252444 said:
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">I was at Neverland a lot during 1988 and 1992 and I never saw Wade or his family there. There was no Train Station there during that time. I knew every inch of that place. What a Liar he his. How on earth was this not checked for the facts. Or they just didn’t care! &#65533;&#65533;</p>&mdash; Brenda Harvey Richie (@BrendaRichie) <a href="https://twitter.com/BrendaRichie/status/1111394982911307776?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 28, 2019</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
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Great someone should definitly ask her if she saw any tent/tippie village in Neverland in this time period!!!
 
This so called "documentary" is complete bullshit. Wades story doesn't even add up with his own mothers testimony https://www.mirror.co.uk/3am/celebrity-news/wade-robsons-michael-jackson-sex-14201396

Not to mention she was liking pictures and facebook fan pages of MJ as late as 2015 AFTER Wades accusations and didn't even take down the likes until TWO DAYS ago.

https://twitter.com/Zigmanfreud/status/1109220575589732352?s=19

Even as a MJ fan I have had many questions and doubts over the years but ironically enough this documentary that was supposed to expose and mute Michael forever has instead just made me almost 100% convinced that the man was/is innocent instead.
 
[h=1]Will.i.am slams 'inhumane' Michael Jackson backlash: 'He wouldn't hurt a fly'[/h]The Voice UK mentor, who met Jackson, says money is 'obviously' motivating Jackson's accusers and calls those banning his songs hypocrites


The Voice coach Will.i.am has branded TV and radio bosses &#8220;hypocrites&#8221; for banning Michael Jackson songs from their shows.
The rapper was a close friend of the late Thriller singer, whose reputation is now under fire after he was branded a child sex abuser in the recent documentary film Leaving Neverland.
Will.i.am said: &#8220;I don&#8217;t know what to trust or who to believe. Who is behind it or what? Obviously it&#8217;s money. All I know is it&#8217;s a smear campaign. If he did it, then it&#8217;s sad and inhumane.
&#8220;But if he didn&#8217;t, then what is happening is sad and inhumane.&#8221;
The Black Eyed Peas star raged: &#8220;It is double standards. You&#8217;re not talking about banning the company that made the chemicals to kill all the Jews.


&#8220;Imagine every country that ever had slaves and people said, &#8216;never travel to those countries because of things they&#8217;ve done in the past&#8217;.
&#8220;Are you not supposed to do anything with anyone who ever did ill? I could name 1,000 ills that are worse, but we are gonna pull songs instead. Why?&#8221;
Will added: &#8220;We live in a very, very, very hypocritical, double standards, fake society.


&#8220;I could name 1,000 other products that you still buy and still use that are owned by folks that have done the most horrendous things to people&#8230;&#8221;
He added he is &#8220;torn&#8221; over what to believe about the singer, who died in 2009.
He said: &#8220;The Michael Jackson I loved I will always love.
&#8220;The person I met was the kindest and most genuine and big-hearted person, who wouldn&#8217;t hurt a fly.&#8221;


Make sure to give them a click - https://www.mirror.co.uk/3am/celebrity-news/william-slams-sad-inhumane-ban-14206115
 
 
Great to see Will speaking out, but at the same time it's a bit odd. He says it's obviously about money, but he still brings in doubt earlier on with "if he did it, it's inhumane and sad.". Odd.
 
Staffordshire Bullterrier said:
Great to see Will speaking out, but at the same time it's a bit odd. He says it's obviously about money, but he still brings in doubt earlier on with "if he did it, it's inhumane and sad.". Odd.
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It seems like he's saying that their motivation for talking publicly is money, but that doesn't mean that they're definitely lying. I'm guessing he hasn't done his research.
 
Staffordshire Bullterrier;4252481 said:
Some fans are now tweeting Dan Reed with facts. Why, why, whyyyyyy? All they are doing now is help his filthy cause.
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Why would fans do that? Dan Reed is scum. He doesn’t give a damn about facts. Therefore, why would fans give this leech any help to alter, delete and revise their lies? &#129318;*&#9792;&#65039;
 
Anna said:
It seems like he's saying that their motivation for talking publicly is money, but that doesn't mean that they're definitely lying. I'm guessing he hasn't done his research.
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That or he's pandering to people who want MJ to be guilty. It seems like a lot of haters won't even listen to someone who doesn't add in a "oh, but maybe he did..." caveat.
 
Another random thought, unrelated to the discussion of Will.I.Am: anyone else find it odd that, in Amazon's description of the LN DVD, it doesn't list a run time for the movie? I can't say I've looked at tons of Amazon listings for upcoming releases, but I know that their descriptions of movies usually include the run time. Muy interesante, given how Dan Reed keeps cutting out parts.
 
There is no point in mincing words, Dan Reed is ignorant. To present the "documentary" the way he did shows just how desperate he was to have people condemn Michael and to start the rumour mill once again. Facts are facts though. Law enforcement cleared Jackson on TWO occasions (along with the FBI). This "documentary" was a blatant attack without provocation. It is sad to see Wade and James betraying Michael, both are in debt to his estate as most of you know. If they really cared about Michael and his children as they claimed, they would let him rest in peace. Wade has proven he is a liar on more than one occasion.
 
I'm not one to talk bad about Janet but this pisses me off. She's being inducted into the rock and roll hall of fame and look who is broadcasting it and who's logo appears on the red carpet. I don't give a **** if it is a monumental career achievement, if they are calling my brother a pedophile i'm ****ing boycotting!

jj-rr.jpg
 
^ I've been wondering ever since I first heard things are being edited out - what would make it to the DVD/Blu-ray release..
 
Check out @NeverlandFacts’s Tweet: https://twitter.com/NeverlandFacts/status/1111708354190049280?s=09
"And to drive a final nail into the coffin of the Dan Reed-James Safechuck #LeavingNeverland lie, Santa Barbara News-Press article showing that the county didn't even issue a permit to build the train operation until June of 1993.https://t.co/ScQYK2U3W5 "

<a href="https://ibb.co/XVcRM3b"><img src="https://i.ibb.co/g6kKhP3/IMG-20190330-002311.png" alt="IMG-20190330-002311" border="0"></a>
 
The amazing TSCM strikes again

https://twitter.com/MJJRepository/status/1111851775777230852


TSCM&#8207; @MJJRepository<button type="button" class=" EdgeButton EdgeButton--secondary EdgeButton--medium button-text follow-text" style="color: rgb(107, 13, 11); font-family: inherit; font-size: 14px; font-style: inherit; font-variant-caps: inherit; font-weight: bold; line-height: 20px; margin: 0px; overflow: visible; cursor: pointer; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); border: 1px solid rgb(107, 13, 11); padding: 6px 16px; -webkit-transition: box-shadow 0.15s ease-in-out; transition: box-shadow 0.15s ease-in-out; border-top-left-radius: 100px; border-top-right-radius: 100px; border-bottom-right-radius: 100px; border-bottom-left-radius: 100px; box-shadow: none; position: relative; white-space: nowrap; display: block; min-width: 105px;">FollowFollow
@MJJRepository​
</button>

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The permit to begin construction of Neverland train station was approved SEPT. 2, 1993.More permits were granted during development including for final bay windows on JANUARY 13, 1994.Chief construction done from Sep. 93—Jan. 94.2nd floor was 12x16.-Receipts- #MJInnocent


 
haha FU Safechuk

Weird about Janet. I remember she said her and Michael drifted apart right after Thriller on Evil Oprahs show. SHe doesn't seem to care much. I would yell from the roof tops if my brother was being smeared like this and had her platform
 
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