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Petition For Increase In Charges Against Murray

I hope its ok to repost this here too(also posted in the press release thread).

These are direct Email to DA in trial via justice 4 mj.


http://www.justice4mj.com/change-the-charges/


Change the charges!
Send your letters requesting that the charges be changed to second degree murder.
Case Number: SA073164?
Case Title: People v Conrad Murray

David B Walgren?
213.974.3992?
Fax: 213.974.1484
dwalgren@da.lacounty.gov dwalgren@da.lacounty.gov

Deborah Brazil
dbrazil@da.lacounty.gov dbrazil@da.lacounty.gov
 
Personally I don't agree with this. Eventhough most people on MJ forums understand what has been going on through the prelim, the regular public who will comprise the jury pool does not have a clue about any of the medical incompetence that happened that dreadfull day.

Has any of you listened to the court TV channel (True TV) where they have been talking about the prelim every day and re-enacted with portraits and discussions and what not?

Have you heard what the callers have to say about the case. OH my gawd!

Eventhough the majority of callers say they like Michael Jackson, you should hear their un-educated views. They're all confused in their mind with the medical mumbo jumbo and have the facts all wrong. It's just beyond what Joe public can understand.

Some of them even feel sorry for Murray and all we need is ONE of them in the jury pool and it's over. Guys you have to understand that for the masses Doctors are put on pedestals and it will be very hard to make the jury feel they have to put a doctor in jail for a longer time if anything at all.

Just my opinion of course.
 
Hi riviera, I understand what you are saying; however, it's important that we give people the choice to address if they want. There are many intelligent people out there and even if they do not understand the medical presentation of the evidence, the mere fact that Murray administered these drugs and did not provide the required standard of care; ie EKG, defibrillator and oxygen, people will understand that what Murray did was just wrong. Many may agree with you and won't act. Thank you for your thoughts. :better:

riviera1992 said:
Personally I don't agree with this. Eventhough most people on MJ forums understand what has been going on through the prelim, the regular public who will comprise the jury pool does not have a clue about any of the medical incompetence that happened that dreadfull day.

Has any of you listened to the court TV channel (True TV) where they have been talking about the prelim every day and re-enacted with portraits and discussions and what not?

Have you heard what the callers have to say about the case. OH my gawd!

Eventhough the majority of callers say they like Michael Jackson, you should hear their un-educated views. They're all confused in their mind with the medical mumbo jumbo and have the facts all wrong. It's just beyond what Joe public can understand.

Some of them even feel sorry for Murray and all we need is ONE of them in the jury pool and it's over. Guys you have to understand that for the masses Doctors are put on pedestals and it will be very hard to make the jury feel they have to put a doctor in jail for a longer time if anything at all.

Just my opinion of course.
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riviera1992 said:
Personally I don't agree with this. Eventhough most people on MJ forums understand what has been going on through the prelim, the regular public who will comprise the jury pool does not have a clue about any of the medical incompetence that happened that dreadfull day.

Has any of you listened to the court TV channel (True TV) where they have been talking about the prelim every day and re-enacted with portraits and discussions and what not?

Have you heard what the callers have to say about the case. OH my gawd!

Eventhough the majority of callers say they like Michael Jackson, you should hear their un-educated views. They're all confused in their mind with the medical mumbo jumbo and have the facts all wrong. It's just beyond what Joe public can understand.

Some of them even feel sorry for Murray and all we need is ONE of them in the jury pool and it's over. Guys you have to understand that for the masses Doctors are put on pedestals and it will be very hard to make the jury feel they have to put a doctor in jail for a longer time if anything at all.

Just my opinion of course.
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So people have to put up with continuing ignorance, instead of making people aware of that a doctor Can do wrong, and what Murray did shows by far how impossibly negligent he was for not even having the basic medical equipment for his insomniac patient, Not to mention he tried to cover for his deeds instead of trying to save his dying patient and calling 911 straight away. How can one put up with such offensive ignorance on behalf of the public? In spite of shown evidence of Murray's complete disregard of human life at the end of the day? A human very hard at work preparing for 50 concerts. If Murray saw a distressed Jackson due to the gruelling rehearsals he did, as he said, he did Nothing to ask AEG to ease up the speed and at least to postpone the concerts, for rehearsals weren't finished and his patient couldn't sleep. Instead, by Kenny Ortega's words, Murray told him that Jackson was his patient and he knows what it's best for his patient. That's why he drugged him to death that last night, didn't have the needed medical equip for him, and spoke on the phone with his lovers, while administering him that anesthetic and Not monitoring him. Jackson didn't want to die, didn't ask to die, he tried everything to help him sleep and nothing worked, so at least Somebody, this so-called doctor could have had the proper equip to assist with anesthesia, yet he didn't care about that and only dreamt about his big money. That should be crying out in the sky in any other victim's case so as not to protest that.
 
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I have no idea. This IM charge is very upsetting. (Just close your eyes and imagine conrad free as a bird in just 4 years) I already emailed the D.A. a second time.

What's up with him not charging murray with what he derserves!! They say it's "easier to prove" and will "guarantee a conviction"? Is that an excuse for not charging someone with WHAT THEY DESERVE TO BE CHARGED WITH??? Where is the justice?!
 
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It would be more effective if we call ourselves. 1,000 phonecalls is better. And besides, calling is more direct.

I'm not settling for IM. One plus four does not equal three.
 
Owh, i am gonna sign that petition right away...

no doubt =)

Gosh...he's having his vacation in Disneyland right now...
Stay away from DL...MJ loved it there.... -.-
He doesn't deserve to have fun.... i wish he could feel what we feel right now....


TheDutchApplehead
 
This is the most ridiculous thread I have ever seen. As fans we need to stay out of things that concern the law, no matter how strongly we may feel about what happened to Michael. Let the law decide. Michael was given an incredibly fair trial in 2005, and yet you're all so worried that apparently Murray is going to walk off scott free. And the end of the day, there is overwhelming evidence that he killed Michael; whether it was by pure accident or not. And he'll get an appropriate charge for that, that people and fans are just going to have to deal with. We may have lost an icon and an amazing person, but there are three kids out there who lost a father and a family who lost a brother and a son. I think we should just trust that the right thing is going to happen, and not further tarnish the already damaged image we have as fans.
 
kindofdisco said:
This is the most ridiculous thread I have ever seen. As fans we need to stay out of things that concern the law, no matter how strongly we may feel about what happened to Michael. Let the law decide. Michael was given an incredibly fair trial in 2005, and yet you're all so worried that apparently Murray is going to walk off scott free. And the end of the day, there is overwhelming evidence that he killed Michael; whether it was by pure accident or not. And he'll get an appropriate charge for that, that people and fans are just going to have to deal with. We may have lost an icon and an amazing person, but there are three kids out there who lost a father and a family who lost a brother and a son. I think we should just trust that the right thing is going to happen, and not further tarnish the already damaged image we have as fans.
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And I think that's the most cynical thing I have read in this entire thread. He got a 'fair' trial????? A trial with a DA that falsified evidence and is on tape while he's doing it???????? Unbelievable.
Yes, what a "fair" gift Michael was "given". Just the choice of words makes my hair stand up. "Given". Should he be even grateful for that horror?

Yes, he walked. And I'm incredibly grateful that he did. That doesn't make that trial 'fair'. His lawyer called this entire trial a travesty.

People are not advocating wild west 'serve justice yourself'. People need not "stay out of it" like good, obedient sheep. That's exactly the reason why Michael had his 'fair' trial. Because people in power abused their public office and people looked away, because well, it was Michael Jackson.

People chose to speak up because his house was NOT a crime scene for a long time, because the law NEVER treated Michael Jackson right. That's why. Because it already took 'forever' to declare his death even a 'homicide' and not the 'freak accident' that people blamed on Michael himself.

Thank God some people will speak up, no matter how many people think it's 'not their place' to do so. If we all followed that logic, we'd still be sitting in caves.

P.S.: Mesereau is on tape stating that there actually WAS HUGE internal debate weather to charge IVM or Murder- so apparently the 'out of control' fans weren't that far off. If I find the video, I'll gladly post it.

P.P.S.: MJ fans are the first ones to know that a 'tarnished image' isn't necessarily an indicator of 'truth'. Michael's image was rather 'tarnished', that doesn't mean that his reputation has anything to do with who he truly is.
Gotta start learning to not worry so much about your 'image'. People spoke up for Michael because they figured it the right thing to do.
Yeah, let's all sit down and let 'em do their thing. Because the track record is incredibly 'trust' infusing- NOT.
 
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Pace said:
And I think that's the most cynical thing I have read in this entire thread. He got a 'fair' trial????? A trial with a DA that falsified evidence and is on tape while he's doing it???????? Unbelievable.
Yes, what a "fair" gift Michael was "given". Just the choice of words makes my hair stand up. "Given". Should he be even grateful for that horror?

Yes, he walked. And I'm incredibly grateful that he did. That doesn't make that trial 'fair'. His lawyer called this entire trial a travesty.

People are not advocating wild west 'serve justice yourself'. People need not "stay out of it" like good, obedient sheep. That's exactly the reason why Michael had his 'fair' trial. Because people in power abused their public office and people looked away, because well, it was Michael Jackson.

People chose to speak up because his house was NOT a crime scene for a long time, because the law NEVER treated Michael Jackson right. That's why. Because it already took 'forever' to declare his death even a 'homicide' and not the 'freak accident' that people blamed on Michael himself.

Thank God some people will speak up, no matter how many people think it's 'not their place' to do so. If we all followed that logic, we'd still be sitting in caves.

P.S.: Mesereau is on tape stating that there actually WAS HUGE internal debate weather to charge IVM or Murder- so apparently the 'out of control' fans weren't that far off. If I find the video, I'll gladly post it.

P.P.S.: MJ fans are the first ones to know that a 'tarnished image' isn't necessarily an indicator of 'truth'. Michael's image was rather 'tarnished', that doesn't mean that his reputation has anything to do with who he truly is.
Gotta start learning to not worry so much about your 'image'. People spoke up for Michael because they figured it the right thing to do.
Yeah, let's all sit down and let 'em do their thing. Because the track record is incredibly 'trust' infusing- NOT.
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I just want to say thank you for posting this. I agree with you on this. Michael's trial shouldn't have happened in the first place, which I believe is your point. I also think that Tom Mesereau was hugely responsible for making sure Michael's trial was as fair as it could be. Regarding the fans speaking up on behalf of Michael, I think that they deserve much credit as they are very well informed. Sure there are those few that will fuel the fire about the "crazy fans"; however, it's the fans who help bring attention to things that should be addressed. For example when the Discovery Channel - UK was going to air that mock autopsy program, it was the fans who brought it to the attention of Estate, who in turn wrote a letter to Discovery. This is just one example. So while this other individual doesn't agree with the fans wanting to get the charges changed, perhaps if people listen to what some of the fans are saying, they may learn the truth about who Michael was and what happened on June 25, 2009. Of course this is all my humble opinion.
 
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Im gonna definitely sign this petition. murray just going up for involuntary manslaughter is wrong. he took our sweet michael:no:
 
Pace said:
P.S.: Mesereau is on tape stating that there actually WAS HUGE internal debate weather to charge IVM or Murder- so apparently the 'out of control' fans weren't that far off. If I find the video, I'll gladly post it.
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I agree with you and Windy about the 2005 trial, it should never have happened in the first place!! There was proof of false evidences from the very beginning but DA ignored that and went ahead...!

This is the video you mentioned: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/41278781#41270696

The interview to Mesereau is from minute 2:40.

This is what he said on 26 January about the upgrading of charges being discussed in the DA Office:

"Reporter: Involuntary Manslaughter, this type of homicide charge, Tom, is it easier for the prosecution to prove?

Tom Mesereau: Yes, it is. It's not a charge of First or Second-Degree Murder. I have heard that there was tremendous debate in the Los Angeles county district attorney 's office over whether to charge Second-Degree Murder or Involuntary Manslaughter and Involuntary Manslaughter won out. It's easier to prove. I think they have already got the evidence to prove it and I think they will."

--------------

My question now is: are there still any chances to upgrade the charges? It was clear that DA choice of the easiest charge to "win" had also something to do with their initial weak investigation.

Hope at the trial DA can debunk all defence's theories and can prove what Murray did in a conclusive way no leaving way for further speculation or unanswered doubts. Only then, with thorough work from the prosecutors we will see Justice done. And to do so they will have to prove Murray's culpability not precisely in the "easiest way", but in the fairest way.
 
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My question now is: are there still any chances to upgrade the charges? It was clear that DA choice of the easiest charge to "win" had also something to do with their initial weak investigation.
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in a legal sense they could go to the judge say u want the case thrown out and want to start again on new charges cause they have new evidence. but its not as if they are looking for other evidence that will make them say we must increase the charges.they arent gonna change the charges based on the evidence they have now.
 
Guys, there is absolutely NO way it will be upgraded to murder.

Murder is the INTENT to kill someone. There is no evidence at all that Murray intended to kill Michael. He didn't start plotting his demise one day, he didn't wake up one morning and suddenly happen upon the idea of murdering Michael. Michael died because of a stupid mistake from a Doctor that shouldn't have even been practicing. That's all. That's it.

There could be some greater conspiracy around the whole thing, but at the end of the day Murray had no intent what so ever to kill Michael that night. So it'll never be murder.

Yes, we're all hurt and angry that Michael is gone but condemning a man with a charge that he doesn't qualify for at all is not the right way to go about it.
 
2nd degree murder charge doesn't require intent.
 
They are never going to increase the charges, just hoping that we can get some kind of justice for Michael and all of those who loved him.
 
kindofdisco said:
Murder is the INTENT to kill someone.
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Murder is the unlawful killing of a person with malice aforethought.

188. Such malice may be express or implied. It is express when
there is manifested a deliberate intention unlawfully to take away
the life of a fellow creature. It is implied, when no considerable
provocation appears, or when the circumstances attending the killing
show an abandoned and malignant heart. (California Penal Code).
 
kindofdisco said:
Guys, there is absolutely NO way it will be upgraded to murder.

Murder is the INTENT to kill someone. There is no evidence at all that Murray intended to kill Michael. He didn't start plotting his demise one day, he didn't wake up one morning and suddenly happen upon the idea of murdering Michael. Michael died because of a stupid mistake from a Doctor that shouldn't have even been practicing. That's all. That's it.

There could be some greater conspiracy around the whole thing, but at the end of the day Murray had no intent what so ever to kill Michael that night. So it'll never be murder.

Yes, we're all hurt and angry that Michael is gone but condemning a man with a charge that he doesn't qualify for at all is not the right way to go about it.
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the discussion re upgrading the charges was in relation to murder 2. actions that are a gross disregard for human life and do not require intent.
 
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