Open General discussion - Katherine Jackson vs AEG

[Tygger]

Very interesting that a “big win” is the major discussion point in Opri’s comments. This trial has been described as a ‘David versus Goliath’ case actually.

I think oral or implied contract is easy in this case.

Murray was listed as "production cost" hence 95 % but they said it was a mistake and he actually should be listed as "artist advance" hence 100%

Ivy, the plaintiffs’ lawyers want you as a juror! They are trying to prove the doctor was working implicitly for AEG. AEG believes there was no employment for them because there was no express (signed) contract and Michael hired him.

The doctor was listed as a production cost and Trell said it was an error but, it was never corrected. It was submitted to the Estate as a production cost of $300,000, then corrected to $0 but, never removed as a production cost. Will jurors believe it was an advance or a production cost for an independent contractor allegedly hired implicitly? We shall see.

I'm not sure who the jury was laughing at PG or at Panish honestly, it sounded exagerated and a time waster.

i suspect the J lawyers have nothing to "incriminate" PG with the History tour, or they are waiting to catch him in a huge lie later, you never know.

Bouee, the jurors, Panish, and the judge were laughing at Gongaware. Panish actually referenced ‘repressed memories’ that are recovered in about three to four years; very similar to another situation we are aware of. The plaintiffs’ lawyers have laid the foundation for jurors that Gongaware is not to be trusted. We shall see if the jurors truly believe this.

Regarding Phillips/Ortega, maybe Phillips feared Ortega would go public with his feeling on Michael’s health issues and he sought to prevent this?

Thrill, Troubleman84: Trell testified Tohme verbally committed Michael to 50 shows. Phillips said in the criminal trial, Tohme verbally agreed and then, Michael verbally agreed. However, no changes were allowed unless in writing. There is no signature to approve those 50 shows, only 31. There were a few documents that needed to be signed after Michael passed and AEG used Tohme and/or Dileo’s signatures in lieu of Michael’s. Only one document was not signed and that was the employment contract for the doctor. AEG has maintained Michael did not sign the contract so the doctor was not paid and the doctor was Michael's employee. However, others have been paid after Michael’s passing and without Michael’s signature.

I do not believe Michael did not rehearse for the History Tour. Michael was raised to rehearse and perfect his performances. Michael danced for hours when he was not on tour just to perfect his performances. Michael at least had to know where his mark was onstage. This response from Gongaware is not believable.

 

[bouee]

Paul Congaware said MJ did not rehearse once for the HIStory tour and he nailed it.

There are so much focus on MJ not rehearsing for This is It when a) MJ was not required to and B) it seems like some ppl from AEG were not worried about it cuz they knew MJ would be amazing when being on stage.

So why all this fuss about him "missing" rehearsals that got everybody worried? It seems as the plaintiff and some witnesses tries to portray MJ missing rehearsals being a sign that something was wrong when it can just have been that MJ wasnt too keen on rehearsing in general.

I agree , there's something weird here.
What PG is saying, and Phillips said the same thing at Murray's trial , is that it was not AEG's problem if Michael rehearsed or not. If you look at the contract AEG-Michael, the artist has no obligation to rehearse. Pg said it was common, usually artists are not required to rehearse in their contract.

That's the legal aspect of things, what's in the contract and what is not. Then there is real life : if you are Bob Dylan and you are doing a show on your own with you guitar, I can understand there is no need to rehearse.
If you ar MJ, Madonna, Kylie Minogue,with huge show and a lot of people on stage , special effcts, etcc...You need to rehearse.


The Michael "never rehearsed once" for History tour is either probably not true or mis reported. Maybe he said simething like "he didn't rehearse much" for History tour.

There's a contradiction here , MJ missed 5-6 reharsals , 2-3 first week of june, 1 on 13th june, then 19th june, and there's a problem everytime. First he is asked to come back, then there's those e mails and "planned intervention" (with Pg and Phillips) , then june 19th.

PG is saying it was Ortega's problem. Technically , it was, but I think there's a bit of hypocrisy here.

"Michael was obviously NOT OK, as per all those emails." Bouee

Except for Bugzee's email, the other ones come mostly from one date 6/19--I think it's agreed by all he was not ok on that date. The issue is was he ok the other dates? Since he had the best rehearsals the 2 days before we lost him, how can be ok then when not ok before? This is the basic confusion at the core--how was he actually in terms of health? Was he the basketcase at death's door portrayed by Karen and the other lady, was he fine according to people like Stacey Walker, or PG? The autopsy report said he was healthier than other people his age. It's hard to say on one hand you have a hospice patient at end stage and yet when you do the autopsy, he is healthier than average. When MJ said I'm fine--was he lying/covering up or was he telling the truth? If he was so bad off on the 19th, how come he does so well the 24th and 25th?

Bugzee's e mail says 8 weeks+ mentions spins

Yes, the confusion IS important. AEG wants to make it sound like the 19th was an isolated incident, Jacksons want to show it was obvious before that.

I think the Jacksons are right, based on the emails + testimonies. Anyway that's how I see it. Maybe not as exagerated as Karen puts it, but it was there, and I think Pg was aware of it. I will post another mail about that, later in this post.

Good exapmple EMS version (hopsice patient) vs Coroner version : both of them are healthcare professionals, talking about the same person, they saw MJ almost at the same time. The problem was the drugs, ie "Murray's treatment' , other than that Michael was in good health, that's why you have a difference between how Michael looked , and how he really was. T
That's why problems started showing in may/june, not before.
There were posts in this thread yesterday at about the same time as now, about if Murray's treatment changed after the 20th. I made a post with the relevant parts of dr Shafer's Q&A. That can help understand some things .

I won't "judge" or talk about Michael saying he was fine, because I don't know what he thought, and especially what Murray told him. I don't believe for a second Michael was the only one Murray did not lie to. So Michael didn't know the truth about his own health IMO.

I find it a bit odd that Ms. Rowe would ask Ms. Faye to bring the "patches." Why wouldn't she just carry them herself, I mean, she was a nurse, and probably had more legitimacy for carry such items, unlike the make-up artist. Weird!

That would make more sense if Debbie wasn't there. I think she wasn't (otherwise Karen would have been fired during the dangerous tour, logical, no ? LOL)

What about the contracts of Al (the bassists) and Orianthi? There were something about their contracts not being signed but they got paid or Im I wrong? It was brought up in court. Someone can refresh my memory?

My understanding : these contracts did not require Michael's signature, so there was no problem : they were signed after Michael's death, and they got paid.

-----------

About today's testimony, i thought many questions by Putnam were a waste of time. PG had already given clear answers, I don't understand the need to ask again.

That thing with the schedule artwork could be easily cleared if they showed it was done after the dates change, PG said they rescheduled 4 shows. Maybe it's the way it was reported.

Again, Gongaware is full of conrtradictions, I find his story really shaky, and Putnam questionning him doesn't help.

for example :

ABC7 Court News ‏@ABC7Courts 10 h
Gongaware said he's been on tour before where an artist had chiropractors, but couldn't remember being in one with a doctor.
Ouvrir
ABC7 Court News ABC7 Court News ‏@ABC7Courts 10 h
Gongaware said other artists take doctors as well, so he was not the only one and it didn't surprise him.

Which one is it ?

from the e mails

5th May 09

Email on 5/5/09 from Gongaware to Carla Garcia: Pray for me. This is a nightmare. Not coincidentally, I have them now every night. Cold sweats too. Life used to be so much fun... (ABC7) It was not an admission that he was concerned about Jackson's ability to do the show, he said. "It was just playing around, joking," with AEG President Tim Leiweke's assistant, Carla Garcia, he testified. "Carla is an absolute babe and I was just chatting her up," he said. (CNN)


6th May 09

Gongaware on 6/5/09 in response to Sunday Mirror Query: "We can only make this work, of course, if MJ puts on the best show of his life.
Email cont'd: I'm here to tell you that be will. I have seen it for myself. Last night he ran 9 songs with full band, singers and dancers.
Email cont'd: Sang every one, he was amazing, captivating, riveting. And he's just getting started.
Email cont'd: Taking it one step further. When people realize that bulls**t the press has been, they will be in receptive mood for the truth
Email cont'd: Hey look. No skin cancer. He's just a good dad, loving raising his kids. His art and his craft are paramount.
Email cont'd: A gentile, loving man who does care about people. "The shows were going to be spectacular," Gongaware said.

Gongaware testified he woke up to one gossip headline pretty much every day. His idea was simply to ignore the tabloids.

Anthony McCartney ‏@mccartneyAP 7 h
Gongaware said he urged the press agents not to respond. He wanted Jackson’s performance to speak for itself & silence skeptics.

Why does he answers to tabloid, then ?

I'm not sure it was a good idea to bring this e mail to the Sunday Mirror. From another website, Jacksons brought up another e mail from PG on his first day of testimony. It was an e mail he wrote in 2007/2008 to convince (Thome ? it was not clear who he sent that to) to work with AEG. So of course, PG was saying AEG was the best promoter / producer ever and exagerated some stuff.
Jacskons used it to say that the opposite happened , in their opinion, it showed PG was a liar. I thought that was a bit weird, at this point, in 2007, PG was only trying to get the shows. That e mail and that part of the the testimony was insignificant IMO.

Now Putnam does the same thing. Of course PG is going to exagerate things , he's talking to a tabloid, and he is a show promoter. I don't see the point in bringing this up.

------

End of may 09

Dancer and choreographer Alif Sankey told a jury that MJ appeared thin and unprepared for the rigors of the shows. She testified that a month before MJ’s death, she wrote an email to tour director Kenny Ortega urging him to try to improve the singer's health and spirits. She says she never received a reply. (AP)
Sankey wrote to Ortega: "Please help me help you to get him back into that Magical Light, please let me help you help him find what was lost, his GRAIL," She wrote that she knew what she could say to Jackson that would make him respond and also offered suggestions to help lessen the pain of rehearsals.(AP)

Gongaware on 5/27/09: The Kid is healthy and rehearsing every day. He was still there at dance rehearsals at 9pm last night when I left.
ABC7 Court News ‏@ABC7Courts 5 h
Email cont'd: Our redemption will be when he does his shows, that makes all of this build up so damn sweet.
ABC7 Court News ‏@ABC7Courts 5 h
Email cont'd: We don't have to sell tickets, so we can just sit back and prove them wrong by just doing it.

Gongaware said earlier in his testimony he was at the rehearsal facility everyday, but mostly in the offices, not actually watching the rehearsals. It would be interesting to know who he wrote that to.
The feeling I get is that he was there when everything was fine, and miraculously not there when there were problems.

 

[Bubs]

One question, did Mr. Panish mention Debbie Rowe in his opening statements?

I saw you got your answer already.

Debbie is going to testify that she saw MJ to be put under in his hotel room, but the hitch is, was Gongaware in that hotel room too?
When MJ was put under, was there open door so anyone could come and go and see what was happening?
I would think that after the show, everybody went to their own rooms and rested, or even if they talked after the show, I doubt it was done in MJ's bedroom while doctor was there putting MJ under the propofol.
So did Gonga saw anything?


@Lasttear
"I know I'm totally speaking out of turn but, timing.... Paris/Debbie....Kai/Jacksons. hmmmmm"

That crossed my mind too.

 

[Thrill]

Thrill, Troubleman84: Trell testified Tohme verbally committed Michael to 50 shows. Phillips said in the criminal trial, Tohme verbally agreed and then, Michael verbally agreed. However, no changes were allowed unless in writing. There is no signature to approve those 50 shows, only 31. There were a few documents that needed to be signed after Michael passed and AEG used Tohme and/or Dileo’s signatures in lieu of Michael’s. Only one document was not signed and that was the employment contract for the doctor. AEG has maintained Michael did not sign the contract so the doctor was not paid and the doctor was Michael's employee. However, others have been paid after Michael’s passing and without Michael’s signature.

i agree 100% and i find this very critical of fans and aeg.

- AEG keeps on stating the contract with dr murray was not fully executed, therefore he was not hired and not paid. i saw that post earlier that Orianthis, Alfred Dunbars and Michael Beardens contract was also under negotiation and not completed as of june 25 but they got paid. why was these band members paid but not murray?? even if only Murrays contract required Mjs signature as well, it doesnt matter because the other documents were obviously not completed as well, so in other words - going by aegs logic - this means they were also not hired.

- any change in the contract required a WRITTEN approval but there are non re the addition of 19 shows. aeg keeps on talking about the importance of fully executed contracts but heck they obviously did not care enough to have a new/updated WRITTEN contract with the addition of the shows, inspite it being required. how can you take them seriously if themselves did not care to have an updated contract with the extra shows added. shame.

AEG SHOULD HAVE NEVER ANNOUNCED THE 50 SHOWS WITHOUT MICHAELS SIGNATURE ON THAT DOCUMENT IMO!!!! Thats unprofessional.

you cant defend that. even IF tohme told them to add extra shows, they should have talked with michael and had him sign the papers as it was required. the fans that met Michael was told he felt pressured when it was announces the extra 19 shows (now 50 shows). dr thome ****ed up royally in terms of adding extra shows and it added more pressure and stress on michael.

 

[Bubs]

@bouee
Putnam really said this?
I mean, that is not possible. Debbie was pregnant with Prince.

Debbie was with Dr. Klein for a time (one leg perhaps?) on the Dangerous-Tour.

Putnam didn't mention the name of the tour, he said: She remembers Michael being given Propofol in Munich, London and Paris

Prince was born February 97
She could have been with MJ on second leg of History tour which were from June 27 onwards (4 months after Prince was born) and those cities meantioned were on the second leg of History tour.

Or she could have been there during 1st leg of Dangerous tour 92. I looked the dates for
Munich - June 27, 1992
London - July 30, 1992, July 31, 1992, August 20, 1992, August 22, 1992, August 23, 1992
Paris - September 13, 1992

 

[Bubs]

@bouee, Perhaps you/we will get a better understanding of that meeting when Ortega takes the stand. I would like to know from someone else how Michael appeared that day. Although we will probably still get confused if Kai Chase does testify that a vase was broken.

That vase thingy is curious. I was thinking that there were bunch of people in the room and someone leaned in the wrong place, or waived hands, and the case fell on the floor. Given that there is all sort of conspiracy theories going on, the only approved scenario for broken vase on the floor is: someone one threw it on the floor

Kai wasn't in the room so she cannot say how the vase ended up on the floor, she can only testify that she saw broken vase on the floor after the meeting. What if someone pushed the vase on the floor by accident? I has happened to me and I believe for many others too

 

[bouee]

i agree 100% and i find this very critical of fans and aeg.

- AEG keeps on stating the contract with dr murray was not fully executed, therefore he was not hired and not paid. i saw that post earlier that Orianthis, Alfred Dunbars and Michael Beardens contract was also under negotiation and not completed as of june 25 but they got paid. why was these band members paid but not murray?? even if only Murrays contract required Mjs signature as well, it doesnt matter because the other documents were obviously not completed as well, so in other words - going by aegs logic - this means they were also not hired.

I'm not talking about 50 vs 31, shows, just about Murray's contract (you do have a point IMO about the sigantures on 31/50 shows).

Tygger's point is very interesting, saying thet other papers were signed after Michael's death by Tohme or Frank, except Murray's contract. It's very interesting in the context of this trial, for the hiring/retaining part.

Technically Murray's contract was not "executed", ie signed, and it was not signed presumably because Michael died before he could. (@ Big Apple, NOT a false info !!! :wink. Now we can argue that maybe Michael did not want Murray anymore, but he never told AEG, so for them Michael wanted Murray. That's their argument so far, Michael wanted Murray, not us. We did not check his background because Michael wanted THIS doctor. So the unexecuted argument is not logical , in itself. It will be for the jury to decide which is which.

Now, let's go to real life, who wants Murray to be paid for his "work" ?? No one on this board, no one in that courtroom, and no one in the rest of the world (or maybe 2% , haters, crazy people, or masochists). AEG did the right thing not paying him, and so did the right thing NOT asking DiLeo or Tohme's signatures on that paper. Would they have agreed to sign this, after Michael died ? I don't think so.

It's a trial about liability, so that's why this is brought up, and that's the only reason why it's interesting in this context.

It was explained before that other contractors' contracts did not resuire Michael's signature, they worked, so they got paid, it's normal.

That vase thingy is curious. I was thinking that there were bunch of people in the room and someone leaned in the wrong place, or waived hands, and the case fell on the floor. Given that there is all sort of conspiracy theories going on, the only approved scenario for broken vase on the floor is: someone one threw it on the floor

Kai wasn't in the room so she cannot say how the vase ended up on the floor, she can only testify that she saw broken vase on the floor after the meeting. What if someone pushed the vase on the floor by accident? I has happened to me and I believe for many others too

I read somewhere (could not tell you where) that it was not only a broken vase, Michael also left the room visibly upset, raised voics, etc...according to the thing I read.

 

[LastTear]

I'm sure AEG lawyers will use the fact Kai now works for the Jacksons to raise doubt over her testimony if necessary.

Can we all pay attention to this quote from bouee

It was explained before that other contractors' contracts did not resuire Michael's signature, they worked, so they got paid, it's normal

But even so, are you all surprised that Murray wasn't paid after killing Michael?

 

[Bubs]

ABC7 Court News ?@ABC7Courts 13h
Gongaware said he doesn't think a doctor's financial situation has anything to do with being an ethical doctor.
Gongaware said it never crossed his mind to either do a background check on Dr. Murray or to suggest to anyone to do it.
"I just expect doctors to be ethical, the financial side of their lives shouldn't have impact on their medical decision," Gongaware opined.

I agree with him. Prior to 06/25/2009 I had exactly the same outlook about doctor, never came to my mind that the are doctors like CM out there.
------------------------------------------------
Gongaware on 5/27/09:
The Kid is healthy and rehearsing every day. He was still there at dance rehearsals at 9pm last night when I left.
Email cont'd: Our redemption will be when he does his shows, that makes all of this build up so damn sweet.
Email cont'd: We don't have to sell tickets, so we can just sit back and prove them wrong by just doing it.

This shows me that Gonga calling MJ as Mikey is just a nick name and no intended as degrading way. In this email he calls him kid (50 year old kid) and show they have great trust on MJ ability to make TII huge success.
Plaintiffs are trying their best to show to jurors that AEG were calling MJ in all sort of names, but luckily AEG has emails to show the whole picture, like Gonga calling MJ a kid.
-------------------------------------------
"I think the live audience would be just captivated by it," Gongaware said about the little girl running after the last plant on Earth song.
End of the show would be 3D animation. An airplane taxis up, door opens, Michael entered the plane.
The airplane door closes, MJ would actually take an elevator down and out of the building, but plane would take off over the audience.

Ooh, I would've wanted to see that:-(

 

[LastTear]

Putnam didn't mention the name of the tour, he said: She remembers Michael being given Propofol in Munich, London and Paris

Prince was born February 97
She could have been with MJ on second leg of History tour which were from June 27 onwards (4 months after Prince was born) and those cities meantioned were on the second leg of History tour.

Or she could have been there during 1st leg of Dangerous tour 92. I looked the dates for
Munich - June 27, 1992
London - July 30, 1992, July 31, 1992, August 20, 1992, August 22, 1992, August 23, 1992
Paris - September 13, 1992

Debbie was definitely present for the second leg, she was certainly at the Wembley shows. The first leg, I'm sure I saw pictures of her, so she was around but whether she was there for the whole tour idk.

 

[bouee]

Putnam didn't mention the name of the tour, he said: She remembers Michael being given Propofol in Munich, London and Paris

Prince was born February 97
She could have been with MJ on second leg of History tour which were from June 27 onwards (4 months after Prince was born) and those cities meantioned were on the second leg of History tour.

Or she could have been there during 1st leg of Dangerous tour 92. I looked the dates for
Munich - June 27, 1992
London - July 30, 1992, July 31, 1992, August 20, 1992, August 22, 1992, August 23, 1992
Paris - September 13, 1992

Gongaware said he did not have a general concern with MJ having a drug addiction. After shows ended in Hawaii, Michael had lost $27 million, was in debt $11 million to lighting and sound, Gongaware testified. He switched managers to fixed things up in yhe second half of the tour, Gongaware explained. Gongaware said he had to cut lot of expenses. They wanted to give Michael the same show, but he said there was so much excess to be trimmed. Second half of the tour, Gongaware was the tour executive and he worked directly for MJ. It netted $14 million, $11 million paid vendors. We got the tour to break even, Gongaware testified, saying he worked closely with Jackson on the second half of the tour.(ABC7)

Pg says he sarted to work on the second half of the tour (not leg). After Hawaii. How many mangers were there for History tour, I think 3 ?.Does anyone remember the dates ?

Hawaii ended on 4th juanuary 97.

Second leg started in Bremen, on 31st may 97.

Paris : june 27th-29th 97

Munich : july 4th-july 6th 97

London : July 12th -15th-17th -97

Now wasn't Michael satying mostly in Paris during the west European part (with Prince) ?

There was a very short 3rd leg , 2 first weeks of october 97 , in Africa.


So if PG was there , the next thing will be to make it clear if he knew or not. He can always argue (and that could be true) that he didn't know that these persons were doctors.

 

[Bubs]

I read somewhere (could not tell you where) that it was not only a broken vase, Michael also left the room visibly upset, raised voics, etc...according to the thing I read.

What if Philips or Gonga or anyone in the room were swinging their arms when they talked and hit the vase, and MJ got upset because it was invaluable vase from Ming dynasty so he got upset with the guilty person and could have even coursed that person

Seriously, we have to wait until we hear what happened there.

So if PG was there , the next thing will be to make it clear if he knew or not. He can always argue (and that could be true) that he didn't know that these persons were doctors.

First of all, we do not know whether concert managers (or whatever was PG's title) and doctor came face to face during the concerts and secondly whatever and however these docs treated MJ, they weren't doing it on plain view for everyone. It happened in MJ's room out of everyones sight.

 

[bouee]

What if Philips or Gonga were swinging their arms when they talked and hit the vase, and MJ got upset because it was invaluable vase from Ming dynasty so he got upset with the guilty person and could have even coursed that person

Seriously, we have to wait until we hear what happened there.

LOL ! yes, maybe Michael was showing them a dance move, they tried it, failed, and broke a vase, Michael was upset and left... :wink:

That's exactly what I'm saying, we need to wait, I agree.

 

[bouee]

Debbie was definitely present for the second leg, she was certainly at the Wembley shows. The first leg, I'm sure I saw pictures of her, so she was around but whether she was there for the whole tour idk.

Yes, Lisa Marie was around too. So maybe Debbie was not always there.

 

[Big Apple2]

AEG SHOULD HAVE NEVER ANNOUNCED THE 50 SHOWS WITHOUT MICHAELS SIGNATURE ON THAT DOCUMENT IMO!!!! Thats unprofessional.

In my opinion, the bigger question is: Did Thome-Thome have POWER OF ATTORNEY at the time in question? If so, why?

Speaking of the good "Dr." Thome, I wonder if he will actually make it to the witness stand (is he on both witness list). I mean, now that dude is one Smooth Criminal, in my opinion.

I notice that his name is starting to creep up around here, but will the man of many, MANY mysteries actually make it to the witness stand. His connection to Jermaine Jacksun, will that be exposed? Time will tell. I'm sure his role will be down played, as to not expose Jermaine to any of Thome's shenanigans.

 

[bouee]

First of all, we do not know whether concert managers (or whatever was PG's title) and doctor came face to face during the concerts and secondly whatever and however these docs treated MJ, they weren't doing it on plain view for everyone. It happened in MJ's room out of everyones sight.

Pg said there was no doctor on History tour + he was handling the finances.

ABC7 Court News ?@ABC7Courts 15 h
Putnam: Did you contemplate bringing a doctor on tour? Gongaware: I didn't think he needed one, we didn't have one in History, he was fine

Still he could say he didn't know, if doctors were paid by Michael directly.

 

[LastTear]

Yes, Lisa Marie was around too. So maybe Debbie was not always there.

Yes I'm sure it was a careful juggling act! Lol OT Remind me, was this the time LMP bleached her hair blond?

 

[Big Apple2]

Oh and I have to admit, I really liked Mr. Gongaware's response to the UK press regarding all of those "Michael Jackson Has Cancer" stories. He not only did a good job, he also put the press on blast. That was sweet.

I remember all of those stories, and they made me so upset, but having Michael give an excellent performance would have been SWEET revenge for sure. Man, I wish he would have had that opportunity.

I also remember one time when Michael was leaving Dr. Klein's office and one of his bodyguards was holding a plastic bag filled with whatever and the outside of the plastic bag said "something-something CANCER" and I was like "OMG the press is gonna have a field day with the words on that plastic bag." I guess MJ was in on the joke and was doing his part to amp up the media.

 

[LastTear]

Pg said there was no doctor on History tour + he was handling the finances.


Still he could say he didn't know, if doctors were paid by Michael directly.

We have to remember that we are only reading a tweet, if we take a days testimony from the list of tweets we receive then a court day would last about 30 mins. But yes it needs clarifying, no tour doctor hired doesn't mean there were no doctors at all, just that one wasn't hired to follow the tour.

 

[bouee]

Yes I'm sure it was a careful juggling act! Lol OT Remind me, was this the time LMP bleached her hair blond?

Lol !!! I don't know ...:fool: sorry ...

 

[bouee]

We have to remember that we are only reading a tweet, if we take a days testimony from the list of tweets we receive then a court day would last about 30 mins. But yes it needs clarifying, no tour doctor hired doesn't mean there were no doctors at all, just that one wasn't hired to follow the tour.

Yes, and if they were paid by Michael, he didn't necesarily know they were doctors.

 

[LastTear]

Oh and I have to admit, I really liked Mr. Gongaware's response to the UK press regarding all of those "Michael Jackson Has Cancer" stories. He not only did a good job, he also put the press on blast. That was sweet.

I remember all of those stories, and they made me so upset, but having Michael give an excellent performance would have been SWEET revenge for sure. Man, I wish he would have had that opportunity.

I also remember one time when Michael was leaving Dr. Klein's office and one of his bodyguards was holding a plastic bag filled with whatever and the outside of the plastic bag said "something-something CANCER" and I was like "OMG the press is gonna have a field day with the words on that plastic bag." I guess MJ was in on the joke and was doing his part to amp up the media.

These emails actually upset me emotionally far more than the not so nice ones. I may be premature but I take from them that Gongaware really liked Michael as a performer and as a person.

Lol !!! I don't know ...:fool: sorry ...

I will have to look it up, but I'm sure it was around that time. Lol

 

[Big Apple2]

I may be premature but I take from them that Gongaware really liked Michael as a performer and as a person.

Yeah, I totally agree.

I also noticed from yesterday's tweets that Mr. Gongaware mentioned Michael being a wonderful father, something that folks who have been around Michael and his children have always said. Lost in all of the drug talk and Alan Duke's "mini-clinic" talk, it was nice to be reminded how great a father Michael was and not some drugged up loon who couldn't tie his own shoe.

 

[Big Apple2]

Can somebody confirm whether or not Thome-Thome is on both witness list, on one witness, or not a witness at all. Thanks!

 

[LastTear]

^^^^^ Yes, he is on the list for AEG.

 

[Bubs]

In my opinion, the bigger question is: Did Thome-Thome have POWER OF ATTORNEY at the time in question? If so, why?

Speaking of the good "Dr." Thome, I wonder if he will actually make it to the witness stand (is he on both witness list). I mean, now that dude is one Smooth Criminal, in my opinion.

I notice that his name is starting to creep up around here, but will the man of many, MANY mysteries actually make it to the witness stand. His connection to Jermaine Jacksun, will that be exposed? Time will tell. I'm sure his role will be down played, as to not expose Jermaine to any of Thome's shenanigans.

I defenitely agree with you about Tohme's role being downplayed here, and yes at some stage he had POA.
People are accusing AEG "forcing" Mj to do extra 19 concerts, but what went on behing the scenes, we have no idea and why AEG accepted Tohme's word that MJ would do those ectra dates.
I'm want to know why the hell Tohme had a such a power to tell AEG MJ would do those shows and why MJ didn't decline or raised his voice about those dates. Certainly if he was in the position to say no, he would have voiced his disapproval.
It is whether MJ badly needed the money that those gigs, or Tohme did something that MJ couldn't get away from those dates.
But I wouldn't be looking into AEG being guilty of those dates, I would look into Tohme's direction, he delivered MJ's head to AEG on gold platter, and they are not that stupid not to take it.

Or it could be just plain explanation that Tohme asked MJ would he do 19 extra dates, MJ said ok, Tohme delivered that info to AEG, and so it went. Some people to say that MJ said he wanted to do only 10, but that is not going to explain how his contract includes 31 dates.

 

[Big Apple2]

^^^^^ Yes, he is on the list for AEG.

LOL! I was correct then. Mother's side are not calling Thome, because they "probably" don't want the Jermaine connection to be put on blast.

(Thanks LastTear.)

 

[Big Apple2]

I defenitely agree with you about Tohme's role being downplayed here, and yes at some stage he had POA.
People are accusing AEG "forcing" Mj to do extra 19 concerts, but what went on behing the scenes, we have no idea and why AEG accepted Tohme's word that MJ would do those ectra dates.
I'm want to know why the hell Tohme had a such a power to tell AEG MJ would do those shows and why MJ didn't decline or raised his voice about those dates. Certainly if he was in the position to say no, he would have voiced his disapproval.

It is whether MJ badly needed the money that those gigs, or Tohme did something that MJ couldn't get away from those dates.
But I wouldn't be looking into AEG being guilty of those dates, I would look into Tohme's direction, he delivered MJ's head to AEG on gold platter, and they are not that stupid not to take it.

Or it could be just plain explanation that Tohme asked MJ would he do 19 extra dates, MJ said ok, Tohme delivered that info to AEG, and so it went. Some people to say that MJ said he wanted to do only 10, but that is not going to explain how his contract includes 31 dates.

This is a little off topic, but did Michael make a practice of giving his Power Of Attorney to his manager's? I "think" at one point Weisner had it also. Did Frank DiLeo ever have it?

As to the 10 shows, there is no way that AEG and/or MJ would have put all of that work AND money into a show which would only be for 10 dates. No way! For that reason alone, I never scribed to the theory that the O2 dates were supposed to be for only 10 shows.

As toTohme-Tohme, there is just no telling what he did behind Michael's back. I'm reminded of the 5 MILLION DOLLARS he "claimed" he was holding for Michael in order to purchase a home in Vegas. I mean, for all anybody knows, Tohme could have been holding 10 Million Dollars and after Michael died, he decided to keep 5 Million for himself. Who's to know - right Tohme!

 

[bouee]

Totally OT (or not ! ) wasn't there something in the AEG-Michael contract (I don't have the time to look it up now, but it's somewhere in the testimonies of this trial, at the beginnig, maybe Trell or Julie Hollander) about an advance for the LV house ? Was it 5 millions ?

I'm thinking maybe Tohme was asked to give them back, because this money was missing from Michael's account, or paid directly to Tohme .

 

[Bubs]

MJ had different type of managers, DiLeo wasn't that king of manager that handled business issues (I think). Business manager/personal manager are different I think?
I just have to wonder that Tohme had POA, but even Frank would have been more experienced and qualified to handle those things that he did. Tohme had no background of what he did to MJ (and he badly messed up everything).
Thanks Jermaine, like MJ didn't have enought of those creepy crawlies in his life :no: