Open General discussion - Katherine Jackson vs AEG

[8701girl]

No doubt Brian Pannish is a smart lawyer, but I wonder if he knew what he was getting into with this family?

I dont think he wouldve got involved with them if he knew what they were really like.

 

[Justthefacts]

I'll try to do summary of all three experts from partial depositions before I go to bed

Ivy, much appreciated

 

[jamba]

I believe Biggs is not only a clown but an exposed liar . The jury got to know how he lied on purpose regarding MJ's share in the catalouge , when he had the nerve to say under oath MJ was in $ 400 millions in debt but had no asset worth anything near $ 200 , 300 or 400 millions. actually after he was forced to admit to his lie there was A LONG PAUSE in the court room .

A liar when he testified that he built his estaimation on a Jacksons' expert who said due to Murray's presence in MJ's life , MJ had a one week life expectancy . He insisted on deleting Murray from the equation , when he was the very reason for the expert's openion

A paid liar who reviewed all the testimonies from the four doctors however did not believe he had to review the coroner's report while addressing MJ's life expectancy .

The jury already heard what AEG bosses said about the success MJ had , how much hopes they had for the concerts , a $ 700000 paid to lie expert who was impeached heavily would do nothing to change that .

To my mind, Briggs was effective in refuting the claims of Erk (which were so unrealistic IMO) that MJ would have done 4 world tours, going into his 60's. That is my main point for respecting him and his testimony.

As far as saying MJ had one week to live, that came from a Jackson sleep expert, so why is it a lie to use that expert testimony? Briggs did not say MJ would actually die in a week but that he had health and drug dependency issues that would affect his ability to do as many shows as Erk claimed (I think the total was over 300 shows). This seems logical given what the Jackson side has claimed re MJ being so emaciated, weak, etc.

Speaking of the autopsy, the autopsy has been disregarded IMO by both sides in this trial when it is convenient. For example, the Jackson side harp on that photo of MJ in a t-shirt as if he is horrifically underweight, and yet the autopsy said he was within normal weight range at 137 lbs.

As far as assessing the value of the catalogue--I think Briggs said it was equivalent in value to MJ's debt (400 M). The point is trying to assess the value back in 09 as opposed to now is going to present variables. Also, what something is valued at must be compared to what someone else is willing to pay. I might value my house at 250k but in a down market I might get a lot less than that. If MJ could not get investors and sponsors in 09 even after the huge interest in O2 shows, that would affect the valuation of his catalogue (I am guessing here b/c obviously I am not an expert).

However, it's clear that the valuation of the catalogue is something that is hard to pin down and I have read various estimates that range quite widely and to my mind an estimate in 09 of 400 M for MJ's half is credible. You would have to go back to articles in 09 that refer to the value of the catalogue at that time. I do not believe the catalogue was valued at 1 billion in 09.

 

[Justthefacts]

I dont think he wouldve got involved with them if he knew what they were really like.

IMO it seems that there were things they kept from him

 

[jamba]

so briggs also nailed it when he said he couldnt calculate how much money mj would've made cus thats speculative??????? So Briggs nailed it when it turned out he based his theory on a survey of 1800 ppl in the US?? so briggs nailed it when he UNDERVALUED sony/atv???? apparently he did an amazing job valuing the catalogue because thanks to him the IRS is investigating it now. LMAOOO. briggs was the biggest clown in this mess so far and his paid ass was sweating on the witnessstand....

Yes, I agree that it is speculative to put a dollar amt on what MJ would have made had he not died. B/c 1) we don't know how long he would have lived had he not died and 2) we don't know if he would have done all the tours or any tours after TII. He said he wanted to do film, not tour. So this is my opinion on that issue and that is my main reason for thinking Briggs is less a clown than Erk.

 

[Ashtanga]

*big sigh*

 

[Soundmind]

To my mind, Briggs was effective in refuting the claims of Erk (which were so unrealistic IMO) that MJ would have done 4 world tours, going into his 60's. That is my main point for respecting him and his testimony.

As far as saying MJ had one week to live, that came from a Jackson sleep expert, so why is it a lie to use that expert testimony? Briggs did not say MJ would actually die in a week but that he had health and drug dependency issues that would affect his ability to do as many shows as Erk claimed (I think the total was over 300 shows). This seems logical given what the Jackson side has claimed re MJ being so emaciated, weak, etc.

Speaking of the autopsy, the autopsy has been disregarded IMO by both sides in this trial when it is convenient. For example, the Jackson side harp on that photo of MJ in a t-shirt as if he is horrifically underweight, and yet the autopsy said he was within normal weight range at 137 lbs.

As far as assessing the value of the catalogue--I think Briggs said it was equivalent in value to MJ's debt (400 M). The point is trying to assess the value back in 09 as opposed to now is going to present variables. Also, what something is valued at must be compared to what someone else is willing to pay. I might value my house at 250k but in a down market I might get a lot less than that. If MJ could not get investors and sponsors in 09 even after the huge interest in O2 shows, that would affect the valuation of his catalogue (I am guessing here b/c obviously I am not an expert).

However, it's clear that the valuation of the catalogue is something that is hard to pin down and I have read various estimates that range quite widely and to my mind an estimate in 09 of 400 M for MJ's half is credible. You would have to go back to articles in 09 that refer to the value of the catalogue at that time. I do not believe the catalogue was valued at 1 billion in 09.

The one week life expectancy solely due to Murray's pretense in his life. When Brigss deliberately omit the REASON the BASIS for the expert opinion then he is twisting the fact , misrepresenting the statement , lying period .

in 2007 TMZ posted legal documents in which MJ's share ALONE in the catalouge was worth more than billion . the title was Jackson was very cash poor , that he had a net worth 1200 millions but only $ 600000 in cash .

He did not say his debt equaled his assets he said he was 400 millions in debt , and he was not aware at all of him owning any asset that was worth as low as 200 $ let alone 300 and 400 millions , admitted eventually after continuous denies that according to the RIS the value was more by 100 to 300 millions . from 200 millions to 500 or 700 millions that a huge margin to dismiss . As you know IRS estimations are much less than what is the price in reality. So the value is much higher , he definitely was aware but hid behind confidentiality until he was cornered and had to answer . I had to remind everyone that after he admitted to his lie there was a LONG PAUSE in the court room . -_- He was the less credible witness so far to take the stand , he was impeached on many things , many lies were exposed , unlike other experts no one but him lied so arrogantly

 

[crillon]

^^
isnt this what the trial is about??? somehwere the hiring part got lost.

so far aeg have done nothing to prove that mj was the one that hired murray. they say 'no signature = no contract' but really... why was other ppl working and being PAID bu aeg without a signed contract??

It's not their job. The burden of proof rests with the ones who brought the case--the plaintiffs.

No doubt Brian Pannish is a smart lawyer, but I wonder if he knew what he was getting into with this family?

Panish may be smart about the law, but his behavior in the courtroom is not street-smart or professional. imo

 

[8701girl]

IMO it seems that there were things they kept from him

yep that wouldnt surprise me!

 

[jamba]

The one week life expectancy solely due to Murray's pretense in his life. When Brigss deliberately omit the REASON the BASIS for the expert opinion then he is twisting the fact , misrepresenting the statement , lying period .

in 2007 TMZ posted legal documents in which MJ's share ALONE in the catalouge was worth more than billion . the title was Jackson was very cash poor , that he had a net worth 1200 millions but only $ 600000 in cash .

He did not say his debt equaled his assets he said he was 400 millions in debt , and he was not aware at all of him owning any asset that was worth as low as 200 $ let alone 300 and 400 millions , admitted eventually after continuous denies that according to the RIS the value was more by 100 to 300 millions . from 200 millions to 500 or 700 millions that a huge margin to dismiss . As you know IRS estimations are much less than what is the price in reality. So the value is much higher , he definitely was aware but hid behind confidentiality until he was cornered and had to answer . I had to remind everyone that after he admitted to his lie there was a LONG PAUSE in the court room . -_- He was the less credible witness so far to take the stand , he was impeached on many things , many lies were exposed , unlike other experts no one but him lied so arrogantly

I don't agree with this assessment of his testimony. First, he stated he had evaluated the catalogue 5-10 times and did not want to name the clients he worked for, but the judge insisted he had to answer (which seems to violate the confidentiality of his clients and I wonder why she did that). There were sidebars about it and a bit of anger from the judge re the lawyer Strong who objected to Panish's questions re naming the clients and getting into the work he did or the clients. But Strong kept objecting to Panish's questions and so there was another sidebar. Personally, I am wondering what these other clients have to do with the issues of the trial and why Pazuelos ruled Briggs had to answer.

However, he was forced and then Panish brought up the IRS issue and it was objected to and sustained! So I guess that means it can't factor into decisions by the jury. BTW, the IRS is investigating the evaluation given by Briggs' clients, not Briggs himself.

Regarding the one week testimony--this was given by the guy whose deposition they are now fighting over (Shilman--or some such name) and Briggs referred to that expert testimony. Briggs was asked by Panish, if you take CM out of the equation, there is no death or risk? And Briggs said even without CM in the picture there were risks b/c of MJ's history of cancellations and his drug use. So it isn't correct that he refused to discuss CM and his role--what he said is that there were other risks even if CM is out of the picture (which he wasn't and MJ never indicated he was going to get rid of CM). Now this seems logical to me that if you are going to speculate on future earnings (that never took place) you have to look at risks such as Briggs named.

As far as IRS, I am not aware thst their evaluations are always so much lower than reality. This seems a bad idea for a tax agency. However, the mere fact that they are investigating one of Briggs clients--we don't know if the estimate was the one Briggs gave them--maybe they got other estimates as well as his? Also just b/c IRS is investigating doesn't automatically mean there is fraud on the part of Briggs or his client. Just sayin things are more complex and we don't have all the info.

I am copying some excerpts from the post Ivy gave us on Briggs cross.


Eric Briggs Testimony

Panish held a three ring binder with about 2 inches of documents and asked Briggs if those were all the documents he generated for $650K. Briggs said that binder does not contain everything that he generated. (ABC7)

Panish: Everything contained in this little file is what you generated in this case, correct?
Briggs: By your definition, yes (ABC7)

Panish said the material Briggs generated is about an inch worth of documents. Briggs said that if Panish is defining in printed paper what he generated, then yes. But if he counted deposition and testimony, then no. (ABC7)

Panish: Did you ever make a list of all the depositions you reviewed in this case?
Briggs: I did not put together an exhaustive list. (ABC7)

Briggs said he read thousands of pages of depositions, probably 10K. Panish asked if Briggs made summaries of the depositions. He said no. "I cannot give you an exhaustive list of all the depositions I reviewed in this case," Briggs said. He named about 15/16 people. Briggs said he reviewed the opening statements by both parties, summary judgment and opposition, and the judge's ruling. Briggs said he has only testified once in UK related to a tax case. He has never testified before in a court in the US. The expert didn't summarize the trial testimony he read either. He named about 7 people from whom he read testimony. (ABC7)

Panish: Did you review Billboard Magazine regarding this case?
Briggs: Yes
Panish: You never promoted a concert, have you?
Briggs: I'm not a concert promoter (ABC7)

Briggs also said he has never produced concerts. People in the music industry are his clients, Briggs said. (ABC7)

Panish: And the highest selling album in the history of the world is "Thriller," correct, sir? Briggs: I believe that's correct. The chart stated it sold 65 million. (ABC7)

Panish: You understand the defendants say they are not responsible for anything in this case, right? Briggs: I'm not entirely sure what the defendants said they are responsible for . (ABC7)

"I don't believe the defendants are admitting they owe anything" Briggs said. He said he was asked to opine on plaintiff's damage analysis. Panish: MJ would earn no money in the future had he not died? Briggs: My opinion is that it is speculative to project that he (MJ) would earn money related to work. (ABC7)

Panish: Your opinion, had MJ not died, he would have earned no money, correct?
Briggs: That's not my opinion
Panish: How much would he have made working in concerts?
Briggs: My opinion is that it is speculative to project earnings for future work
Panish: Could he have made money working?
Briggs: Sure, anything is possible (ABC7)

Briggs: My opinion related to Mr. Erk's analysis, which has earning capacity in it. Briggs said his understanding is that future earning capacity is what someone is expected to receive for future work. Panish asked if Briggs has ever testified regarding loss of income in wrongful death or personal injury cases. The expert said no. "I've not done projection of loss of earning capacity," Briggs said. (ABC7)

Briggs said he's worked an average of 50 weeks per year over the past 15 years. Panish calculated it to be about 750 weeks of work. Panish: So you worked on 1300 project in 750 weeks? Briggs: Approximately (ABC7)

Panish showed a document Briggs wrote that was basis for opinion on not getting endorsement is debt. Briggs notes: Challenges with major advertisers given history (drug usage, child abuse, litigation, debt); also negative publicity. Briggs: MJ history of significant debt figured in my opinion that MJ would encounter challenges in securing endorsements. Panish asked if Briggs considered MJ's Sony ATV catalogue, which is one of his assets, to offset the debt. (ABC7)

Panish: How do you know he was in debt?
Briggs: There were extensive testimony in this case about MJ's debt (ABC7)

Panish asked if Briggs knows that MJ had assets with value. Briggs said yes. Panish asked if Briggs knows that MJ's asset, especially one, exceeded the amount of his debt. Briggs said he's concerned about confidentiality agreement in answering this question. Panish: You know, through your own knowledge, that MJ's assets far exceeded his debts when you wrote that on the sheet, don't you sir? (Judge gets mad with Strong for not stopping the objections, tells her to abide by her rulings. Strong continued, judge called a sidebar.) Briggs said he does not know that MJ had assets worth more than 300 or 400 or 500 million when he wrote his opinion . Briggs said he had knowledge of some of MJ's asset.(ABC7)

Panish: Did you value that asset (Sony's catalogue)?
Briggs: Yes
Panish: It's well in excess of $500 million, isn't it, sir?
Briggs: I'm sorry I'm having a trouble here, but I don't want to disclose any confidential information. (ABC7)

There were three sidebars in the afternoon session, one of which was called after Strong repeatedly objected to a line of Panish's questions Panish asked Briggs whether he had done any work valuing Jackson's assets outside of the AEG case. He had, but he didn't want to answer who he had done the work for. He said the work was the subject of confidentiality agreements and he didn't want to violate them. Panish kept pressing for answers and Strong kept objecting, to the point that the judge told her, "Ms. Strong, I've made the ruling." Panish continued asking questions about Briggs' work on Jackson's assets outside of this case, and Strong objected. The judge told Strong again that she should stop objecting, that she'd overruled them. Strong kept talking, and the judge called a sidebar (AP)

Panish asked if the gross value Briggs put for the Sony catalogue is well in excess of the value of MJ's debt. "I don't remember the number," Briggs said. "I did not believe that's the case." Briggs: I believe the testimony the debt associated with Sony ATV catalogue was $400 million. Panish wants to know if the gross value of the catalogue was in excess of the debt. Briggs said no. Briggs said he performed the evaluation of Sony's catalogue many times, and his response was related to June 2009. Briggs said he was working with someone unrelated to this case regarding the value of the Sony catalogue. Briggs asked the judge to instruct him on what he should answer, since Panish wants to know who he was working w/ regarding the catalogue. (ABC7)

Panish: Do you have a conflict of interest in this case?
Briggs: No
P: Have you been clear about your company to testify?
B: Absolutely(ABC7)

Briggs said he's not comfortable disclosing the names of the companies that hired him before. Judge Yvette Palazuelos ordered him to answer. Briggs: In one particular case, a law firm hired us. It was in late 2009, after Michael Jackson had died. Panish asked if before MJ died if any law firm hired his company to assess MJ's assets. Briggs said he doesn't recall. Regarding this asset, the Sony ATV catalogue, Briggs said he worked on evaluating it between 5-10 times. Briggs said he provided his opinion in those engagements, 5 to 10 times, before MJ died, to 3 or 4 third parties. (ABC7)

Panish: Was one of them Sony?
Briggs: Yes
Sony ATV Music Publishing was one of the companies, not Sony music, Briggs said.(ABC7)

Fortress Capital -- Briggs said it was another company. He recalls law firm and there may have been financial companies.
Panish: Goldman Sacks?
Briggs: It's possible, I work on hundreds of projects a year.
Panish: Goldman Sacks hired you regarding MJ, right sir?
Briggs: I don't recall specifically. (ABC7)

When the attorneys came back, Panish continued his questions about Briggs' other clients on Jackson issues. Briggs said he was still uncomfortable discussing the clients.The judge told him to answer the questions with a yes or no answer. There had to be another sidebar before Briggs told jury there had been 5 to 10 "engagements" in which he'd worked on Jackson assets. He said he delivered opinions to 3 or 4 different entities. One of them was Sony-ATV, the massive music catalog MJ has an interest in. Another was Michael Jackson's estate. Briggs said he discussed working on the AEG case with an estate attorney and was told it was OK. Briggs also said the general counsel of his company, FTI Consulting, approved him working as an expert in the AEG Live litigation. (AP)

Briggs never performed an audit for a record company. (ABC7)

Briggs said he watched the testimony of Meglen in the overflow room. He was accompanied by 3 AEG attorneys. (ABC7)

Panish asked if Briggs worked with MJ before being retained in this case. He said yes and that he discussed it with AEG. Briggs testified AEG didn't see the work done in previous engagements as conflict of interest. Briggs said that what was more important to him is what FTI's general counsel thought and they determined there was no conflict of interest. Briggs said he had engagement agreements with a number of entities related to MJ. “I went one step further and told them (AEG) I would not be discussing anything regarding my other work," Briggs said. Panish: Who did you call, have sign waiver in writing about a potential conflict of interest? Briggs said there wasn't anything in writing. "My recollection was the attorneys for the Estate of Michael Jackson," Briggs testified. He said a call took place, doesn't know who called. Briggs was retained on February 8, 2013. He spoke with Jeryll Cohen from MJ Estate and she okay'd him to testify as witness in this case. She was well aware what was going on and approved it. Briggs said he told her he had no interest in sharing the work done for the Estate. Briggs said he spoke with Cohen again about two months ago, and she acknowledged his work on this case. (ABC7)

Briggs receives a salary and bonus based on performance of the division. FTI is a public traded company. Briggs said he thinks the company was approaching $2 billion in revenues last year. (ABC7)

Panish asked Briggs about doing risk assessments, and whether he considered Conrad Murray a significant risk to Jackson's life. The question was based on an expert who testified at deposition that he would have been surprised if Michael Jackson lived another week given Murray's treatments on MJ.Briggs didn't want to say Murray was a risk to Jackson's life, or address medical risks. Briggs said he couldn't offer a medical opinion, but just considered the opinions of other medical experts in the case. Panish questioned whether having a "fit and competent" doctor would have lessened the risk to Jackson's life. Briggs didn't want to say yes. "That one risk would be removed," Briggs said about Murray if he was no longer MJ's doctor. He said other medical risks remained, though. Panish mentioned the coroner's report and testimony and specifically that they found no evidence of problems with Jackson's heart. (AP)

Briggs testified he saw testimony that MJ had one life week to live after June 25, 2009, the day of the artist's death. Panish said Dr. Shimelman testified MJ's life expectancy was one week based on Dr. Murray's treatment of him Briggs: I believe his statement was MJ's life expectancy was one week, and he was taking into effect a lot of things: Dr. Murray, drug use (ABC7)

Panish: Are you aware that IRS is investigating the people who hired you and undervalued Sony ATVcatalogue? Objection: Sustained (ABC7)

Dr. Earley said MJ was essentially playing Russian roulette in the way he was using drugs, Briggs said. Panish: Dr. Murray was a big risk to MJ's health, wasn't he? Briggs: I wasn't focused on the risk, I was focused on a doctor assessing a record after the fact. Panish asked if Dr. Murray was a risk to MJ's health. Briggs: It appears in determining his life expectancy Dr. Shimelman took in consideration Dr. Murray. Panish: If Dr. Murray isn't in the question, there's no risk, right, sir? Briggs: There are all kinds of risks, like risk of relapse, risk of the manner he's taking the drugs. Briggs: This is not my opinion, I'm not a doctor, I was relying on Dr. Shimelman's testimony (about one week to live). Briggs' note says Dr. Shimelman -- Die any night. Briggs: Dr. Earley said the way MJ was taking drugs was like playing Russian roulette. Panish: Isn't it true Dr. Earley never blamed MJ for his addiction? Briggs: That's what I recall from the testimony. Briggs: I was asked to assess forecast earnings, not blame. Briggs: To a lay person, Dr. Earley's testimony that MJ was playing Russian roulette is talking about life expectancy. Panish said Dr. Earley wasn't asked to opined on MJ's life expectancy. Briggs read Dr. Earley's deposition and that's what it reads. Briggs: Just to be clear, I can't assess anyone's life expectancy. (ABC7)

Briggs said he relied on AEG's attorney to give him all the relevant materials related to what he's been asked to opine. The expert said he didn't review MJ's autopsy report, since he has no ability to read it. Briggs said one of the experts he reviewed stated the normal actuary doesn't apply to MJ's life and behavior. Briggs relied on Dr. Earley's testimony. He was unable to give a life expectancy to MJ because he wasn't hired for that. Dr. Shimelman said if Dr. Murray remained in the picture, MJ would live only another week. Dr. Schnoll said MJ could've been treated by a fit and competent doctor and remove the risk. Briggs: Dr. Shimelman stated a life expectancy of one week, I don't know how someone could perform for 9 months. (ABC7)

 

[Petrarose]

No doubt Brian Pannish is a smart lawyer, but I wonder if he knew what he was getting into with this family?

Well he has to blame himself too. He needed to do some research and then tell the family members not to talk. Then he has too many theories in his case. He then went and got testimony for different theories which is now going to contradict some of his own theories. I think he did this because initially he did not have a clear path to follow. That is why he was waiting on the AEG documents and then returned the whole thing back to them during discovery. Without a clear path of defense, he went out and pulled together different testimonies rather than creating a strategy and then gathering the people and evidence that will support it.

 

[ivy]

Summary of 3 experts

Heads up : AEG want to play Jacksons expert Shimelman deposition, Jacksons are opposing. Shimelman is the doctor who said Michael had one week to live (mentioned by Briggs during his testimony). In his deposition he says Michael was addicted to opioids / Demerol since 1993 and never stopped using them (getting injections even when he had the implant) and actively addicted to Demerol at time of his death. He lists almost all of Michael's doctors for giving him not good medical care.

AEG has 2 of their own witnesses to testify to similar things.

I'm going to do this in bullet point format, it's basically shortened versions of what they are saying

Shimelman - Jackson expert

- addicted specifically to Demerol
- addicted to opiates and benzos
- actively addicted to opiates at the time of death
- Q : assuming MJ did not die on June 25th, how much his life expectancy affected by opiod and benzo addiction? A: one week to live
- assuming he's not getting propofol, he was getting benzo and his life expectancy reduced moderately
- if murray is treating, clock is running
- believes active opiate addict after 90 rehab
- was not abstinent during the implant, he had another doctor injecting him
- doesn't believe Michael was clean 02/03, has slight hope but not belief
- doesn't think Michael was successful getting of the drugs between 90s to 2009
- no intention to get clean in 2009
- got bad medical treatment from Klein, Metzger, Van Valin, Farshchian, Forecast and so on
- addicts always hide addiction

Earley - AEG Expert

-doesn't think he could have done a better job to get Michael in recovery in 2009 based on asking for Propofol from multiple people showed drive for it
- addicted to opiods in 2009 , primarily to Demerol
- not enough evidence to conclude addiction to benzos and propofol
- death not caused by Demerol
- synergy between Demerol, Propofol and benzos
- opiods addiction dating back to 90s, the longer someone on it worse chances for recovery
- can't give a number/ age for life expectancy , can give the risk factors
- use of multiple drugs, drugs synergy increases risk of accidental overdose prematurely
- concerned MJ would never would have gotten better, had obstacles for recovery
- propofol is also dangerous due to multiple factors such as setting it's given, synergy with other drugs, effects of it and so on
- propofol causes an aggressive dependency , hard to get off it.
- no liver damage
- spider bite on his leg could be a injection site infection
- scars from needles
- suboxone treatment is discussed. requires giving suboxone, no benzos (which can interact), full disclosure of drug sources, random drug testing.
- uses grave prognosis medical term meaning very serious condition, Jackson lawyer starts referring to MJ as a "goner", asks Jackson lawyer stop referring MJ as goner saying it's offensive.
- several questions from Jacksons lawyers if he is hired to give a low life expectancy for Michael, disagrees with that, saying it's the truth, he is doing his job, this is such a tragic situation

Levounis - AEG expert

- substance addiction, could be underlying psychiatric reasons
- 2009 opiod addiction, Demerol primarily , Percocet second
- cannot say if benzos rises to the level of full addiction
- cannot say alcohol was an addiction
- 2009 reasonably certain of propofol addiction based on frequency and deterioration (missing appointments , not able to function 100%)
- 1993 to 2009 opiod addiction, probably started before 1993
- there are highs and lows in opiod use between 1993 and 2009, wouldn't say there were full remissions
- 93 rehab, Debbie Rowe detox, implants and Dr. Saunders trying another drug are the lows
- doctor shopping well documented
- spent a lot of time and effort to get Demerol shots
- occupational consequences of drugs such as cancelling or postponing meetings
- doesn't think Michael had the motivation or mindset to get clean in 2009, unlikely he would go to a doctor and want to get clean
- if he did want to clean, he would do a full psychiatric exam,give drugs if needed for those, probably Buperborphine, therapy - individually and as a group, 12 steps program, suboxone
- motivation to seek treatment factors: court order (court orders rehab or jail), family members pressure (wife threathening to leave), job pressure (get clean or get fired), person realizing a problem (internal motivation)
- opiod addiction could be due to genetics (some people are more likely to be addicted) or use of the drug itself (use it for a long time brain craves it)
- severe addiction, chronic relapses, life expectancy poor, cannot give a number / age
- significant possibility for accidental overdose
- weight loss and constant dehydration could be the physical effects of opiod addiction
- overall prognosis is poor, addicts could have good days and bad days. some days he can look good and be on the top of his game and other days the opposite
- even if propofol is removed seeking high amounts of demerol every few days, addiction is there, still severe effects on life expectancy
- even without propofol conditions are still very poor but a little better than with propofol
- other doctors giving opiods in addition to Klein, synergy effects
- high possibility of accidental overdose : multiple doctors giving drugs without knowing what the other one giving, unless Michael is calculating / keeping track what he's taking from multiple docs there's a risk, high amounts after a few day breaks is a risk

 

[jamba]

re value of ATV/SONY from wikipedia--values are all over the place--T Mez gave the highest evaluation wheh he claimed at the trial it was worth 4 or 5 billion. But he had an obvious reason for a high estimate so as to counter Sneddon's argument that MJ was desperate b/c he was broke.

In 2006, Sony gained operational control of Sony/ATV and obtained an option to buy half of Jackson's stake in the company at any time for a fixed price of $250 million.[27][28][29][30] Sony has not exercised the option.
Digital sheet music provider Musicnotes.com announced in June 2006 that it had signed a long-term distribution agreement with Sony/ATV Music Publishing. Musicnotes.com would produce and sell digital sheet music and guitar tablature for songs from Sony/ATV's extensive catalog.[31] "As a music publisher, we are always looking for new and innovative ways to promote our songs and songwriters," Sony/ATV chairman and chief executive David Hockman announced in a statement.[31] Another company acquisition was made in 2007, when Sony/ATV purchased Famous Music, a music publishing business with song catalogue of more than 125,000 songs including "Moon River" and "Footloose." The deal, sought by Viacom, included the assumption of around $30 million of debt. The company purchased the business for $370 million. The song catalogue also includes the hits of Eminem, Akon, Linda Perry, Björk, Shakira and Beck.[32][33] With this acquisition, Sony/ATV acquired the rights to publish music from films released by Viacom's Paramount Pictures subsidiary, which had founded Famous Music in 1928 to publish music from its films. This also included films released by DreamWorks, which Viacom acquired in 2006.
Following Jackson's death in June 2009, it was revealed that Sony/ATV Music Publishing would keep control of the Beatles' songs.[34] Upon his death, Jackson's entertainment attorney, Joel Katz, commented on the singer's work as a businessman. "Michael Jackson was a perfectionist and his business affairs are worldwide. Many of them are quite ongoing and will be dealt with appropriately."[34] Ivan Thornton, a private-wealth adviser who worked with Jackson and his family, also commended the business side of the musician. "His business mind was fascinating. We’d go to meetings with bankers and Wall Street people and once I explained the language to him, he totally got it. There was no formal education there, but his natural knack was off the charts."[34]
In November 2011, Citigroup announced a tentative deal to sell EMI, with the recorded music arm going to Vivendi's Universal Music Group for $1.9 billion and the publishing business going to a Sony/ATV-led consortium for around $2.2 billion. Other members of the Sony consortium include Blackstone and Abu Dhabi-owned investment fund Mubadala.[35] In March 2012, concessions were offered to the European Union to help win approval of the consortium's purchase.[36] The deal won European Union approval on April 19, 2012.[37] As part of the deal, Sony/EMI divested the publishing rights for Famous Music UK and Virgin Music. These catalogues were acquired by BMG Rights Management in December 2012 for $150 million.[38]

Value

The value of Sony/ATV Music Publishing has varied in reports. In 2002, Forbes magazine estimated Jackson's 50% stake in the company, along with other music publishing ventures, to be worth $450 million.[39] The organization was valued at $700 million in 2003.[40] Industry experts valued the catalogue at between $600 million and $1 billion in 2004, based on the sales of rival catalogues.[41] Charles Koppelman, a veteran music industry executive, stated that $1 billion was more reflective of Sony/ATV Music Publishing's worth.[41] "Buyers would be lining up around the block if it were ever put up for sale," he said. "And I'd be in the front of the line."[41] The value of the company was further estimated by Ryan Schinman, chief of Platinum Rye, to be $1.5 billion.[42]
In 2005, Jackson's defense attorney, Thomas Mesereau, claimed that the song catalogue had been valued at between $4 billion and $5 billion.[43] Jackson's own financial documents stated that his 50% share of the catalogue was worth $390.6 million as of 2007,[44] which would have made the entire catalogue worth $781.2 million. When Sony/ATV led the consortium that acquired EMI Music Publishing in 2012 (with Sony/ATV becoming administrator and 38% shareholder), it became the largest publishing company in the world, with more than 2 million songs[45] and estimated revenues of over 1.25 billion dollars per year.[46] As of 2012, Sony/ATV administers Jackson's other publishing firm, Mijac, which includes songs written by Jackson himself (amongst others), and which used to be administered by competitor Warner/Chappell Music.[47]

 

[Bubs]

Heads up : AEG want to play Jacksons expert Shimelman deposition, Jacksons are opposing. Shimelman is the doctor who said Michael had one week to live (mentioned by Briggs during his testimony). In his deposition he says Michael was addicted to opioids / Demerol since 1993 and never stopped using them (getting injections even when he had the implant) and actively addicted to Demerol at time of his death. He lists almost all of Michael's doctors for giving him not good medical care.

AEG has 2 of their own witnesses to testify to similar things.

Why Jackson's are opposing their own expert witness? If they hired an expert to testify for them, and the result is something that they don't want to hear, why not dismiss his testimony and him from their witness list?
Moreover, why the hell KJ and co are still going ahead with this lawsuit if their own expert is telling this to them. KJ must have known that if Shielman deposition is played at court, it would be extremely damaging to to her case, but even more damaging to Michael.

 

[Tygger]

Will the defense play the whole deposition of Dr. Shimelman or just portions?

A good thing only a brief cross was allowed today. It will only get worse for Jorrie.

 

[AliCat]

Demerol

Demerol (meperidine) is a opioid pain reliever. It is similar to morphine. An opioid is sometimes called a narcotic.

Demerol is used to treat moderate-to-severe pain.

Do not drink alcohol while you are using Demerol.

Dangerous side effects or death can occur when alcohol is combined with Demerol. Check your food and medicine labels to be sure these products do not contain alcohol.

This medication may impair your thinking or reactions. Avoid driving or operating machinery until you know how Demerol will affect you.

Do not take Demerol with other narcotic pain medications, sedatives, tranquilizers, muscle relaxers, or other medicines that can make you sleepy or slow your breathing. Dangerous side effects may result.

Call your doctor at once if you have any of these serious side effects:

weak or shallow breathing, slow heartbeat;
severe drowsiness, feeling like you might pass out;
seizure (convulsions);
cold, clammy skin;
muscle movements you cannot control;
confusion, mood changes;
severe weakness or dizziness; or
agitation, hallucinations, fever, fast heart rate, overactive reflexes, nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, loss of coordination, fainting.
Less serious Demerol side effects may include:

constipation;
loss of appetite;
headache, dizziness, mild weakness;
dry mouth;
sweating;
itching;
urinating less than usual; or
loss of interest in sex.
http://www.drugs.com/demerol.html

With all this focus upon whether or not Michael Jackson was addicted to Demerol, the autopsy report shows he was not. If Michael Jackson was heavily using this product, Demerol, I would think we would have seen anything that looked remotely suspicious when he was rehearsing "This Is It." We have heard testimony concerning the last two weeks of Michael's life and how he was not showing up for rehearsals and then Kenny Ortega sends Michael Jackson home, after Michael Jackson had missed several day's of his last two weeks of his life and Conrad Murray was peeved. Kathy Jorrie testified saying she was told Conrad Murray was making a million dollars a month from his practices, so naturally he'd be peeved, because Conrad Murray depended upon his livelihood working for Michael Jackson. But...this demerol issue and how supposedly Michael Jackson needed this product to sustain an existence does go against what the Coroner found, strong organs. Even Steve Jobs, founder of Apple Computers, etc., had a liver transplant. Michael Jackson was healthy. Demerol was used at various times to treat back pains, sprained ankles and even a burned scalp, back in the 1980's. Demerol was also used in Michael Jackson's dermatological treatments. It's just sad to think that it is okay to state that Michael Jackson depended heavily on Demerol and yet he dies with strong organs.

 

[Bubs]

With all this focus upon whether or not Michael Jackson was addicted to Demerol, the autopsy report shows he was not

Don't take my post wrong way.
I have question about that Michael's autopsy report showed he wasn't addicted to Demerol. How is it determined in autopsy report whether person is addicted to something? As far as I know, Michael's autopsy report showed no Demerol in his system, but how it was determined that he wasn't addicted to it?

 

[Bubs]

Shimelman - Jackson expert
- got bad medical treatment from Klein, Metzger, Van Valin, Farshchian, Forecast and so on

I'm on the fence about Metzger, as there were testimonies that he tried to help MJ, but then again he was involved in the mess about KJ granny-napping episode, and he was called in by Randy and other crooks.

Earley - AEG Expert
- uses grave prognosis medical term meaning very serious condition, Jackson lawyer starts referring to MJ as a "goner", asks Jackson lawyer stop referring MJ as goner saying it's offensive.

How disrespectful from Katherine's lawyer to refect her son as goner.
I wonder if KJ knew about it, and got upset as much she got upset when somebody called her son lazy, or freak, or is it defferent when insults comes from her own side?

Levounis - AEG expert
- other doctors giving opiods in addition to Klein, synergy effects
- high possibility of accidental overdose : multiple doctors giving drugs without knowing what the other one giving, unless Michael is calculating / keeping track what he's taking from multiple docs there's a risk, high amounts after a few day breaks is a risk

When he says that other docs were giving demerol to MJ the same time than Klein, I suppose he had medical records from other docs and he compared the dates when MJ got Demerol?

 

[Justthefacts]

Dr. Farshchain helped Michael and the Jacksons expert threw him under the bus. IMO the family once again dismissing Michael like any issues he had medically were not worthy. So any doctor who touched Michael did evil to him, and notice who's name is missing from that bad doctors list? And has I thought the Jackson's "expert" is the most assine of any of them. I see why they don't want his deposition played. They make Michael sound like a junky on the street.

 

[Bubs]

i knoww hilarious right?? Panish did a great cross. Briggs was even forced to admit the AEG exces had told the demand was so high they could've done 100 shows if they wanted hahah. he was also forced to testify that even aeg and ortega were talking about a worldtour after london. it was hilarious and painful to read his cross

What was even more hilarious that some people said that AEG forced MJ to do 50 concerts and MJ only wanted to do 10, then some people are willing to believe when Jackson's paid expert testifies that MJ would have done 270 concerts + other things.
Isn't it funny?

Btw, talking about is not the same as doing it, don't we agree with that?
There is a long list things MJ wanted to do, but for some reason or other, they didn't happen.

Dr. Farshchain helped Michael and the Jacksons expert threw him under the bus. IMO the family once again dismissing Michael like any issues he had medically were not worthy. So any doctor who touched Michael did evil to him, and notice who's name is missing from that bad doctors list? And has I thought the Jackson's "expert" is the most assine of any of them. I see why they don't want his deposition played. They make Michael sound like a junky on the street.

CM's name is missing. Is he good doctor in Jackson's book?

 

[bouee]

Don't take my post wrong way.
I have question about that Michael's autopsy report showed he wasn't addicted to Demerol. How is it determined in autopsy report whether person is addicted to something? As far as I know, Michael's autopsy report showed no Demerol in his system, but how it was determined that he wasn't addicted to it?

2 reasons , based on Klein records and autopsy report :

- Dates: the dates of the injections were irregular, there were too many days without demerol in between shots and we know that withdrawal starts within 24 to 48 hours. + Michael had no opioids whatsoever in his home. Since no other doctor were found at the time, it's assuming that no one else gave him demerol- or other opiods, since it's the morphine / opium derivated molecule that is addictive

- Doses : they were decreasing , and significantly decreasing (almost divided by 2 ) between april and june.

Both things are inconsistant with addiction or even dependance. That's how Waldman was destroyed on the stand by Walgren.

Autopsy : some said the liver and kidneys was not damaged, and opiods can affect both organs. If true, it means no recent excessive use. No opioids in his system = no interaction possible on june 25th with benzos and propofol.

 

[Justthefacts]

Shimelman - Jackson expert
- got bad medical treatment from Klein, Metzger, Van Valin, Farshchian, Forecast and so on

I'm on the fence about Metzger, as there were testimonies that he tried to help MJ, but then again he was involved in the mess about KJ granny-napping episode, and he was called in by Randy and other crooks.

Earley - AEG Expert
- uses grave prognosis medical term meaning very serious condition, Jackson lawyer starts referring to MJ as a "goner", asks Jackson lawyer stop referring MJ as goner saying it's offensive.

How disrespectful from Katherine's lawyer to refect her son as goner.
I wonder if KJ knew about it, and got upset as much she got upset when somebody called her son lazy, or freak, or is it defferent when insults comes from her own side?

Levounis - AEG expert
- other doctors giving opiods in addition to Klein, synergy effects
- high possibility of accidental overdose : multiple doctors giving drugs without knowing what the other one giving, unless Michael is calculating / keeping track what he's taking from multiple docs there's a risk, high amounts after a few day breaks is a risk

When he says that other docs were giving demerol to MJ the same time than Klein, I suppose he had medical records from other docs and he compared the dates when MJ got Demerol?

I am more then sure Metzger had no clue what they were up too. Because Michael was getting demerol for medical treatment he was addicted? And if Michael took something because he could not sleep he was an addict. Ridiculous

 

[Bubs]

I am more then sure Metzger had no clue what they were up too

I don't know whether he was made aware of what is going on, but he was (I copied this from Radar)
issued a Public Letter of Reprimand by The Medical Board of California for engaging “in fraudulent medical practice based on prescriptions written for an international entertainer using a false/fictitious name.”

I think that case was about Janet. Then there was the thing Pari wrote in her twitter during granny-napping episode:
Paris Jackson is fuming that her uncles have allowed Metzger to treat her grandmother after he testified that her late father was a heavy drug user. something she took to Twitter to dispute.

“The same doctor that testified on behalf of dr. murray saying my father was a drug addict (a lie) is caring for my grandmother….just saying,” Paris wrote.

Maybe he was a good doc or maybe not, I don't know.

 

[Justthefacts]

He never said Michael was a heavy drug user.

 

[Annita]

“The same doctor that testified on behalf of dr. murray saying my father was a drug addict (a lie) is caring for my grandmother….just saying,” Paris wrote.

.

Paris was wrong with this. Metzger didn`t say anything negativ about Michael in Murray-trial.

 

[Bubs]

^^ I had to check what exactly he testified during CM trial, and it wasn't bad to MJ and he didn't say anything about MJ being addicted. Wonder where did Paris got her impression of Metzger saying so? Could it be that someone in the house told her different version of testimony and she believed?

 

[bouee]

It has been quite some time since I heard an AEG employee testify to not remembering an email and/or not understanding simple terms said by them or directed to them in those forgotten emails.

I am baffled as to how the defense felt Wooley's deposition helped their case.

re AEG employees memory loss : maybe Murray did something to them too ? Since both parties love to spend money on medical experts,they should have one analysing those memory problems.

I don't understand either why AEG played that depo : he's saying what Trell already said, what Jorrie is saying (not signed = unexecuted) , but he's adding the fact that Murray asked AEG for payment.

Re the equipment and Wolley suggesting the CPR machine, I heard a slightly different version from that "other website". Slightly different, but that can fit with what he's saying. That was a while ago, I'm not sure if it was about Jorrie or Woolley, and I don't remember the source, so I'm not sure this is reliable, but the story was Murray requested equiment, but used technical words. AEG (Jorrie or Wooley) did not understand what he meant , and Murray was not too keen on explaining. So they ended up asking if it was a CPR machine , and he said yes.

-Jorrie also told jurors she mistakenly left language in a contract that Murray signed that called for him to perform services "reasonably requested" by AEG Live.

-She maintained throughout her testimony that Murray was Jackson's personal doctor and the language about him performing services for the promoter shouldn't have been in the agreement. Jackson's approval was required on the contract, but he died before signing it.

That mistake is going to be a problem for AEG. She testified that she works with contracts and trial work, so why did she make this crucial mistake, if indeed it was a mistake?

I'm not up to date with yesterday's tesimony, but she said during Muuray's trial that she changed that for the final version, on june 23rd. I think it was the 3rd "draft" , weird that Murray asks for that change on 23rd, and did not ask for this change before.

Yes, I agree with you, this mistake is strange coming from a lawyer. But it's not the first one from AEG, they sound very disorganised.
The big question to her is why issue a contract to Murray at all ? Why not tell AEG that it could be dangerous for thjem to do that and that they should rather issue an advance to Michael and let him deal with his personnal physician ?


That june 19th call is weird too. Was Phillips asked about that by AEG when he was on the stand ? They would definitely want him to clarify that very damaging e mail he sent to Ortega, and I don't remember this call being mentionned before, by anyone, not in testimony, not in this forum, and we have talked about this mail many times. "he's a great doctor, ethical, doesn't need this gig, etc.."

All those questions by Murray to Jorrie in the end of june make it sound like he felt trouble was ahead. Just my interpretation though.

So she checked his licences and GCA, but did not check the 3 other copmanies ? She went by Murray's word, and according to her now, repeated this to Phillips, not knowing if it was true or not. She seems to be the one who has a huge reponsability in this mess (contract with Murray), is she willing to help them now ?
We saw an email from her 'recommending' a background check on Tohme when she was drafting the AEG- Michael contract.

This dr. though, sounds a little extreme. If Michael was addicted since 93 and NEVER stopped using them (I assume he means he was a continuous addict) how did the coroner find his body in that condition. I wonder if the doctors he lists can do anything legally to him, unless he has some concrete proof.

Opps sorry double post.

Yes I agree. How can you draw such radically different conclusions from the same records. Really something should be done about the expert system. Maybe like having to pick the experts from a pre established list that the court would do, for all sorts of trials, not a case in particular, and pay them a fixed amount. 700 000 $ is crazy.

Heads up : AEG want to play Jacksons expert Shimelman deposition, Jacksons are opposing. Shimelman is the doctor who said Michael had one week to live (mentioned by Briggs during his testimony). In his deposition he says Michael was addicted to opioids / Demerol since 1993 and never stopped using them (getting injections even when he had the implant) and actively addicted to Demerol at time of his death. He lists almost all of Michael's doctors for giving him not good medical care.

AEG has 2 of their own witnesses to testify to similar things.

From the summary you posted, he doesn't say the bolded. It could mean on and off - with a relapse in the final year.

Summary of 3 experts



I'm going to do this in bullet point format, it's basically shortened versions of what they are saying

Shimelman - Jackson expert

- addicted specifically to Demerol
- addicted to opiates and benzos
- actively addicted to opiates at the time of death
- Q : assuming MJ did not die on June 25th, how much his life expectancy affected by opiod and benzo addiction? A: one week to live
- assuming he's not getting propofol, he was getting benzo and his life expectancy reduced moderately
- if murray is treating, clock is running
- believes active opiate addict after 90 rehab
- was not abstinent during the implant, he had another doctor injecting him
- doesn't believe Michael was clean 02/03, has slight hope but not belief
- doesn't think Michael was successful getting of the drugs between 90s to 2009
- no intention to get clean in 2009
- got bad medical treatment from Klein, Metzger, Van Valin, Farshchian, Forecast and so on
- addicts always hide addiction

Earley - AEG Expert

-doesn't think he could have done a better job to get Michael in recovery in 2009 based on asking for Propofol from multiple people showed drive for it
- addicted to opiods in 2009 , primarily to Demerol
- not enough evidence to conclude addiction to benzos and propofol
- death not caused by Demerol
- synergy between Demerol, Propofol and benzos
- opiods addiction dating back to 90s, the longer someone on it worse chances for recovery
- can't give a number/ age for life expectancy , can give the risk factors
- use of multiple drugs, drugs synergy increases risk of accidental overdose prematurely
- concerned MJ would never would have gotten better, had obstacles for recovery
- propofol is also dangerous due to multiple factors such as setting it's given, synergy with other drugs, effects of it and so on
- propofol causes an aggressive dependency , hard to get off it.
- no liver damage
- spider bite on his leg could be a injection site infection
- scars from needles
- suboxone treatment is discussed. requires giving suboxone, no benzos (which can interact), full disclosure of drug sources, random drug testing.
- uses grave prognosis medical term meaning very serious condition, Jackson lawyer starts referring to MJ as a "goner", asks Jackson lawyer stop referring MJ as goner saying it's offensive.
- several questions from Jacksons lawyers if he is hired to give a low life expectancy for Michael, disagrees with that, saying it's the truth, he is doing his job, this is such a tragic situation

Levounis - AEG expert

- substance addiction, could be underlying psychiatric reasons
- 2009 opiod addiction, Demerol primarily , Percocet second
- cannot say if benzos rises to the level of full addiction
- cannot say alcohol was an addiction
- 2009 reasonably certain of propofol addiction based on frequency and deterioration (missing appointments , not able to function 100%)
- 1993 to 2009 opiod addiction, probably started before 1993
- there are highs and lows in opiod use between 1993 and 2009, wouldn't say there were full remissions
- 93 rehab, Debbie Rowe detox, implants and Dr. Saunders trying another drug are the lows
- doctor shopping well documented
- spent a lot of time and effort to get Demerol shots
- occupational consequences of drugs such as cancelling or postponing meetings
- doesn't think Michael had the motivation or mindset to get clean in 2009, unlikely he would go to a doctor and want to get clean
- if he did want to clean, he would do a full psychiatric exam,give drugs if needed for those, probably Buperborphine, therapy - individually and as a group, 12 steps program, suboxone
- motivation to seek treatment factors: court order (court orders rehab or jail), family members pressure (wife threathening to leave), job pressure (get clean or get fired), person realizing a problem (internal motivation)
- opiod addiction could be due to genetics (some people are more likely to be addicted) or use of the drug itself (use it for a long time brain craves it)
- severe addiction, chronic relapses, life expectancy poor, cannot give a number / age
- significant possibility for accidental overdose
- weight loss and constant dehydration could be the physical effects of opiod addiction
- overall prognosis is poor, addicts could have good days and bad days. some days he can look good and be on the top of his game and other days the opposite
- even if propofol is removed seeking high amounts of demerol every few days, addiction is there, still severe effects on life expectancy
- even without propofol conditions are still very poor but a little better than with propofol
- other doctors giving opiods in addition to Klein, synergy effects
- high possibility of accidental overdose : multiple doctors giving drugs without knowing what the other one giving, unless Michael is calculating / keeping track what he's taking from multiple docs there's a risk, high amounts after a few day breaks is a risk

----------------

- Q : assuming MJ did not die on June 25th, how much his life expectancy affected by opiod and benzo addiction? A: one week to live
- assuming he's not getting propofol, he was getting benzo and his life expectancy reduced moderately

he's contradicting himself here, or there is something missing in the first sentence (Murray and propofol)

- was not abstinent during the implant, he had another doctor injecting him

we know he had it removed at one point.

-- propofol causes an aggressive dependency , hard to get off it.

First time we've heard that. All other testimonies about propofol said it was not physically addictive, maybe psychologically " addictive"

- Dr. Saunders trying another drug are the lows

Which drug ? I don't remeber Dr saunders testifying to that.

-- 2009 opiod addiction, Demerol primarily , Percocet second

Percocet now ? first time we've heard about it too. It's an opioid as well.

Why Jackson's are opposing their own expert witness? If they hired an expert to testify for them, and the result is something that they don't want to hear, why not dismiss his testimony and him from their witness list?
Moreover, why the hell KJ and co are still going ahead with this lawsuit if their own expert is telling this to them. KJ must have known that if Shielman deposition is played at court, it would be extremely damaging to to her case, but even more damaging to Michael.

yes that's ultra super weird. I guess there is something that we don't know, it doesn't make sense at all.

 

[Big Apple2]

CM's name is missing. Is he good doctor in Jackson's book?

In my opinion, Murray's name is missing because he's only THE FALL GUY!

How many Jackson family members have used those very words since Michael died!

 

[Bubs]

Back to Jorrie's testimony

Jorrie spoke with Randy Phillips on June 19, 2009 on an unrelated matter and Dr. Murray's subject came up.
It was phone conversation, she relayed Dr. Murray was licensed to practice in 4 states. "I checked out, or confirmed the info," she said. Jorrie testified she told Phillips Murray appeared to be very successful in his practice, may have told him about a million dollar a month. "I definitely told him he's very successful in his practice," Jorrie said. "I confirmed he was licensed to practice in 4 states."

I wonder what she said to RP on the phone on 19th, resulted him to write in email on 20th the following:
"This doctor is extremely successful - we check everyone out - and he does not need this gig so he (is) totally unbiased and ethical," Phillips wrote.

It is believable that as Jorrie told him she checked CM info in medical board and then told how much CM earns (CM most likely lied to Jorrie) and RP couldn't determinate whether CM was ethical, so he believed what he wrote was correct.
-------------------------
Panish said Paul Gongaware and John Meglen were sued for stealing the name Concerts West.
Bina objected, saying the lawsuit was dismissed and Panish was trying to tarnish Gongaware and Meglen's reputation.
Judge: Was the case dismissed?
Panish: Yes
Judge: Then it's not stealing. Please refrain from using that word. Describe it accurately.

Nasty tactic from Panish.

 

[Bubs]

In my opinion, Murray's name is missing because he's only THE FALL GUY!

How many Jackson family members have used those very words since Michael died!

That would explain no restitution from "fall guy" as obviosly he didn't deserved to be punished for what someone else did (according to Jacksonese).

Whose fall guy CM was, Randy Jackson's?