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Michael - The Great Album Debate

Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Bumper thanks for posting those, i see my comment in there. I was 'disgusted' and i still am.
Annie you say the voices aren't 'exactly identical' in pentum's video. Do they have to be 'exactly identical'? Compare any cascio track line to any real mj line and you will find thst not only do they not sound 'exactly identical' they are clearly completely different.
Ivy i don't understand why you keep resorting to the legal issue. We know full well that they have covered their asses sufficiently to make it virtually pointless going to court. Unless somebody in the know confesses someday we will never officially know the truth.
That last comparison video by pentum... Omg! Those two voices are just well... The same voice! The only reason believers haven't made similiar videos is because they cannot find any examples of mj that sound close enough. How is it logical that mj 'processed' etc etc sounds more like jason malachi than himself ever on any song? You might be able to make that argument for breaking news and monster but the voice on keep you head up is NOT heavily processed so why do you keep saying you can't compare to mj?
I'm meeting a group of friends today... 6 of them. They are not mj fans and they prob don't even know he has a new album out. I'm going to play pentum's clip and ask them is it all the same voice....
 
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Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Can't abide mj impersonator's. Just no. The way he pronounced 'seducing sighs'.
Can't stand anyone else singing an mj song. Had to turn that off before it finished. Same reaction i had to the cascio tracks. Just no.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

mjjesamor said:
Bumper thanks for posting those, i see my comment in there. I was 'disgusted' and i still am.
Annie you say the voices aren't 'exactly identical' in pentum's video. Do they have to be 'exactly identical'? Compare any cascio track line to any real mj line and you will find thst not only do they not sound 'exactly identical' they are clearly completely different.
Ivy i don't understand why you keep resorting to the legal issue. We know full well that they have covered their asses sufficiently to make it virtually pointless going to court. Unless somebody in the know confesses someday we will never officially know the truth.
That last comparison video by pentum... Omg! Those two voices are just well... The same voice! The only reason believers haven't made similiar videos is because they cannot find any examples of mj that sound close enough. How is it logical that mj 'processed' etc etc sounds more like jason malachi than himself ever on any song? You might be able to make that argument for breaking news and monster but the voice on keep you head up is NOT heavily processed so why do you keep saying you can't compare to mj?
I'm meeting a group of friends today... 6 of them. They are not mj fans and they prob don't even know he has a new album out. I'm going to play pentum's clip and ask them is it all the same voice....
Click to expand...

Brilliant post. And one of these leeches is going to let the cat out of the bag one day, I'm sure of it. Either that, or they'll end up dead a la Peter Lopez.

So if it's legally impossible to prove it's not Michael Jackson that means it is Michael Jackson? Got it... So... Those weopans of mass destruction... They still 'legally' exist, don't they???
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Cheers sam, i'll let ye know the result of my mini test later!
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

ivy said:
thank you but I hope I can express this but I think the vocals on the Keep Your Head up is softer and have more easy flow to them and Jason is struggling with his parts(it's packed, no flow from word to word). It might sound similar but not the same style. Also look to the waveform - (again hopefully what I'm saying will be clear) the parts of Keep your head up is larger and Jason's are shorter. (for example compare 0.03:0.10 to 0.10:0.16) Doesn't it show that the characteristics is different? Wouldn't this show us that Jason cannot fool a expert waveform test? (not that I'm expert in waveforms - please correct me if I'm wrong).

btw before calling this "damning evidence" and rushing to court let me say this - this won't hold because of "Note: I did pitch Jason's voice with 2 +. The reason why I did this is because in my opinion, The Cascio tracks are pitched up with at least 2 +. " - You are saying that you modified JM vocals to fit to Cascio vocals. There goes the objectivity.
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Thanks for making the comparison Pentum, but I still don't hear JM on the cascio tracks. The acapella is much faster than the beat was, had to slow it down a bit.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Jason Malachi does not sound enough like MJ to have pulled off the Cascio tracks. He just doesn't. I can't hear this exact match that some claim to hear. I'm trying, but to me there is a clear distinction between when MJ's (or whoever's vocals they are) are playing and Malachi's.
If the vibrato on the Cascio songs was not similar to Malachi's, most people would not be falling over themselves saying it's him singing. The actual complete voice, forgetting the vibrato, is not the same.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Can you point out the differences in the vocals for me?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

That's exactly why we have this whole controversy anna! In your words 'because malachi doesn't sound enough like mj to pull off the cascio tracks'
They didn't pull them off! That's the whole point! They tried and they failed! The voice on the cascio tracks does not sound 'enough' like mj to convince everybody it is mj!
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

mjjesamor said:
That's exactly why we have this whole controversy anna! In your words 'because malachi doesn't sound enough like mj to pull off the cascio tracks'
They didn't pull them off! That's the whole point! They tried and they failed! The voice on the cascio tracks does not sound 'enough' like mj to convince everybody it is mj!
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But it doesn't sound enough like Malachi either. At least, it doesn't to me and many other people.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

So you admit it doesn't sound enough like michael?
Remember on the tracks you are hearing james porte mixed in too as well as genuine mj adlibs and isolated cut and paste words within sentences. It's very complicated.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

mjjesamor said:
So you admit it doesn't sound enough like michael?
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Well yes. It sounds... off. And that's either because it's not MJ, or because the vocals have been digitally altered, which apparently they were.

Malachi's voice is not consistent enough to pull off the Cascio tracks. He sounds too forced at times. His voice doesn't flow very well. The Cascio tracks don't sound like Malachi to me.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

ivy said:
"Note: I did pitch Jason's voice with 2 +. The reason why I did this is because in my opinion, The Cascio tracks are pitched up with at least 2 +. " - You are saying that you modified JM vocals to fit to Cascio vocals. There goes the objectivity.
Click to expand...
Okay, since some people complained I pitched it up by 2, here is a version with no pitching. It's hard to notice the difference...

Room 2 Breath VS Keep Your Head Up [No Pitch]
http://soundcloud.com/pentum/room-2-breath-vs-keep-your-1

Room 2 Breath VS Keep Your Head Up [Pitched By 2]
http://soundcloud.com/pentum/room-2-breath-vs-keep-your

There is one thing I always see people forget when saying "It's not Jason, he coudln't do it, he sounds different on the Cascio tracks".

Ever thought about Jason actually doing a much better impersonating when doing the Cascio songs? I mean, Keep Your Head Up sounds exactly like Jason to me, but has some kind of "chimpunk" effect on the voice (hence why I pitched up Room 2 Breath as well).
Imagine Jason actually singing Room 2 Breath in the absolute same way he did Keep Your Head Up. With a smiling face and even softer voice. What do you get? It's obvious that in Room 2 Breath, he's dead serious and KYHU, he's smiling all over the place.

You forget that the cascio songs weren't meant to be compared to his older work - different place, different lyrics, different recording equipment, different, different mood, different songs (!), different purpose. That's why some of you say "it doesn't sound exactly the same", right?

I showed my audio to one of my friends. Response: "Cool song". Yeah, he didn't even notice that it was suppose to be two different voices.

Anna said:
Malachi's voice is not consistent enough to pull off the Cascio tracks. He sounds too forced at times. His voice doesn't flow very well. The Cascio tracks don't sound like Malachi to me.
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Malachi's voice is good enough to do ANY of the songs. He's been singing for at least 20 years. If you've heard all of his songs and know his voice, you would never say "his voice doesn't flow very well". And the voice on the Cascio songs flows well? Hell, have you seen how much copy paste there are on these songs!? Great editing skills I say.

Malachi could do ANY of these songs easily. These songs are nothing special at all.

Malachi is the singer on the Cascio songs with minor tweaks done by someone on the vocals.

Edit: And I'll be sending some stuff to TMZ, see if they are slightly interested...
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Does anyone have a pure a capella of "Monster"? I want to see if there is fragmentation of every word, like in "Breaking News".

There are similarities with Malachi, but maybe that has something to do with, I don't know... He's a soundalike!? Upon listening to "Monster" pitched down, only a confession will make me believe that there is someone other than MJ and Porte on these tracks.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Again, all the Cascio tracks are not digitally altered, some of them are.
Lots and lots of artists these days digitally alter their voices. They still sound like themselves.
Again digitally altering a voice won't change the way a person pronounces his words. It doesn't change your accent.
When i heard that first few lines of breaking news i felt like i had been kicked in the stomach. What a blow! Since when did Michael Jackson sound like that and pronounce his words like that?
Remember 90% of the people on this very board said it didn't sound like Michael at the beginning. Initial gut reaction of 90% of people. How lightly is it that they were all wrong?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Anna said:
Well yes. It sounds... off. And that's either because it's not MJ, or because the vocals have been digitally altered, which apparently they were.
Click to expand...

Just to get this right... are you saying they DON'T sound like Michael Jackson but, because the sellers have told you it's Michael (only digitally altered) you believe it's Michael Jackson?
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Pentum said:
Okay, since some people complained I pitched it up by 2, here is a version with no pitching. It's hard to notice the difference...

Room 2 Breath VS Keep Your Head Up [No Pitch]
http://soundcloud.com/pentum/room-2-breath-vs-keep-your-1

Room 2 Breath VS Keep Your Head Up [Pitched By 2]
http://soundcloud.com/pentum/room-2-breath-vs-keep-your

There is one thing I always see people forget when saying "It's not Jason, he coudln't do it, he sounds different on the Cascio tracks".

Ever thought about Jason actually doing a much better impersonating when doing the Cascio songs? I mean, Keep Your Head Up sounds exactly like Jason to me, but has some kind of "chimpunk" effect on the voice (hence why I pitched up Room 2 Breath as well).
Imagine Jason actually singing Room 2 Breath in the absolute same way he did Keep Your Head Up. With a smiling face and even softer voice. What do you get? It's obvious that in Room 2 Breath, he's dead serious and KYHU, he's smiling all over the place.

You forget that the cascio songs weren't meant to be compared to his older work - different place, different lyrics, different recording equipment, different, different mood, different songs (!), different purpose. That's why some of you say "it doesn't sound exactly the same", right?

I showed my audio to one of my friends. Response: "Cool song". Yeah, he didn't even notice that it was suppose to be two different voices.


Malachi's voice is good enough to do ANY of the songs. He's been singing for at least 20 years. If you've heard all of his songs and know his voice, you would never say "his voice doesn't flow very well". And the voice on the Cascio songs flows well? Hell, have you seen how much copy paste there are on these songs!? Great editing skills I say.

Malachi could do ANY of these songs easily. These songs are nothing special at all.

Malachi is the singer on the Cascio songs with minor tweaks done by someone on the vocals.

Edit: And I'll be sending some stuff to TMZ, see if they are slightly interested...
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Meh... I'm not convinced. But I respect your opinion. I don't hear enough Malachi to think it's him.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

samhabib said:
Just to get this right... are you saying they DON'T sound like Michael Jackson but, because the sellers have told you it's Michael (only digitally altered) you believe it's Michael Jackson?
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No, they sound like MJ's vocals. His vocals that have been extensively altered and tampered with. Either that or they're not his.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Anna said:
No, they sound like MJ's vocals. His vocals that have been extensively altered and tampered with. Either that or they're not his.
Click to expand...

My thoughts exactly. I think they've also been pitched weirdly and butchered greatly, like the word fragmenting towards the end of "Breaking News".
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

I feel like maybe some people confuse 'don't want to hear' with 'don't hear'. It's perfectly understandable to react like that.It's outrageous that they have done this to Michael.
Pentum the pitching doesn't make any significant difference in my opinion.Both vocals still sound the same to me.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

jason m. or not.....the 3 cascio songs are questionable, I'm even a new fan & hearing it the first time, it was like a gut feel that it isn't him. Maybe partly or maybe not....hayzz really there's no debate if its Him. And i can only guess debates will go on and on sadly.....if the Cascio's really cared, loved & respect MJ they should not let those tracks in...but 3 parties are involved in this mess, Sony ( their the distributors & should have known if its authentic or not coz they're the expert in music)....the Cascio's coz I think the demos are really weak whether MJ or not...and then the ESTATE who have the final decision of all shouldn't have let this happen....they should opt to the fully finished ones not necessarily current but at least decent enough to be in an album. As many have said....
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

If you knew me personally, you'd know that I uphold a lot of morals. I will never talk to someone again that has stabbed me in the back. I've done my research on this. I've listened to Malachi's music that's similar to these tracks, and I concluded that there's no spark there that only MJ had, that I hear in these tracks. Unless indisputable evidence arrives, then I'm sticking with that opinion.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Maybe because the thought of Jason ending up on a brand new Michael Jackson album + money or whatever he got gave him that "spark" you're listening to.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Eh, it could be possible. One thing I don't get is how no-one, not even the Jackson's, have even filed legal action against whoever decided that the tracks be on the album. There's certainly enough basis for it. SONY would be widely discredited, the Estate would be dissolved and presumably run by the family, win-win for most fans, surely!
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

I agree and I think it's disgusting that they haven't done anything else than tweeted and made a comment on video about it. If I was one of The Jacksons, I'd taken this much more seriously.

But I'm holding my breath that they might do something after this whole Murray case is over.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Jesta said:
Eh, it could be possible. One thing I don't get is how no-one, not even the Jackson's, have even filed legal action against whoever decided that the tracks be on the album. There's certainly enough basis for it. SONY would be widely discredited, the Estate would be dissolved and presumably run by the family, win-win for most fans, surely!
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Yeah, that's what I don't get either. I mean, the Jackson's of all people should be the most enraged and the most determined to get justice if fake MJ tracks were placed on the first posthumous new MJ album.
If I was them and I thought they were fake, I'd sure as hell do something about it! But they haven't. They haven't done anything.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Personally, I don't think they're taking it even 1/10th as seriously as we are. Think about it, their talks about this are limited to Twitter. Even other producers doesn't think it's him, so why don't THEY do something about it!? While I think it's him, I also think that we need to be united in his music, and this is causing a division. With your comparison videos, surely the fans have more than enough to take SONY and the Estate to court!
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

Jesta said:
Eh, it could be possible. One thing I don't get is how no-one, not even the Jackson's, have even filed legal action against whoever decided that the tracks be on the album. There's certainly enough basis for it. SONY would be widely discredited, the Estate would be dissolved and presumably run by the family, win-win for most fans, surely!
Click to expand...

For the same reasons Michael hadn't done it himself back in 2001/2. SONY know how to protect themselves legally.
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

But here's the thing. I'm sure that an analysis of the vocals would have to be done there and then. The fans could produce a Malachi a capella to analyze as well, and have it compared. Seriously, I don't think the fans can lose if this is taken to court!
 
Re: Michael - The Great Album Debate (Only Go Here if You Want To Continue The Controversy)

If I lived in the US and had more life experience, maybe I'd go to court. But for no, it won't happen.

Producer can't really do anything. I don't think they really care about it that much. Surely, they think it's disgusting but taking it to the court, etc, I think they feel it's not their responsibility and like BUMPER just said, Sony isn't some amateur company. They are HUGE. They run more than we know.

If only someone here at MJJC or MaxJax knew a forensic musicologist... Problem would be solved.
 
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