Latest on MJJC

Triumph 45th Anniversary

ChanceToDance said:
I'm ngl, but I'm more excited for Adore You and Water leaking in full one day than I am for the Thriller 40 documentary lol.
Click to expand...
Because I suppose like most Jackson fans online you didn't care about everything about pre-Bad area, I feel the opposite, I really hate 90% of his works after 85/86 (some demo are cools), I take any days Behind the Mask demo than your examples of leaks, I think that show a really strong division among Jackson fans.

Lot of peoples complain about the Estates but I'm sure most peoples here would didn't care if the songs from The Jacksons (or pre-Bad Michael) would be leaked or released officially.
 
blair said:
Because I suppose like most Jackson fans online you didn't care about everything about pre-Bad area, I feel the opposite, I really hate 90% of his works after 85/86 (some demo are cools), I take any days Behind the Mask demo than your examples of leaks, I think that show a really strong division among Jackson fans.
Click to expand...
What a baseless assumption. It's not that I don't care about MJ's music pre-87, there are reasons why someone would care more about those songs over some badly edited, mid documentary which barely touched on the album's creation with the exception of like 3 songs. For starters those songs finally give us a glimpse on what kind of music MJ was working on before he died and that's a time which has an entire era of music that we have almost no content from, with the general audience not even being aware it exists.

It's totally fair if you prefer other types of music, but don't come here with this "holier-than-thou" attitude because you have one different opinion (which tbf isn't even an unpopular opinion since the public is way more focused on MJ's work from the 70's/80's anyways) lol.
blair said:
Lot of peoples complain about the Estates but I'm sure most peoples here would didn't care if the songs from The Jacksons (or pre-Bad Michael) would be leaked or released officially.
Click to expand...
Saying that no one here cares about those songs is another baseless thing to say, how many people throughout the years have been hyped over songs like Buffalo Bill, Chicago 1945, Victory, Rolling The Dice, Going To Rio or any other song that dates from the early 80's or before? If you look around the forum or any other fan-space you'll see many people showing interest over those types of songs.

Personally I would love to hear songs from the OTW era as well since it's another era we have no outtakes from. I would've also liked if The Jackson brothers released outtakes of their own on the deluxe editions of their albums instead of putting instrumentals and longer mixes as bonus material.
 
Yes I'm aware that there are a big difference between the general audience and the forum fans, but that change the fact that there are a big disdain from these fans for everything pre-Bad, I really don't see the reason you talk about Jackson 2000's area to talk craps about Thriller 40th in a subject about The Jacksons Triumph 45th anniversary, and about holier than you attitude, please, you talk about your opinion about Thriller 40th like an absolute fact, for the snippet about "water" and "adore you", I find them horrible, but I don't go to different threads to say that Michael since Bad made weak music.

Please I'm aware you can find pre-Bad fans in forums, but to say that there are not a negative attitude toward Jackson pre-Bad work is a joke, lot of peoples have noticed that, there were a forum "Mjearly80's" a longtime ago because of that, I could ignore that, but there are lot of critics it's in each subject about pre-Bad thread.
 
blair said:
Yes I'm aware that there are a big difference between the general audience and the forum fans, but that change the fact that there are a big disdain from these fans for everything pre-Bad, I really don't see the reason you talk about Jackson 2000's area to talk craps about Thriller 40th in a subject about The Jacksons Triumph 45th anniversary, and about holier than you attitude, please, you talk about your opinion about Thriller 40th like an absolute fact, for the snippet about "water" and "adore you", I find them horrible, but I don't go to different threads to say that Michael since Bad made weak music.

Please I'm aware you can find pre-Bad fans in forums, but to say that there are not a negative attitude toward Jackson pre-Bad work is a joke, lot of peoples have noticed that, there were a forum "Mjearly80's" a longtime ago because of that, I could ignore that, but there are lot of critics it's in each subject about pre-Bad thread.
Click to expand...
I didn't mention it out of the blue, people were talking about leaks so I mentioned those songs as something I'm excited for myself. I brought up the documentary simply as a comparison instead of defaming it since it was the project everyone was looking forward to at the time, I couldn't trash on something which hadn't even been out at the time I wrote the message.

And the part about the documentary isn't just an opinion of mine, a lot of people were displeased by the fact that the documentary didn't focus on the creation of the Thriller album to instead talk about trivial things like TikTok and things of sorts. Or that it included A.I upscaled footage taken straight from Youtube and many other issues. Plenty of people weren't pleased by it and made comparisons to the Greatest Night In Pop documentary saying it's what the documentary should've been like.

I'm not sure about what type of disdain you're talking about, his work between the 70's-80's is what's held to the highest regard usually. And when people have a dislike to it they make actual criticisms about it instead of hating with no reason. I'm curious to know what type of hate you're referring to.
 
No sorry I really don't see why you make this kind of comparaison specially in this thread, specially if you didn't have seen the Doc yourself, I don't see your point except to be extremely negative about a Thriller project.

Yes I'm aware of some critics, but there are lot of positive about the doc, unreleased footages from this times, from studio, Victory tour, and it's not just about this doc, it's like that with everything pre-Bad by the same peoples, they hate The Jacksons album, Victory tour, Quincy Jones,Thriller 25th and 40th and their unreleased songs etc...I have seen peoples here who have thought that "Be not Always" was a leaked song.

I have already said that I'm aware that there are a difference between the casual fan of MJ and what we find in a forum, for example what your favorite area ? Because I find weird you prefer these 2000's songs than the unreleased footages from the peak of his career, for the "critics" I have rarely something like that in a MJ forum, in general it's just subjective taste, lot of double or triple standard, and lot of free hate against his family, The Jacksons and Quincy.
 
Last edited:
blair said:
No sorry I really don't see why you make this kind of comparaison specially in this thread, specially if you didn't have seen the Doc yourself, I don't see your point except to be extremely negative about a Thriller project.

Yes I'm aware of some critics, but there are lot of positive about the doc, unreleased footages from this times, from studio, Victory tour, and it's not just about this doc, it's like that with everything pre-Bad by the same peoples, they hate The Jacksons album, Victory tour, Quincy Jones,Thriller 25th and 40th and their unreleased songs etc...I have seen peoples here who have thought that "Be not Always" was a leaked song.

I have already said that I'm aware that there are a difference between the casual fan of MJ and what we find in a forum, for example what your favorite area ? Because I find weird you prefer these 2000's songs than the unreleased footages from the peak of his career, for the "critics" I have rarely something like that in a MJ forum, in general it's just subjective taste, lot of double or triple standard, and lot of free hate against his family, The Jacksons and Quincy.
Click to expand...
Tell that to the people on the thread who began talking about songs that aren't related to the Triumph album, I was merely joining on the discussion. How is that hard to understand lol

Yeah that's why I say the doc was mid and not downright bad, it has it's qualities for sure. The unseen footage from Beat It was easily my favorite part of the documentary. But the new footage doesn't negate the issues the doc still has, for one it should've been longer and the runtime should have been saved to talk about the other songs on the album instead of talking about shit like BTS and TikTok lol.

Although footage like that is neat but to me it's just something I'll watch once or twice and then never again. Music on the other hand is something you can always come back to and it never gets old (or at least it doesn't get old as fast lol).

I feel like we're going in circles at this point and we're just messing up the thread. Not everyone is gonna like everything, some people aren't gonna like the 70's stuff, some people aren't gonna like the 90's/00's stuff and some people are gonna like everything in between, we're not some kind of hivemind. Everyone is gonna have their own taste so let's leave it at that. Sorry for the arrogant tone on my first reply. Hope you have a good one.
 
Hot_Street said:
The Jacksons - Everybody (Demo)

Click to expand...
This is great. So this demo sounds very close to the final version. Which makes sense, as this is what has been discussed. The demo's were very close to the final version. My only question; this song gives writing/producing credit to Mike McKinney. I wonder what it was that he contributed to this song that was enough to receive final credit.
 
blair said:
Because I suppose like most Jackson fans online you didn't care about everything about pre-Bad area, I feel the opposite, I really hate 90% of his works after 85/86 (some demo are cools), I take any days Behind the Mask demo than your examples of leaks, I think that show a really strong division among Jackson fans.

Lot of peoples complain about the Estates but I'm sure most peoples here would didn't care if the songs from The Jacksons (or pre-Bad Michael) would be leaked or released officially.
Click to expand...
I like everything MJ did about equally.

It's way more common for people to hate Invincible than anything post Quincy Jones.

And no one cares what you're sure about, especially because you're wrong.
 
Mister_Jay_Tee said:
I like everything MJ did about equally.

It's way more common for people to hate Invincible than anything post Quincy Jones.

And no one cares what you're sure about, especially because you're wrong.
Click to expand...

"No one cares", apparently you because you have read and replied to my comment, but next time try to speak just for yourself.

Ok so look the polls about the most overrated album, most have said Thriller, that don't mean they hate that, okay, but you have Thriller40 the docs and the new songs, lot of peoples hate them, how they prefer the Behind the Mask remix from "Michael" album than the original, or the thread about Victory tour, and you have lot of ugly comments, sorry but I have never seen something like for Invincible.

Sorry I'm wrong about what ? Mjearly80's didn't exist ? because lot of subjects were about this there are long time ago, or see the forum Lipstick alley recently they talk about that too.

I don't want to derail the thread, for me it's a big problem inside this community, I mean 1/3 of the comments are about how Thriller40 suck in a thread about the Triumph album.
 
blair said:
"No one cares", apparently you because you have read and replied to my comment, but next time try to speak just for yourself.

Ok so look the polls about the most overrated album, most have said Thriller, that don't mean they hate that, okay, but you have Thriller40 the docs and the new songs, lot of peoples hate them, how they prefer the Behind the Mask remix from "Michael" album than the original, or the thread about Victory tour, and you have lot of ugly comments, sorry but I have never seen something like for Invincible.

Sorry I'm wrong about what ? Mjearly80's didn't exist ? because lot of subjects were about this there are long time ago, or see the forum Lipstick alley recently they talk about that too.

I don't want to derail the thread, for me it's a big problem inside this community, I mean 1/3 of the comments are about how Thriller40 suck in a thread about the Triumph album.
Click to expand...
Thriller 40 does suck, quite a lot. It was a far worse project than Bad 25.

It was better than Thriller 25 though, so it balances out.

I like both versions of Behind The Mask equally, for different reasons. It's my favorite MJ song period. The new version wasn't even done by MJ?

Off The Wall is probably my most heard MJ album, and music album, of all time.

There's a million forums talking about MJ, you should see the Steve Hoffman forums, they always embrace the Quincy Jones trilogy.
 
That your opinion about Thriller40th not an absolute fact, I find that far superior to Bad25th simply because the songs are better, Bad suck imo.

Of course the New version of Behind the Mask was not done by Micheal, it was an estates projects after his death with new vocals (by others artists), instrumental etc ...

No there are no millions forums, most are closed now, Hoffman forums are not fans of Michael that the opposite, it's more about music in general, and they are not fans of the albums of Quincy, I have seen more fans of this trilogy in a Prince forums.

Sorry but why you talk about the others forums ?
 
Last edited:
blair said:
Bad suck imo.
Click to expand...
Well that's too bad because it's definitely MJs best. It's not even my favorite but it's hard to see it as anything but pure and unfiltered MJ. And it's ridiculous to think stuff like Trouble and Sunset Driver are better than "I'm So Blue" and Price of Fame. Actually insane actually.
blair said:
Hoffman forums are not fans of Michael that the opposite
Click to expand...
That's very strongly untrue but just as well.
 
I really don't see how someone with good musical tastes can compare something ugly like the Bad sound with something from Thriller, I mean Michael have lost his touch, scream instead of sing or barely mumble like a kid in I'm so blue, there are lack any nuance or passion in these songs, price of fame is ugly musically, yes we can't compare them with she's trouble or sunset driver, nobody can seriously call Bad album among is best work, he have won no grammy with this album, Quincy himself have called that mediocre in his book, you can see the old articles, it was the moment Michael have lost his career.

Regardless you make my point there are clearly a division among fans between the pre-Bad fans and the others, I really don't believe you when you say your favorite album is Off the Wall or you like his albums equally (you seem to hate Thriller), sunset driver have the "off the Wall" sound but you hate that ? In general old school fans like this one.

You can have the tastes you have but I don't why this hate for Thriller is in a thread about the Triumph album.

For Hoffman, sorry you call this membres forums seriously Michael fans ? I have seen more negative than positive in this forum about his olds albums, sincerely you are wrong about that.
 
blair said:
I really don't see how someone with good musical tastes can compare something ugly like the Bad sound with something from Thriller, I mean Michael have lost his touch, scream instead of sing or barely mumble like a kid in I'm so blue, there are lack any nuance or passion in these songs, price of fame is ugly musically, yes we can't compare them with she's trouble or sunset driver, nobody can seriously call Bad album among is best work, he have won no grammy with this album, Quincy himself have called that mediocre in his book, you can see the old articles, it was the moment Michael have lost his career.

Regardless you make my point there are clearly a division among fans between the pre-Bad fans and the others, I really don't believe you when you say your favorite album is Off the Wall or you like his albums equally (you seem to hate Thriller), sunset driver have the "off the Wall" sound but you hate that ? In general old school fans like this one.

You can have the tastes you have but I don't why this hate for Thriller is in a thread about the Triumph album.

For Hoffman, sorry you call this membres forums seriously Michael fans ? I have seen more negative than positive in this forum about his olds albums, sincerely you are wrong about that.
Click to expand...
Mister_Jay_Tee said:
Nah I'm done after that. Too many terrible takes to actually assume you're even being for real. I pity you.
Click to expand...

Imagine calling an album that spawned a record breaking five consecutive no 1 singles, went on to sell 45 million copies worldwide, was well received by the press and fans, and was the centerpiece of a tour that became the highest grossing tour of the 1980s, the moment he ”lost” his career.

Terrible take indeed.
 
Themidwestcowboy said:
Imagine calling an album that spawned a record breaking five consecutive no 1 singles, went on to sell 45 million copies worldwide, was well received by the press and fans, and was the centerpiece of a tour that became the highest grossing tour of the 1980s, the moment he ”lost” his career.

Terrible take indeed.
Click to expand...

If you were present during the transition between Thriller and Bad, lot of peoples were disappointed, lot of peoples talk about that in reddit, Hoffman forum, video in youtube etc..., lot of peoples think he have lost his sound, the black funk style completly for something harsh, artificial, it's for that I have talked this old website/forum "Mjearly80's" and I don't talk about his appearances, his changes of styles, but his songs, his voices everything wes differents; it was extremely complicated to see during this times, sure the success were here, that normal after Thriller, but the consequences for his career was catastrophic, I remember a magazine have called that the worst album of the year of something like that.

For the tour that not true, it was not the most successful of the 80's, you can see yourself:

en.wikipedia.org

List of highest-grossing concert tours - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

The Average gross for Victory tour was bigger than Bad tour, and most fans here call his tour his biggest mistake and a disaster despite the most succesful in term of money in the 80's (the Rolling Stones tour in the list has more date and continue to 1990) , for Bad album , I don't see your problems about my opinion when lot of peoples here think Thriller is overrated or suck, that the division have talked about MJ fans, and I'm not the first to have started this kind of discussion in a thread about the Triumph album.
 
Last edited:
Hot_Street said:
We Love You (unreleased song from Triumph)

SCHEDULE FOR THE ESTATE

Let's support the Estate and collect dates and ideas for future releases. We can do it, we can do it We can work it out The Jacksons, 1976 SCHEDULE FOR THE ESTATE: 2024 Victory 40th Anniversary https://www.mjjcommunity.com/threads/victory-40th-anniversary.202865/...
www.mjjcommunity.com www.mjjcommunity.com
Click to expand...


Composed by Jermaine Jackson.
 
Themidwestcowboy said:
Imagine calling an album that spawned a record breaking five consecutive no 1 singles, went on to sell 45 million copies worldwide, was well received by the press and fans, and was the centerpiece of a tour that became the highest grossing tour of the 1980s, the moment he ”lost” his career.

Terrible take indeed.
Click to expand...
Well said. There's having your own takes on things and then there's ignoring reality altogether.

Blair falls in the latter.
 
SeriousFX said:
Well said. There's having your own takes on things and then there's ignoring reality altogether.

Blair falls in the latter.
Click to expand...

Sure there are no controversy surrounding Bad, no surgery, no tabloïds, no big conflict with Quincy for the sound of album and Thriller was a crappy album and Victory tour suck, sure, and I'm the one who deny the reality.

Look you can see yourself in youtube video during this time or peoples who were present in 87 and give their opinions in various forums etc...you could see that yourself.
 
blair said:
If you were present during the transition between Thriller and Bad,
Click to expand...
I was! :)

blair said:
lot of peoples were disappointed,
Click to expand...
I'm sure they were but Michael's fan base is huge so there are always many different viewpoints being expressed. Lots of people might have been disappointed but the album was phenomenally successful and loads of people loved it.

blair said:
lot of peoples talk about that in reddit, Hoffman forum, video in youtube etc..., lot of peoples think he have lost his sound, the black funk style completly for something harsh, artificial, it's for that I have talked this old website/forum "Mjearly80's" and I don't talk about his appearances, his changes of styles, but his songs, his voices everything wes differents; it was extremely complicated to see during this times,
Click to expand...
Speaking only for myself, I didn't see this period as remotely complicated. A fabulously interesting progression, sure.

blair said:
sure the success were here, that normal after Thriller, but the consequences for his career was catastrophic,
Click to expand...
Respectfully, I'm struggling to see the success of Bad as causing 'catastrophic' consequences for Michael's career.

blair said:
I remember a magazine have called that the worst album of the year of something like that.
Click to expand...
Well, sure. It wasn't universally loved, 100%. That's normal. Personally, I rather like the Rolling Stone review (and I do not like RS) which made these comments:

"Comparisons with Thriller are unimportant, except this one: even without a milestone recording like “Billie Jean,” Bad is a better record."

"As in his best songs, Jackson’s free-form language keeps us aware that we are on the edge of several realities: the film, the dream it inspires, the waking world it illuminates."

“Bad” needs no defense. Jackson revives the “Hit the Road, Jack” progression and proves (with a lyric beginning with “Your butt is mine” and ending with the answered question “Who’s bad?”) that he can outfunk anybody any time. When Jackson declares that “the whole world has to answer right now,” he is not boasting but making a statement of fact regarding his extraordinary stardom."

"Michael Jackson deserves the rewards due to those who tell their truth, who admit complexity when simplifications are at hand and who can funk in the valley of the gods."

I'm not posting these quotes bc I expect everyone to agree with them. That'll never happen. But one magazine naming Bad as the worst album of the year is just one magazine out of many that had other, more positive views.

blair said:
For the tour that not true, it was not the most successful of the 80's, you can see yourself: [...]
The Average gross for Victory tour was bigger than Bad tour, [...]
Click to expand...
Bc Victory was a shorter tour. That will affect the figures. Besides, the actual gross is surely more important than an average gross.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top