Katherine Jackson vs AEG Live -Daily Trial Testimony Summary

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 58 – July 29 2013 – Summary

No Jackson family member was in court.


Eric Briggs Testimony


AEG direct


Strong asked about Briggs opinion on the completion of the 50 shows agreed by Michael Jackson at the time of his death. The expert said it was speculative to assume MJ would complete all 50 shows in London. A slide shown to the jury relates to a world tour that would be speculative, Briggs said. (ABC7)

Slide: Erk's TII Tour: Speculative 1- No agreement beyond 50 shows 2- MJ's drug use 3- MJ's history if cancellations 4- World tour depends on completion of 50 shows a- Performance Risk b- Execution Risk

However, Briggs said numbers 1 and 2 also relates to the 50 shows in London. Briggs said MJ's history and manner of drug use and lasting affects are supporting basis for opinion that 50 shows were speculative. “MJ had a significant history of canceling projects, even if they were reasonably sure to happen," Briggs said. (ABC7)

Briggs said he evaluated Mr. Erk's numbers regarding the 260 shows. Jacksons atty Brian Panish asked for sidebar. It lasted 23 minutes. (ABC7)

Brigg’s opinion is that it’s speculative to assume that Jackson would have completed the 50 “This Is It” shows. He also thinks it’s speculative that Jackson would have performed a 260 show world tour, as plaintiff’s expert Arthur Erk projected. Briggs told the jury two main points for his opinion are Jackson’s history of canceling shows and his prescription drug usage. (AP)

Regarding the 260 shows Erk calculated, Briggs said the expert's projection was unprecedented for gross ticket sales and revenue perspective . Briggs said the highest grossing tour ever is U2 360 Show, which generated $736 million in ticket sales and merchandise. (ABC7) Erk had estimated Jackson would earn more than $1 billion on touring, merchandise and endorsement deals if he had lived. Briggs however said Erk’s estimates were out of line with Jackson’s history, and the history of other successful tours. (AP)

Tour Gross Revenues: Tickets/Merchandise 1- U2: $736 million 2- Rolling Stones: $558 million 3- AC/DC: $441 million 4- Madonna: $408 million

Briggs said what's actually received by the artist is much smaller that the gross number and it is based on the expenses of the tour. If the production is expensive, Briggs said the net to AC/DC members could be higher than the net to U2 members, even though U2 grossed more. (ABC7)

MJ's Highest Grossing Tours: HISTORY generated $165 million for 82 dates in 1996-97 BAD generated $126 million for 120 shows . Briggs said the Dangerous tour was not included because it was not reflected in the list of highest grossing tours of all times. Dangerous tour was cut short due because MJ entered rehab, Briggs explained. (ABC7)

Although one of Briggs’ charts wasn’t shown to the jury, he did see one showing revenues of the top 4 highest-grossing concert tours ever. U2’s 360 tour tops the list with $736 million in ticket sales and merchandise, although Briggs says that’s not how much the band made. The Rolling Stones and AC/DC are the #2 and #3 on the list, with Madonna ranking as the top-grossing solo artist at $408 million. Those are gross figures, and Briggs says it’s not clear how much each artist took home from their tours. He contrasted that with Jackson’s HIStory tour, which grossed $165 million, and the Bad tour, which grossed $126 million. The Dangerous tour didn’t make the list because it was cut short. Briggs would later show a chart showing it lost money. (AP)

For the “This Is It” shows, AEG Live projected gross ticket sales of between $94 and $107 million. (AP) AEG's Predicted Future Tours: Prod 1: $94 million Prod 2: $107 million (ABC7)

Strong asked Briggs how AEG's 2009 Budget compare. Erk projected $1.65 billion for 260 shows tour, he answered. "Clearly this is in excess of anything we've ever seen in the history around the world," Briggs opined. Briggs said Mr. Erk was projecting $900 million to be paid to MJ as net for tickets, endorsements and merchandising. Based on the record, this amount was nowhere near what MJ had brought home in the past, Briggs testified. Briggs said Paul Gongaware testified MJ's Dangerous tour lost money, it was not profitable. He also testified HIStory tour was a break even. Net is the value of tickets and merchandising minus all the costs to put on the show, Briggs explained. Regarding the HIStory tour, Briggs said, based on Gongaware's testimony, there must have been costs that made the tour break even. "What's implied is that MJ did not generate any significant net from this tour," Briggs said. (ABC7)

Plaintiff’s expert Arthur Erk projected as more than $1 billion in revenue for Jackson from ticket sales and merchandise on a world tour. Briggs: “Clearly this figure is in excess of what we’ve seen in the history of the world.” He then showed a slide depicting Jackson’s proceeds from previous tours. HIStory broke even, he said, and Dangerous lost money. (AP)

Briggs testified that AEG's budget shows that MJ, if he completed all 50 show shows, would've taken home between $22 and $31 million. This amount included tickets and merchandising, but not endorsement, Briggs said. Briggs: As Jun 2009, no endorsement was in place, no sponsorhip was in place. AEG Live had taken steps to secure them but none were in place (ABC7) Michael Jackson would have earned between $22-$30 million for the “This Is It” shows, if he completed the 50 concerts in London. (AP)

Briggs spent several minutes telling the jury that Erk’s figures were speculative and weren’t rooted in history. (AP) Briggs said Erk projected MJ would net $890 million from a 260 world tour shows between tickets, merchandising, endorsements and sponsorship. "I don't know how anyone can be reasonably certain this would occur," Briggs said. The highest grossing tour of all times was U2's 360, Briggs said, which was $736 million. Erk's projection for MJ to net was way above that. "It's completely out of line of with history, with MJ's own history and history of all other tours," Briggs opined. (ABC7)

If there's no tour, there's no merchandise, the expert said. Briggs' experience with endorsement relates to working with the estate of major artists, like Elvis and Frank Sinatra. They were approached many times by large companied to put their names on products to sell. (ABC7)

Briggs explained the industry uses a "Q" score data, which draws the likability of a celebrity or persona. Briggs said there are two major types of factors that companies take into consideration to select artist to endorse: 1- history in securing endorsement, relationship with previous sponsors 2- how predictable the artist is, how stable his/her actions are. "Companies are looking for safe bets," Briggs said. "They don't want to take big risks with their products." Briggs explained the companies are concerned about what general public thinks of the artist/celebrity. Briggs: The tour gross relates to people being interests in seeing someone perform. MJ was a great performer. But there's a difference between excellence as performance of stage and whether the company wants to align itself w/ performer, Briggs said. Briggs said the "Q" score data associated with MJ analyzed his albums' sales, actions taken by AEG, and MJ's stability and predictability. Briggs explained data companies calls people and ask how much they like a certain artist, their "Q" score. They then report the results back to the brand company to decide how safe a bet an artist is. Briggs received two sets of data: MJ likability MJ comparative group (Bruce Springsteen, Elton John, Justin Timberlake). Judge wanted to know what kind of questions the company asks people in the survey. Briggs said the question is about the person's impression of the artist, with normally 3-5 choices for answer. The questions are not as much if a person would buy a product, but their impression of the artist, Briggs explained. "Q" score survey: Question: What's your general impression of individual/celebrity? Answers: One of my Favorites, Very Good, Good, Fair/Poor. Briggs said it's useful to look at comparison w/ other artists, how they stack up against others that are similar to the artist in question. Briggs said there's data for "Q" score from 1990 to 2006, with some gaps. There's no "Q" score data between 2006 and 2009. (ABC7)

AEG defense attorney Sabrina Strong asked about Jackson’s prospects for an endorsement deal, which led Briggs into a discussion of Q Scores. Q Scores weigh the broad likeability of an artist based on a survey. Companies use the data to determine their celebrity spokespeople. Briggs: “Companies are looking for safe bets.” He uses Q Scores in his work advising clients and pulled data on Jackson from 1990-2006. There were several years of Q Scores missing for Jackson, and no surveys of his likability were taken after 2006. The judge was interested in how Q Score data is obtained, so Briggs explained it in further detail. Respondents are asked to rank celebrities in one of four likability categories: “One of my favorites” Very good. Good Fair/ poor. ackson’s scores generally declined after 1993, although there were some years in the early 2000s that his scores improved. By 2006, the last year Jackson’s Q Score was evaluated, he had a -7.4 rating. It had declined a lot from 2003 on. The rating means there were 7 times more people who responded unfavorably to Jackson than those who answered he was one of their favorites. Artists are rated against contemporaries. Briggs said in 1990, MJ was groups with MC Hammer, Billy Joel, Don Henley and Kenny Rogers. He didn’t explain who Jackson was grouped with on the survey in the 2000s, although Justin Timberlake was name as a possibility. (AP)

Strong showed a chart of MJ's "Likability," which Declined After 1993. The chart shows a Negative-Positive Impression. Briggs said that in 2006, there was 1 (one) person with positive impression for every 7.4 people with negative impression of MJ. Briggs said in 1993, MJ's likability was pretty well in line with other artists. From that point, it declined substantially. In 2006, Briggs said the chart shows that there were 7.4 negative impressions for 1 positive regarding Michael Jackson. Briggs explained that in 1993 there was a start of some significantly negative headlines associated with MJ, his drug abuse and other issues . There's no data available from 2006 to 2009. Briggs said he requested the data but was unable to get it. He said if someone's likability is so negative, they take those people off the list, since no company would want to align itself with them. (ABC7)

Briggs testified that he studied "Q score" data for Jackson, the trend of his album sales and his stability to conclude that Jackson had a low chance of earning money from endorsements and sponsorships. Briggs said that while Jackson was "a great performer" companies decide which celebrities to align their products with based on "likability" as measured by "Q scores." Jackson's "Q score" in 1993 was in line with the average male musical performer, with about one person of every two surveyed saying they liked him, Briggs said. That was the year Jackson announced he had a problem with painkillers, and he entered rehab.His score became dramatically negative over the next decade, Briggs said. By 2006, a year after he was acquitted in a child molestation trial, more than seven people said they disliked Jackson for every one who said they liked him, Briggs testified. Companies would be "very anxious" about putting someone with such negative "likability" next to their products, he said. (CNN)

"Brand companies appreciate artists can be great performers, but that doesn't mean they want to put their names next to the performers," Briggs said. According to him, Jackson's image rebounded somewhat in the 1990s, but it plummeted again in 2003 for several reasonss. For big-name labels, Jackson was a risk, because new scandals could emerge without warning, Briggs explained, and "brands are looking for predictability." (AFP)

Judge asked Briggs if MJ could've been compared to an individual artist, such as Justin Timberlake, as opposed to a group of similar artists. He said the norm is to compare with the average of the group with the artist in question. (ABC7)

Negative headlines about drugs and sex abuse charges greatly diminished Michael Jackson's earning potential, an entertainment
consultant said. Jackson's album sales dropped sharply from his peak and his "likability" rating turned dramatically negative after "significantly negative headlines, drug abuse and other issues," Eric Briggs testified. (CNN)

Briggs said Mr. Erk specified album unit sales for five of MJ's albums. "It also showed a significant decline," Briggs said. MJ's albums sale: 1982 -- Thriller -- 65 million 1987 -- Bad -- 45 million 1991 -- Dangerous -- 32 million 1995 -- HIStory -- 20 million 2001 -- Invincible -- 13 million (ABC7)

Briggs testified MJ had a significant issue in the media related to negative headlines in a broad of topics. That would impact a company's decision on endorsements/sponsorship. Companies are focused on selling, Briggs said. The expert explained there was a significant audience that wanted to see MJ perform. (ABC7)

He said AEG took steps to secure endorsements and sponsorships but was unable to do so. "I don't know how he can predict that all of the sudden the light switch would be turned on" Briggs said about Erk's endorsement projection. The expert said there were no endorsement or sponsorship deals at the time of MJ's death. (ABC7)

Briggs moved on to discussions of album sales, which declined over Jackson’s career, and he attacked the premise of a Vegas tribute show. Tribute shows only work if the artist is dead, Briggs said. He said Erk’s projections for a tribute show were also speculative. (AP)

Strong asked why Las Vegas deal was speculative. Briggs said there was nothing in the works, no budget, agreement or financing. Beyond that, there's no real precedent for living, touring artist, who has a tribute show. Briggs testified there aren't any meaningful, premium-type of show, associated with a living performing artist. (ABC7)

"In my business, just expressing interest it doesn't mean it's going to happen," the expert opined. He said they were ideas and he sees ideas thrown around all the time. Briggs: Las Vegas is a very competitive market. Every hotel wants a show that appeals to a broad audience. "It's hard to make big bets if there are high questions about likability and predictability." "Entertainment is about finding an audience," Briggs said. "No one can predict if it will be successful until you sell the tickets." Briggs said his understanding is that MJ's Estate did not agree to AEG's proposed Las Vegas tour. (ABC7)

Lastly, he discussed films and whether Jackson was assured of success in the film industry. His opinion was that MJ wasn’t assured success. (AP)

Briggs said in Erk's projection, MJ would go into movies, but he did not provide figures in this regard. Briggs' "Film Production Process": - Ideas - Development/Packaging - Financing - Pre-production planning – Production - Post production - Advertising - Distribution - Theatrical release - Profits? . Briggs said there were efforts taking place at one point for MJ to make movies. He considers it to be in the development phase. "It absolutely does not mean it would be getting to the end of the process," Briggs opined. Briggs said the decision to make films is multimillion dollar one. The commitment is very serious, you can't make movie w/ a million dollars. "A movie can be hundreds of millions of dollars," Briggs said. And a lot needs to be in place, like audience, distributors, etc. He said just advertising a movie in the US can be 50+ million dollars. Briggs said the last feature film MJ was associated w/ "Miss Cast Away," released in 2004-05 and it went straight to video, not in theaters. Briggs said that even at the distribution phase, it doesn't mean film will be profitable/successful. "It's all a risk up until this point." Only after 3-6 weeks in the theater it's possible to figure out if the movie is profitable or not, Briggs said. Briggs named some big films that have been disappointments: John Carter, Battleship, Jack the Giant Killer. Briggs: These movies had big actors, big dollars, big movie studios and big decision process that can't always be right. Each studio releases 15-20 films/year, Briggs said, and only about half of them are known to the public. "Just because you make something it doesn't mean it will go on to critical success," Briggs said. (ABC7)

Briggs: Mr. Erk simply stated he believed Michael would do movies. Briggs said there were periods of times where MJ would have great connections in the movie industry, then fire them only to hired them back. Great connections do not equate that things will get done, let alone be successful," Briggs testified. Briggs: "Not everything that's attempted is a resounding success." Regarding MJ's personal history with respect to feature films, Briggs was emphatic: "I do not believe MJ was successful," the expert said. "Even Mr. Erk said he was not successful in movies," Briggs said. Briggs: I don't know how anyone can project, with reasonable certainty, that MJ would be successful at making movies. (ABC7)

-----------------------------------------------
Court broke for the day, and there were brief arguments by plaintiff’s attorney Brian Panish about Briggs’ billing records. Panish wants detailed records of the work Briggs has done on the AEG case and said the expert’s firm has been paid $600-$700k so far. Panish said he also wants to know what other work Briggs has done for AEG Live so he can address his “bias” on cross-examination. (AP)

Rebbie Jackson was to testify on Wednesday but is sick. Other witnesses expected this week: Debbie Rowe and Randy Jackson via video depo. (ABC7)

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 59 – July 30 2013 – Summary

Katherine and Trent Jackson was present in court.

Before testimony resumed, AEG's Kathryn Cahan said last week, when Dr. Saunders' video deposition was played, they didn't read a correction. She said when Dr. Saunders said the only two drugs he know of were Demerol and morphine -- it should be buprenorphine instead of Morphine. (ABC7)


Eric Briggs Testimony

AEG Direct

Strong continued her questioning. Briggs said he was tasked to analyze Erk's projection related to MJ's potential work-related income.

Briggs Conclusions:
1- It is speculative as to whether these projects would be completed;
2- The projection and numbers are speculative (ABC7)

She asked Briggs for his bottom-line opinion in the case. He didn't give a number for what he thought were Jackson's potential earnings. Instead Briggs said that it would be speculative to offer a damages opinion, and reiterated he thought Arthur Erk's numbers were speculative (AP)

Strong finished her questions. Jacksons' attorney Brian Panish did cross examination.


Jackson cross

Plaintiff's attorney Brian Panish started his cross-examination, which was pointed and initially focused on Briggs' billings in the case. Briggs' firm has billed between $600-700k for their work in the case. He doesn't have detailed time records for the work done though. Panish spent a lot of time asking Briggs to justify the billings and showed him a binder of items he prepared before his deposition. After numerous questions, Panish showed the jury about a stack of documents about an inch high that Briggs had compiled of his work. Some of it was the Q score data he explained yesterday, and other files were news articles. He compiled notes, but they were bullet points. Briggs also reviewed the testimony of numerous other experts in the case, as well as Randy Phillips and Paul Gongaware. Briggs initially identified 15 depositions he'd reviewed, but as his testimony went on he remembered others he had read through. (AP)

Briggs said he's engaged in this matter as AEG and O'Melveny & Myers expert witness. "I'm offering my independent opinion in his matter," Briggs said. As an individual, he's not being paid. Panish asked if his company was being paid, and the expert said FTI consulting is billing fees in this matter. (ABC7)

Panish: You are being paid by this side here, sir?
Briggs: I don't agree with your characterization
Panish: You never worked for us?
Briggs: I'm not performing work in this matter for Mrs. Jackson and Panish law firm (ABC7)

"I'm engaged in this matter as an expert witness," Briggs responded. "My firm has been hired by AEG and O'Melveny & Myers." (ABC7)

Panish: So you are not independent?
Briggs: I'm not sure I understand where you're going with this.(ABC7)

Briggs said he has had between 4 and 6 meeting with AEG's attorneys over the last two weeks. The expert said he worked 40-50 hours approximately since July 18. He said he went to the attorneys' office 5 days last week, 2 this week. Briggs said another member of his firm (Matthew) is helping him in the case. Matthew has been with the company for about a year and Panish says he's the one who has been doing a lot of the work. Briggs said Panish's characterization that Matthew worked the most in this case is concerning. (ABC7)

Panish: How much, sir, have you charged O'Melveny & Myers?
Briggs said the total bill is in the order of $600,000 to $700,000.
Panish: And you say you're independent, correct, sir?
Briggs: I'm offering my independent opinion in this matter (ABC7)

Briggs said his understanding is that there's another person hired by AEG to testify regarding damages in this case. Panish said the expert testified in his deposition he had worked 130 hours in this case. Since his deposition, Briggs said he has worked approximately 200 additional hours, 350 hours total. Panish showed the witness the bill sent by Briggs' company. It does not detail the work done, only the amount of hours spent. (ABC7)

Panish: Do you keep track of the hours you work?
Briggs: Yes, I tell my assistant how much I worked on a case (ABC7)

Bill shows 17.3 hours worked, $13,840 charge. Briggs said he doesn't know specifically what he did on those hours, but did research in connection with the case, preparing for deposition. (ABC7)

Panish held a three ring binder with about 2 inches of documents and asked Briggs if those were all the documents he generated for $650K. Briggs said that binder does not contain everything that he generated. (ABC7)

Panish: Everything contained in this little file is what you generated in this case, correct?
Briggs: By your definition, yes (ABC7)

Panish said the material Briggs generated is about an inch worth of documents. Briggs said that if Panish is defining in printed paper what he generated, then yes. But if he counted deposition and testimony, then no. (ABC7)

Panish: Did you ever make a list of all the depositions you reviewed in this case?
Briggs: I did not put together an exhaustive list. (ABC7)

Briggs said he read thousands of pages of depositions, probably 10K. Panish asked if Briggs made summaries of the depositions. He said no. "I cannot give you an exhaustive list of all the depositions I reviewed in this case," Briggs said. He named about 15/16 people. Briggs said he reviewed the opening statements by both parties, summary judgment and opposition, and the judge's ruling. Briggs said he has only testified once in UK related to a tax case. He has never testified before in a court in the US. The expert didn't summarize the trial testimony he read either. He named about 7 people from whom he read testimony. (ABC7)

Panish: Did you review Billboard Magazine regarding this case?
Briggs: Yes
Panish: You never promoted a concert, have you?
Briggs: I'm not a concert promoter (ABC7)

Briggs also said he has never produced concerts. People in the music industry are his clients, Briggs said. (ABC7)

Panish: And the highest selling album in the history of the world is "Thriller," correct, sir? Briggs: I believe that's correct. The chart stated it sold 65 million. (ABC7)

Panish: You understand the defendants say they are not responsible for anything in this case, right? Briggs: I'm not entirely sure what the defendants said they are responsible for . (ABC7)

"I don't believe the defendants are admitting they owe anything" Briggs said. He said he was asked to opine on plaintiff's damage analysis. Panish: MJ would earn no money in the future had he not died? Briggs: My opinion is that it is speculative to project that he (MJ) would earn money related to work. (ABC7)

Panish: Your opinion, had MJ not died, he would have earned no money, correct?
Briggs: That's not my opinion
Panish: How much would he have made working in concerts?
Briggs: My opinion is that it is speculative to project earnings for future work
Panish: Could he have made money working?
Briggs: Sure, anything is possible (ABC7)

Briggs: My opinion related to Mr. Erk's analysis, which has earning capacity in it. Briggs said his understanding is that future earning capacity is what someone is expected to receive for future work. Panish asked if Briggs has ever testified regarding loss of income in wrongful death or personal injury cases. The expert said no. "I've not done projection of loss of earning capacity," Briggs said. (ABC7)

Briggs said he's worked an average of 50 weeks per year over the past 15 years. Panish calculated it to be about 750 weeks of work. Panish: So you worked on 1300 project in 750 weeks? Briggs: Approximately (ABC7)

Panish showed a document Briggs wrote that was basis for opinion on not getting endorsement is debt. Briggs notes: Challenges with major advertisers given history (drug usage, child abuse, litigation, debt); also negative publicity. Briggs: MJ history of significant debt figured in my opinion that MJ would encounter challenges in securing endorsements. Panish asked if Briggs considered MJ's Sony ATV catalogue, which is one of his assets, to offset the debt. (ABC7)

Panish: How do you know he was in debt?
Briggs: There were extensive testimony in this case about MJ's debt (ABC7)

Panish asked if Briggs knows that MJ had assets with value. Briggs said yes. Panish asked if Briggs knows that MJ's asset, especially one, exceeded the amount of his debt. Briggs said he's concerned about confidentiality agreement in answering this question. Panish: You know, through your own knowledge, that MJ's assets far exceeded his debts when you wrote that on the sheet, don't you sir? (Judge gets mad with Strong for not stopping the objections, tells her to abide by her rulings. Strong continued, judge called a sidebar.) Briggs said he does not know that MJ had assets worth more than 300 or 400 or 500 million when he wrote his opinion . Briggs said he had knowledge of some of MJ's asset.(ABC7)

Panish: Did you value that asset (Sony's catalogue)?
Briggs: Yes
Panish: It's well in excess of $500 million, isn't it, sir?
Briggs: I'm sorry I'm having a trouble here, but I don't want to disclose any confidential information. (ABC7)

There were three sidebars in the afternoon session, one of which was called after Strong repeatedly objected to a line of Panish's questions Panish asked Briggs whether he had done any work valuing Jackson's assets outside of the AEG case. He had, but he didn't want to answer who he had done the work for. He said the work was the subject of confidentiality agreements and he didn't want to violate them. Panish kept pressing for answers and Strong kept objecting, to the point that the judge told her, "Ms. Strong, I've made the ruling." Panish continued asking questions about Briggs' work on Jackson's assets outside of this case, and Strong objected. The judge told Strong again that she should stop objecting, that she'd overruled them. Strong kept talking, and the judge called a sidebar (AP)

Panish asked if the gross value Briggs put for the Sony catalogue is well in excess of the value of MJ's debt. "I don't remember the number," Briggs said. "I did not believe that's the case." Briggs: I believe the testimony the debt associated with Sony ATV catalogue was $400 million. Panish wants to know if the gross value of the catalogue was in excess of the debt. Briggs said no. Briggs said he performed the evaluation of Sony's catalogue many times, and his response was related to June 2009. Briggs said he was working with someone unrelated to this case regarding the value of the Sony catalogue. Briggs asked the judge to instruct him on what he should answer, since Panish wants to know who he was working w/ regarding the catalogue. (ABC7)

Panish: Do you have a conflict of interest in this case?
Briggs: No
P: Have you been clear about your company to testify?
B: Absolutely(ABC7)

Briggs said he's not comfortable disclosing the names of the companies that hired him before. Judge Yvette Palazuelos ordered him to answer. Briggs: In one particular case, a law firm hired us. It was in late 2009, after Michael Jackson had died. Panish asked if before MJ died if any law firm hired his company to assess MJ's assets. Briggs said he doesn't recall. Regarding this asset, the Sony ATV catalogue, Briggs said he worked on evaluating it between 5-10 times. Briggs said he provided his opinion in those engagements, 5 to 10 times, before MJ died, to 3 or 4 third parties. (ABC7)

Panish: Was one of them Sony?
Briggs: Yes
Sony ATV Music Publishing was one of the companies, not Sony music, Briggs said.(ABC7)

Fortress Capital -- Briggs said it was another company. He recalls law firm and there may have been financial companies.
Panish: Goldman Sacks?
Briggs: It's possible, I work on hundreds of projects a year.
Panish: Goldman Sacks hired you regarding MJ, right sir?
Briggs: I don't recall specifically. (ABC7)

When the attorneys came back, Panish continued his questions about Briggs' other clients on Jackson issues. Briggs said he was still uncomfortable discussing the clients.The judge told him to answer the questions with a yes or no answer. There had to be another sidebar before Briggs told jury there had been 5 to 10 "engagements" in which he'd worked on Jackson assets. He said he delivered opinions to 3 or 4 different entities. One of them was Sony-ATV, the massive music catalog MJ has an interest in. Another was Michael Jackson's estate. Briggs said he discussed working on the AEG case with an estate attorney and was told it was OK. Briggs also said the general counsel of his company, FTI Consulting, approved him working as an expert in the AEG Live litigation. (AP)

Briggs never performed an audit for a record company. (ABC7)

Briggs said he watched the testimony of Meglen in the overflow room. He was accompanied by 3 AEG attorneys. (ABC7)

Panish asked if Briggs worked with MJ before being retained in this case. He said yes and that he discussed it with AEG. Briggs testified AEG didn't see the work done in previous engagements as conflict of interest. Briggs said that what was more important to him is what FTI's general counsel thought and they determined there was no conflict of interest. Briggs said he had engagement agreements with a number of entities related to MJ. “I went one step further and told them (AEG) I would not be discussing anything regarding my other work," Briggs said. Panish: Who did you call, have sign waiver in writing about a potential conflict of interest? Briggs said there wasn't anything in writing. "My recollection was the attorneys for the Estate of Michael Jackson," Briggs testified. He said a call took place, doesn't know who called. Briggs was retained on February 8, 2013. He spoke with Jeryll Cohen from MJ Estate and she okay'd him to testify as witness in this case. She was well aware what was going on and approved it. Briggs said he told her he had no interest in sharing the work done for the Estate. Briggs said he spoke with Cohen again about two months ago, and she acknowledged his work on this case. (ABC7)

Briggs receives a salary and bonus based on performance of the division. FTI is a public traded company. Briggs said he thinks the company was approaching $2 billion in revenues last year. (ABC7)

Panish asked Briggs about doing risk assessments, and whether he considered Conrad Murray a significant risk to Jackson's life. The question was based on an expert who testified at deposition that he would have been surprised if Michael Jackson lived another week given Murray's treatments on MJ.Briggs didn't want to say Murray was a risk to Jackson's life, or address medical risks. Briggs said he couldn't offer a medical opinion, but just considered the opinions of other medical experts in the case. Panish questioned whether having a "fit and competent" doctor would have lessened the risk to Jackson's life. Briggs didn't want to say yes. "That one risk would be removed," Briggs said about Murray if he was no longer MJ's doctor. He said other medical risks remained, though. Panish mentioned the coroner's report and testimony and specifically that they found no evidence of problems with Jackson's heart. (AP)

Briggs testified he saw testimony that MJ had one life week to live after June 25, 2009, the day of the artist's death. Panish said Dr. Shimelman testified MJ's life expectancy was one week based on Dr. Murray's treatment of him Briggs: I believe his statement was MJ's life expectancy was one week, and he was taking into effect a lot of things: Dr. Murray, drug use (ABC7)

Panish: Are you aware that IRS is investigating the people who hired you and undervalued Sony ATVcatalogue? Objection: Sustained (ABC7)

Dr. Earley said MJ was essentially playing Russian roulette in the way he was using drugs, Briggs said. Panish: Dr. Murray was a big risk to MJ's health, wasn't he? Briggs: I wasn't focused on the risk, I was focused on a doctor assessing a record after the fact. Panish asked if Dr. Murray was a risk to MJ's health. Briggs: It appears in determining his life expectancy Dr. Shimelman took in consideration Dr. Murray. Panish: If Dr. Murray isn't in the question, there's no risk, right, sir? Briggs: There are all kinds of risks, like risk of relapse, risk of the manner he's taking the drugs. Briggs: This is not my opinion, I'm not a doctor, I was relying on Dr. Shimelman's testimony (about one week to live). Briggs' note says Dr. Shimelman -- Die any night. Briggs: Dr. Earley said the way MJ was taking drugs was like playing Russian roulette. Panish: Isn't it true Dr. Earley never blamed MJ for his addiction? Briggs: That's what I recall from the testimony. Briggs: I was asked to assess forecast earnings, not blame. Briggs: To a lay person, Dr. Earley's testimony that MJ was playing Russian roulette is talking about life expectancy. Panish said Dr. Earley wasn't asked to opined on MJ's life expectancy. Briggs read Dr. Earley's deposition and that's what it reads. Briggs: Just to be clear, I can't assess anyone's life expectancy. (ABC7)

Briggs said he relied on AEG's attorney to give him all the relevant materials related to what he's been asked to opine. The expert said he didn't review MJ's autopsy report, since he has no ability to read it. Briggs said one of the experts he reviewed stated the normal actuary doesn't apply to MJ's life and behavior. Briggs relied on Dr. Earley's testimony. He was unable to give a life expectancy to MJ because he wasn't hired for that. Dr. Shimelman said if Dr. Murray remained in the picture, MJ would live only another week. Dr. Schnoll said MJ could've been treated by a fit and competent doctor and remove the risk. Briggs: Dr. Shimelman stated a life expectancy of one week, I don't know how someone could perform for 9 months. (ABC7)

Panish: AEG thought MJ could do 50 shows, didn't they, sir? Briggs: AEG had a plan for 50 shows, they had a budget for 50 shows, they were interested in doing 50 shows. (ABC7)

Panish asked who was more knowledgeable in concerts, if Briggs or Paul Gongaware. Briggs responded it depends which aspect of the business. (ABC7) Briggs has never worked as a concert promoter, and toward the end of his testimony Panish asked him if he knew more than Phillips, Gongaware. Briggs said he couldn't say who knew more about concert touring, promotion _ him, Phillips or Gongaware. (AP)

Panish: Did AEG ever hire you to see if the show would happen or not?
Brigss: AEG did not hire me before February of this year.
Briggs: If I were hired, I'd have told my opinion that it's speculative that the 9 months would have been completed. "It appeared they (AEG) believed the shows would've gone forward," Briggs testified. (ABC7)

Panish: Was AEG fraudulently selling tickets for the shows?
Briggs: I can't opine on that, I'm not an expert in fraud. (ABC7)

Panish asked if AEG only hired him 3 and half years after MJ was dead. Briggs said yes. Panish: Live Nation hired you to assess concert and feasibility? Briggs: No (ABC7)

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 60 – July 31 2013 – Summary

Katherine and Trent Jackson was present in court.


Eric Briggs Testimony


Jackson cross

It was very slow going again today, with plaintiff’s attorney Brian Panish continuing to try to get more details about Briggs' work. Panish spent more than 25 minutes this morning trying to get more details on Briggs’ billing records. He didn’t get any more info. Briggs also continued to be very circumspect about what other work he’d done on valuing Jackson’s signature asset, the Sony ATV catalog. Outside the presence of the jury this afternoon, Judge Yvette Palazuelos allowed Panish to question Briggs about his connection to estate. Palazuelos also asked about the other entities Briggs had done work for analyzing Jackson’s assets. Briggs has done work for Goldman Sachs, the Fortress Investment Group and Jackson’s estate regarding the catalog. Panish has said repeatedly that Briggs’ calculations under-valued the catalog and that his mention of MJ’s debt in his testimony in the AEG case doesn’t take into account the Sony-ATV catalog’s actual value at the time Jackson died. Panish says estate attorney Howard Weitzman is going to come to court (probably tomorrow) and discuss whether Briggs can discuss his work. Briggs has said he cleared his work on the AEG case with another estate attorney, Jeryll Cohen. Panish says that’s not true. AEG’s lawyers say they aren’t blocking Briggs from answering the questions about his work with the estate, but he wants the judge to order him to answer. At a sidebar yesterday, AEG attorney Sabrina Strong said Briggs could be sued without the judge’s order. Briggs says his remarks about Jackson being deeply in debt are only tied to his opinion that MJ couldn’t have gotten endorsement deals. AEG’s attorneys did try to say that Panish’s questioning of Briggs on the debt issue was outside the scope of the case. Palazuelos disagreed. “We’ve got debt right smack in the middle of this opinion,” she said. Panish, who has said Briggs’ credibility is at issue and some of his testimony is false, will be able to explore the issue more. (AP)

Panish asked Briggs who he contacted at the Estate of Michael Jackson to waive potential conflict of interest. "I believe FTI checked for conflict of interest," Briggs said. He said he received a form and the conflict of interest check was marked. The expert said he doesn't know who made the call to the Estate, if it was him or his partner. Briggs: As far as I'm concerned, everything I've done for Estate and everything I've done on this matter have nothing to do with each other. Panish: Sir, did you testify you discussed the potential for a conflict of interest with AEG's attorneys? Briggs: I never viewed it as a potential conflict of interest, I don't think I characterized it that way. "I discussed my previous engagements with O'Melveny & Myers," Briggs said. Panish asked which lawyers Briggs discussed at OMM the potential for conflict of interest. He said Sabrina Strong and perhaps Jessica Bina. Panish asked if Briggs called Ms. Cohen to talk about the potential conflict of interest before his deposition. He said he doesn't recall. (ABC7)

Panish: Yesterday, you said you met with Ms. Cohen (attorney for the Estate), correct?
Briggs: Yes
Panish: Did Ms. Cohen say to you she waived any potential conflict between you, FTI, and the Estate of Michael Jackson?
Briggs: Ms. Cohen did not say that
Panish: Did you ask Ms. Cohen to waive any potential conflict of interest?
Briggs: I did not ask her that specific question (ABC7)

Panish asked Briggs if he's produced his time records related to this case. He said he turned the subpoena to FTI's general counsel. Panish: Has any attorneys for AEG told you that the court issued an order to you to produce your time records forthwith (immediately? Briggs: No, my recollection is that the document was a subpoena. Panish tells Briggs there's a signed order to produce his time record in this case. Briggs asked to see it, since he doesn't have it. (ABC7)

Panish showed several bills from FTI for Briggs without itemization of the work done. They are for $55,000, $189,000, $123,000, $155,902. Panish points out there are two employees just out of school earning $350/hr. He asked where their time sheets were. "You'd expect someone working for that kind of money would produce records of what they worked on" Panish asked. Briggs said he doesn't know. Panish: Does your company check the time worked before submitting bill to a client? Briggs: I understand there's a check system in place, but I don't know how it works. Panish asked if Briggs' company has a billing department and itemization of work done. He said yes to first, doesn't know the second. Panish questioned Briggs, extensively, about all the bills FTI submitted and if he knew the specific work performed for each bill. Briggs said that in matters he bills clients by the hour, he's always charged $800 per hour. Other possibility is to charge flat fee. The expert clarified that he probably didn't charge $800/hour in the beginning of his career. (ABC7)

"My opinion is that it's speculative he would earn any money working," Briggs opined. (ABC7)
Panish: Your opinion is that MJ wouldn't earn a dime for future work?
Briggs: Yes, taking the consideration the risk factors we know today

Briggs: MJ's ability to secure endorsements from financial companies would be impacted by negative headlines associated with his debts. Panish asked if Pepsi, Nike, Red Bull, soft drink companies are financial companies. Briggs said no.(ABC7)

Panish asked Briggs if he was aware of anything that AEG did specifically to assess MJ's health. In his deposition, Briggs said he does not know anything specifically that AEG did to assess MJ's health. (ABC7)

Panish asked if Briggs included merchandising revenue in the chart he made. Briggs said Erk testified the numbers included merchandising. Briggs conceded he doesn't know independently whether the merchandising revenue is included in the numbers. (ABC7)

"I was absolutely comparing apples to apples," Briggs said.(ABC7)

Panish asked if U2 360 had 97,000 people at the Rose Bowl. Briggs said U2 was a 360 degree and they were able to fit a record crowd. Panish inquired about Meglen's testimony saying 97,000 people was not true. Briggs said he doesn't think that's what Meglen testified. (ABC7)

Chart:
1- U2 360 in 2009 -- 110 shows, $101, average 66K people
2- Rolling Stones -- 144 shows, $119, average 32K people
3- AC/DC -- 167 shows, $91, average 29K people
4- Madonna -- 85 shows, $115, average 42K people

MJ's HIStory tour averaged 55K people, average ticket was $37, which is one third of U2's ticket price. The last MJ show was about 10-12 years prior to U2. U2 averaged 66K people. Panish did this calculation: 55k (average of MJ's audience) x 186 shows (Gongaware's plan) x $108 (average TII ticket) = $1.1. billion. Panish: $108 ticket price times 55 thousand people times 186 shows, hows does that come out sir? Briggs: That is roughly $1.1 billion (ABC7)

Panish asked if there were drug use allegations regarding The Rolling Stones and AC/DC members. Briggs said yes, there were headlines about it. Panish asked if it was the same headlines Briggs referred to about Michael Jackson. Briggs said MJ's drug use he analyzed was based on testimony in this trial, not tabloid headlines. (ABC7)

Briggs: Yes, I think AEG wanted to go on a worldwide tour with Michael Jackson. Briggs agreed that AEG entered into a 3 year contract with Michael Jackson.
Panish: How many concerts did Gongaware estimated to do?
Briggs: In Sept 2008, prior to an agreement with MJ?
Panish: Yes
Briggs: 186 (ABC7)

Panish inquired if Dr. Shimelman testified that without Conrad Murray MJ would have had a normal life expectancy. Briggs: What he said is that he was not able to offer a statement with the doctor out of the picture and that is significant. Panish asked if Dr. Earley said MJ should no be to blame for his addiction. Briggs said yes, but said addicts should take responsibility (ABC7)

"There was wide spread media coverage, over the years, of MJ's drug usage," Briggs said.
Panish: You'd expect AEG, someone in the business, to know about MJ's drug use
Briggs: I'd generally expect they'd be aware of the headlines (ABC7)

Panish compared Briggs to an armchair quarterback after the fact, issuing opinion after the fact. Briggs: My opinion, of course, is more informed than the one made at the time (ABC7)

Panish: Did you know AEG paid a medical doctor to exam Michael Jackson, yes or no?
Briggs: No
Panish: Did you know AEG paid money to have Dr. Slavit to check Michael Jackson?
Briggs: I didn't have that specific knowledge

"There was a physical on MJ in the beginning of 2009," Briggs said. He added he doesn't know who hired the doctor and who paid him. Briggs said he recall reading about MJ getting a physical and that everything was fine. Briggs: My information is that the physical was passed and that there were no significant issues.

Panish: In your opinion that MJ wouldn't complete 50 shows, u didn't consider Dr Slavit?
Briggs: I don't know if I reviewed it prior to deposition
Panish: Were you aware coroner said MJ didn't have any medical problem at the time of his death that would've his life expectancy reduced?
Briggs: I don't recall that specific testimony, my knowledge is that the coroner's report was introduced through doctor testimony.
"My opinion is based after the facts, what we know today," Briggs testified. (ABC7)

Panish asked how many Dangerous shows were canceled. Briggs said in his opinion is between 3 to 10. He said he did research about it. Panish wanted to know why Briggs didn't bring the documents he relied on regarding the cancelation of the Dangerous tour. Panish asked the judge to admonish Briggs to answer the questions several times throughout the morning. When attorney asked the judge again, judge said: "I keep advising him, but..." . Briggs said in terms of actual dates, approximately 1.4% of the Dangerous shows were canceled. (ABC7)

Panish: How old were you in 1993?
Briggs: About 17-18 (ABC7)

Panish asked how many shows MJ performed in his career. Briggs said he doesn't know for sure, thinks it's 270 approximately. (ABC7)

Briggs said he cannot tell Panish what each specific bill means in terms of itemization of work done. Panish asked if there's any document detailing the time spent on the task and who did what regarding this case. Briggs: To my knowledge, that information does not exist. Panish wanted to know what type of time calculation software FTI uses. Briggs said he doesn't know. Briggs testified he doesn't know if his company has been paid or not. (ABC7)

Briggs reviewed Tom Barrack's testimony. Panish asked if Barrack said if MJ wanted to he could earn $500 million a year. Briggs said no. Barrack runs Colony Capital, an investment company. It's a multi-billion dollar entity. Panish showed deposition of Barrack with interview saying MJ was a guy who could make $500 million a year if he put his head to it.
Panish: Barrack wanted to invest in Mr. Jackson and do work with him in the future, right, sir?
Briggs: Yes (ABC7)

Panish: Government has stated one MJ asset is worth twice his debt, isn't it, sir?
Briggs: The only information I have in that respect is from attorneys of the Estate of Michael Jackson and I'm concerned w/ confidentiality
Panish: You' are well aware the value of one asset is doubled any debt he had, isn't that, sir?
Briggs: The only information I received in this regard came from lawyers of the Estate of Michael Jackson.

Briggs: They hired us to perform work related to Sony ATV catalogue as of the date of MJ's death. Panish argues there's no attorney-client privilege,and Briggs should be ordered to answer. Briggs said he only learned about what he knows of what the government claims regarding Sony ATV catalogue from the Estate. Judge and attorneys extensively argued whether Briggs has attorney-client privilege with the Estate of Michael Jackson. Judge to the jurors: Now you know what we do in chambers. That's the stuff we argue about. (ABC7)

Panish asked if MJ paid for Katherine Jackson's bills and expenses. Briggs said he doesn't recall the specific comments. Panish asked if MJ bought his mother a $500,000 motorhome. Briggs said he doesn't recall. Panish wanted to know if Briggs reviewed all the relevant documents in this case. He said the attorneys gave him documents, he asked others (ABC7)

Briggs identified 3 primary risks:
- Health/medical experts
- Projects falling through/cancellations
- Industry/precedent

Panish asked where Dr. Murray was in the risk. Briggs said he did not take Dr. Murray into account. (ABC7)

Panish: What's Madonna's cancellation rate?
Briggs: I don't know (ABC7)

Panish mentioned U2 canceled shows for Bono's back surgery, Madonna canceled show to be with her family, Guns N'Roses canceled and returned. Panish asked about Eric Clapton and Van Halen's cancellation of shows. Briggs doesn't recall how many were canceled. Panish said Briggs got his information from articles out of the internet. (ABC7)

Panish: All of these information, someone in 6th grade would be able to get the same exact information off the internet, correct, sir?
Briggs: They may have the same information but the interpretation is absolutely different.
Panish: Are you saying all these people are risks and no one should do business with them?
Briggs: I didn't say that (ABC7)

Panish asked how many shows AEG does in a year. Briggs said he doesn't know. Briggs estimated hundreds, perhaps thousands shows happen in a year around the world. (ABC7)

Panish: Did you take in consideration Randy Phillips and Dr. Murray had shared responsibility to get MJ into rehearsal? Briggs didn't recall. Panish showed email saying Phillips and Dr. Murray were responsible for getting MJ to rehearsal. Briggs said he doesn't recall it.(ABC7)

Briggs said that sometimes his clients don't follow their advice. "Our advice is not always right," the expert said. "The truth of my opinion has nothing to do with how much we're being paid in this case," Briggs testified. Panish asked what specific work Matthew did. Briggs said he researched cities Erk said concerts would take place, audience capacity, arenas. In deposition, an attorney asked Briggs if he performed specific calculation to demand in India for a MJ show in 2009-2012. Briggs said he did not nor was he aware of any material to enable them to make projections about India. (ABC7)

Panish: Do you agree Mj could have toured?
Briggs: Had he lived, it's possible
Panish: Could Mr. Jackson make movies?
Briggs: Yes
Panish: Could he have acted in movies?
Briggs: It's possible, sure
Panish: How much actors get paid for good movies?
Briggs: It vary from a few million to many millions of dollars
Panish: MJ could have made records?
Briggs: Yes, it's possible
Panish: Could he have done tours?
Briggs: Yes, it's possible
Panish: Could he have been involved in movies?
Briggs: Yes, it's possible
Panish: Could he have gotten endorsements?
Briggs: Yes, it's possible
Panish: Could he have sold merchandise?
Briggs: To the extent the shows happened, it's possible
Panish: Could he have done a residency shows in Las Vegas?
Briggs: It's possible
Panish: Did you look into MJ having a residency show with Celine Dion?
Briggs: I'm not aware of that
Panish: Did Ortega testify he discussed with MJ going on a worldwide tour and going to India?
Briggs: I don't recall that in trial testimony (ABC7)

Katherine Jackson stated that Michael Jackson didn't want to be moonwalking at 50 years old, Briggs said. Panish asked if Ortega testified that he wanted to do films with MJ and wanted to be involved in anything Jackson related. Briggs said yes. Panish inquired if Taj Jackson also testified about MJ wanting to do movies. Briggs answered yes. (ABC7)

Panish asked about album "Thriller 25" released in 2006 or 2007. Briggs said he concentrated on MJ's brand new albums in his chart. "I would describe it (Thriller 25) as successful re-release," Briggs said. (ABC7)

Panish asked how many people "Q" score company surveys. Briggs said he thinks they measure about 1800 people. Panish said it's 1400. Briggs said the "Q" scores measure people in the US. Panish asked if it were measured around the world. Briggs said there wasn't available. Panish: All you have is 1800 people surveyed across the United States? Briggs: That's correct . "The "Q" score was not relevant to ticket sales" Briggs said. Panish asked how the ticket sales went in London. Briggs responded "very well" (ABC7)

Panish: Mr. Gongaware had no concern that Mr. Jackson could do 50 shows, correct?
Briggs: With the information he had, it appeared that way (ABC7)

-----------------

Outside the presence of the jury, attorneys and judge discussed about what Briggs recalls regarding Gongaware's testimony. Judge: It seems like he doesn't recall, or doesn't want to recall, the testimony. Panish: The IRS has called into question what this witness is trying to say. The Estate never gave witness waiver to testify in this case. Panish: He never had permission, never had waiver. I believe the true facts will show he didn't contact Ms. Cohen until after his deposition Panish: There's no privilege regarding the value of ATV catalogue being double the amount of MJ's debts. Panish: His credibility is seriously at issue here, there's no privilege whatsoever. Bina: Briggs said he believes debt aspect would make MJ not appealable to endorsements. Bina: Ackerman has analyzed in great detail MJ's spending, debt. She said her understanding that conflict of interest has been waived. Bina: The government and his company may have a different understanding as to the catalogue value. Judge: What kind of investigation is that? Putnam: We don't know, we can't ask. Bina: There's no conflict of interest. Besides that, Erk didn't consider the ATV catalogue value and debts. Panish: They want to show he was destitute and had not money.That's not true, he could've spent money for 30 years and still not be in debt. Bina: He cleared the engagement for work on this case, not the debt. Judge: It sounds pretty suspicious to me. Bina: It doesn't matter whether MJ was in debt (for endorsement), but the negative perception he was in debt was sufficient. Boyle: He said that the value of the ATV catalogue was less than the debt. And that's not true. He knows it's not true. Boyle: According to the IRS, it's much higher than the debt. Judge: I don't understand him claiming privilege as to what the IRS says the value of the catalogue is. (ABC7)

Panish asked if Briggs has done extensive work regarding the value of Sony ATV catalogue. Briggs said yes, for Goldman Sachs; Sony ATV, not corporate; Fortress Capital; Estate of MJ; Law firm in 2007. Briggs said it's all in connection with the evaluation of Sony ATV catalogue. The expert said he gets rehired some times. Briggs has given valuation opinions in writing, which is easily accessible. Briggs: The work was performed after MJ's death, but the valuation is of date of death. (ABC7)

Panish: You don't consider IRS putting into question your work a major problem?
Briggs: IRS review about valuation is very commonplace, specially in large estates. (ABC7)

Judge: It sounds like you have info not subject to privilege, with other companies that ordered the valuation. Panish: He put a very low value on the catalogue and said it is less than MJ's debts, when the IRS valued it twice. Panish said the value ranges from a billion to 8 billion dollars. He knows the IRS has given much higher value, the attorney argued. Perry Sanders: the other side could stipulate there's another valuation that says the Sony catalogue is almost 2 times the debt. Bina: The problem is that we don't know the answer, we don't know that to be true. (ABC7)

Panish asked if Briggs has been subpoenaed by IRS. He said he's not aware.

Briggs: I understand the IRS is in discussions with the Estate. (ABC7)

Judge said to get the Estate lawyer in court to see if there's a waiver. Panish: If Briggs said something that's not true, it goes against his credibility. Bina said MJ' business manager said MJ had no ability to borrow money and had no money at time of death Panish: That's not true! He didn't know how much catalogue was worth, had $6 million in an account that Tohme was holding, so he had money. Jury then entered the courtroom. Testimony resumed. (ABC7)

------------------------------

Panish asked Briggs if he knows the average ticket price for MJ's show was $108. He said it's approximately right. (ABC7)

John Branca is a prominent entertainment attorney. Briggs said he was brought back around the time MJ died. Briggs doesn't recall Branca saying he believes MJ could have done the 50 shows. Panish asked if Briggs noted anything positive that Branca said regarding MJ's ability to make money. He said he doesn't believe he did. (ABC7)

Panish: All you remember is the things that were against MJ?
Briggs: My opinion is not against MJ.(ABC7)

Briggs: The positive I knew quite well, so there's no notes to that, the positives were apparent. Briggs said the points in his outline is to support his opinion, since the positive things he already knew about. (ABC7)

Briggs said he reviewed Shawn Trell's trial testimony of 4 days but does not recall anything he said that was relevant to his opinion. Briggs said the figures below are for ticket sales and merchandising: Prod 1 -- $94 million, Prod 2 -- $107 million. Briggs said there's a non-appearance insurance on the budget. Lloyds of London charged $450,000 for the premium. Panish: How much did the pay out was? Briggs: I have no idea (ABC7)

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 61 – August 1 2013 – Summary

Katherine Jackson was present in court.

(source: ABC7 unless otherwise indicated)


Eric Briggs Testimony


Jackson cross

Panish asked if independent appraiser hired by the IRS valued Sony ATV catalogue between 100 and 300 million. Briggs said "that's correct." Panish: And that Mr. Jackson had more assets, this was just one of them and it was valued 100 to 300 million in excess to the debt, correct? Briggs: I understand there were other assets. Panish said MJ had his own music catalogue, in addition to the other assets. Briggs agreed. The value was just for the Sony ATV catalogue.

Panish showed a chart with MJ's "Net" Earnings from Tours. Briggs said he relied on Paul Gongaware's statement saying "Dangerous" lost money. Panish said Gongaware is one of the defendants in this case. Briggs said he relied on his testimony. Panish: You'd expect he would know what was going on, right, sir? Briggs: I'd expect he had information that supported that statement. Panish asked what was Gongaware's involvement in "Dangerous" tour. Briggs said he believed he was involved in the production of the show.

Panish: Did Mr. Gongaware deal with the artist in the tour?
Briggs: They are dealing with many different factors, including the artist, MJ.
Briggs: I understood he was involved in the production of the show and had knowledge to make that statement.
Panish: Did you know MJ went into rehabilitation?
Briggs: I know he ended the tour and entered a rehabilitation.

Briggs said he cannot speak to specific knowledge of what Gongaware had. The expert said Gongaware made it very clear the tour lost money. Panish: Just a fact that he made the statement was good enough for you to rely on? Briggs: I did not check the veracity of the information. I relied exclusively on his statement.

Panish: How do you know "HIStory" broke even?
Briggs: I relied on Paul Gongaware's statement.
Panish: Did he give it to orphanages in India during that tour?
Briggs: I don't recall that specifically.

Panish asked if Briggs knew how much money MJ donated to charity from that tour. He said he doesn't know. "My recollection was non-profit organization established and there were conflicting headlines as to what was going in entity," Briggs said. Briggs doesn't know how much money MJ donated from the "HIStory" tour.

Panish spent about an hour on his cross-examination, challenging other aspects of consultant Eric Briggs’ testimony. Regarding a slide that Briggs prepared that showed Jackson’s Dangerous tour lost money, Briggs said it was based on Gongaware’s testimony. Panish asked whether Briggs did any other research on earnings for the Dangerous tour. The consultant said no. The slide states the HIStory tour broke even, which Briggs also based on AEG exec Paul Gongaware’s testimony. Panish asked whether Briggs looked into the millions that Jackson donated to charities during that tour. Briggs said he read news stories. Briggs said he saw conflicting headlines about where the donations went, and he couldn’t recall how much the stories said Jackson donated. (AP)

Briggs said he met Gongaware at the AEG's lawyers office.
Panish: Where you there meeting with the lawyers?
Briggs: Yes

No one told Briggs that he shouldn't ask Gongaware questions. Panish asked if he spoke with Gongaware about this case. Briggs: Our discussion was very high level, we spoke about the industry, friends in the industry, generic subjects.

"It was speculative whether the world tour would happen," Briggs said. Panish asked if mattered that there was no agreement beyond the 50 shows, since w/ agreement, it would be speculative in his opinion anyway. Briggs: I disagree with your logic, the lack of agreement supports my opinion that it is speculative that the world tour would happen. Briggs said MJ's history of drug use, long-term effects, and that he was taking drugs in a very dangerous way shortened his life expectancy. Panish asked what "great prognosis" is. Briggs said it means that someone is partaking in actions that's very dangerous. Briggs testify Dr. Earley said MJ's drug use was like playing Russian roulette.

Panish: Who put the bullets in the gun?
Briggs: I believe he said it wasn't an appropriate question.
Panish: The witness wants to argue with me and not answer the quesitons.
Judge: He's answering the questions.

Panish asked what was MJ's cancellation rate for shows. Briggs said he doesn't know for certain. Performance risk is whether people would come 2 the show, Briggs said. Panish asked if there was any question people would show for TII tour. Briggs said no, that there was testimony they could've done at least 100 more shows based on demand.

"This It It" tour:
Panish: Was there a plan to do O2 shows?
Briggs: Yes
P: Was there an audience?
B: Certainly
P: Was there finance?
B: Yes
Panish: So all the factors were met for the O2 shows?
Briggs: Yes

World tour:
Panish: Was there ever a plan, in writing, from Gongaware for world tour?
Briggs: If you're referencing the Sept. 2008 plan, yes

The proposal reflected 186 shows, Briggs said. "It appears, based on exhibits I reviewed, that proposal was sent to Mr. Anschutz." Briggs said he recalls Gongaware testifying they wanted to go on a world tour after O2 shows. Panish asked if Briggs reviewed MJ's lawyer, Dennis Hawk, testimony that MJ was planning to go to Asia on tour. He said yes.

Panish: Do you recall Mr. Hawk testified that MJ would get $400 million?
Briggs: Tried to, yes, that's what he hoped.

"He described that as his hope, yes," Briggs said. "He described as hope, not intention." Panish asked if Hawk testified he had no doubts MJ would complete the shows successfully. Briggs said the word successfully was in the question, and that Hawk answer "no, I have no doubts." Regarding Kenny Ortega, Panish asked if MJ told Ortega that they were going on a world tour, asked 'Have you ever been to India, you must.' And MJ continue to tell Ortega that after completing the O2 he wanted to take the show back out and around the world. "Whatever you're doing, you have to come to India' MJ told Ortega and then he said 'Have you ever been to Japan?' Ortega testified that after that, MJ was going to hang his hat up as touring artist and wanted to transition to do movies. Panish: After the world tour, sir, isn't that true? Briggs: I don't recall the sequence of events . Panish showed Ortega's deposition.
Panish: Your interpretation of Ortega's deposition is that he's not going on tour?
Briggs: He states here very clearly he had hopes.

"That someone hopes that something is going to happen it doesn't indicate it will happen," Briggs said. Panish asked if Briggs saw Paris' testimony that they were going on world tour. "I believe I considered her testimony, but her testimony was not a foundation or basis for my opinion," Briggs testified. "I understand Mr. Gongaware expressed same intention, and I relied on that," Briggs explained. Briggs said Gongaware had intentions based on what he knew then, not now.

The consultant stuck to his core opinion, that projections of Jackson’s earnings or the idea he’d complete a world tour were speculative. To combat that, Panish showed Briggs testimony from “This Is It” Director Kenny Ortega and Paris Jackson. They discussed the world tour. Both Ortega and Paris Jackson in their depositions discussed MJ's plans to go on a world tour after completing the London shows. Briggs was also shown deposition testimony by MJ’s attorney, Dennis Hawk, stating he tried to structure a world tour deal so that Jackson would earn $400 million if he completed the shows. Briggs agreed that was Hawk’s testimony, but said world tour was a ‘hope.’ (AP)

Panish then showed a slide with the 4 highest-grossing concert tours of all time. U2 topped the list. Panish then walked Briggs through the math if Jackson did as many shows as U2 or Madonna, had an average ticket price of $108 and sold merchandise equal to 7.5% of the tour’s earnings. The results showed that an MJ tour would have earned more than $1 billion. The ranges went as high as $1.6 billion with merchandise and ticket sales factored in, very similar to projections by the plaintiff’s expert. Briggs was dismissive of the exercise, saying it was a “math problem.” (AP)

Briggs testified the range for merchandise is 5-15%. The budget had approximately 7-8% of total revenue tour in merchandise. Panish's calculation: 186 shows x 55,000 people x $108 ticket = $1.1 billion x 7.5% merchandise = approximately $1.2 billion total.

Judge: Mr. Panish, why are you gesturing me?
Panish: Ms. Strong is making faces at me, I didn't want to say anything.
Jurors groaned...
Strong: There has been many misrepresentations against me and my colleagues.
Judge: I don't think making faces is something I should even have to acknowledge it. Just ignore it.

Panish concluded his cross examination


AEG redirect

Sabrina Strong did re-direct. Sony ATV catalogue contains Eagles music in and countless others, Briggs explained. "I performed significant amount of work regarding Sony ATV catalogue over the last 5-10 years," the expert said. Michael Jackson and Sony corporation own the catalogue 50/50 each.

Strong: Why were you so uncomfortable answering the questions regarding the Sony ATV catalogue?
Briggs: Because I am under confidentiality agreement with various companies I worked for related to valuation of Sony catalogue.

Briggs said he takes the confidentiality agreement very seriously and didn't want to violate them. During deposition, Briggs said he told Jacksons' attorneys that he would not disclose the value of the catalogue to any of the sides. Strong: You're not here as expert to talk about Sony catalogue? Briggs: That's correct, it had nothing to do with the conclusions of my work.

Briggs: We project future income from songs, assess that income to figure out how much the catalogue was worth. Briggs performed work for Sony ATV, various lenders and investors, like Fortress Capital, and the Estate of Michael Jackson. Briggs said he has a confidentiality agreement with the Estate of Michael Jackson and other companies he worked for. Briggs said he cannot disclose any information regarding the catalogue unless directed by the court.

Strong: At the instruction of the judge, you told us values of Sony catalogue, right?
Briggs: Yes.

Strong asked when MJ Estate attys hired him to evaluate the catalogue. Briggs said the work was done in 2010 for the value as of MJ's death. The evaluation was done based in the piece that belonged to Michael Jackson, which is 50%, Briggs said. Strong: What did you value the catalogue?

There was an objection, since he didn't answer that before. Kevin Boyle: IRS valuation for MJ's part of the catalogue was in excess of MJ's debt by range of $100-300 million. Testimony is that MJ's debt was $400 million plus range= $500-700 million for MJ's part alone, about $1.4 billion for entire catalogue.

Strong: And your valuation was less than the debt?
Briggs: That's correct.
Briggs said his valuation was roughly in line with what MJ owed. Briggs knows who the person doing the appraisal for the IRS is.
Strong: Do you believe you undervalued the catalogue at the date of debt?
Briggs: Absolutely not.

Briggs said his firm always used the same techniques to assess risk, and his valuation was used in loans and plans. Briggs said people were listening and transacting based on his numbers.

Boyle: The witness has no problem of breaching the confidentiality when Ms. Strong is asking the question. Judge: He's not breaching it, he's looking at me for instruction. If I say he needs to answer, he needs to answer.

Strong: Why there may be a difference in your valuation and the IRS? Briggs said there are many reasons, two significant. One of which has to do with subject of control, Briggs said. If one party can control a business their share is worth more. Briggs: If there's a party that doesn't have control, they have to sit there as victims. It's how you interpret control. Briggs said the other is limitation on selling/monetizing. If someone owns part of something, entered into rules, it's not worth fair share. Because you're restricted, you can't do things freely, Briggs said. That's the difference between his valuation and IRS' valuation. Strong: MJ had control issues? Briggs: Generally speaking, yes. Briggs: MJ had limitation to sell or borrow against it. His ability to sell it brings the value down. Strong said there were testimony that MJ was no longer able to borrow against that asset. Is that consistent? Briggs said a number of business managers made reference of MJ's financial situation. "I do not believe I undervalued that asset," Briggs testified.
Strong asked about conflict of interest in this case. Briggs said he participated in the process of checking whether a conflict existed. Strong: There's no conflict because that work was not related to this work? Briggs: My specific opinion in projecting income for MJ had he lived, what he would've earned. Briggs: Everything regarding the catalogue had nothing to do with MJ's ability to make money working. Briggs said Sony ATV catalogue has the Beatles songs in it, Willie Nelson, others. It's an investment, doesn't even have MJ's music in it.

As using debt as factor in his opinion, Briggs said he meant it in relation to endorsements. The perception that MJ had debts could infringe his ability to, for example, go to Citibank, ask money for the tour, Briggs said. Briggs: The unfortunate perception in the media, it had nothing to do whether he did it or not. Strong asked why Briggs mentioned the molestation trial if MJ had been acquitted. "Because we live in a world, unfortunately, that headlines created a perception. And that hurts endorsement deals," Briggs said.


Michael LaPerruque Testimony


AEG direct

After lunch, AEG called their next witness out of order, Michael LaPerruque. He is unavailable at other times.

Atty Marvin Putnam did the questioning. He asked if LaPerruque met with attorneys from defense and plaintiff prior to testimony. He said yes

Putnam: Are you rooting for either side?
LaPerruque: No, I'm not rooting for any side

LaPerruque: I'm a security specialist, provide security for high profile people, celebrities, estate. I worked for Michael and Janet Jackson. MJ hired LaPerruque 5-10 times in the Summer of 2001. He was hired full time in December 2001 and was under employment until 2004. First full time gig in private security was in December 2001. He was with the Sheriff's Department prior to that for 22 1/2 years. Putnam asked if LaPerruque was trained to identify people intoxicated. He said yes, he attended drug intoxication courses.
Earlier in the summer/01, while still at the Sheriff's Dept, LaPerruque said man with MJ security asked for help at the Universal Hilton. LaPerruque stayed at the Universal Hilton, there was a room for him. MJ and the children, nanny, personal security team were there as well. The nanny would call him if they needed anything for MJ or the children. MJ was shooting short film at the lot, so LaPerruque was asked to provide security some times.

He went with MJ to NY to provide security at 30th anniversary of Madison Square Garden. In December 2001, LaPerruque was asked to be full time and head the security of Michael Jackson. For the NY trip, LaPerruque used vacation.

Putnam: Is it fair to say you quit your job with the Sheriff's Department to work for Michael Jackson?
LaPerruque: I retired.

LaPerruque was in charge of Mr. Jackson's protection and the protection of his children. He consulted regarding Neverland security. LaPerruque: Anytime MJ stepped out of the property for extended period, going to LA or around the world, I was activated to accompany him. LaPerruque never lived at Neverland Ranch.

Putnam: Was there a period of time he was with a doctor on a daily basis?
LaPerruque: Yes

LaPerruque: He would have a physician present, also when we would go out and were staying somewhere he'd have me call a physician. LaPerruque: We would get to a hotel and he would ask me to get the hotel physician. LaPerruque: I would go down to the concierge and ask if they had doctors they work with and get recommendation. LaPerruque would call the doctor. He said MJ complained about back pains, but he didn't ask every single time what the complaint was. "It became commonplace to have a physician ready upon arrivals at hotels," LaPerruque said. LaPerruque testified he learned the client's needs and after been asked many times to find hotel doctor he understood it was part of his job. If doctor came along, it would be someone Mr. Jackson knew and they would have a hotel room. LaPerruque did not help find those doctors.

Putnam: From Dec. 2001 to 2004, did you believe Mr. Jackson was under the influence of drugs?
LaPerruque: Yes

LaPerruque said there were 3 times he was at a hotel and got a phone call in the middle of the night. "His speech would be very slurred, it would be a lot of mumbling, wouldn't understand him sometimes," LaPerruque described. The security head said he would be asked to go to MJ's room, he had a key. "I would go to his room to make sure he was ok," LaPerruque said. "We would be in the room and he seemed to have a hard time," he said.

Putnam: Did he speak in an incoherent manner?
LaPerruque: Yes

"It's just slurred speech, sort of mumbling," LaPerruque said. He would be sleeping when MJ called.

Putnam: How many times did you go to his room?
LaPerruque: Through the course of employment, probably 10 to 15 times.

Another 10 to 15 times, he wasn't asked to go to MJ's room, LaPerruque said. Total would be between 20 and 30 times.

LaPerruque: He wouldn't be very coherent, slurred speech, trying to fall asleep, incomprehensible. LaPerruque: He asked questions about the next day's schedule, asked questions over and over. "I knew he had unusual sleep patterns," LaPerruque said. "I think he was just lonely and wanted somebody to talk to."

Putnam asked what made LaPerruque think he was under the influence of drugs. LaPerruque: Because the objective symptoms he was displaying, slurred speech, nod. "I never performed any tests but the symptoms he was displaying were consistent with being under the influence," LaPerruque testified.

LaPerruque spoke with Dr Slavitch from San Francisco. He said he became worried about MJ due to numerous times he saw MJ under the influence. "I was worried about his health," LaPerruque testified. He also spoke with Grace Rwamba, MJ's children nanny at the time, about his concerns and Dr. Alimorad "Alex" Farshchian in Miami, Florida. He was one of the physicians that traveled with MJ, LaPerruque said, probably chosen by MJ. The relationship between Dr. Farshchian and MJ was already established when LaPerruque began working for the artist. LaPerruque spoke with Dr. Slavitch, Dr. Farshchian and Grace Rwamba about his concerns with MJ.

Putnam: What were you concerned?
LaPerruque: Just his general health, it seemed the frequency of the intoxication to be more occurring

LaPerruque said his job was not only to protect MJ from fans or outside causes, but "I took it upon myself to take care of Mr. Jackson." LaPerruque: I knew they (the doctors) would be treating Mr. Jackson and wanted them to have a clear picture going in. Putnam asked if LaPerruque spoke with MJ's family members or business associates. "I didn't believe it was my place to do that," he said.

LaPerruque: Few times in the middle of the day I'd go into his room and he'd be displaying signs of being under the influence. LaPerruque: Any kind of emails and phone calls came to me. I'd relay the message to him, would go to his room to slip a note under the door. LaPerruque: Mr. Jackson had propensity of losing his cell phone. I think I counted he lost 27 cell phones (jury laughs). People were given LaPerruque's cell number and would leave him messages for Michael. LaPerruque'd knock on MJ's door, escort him to the room meeting would take place. He'd wait outside the door and escort MJ back to the room. LaPerruque: In rare occasions, there were times he seemed to be under the influence of drugs in meetings, had to be taken back to his room. "He had slurred speech, incoherent, looked like he was going unconscious," LaPerruque said. LaPerruque: I'd take him back to his room and make sure he was okay. I would seat there and make sure that he was breathing.

Putnam: Why did you do that, sir?
LaPerruque: It was part of my job.

LaPerruque said speaking with MJ about it would be crossing the line. Even though he developed close relationship, needed to have a distance. LaPerruque: There are some professional lines you don't cross and I think it was not my place.

Michael La Perruque said he occasionally went into the singer's hotel room to make sure he was breathing and would often find doctors to treat the pop superstar when he traveled. La Perruque retired from his job as a sheriff's deputy in 2001 to work as the head of Jackson's security detail and frequently traveled with him until 2004. (AP)

Putnam: Did you like Mr. Jackson?
LaPerruque: Very much!

Putnam: Was there a time you didn't like Mr. Jackson? LaPerruque said they had some issues related to workload and work schedule, but for the most part it was a pleasure to work with Mr. Jackson

LaPerruque: I believe he knew that I knew what was going. To bring up that conversation would put him on defensive, have barriers between us. "I wanted to be close to him, to protect him, to watch him," LaPerruque testified. LaPerruque: He knew I was there, he knew I saw him. There were times he fought very, very hard not to be dependent of those medications. "He fought very hard to not be dependent on prescription medication," LaPerruque testified.

La Perruque said he spoke to two of Jackson's doctors about his concerns about the singer's prescription drug use, but that he never spoke directly about it to the singer because he didn't want him to become defensive. "It was my concern that he may overdose," he said. He said he knew Jackson had severe back pain and difficulty sleeping. Despite seeing the entertainer impaired, La Perruque said he never saw Jackson take any drugs or saw any signs of medications lying around. Jackson did try to get help, he said. "He fought very hard to be sober," La Perruque said. "He fought very hard not to be dependent on these prescription medications." Jackson however kept members of his family away because he knew they were trying to stage an intervention, he said. He told jurors that Jackson's younger brother Randy arrived at Neverland Ranch one day in a helicopter to speak with his brother about his medication usage. La Perruque said he turned him away. He said Jackson called him in the middle of the night between 20 and 30 times in the early 2000s and was often mumbling and incoherent. Half those times La Perruque said he went to the singer's room to check on him, and they would start talking."I think he was just lonely," La Perruque said. "He wanted somebody to talk to." (AP)

One day, LaPerruque said MJ told him he was clean. 'I just want you to know I'm going to stay this way,' LaPerruque said MJ told him. LaPerruque understood that MJ was working hard to battle the prescription medication dependency. "He would have the doctors treating him to get him off the harder narcotics," LaPerruque said. Putnam asked how he knew and he said he'd have discussions with the doctors and they would tell him.

Putnam: Where you concern it could cause overdose?
LaPerruque: Yes.

LaPerruque said that when he was with the sheriff's department he saw a number of people overdose and taken to emergency room. "It was my concern he would overdose," LaPerruque testified. LaPerruque never saw MJ do drugs or take prescription medication. He did see open wine bottles in his room. The security head said he never saw, anywhere, prescription drugs in MJ's hotel room or at Neverland.

LaPerruque went a couple of times with MJ and his children to Disney World in Florida. There was a medical emergency once in 2001 or 2002. They were staying at a Disney hotel. LaPerruque doesn't think a doctor traveled along. He stayed in a different room from MJ and kids. LaPerruque: I was in my room, received phone call from hotel security that someone had called 911 from MJ's hotel room, like young children. LaPerruque said they would check in under assumed name. Room service would come to him and he would take it to MJ's room. LaPerruque would set up times to have MJ's room cleaned. LaPerruque: I grabbed Mr. Jackson's keys and found Prince and Paris crying. They were crying saying they couldn't wake up daddy. LaPerruque: I was able to go into the room, had called security partner to meet at the room as well to take the two children to nanny's room. LaPerruque: I found Mr. Jackson in the hallway in the suite proned, unconscious. LaPerruque: I had to check for pulse, turned him over, shook him, ultimately was breathing. I was able to wake him up, took him to his room.

Putnam: Did you have to do mouth-to-mouth?
LaPerruque: I did
P: Did you see any drugs?
LP: No
P: Alcohol?
LP: Not that I recall

"He became conscious, I wouldn't say alert, but conscious," LaPerruque said. Putnam asked if he was groggy. He said yes. LaPerruque tried to cancel paramedics, but they were arriving. He told them he found MJ and paramedics said they had to check him anyway. LaPerruque: He was cleared, they told me he had to see a physician. LaPerruque asked the paramedics to put on their report the name he checked himself under, not MJ name. LaPerruque: Just to make sure that was no further embarrassment on Mr. Jackson's part. LaPerruque said they left shortly thereafter. "I was just told we were gonna leave." LaPerruque never discussed this incident with MJ.

Putnam: Did he ever thank you for coming over and helping him?
LaPerruque: No
P: Did anyone thank you?
LP: No
Putnam: Why didn't you talk to Mr. Jackson about it?
LaPerruque: Because I didn't think it was my place.

La Perruque said the singer's children called 911 during a trip to Florida in 2001 or 2002 after their father collapsed in a hallway in a hotel suite at Walt Disney World. He said he found Jackson unconscious, revived him before paramedics arrived and never saw any signs of drugs or alcohol that the singer may have taken. Paramedics checked out the singer and determined he didn't need further medical attention, La Perruque said. (AP)

LaPerruque would take MJ to doctors appointments, normally in Beverly Hills. He'd call building security alerting they were on the way.

Putnam: Did you speak with anyone about that incident before?
LaPerruque: No
P: Did you ever consider letting the tabloids know?
LP: No
Putnam: Did you consider you could've made a lot of money?
LaPerruque: No
P: Why?
LP: Because I had a commitment to Michael Jackson.

The first time LaPerruque told anyone about this incident was in his deposition. Today in court was the second time.

Putnam: Did you ever understand MJ had surgical procedure implant to help him get off of drugs? LaPerruque did not see any scarring regarding an implant. He was told by a physician, and judge didn't let him continue since it's hearsay.

LaPerruque remembers in 2001 Jackson family attempting an intervention. MJ asked him to come up to the ranch right away. LaPerruque: He told me that his family would be coming over to the ranch to speak with him and asked me to interface with his relatives. "It was requested by Mr. Jackson," LaPerruque said.

Putnam: He wanted to make sure his family members didn't come thru?
LaPerruque: Yes

LaPerruque: I was at the front gate, saw private helicopter flying very low over Neverland. Randy Jackson was in the helicopter. "He demanded to see Michael," LaPerruque recalled. "I told him that MJ said he didn't want to see any of his family members at the time."

LaPerruque said Michael told him he had trouble sleeping. LaPerruque: He was trying to find something that would help him sleep. LaPerruque: There was one occasion I took him the doctor and I assumed he was there to see if he could find anything to help him sleep.

Putnam: Did you have any understanding MJ was taking Propofol?
LaPerruque: No
LaPerruque never discussed using Propofol with MJ.
Putnam: Did you ever have an impression Mr. Jackson was trying to hide drugs from you?
LaPerruque: No.
"I never saw him swallow a pill, never saw him take injections," LaPerruque testified.

LaPerruque said there were two reasons he stopped working for MJ. First, he had two young children and at the service of MJ you work at his pleasure, you never had set schedule. LaPerruque: I was never home, I missed a lot my children, birthdays, holidays. He said he saw MJ's litigation with the Arvizo family (molestation accusation), had been in court before and knew how demanding it was. LaPerruque: He and I had discussed me taking some time off. LaPerruque said the other reason was the revenue stream, which was harder and harder, and financial matters were becoming an issue. LaPerruque took other jobs. He became in charge for the security of LA Times printing plants and security of corporate office. He also worked on internal investigations, security of journalists working on hostile environment in Iraq.

In 2007, LaPerruque went back to work for Michael Jackson. He was still the head of security of the LA Times. Grace Rwamba called LaPerruque and said she wanted to meet him, had a message from Michael Jackson. LaPerruque: MJ always appreciated my loyalty, best security he ever had, asked me to return to work for him. "He kind of grew on me," LaPerruque explained. "I did care for the man." LaPerruque: At that time, my children had grown older, started their own things, always enjoyed the challenge working for MJ. After meeting with him and speaking with his manager at the time, LaPerruque left the LA Times and went to work for Michael Jackson. They met face to face, since the last time they spoke was in the Arvizo trial. He wanted to hear what MJ wanted him back. LaPerruque said Michael appeared bright, clear, energetic, full of energy. He wanted to do a lot of things. Based on the meeting, that's why he went back to work with him in 2007. His job was the same as before. He spoke with Raymone Bain. LaPerruque had a written agreement to work as head of security for Michael Jackson. He worked for him for only a few months in 07.

During this time, LaPerruque took MJ to NYC to meet with AEG Live execs. He escorted MJ into the room, probably 10 people or more present. "Michael seemed bright and alert at this meeting. He seemed excited," LaPerruque said. The meeting lasted a couple of hours, LaPerruque said. He escorted MJ to Penn Station, he wanted to pick up some doughnuts for the kids. LaPerruque said he seemed happy, did not ask about how the meeting went.

The security head never told AEG about any of the concerns he had with Michael Jackson. LaPerruque said he did not have any concern with MJ being under the influence of prescription drug in 2007.

LaPerruque said he stopped working for MJ due to financial difficulties. "I wasn't getting paid," LaPerruque explained. "The production company wasn't paying me for my services," LaPerruque testified. He stopped in the beginning of 2008. Work began in August of 2007, got paid in September and didn't get paid anymore until 2008. LaPerruque spoke with MJ. "He said he was very embarrassed not being able to pay me, he said he was going to make it right, apologized." This was in November 2007. He still didn't get paid. MJ then moved to Las Vegas. He spoke with Raymone Bain, who said MJ had moved. He never heard from anyone about working again. LaPerruque said he tried calling MJ several times about getting paid but never heard back. LaPerruque retained an attorney to speak with MJ's reps to enforce agreement they had. They settled. "I was mad, but not mad at him," LaPerruque said. "Because of what I heard why we stopped working together." (financial reasons). LaPerruque said he never thought of selling his story to the tabloids.

LaPerruque said he saw MJ about 2 weeks prior to his death. He was working for Janet, she threw a party for their parents at a restaurant. LaPerruque: MJ saw me and said Mike! Came running to me, gave me a big hug. He asked if they could talk, I took him to a private room. LaPerruque said MJ seemed happy to be there at the party. He was not incoherent or had slurred speech. LaPerruque: I did ask 'Mike, you're looking skinnier than I've ever seen you. You need to get meet in your bones.' He laughed. LaPerruque said MJ told him he was rehearsing a lot, thus the weight. He said MJ seemed excited about going to London.

Putnam: Were you surprised he passed?
LaPerruque: Yes "It just caught me off guard," LaPerruque explained.

Putnam asked if there was anything LaPerruque thought he could've seen at the meeting two weeks prior but didn't. He answered no.

La Perruque stopped working for Jackson in 2004, but returned to oversee his security in late 2007. He said he didn't see any signs that Jackson was impaired during the few months he worked for him again. He testified he last saw Jackson two weeks before the singer's death and he looked fine, but he noticed that his former boss was skinnier than usual. (AP)

(Outside the presence of the jury, LaPerruque approached Ms. Jackson, hugged her and cried. They had a conversation, she handed him a tissue.)


Jackson cross

Jacksons' attorney, Deborah Chang, did the cross examination of LaPerruque following the afternoon break.

LaPerruque worked for the LA Sheriff Department for 22 years. He said MJ being a high profile, would not be able to go out in public. "Wherever we would go, there would be fans there," LaPerruque testified. He said fans wanted to meet MJ, take pictures. LaPerruque: There was always a concern of kidnapping him or his children to hold for ransom. LaPerruque explained he not only try to protect the client from outside sources, but from embarrassing himself. LaPerruque said MJ had thousands of fans everywhere in the world. Chang showed a picture of LaPerruque helping MJ with a left foot casted.

Total time LaPerruque worked for MJ was 3 years. The only time he saw MJ under influence of drugs in 2001-2004.

About the Documentary "Living with Michael Jackson" by Martin Bashir. LaPerruque was present, thought MJ trusted Bashir
Chang: Was he devastated for what he believed to be violation of that trust?
LaPerruque: Very devastated!

LaPerruque said MJ was in pain after the release of the documentary. Chang wanted to play a snippet of the documentary, but changed her mind. Chang: You know what, because he (AEG attorney) was threatening to show other parts of it, I'll withdraw my request.

Chang: Did you believe the Arvizo charges to be false?
LaPerruque: Correct.

"I came out in full support of him," LaPerruque recalled. LaPerruque asked how MJ reacted in regards to the accusations, when all he wanted to do was to take care of children.

LaPerruque: Yes, it devastated him.
Chang: Was he emotionally and physically wrecked in pain?
LP: Yes
C: Have you seen him cry?
LP: Yes

LaPerruque said he knew MJ had vitiligo and needed treatment. He said MJ complained of back pain.

Chang asked if most of the times LaPerruque heard MJ slur his voice on the phone was during the night. He said yes.
Chang: Could he have taken a sedative such as sleeping pill, or Xanax pill?
LaPerruque: It's a possibility
Chang: Drink wine or vodka?
LaPerruque: It's a possibility
C: Or combination of drinking and sedatives?
LP: Yes

LaPerruque never saw any prescription drug in MJ's room, never saw him hooked up to IV lines. He only saw MJ drink wine once in a plane. LaPerruque said he always had full access to MJ's room, had keys to his hotel room. The security head said he would not be able to say MJ was addicted to Demerol or painkillers. He knows MJ wanted to be clear and was motivated in the worse way.

Chang: And you believed him?
LaPerruque: I did

LaPerruque said the majority of time he traveled with MJ he wasn't under the influence. Chang asked if LaPerruque saw MJ doing anything that could put the kids at risk, if he would've called Child Services. He said absolutely.

Chang: Were you very proud of working for MJ?
LaPerruque: I was

LaPerruque received phone calls from President Clinton, Elizabeth Taylor, Gregory Peck, Marlon Brando, world leaders looking for MJ. Chang showed video of Liz Taylor presenting Michael Jackson. LaPerruque said MJ's fans were deafening, nothing like he had ever seen before.

Chang: How would you describe MJ that night?
LaPerruque: He was fantastic
Shows were on Sept 7 and Sept 10, 2001, day before 9/11. "I never experienced anything like this," LaPerruque testified.

Chang showed video of music "What More Can I Give" with several high profile artists singing it, like Celine Dion, Beyonce, Gloria Estefan
Chang: Did MJ write that song in benefit of 9/11 victims?
LaPerruque: Yes

MJ received the 2002 American Music Award Artist of the Century. Chang showed the video of the announcement. LaPerruque said MJ was very down to earth, never bragged about all the awards he received.

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 62 – August 5 2013 – Summary

Katherine and Trent Jackson are in court.


Michael LaPerruque Testimony

Jackson Cross

Deborah Chang, did the cross examination.

LaPerruque said 2001-2004 were very difficult years for Michael Jackson. They were also very busy years. MJ was recording "You Rock My World" single and shooting a short film at the Universal Studios when LaPerruque began working for the artist. Change showed clip of "You Rock My World" with Marlon Brando and Chris Tucker and MJ. The single became part of "Invincible" album. LaPerruque was present when the song was recorded. In 2002, LaPerruque said Blanket was born. MJ was very excited about being dad again. LaPerruque went to New York with MJ to be at the Apolo Theater with President Bill Clinton to encourage people to register to vote.Chang showed clip of President Clinton introducing MJ to the crowd. She also showed the 2003 American Bandstand 50th anniversary in Pasadena and MJ's cameo in "Man In Black 2" in 2002. (ABC7)

Chang started out her cross-examination by showing several clips of Jackson’s work during the 2001-2002 time period. These years were the first time that La Perruque worked for Jackson. Chang showed him clip of “You Rock My World” music video. La Perruque was present during the shooting of some of the video, which starred Jackson, Chris Tucker and Marlon Brando. Chang then showed a clip of Jackson performing at a 2002 Democratic National Committee fundraiser. He performed “Dangerous.” Jackson was introduced by Bill Clinton. AEG Live defense attorney Marvin Putnam objected to the clip, specifically the Clinton speech. Chang had stopped the clip just as Jackson’s performance started. The judge allowed the clip to be played and didn't strike Clinton's intro. Chang then played another performance clip on the 50th Anniversary special for American Bandstand. Dick Clark introduced Jackson. She concluded the clips by showing Jackson’s cameo in “Men In Black: II” to show that the entertainer was busy in 2002. (AP)

Chang: Did MJ have a good sense of humor, including about himself? LaPerruque: Yes (ABC7)

Chang asked about MJ passing out in Florida and his children called 911. LaPerruque said he doesn't know what caused him to go unconscious. LaPerruque said paramedics are more prepared than him, as former sheriff's deputy, to assess a patient. LaPerruque never saw the paramedics report. They did no take the MJ to the hospital. Chang asked if there was a mention of low blood sugar in the report. Defendant's attorney objected based on hearsay and judge sustained it. LaPerruque said it was hot and humid that day in Orlando and he does not know when was the last time MJ ate or drank anything. (ABC7)

Chang then asked about the Florida incident in which Jackson’s children found their father unconscious in a hotel suite hallway. Chang asked La Perruque about his experience with paramedics making medical evaluations of people, based on his experience as a deputy. La Perruque said he didn’t know what caused Jackson’s condition, and that paramedics did not transport him or indicate it was an overdose. He said he never saw the paramedics’ report and wasn’t in the room where they checked out Jackson. Chang asked La Perruque if the paramedics mentioned Jackson had low blood pressure, but AEG objected and it was sustained. La Perruque reiterated that he never saw prescription bottles or alcohol in Jackson’s suite that day. (AP)

The head security never saw drugs in MJ's room. "I never saw the doctors actually treating Mr. Jackson," LaPerruque said. He said he only took MJ to doctor's office and would wait outside.(ABC7)

Chang asked about the doctors La Perruque knew traveled and treated Jackson. He told jury he never witnessed their treatments on Jackson. La Perruque was asked whether any of the doctors seemed awestruck with Jackson. He said yes, and cited Dr. Alimorad Farschcian. Farschcian is a Miami doctor who put an implant in Jackson to block the effects of Demerol and other opiates.(AP)

Chang: Did you ever raise concerns to Dr. Farshchian you thought he overprescribed medication? LaPerruque: Yes
"There seemed to have been a social relationship between Dr. Farshchian and Michael Jackson," LaPerruque said. (ABC7)

Chang: From 2001-2004 went through a lot of pain, stress and anxiety? Objection, vague. Sustained. (ABC7)

LaPerruque was never aware of the kind of treatment necessary to treat MJ's vitiligo and burned scalp. (ABC7)

In 2007 - 2008 LaPerruque worked back with MJ. He had never heard about Dr. Murray.(ABC7) Chang asked whether La Perruque ever heard of Conrad Murray when he went back to work with Jackson in 2007 and early ’08. He said no. (AP)

Chang: Would it be fair to say that throughout the years you worked for MJ you never saw him overdose? LaPerruque: Yes (ABC7)

LaPerruque raised his concerns with Dr. Farshchian, Dr. Slavitch in San Francisco and Grace Rwamba. At one point, LaPerruque and Rwamba had a system to try to stop doctors to overprescribe drugs to MJ. (ABC7) La Perruque said he raised concerns with Farschcian that the doctor was over prescribing medications to Jackson. He said that Farschcian often accompanied Jackson on what seemed to be more social trips, rather than for medical reasons. (AP)

Chang: You tried to protect Mr. Jackson, right? LaPerruque: Yes
Chang: Have you ever see him with terrible case of chills? LaPerruque: No
Chang: Have you ever seen an alarming weight loss? LaPerruque: No
Change: Have you ever heard people complain they could see his heart beating through his chest? LaPerruque: No
Chang: Have you ever seen MJ lost, paranoid? LaPerruque: No
Chang: Did you ever hear MJ saying that God was talking to him? LaPerruque: No

Chang asked if LaPerruque saw those symptoms, what would he have done."I'd have been very concerned and if I thought it was life-threatening I'd have taken him to the hospital," LaPerruque said. (ABC7)

The attorney asked whether La Perruque tried to protect Jackson. “Yes,” he responded. “I did my best.” La Perruque, in response to Chang’s questions, said he never saw MJ with “a terrible case of the chills” or have an “alarming weight loss.” The bodyguard also said he never heard Jackson say he was talking to God or seem lost and annoyed, symptoms he displayed in 2009. La Perruque said if he saw any of those symptoms and thought they were life-threatening, he would have taken Jackson to the hospital. (AP)

Randy Jackson was by himself when he arrived at Neverland by helicopter. He did have a pilot, though, LaPerruque clarified. Chang: Did you ever hear Randy Jackson speak about an intervention? LaPerruque: No. Chang: Did you ever hear the word intervention that day? LaPerruque: No. Chang: Did you ever know there was an intervention? LaPerruque: No. (ABC7)

Chang asked about the incident in which Randy Jackson came to Neverland Ranch via helicopter and was turned away. La Perruque said neither Michael nor Randy Jackson used the term intervention to describe the visit. Randy didn’t bring a doctor, he said. (AP)

After 2004, LaPerruque didn't see MJ on a day-to-day basis except for 2005 during the criminal trial. He never saw MJ in 2006 and early 2007. MJ was acquitted of all child molestation charges and left the country after the verdict. Rwamba contacted LaPerruque to go back to work for MJ. He said he wouldn't have jeopardize his job at the time if he thought MJ was on drugs. LaPerruque never observed any problems in 2007 with MJ being under the influence of prescription drugs. (ABC7) The bodyguard said when he returned to work for Jackson in 2007-early ’08, the singer seemed to have a clear path of what he wanted to do. La Perruque reiterated that he didn’t see any signs Jackson was struggling with prescription medications in ’07 or early ’08. (AP)

Chang: Do you have any idea who was in charge of MJ's finances in 2007? LaPerruque: Raymone Bain (ABC7)

The head security said he learned Bain became MJ's manager in 2006. She was the CEO/president of MJJ Productions. She signed his contract. Chang asked if LaPerruque noticed there was a transition with Bain's position at the time he wasn't paid. He said he didn't know. LaPerruque said he wasn't aware of MJ's worth and/or debt at that point. He received call from Bain said MJ would not be needing security. (ABC7)

LaPerruque said Janet Jackson hired him and other personnel to work at the May 14, 2009 event, which was her parents' anniversary. The event took place at Chakra Indian restaurant in Beverly Hills. That was the last time LaPerruque saw MJ, a month prior to his death. Chang showed picture of MJ on June 2009. Chang: He did not look anything like this, correct? LaPerruque: Correct. Chang: If he had you'd have been alarmed? LaPerruque: Yes (ABC7) Chang also clarified when La Perruque last saw Jackson. He said last week it was two weeks before the singer’s death. In fact, it was in May, during an anniversary party that Janet Jackson threw for her parents at restaurant in Beverly Hills. Chang showed La Perruque the June 19th photo of Michael Jackson in which he looks extremely thin. She asked if he looked like that in May. I couldn’t see La Perruque, but he seemed taken aback by the photo. He said that’s not how Jackson looked in May 2009. The bodyguard added that if he had seen Jackson as he appeared in the photo, he would have been alarmed. (AP)

Chang: Was he a kind and gentle person? LaPerruque: Yes

The fact that MJ was one of the most famous artists in the world didn't change his way of being humble, LaPerruque said. Chang asked if LaPerruque knew MJ gave thousands of dollars to United Way. He said yes. LaPerruque told the jury there was a time where MJ asked him to go to Toys R Us to buy as many presents he could. He said MJ wanted to give the toys to the children at the Women Shelter in Hollywood, Florida. He said MJ spent thousands of dollars there, and MJ decided to declined his appearance because he didn't want it to become a media circus. "We went and donated the toys," LaPerruque said. LaPerruque said MJ learned with his mother to give money to the poor. (ABC7) La Perruque was asked about Jackson’s charity and he cited instances when the singer bought toys for a Florida women’s shelter. Instead of delivering the toys and causing a scene, La Perruque said Jackson had his bodyguards deliver them. The singer would also stop his car and give money to people on the streets, a practice he learned from his mother, La Perruque said. (AP)

Chang: Based on your observations and the things he told you, did he love his mother? LaPerruque: Yes C: Did she love him? LP: Yes
LaPerruque described MJ's relationship with his children as excellent. "It was a very loving relationship," he said. LaPerruque: They wanted to be with their father, I think MJ was the happiest when we was with his children. He said MJ wanted them to really want something and appreciate what they had. MJ would restrict his children to one present and one present only when they went to a toy store, LaPerruque testified. MJ's intention was for the kids to really want something and appreciate what they had, LaPerruque explained. LaPerruque: Not only that, he pushed them toward educational type of toys that they could've learned from. "He wanted to be the best father ever," LaPerruque testified. One of the things LaPerruque remembers the most about Michael Jackson is the fact that MJ was always kind and gentle with his children. (ABC7)

The bodyguard described the close and loving relationship Jackson had with his mother and his three children. La Perruque: “I think Michael was at his happiest when he was with his children.”He added that Jackson didn't spoil his children. Jackson would only allow his children to buy one toy apiece when they went shopping, La Perruque said. Chang: “Did he want to be remembered as the greatest entertainer in the world or the greatest father?” A: “I would say the greatest father.” (AP)

The 2001-2004 period was the time MJ was trying to quit addiction to drug use, wanted his family away from Neverland, LaPerruque said. For the parents' 60th anniversary party, the restaurant was closed for Janet Jackson and the party members. (ABC7)

LaPerruque: In my course of employment with Mr. Jackson we'd have a room for him for down time also called green room. LaPerruque made sure the room was set for MJ upon arrival. They first saw each other in the main room but talked in the private room.(ABC7)

Chang: A family member come to the ranch on one occasion, right? LaPerruque: Yes.
Chang: Was MJ always able to perform and complete his functions? LaPerruque: Yes.
Chang: If there was ever a time he could not get up on stage to perform, that would've been a concern for you? LaPerruque: Yes


AEG redirect

Chang’s questioning concluded, and Putnam only asked a few questions. He asked if Jackson’s late night calls came during the same time period as the clips of him performing at the Democratic fundraiser, American Bandstand event. La Perruque said they were. The calls occurred over was a broad time period, from 2001 to 2004. (AP)

LaPerruque is then excused.


Eric Briggs Testimony

AEG redirect

AEG Live defense attorney Sabrina Strong questioned Briggs first today, questioning him about areas where his opinion had been attacked. Briggs maintained that any projection of Jackson’s future earnings would be speculative and he didn't try to estimate a figure. Briggs said calculations that Panish walked him through last week weren't credible. He called them the results of a “math problem.” The figures Panish had Briggs tally were very similar to what $1 billion+ figure that plaintiff’s expert Arthur Erk generated. Briggs: “Those are tours that never took place.Those are imaginary tours that are the result of a math problem.” (AP)

Sabrina Strong did the questioning. She asked if Briggs recorded the time worked in this case as it's customary in the industry. "During the course of my 15 year career, this is the normal course we bill clients," Briggs responded. Strong asked if the amount he billed had anything to do with his opinions. Briggs said no. (ABC7)

Briggs: I set out to evaluate the reasonable projections based on Mr. Erk's numbers. He said he attended Erk's testimony, gave depositions, did extensive research to come to his conclusions and opinion. Briggs said the first time he saw Erk's projections was during Erk's deposition in March. He was deposed a couple of days later. Briggs said after his own deposition, he did additional research. He looked into the history of MJ's tour in the US and overseas. He also analyzed the history of any artists selling out all the shows. Briggs said the projection was done based on a solo artist, thus he didn't analyze MJ as part of Jacksons 5 group. Briggs said he analyzed Erk's projection and upon concluding it was speculative, it wasn't for him to speculate forecast in lots of pages. (ABC7)

Strong asked about Brian Panish inquiring Briggs' background in audits. "This case does not involve audit dispute," Briggs responded. (ABC7)

Briggs said Erk submitted specific projection of an entertainment project that MJ would've potentially be part of. "What the economics of the project is is what I do every day, evaluating risks and projecting income," Briggs explained. Strong showed slide created by Panish. The blue bars is what has been publicly known to have occurred, Briggs said. Strong asked if the green bars are "imaginary tours" result of math problem. "Those are tours that never took place," Briggs said. Briggs explained Panish's math: MJ's average public multiplied by number of shows by other artists multiplied by Erk's $108 tix price. Briggs said Panish used 3 different statistics and multiply them all. "It's just a math problem," he said.Strong: Looking at this, did Mr. Panish compare apples to apples? Briggs: I don't think so. Briggs said 55k people multiplied by 167 shows in AC/DC tour results in over 9 million tickets, doubled what was ever associated with MJ. Briggs said HIStory tour sold 4.5 million tickets for 82 shows, Bad also sold roughly 4.5 million tickets for 123 shows. Briggs: Historically, his shows sold 4.5 million tickets, appreciating he sold more albums at that point and was more active. Strong: Was that the peak of his career? Briggs: I think so. Briggs said Erk's projection is "significantly in excess of MJ's prior tours & significantly in excess of imaginary tours Panish calculated". Strong: Could MJ have audience of 13 million on his show? Briggs: I don't know how you can be reasonably certain that would've happened. (ABC7)

He told the jury you can't assume that just because a promoter added concerts, it would definitely sell out. Briggs: “Simply adding shows doesn’t mean the audience will keep showing up to fill the arena.” The global attendance for two of Jackson’s previous tours, “Bad” and “Dangerous” was roughly 4.5 million concertgoers, Briggs said. Erk’s projections more than doubled that figure, which Briggs said wasn't supported by Jackson’s touring history. (AP)

Briggs said Gongaware email communication indicate there was a proposal to go on a worldwide tour on Sept. 26, 2008. Briggs said there were number of words in the email that indicates to him it was a preliminary plan. "This is clearly in the early stages of a proposal," Briggs said. In Sept. 2008, the agreement between MJ and AEG had not been signed yet. Regarding email saying "his gross would approached half a billion dollar," Briggs said he interprets it to be total ticket sales/merchandise. Erk's projection was $1.56 billion, he compared. Email says "Net to Mikey $132 million," which Briggs explained indicates the amount AEG was expecting to have MJ net. Briggs said Erk projected roughly $900 million net for MJ. Briggs: There was no formal plan (for world tour), this is early proposal and Mr. Erk's projection was entirely speculative. Regarding shows in Japan and India, Gongaware was planning 4 shows in India. Briggs said Erk projected 60 shows in India. Gongaware planned 8 shows in Japan plus 1 private for a total of 9 shows, versus Mr. Erk's projection of 50 shows in Japan, Briggs said. (ABC7)

Briggs said he saw some headlines regarding MJ donating proceeds from a tour to charity. He said he doesn't know if that ever happened. Briggs said he relied on Gongaware's testimony that MJ's tours lost money or broke even, since the actual amount is normally confidential.Strong: If he didn't make money from those tours, would he donate money? Briggs: If he didn't make any money there would be no profit for him to donate. (ABC7)

Briggs reviewed Dr. Shimelman's deposition in this case. The doctor was asked to give his best estimate of MJ's life expectancy in June 2009.Briggs: He clearly stated that Michael Jackson's life expectancy was 1 week as of June 2009. Strong: What other issues did Dr. Shimelman rely upon other than MJ's use of Propofol? Briggs: He spoke specifically to the synergy of the drugs MJ was taking and the impact of them on the artist. Briggs said Dr. Earley and Dr. Levounis also relied upon knowledge of history of his drugs use/manner which he took them for their opinion. Strong: Did they rely solely on Propofol use? Briggs: There were testimony of the synergy of the drugs, the interaction of the drugs MJ used (AB7)

"I don't see how an interest for a world tour makes it reasonably certain it will happen," Briggs said.He said there was no agreement beyond 50 shows at the time of MJ's death.Also, there's a need to consider MJ's history of drugs use and canceling shows, and the broad risk in the business. Briggs said there was significant demand that exceeded expectations for the London show. "It means in London there were many people interested in seeing MJ do what he did best: perform," he explained. But Briggs testified there was a difference between demand for seeing MJ and a company sponsoring the artist.He said AEG was not able to secure any endorsement even after the high demand for tickets. Briggs: It indicates there was a demand, it does not alleviate the health risk, it does not alleviate the cancellation risk. (ABC7)

Tom Barrack testified he did not know about Mr. Jackson's drug use, Briggs said. Briggs said he was asked to analyze what we have today and the key factors we know now that we didn't know back then. "Erk specifically stated he did not take Michael Jackson's drug use into consideration to form his opinion," Briggs testified. "There's no reasonable basis for those projections based on the facts we know," Briggs concluded. (ABC7)

( Outside the presence of the jury, Putnam told Judge Yvette Palazuelos that Panish threatened Briggs during the break. Putnam said Panish told Briggs "you're lucky we're in court." "I can't have my witness threatened, you honor," Putnam said. Panish said the events were not quite like that. He told the judge Briggs ran him over, said "this witness ran me over".Judge laughed and said "I'd be surprised if anyone can run you over, Mr. Panish." Panish said he didn't touch or hit him. Judge: Mr. Panish, don't talk to any witness unless you're talking about this case. Panish: I didn't threat him, he's not afraid, he'd know if I threatened him. (ABC7) )


Jackson recross


In re-cross, Panish asked if Briggs was put aside to accommodate another witness who had scheduling problems. He said yes. (ABC7)
When Panish took over, he asked Briggs if it was fair to say his fees for the case were over $700k. Briggs said that was fair to say. Panish then said that for $700k, his opinion was that Jackson wouldn't have earned any money for his children. Briggs said any projection was speculative and he wasn’t there to speculate.(AP)

Panish: Is it fair to say your bills is $700 thousand now? Briggs: That's fair to say. Panish: And for 700k your opinion is that MJ would not have earned one dime from working to give to his children? Briggs: Any projection of earning is speculative Panish: In your opinion, it's speculative MJ'd earn any money working, correct? Briggs: Yes. Panish: You don't determine what's relevant in this courtroom, right? "Concerning my opinion, I determine what is relevant," Briggs said. (ABC7)

Panish asked about Briggs' interaction w/ MJ Estate's lawyer. "I told you there was not a written waiver with the Estate," Briggs explained. The Estate has different lawyers, they are not represented by Panish's firm, Briggs said. He said his understanding is that his partner called the Estate lawyer, Jeryll Cohen, notifying he would testify in this case. Panish: So that statement under oath was untruthful, sir? Briggs: That's not correct, that was my best understanding at the time. Panish said Briggs testified he asked the Estate for permission to be hired by AEG and testify in this case. "I now understand the substance of the call was not an authorization but a call of notification," Briggs explained."There was a call to notify the Estate not to receive authorization from the Estate," Briggs said. Panish: Is your testimony you called Ms. Cohen prior to signing the engagement letter with AEG's attorneys? Briggs: That's not correct. "I never called Ms. Cohen to get authorization to testify," Briggs said. "No one called for authorization, they called for notification." Briggs said his partner, Roy Salter, called Hoffman's company to notify Briggs was going to testify in this case. Panish: And you are as sure of that as everything you testify to in this case, correct? Briggs: Yes. Briggs said the general counsel at FTI took care of the issue. (ABC7)

Panish: Are you concerned about giving false testimony under oath? Briggs: Of course I'm concerned of giving false testimony under oath!
"There was no authorization sought, there was a notification to the Estate," Briggs said.
Briggs said he doesn't have any record of speaking with Salter about it.
He said his best recollection is that it happened a few days prior to the firm's engagement with AEG's counsels. (ABC7)

Panish showed Briggs' opinion. "This is the basis of my opinion that it's speculative that the UK shows would be completed," Briggs said. "One basis is the health of MJ," Briggs said. "As part of that basis, life expectancy is key." Panish: Did you write anything up about the Coroner's testimony? Briggs: I did not. Panish asked if Coroner's testified about life expectancy. "I understand the Coroner was not deposed," Briggs said. Therefore, he said he could not note anything about it in his notes. "I did not make reference of autopsy report," Briggs explained. (ABC7)

Panish asked how many projects MJ did after the "Dangerous" tour. Briggs said it depended on how the work was classified. Panish named several projects MJ worked, such as Luciano Pavarotti Benefit for the Children, "United We Stand" 911 benefit. He also performed in NY with Bill Clinton, participated in movies "Man in Black 2" and "Miss Castaway," Thriller 25 album re-released. Briggs knew about some of the projects, not all. He said "Thriller 25" was extremely successful.(ABC7)

After the break, Panish asked Briggs about several projects that MJ completed after the HIStory tour that the consultant hadn't considered. They included some of the events that La Perruque testified about this morning, including the “Men In Black: II” cameo. Panish also asked about the release of a No. 1 hits compilation, the “Thriller 25” release in 2008 and 100 songs MJ recorded between ’01-‘08 Briggs said he couldn’t say for sure how involved Jackson was in any compilation or album re-release projects. (AP)

Panish: Do you know he recorded 100 new songs between 2001 and 2008 for new release? Briggs: I did not know that. "Just to be clear, I'm giving an opinion to future earning, not about his albums," Briggs said. Briggs explained if they had a plan, that would be in support of the O2 tour, as well as detailed budget and financing. "Financing appeared to be in place for O2 concerts, yes," Briggs said. There was also a director and approximately $34 million investment. O2 arena's capacity for MJ show is 15,000 average. "The contract contemplated a possibility for a world tour," Briggs opined. "Territory is a define term in the contract," Briggs said. " Territory is defined as the world." Panish: Is this evidence a world tour was contemplated by MJ and AEG Live? Briggs: Yes, this is evidence a world tour was contemplated.(ABC7)

Panish showed email Kathy Jorrie wrote: Nonetheless, I recommend that a background check be performed through a private investigator and/or at a minimum, that someone at AEG Live meet with Michael Jackson to make sure he understands that we are entering into a tour agreement with him that will require him to perform a worldwide tour... (ABC7)

Panish asked about a line in an email by Kathy Jorrie, the attorney who drafted Conrad Murray’s agreement, that mentioned a worldwide tour. Briggs confirmed that Jorrie wrote that Jackson would be required to perform a worldwide tour. He reiterated his opinion, based on reading testimony from medical experts, that Jackson’s drug use might keep the world tour from happening. Panish also showed Briggs an email from AEG Live CEO Randy Phillips from March 2009 that said the company had a 4-year plan for MJ concerts. Briggs said just because there was demand for Jackson concerts, it didn't change the risk factors that MJ wouldn't be able to tour.(AP)

Panish: You told us MJ's drug use makes it speculative that he could do a worldwide tour and earn a dime? Briggs: His drug use was a factor and basis for my opinion. (ABC7)

Briggs said endorsement companies have a long memory about the people they want to associate themselves with. Panish asked if endorsement companies had a long-lasting memory about Tiger Wood. Briggs said athletes and very different from artists. Panish: Tell us every endorsement deal you remember you reviewed as part of your experience. Briggs said he doesn't remember reviewing specific contracts for endorsement, need moment to think. The expert did say he reviewed 50 Cent and Vitamin Water endorsement deal. Briggs said he's reluctant to disclose values, but knows 50 Cent received equity in the company. Panish: It was more than $100 million, wasn't sir? Briggs: Not at the time, he entered into a deal thought to be much less than that.
Briggs said the deal was around $10 million, but he doesn't recall any cash transaction. Today the deal is said to be valued $100 million. Briggs wrote in his note: Paul McCartney -- $5 million Lexus Rolling Stones -- $10 million Citibank Others in the $1-2 million range.Panish asked Briggs where that information came from. Briggs said he doesn't recall, can't give specifics. (ABC7)

Regarding the 4 year plan that included Australia tour, Briggs said: "I do not see how demand addresses a one week life expectancy."(ABC7)

Panish addressed the judge: Your honor, I ask that Mr. Putnam stop making comments. Judge: I already said I'm not going to babysit the two of you. Jury didn't laugh this time around. (ABC7)

Panish discussed with Briggs, extensively, the chart and how Erk arrived at those numbers. (ABC7)


AEG redirect

Strong, in re-re-re-direct: Did you ever dispute a world tour was contemplated? Briggs: I did not. He said he took that in consideration, but it didn't alleviate some of the concerns he had. (ABC7)

Briggs said the general counsel of his firm cleared that there was no conflict of interest for him to testify in this case. "The Estate has not objected to my involvement in this case," Briggs said. (ABC7)


Jackson recross

Panish, in re-re-re-cross: You're sure as anything else you testified that your company contacted the Estate before signing the agreement? Briggs: That's correct.

Briggs is excused and judge gave a break in the afternoon session.


Timm Wooley video deposition


AEG's attorneys played video deposition of Timm Wooley, a financial advisor who worked on "This Is It." He's been an advisor for 20 years. (ABC7)

Woolley was a tour accountant who spoke to Murray about the terms of his contract and forwarded him draft contracts. Woolley was deposed in Florida in June 2012. He said he never read Murray’s draft contracts and denied he negotiated with the doctor. According to Woolley, he called Murray to work out details of what he needed to work on the “This Is It” shows and details for a contract. Woolley said he was instructed by AEG Live executive Paul Gongaware to deal with Murray. The men spoke in early May.(AP)

Kevin Boyle, Jacksons' attorney, did the questioning. Boyle asked if he thought it was weird MJ wanted a doctor on tour. "It was his choice, whether it was usual or not usual was not my place to decide," Wooley responded. "I think I wanted to get Mr. Murray off my back," Wooley said regarding emails he wrote to Murray. He said the intention was to put him off. (ABC7)

Wooley said Prince had done some shows in O2, he acted as financial consultant. Gongaware contacted Wooley to work in the "This It It" tour. Wooley got an email in early 2009. He said Gongaware wanted him as his deputy to work on projections, payables, payroll, petty cash. "(I) Deputed for him in matters financial, when delegated to me," Wooley explained. Wooley said he did not do the negotiations with Dr. Murray. He said negotiations is a broad term, may have done some work. He said he gathered information on behalf of MJ, his doctor that the artist wanted to contract, Wooley explained.Wooley said Gongaware told him MJ wanted to hire Conrad Murray, whom he said he later found out was MJ's primary physician. Boyle: Did you ask why MJ wanted a personal physician on tour? Wooley: Not mine to ask. (ABC7)

Wooley remembers calling Murray once in early May to check if he needed anything that he would get the info to the appropriate people. One email says: "Need for one venue-based, one home-based extracorporeal CPR units." Wooley said he suggested Dr. Murray to get CPR units. He said he was working for the tour, called the doctor on behalf of Michael Jackson. Boyle: Did you take any orders from MJ? Wooley: No. "I enumerated that item as an item he might wanted to have," Wooley said about the CPR, or defibrillation, units. He said in his community there was installation of CPR units in some houses and he thought of asking. Boyle asked if Wooley lived in a retirement home. He said he's not retired. Boyle: Did you have any reason to believe MJ could have suffer a heart attack? Wooley: None (ABC7)

Murray wasn’t forthcoming with what he needed to treat Jackson, so Woolley said he suggested he have two CPR machines for use in London. Woolley said he didn’t have any specific reason to think Jackson needed a CPR machine, but suggested it as a precaution. (AP)

"I was gathering information to compose projections and budget," Wooley testified. Boyle: Did you discuss Dr. Murray giving injection of Propofol to MJ? Wooley: No. Wooley never discussed the need for IV lines and needles. He said the doctor told him he may needed an assistant. Wooley said they did not discuss need for nurse or doctor. "We didn't talk about his services," Wooley said. (ABC7)

Boyle showed an email Wooley sent to Dr. Murray on May 14, 2009. It says he was following up with Dr. Murray. Email from Murray on May 15, 2009: As for good faith w/ my client... I'm sure you're aware my services are already fully engaged with MJ. Wooley doesn't remember the email and doesn't know what "my services are already fully engaged" meant. "I was attempting to be helpful," Wooley explained. He said he was not aware that Dr. Murray was treating MJ on behalf of AEG. Email from Dr. Murray: Dear Timm, I gather from your last email my contract is taking a little more time to get than usual... Email said his services are being done in good faith and asked, in reciprocity of good faith, to have payment for May deposited. "I didn't have any agreement with Dr. Murray," Wooley said.(ABC7)

Boyle: Did AEG have an agreement? Wooley: Never. There was never a completed agreement between Dr. Murray and AEG. Wooley said he had no idea if AEG would pay Dr. Murray for May. He said he never read the contract. Wooley testified he would've told Dr. Murray he would not get paid until the contract is completed. Wooley said he does not recall specifically receiving an email from Dr. Murray with his bank account info and request for $150k payment. Wooley said he does not remember if he asked Dr. Murray his bank account number. The advisor said he was gathering the information with Dr. Murray to be put in a contract . (ABC7)

Woolley said he was self-employed but paid by AEG. He said he took orders from Gongaware but did not take orders from Jackson. Woolley wrote Murray that the type of contract he needed to work on “This Is It” tour was rare and needed to be specially drafted. The men exchanged numerous emails in May and June 2009, with Murray trying to get AEG to pay his $150k a month fee. (AP)

Email on May 28 from Wooley to Murray said doctor's contract was delayed because it was rare event physician engaged to go on tour. "Yes, as far as I know, I was telling the truth," Wooley said. "I was putting him off." (ABC7)

Boyle wanted to know if Wooley asked why they were taking the doctor along. "Did I not say it was Mr. Jackson's request and it was not my place to question that?" Wooley responded.(ABC7)

Wooley said Dr. Murray came from Vegas and MJ was living in Vegas for a period of time. Wooley wrote email that AEG policy dictates you can only pay someone w/ fully executed contract. He said he knows it based on his experience. (ABC7)

Wooley testified he forwarded to Dr. Murray the contract Kathy Jorrie sent him. He said he did not read it.Boyle showed Wooley a chain of emails between him and Kathy Jorrie. He said he did not recall the chain specifically. In an email, Wooley apologized for the delay in getting the contract to Murray, said once contract is executed AEG could pay May/June salary."There wouldn't be any payment until a full agreement," Wooley said. (ABC7)

Woolley forwarded draft contracts prepared by attorney Kathy Jorrie to Murray and also tried to obtain the doctor's medical records. The medical records were needed for a second physical that insurers wanted on Jackson in order to get additional tour insurance. Woolley said he couldn't remember whether Murray ever provided the medical records to AEG. (AP)

Wooley said he remembers Dr. Murray had MJ's medical record from 2006 to 2009. It was needed for purposes of securing insurance. Wooley testified Dr. Murray seemed to be the person to have the records, which was needed for underwriter of insurance. (ABC7)

Wooley said they would not have needed CPR units until they went to the UK. He did not quote any prices for the machine. Wooley expressed he never discussed with Dr. Murray what kind of treatment he would be giving MJ. (ABC7)

Wooley testified he never saw any of the drafts of the contract between Dr. Murray and AEG, only forwarded them. Brigitte Segal was MJ's personal tour manager, Wooley said.Wooley was not asked to run a background check on Dr. Murray and doesn't know if it was ever requested by anyone. (ABC7)

Wooley said Dr. Murray asked for a "locum," a British medical term for a person who stands by in place of a physician. (ABC7)

He also said he never estimated how much getting CPR equipment in London would cost, and never discussed medical treatments with Murray. Woolley maintained throughout his testimony that Murray was Jackson’s personal doctor and he never had an agreement with AEG. His deposition was taken by plaintiff’s attorney Kevin Boyle and there was no cross-examination by AEG lawyers played for jurors. (AP)

That ended Wooley's deposition

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 63 – August 6 2013 – Summary

Katherine and Trent Jackson is in court.

Judge Yvette Palazuelos and attorneys spent more than 1 hour and 15 mins this morning discussing boundaries for next witness, Kathy Jorrie. Jorrie is a lawyer who works for AEG and put together Murray's contract. Both sides argued extensively regarding attorney-client privilege. (ABC7)

There were lots of arguments today today about testimony of Kathy Jorrie. Jorrie is an independent attorney who does a lot of work for AEG Live. She's handled almost 300 matters for the company since its creation. The arguments about what Jorrie would be able to testify about today lasted for more than an hour. Jorrie drafted Conrad Murray’s agreement to work on the “This Is It” tour. There were concerns about atty-client privilege, hearsay issues. Katherine Jackson’s attorneys objected to Jorrie’s testimony, saying she was being offered as an expert witness. Attorneys Brian Panish, Kevin Boyle and William Bloss argued that if Jorrie testified, AEG was waiving attorney-client privilege. The judge didn’t totally agree with the plaintiff’s attorneys, but she did want to review a heavily redacted email between Jorrie and AEG Live’s general counsel Shawn Trell. She also told AEG attorney Jessica Stebbins Bina to tread carefully. Panish argued a lot of Jorrie’s testimony about her discussions with Conrad Murray, Trell and AEG Live CEO Randy Phillips were hearsay. The judge wanted to avoid Jorrie from providing a legal opinion about whether AEG Live hired Murray, which is for the jury to decide. Stebbins Bina argued that Jorrie should be allowed to testify about certain conversations because the Jacksons’ lawyers are trying to argue to the jury that AEG ignored warning signs about Conrad Murray. She checked his medical licenses in 4 states (CA, NV, TX, HI). Stebbins Bina said if Murray had failed the “smell test” in talks with Jorrie, it would be reasonable if she stopped negotiating with him. The judge’s ruling was that Jorrie could testify about conversations with Murray that related to changes in his contract’s terms. The judge said it didn’t open up every communication between Jorrie and Murray (or even Phillips and Trell) to scrutiny by the plaintiffs. The judge did review the heavily redacted email after during the lunch break and determined its contents couldn't be shown to plaintiffs. Judge Yvette Palazuelos however said that if something in Jorrie's testimony changed her mind, plaintiffs could review unredacted version. Nothing so far persuaded Palazuelos to release the email to plaintiffs. She said she would keep a sealed copy in the court file. (AP)

Kathleen Ann Jorrie Testimony

AEG direct

Attorney Jessica Stebbins Bina did direct examination.

Jorrie said she's in the business for 20 years. She did undergraduate at UCLA and got JD degree at Hastings College of Law. Jorrie is a partner at a law firm, works in Los Angeles. Her firm is an international company with close to 80 attorneys in the LA office. Jorrie said she splits her work between being a trial litigator and transactional work, one who deals with contracts. The focus of her clients has been the entertainment business. Her clients involve motion pictures studios, television content producers. She also works with movie distributors, satellite providers, live entertainment promoters, etc. (ABC7)

Jorrie said she works with AEG Live and AEG in their live entertainment business. She deals with Shawn Trell (who testified earlier on.) The attorney said she worked on more than 75 tour agreements with prominent artists, Rolling Stones, Bon Jovi, Britney Spears, Kanye West. Over the years, Jorrie said Trell asked her to help negotiate agreements with vendors. She said she normally works on big agreements.(ABC7)

Jorrie worked on third party agreements for "This Is It" tour. She worked on deal with Bravado for merchandising, negotiated stage. Jorrie also did the contract for Dr. Conrad Murray that Michael Jackson requested. "I drafted the version that was sent to Mr. Wooley, who provided my draft agreement to Dr. Murray," Jorrie explained. Jorrie said, to her best recollection, she received a call from Timm Wooley to help prepare an agreement for Dr. Murra in late May of 2009. The attorney never talked to Murray before drawing the first draft. Initial draft was based on basic terms Wooley provided her, Jorrie said. Jorrie: He told me that MJ had agreed to pay $150,000 per month for Dr. Murray, that Dr. Murray was MJ's personal physician.In addition to providing medical care, Dr. Murray would be on call for emergencies, Jorrie explained. Jorrie said nurse would be provided as selected by Dr. Murray and paid for by AEG Live. The doctor would have the air fare to/from London. Also, the doctor and family would be provided housing in London.Wooley said Dr. Murray wanted personal insurance in case he got sick. The payment to commence as of May 1, 2009. Jorrie said he did not say what ended point would be. She put all the terms in the first draft agreement, but most details were missing.Jorrie said she included other important terms: - End date to be end of O2 arena in Sept. 2009 - Termination provision – Indemnity. Jorrie said she sent the draft to Wooley and if he was happy with it to forward it to Dr. Murray.(ABC7)

Jorrie said there were 2 more drafts after the first. She said she looked at other AEG agreement contracts she had prepared AEG as template. Jorrie explained she worked off the base contract and included a bunch of other provisions to the agreement. Jorrie said the "Scope of Services" was a mix between what Wooley requested and her additions. At Wooley's request, she included that Dr. Murray was MJ's personal physician and had been for some time. Jorrie added "services to be provided by Dr. Murray administer those services professionally and greatest degree of care expected." The attorney said Wooley told her that Michael Jackson had asked Dr. Murray to go on tour with him and that MJ would pay for it. Jorrie said she included in the contract "Artist Consent," saying the contract was not enforceable unless and until MJ signed the agreement. She said she added a line for MJ's signature at the end of the document. Jorrie said this provision was included in the 1st draft. She said Murray had no comment regarding the first 2 provisions of the contract. Jorrie said Recital A, Paragraph 9 and wording above MJ's signature explained Dr. Murray was hired on behalf of Michael Jackson. (ABC7)

Jorrie explained the Termination provision that allowed AEG to terminate the contract with Dr. Murray. Termination: 1- in event there was a default of the agreement by the doctor 2- in the event series of concerts postponed or canceled. Termination: 3- if artist decided he no longer wanted or needed Murray 4- failed to maintain all licenses and approval to practice medicine. Termination: 5- failed to submit written evidence that he was legally authorized to practice medicine in US.Termination: 6- no later than July 3rd, evidence he was allowed to practice medicine in the UK. (ABC7)

Jorrie said she believes she sent the email to Wooley/Dr. Murray on June 15. She testified she never received any documents from Dr. Murray. Jorrie said Murray called her on 6/18/09: 1- Murray and MJ relationship 2- Some of changes he wanted made 3- Couple of questions Jorrie had. The attorney said the conversation about Dr. Murray and MJ relationship did not result in any change to the contract. Jorrie: The changes he mentioned to me during the call, he wanted his company GCA Holdings to be the contracting party instead of him. Dr. Murray also wanted to change provision where Jorrie referred to nurse. Jorrie explained Dr. Murray said he wanted flexibility to have a "qualified assistant medical person," who could be another physician. Another change requested was to provision 7.7 regarding termination, Jorrie said. (ABC7)

Jorrie: He also let me know he was license to practice medicine in 4 states and gave me the states.Jorrie: Dr. Murray told me he preferred to have GCA Holding as contracting party and he as employee of the company. Jorrie said that it was okay but she wanted Dr. Murray on the contract also. Jorrie: I asked why you needed another physician as opposed to a nurse. He told me in case he was unavailable or tired. Jorrie said Dr. Murray wanted to have the flexibility to have someone on stand by, payable for by AEG Live. Jorrie said ultimately she made the changes. Dr. Murray was the one who would identify who this medical person would be, but never did.The attorney said Dr. Murray told her he was licensed to practice medicine in California, Nevada, Texas and Hawaii. The first payment was to be no later than 5 days after contracted was fully signed by everybody, including Michael Jackson. (ABC7)

Dr. Murray wanted to modify section 7.7, termination either because MJ decided he didn't want him anymore or the concert canceled. As a result, he would not want to be in a position he would have to refund any part of his payment. Payment was due to him on the 15th of the month to cover from 1st-30th. If he were terminated on the 20th, he wanted to keep full payment. Jorrie: My response: Dr. Murray, $150,000/month is a lot of money! Jorrie said Dr. Murray told her he had 4 medical practices making a million dollar a month, and it was not fair to have to return money. Jorrie: Murray said under no circumstances he was leaving his practice if when terminated he couldn't keep the whole 150,000 received. Jorrie explained that provision 7.7 detailed what happened if there was a termination. Dr. Murray asked her to limit that provision. Jorrie: He had asked to be able to retain the full payment for the month he received. "He thought it would be fair and appropriate due to him leaving his established medical practice," Jorrie explained. (ABC7)

Jorrie said she asked Murray about the CPR machine. The doctor provided a list of equipment he needed to Wooley, who in turn sent to Jorrie. Jorrie: I asked Dr. Murray, why do you need a CPR machine? He said he needed one in London, MJ puts on a strenuous performance. Jorrie asked if O2 arena didn't have one. He said he didn't want to take risks, wanted one at hand. He also told her it's customary. "Giving Michael's age, giving his age, and that he puts on a strenuous performance, he just didn't want to take a chance," Jorrie said. Jorrie recalled there was other equipments on the list, normally for dehydration purposes, like saline and catheter. Contract said "producer to provide medical equipment portable CPR, saline, catheter, needles, gurney and other mutually approved equipment." Jorrie: Our conversation concerned London, he said he needed one (CPR machine) in London. (ABC7) The attorney told jurors that she spoke to Murray about an agreement she drafted that would have paid him $150,000 a month to accompany Jackson to London for 50 concerts. She said she questioned the doctor about a request in the contract for CPR machines, but she was satisfied with his response that the singer's shows were strenuous and he needed lifesaving equipment nearby if there was an emergency. (AP)

Jorrie said she took the information she got from Dr. Murray, went online and checked it out. The attorney said she went to the Nevada Secretary of State to check if GCA Holdings, LLC was indeed a valid company. Jorrie said she checked the medical boards Dr. Murray told her he was licenses and googled the doctor. Jorrie testified GCA was a proper company and Dr. Murray was the manager of it. She added the address on the contract and Dr. Murray's title. Jorrie said it was very easy to check the medical licenses. She went on the Medical Board websites and checked his licenses in all. "There was no disciplinary action against Dr. Murray," Jorrie said. She checked in California, Nevada, Texas and Hawaii. Jorrie testified she did the medical license check on June 18, 2009. (ABC7) Jorrie testified Tuesday that she reviewed records that showed Murray's Nevada clinic had a valid license, the physician was licensed to practice medicine in four states and she searched his name on Google. (AP)

She said she sent the draft to Dr. Murray, but the email bounced back. She then sent email to Wooley asking him to forward the contract to Murray. Jorrie said she also attached a comparison doc with the redlines marking the changes she made for easier understanding.(ABC7)

Jorrie explained it's her practice to save doc as "final pdf version." She said it is a personal indicator that the final version was sent. The attorney told the jury once the contract is fully executed, she saves it "fully executed."(ABC7)

Jorrie said she was asked by the general counsel to see if she could ask Dr. Murray for the medical history for insurance purpose. "Dr. Murray said he had told me he had been MJ's physician for a period of time," Jorrie expressed.
Bina: Did you send this email because you believe Dr. Murray was MJ's physician? Jorrie: Yes.
Jorrie asked that if Dr. Murray was not the right doctor to provide records, if he could please direct her to the appropriate physician.
The attorney said Dr. Murray told her he would help. (ABC7)

Jorrie explained she had 3 drafts of Dr. Murray's agreement. GCA would actually provide the services of Dr. Murray, Jorrie said. The $150k would be paid not to Dr. Murray, but to GCA Holdings. Jorrie changed Provision 3.4 at the request of Dr. Murray, from nurse to qualified medical person (assistant) Change in 7.7: If there's termination, GCA shall have no obligation to refund any portion of any installation due and payable before. Jorrie said Dr. Murray called her again on June 23, 2009 asking for some more changes. (ABC7)

Jorrie spoke with Randy Phillips on June 19, 2009 on an unrelated matter and Dr. Murray's subject came up. It was phone conversation, she relayed Dr. Murray was licensed to practice in 4 states. "I checked out, or confirmed the info," she said. Jorrie testified she told Phillips Murray appeared to be very successful in his practice, may have told him about a million dollar a month. "I definitely told him he's very successful in his practice," Jorrie said. "I confirmed he was licensed to practice in 4 states." (ABC7) Kathy Jorrie, an independent attorney who has handled nearly 300 matters for AEG Live LLC, said she told the company's CEO that the physician was properly licensed during a conversation six days before Jackson died in June 2009. Jorrie said she also told the executive that former cardiologist Conrad Murray told her his medical clinics were earning more than $1 million a month. (AP)

Jorrie: AEG Live has been a consistent client of mine since 2000. Approximately 300 matters have been opened in 12 years.(ABC7)

First change was the effective date, from June to May 1, 2009, Jorrie said. Jorrie: He said he was promised that when the agreement was signed he would've been paid retroactively to May 1, 2009. (When Bina asked about payment provision, Panish objected to prevent Jorrie from expressing her opinion about the contract. Judge: I'm going to strike the entire testimony if she keeps interpreting the contract.) Jorrie: He wanted to extend, by about 5 months, his engagement. Jorrie asked if MJ would be paying him even though the tour would be on break. He said yes. End date changed from Sept, 2009 to March, 2010. 1- Scope of Services -- it had language saying perform services reasonably requested by "Producer." Jorrie: Murray said we need to change that to Artist, it's the artist who's my patient. I said absolutely right, the artist if your patient. Jorrie said provision 4.1 also says "Perform the Services reasonably requested by Producer.".Jorrie: I didn't change it to Artist because Murray didn't draw my attention to that and I didn't remember that language was in there twice. Jorrie said if she had seen it, she would've changed it to Artist, not Producer. (ABC7) Jorrie also told jurors she mistakenly left language in a contract that Murray signed that called for him to perform services "reasonably requested" by AEG Live. (AP)

Bina asked if on June 23 Jorrie discussed with Dr. Murray to get MJ's medical history. She said yes. Jorrie revised the agreement, emailed to Dr. Murray on 6/23/09: saying 'I have attached a clean pdf version, which is ready for execution.'Jorrie said she sent 3rd version of the draft to AEG Live. She didn't send it to MJ or his reps, was not in communication with MJ about it. Jorrie explained it was never her understanding that MJ's medical records would have been sent to her but to insurance underwriter. Jorrie: Late in the evening on June 24, I received a fax with a document signed by Dr. Murray. I forwarded a copy to it to Mr. Trell. Jorrie said neither Michael Jackson nor AEG signed the contract. (ABC7)

The attorney said she has negotiated with third party vendors before without showing the drafts to the artist. Jorrie: The reasons is that attorneys for the artist would have the document exactly like they wanted. Judge: How do you know if you don't talk t the artist that the agreement is what the artist's want? "Sometimes we enter in agreements the artists never see," Jorrie told the court. Jorrie said this is the first third-party vendor agreement she was involved with a medical doctor. (ABC7)

Jorrie sent Dr. Murray the last version on June 23rd, Dr. Murray faxed it back on June 24th.

Jorrie said she didn't talk to Murray about specific treatment he was giving to MJ. "He didn't tell me anything he was doing to treat MJ." Bina: Did Dr. Murray ever ask you for payment? Jorrie: Never. (ABC7)

Jorrie explained paragraph 4 of the contract, which detailed the responsibilities of GCA/Dr. Murray. Jorrie testified she discussed with Dr. Murray the requirement for UK medical license either on June 18 or 23. Jorrie said July 3, 2009 was the date Dr. Murray was planning to go to London with Michael Jackson. Bina showed the last page of Dr. Murray's agreement. Under the signatures, it is dated June 24, 2009. Jorrie said she put that date since she thought the parties would've signed the contract that day. "I do not know if Michael Jackson would've signed the agreement," Jorrie testified. Regarding the reference that AEG hired doctor at request of MJ, Jorrie said she never did this on any other agreement on behalf of AEG. "Because we're talking about Michael Jackson's physician," Jorrie explained. (ABC7)

Recap: June 15th -- first draft written, sent to Dr. Murray June 18th -- negotiation with Dr. Murray began, over the phone. June 19th -- checked medical license, business standing June 19th -- spoke with Phillips about it. June 23rd - Murray called asking additional changes June 23rd - third draft sent to Murray June 24th - Murray signed it and faxed it back (ABC7)

Jorrie emailed Dr. Murray one more time after that related to the insurance for the tour. (ABC7)

She maintained throughout her testimony that Murray was Jackson's personal doctor and the language about him performing services for the promoter shouldn't have been in the agreement. Jackson's approval was required on the contract, but he died before signing it(AP)

Jorrie said she first spoke to Murray on the phone on June 18, after he reviewed an initial draft of the contract. He asked that his company's name be added to the contract and that a provision allowing him to hire a nurse as an assistant be changed to a "qualified assistant medical person." "I had asked him, 'Why would you need another physician as opposed to a nurse?'" Jorrie testified. "And he told me that in an event that he was not available or he was tired, he wanted the flexibility" to have a back-up. Murray asked that he be responsible for hiring the additional doctor, but did not provide a name, Jorrie said. The attorney testified that she ultimately agreed to the change.Murray also requested that should his contract be terminated early, he would not be required to refund his $150,000-per-month payment. Jorrie said Murray told her that his medical practices brought in "a million dollars a month" and because he was leaving those practices for the tour, "it'd be fair and appropriate" that he keep the full payment he had received. Jorrie said she also spoke to Murray about his request for medical equipment. Woolley had provided her a list of items the doctor might ask for, she testified, and she wanted to know why a "CPR machine" was on the list. "He said he needed it in London during the performance, Michael Jackson puts on a strenuous performance and that he did not want to take a chance," she said. "That should anything go wrong, should there be an emergency, etc., he wanted to have that."
When she asked if having a machine available at the O2 Arena would suffice, she said Murray said no. "He said they would" have the machine, she said, "but that he didn't want to take a chance." After speaking to the doctor, Jorrie said she searched online to confirm some of his background. She verified his company was based in Nevada and that he had medical licenses in four states. She also "Googled him," she said. "I Google everybody." Jorrie said she attempted to email the revised contract to Murray, but the email bounced back. She then sent it to Woolley, who forwarded it to the doctor. Murray called June 23 with additional changes that involved when his payments would begin and extending the time of his services from September 2009 to March 2010. Murray told her Jackson had agreed to pay his monthly salary for that extended time frame, she said. Jorrie said she sent Murray another draft based on the changes. The next day, she testified, she received a copy of the agreement via fax that had been signed by Murray. The attorney testified that she never directly communicated with Jackson or sent the singer or his representatives any versions of the contract, though there was a space set aside for the pop star's signature. The empty line on the contract shown to jurors Tuesday was dated June 24, which is when Jorie said she expected the parties involved to sign the final agreement. Jackson died the next day.(LATimes)


Jackson cross

In cross examination, Panish asked if Jorrie is an independent witness. Jorrie: I don't understand the question, Mr. Panish. Panish: Are you being paid for the work you've done in this case? Jorrie: I'm not being paid as I sit here today. (ABC7)

Panish asked if her company has received millions and millions of dollar from AEG. She said since 2000, yes. Panish inquired if Jorrie is friends with Randy Phillips and Paul Gongaware. "I'd like to think all my clients are my friends, Mr. Panish," Jorrie explained. "They are business friends." "I'm aware that Mr. Gongaware was sued one time, but I want to be absolutely certain," Jorrie said.Panish: Professionals keep itemization of the work they do, don't they? Jorrie said she keeps tabs of the work she does. Panish asked if Jorrie hires expert witnesses. She said yes. He inquired if professionals keep itemization. She said yes. Panish: Have you ever paid an expert $700,000? Jorrie: I have not. (ABC7)

Panish asked if Jorrie brought the contract she used as basis for drafting Dr. Murray's contract.Jorrie said she has it in her office. Panish asked to see it, she said she can provide it, redacting the name of the third party. (ABC7)

Jorrie charges AEG $595 per hour. She said she's not billing AEG for the testimony today. Panish: How much have you billed AEG related to the "This Is It" project? Jolie: Work started in October 2008. Jorrie asked if it included litigation. Panish said yes. Jorrie: Of all matters related to This Is It? Panish: Yes. More than 20 million? J: Of course not P: 10 million? J: No P: 5 million? J: No. Jorrie said she can have her accounting department put together a spreadsheet with all she has billed AEG. (ABC7)

Panish said Paul Gongaware and John Meglen were sued for stealing the name Concerts West.Bina objected, saying the lawsuit was dismissed and Panish was trying to tarnish Gongaware and Meglen's reputation. Judge: Was the case dismissed? Panish: Yes Judge: Then it's not stealing. Please refrain from using that word. Describe it accurately. (ABC7)

Jorrie: For all of those matters, for 12 years, it would be millions of dollars. Panish: How many multi-million dollars has your company been paid? Jorrie: It could be over $5 million for that period of time (since 2000). (ABC7)

Panish: You knew MJ was going on a 3-5 years worldwide tour, correct? Jorrie: That's not correct. Putnam was present when Jorrie spoke with LAPD after Michael Jackson's death. Panish: Did you go meet with LAPD and discussed MJ going to go on a worldwide tour? Jorrie: No, they came to my office, asked questions. Panish: Did you tell LAPD the that MJ was going on a world tour? Jorrie: No. Panish: Did you say European tour was just the beginning and MJ would be making a worldwide tout? Jorrie: Not that I recall. "That's not my statement and I don't recall that," Jorrie testified. Panish: Did you tell LAPD that MJ was going on a worldwide tour after European leg was over? Jorrie: No. Panish: Did Mr. Putnam tell LAPD MJ was going to do a world tour for 3 to 5 years? Jorrie: No. Panish: You denied making that statement? Jorrie: Yes. Not like that. Panish asked if Detective Schmidt is called to testified and said Jorrie told him about MJ going on a worldwide tour, if that's a lie. "He would've been mistaken, Mr. Panish," Jorrie said. "Because he misunderstood what I was saying about the tour.". (ABC7)

Jorrie said she did not bill for the time she testified at deposition. (ABC7)

Panish: Did you tell the police department Dr. Murray took in $12 million a year? "I said that he told me that his 4 medical practices brought in more than a million dollars a year," Jorrie said.Panish: Did you say one million dollar a month? Jorrie: Dr. Murray had 4 practices, I told one million dollars a year and they added up to 12 million. "I spoke with him about the tour agreement and how it would work," Jorrie testified. (ABC7)

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 64 – August 7 2013 – Summary

Source : ABC7 unless otherwise indicated

Kathy Jorrie Testimony

Jackson cross

Brian Panish, attorney for the Jacksons, doing the questioning.

Jorrie brought copy of the contract she used as template to draft Dr. Conrad Murray's agreement. She also gathered an estimate AEG paid her law firm since 2000, covering 14 years of work. Panish asked if it was in excess of $7.2 million. Jorrie: It's my estimate that my firm received a little over $ 7 million since 2000, which is about $500,000/year for services for AEG Live.

Panish: Did you say you negotiated probably 75 agreements with artists?
Jorrie: It's about 75, but it could be more, all for AEG Live.

Panish: Where you representing Michael Jackson when you were preparing Dr. Murray's contract?
Jorrie: I was not.

Regarding the LAPD conversation, Panish asked Jorrie if she was represented by Marvin Putnam in that meeting. She said no. "I really didn't feel like I needed representation in that meeting, sir," Jorrie said. "I was a witness." Panish asked if Jorrie represented herself, since she is a lawyer. She said she doesn't know how to answer, you always rep yourself as attorney. Jorrie met w/ LAPD twice in her office. Det Smith questioned her, Putnam and Deborah Brazil, one of the DAs prosecuting Murray, were present

Panish: Do you remember telling me yesterday that you never told LAPD that MJ was engaged to go on worldwide tour?
Jorrie: Yes
Panish: Do you remember you denying telling the police department that statement?
Jorrie: Yes
Panish asked if after reviewing LAPD's interview, Jorrie contacted Det. Smith to fix it. She said no, read it only months later.
Panish: Did AEG ever enter into a tour agreement with Michael Jackson that required him to do a world tour?
Jorrie: Yes

Jorrie explained some things had to happen before the world tour could take place. She said the world tour was contemplated, but it didn't mean it was going to happen. Jorrie explained that if the parties agreed, then the tour could go on beyond London. Jorrie said Dr. Tohme was a manager for Michael Jackson during the time they negotiated the tour and continued until the time of death. Michael Jackson's contract with AEG was signed on Jan 26, 2009.

Panish: Did you ever have reservations in January 2009 about Dr. Tohme?
Jorrie: I did

Jorrie said she googled Tohme and couldn't see he was a music manager. Panish asked Jorrie if she checks people on google. "That's usually my first step in the process," she responded.

Panish: And you recommended that a background check be done on Tohme, right?
Jorrie: As an alternative, yes.

Panish showed email Jorrie wrote regarding Dr. Tohme and her concerns if he was the "real McCoy." Jorrie explained she recommended at minimum that someone meet w/ MJ to make sure he understands he's entering into worldwide tour agreement. Jorrie said background check was not done on Dr. Tohme, at least to her knowledge. She didn't do one.

Jurors were shown letters and emails Jackson wrote saying Tohme was not his representative, although concert promoter and producer AEG Live acted as if he were. Jorrie expressed reservations about Tohme as early as January 2009, five months before the singer died. In an email to AEG executives, she wondered "whether or not he is the real McCoy... Nonetheless, I recommend that a background check be performed through a private investigator and/or at a minimum, that someone at AEG Live meet with Michael Jackson to make sure he understands that we are entering into a tour agreement with him that will require him to perform a worldwide tour.” No private investigator was hired. A copy of the email was sent to Peter Lopez, one of Jackson’s attorneys. On April 22, 2009, Jackson wrote Phillips, “This letter shall serve to confirm that I am not using Dr. Tohme for tour production management services and that I do not intend to use Dr. Tohme in the future for tour production management services or with respect to other event related matters. "Therefore, you are not authorized to pay Dr. Tohme or any of his affiliated companies for any such services in connection with my upcoming tour or any future tours or other events..." Jorrie testified she did not see the letter before Jackson died on June 25, 2009. (LATimes)

Jorrie explained promoters and producers can and do negotiate third party vendors agreement as part of the business. The attorney said she was very much involved in drafting Michael Jackson's agreement with AEG.

Panish said Jorrie refused to have her deposition videotaped. Jorrie explained she was not properly notified about video deposition.

Dennis Hawk, Tohme Tohme and Michael Jackson's company received a copy of MJ contract with AEG, according to Jorrie's deposition. Panish: On January 28, Mr. Tohme approved the cost in excess of $7.5 million, correct? Jorrie: On January 28, Dr. Tohme had provided written approval that MJ company had approved certain production costs. Jorrie said it's actually June 28, 2009, not January as she previously stated. MJ died on June 25, 2009. Panish: At the time of MJ's death, are you aware of anyone approving production costs in excess of $7.5 million that was in the contract? Jorrie: I'm not privy to everything, so I don't know.

Panish: Did you ever see a written agreement for more than 31 shows as stated on the contract?
Jorrie: No, not that I recall.
Panish: The agreement specified the territory of the tour as the world, correct?
Jorrie: Correct

Panish shows contract of Michael Jackson with AEG. The contract says the shows were not to exceed 1 per day and 3.5 shows per 7 days. Panish asked, if under the contract, Michael Jackson was prohibited to tour except if done with AEG. Jorrie was not allowed to answer, since it calls to interpretation of the contract. Jorrie said she sent the contract to Michael Jackson's representatives.

Panish: And the term was Dec 2011 or conclusion of world tour, whichever occur later, right?
Jorrie: That's what it says in the paragraph.

Panish: Did you ever learn Tohme ceased being MJ's manager?
Jorrie: To my best recollection, that issue came up after Mr. Jackson's passing.

The fact that Tohme stopped representing MJ came up and it's in litigation, Jorrie said. Jorrie said Howard Weitzman, attorney for Michael Jackson's Estate, told her about Tohme in connection with litigation several years ago. Frank DiLeo may also have told her, she said. There's also litigation about it as well. Jorrie said she doesn't recall if Weitzman was the first person who told her about Dr. Tohme not representing MJ at one point.

On June 28, 2009, there was a meeting at John Branca's office with all the higher ups for AEG and MJ's representatives. Jorrie was involved in drafting a consent agreement for Tohme to sign.

Panish: AEG was out $34-plus million at the time?
Jorrie: I believe so, perhaps more.
Panish: On that day you questioned if Dr. Tohme was an officer of Michael Jackson's company?
Jorrie: I did.
Panish: And that day you didn't have anything in writing approving $34 million in expenses?
Jorrie: Correct.

Jorrie said she believed Dr. Tohme was an officer of MJ's company prior to June 28, 2009. Paul Gongaware may have been the one telling her. During the meeting on June 28, Jorrie said Tohme told her, personally, that he was an officer of Michael Jackson Company, LLC.

Panish: Did you look up to see if Dr. Tohme was an officer of MJ's LLC?
Jorrie said in Delaware you can't check officers for LLC online.

However, on June 28, 2009, three days after Jackson died, Tohme was given a document to approve payment of the $34 million AEG had advanced the singer. Jorrie testified the document was drawn up by her and Shawn Trell, AEG Live's general counsel. The document, signed by Tohme, said he was an officer of Michael JacksonCo. LLP and had authority to act on the company's behalf. A Jan. 14, 2009, email from Jackson attorney Dennis Hawk to Jorrie said the singer was "the sole officer" of the company "and will be the signatory to the contract on behalf of the entity.” Jorrie said AEG executive Paul Gongaware, a defendant in the suit, may have told her Tohme was an officer of the Jackson's company. Included in the document were 35 pages of expenses that Jackson supposedly owed AEG. Jorrie testified that the document was never sent to Jackson's lawyers, even though it was handed to Tohme in the office of one of them. (LATimes)

Panish inquired if Jorrie could've asked MJ directly if Tohme was an officer of his company. She said yes, if she felt it was necessary.

Panish: You never spoke with Michael Jackson, did you?
Jorrie: Not once.

Panish: Who signed the tour agreement on behalf of Michael Jackson's company?
Jorrie: Michael Jackson.

As of January 2009, Michael Jackson was the sole officer and signatory of Michael Jackson Company, LLC. Jorrie received that information from MJ's attorney, Dennis Hawk.

Panish: Before MJ died you had nothing in writing that MJ was not the sole company officer?
Jorrie: Nothing in writing was provided to me.

Jorrie said in the meeting they were getting consent from Tohme that production expenses had been approved by MJ's company.
Panish: But you needed someone approved by MJ's company, right?
Jorrie: That's why we had confirmation he was an agent.

Total expense was around $34 million, plus $7.5 million that was pre-approved based on the contract resulted in $27 million outstanding. The document was prepared by Trell and Jorrie prior to the meeting at Branca's office.

Panish: AEG had $27 million out there that they had spent?
Jorrie: That's my understanding.
Panish: And you and Mr. Trell had a document you gave Tohme at the meeting?
Jorrie: Yes.
Panish: And the word "consent" was there?
Jorrie: I'm not sure it was there.

Panish showed Jorrie a letter from Michael Jackson to Randy Phillips on April 22, 2009. The document, signed by Michael Jackson, terminated Dr. Tohme's representation as his manager. Jorrie said she does not recall seeing it.

Letter from Concerts West to The Michael Jackson Company, LLC Jorrie helped draft, dated June 28, 2009. 1.I hereby confirm that Artistco (MJ) approved the attached budget of expenses which includes Production Costs and Pool Expenses. 3.The undersigned Dr. Tohme Tohme represents he's officer of Artistco, has full authority to act on behalf of Artistco/to sign this document

Panish: You never asked Tohme after MJ died if he was an officer of MJ's company?
Jorrie: That's right.
Jorrie: He confirmed to me, at the meeting, that he was an officer of Michael Jackson's company.
Panish: Did you see any document saying Tohme was an agent of Michael Jackson's company?
Jorrie: I had not seen any such documents.
Panish: Did you make any effort to confirm Tohme was an officer of the company? Jorrie said she spoke with Tohme about it.

Panish asked if Jorrie inquired John Branca, MJ's attorney, if Tohme was authorized to sign on behalf of Michael Jackson Company, LLC. "I didn't ask him that question," Jorrie said. Panish asked if she discussed w/ Branca about Tohme signing the doc. Jorrie said she didn't. Panish said the document she handed to Tohme has a budget attached to it. Jorrie said she did not review the attached budget. Jorrie said budget was given to her by Gongaware. Panish asked if the budget included payment of $150k/month, times 2 months, for Murray. Since Jorrie testified she didn't read the document, there is no foundation for her to answer the question. Judge sustained the objection. "I had nothing in writing that said Tohme was an officer of Michael Jackson's company," Jorrie testified. Panish asked if Jorrie saw the attached budget. "I never looked at that, that was Paul's job," she answered. "I have never seen a single piece of paper saying Tohme was not an office of the company," Jorrie said. Jorrie: Why would the Estate approve the expenses then, sir? Panish argued Jorrie doesn't know what's on the budget, so how does she know the Estate paid what's requested. Jorrie: I know Dr. Murray was not paid because he was not entitled to be paid. Panish: Was Dr. Tohme there on the budget for $200,000? Objection, sustained (since she had not read it.) Judge told Panish to move on or she will cease the examination.

Panish: Mr Trell never told you about this document (MJ's termination of Tohme)? Defendants objected again based on attorney-client privilege

Cross examination by plaintiff’s attorney Brian Panish continued this morning. He hasn’t yet asked about Conrad Murray’s contract. He has spent a lot of time on Michael Jackson’s touring agreement with AEG Live, asking Jorrie about terms in it. Panish has also been asking Jorrie about whether any authorization for tour expenses above $7.5 million was obtained before Jackson’s death. No authorization was obtained from Jackson. Before the break, Panish asked about a form that Jorrie got MJ’s former manager Tohme Tohme to sign a few days after Jackson’s death. (AP).

Judge sustained the objection and ordered lunch break. Outside the presence of the jury: Judge Yvette Palazuelos to Panish: You keep invading attorney-client privilege. As to the budget -- she keeps telling you she didn't review it. Any question about the budget is without foundation. I don't want to waste time with that, over and over. I know you understand the ruling, I assume you have nothing better to ask. "If you don't move on I'll shut down the examination," Judge Palazuelos told Panish. Panish explained what he was trying to do, that Jorrie volunteers and continue to volunteer what is not asked, almost more than any witness. Panish: It's improper what she did, your honor. As member of the bar, she knew as of January that this person was not officer of the company Nonetheless she, as concerned he was not the real Mccoy, brought document to him with $34 million for him to sign off. Bina said it was done in good faith, Tohme told her he was an officer of the company. She said DiLeo also told Jorrie MJ approved the budget Panish: When she says my client told that, why can't I ask about communication about that? Judge ordered Panish to move on or she will finish his examination.

After lunch, outside the presence of the jury, Panish told judge he's excluding anything that's potential violation of atty-client privilege. Panish asked the judge to strike testimony of Jorrie when she issued opinion that the Estate didn't pay Murray because he wasn't entitled to. Jacksons attorneys want the judge to tell the jurors to disregard it, since the implication is the Estate didn't recognize contract as valid.

Jorrie explained she doesn't recall working on agreements where AEG was both producer and promoter of the show. Jorrie said she never worked on a contract for a doctor to go on tour, except for Michael Jackson.

Email from Murray to Wooley: I am basically in agreement and reiterate that your memo is correct pursuant to our conversation of May 8, 2009 As for good faith with my client I'm sure that you are aware that my services are already fully engaged with Mr. Jackson.
Jorrie said she doesn't recall receiving or seeing this email. Murray never told her he was meeting with AEG people regarding his contract. Panish: Did Dr. Murray ever tell you he met with AEG personal at anyone's request? Jorrie: No. Wooley did not tell Jorrie that Dr. Murray's services were being rendered.

Panish: Did you ever tell Dr. Murray he could not perform work without a fully executed contract?
Jorrie: Of course not.

Jorrie spoke with Murray about getting medical license to work in the UK. She knew Brigitte Segal was looking for housing in London for him. Panish asked if it was in anticipation the contract would be all signed by July 3, 2009.

Panish: They were undertaking acts that were spelled out in the contract?
Jorrie: Yes.
Panish: Dr. Murray was undertaking acts that were spelled out in the contract?
Jorrie: I was told he was the personal physician for 3 years.
Panish: Regarding pay, equipment, starting and ending date provided by Mr. Wooley and not Dr. Murray, correct?
Jorrie: That's not right, Mr. Wooley didn't give me an ending date, for instance.

Panish showed the template contract Jorrie used to create Dr. Murray's agreement. Jorrie said she took out paragraph 7 about Conflicts. CPR machine was on the list Wooley provided to Jorrie regarding the requirements for Dr. Murray. Panish played video of Jorrie's testimony in Murray's trial. She said in latter part of May, Wooley advised her he needed contract prepared. May 1, 2009 is the commencement of the contract. Jorrie sent the contract to Dr. Murray on June 15, 6 weeks later.

Panish: Did you ever testify that payments had been promised to Dr. Murray retroactively to May 1?
Jorrie: Yes, once the contract was signed

Panish played another part of Jorrie's testimony in the criminal trial. DA asked if irrespective of the contract becoming activated, Murray was contemplating compensation from a period retroactively to 5/1/09. Jorrie: Yes

Panish discussed paragraphs 3 and 4 of the contract, which spelled out the obligations for AEG and Dr. Murray. Panish asked if AEG could terminate Dr. Murray without the consent of Michael Jackson. Jorrie said yes. "He told me his four medical practice was grossing a million dollars a month," Jorrie testified. Panish said $150,000 per month equates to $5,000 a day for 30 days.

Panish: Did you find his website?
Jorrie: No, I didn't find a website.

Jorrie put Conrad Murray and the names of his two clinics on google.
Panish: He was making a million dollars with two clinics?
Jorrie: He said he had 4 medical practice, but I only found 2 clinics.

Jorrie said she could find addresses for only 2 clinics, but Dr. Murray told her he had 4 medical practices. Jorrie explained she looked up Dr. Murray's medical license and two clinics are named. "I don't know for sure it was his companies," Jorrie admitted. "It was my assumption they were his." Jorrie said the clinics were in Nevada and Texas, didn't find anything in Hawaii and California. The attorney said she spent about 10 minutes researching Dr. Murray online. Panish asked if Jorrie charged AEG for the time she spent. She said she doesn't know.

Panish: Sometimes you do freebies for AEG?
Jorrie: Yes, for all my clients.

Jorrie uses Lexis for legal research, she said. Panish asked if she checked how many judgments existed against Dr. Murray. She said not. Jorrie didn't check any pending lawsuits, litigation regarding child support or if Dr. Murray's properties were in foreclosure. Jorrie conceded she could've searched Dr. Murray in Lexis. "I definitely said he (Murray) appears to be successful," Jorrie said about her conversation with Randy Phillips.

Jorrie testified she told AEG Live Chief Executive Randy Phillips that Murray was successful, based on a 10-minute Google search and a conversation in which the doctor told her his four clinics were grossing $1 million a month. She testified that her Internet research turned up one clinic in Nevada and another in Texas.She didn’t discover that Murray was actually deeply in debt. Under questioning by Brian Panish, the Jackson family attorney, she said she hadn’t checked to see if his house was in foreclosure or if he owed child support. “I could have,” Jorrie said. (LATimes)

Panish: And you determined Dr. Murray was successful based on 2 clinics?
Jorrie: No, it was based on my conversation with him and verifying the fact that he was licensed to practice medicine in 4 states.
Panish: Did you tell Phillips Dr. Murray made a million dollars a month?
Jorrie: I think I told him he (doctor) appeared to be successful and may have told him about his practices making a million dollars a month.
Panish: Your successful assessment was based on what Murray told you?
Jorrie: Yes
P: You verified licenses, googled him for 10 mins?
J: Yes

Panish asked Jorrie if Dr. Murray had to shut down his practice in order to work for MJ. She said no. Panish: Dr. Murray could keep, sell or have someone else run his practices as to retain the $12 million/year revenue? Jorrie: Yes

Jorrie never communicated with anyone representing Michael Jackson regarding Dr. Murray's contract. She did not send MJ or his reps any draft of the agreement, but sent them to Shawn Trell at AEG. Dr. Murray called Jorrie on June 23, 2009 and told her he spoke with MJ about extending the end of the contract to March. Dr. Murray would receive salary for 3 months plus without working, since the tour would be off, Jorrie said. Panish asked if Jorrie checked with anyone in MJ's camp whether the artist had indeed approved the extension of the contract. She said no. "I did not check anything with MJ's representatives about Dr. Murray's contract," Jorrie testified. Jorrie sent the last version to Murray on June 23, 2009. All versions said 4.1- Perform the Services reasonably requested by Producer.

Jorrie's files:
Murray Agreement 6-15-09
Revised MJ/AEG/GCA Holdings Agreement 6-18-09
Final MJ-AEG-GCA Holdings Agreement/Dr Murray 6-23-09

Panish concluded cross examination.


AEG redirect

Jessica Stebbins Bina did re-direct of Jorrie.

Jorrie said the names of the files included all signatories of contract. "Because it was for Michael Jackson's physician," Jorrie explained

Jorrie said she values the relationship with AEG, but that does not prevent her from testifying in a truthful manner. Bina asked about the time Jorrie represented Gongaware and Meglen. She said it was a lawsuit filed by the children of Tom Hulett against AEG Live, Paul Gongaware and John Meglen. Panish's old firm represented the children, Jorrie said. It was a trademark infringement case. Jorrie said plaintiffs claimed they were using Concerts West name without permission. "We prevailed in all counts," Jorrie said. Jorrie: My clients received the judgment. It was appealed and the judgment in favor of my clients was affirmed.

"The tour agreement had a potential to be a world tour" Jorrie said. "In order for tour to continue beyond London, the parties had to agree". "Michael Jackson could've chosen not to approve the itinerary," Jorrie said. Jorrie told LAPD detective that the agreement had potential to be extended to a world tour, based on mutually-approved itinerary.

Bina asked about paragraph 11 of MJ's contract, which talked about "Approvals." It says no party can withhold approval unreasonably. Contract Section 8.2 -- Production cost. Initial production advance not to exceed $7.5 million.

Bina: Based on that provision, if they request them (costs), they are responsible for them?
Jorrie: Yes

Jorrie explained, based on the contract, AEG was to recoup all costs incurred for production. Outstanding balance was MJ's responsibility.

Bina showed the document Tohme Tohme signed approving the costs of production. Jorrie said John Branca requested a meeting on June 28, 2009 to discuss several issues, among which how to unravel the tour. Branca was named executor of MJ's estate, had to be approved by probate court.


Jorrie is ordered to be on call to conclude her testimony

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 65 – August 8 2013 – Summary

Source: ABC7 unless otherwise indicated.

Katherine Jackson is in court.

The judge started out by asking attorneys for a time estimate on the case. Superior Court Judge Yvette Palazuelos said she felt she needed to give the jurors an update on how long they'd be here. AEG Live's lawyers said they hoped to be done with the defense case in early September. There are a lot of witnesses that still need to be called, though, and lots of days the court won’t be in session in late Aug, early Sept. There could also be a rebuttal case, which Panish said would probably currently be about 4 witnesses. There's also closing statements. When the jury came in, Judge Yvette Palazuelos told them her estimate had changed and she thought they’d get the case by the end of Sept. “You can write me a note if that presents a problem,” the judge said. She noted that one juror has already said she needed to be done in August (AP)

Jury entered the courtroom 10:10 am PT. Judge Yvette Palazuelos advised jurors she came up with new time estimate for the trial. Judge: My estimate has now changed. The case will probably be submitted to you at the end of September. "It is what it is," judge said. She told jurors before they would get the case at the end of August. Outside the presence of the jury, AEG attorney told judge he will be done 1st week of Sept or so. Panish said he has 4 rebuttal witnesses.


Kenny Ortega Testimony

AEG cross

Putnam showed Ortega a "Certificate of Employment -- Loan-Out," which Ortega said it's certificate that he works for The K.O. Company, Inc. AEG Live had an agreement with K.O. Company for the services of Ortega. Putnam: Did you understand you were an employee of AEG Live? Ortega: No P: What were you employee of? O: K.O. Company. "I was only contracted, and we were only focused, on the London tour at this time," Ortega explained. Ortega's contract was executed on April 26, 2009. "I believe I was paid in advance of signing," Ortega said. In his deposition, Ortega was shown documents to refresh his recollection. Putnam showed him the same documents. Ortega looked at the document and said he was paid on May 11, 2009, which is after he signed his contract. Putnam: You were paid after the contract was executed, right? Ortega: That's what appears in this document. Ortega said he has put himself in the position of working prior to signing a contract. "It's what I call working in good faith." "It's sort of common in the industry," Ortega said. Putnam: If you don't reach an agreement, you could work and not get paid? Ortega: Yes. "I can recall specifically, but I'm sure in my 40-something years in this business that has occurred," Ortega testified.

In Ortega's contract, there is a provision for bonus in case "This Is It" tour went around the world. "The shows were not booked or guaranteed," Ortega said. "That's what I think Michael hoped to do, but wasn't booked." Putnam: If tour was successful, you already have in your agreement what you'd be paid in bonus, correct? Ortega: That's what I understand it's in my contract

Ortega's contract does not have a signature line for Michael Jackson. Putnam read Murray's contract were it says the contract is not valid unless MJ consented to it and asked if Ortega has that in his contract. Ortega went thru all the pages of his contract and said: "I do not see that anywhere."

Putnam: Did you consider it a tour? Ortega: We called it tour, term used in the industry, but we weren't really touring, it was 1 venue. "People were calling it a tour but it was more like an event," Ortega explained.

"He told me he only wanted me," Ortega said about Michael Jackson's wished that he be the director. Putnam: Is it fair to say you were the "TII" director because of MJ? Ortega: Yes. Ortega said he doesn't remember who he said reached out to him first regarding the tour in his deposition. Putnam showed Ortega's deposition transcript. "In deposition, I remember it to be Dr. Tohme," Ortega said. In a deposition related to Lloyds of London litigation, Ortega also said Dr. Tohme first reached out to him regarding TII. In Dr. Murray's criminal trial, Ortega said it was Paul Gongaware. Putnam: Do you remember as you sit here today who first contacted you? Ortega: I'm not really certain. Ortega said he didn't really know who Dr. Tohme was, have never met the guy at that point. Tohme said he called on behalf of MJ.

Ortega testified he never really fully understand Dr. Tohme's role related to MJ. He thought was a friend. Regardless of who contacted him first, Ortega said he was hired because Michael Jackson wanted him.

Ortega said AEG Live and MJ were co-producers of the show. Ortega said he reported to Michael Jackson for the creative side of the tour and regarding budget/financial matters he reported to Gongaware. Ortega explained he dealt with Gongaware regarding technical things, like moving dates to new rehearsal venue, delivery of stage parts, etc. Ortega would discuss with Michael about hiring someone and the director would go to Gongaware to get the contract drawn and the person hired. Ortega did not discuss with Gongaware anything related to creative matters. "Because the creative person was Michael, and myself," Ortega explained. "We talked about these things together and I'd go with Michael's blessing to Paul to begin the process," Ortega explained. "I'd go and say 'this is what we'd like,'" Ortega said. Putnam: Did he ever tell you you couldn't get something? Ortega: No. "He would just make it happen," Ortega said. He could not recall Gongaware denying anything. "Final say would be Michael," Ortega said. "Michael had final creative say." Putnam: Why? Ortega: Because he was brilliant and he knew what he was doing. "At the end of the day, creatively, we trusted Michael knew what we needed," Ortega said.

Ortega said February, March and April MJ was very involved in the creation of the show, would show up a lot. "A lot meaning 3-4 times a week," Ortega clarified. He said things changed as they were moving to the Forum, which was end of May.

Putnam: Who did you consider your boss? Ortega: Michael. Ortega: I thought of MJ as my partner, I didn't think of him as my boss. But MJ always had the final creative say in all the years we worked.

Putnam: Did you ever see AEG pressure Michael in any way? Ortega: No Putnam: Did you feel AEG Live supported MJ? Ortega: Yes . Ortega: Everything we brought to AEG, in terms of enormous creative needs, that AEG was very supportive in doing all they could. Ortega said he would ask Gongaware for more and more things to create the show. Gongaware never denied anything. He said there were professional discussions like 'is this something you really feel it's going to benefit,' 'do you really need this.' Ortega: I think we were getting in a place were we had a ceiling, because we were already with a fat budget. Ortega: But at the end, I believe they thought Michael had what he wanted.

Ortega said he learned from Randy Phillips that Dr. Murray was responsible to get MJ to rehearsals on June 15, 2009. He explained he didn't think Phillips was involved as much in MJ's scheduling, but was overseeing it. Ortega said he never spoke with Timm Wooley about scheduling. "I looked at Mr. Phillips as the promoter, Michael's promoter and producing partner," Ortega testified. Ortega: In this stage of the game, Mr. Phillips took on overseeing position to make sure the schedule was responsible for Michael. Ortega: I think they were trying to create a schedule to factor in all of Michael's needs (like family) and still could come to rehearsal.

Putnam asked about June 19, 2009. "I'll always remember June 19," Ortega said. Putnam asked if Ortega testified before he thought MJ had a really bad case of flu. "I supposed I might have suggested it could look that way," Ortega said. "It would've been a really, really bad flu." Putnam asked if throughout the night on June 19th, if MJ got better. Ortega said yes. Putnam: He was coherent? Ortega: Yes P: Warmed up? O: A bit P: More engaged? O: Yes P: Calm? O: Yes. "I felt somewhat calm when we left," Ortega said. But he said he was still concerned, thus the email he sent to AEG high ups. Ortega: It didn't appear to me it was drugs, it appeared to me it was something else, emotional. Putnam: It never crossed your mind it could be drug related? Ortega: No, I was thinking it was something else. Putnam: You have never seen Mr. Jackson like that before? Ortega: No.

Ortega sent an email after seeing MJ that way because he thought Phillips and Gongaware should know about it. There was a meeting scheduled next day to address MJ's problems on June 19. Ortega said he thought it was a responsible way to deal with it, and pretty immediate after the fact. At the meeting, Dr. Murray told Ortega to stay out of it and to leave MJ's health for him to take care. Dr. Murray told Ortega to quit being an amateur doctor and that MJ was physically fit to show, the director recalled. Putnam: MJ assured you that he was fine? Ortega: I didn't feel assured. Ortega: He said don't leave me, I'm gonna take the reins, you'll see I'm going to change this. He seemed absolutely committed at that point. Ortega: Murray started up saying I had no right to not allow Michael to rehearse that night and that I had no right to send him home. Ortega testified he said: 'Wait a minute, that's not at all what happened.' The director recalled Dr. Murray said MJ told him that. Ortega: I looked at Michael and asked him to tell what had happened, that I didn't forbid Michael of anything. Ortega said, at one point, MJ told him he was going home. "I said yes, go home, tuck your children in, feel better," Ortega described. Ortega: I did think it was right he didn't rehearse that night, I did think it was the right thing he went home. Ortega said Dr. Murray told him to be the director and to quit his concerns with Michael Jackson's health because it was not his job. Ortega: I'd like to think that Michael would not set me up that way, I'd like to think Dr. Murray misunderstood Michael. Ortega said Michael explained in the meeting that what Dr. Murray said was not what had occurred.

Putnam: Did you talk about drugs in that meeting?
Ortega: No
Putnam: Did he (Murray) offer any explanation of what happened to MJ the night before?
Ortega: I don't believe so.

Ortega: I worked with 10,000 people in the Olympics, how can I be responsible for everybody's health? "Adults are responsible for their own health," Ortega opined.

Putnam: Do you think MJ was being responsible with his own health?
Ortega: I didn't think he was being very responsible, but it was his responsibility, in my opinion.

(Jurors were writing vigorously at this point. Juror number 6 looked over at Katherine Jackson)

Ortega: I wanted to take care on him, you want to take care of someone when something is not right, but you can't be responsible.
Putnam: Were you responsible for MJ's health?
Ortega: No.

Someone on behalf of Michael Jackson contacted Ortega to be part of the HBO special. Ortega never asked MJ about his rehab stint or any drug use. Putnam: Did you have any reservation to work with him after rehab? Ortega: No P: Why not? "Because he came out of rehab," Ortega said. "He was moving on with his life in a healthy way, hopefully."

Putnam: Did you ever talk to him about nutrition?
Ortega: As a general idea
P: Physical therapy?
O: Yes

Ortega said he would talk to MJ, as a performing artist, and ask if he was focusing on nourishment, health, warming up, stretching, sleeping. MJ wasn't really fond of massage, Ortega said. "Don't forget to eat, get some rest," Ortega would tell MJ. The singer would smile and answer "okay" in a very loving way, Ortega recalled. Ortega said MJ liked to be in a certain kind of place (weight) to execute his moves and to get the look he wanted. "I might have been a little concerned (with his weight) when I brought that up, yes," Ortega testified.

Putnam: In your opinion, was Mr. Jackson always skinny?
Ortega: In the early years I worked with him he was light, lean performer. "He was strong," Ortega said. But 20 years later, when Ortega worked with MJ in the "This Is It," the director said MJ was much different.

Ortega's first time working with MJ was in the "Dangerous" tour. He said he may have been director of the project. It was in 1992-93. Ortega said he usually likes to stay in tour until everything is working to everybody's satisfaction. He said it may be 4-5 shows or 8-10.

Putnam: Did you have any concerns he might have been using drugs then?
Ortega: No

At this time, MJ was living at Neverland. Ortega said they never rehearsed at MJ's ranch, but a stage in Los Angeles.

Ortega was called to help MJ with the HBO special.
Putnam: He seemed well to you?
Ortega: Unhappy
Putnam: Was he physical well?
Ortega: He seemed tired and unhappy, stressed.
Putnam: But at no time you thought he was using drugs?
Ortega: No.

Ortega was present at Beacon Theater when MJ collapsed. He didn't see the artist fall, though. He said security responded quickly, everybody stayed away to give paramedics room to work. MJ was transported to the hospital. Ortega didn't go, because he said he wasn't invited. "Certainly concerned," though, he explained.

"HIStory" tour rehearsal was done in Los Angeles, Ortega said. Putnam: Did you have any concern with MJ's health?
Ortega: I don't recall having any concerns
P: How about mentally?
O: No

Putnam: Were you concerned MJ was doing drugs before "TII" in 2008?
Ortega: No, I saw him.

Ortega said he had dinner with MJ a couple of times, MJ took his children to see High School Musical, and that he looked fined. The director described MJ very excited, even not knowing yet what "TII" was going to be, but feeling exhilarated. Ortega said MJ was being approached by someone from American Idol, also Randy Phillips approached him, they wanted to do something with him. "I think seating in a theater for 5 years in Las Vegas wasn't really attractive to him," Ortega explained. "Michael wanted to get out on the road," Ortega said. Ortega: I was happy for him, because he had been through so much, I wanted him to be the King again. Ortega: I think the arrival of his children in his life brought something he didn't have before. "He seemed exhilarated, excited, like the Michael I always knew," Ortega described. Ortega: He was unbelievable! His reasons for doing the tour were incredible. He was motivated.

Ortega said the meeting on June 20th was at MJ's Carolwood home. On June 23rd, Ortega testified MJ was in great spirits, ready to work. Putnam: Completely different?
Ortega: Completely. Ortega: He seemed healthy, ready and happy, there didn't seem to be any left over issues from the 19th. Ortega said MJ was always a little chill, but not like on the 19th. The director was surprised how quickly MJ got better. "It was like metamorphosis," he said. Putnam asked if Ortega inquired MJ what had happened. "I didn’t pry in his personal life," he replied. Putnam: How was the rehearsal? Ortega: Great. It was one of the best rehearsals we had up until then. MJ was there a number of hours, Ortega said. He went thru a number of songs. Putnam: Had he taken the reins? Ortega: Yeah. Ortega: He was in charge. Not only capable to rehearsing but to talk about other aspects of production, like films, the effects, costumes. Ortega said he just embraced it and went with it. "We were all delighted" Ortega recalled. "The energy in the room changed, hope returned" Ortega: Everybody felt there was a different Michael in the room. Ortega said MJ was almost as good on the 24th as the 23rd. He seemed a little tired from the day before but talked about things for the show. MJ also rehearsed and performed. Ortega said he was feeling they were back on track, believing they were in a new chapter. Ortega felt less excited, deeply grateful about MJ's come back. "Maybe it was a lot of rest," Ortega opined. "He did seem rested, stronger"

Putnam: Did you have concern on the 23rd or 24th he was taking drugs?
Ortega: No.

Ortega said said excitement was pretty unanimous among all the people working on "This Is It."


Jackson redirect


In re-direct, Panish asked: Prior to June 23rd, you thought Michael got real organic sleep?
Ortega: Yes. Panish: And before that you thought he was not having any sleep? Ortega: Yes. Panish: The symptoms he had, did it seem like someone who wasn't sleeping? Ortega: I think that might have been a factor there. Panish asked Ortega to assume MJ was getting Propofol for 60 days then didn't have Propofol the last few days before his death. Ortega: I assumed sleep had to be a part of it, he looked rested.

Panish asked is Ortega saw MJ several times appearing under some kind of drugs during TII. Ortega: It seemed like it was doctor related, so it wasn't like taking drugs but just being under the influence.

Panish: In all your years in the industry, have you ever heard a producer involved in hiring a doctor for an artist?
Ortega: I haven't.

Ortega said he thinks it's unusual for producers to engage attorneys to hire a doctor for an artist. Ortega clarifies that the only artist, "the" artist, was Michael Jackson.

Panish asked if MJ could've been fired by AEG. "No, he was a partner," Ortega responded. He said Michael told him that. Panish: The producer could fire you if they wanted, right? Ortega: I think Michael would not be happy with that. "I assume they could give a good try," Ortega responded. "I assume they could do that but I doubt it would last more than 24 hours." "I don't think producers can fire Tom Cruise," Ortega opined. Panish said movies are different from singers. "I don't think producers can fire Cher," Ortega said.

Panish: Were you ever involved in a show where promoter was buying CPR machine?
Ortega: Not that I know of.
Panish: Were you ever involved in a show where promoter was buying saline, catheter, needles for a doctor?
Ortega: No.

Email from Woolley to Bob Taylor saying Randy Phillips and Dr. Murray were responsible for MJ rehearsal and attendance schedule. "I recalled that Dr. Murray was going to be responsible for the schedule," Ortega said. Earlier in the trial, Ortega testified rehearsal schedule and attendance was up to Dr. Murray and Randy Phillips.

Ortega said, at one point, there was a standstill regarding his contract. Email from Gongaware to Ortega on March 25, 2009: I'm afraid we may not be able to meet your financial requirements for a deal.

Panish: Are you aware of any artist in the world with the drawing power of Michael Jackson? Ortega: I'd think if done right, that Michael would be the highest draw on the planet. Panish: You don't thinkCeline Dion would be bigger? Ortega: I think the Stones come close, McCartney come close. But if MJ was not the number one, he was very close. "He sold 50 shows," Ortega said. "Pretty awesome, historical."

Ortega said he disagrees with anyone who says there's no way MJ could've done 50 shows.

Panish: Did you ever have assistant producer say she was afraid an artist would die in weeks of a show and they actually did die?
Ortega: No
"Yes, he did change over time," Ortega said about Michael Jackson.

Panish: Was MJ perfectionist?
Ortega: That would be something that people would have called him. Ortega: Most of us have never seen anyone work as hard to accomplish something as MJ.

Ortega said he didn't see MJ at practice for a long period of time in June. Panish: In June, he didn't show at all? Ortega: That's correct. "It was fairly obvious he was not moving forward in the rehearsals with this sort of tempo," Ortega testified.
Panish: Did you have concerns about his physical condition on June 14?
Ortega: I'd say yes.
Panish: Sir, did you tell anyone that MJ should've been taken to the hospital?
Ortega: I might have.
Panish: Did you say that after MJ died?
Ortega: No, I think I'd have said it sooner than that.
Ortega suggested another physician, not Murray, come to check MJ out.
Panish: You didn't think Dr Murray was doing a good job?
Ortega: No
Panish: Did you think MJ was irresponsible?
Ortega: It seemed to me that he was in trouble.

Ortega: MJ was very cool, bold, strong in his ideas and what he wanted all through the beginning of the process. "Eventually he started to decline and disappear," Ortega recalled.

Panish: I want you to assume that AEG Live hired Dr. Murray. Would you expect them to hire a fit and competent doctor?
Ortega: Yes.
Panish: You expect AEG to check them out, not being under conflict of interest situation?
Ortega: Yes.

Panish asked if Ortega was doing his job when he sent email w/ concerns. "More than just doing my job, looking out for my friend" he said.

Ortega said Dr. Murray did not have the same mindset as him in the June 20th meeting. Phillips didn't do anything to stop Dr. Murray's admonishment of Ortega in the meeting, Panish said. Ortega agreed. Panish: Did you ever learn that Phillips was grabbing Dr. Murray's arm? Ortega: I never heard that. Panish asked if Ortega knew how much pressure AEG was putting MJ and Dr. Murray on. He said no. Panish: Did you heard Murray walked out and said he couldn't take this s**t anymore? Ortega: No, I never heard that. Ortega then opined: If Michael ever heard you talk like that it would not be appropriate. Isn't that right Mrs. Jackson? Katherine Jackson nodded in the audience in agreement. "In respect of why we are all here for, that's not nice," Ortega said on the stand.

Ortega said he never told Faye MJ had to face his fears; used the word tough love, may have said the show could be cancelled if not ready.


AEG recross

Putnam did re-cross.

Ortega: Michael had not performed in 10 years. Whether he'd command the world like he had before remained to be seen. "However, the sell out at the O2 for 50 shows showed he still had drawing power," Ortega opined.

Putnam: Did you see Michael deteriorate over 8 weeks?
Ortega: I would've not used the word deteriorate to describe what I saw.

The week of June 15th is when Ortega grew concerned with Michael Jackson. Ortega said nobody came up to him on the 23rd or 24th expressing concern about MJ. They did on the 19th but not after MJ came back on 23rd.

Putnam: Would it be surprising to you that the Rolling Stones have a doctor on tour with them right now?
Ortega: No.
Putnam: You just don't know some of those things, right?
Ortega: Yes.

Putnam: Have you ever worked on a tour where an artist was $400 million in debt?
Ortega: Not to my knowledge.
Putnam: Have you ever worked on a tour where the artist could not afford his daily expenses?
Ortega: I don't believe so.
Putnam: Have you ever worked on a tour where the promoter/producer was advancing all daily expenses?
Ortega: It's possible, I don't know.
Putnam: Have you ever worked on a tour where artist was unable to pay his personal doctor?
Ortega: I don't think so, assumption on my part.

Putnam: Who introduced you to Dr. Murray?
Ortega: Michael
P: Did AEG introduce you to him?
O: No
P: What did MJ say?
O: This is my doctor.

Putnam asked if AEG checked if the doctor was licensed and if he had been disciplined, if it was responsible thing to do. Ortega said yes. Putnam: If they weren't hiring Dr. Murray, would that responsibility be above and beyond anything they needed to do, in your mind? Ortega: I think that would've been responsible.

Putnam: Did Mr. Phillips ever tell you he wanted MJ to come on tour?
Ortega: No


Jackson redirect


In re-re-direct Panish: Would it be responsible to place a doctor in a conflict of interest had they hired him?
Ortega: In my opinion, no


AEG recross

Putnam in re-re-cross asked if it's common practice to check a doctor's credit report prior to hiring him. "I wouldn't think it would be something that would be the norm," Ortega responded.

Putnam: Do you think it's responsible for a studio to hire Kenny Ortega if he were in debt? Ortega: I've been there and they hired me. Putnam asked if being in debt diminishes your capability. "I don't think so," Ortega responded. Ortega: Being in debt doesn't change your talent, your gift, your ability.


Jackson redirect

Panish in re-re-re-direct: Do you have access to a prescription pad?
Ortega: No

-----------------------------------------

Putnam and Panish took turns in asking out-of-the-ordinary questions regarding responsibility to Ortega. Jurors were laughing out loud with the exchange between the attorneys. The director kept his composure and responded to all questions. Ortega was dismissed, subject to recall in AEG's case in chief. When the director got up, all jurors clapped for him. He thanked the jurors, kissed Mrs. Jackson, shook hands with Shawn Trell and left.

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 66 – August 9 2013 – Summary

Katherine Jackson is not present in court.

Source : ABC7 unless otherwise indicated


Kathy Jorrie Testimony


AEG redirect

Kathy Jorrie is back on the stand. Jessica Stebbins Bina resumed re-direct examination. Bina showed Jorrie MJ's contract. Paragraph 13: Artistco hereby represents/warrants that Artist does not posses any known health condition injuries or ailments that would reasonably be expected to interfers with Artist's first class performance.

Bina: Who signed this?
Jorrie: Michael Jackson.
Bina: So MJ represented that he did not have any health condition that would interfere with his performance?
Jorrie: I never had any information that MJ was not in good health.
Bina: Drug problems?
J: None whatsoever
Bina: Insomnia or sleep problems?
Jorrie: Not in the least.

Bina asked if Jorrie believed Tohme was an officer of MJ company. She said yes. Bina: Did Mr. Panish show any documents that he was not an officer? Jorrie: He did not. Regarding the email Dennis Hawk, MJ's attorney, sent Jorrie on January 14, 2009, she said they wanted to replace the name of MJ's company. Bina: Before Jun 28 you had been told Tohme was an officer of the MJ's company? Jorrie: Yes. It's usually the type of representation she gets. Bina asked if Jorrie was told on June 28, 2009 that Dr. Tohme was an officer of MJ's company when he received the consent document. Jorrie: That's my best recollection, I was informed that he was an officer of Michael Jackson's company. Jorrie said Tohme himself represented to her he was an officer of MJJ's company.

Jorrie said the meeting on June 28, 2009 was called by John Branca, co-executor of MJ's Estate, co-executor John McClain was on the phone. She said Frank DiLeo and various AEG reps were also present at the meeting and Tohme was there speaking about things having to do with MJ. "Dr. Tohme was there discussing MJ's business in front of everybody," Jorrie testified. "Nobody challenged Dr. Tohme or his presence." Jorrie said Dr. Tohme signed this document. She said she has seen Frank DiLeo's signature as well approving the expenses. Jorrie: I'm aware that the Estate reimbursed some costs. Bina asked if Weitzman told her Tohme had been fired but nevertheless the Estate agreed to reimburse AEG for production costs. Jorrie: Correct

Bina asked if Woolley forwarded Jorrie an email saying Dr. Murray was fully engaged in Mr. Jackson's treatment in May. She said no.

Bina: Did it surprise you Dr. Murray was fully engaged and treating MJ in May 2009?
Jorrie: No.
Bina: Why not?
Jorrie: Because I understood from Murray that he was MJ's personal physician for 3 yrs
B: Did Murray tell you that?
J: He did

Bina asked if Jorrie told Dr. Murray to stop treating MJ until they had an agreement. She said no. Jorrie: The reason is that Dr. Murray was Mr. Jackson's physician and it would not be my place to tell him not to provide services. Jorrie said MJ had been his patient for many years.

Bina: Did Dr. Murray need an agreement with AEG Live to treat patients?
Jorrie: No, he did not need an agreement from AEG Live to perform services to his patients, including Michael Jackson.

Jorrie read graph 9 of the contract, "Artist Consent." It says that without the express written consent of MJ the contract was not valid. Jorrie: This is an independent contract agreement. Dr. Murray was MJ's physicians, retained to and in the expense of the artist.

Bina: You didn't put any provision for Dr. Murray to be supervised by AEG Live?
Jorrie: Of course not.
Bina: Are there any words in agreement that says Murray can only use medical equip approved, bought by AEG?
Jorrie: There's no such wording. Jorrie said there was also no word about Dr. Murray having to use only equipment provided by AEG to treat Michael Jackson.
Bina: Did Dr. Murray ever ask you for any equipment?
Jorrie: No

Bina asked about end date of contract. Original date was Sept. 2009, but Dr. Murray asked it to be changed to March 2010, Jorrie said. Bina asked Jorrie why she didn't check with MJ or his reps about changing the end date of the contract. Jorrie explained they were negotiating a contract to a place where Dr. Murray was happy with the agreement. She said it would then be presented to MJ and his representatives for approval.

Bina: Did you ever send the signed agreement to MJ?
Jorrie: No, I didn't.
B: Why not?
J: Michael Jackson passed away.

Jorrie used as template an independent contract agreement used in the King Tut exhibition. It was between an individual and affiliate of AEG. There is no mention of artist consent in that contract, it was not a service to an artist. Jorrie said she took out the conflict provisions because they dealt with conflict of interest for the individual working for a competitor. She said that provision was no applicable to Murray. Jorrie also took out provision "Intellectual Property" since it was not applicable also.

Bina asked if Jorrie's understanding was that Dr. Murray was making one million dollars a month. She said he understood his medical practice brought in a million dollars, from which he had to pay his expenses, nurses, medical equipments.

Jorrie said from the conversation she had with Dr. Murray she did not understand he was going to close his medical practices to go on tour. "He told me he was leaving the practices to go on tour with MJ," Jorrie explained. Dr. Murray never told her he was closing his practices.

Jorrie found that there were two places of businesses associated with Dr. Murray and his medical licenses. Jorrie: I found Dr. Murray was licensed to practice medicine in 4 states, no disciplinary action against him in any state. The clinics she found were in Nevada and Texas, Jorrie said. "The 2 places of businesses that I assumed were clinics." Jorrie: It was just spot check, I checked his medical licenses, there were no disciplinary actions, company was legit, everything matched. "I had no reason to doubt the information given to me was incorrect," Jorrie said. "There were no red flags." Jorrie: I didn't think it was my place to check Michael Jackson's physician, who he had for many years.


Jackson recross

Panish then did re-cross of Jorrie.

Jorrie said GCA Holdings was a legitimate company, its license had not be suspended. Panish: Did you bill AEG for the research you did? Jorrie: It was 10 minutes of research and it was part of preparation of Murray's contract. Jorrie explained she would not have entered into the invoice a spot check of Dr. Murray's licenses/company. Panish: Does your time entry has anything about check you did on Murray? Jorrie said she needs to look at the documents to refresh memory.

Jorrie said a red flag is when things come up that alerts her to evaluate further. Panish: There were no red flags raised in the 10-minute search you did on Dr. Murray, correct? Jorrie: That's correct. Jorrie said she was checking to make sure the information Dr. Murray gave her were correct.

Panish: Did you ever do a google search for Michael Jackson Company? Jorrie: No. Jorrie said she went on to the Delaware Secretary of the State website to check Michael Jackson's company. Panish: MJ's company was a sole member LLC, wasn't it? Jorrie: That I don't recall when I looked at it. Jorrie said she believes she has a copy of the Delaware Secretary of the State of when she checked MJ's company. Panish: Did you bill your client for that work? Jorrie: I don't recall, I have to look at the time and see whether or not I billed them. Jorrie said she never received any document from Shawn Trell stating anyone else as officer of Michael Jackson's company. Panish: Did you ever contact Delaware Secretary of State to see if Dr. Tohme was an officer of MJ LLC? Jorrie: No. Jorrie did not contract John Branca, co-executor to be, to check if Dr. Tohme was an officer of MJ's LLC.

Jorrie said Mr. Tohme did not sign the consent document in her presence. She gave him the document for review.
Panish: Were you aware Dr. Tohme was supposed to get paid $200,000 for signing this document?
Jorrie: I wasn't aware, sir.
Panish: Were you aware the budget called to pay Dr. Murray $450,000?
Jorrie: I was not aware, sir.

Jorrie said the budget had to be approved prior to any payment. She testified she never asked Branca if Tohme was officer of MJ's company.


Jorrie said she saw Dr. Murray was licensed for cardiovascular something. He was also licensed in internal medicine. Panish asked if there's such a things as cardiovascular license. "I told you what I remember seeing," Jorrie explained. Panish: Did you see his internal medicine license had lapsed in 2008? Jorrie: No, I don't remember seeing it. Panish: Is your testimony that Dr. Murray was licensed in internal medicine and cardiovascular? Jorrie: It's my testimony under oath that's what I saw 4 years ago, yes.

Jorrie said she told Dr. Murray he would get paid once the contract was fully executed. Jorrie sent all drafts of the contract to Trell and AEG, but never sent them to Michael Jackson or his representatives. This was the 1st time Jorrie negotiated a contract for an artist's physician. She never researched about third party contract for artist/doc

Jorrie said she did not go out of her way to check Dr. Murray's credit report, debts, outstanding child support claims. Panish asked if Jorrie was copied on any of the chain email "Trouble at the Front." She said she was not. Jorrie said the only medical check she's aware of that Michael Jackson underwent was for the insurance company.

Jorrie said Howard Weitzman may have told her about the dispute in termination of Dr. Tohme.


AEG redirect

In re-re-direct, Bina asked: Why didn't you ask John Branca if Dr. Tohme was officer of the company? Jorrie said Branca was a co-executor to be and she believed he would not know the answer. He had been MJ's attorney for a week. Jorrie thought Dr. Tohme would be the most appropriate to ask whether he was an officer of MJ's company or not.

Bina: Did u think there was conflict of interest in the contract? "I believe that there wasn't contractual conflict of interest" Jorrie said Jorrie explained MJ and Dr. Murray's interests were aligned, to treat him and keep him healthy while performing at the O2 arena.


Jackson recross

In re-re-cross, Panish asked if Jorrie has expertise in medical conflict of interest. She said she's not an expert in medical conflict.

Jorrie said she read that Branca represented MJ about 10 years before.

Panish: AEG didn't have to have a contract with Dr. Murray, right?
Jorrie: It was an accommodation, sir.
Panish asked if there was anything preventing AEG from preparing the contract with Dr. Murray and giving it to MJ. She said no.


AEG redirect

In re-re-re-direct, Bina asked if MJ specifically asked AEG to draft the contract for Dr. Murray and advance funds necessary?
Jorrie: Yes


Jackson recross

in re-re-re-cross, Panish rebutted: And AEG could've refused it, right?
Jorrie: Yes

Randy Jackson Video Deposition

A jury heard videotaped testimony Randy Jackson, who described more than half a dozen interventions his family attempted to try to get Michael Jackson to stop taking prescription medications. Randy Jackson, the pop superstar’s younger brother, said several of his siblings were involved in the efforts, and they occasionally brought interventionist doctors to try to convince their brother to go into rehab. The superstar always refused and kept his family at a distance in the final years of his life, Randy Jackson said. Randy Jackson says the interventions took place in diverse locations including New York, Las Vegas, Jackson’s Neverland Ranch and Taiwan and dated back to the mid-1990s. However, he said he did not talk to his brother much in the five years before his death and was unable to get into his rented mansion during the period before he died because security guards blocked his access. “Michael didn’t want to be around the family too much because he didn’t want them to see him like that,” Randy Jackson said. “He was hiding from me.” He said most of the interventions were attended by his sisters Rebbie and Janet and his brothers, Tito, Marlon, and his father, Joe Jackson. But he said his mother only came along once or twice. He said she was unwilling to accept that Michael was addicted and he felt “she was in denial. She just didn’t want to believe.” Randy Jackson said his brother was terrified during the run-up to his 2005 child molestation trial in Santa Maria. At one point Randy Jackson said he had to take his brother to a hospital because “he was under the influence of something.” He said he had no idea what drugs Jackson was taking. “He was very frightened, and I had to get him to court,” Randy Jackson said. (AP)

He said almost every time he tried to intercede it was after a call from a nanny who cared for Michael Jackson’s children and told him the singer was over using prescription drugs. He said he never saw his brother take drugs but twice saw him in a condition where he was slurring his speech. He said he later fired the nanny after he encountered her at a pharmacy picking up prescriptions for the singer. Randy Jackson said he never heard of the drug Propofol until after his brother died from an overdose of the anesthetic. Randy Jackson also testified that at one point he wrote a letter to his entire family, including his mother, saying they needed to help Michael. “He’s an addict, and he isn’t responsible. The family has to step in and do something about it,” Jackson testified.He also said his brother refused repeatedly to go to rehab. “I told him I was taking him to rehab and he said he’s not going. I told him, ‘Yes, you are.’ And he would say ‘No, I’m not,’” Randy testified. (CBSLA)

Michael Jackson suffered a secret near-overdose in Beverly Hills in 2005 and deflected more than a half-dozen drug interventions staged by his concerned relatives, a Los Angeles jury heard Friday. The near overdose, meanwhile, came after the trial at a house in Beverly Hills called Shadow Wood, according to the video testimony. Randy Jackson said Rwaramba called him in a panic after Jackson purportedly took too much of a prescription obtained in her name. He said Jackson was out of it and talking in "slurred speech" while his kids and guests were inside the residence. "He was certainly under the influence of something that was altering his normal way of functioning," Randy Jackson recalled. The brother said he confiscated all the drugs he could find and was downstairs getting something to eat when he heard Jackson had "collapsed."Randy Jackson also testified that his family staged at least 10 interventions to try and get the pop star off various addictive prescription drugs. Randy Jackson said he picked his brother up off the floor, put him on a bed and raced around the corner to get a doctor. He said the doctor gave Jackson something to "counter" the effects of the overdose and said not to leave the pop icon's side. "Somebody should sleep next to him, make sure he doesn't vomit or choke, anything like that," the doctor said, according to Randy Jackson. He recalled as many as 10 attempted interventions with Jackson that started in Taiwan during one of the singer's tours and also included an intervention in a New York hotel in 2000, about "four or five" surprise trips to Neverland Ranch and an attempt at Jackson's Las Vegas residence after the 2005 trial. Randy Jackson said he even wrote a letter to all his family members explaining his concern that his brother was an addict. "I copied everybody on it. Everyone. I made sure everybody knew it. I would say he has — he's an addict, and at this point, addicts aren't so responsible for what they do," he said. He said it was "upsetting" to him that Rwaramba seemed to be supplying drugs to his brother and then calling him to pick up the pieces. He said he would race to pharmacies to confront her over her actions. Randy Jackson said his brother didn't like the interference and would "isolate" himself, especially during the last year of his life. "I wasn't afraid to say no to him. So he would really -- he would, like, get physical with me because — and I wouldn't be afraid to say no to him. But he's like 90 pounds, so it wouldn't do much," Randy Jackson with a laugh. Asked if his mom believed Jackson had a problem, Randy Jackson said she was "in denial." "She didn't want to believe it," he said. He said Jackson knew how to "sweet talk" his mom. (NYDailyNews)

First deposition was on Nov 6, 2012.

Q: Do you know Grace Rwamba?
A:Yes, and fired her too.
Q: Why?
A: Because he asked me to.
Q: Your brother Michael did?
A: Yes
The attorneys stipulated the firing occurred in 2004/2005.

Randy said he and Michael were pretty close, since they were close in age. Randy said he doesn’t remember when it was the last time he spoke with MJ. He said MJ was traveling.
Q: Did you call him in 2009?
A: I don’t remember
Q: Did you see him in 2009?
A: I don’t remember

Randy said Frank Dileo was MJ’s manager. “From what I understand until my brother passed,” he explained. There was a time he was the manager, then not manager, then manager again, Randy said.

Q: Your brother didn’t want to see you and you went to see him?
A: Yes
Q: Couple occasions?
A: Yes, 3 or 4 times
I wanted to make sure he was ok, Randy testified.

MJ’s brother said one intervention was in Vegas, then in NY then LA. Randy remembered 3 times and intervention being attempted. Because I had received call that he had been abusing prescription drugs, Randy said. Grace called him, he’s sure if she called anyone else. Randy said it was around the time of the trial, doesn’t know if before or after, not sure. MJ was staying in Vegas. Randy said he went there with Jackie, Rebbie, maybe Janet, maybe Marlon. Randy said he spoken with Grace, the other siblings spoke with her too. “We may have had a conference call.”

Q: Have you ever believed MJ was abusing prescription drugs before?
A: Yes.

Grace called Randy before about MJ using prescription drugs. He said she called him two or 3 times before. Randy confronted MJ every time Grace called him. Randy said security told him MJ didn’t want to see him. Just drive in and walked in the house. The gate was open, I just drove in walked in.

Q: Did you see MJ?
A: Yes. I told him him I was taking him to rehab,” Randy said. “He said he was not going. I said you are, he said I’m not
MJ didn’t go to rehab. Randy said the other siblings told MJ the same thing, to go to rehab.
Q: Did he admit having a problem?
A: No
Q: Did he deny he had a problem with prescription drugs at that time?
A: No
Q: Did he say whether or not he had a problem with prescription drugs at that time?
A: No. No he didn’t say it

They were with MJ for 2 hours. Randy said MJ told him ‘Don’t worry, I’m okay. I’m not gonna go.’
Q: Did he seem ok?
A: At the time yes
Q: Did you leave thinking he had a problem?
A: Yes
Q: When was next discussion?
A: That may have been the last time, maybe. There were prior times. It was just around the Santa Maria trial, Randy said. “It was after, I think.”
Q: Up until the time of his passing you never discussed it with him again?
A: No
Q: Why not?
A: I hadn’t gotten call from Grace or anyone

Randy said Leonard Rowe told him MJ may have prob w/ prescription drug. He guessed it was around time shows in London were being prepared. Randy: No, let me correct that. Initially we were playing on our tour, the brothers tour. There was concern then.

Q: Did you ever discuss that with your parents?
A: Yes
Q Their reaction?
A: Displeased
Q: With?
A: Him not getting the help that he needed.


Randy said he doesn’t know if the parents talked to MJ. Randy and Janet had a doctor in the mix for the Vegas intervention. He was an experienced interventionist, Randy testified.

Q: How did you know that?
A: He told me
Q: Had you met him before?
A: No. Internet, maybe
Q: Was this Mr. Webb?
A: No. I don’t recall
Q: Besides siblings and the doctor was there somebody else who went?
A: I don’t recall who the 2nd guy was. I didn’t arrange it, Janet knew

They talked to MJ while there, Randy said. He doesn’t remember specifically what was said, but that the family loved him, wanted to help. Randy said he met the interventionist doctor at Madeo for lunch, probably met doctor one time prior as well. He said he wanted to know just what they do and what is the procedure here, what they suggest. Randy discussed MJ’s stint in rehab before with the singer. Randy said he thinks it was one time that MJ was in rehab. Randy said he told the doctor there had been prior attempts to get MJ help and they weren’t successful, needed professional help. Randy discussed with the doctors the attempted interventions. Randy did not speak with the doctors again after that. Besides Michael, just security was present.

Q: You mentioned another one in NY?
A: Yes

Randy believes the NY attempt happened prior to the Vegas time. He said he was worried about MJ, about “prescription,” “prescription abuse.” Grace had called Randy each time. Janet, Rebbie and Tito were with Randy in NY. It happened in early to mid-2000. Grace called him, he called the family, other family members, Rebbie, Tito, Janet, Randy said. You need to get down here, Randy said Grace told him. She didn’t need to say anything else. “Because, my brother,” Randy explained. Randy went with family only to the NY intervention.

Q: Did he agreed to see you?
A: I guess, I just walked in.
He wouldn’t go Randy said about his attempt to take MJ to rehab.
Q: Did you tell him to go?
A: Yes
Q: Did he tell you he wouldn’t?
A: Yes

Randy doesn’t remember the details of the conversation, whether MJ admitted or not abusing prescription drugs. MJ didn’t go to rehab, Randy didn’t tell the parents, he said he didn’t want to stress them out. Randy called Grace. “She told me that he cleaned up,”

Q: How?
A: Because I was there, probably.

Randy testified the brothers just talked to him. “Just tell him that his family loves him, concerned for him.”

Q: Did he clean up after LV intervention?
A: Yes

Randy: He stopped using these things, as fas as I know, he stopped using it. I learned it from Grace, pretty much Grace. Randy doesn’t know how he cleaned up. The intervention at the Ranch occurred after NY. He got a call from Grace “You need to get down here.” Randy told siblings, Rebbie, brothers, Janet. They had another conference call. The parents were not on the call. Randy: I think my mom found out about the Grace. My family went with me, he said.

Q: Did you mom go?
A: I think so. Janet, Rebbie, no Marlon, not sure LaToya, no Jermaine, Tito maybe, Jackie
Randy said he just walked in. One the brothers went over fence to open the gate
Q: Because security won’t let you in?
A: Yes. We don’t ask

MJ didn’t want to go to rehab that time either. The brothers stayed a few hours. It was just family, no doctors.

Q: Believe your brother had problem with prescription drug?
A: Yes
Q: Did MJ deny he had a prob with prescription drugs?
A: Yes
Q: He also refused to go to rehab?
A: Yes

I didn’t believe him, Randy testified. Just leaving there all the brother talked about it, Randy said. Other family members didn’t believe him either. My mom didn’t believe it, Randy explained. “But it’s my mom, she didn’t want to believe it.”

After the Las Vegas intervention, Randy said he watched MJ clean up. He was around, it was around Santa Maria trial. He just did it and got ready for the trial, Randy explained. MJ never discuss any drug problem with Randy ever.

They were at the Ranch for 2/3 hours. Randy discussed with MJ the Ranch intervention after. I told him I wanted him to go to the therapist with me, Randy described. He said this was after Santa Maria trial, which took over things

Randy said he went to visit Frank DiLeo in the hospital after he was in a coma. He knew DiLeo for 20-30 years. Randy learned DiLeo came back as MJ’s while the O2 show was being put together.
Q: Was he a good manager?
A: Yes

Q: Did MJ talk to you about his burned scalp?
A: Yes. He said it was painful.

I went to visit him at the hospital, Randy said about MJ. He never discussed with MJ insomnia, sleeping problems.

Randy did not know about MJ taking anesthesiologists on tour. Randy said he never saw MJ take prescription drugs or illegal drugs. He never heard of propofol or diprivan prior to MJ’s death.
Q: Did your brother ever discuss taking medication to sleep?
A: No
I never got a call about illegal drugs, Randy explained.
Q: When did you first come to believe MJ had a prob with prescription drugs?
A: I guess it was Grace.

The first time was in Los Angeles, she called me, Randy said. It was around 2000, year 2000. She just told me she was concerned, Randy described. “Because he was using prescription medication too much.”

Q: What medicine?
A: Sedatives, whatever they call them, sedatives.


Randy didn’t talk to MJ about it at this point. He talked to Rebbie. “I was investigating about it, talking to people around him.” Randy: Also, as I recall, I tried calling a doctor in Vegas and a doctor in Florida, but they wouldn’t talk to me about it. Randy said he forgot the doctors’ names. He talked to doctor friends he knew about his concerns of MJ’s prescription drug abuse.

Q: Was he addicted?
A: I don’t know, I wasn’t sure, I wasn’t clear on it.
Randy: Just excessive use, maybe, I don’t know if I would call that an addict, I’m not a doctor.
Q: Did he ever tell you he had a problem with prescription drugs?
A: No.
Q: Did you ever discuss you believed your brother had a problem with prescription drugs with your mother?
A: Yes

That was after the second attempted intervention at Neverland, Randy testified, which was the same as the one his mother attended. Randy said he had a phone call with his mother, he initiated the conversation. I told her that we need to plan an intervention and that, her being a mother, because she was there.

Q: Did your mother ever tell you she believed your brother had problem w/ prescription drugs?
A: No, no, she didn’t tell me that believed


Randy said he and his father tried to call MJ while he lived at Carolwood home. “We were unsuccessful,” he said. Randy: There was a drug issue. He wasn’t eating. All of these things were happening at the same time. And, you know, a lot of pressure. Randy: Leonard Rowe was involved very much in the shows and was giving reports to me that he didn’t look too good. Randy said they were concerned about prescription abuse around the time MJ was living at the Carolwood house. Randy had already selected a rehab facility to take MJ. It was in the Bay area, San Francisco. The same place were interventionist worked

Randy said his brother didn’t drink. “I never seen him drink alcohol.”
Q: From 2000 until the time that your brother passed were there periods you believed he didn’t problem with prescription drugs?
A: Yes

Second part of the deposition was taped on March 26, 2013.

Randy said Michael enjoyed touring.
Q: Why do you say that?
A: Well, because we like to tour, perform.
Q: Did you ever see any signs he was on prescription meds on tour?
A: No.


Other than the times Randy described in the last deposition, she said saw signs MJ was on prescription medications at home. Randy said this was in 2005 at the Shadow Wood home in Beverly Hills. “He was under the influence of something.” Randy said his speech was slurred. Then Grace, his nanny, would tell me all the time, “You need to get over here. Something’s not right.” I went over to help him out and take everything away as I could, Randy testified. Grace called Randy again to come over. “She needed help with him. He wasn’t doing so well.”Randy: We had discussed this before, so I kind of knew what was going on.

Q: And what did you see when you went over there?
A: He was certainly under the influence of something that was altering his normal way of functioning. I tried to get help him some help.

Randy said he tried to take everything away, from Grace too. “It was ironic because she was giving it to him but complaining about it.” Randy said some prescription drugs were in Grace’s name. “It was upsetting to me. I think she had a hard time saying no to him.”

Q: You just looked around the house and took bottles?
A: I made her show where everything was.
Randy: Because what good would it be to help him if you’re leaving stuff there?
Randy said there wasn’t much to talk to MJ then. “Yes, I could talk to him but I’d pick my moments. I’d wait till he’d be a bit more in tune
Q: Did he tell you what he was taking specifically?
A: No
Q: Did you do anything else besides take it away?
A: I went downstairs, I think he had some friends over. And I went downstairs to eat something.

Randy: They ran downstairs and told me that he had collapsed. And I went upstairs. I picked him up, put him on the bed, it was pretty late. Randy: And as I recall, I called my doctor who lived literally around the corner. My doctor came over and took care of him, said he’ll be ok Randy said the doctor gave MJ something that would counter, help counter whatever it is he had done. Just let him rest it off. Somebody should sleep next to him, make sure he doesn’t vomit or choke, anything like that, doc told Randy. Randy instructed one of the Cascios to sleep next to MJ. He stayed overnight as well. Next morning, Randy said MJ was sleeping pretty late. “I wanted to make sure he was ok, then I left,” he said.Randy asked MJ next day if he remembered what happened. He said MJ replied “no, no, but I heard.” He said he took it to help him sleep, and he said it was a mistake and that he was sorry about it, Randy testified. I was just kind of taken aback by it, maybe, he said.

Q: Did you have concerns about MJ at that point?
A: Yes
Randy: I staged several interventions and set up, tried to get him help many times.
Q: You mentioned Grace would call but was getting him medication?
A: Yes. A few times I would meet her at the pharmacy.


Interventions: NY, Neverland, Las Vegas

Q: Were there any other?
A: It was more than one at Neverland.

There were a few over there. I don’t know, maybe 4 or 5, Randy responded. It was around 2004, 2005. Or 2005-06. Randy said he was spending a lot of time with him, so he kind of got close look at what was going on.


Randy wrote letters to my family about MJ’s problem and that they had to do something to help.
Q: Who did you send the letter to?
A: Everybody, copied everybody. I made sure everybody knew it.
Randy: He’s an addict, and at this point, addicts aren’t so responsible for what they do. Randy: So this is where the family needs to step in and do something about it because their desire becomes physical.
Q: Did you send it to your mother as well?
A: Everybody got a copy of it.
He wrote the letter down on paper and had assistant copy it. He said not everybody in his family looks at email.
Q: Did you get responses?
A: I think everyone was in shock, maybe a little denial. I always got responses, my dad, Rebbie and Janet, always
Randy: No, my mom no. As a mom, I guess maybe it was hard for her, you know, for a mother to see that.


The 4-5 interventions at Neverland were between 2004-2006. “One of them included my mom,” Randy said. Rebbie and Janet went on all of them, except one or two.

Q: Describe the 3-4 additional interventions:
A: First one at Neverland, not the one that KJ was present. Janet, myself, Rebbie. Maybe my mom was at that one. I think my mom was there.
Katherine was at one intervention only, Randy said. “That must’ve been the first one, around 2002-2003, at Neverland.
Randy said Rebbie and Janet were always supportive, always with him. “My dad also.”
Q: What happened when you arrived at Neverland?
A: I think that time he wasn’t there.
Randy didn’t speak with MJ that day. He said people would tip MJ off. “So it’s bad news. Randy’s coming to shake things up.”

After Vegas, there were no more interventions, Randy said. “I tried to get him help but I couldn’t get as many people to stage intervention” Randy tried to jump the gate a few times. “My dad and I tried a few times to get him help.” Shadow Wood home was 50-thousand square feet. Randy said he hated it, it was just too big.


Randy: Michael wouldn’t want to really be around his family too much, I think because he didn’t want us to see him that way, specially me
Q: Could you give a range if years that this was happening?
A: It happened over a period of time, when I was, he stopped doing it also.
Randy: When I was helping with the situation in Santa Maria I was able to make it stop. I fired Grace, stoped it from coming in.

Randy said MJ would really, really enjoyed being around his children. He would cook for them. He was in a great place, Randy said. “Then Grace came back around and he started using it again. I was very pissed off about it.” Randy said he started right before Santa Maria trial but he got MJ clean. He told Rebbie “don’t leave his side” because I didn’t trust Grace. Randy: I fired her again, I noticed when she was around there was a pattern. Whenever she’s around, he’s wasted. So I fired her again.

Q: Were all of the interventions were before the Santa Maria trial?
A: There was one after, the Vegas was after.

Randy: He was using it again because there was a… it was quite disturbing to me. Randy: There was a People Magazine article coming out talking about his drug use. Grace told him that I was behind putting this article out. Randy: Grace and actually Raymone Bain because I fired them both. I fired them both that’s probably whay they said it, Randy opined. “It had nothing to do with me.”

Randy said MJ got people in his family to sign a letter that was on People Mag saying he never used drugs. “I was really disturbed by that.” He said he wasn’t behind the article, but didn’t sign the letter. Janet, Rebbie and his dad didn’t sign it either. The letter was MJ’s idea, Randy said.
Q: Did you mom sign it?
A: My mom, LaToya, all my brothers.
Randy: My mom, you know, she would mever want to believe it. She’s a mom, you know. I felt bad for my her.
Randy: Did she ever believe he had a problem? Yeah, but I think she was in denial, she didn’t want to believe it.

Randy: MJ didn’t want to talk to me too much. Because maybe I wasn’t afraid to say no to him.Randy: He would get physical with me, I wouldn’t be afraid to say no. But he was 90 pounds, it wouldn’t do much.

Randy said MJ was really scared before the Santa Maria trial. And somehow Grace was able to get him something. Randy: He didn’t want to go to court. He didn’t show up to court. And I was freaking out because it was on the news. Randy: I went to hospital MJ said “I don’t know what you’re thinking. I’m not walking into that courtroom so don’t even think about it Randy. Randy: And I said “Okay, but you are going to court.” He goes “No, I’m not.” Q: Was he in the hospital because he had reaction to his drug use? Randy: No. He was in the hospital because he didn’t want to go to court. Randy said that when Grace was around MJ, he was under the some kind of influence. “But we had him go to court and had the doctor with him”. Randy: Then I later found out she had gotten him a patch. I was livid. Randy doesn’t know what kind of patch it was. He said MJ had slurry speech. “He was really frightened to go to that courtroom.”. Randy: He didn’t know who to trust, because people around him were lying to him, telling him things just to secure their positions.
Those were the only two times Randy saw him under the influence. “I’d get calls from Grace all the time,” he said. Randy said the last time Grace called was a long time ago. “I made my presence known, there wasn’t lot more. She didn’t need to call.”Randy: He was doing good in Ireland from what I recall. 06-7, 07-08 around that time.

Q: Do you know if he slept well while on tour?
A: He slept well
Randy said MJ had no issues sleeping that he knew of.

Randy: My dad and I tried to get the house at Carolwood. They wouldn’t let me through. My brother didn’t want me to see him like that.
Q: Who did you see there?
A: Security guard.
They told Randy “he’s not here, he’s not there.” Randy questioned if he wasn’t there why they had the gate closed. “Open it up, no big deal” After being turned down, Randy would then go home.
Q: After Carolwood, did you or father take any other action?
A: No, after that time no.


Randy talked about interventions in NY, Neverland, Las Vegas. And there was another intervention in Taiwan.
Q: Did you go to Taiwan?
A: Yes, with Rebbie and some family members

MJ was doing shows in Taiwan. Randy said what spurred him to go to Taiwan was the fact that he needed help, he was far away, we said we need to go. Randy: I didn’t know anything but we had heard things. That’s why we were there. Randy said in Taiwan they visited him, gave him family love, wanted to make him feel comforted so he wouldn’t think about doing those things

Q: Did he seem he was using drugs at that time?
A: Yes, his speech was slurred, but nothing terrible.

That was probably the first one, the first intervention, Randy said.

Q: Was MJ isolating himself?
A: Yeah, he would do that.
Q: Was he doing it in the 5 years before his death? Isolated?
A: Oh, parts, parts of it.
Q: Did you speak with him regularly?
A: I don’t talk to anyone in my family regularly.
Sometimes he would isolate himself because he didn’t want people to hear his voice Randy said.
Q: Because he might be using drugs?
A: Yes


Randy: After MJ died, everyone was shocked. I was really displeased with all the stuff that was going on in court with Branca, Weitzman. Randy: We were still trying to figure out how to grieve, and these people are in court, and will, and this nonsense. I haven’t even buried my brother yet, Randy said.

Randy said he pushed everything to the side and was getting together this memorial for him and did it with AEG, Kenny Ortega and those guys.
Q: Did you have a positive experience with AEG?
A: Horrible! (laughs) No, I’m just joking. They were nice. They were very nice.
Randy: I practically slept there to put the show together.
Q: Do you recall telling Randy Phillips that you see that Michael was fortunate to have AEG involved in his return to the stage?
A: I don’t remember saying that, but that doesn’t mean I didn’t say it. I kind of felt that way at the time.

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 67 – August 12 2013 – Summary

Katherine Jackson is in court

Prior to beginning of session, attorneys discussed with judge about the next witnesses/exhibits outside the presence of the jury. (ABC7) Forensic accountant William Ackerman is today’s witness. He’ll be testifying about Jackson’s financial history, spending. Testimony got a late start (about 50 minutes) because attorneys were arguing issues about Ackerman’s opinions and whether he could testify. Plaintiff’s attorney Brian Panish argued that Ackerman’s testimony should be blocked because it was cumulative. Panish argued that another defense witness, Eric Briggs, had testified about Jackson’s debts and Ackerman’s opinion would be redundant. AEG Live’s lawyers however argued that Ackerman’s opinion was about Jackson’s financial history and spending and weren’t duplicative. There are 200,000 pages of Jackson’s financial records that form the basis of Ackerman’s opinion. Many are from the 2000s. The judge agreed to allow Ackerman to testify, but did tell AEG to take out certain pictures from slides that will be shown to the jury. For instance, the judge told AEG to take out slides showing a BMW and the Harvard logo. AEG said those were things Jackson’s children might be entitled to. Judge also said AEG shouldn’t show an image of Carolwood mansion to reflect the Jacksons’ housing (AP)

This afternoon, plaintiff’s attorneys argued that some of Ackerman’s slides and testimony should be stricken. Plaintiff’s lawyer Brian Panish says Ackerman’s testimony about Michael Jackson’s consumption, which includes interest payments, is improper. Panish argued that Ackerman’s figures create an improper comparison to plaintiff’s expert Arthur Erk’s figures on MJ’s expenses. AEG Live’s lawyers say the issue can be fixed on cross-examination, but the judge wants to hear more arguments in the morning. Some of his testimony and charts shown to the jury may get stricken, but the judge made clear she wants to think about it some more. (AP)


William Ackerman Testimony


AEG Direct

When Ackerman took the stand he brought 2 large boxes of documents. Ackerman started pulling out binders large and small and stacking them behind him in the witness box. It took him 3 minutes to set up. (AP)

AEG called a new witness on the stand, William Ackerman. Before seating down, Ackerman laid out several large binders from 2 boxes. Sabrina Strong did direct examination of Ackerman. She asked how tall he is. The expert said he’s 6’7″. Ackerman was asked to determine the amount of support the plaintiffs received and could expect to receive had MJ lived. (ABC7)

He said he did an extensive review of the financial information provided to him, did a financial evaluation of MJ. Ackerman works currently at Freeman & Mills, consulting in accounting, finance, economics, business practices, primarily business settings. He's been working in the accounting firm for a little over 22 years. Ackerman said his work is primary is the damage areas, says he works on several cases and they are all different. He's works in all kinds of civil litigation and some criminal matters. The only litigation his firm does not do is marital dissolution. Ackerman studied Business Administration with emphasis in Accounting at Georgetown University. Ackerman testified in a little over 60 cases, all as expert witness. He said the split is half between being hired by plaintiffs/defendants. "I don't choose my clients, they choose me" Ackerman said. The witness has testified on behalf of O'Melveny & Myers about a handful of times. He has also worked on a handful wrongful death matters. Ackerman said he probably worked on 1,000 matters where he looked at damages issues. (ABC7) He is a forensic accountant with the consulting firm Freeman and Mills Inc., which handles a lot of litigation-type cases. Ackerman said he has testified in approximately 60 trials and arbitration proceedings. He said his experience was pretty evenly split between being a witness for plaintiffs and defense cases. (AP)

Ackerman said he was asked to try to determine the amount of support plaintiffs would received/could expect to receive had MJ lived. Scope of Work: Michael Jackson's finances, Support, contributions, gifts and benefits, Present value calculation. Ackerman explained he developed what we would describe as a financial profile of Michael Jackson. Ackerman said he/his firm reviewed over 200,000 pages of documents. About 10 people in his office worked in reviewing these documents. Strong showed Ackerman a question that was posed to Arthur Erk. He was asked if he reviewed thousand of documents in this case. Erk responded he had access to them but decided to read only what he thought was pertinent. Erk's testimony: Otherwise we'd spend millions of dollars and I didn't think this was necessary. Ackerman said he reviewed all docs, didn't amount to millions of dollars. He testified his firm spent between 2800 - 3000 hours on this case. Ackerman said it probably took well over 2000 hours just to read all the documents. He spent between 650 and 700 hours alone. Ackerman's hourly rate is $475. Other people in his firm charge between $325 to $75 an hour. "We submitted invoices in excess of $800,000" Ackerman testified. He said he doesn't know how it's possible to opine without reading all. (ABC7) Ackerman’s firm has billed more than $800,000 for work in the case, which involved compiling Jackson’s financial history. (AP)

Before the lunch break, he described in great detail Jackson’s debts and earnings. He said MJ died $400-500 million in debt. His underlying testimony so far has been to show that Jackson was spending millions more per year than he was earning in the 90s, 2000s. Many millions of dollars each year were spent repaying interest on loans, Ackerman said. He also didn’t have complete records on Jackson’s personal spending in the early 2000s, so he said his debts for that time period were probably higher than shown on his charts. In 2001, Ackerman Jackson’s income was about $15 million, but his expenses were roughly $32-33 million. One of his charts showed Jackson’s spending versus what plaintiff’s expert Arthur Erk calculated for MJ’s expenses. Erk projected that Jackson would spend roughly $7 million a year if he had lived. Ackerman said the historical figures were much higher. For instance, in 2009, Ackerman said Jackson would have spent close to $30 million on annual interest payments alone. The interest payments were for loans taken against his Sony-ATV and Mijac music catalogs and various properties (Neverland, Hayvenhurst.) (AP)

Ackerman said he looked at books and records for Michael Jackson and was asked to measure what MJ paid to plaintiffs for support. Ackerman: I think it's important to share with jury that there was some doubt of his ability to continue to provide support. (ABC7)

Exhibit:
A. Spending Exceeded Income
B. Growing and Significant Debt
C. Profile of Financial Condition

"MJ's spending exceeded his income on an annual basis," Ackerman testified. "He had significant debt over time, the interest had become more and more burdensome to meet," Ackerman described. Ackerman said he put together a profile of Michael Jackson's financial condition. (ABC7)

He said he focused on 2001 to June 2009 period, since the financial information was the most complete during this period. Ackerman: During the last decade of his life the primary source of income was Sony/ATV catalogue and his own MIJAC catalogue. Ackerman said the Sony/ATV catalogue merged in 1995. As part of deal, MJ received a substantial amount of money. The expert said MJ was to continue to receive $6.5 million every year for royalties and $11 million from 2008 and forward until 2014. Ackerman: MJ had ATV catalogue alone and received $115 million over a three year period of time for the merge with Sony's catalogue in 1995. Ackerman said MJ paid $49,5 million dollars for the ATV catalogue, which then was merged with Sony. (ABC7)

Ackerman said MJ had multiple corporations. He said most of his expenses were from one of his entities and not by himself as a person. Ackerman testified that some times the spending on a given company would be bigger than the income, would have a loss. Michael Jackson Company is the corporation that entered into an agreement with AEG. (ABC7)

Strong showed a chart of MJ's Finances -- Spending Exceeded Income
2001: $17 million in income, $33/34 million in expenses
2008: $26 million in income, $42 million in expenses (ABC7)

Ackerman said 2002, 2003 and 2004 there were no personal expenditures record. So they were not included in the graphic. The expert said those were the years MJ was living at Neverland Ranch. And no expenses were reported. Ackerman said there were not a lot of books and records provided for the year 2007. MJ had some sort of dispute with his business manager. (ABC7)

Ackerman said MJ was spending $15-20 million a year on average more than his income. (ABC7)

Michael Jackson's Finances – Expenses. Erk: $6.8 million in consumption. Ackerman said in 2008 it was $41/42 million in consumption. Strong: What things did you see MJ would spend? Ackerman: The large expenditures was in interest. Ackerman: All expenses of the different businesses he had, payroll, Neverland Ranch was very expensive to maintain. Ackerman said MJ was a generous man and donated a lot money to charity. He also gave a lot of gifts to different people at different times. The expert said he had to take care of the animals at Neverland, had people on the payroll, spent half a million dollars in amusement rides. (ABC7)

Despite receiving millions of dollars annually from his song catalogs, Michael Jackson year after year spent more than he earned, including $30 million in annual debt payments, a forensic accountant testified Monday. William R. Ackerman, testifying as a defense witness on behalf of AEG Live in the wrongful-death trial, offered a detailed look at the singer's finances, telling jurors that Jackson spent money on donations to charity, gifts, travel, art and furniture. "He spent a lot of money on jewelry," Ackerman said with a chuckle. Neverland Ranch -- which Ackerman called "a mini-theme park," with its maintenance staff, zoo and train that traveled around the property -- was also a huge drain on his income, the certified public accountant testified. Still, he said, “consistently, his largest expenditure was interest expense. He spent a ton of money on interest.” Jackson's biggest expense was $30 million in annual payments on his debt when he died in 2009. (LATimes)

Ackerman said Michael Jackson had to take on more and more debt to keep going, since income was not sufficient. Strong showed chart with MJ's Interest on Debt, which is the amount of incurred interest over the years. Ackerman said from 2001/2004 the annual interest on debt was from $13 to $15 million, 2005: $20 million, 2006: $25 million, 2009: $30 million. "This is the cost to rent somebody else's money," Ackerman explained. He said the interest rate was 16,8%, almost 17%. Ackerman said this amount was all separated from his monthly expenses. Ackerman: He was close to about $400 million on long-term debt, had other debts to credit he received. Total debt is $400 and $500 million. Ackerman said he saw on documents that MJ was as much as $30 million in debt as early as 1993. "It continued to grow over time to the final numbers," Ackerman said. Strong showed chart with MJ's outstanding debt: 2001 -- $231 million, 2005 -- $275 million, 2006 -- $325 million. Ackerman said in 2007 it was $400 million, plateau there until his passing in 2009. (ABC7)

Interest on the loans grew over the years, ranging from a little less than 7% to 16.8% annually, Ackerman said in a downtown Los Angeles courtroom. As early as 1993, Jackson owed $30 million, a figure that grew to $140 million by 1998. From June 2001 through June 2009, Jackson's debt increased by about $170 million. When he died, Jackson owed $400 million to $500 million, Ackerman testified. Ackerman said Jackson received no loans after 2007, and at the time of his death, he was three to four months behind on payments for the San Fernando Valley home where his mother lived. "He was tapped out," Ackerman said. (LAtimes)

He provided details of Jackson's 1985 purchase of the ATV music catalog, which contains many Beatles songs, for $49.5 million. Jackson merged it with Sony's catalog a decade later, receiving $115 million, along with a guaranteed $6.5 million a year, which was increased to $11 million annually in 2008. The CPA also testified that Jackson's tours in the 1990s were not moneymakers. He said Jackson broke even on the Dangerous tour and lost $11.2 million on the HIStory tour. (LAtimes)

Ackerman said MJ received in Oct 1995-97 -- received $150 million from Sony. But he spent $32 million in 1993, $140 million in 1998. Strong asked what that means. "He liked to spend money," Ackerman responded. (ABC7)

Ackerman said he believes Dangerous tour in 1993 broke even or lost money. He reviewed Gongaware's testimony with that info. Ackerman said the books and records shows MJ lost $11.2 million in the "HIStory" tour. The expert said MJ created new companies for the "HIStory" tour and he analyzed the books, which showed he lost money. (ABC7)

Strong showed chart with MJ's Assets Securing Debt in June 2009:
50% Interest in Sony/ATV Catalog MIJAC Catalog - $ 300,000,000
Neverland Residence - $ 71,509,703
Hayvenhurst Residence - $ 23,000,000
Lindley Residence - $ 3,985,211
Loan Balance - $383,500
Total: $ 398,878,414 in asses securing debt. (ABC7)

The title of Hayvenhurst house was in Michael and LaToya's name, Ackerman said. "After 2008, people were just not giving him more money," Ackerman said. Ackerman said after 2007 no debt had been incurred. "Nobody would lend him money," he said. "He was tapped out," the expert explained. He said his opinion is based on the documents he reviewed in the case. Ackerman: He was having troubles to meet his obligations in the period of 2007-2009, as well as other periods. The Hayvenhurst residence was 3-4 months in arrears by June 2009. (ABC7)


Ackerman said he does not know the value of Sony/ATV catalogue. Strong: Assuming Briggs testified value of MJ's interest in the catalogue is roughly in line w/ debt, is that consistent he was tapped out? Ackerman: Yes, ma'am. "I don't think he was able to borrow any more money," Ackerman said. (ABC7)

Ackerman said the $300 million loan against the Sony/ATV catalogue was due in full in December of 2010. If not paid, Ackerman said he'd assume MJ would not receive the amount he was to receive annually for royalties. Strong: I want you to assume, if MJ did not have the Sony/ATV catalogue, do you have an opinion if he would receive $6.5 to $11 million? "The income goes away," Ackerman said. (ABC7)


Strong showed another chart of MJ's Finances.
Profile of Financial Condition:
1- Significant Debt
2- High Borrowing Rates
3- Catalog Cash Flow Committed to Servicing Debt
4- Bankruptcy Remote Trust Formed in 2006
5- Neverland
6- Hayvenhurst


Ackerman said that, based on his review of the documents, the royalties were dedicated to repay the debt. Ackerman: Mr. Jackson never got paid that money from royalties, it went straight to the lender. "It was earmarked to either pay the interest of the debts or the debts themselves," Ackerman said. Ackerman said he believes lenders were getting nervous in 2006, formed bankruptcy remote trust that included Sony/ATV and MIJAC catalogues. A bankruptcy remote trust is established to protect the interest of the lender in case the borrower files for bankruptcy. Ackerman said his understanding is that the trust would protect the catalogues against other borrowers. Bankruptcy remote trust was formed in March 2006. It was called "New Horizon Trust." (ABC7)

Neverland: Ackerman said about $23 million had been lent against Neverland. "It has become very close to foreclosure by Colony Capital in 2008," Ackerman said about Neverland. Colony Capital came in and replaced primary lender -- non-interest bearing loan to MJ for $23 million. (ABC7)

Ackerman said the mortgage at Hayvenhurst was delinquent 3-4 months and was scheduled to be foreclosed on June 26, 2009, a day after MJ died. "He was in a very precarious financial condition," Ackerman opined. "He dig himself in pretty good hole." (ABC7)


Ackerman calculated Annual Support to Plaintiffs Around 2009: Katherine - $1,167,000, Prince -- $785,000 , Paris -- $780,000, Blanket -- $780,000. Annual Support for Katherine Jackson included all expenses for Hayvenhurst, Auto/RV,Travel, Gifts. (ABC7)

Annual Support for Katherine Jackson alone:
Hayvenhurst mortgage on March 2009 -- 31,513/month
Hayvenhurst property taxes -- 34,000/year
Hayvenhurst repairs and maintenance -- $111,000/year
Hayvenhurst homeowner insurance -- $36,000/year
Hayvenhurst utilities -- $64,000/year
Hayvenhurst employees/independent contractors -- $252,000/year
(groundkeeper, butler, housekeeper, personal assistant, driver, security man)
Hayvenhurst security/alarms -- $69,000/year
Food allowance -- $30,000/year (just for Mrs. Jackson)
Auto/RV
MJ had given Mrs. Jackson a top of the line Mercedes and recreational vehicle -- $118,000/year
Travel -- $35,000/year (Family vacations for 2010 was $118,362 and 2011 was $160,471)
Gifts -- $40,000/year (ABC7)

Ackerman said the books and records listed out the gifts MJ gave to Mrs. Jackson. In some years, there was no gift amount listed. Strong: What you see on the records, it decreased overtime? Ackerman: It appears that way. (ABC7)

Prince, Paris and Blanket Annual Support Around 2009rince -- $785,000, Paris -- $780,000, Blanket -- $780,000. The difference is because Prince was going to Buckley School, which Ackerman said is higher than home schooling for Paris & Blanket in 2009. (ABC7)

Rent -- $1,200,000
Butler -- $31,000
Housekeeper -- $31,000
Chef (Kai Chase) -- $128,000
Utilities -- $64,000
Total Annual Cost -- $1,454,000
25% Allocation per child -- 364,000
Education: Buckley School in 2013 is $36,000 for ages 12-17. In 2009 was $28,000.
2013 cost of private university -- $63,000 (Harvard). Ages 18-21. In 2009, it was $51,000. This included tuition and room and board.
Travel: $122,000 per child (Ackerman said MJ would travel by private plane and would rent entire floors of hotels.)
Security: $69,000 per child per year
Caretaker: $22,000 per child per year
Auto: Ackerman said MJ had acquired 2 top of the line Escalades. $42,000 for MJ and 3 children, about $14,000 per child. Ackerman said he projected kids to have own cars at 16. He testified he thinks the dream car would be a convertible BMW -- $35k/year/child.
Groceries: $17,000 per year per child
Other: $121,000 per year per child for toys, gifts, clothes, electronics, books, jewelry, boats, places. Ackerman said he gave $110,000 cushion in the last category to catch all that was possibly missed. (ABC7)

Ackerman used a discount rate of 18% to put numbers in present value.
Katherine Jackson -- Projected Support
From 2009 - 2019
Period 1 - Ending 12/31/2009 -- $557,000
Period 11 - Ending 6/30/2019 -- $6,111,000
Projected Support to Plaintiffs (cumulative)
Period 1 - End 12/31/2009 -- for KJ and children -- $1,684,000
Period 11 - End 12/31/2019 -- for KJ and children -- $19,452,000
Period 16 - End 12/31/2024 -- for KJ and children -- $21,498,000 (ABC7)

Ackerman said Mrs. Jackson's life expectancy was 10 years from 2009. So he stopped calculating future earnings based on that. For MJ, he calculated 15 and half years of life expectancy, although he didn't offer his opinion on how much MJ would live. (ABC7)

After the lunch break, Ackerman reiterated a point he made this morning, that Jackson was “tapped out,” meaning he couldn’t borrow any more. Ackerman also told the jury that one major piece of Jackson’s debt was a $300 million loan against his share of the Sony-ATV catalog. The note on the Sony-ATV catalog loan would have come due in 2010, Ackerman said. Defaulting on the loan would impact MJ’s income, he said. Ackerman also told the jury about missed payments on Jackson’s Neverland property and on his family’s Hayvenhurt home. “He dug himself a pretty good hole,” Ackerman said of Jackson’s debt, adding that he isn’t sure MJ could have continued to support his family at the same level that he had been supporting them. He pegged that figure at about $3.5 million/year for Katherine, MJ’s kids. The $3.5 million figure was Ackerman’s estimate of support Jackson was providing his family in 2009. The consultant gave detailed breakdowns of how he arrived at those figures for the jury through various slides showing payment breakdowns. The slides showed how much was spent on security, schooling, utilities, food and other expenses for Katherine & the kids. Ackerman then went into another set of figures, which were projected levels of support based on risk calculations he said are commonly made. Part of his analysis involved estimating Katherine Jackson’s life expectancy until about age 89 based on a table used in court proceedings. Ackerman made no projection of how long MJ’s life-expectancy would have been, but projected out his likely level of support for 15 years.The bottom line figure of his projection was $21.5 million dollars for Jackson’s mother and children if MJ had lived for 15 ½ years past ’09. The chart was basically a sliding scale, allowing the jury to see Jackson’s projected support if they think his life expectancy was shorter. (AP)


"He would have to have some form of income to pay those figures," Ackerman testified.

Strong concluded her examination. (ABC7)



Jackson cross

Brian Panish did cross examination. Ackerman said he has an engagement letter with AEG for work in this case. Panish asked if he has a contract. He said yes. Attorney asked if he could bring a copy of it. Ackerman said the general requirement is to have a written agreement before work begins. OMM hired Ackerman in another case, the Cussler case. Bert Fields was the opposing counsel. Anschutz company was one of the defendants. Panish: Did your firm bill in excess of $1 million for that case? Ackerman: I don’t know exactly, but I’d not be surprised. (ABC7)

The bill of $800,000 to $825,000 was for work up until July. Since then, Ackerman worked another 60-100 hours. Ackerman said he keeps time records for the he does. “I don’t know what the industry standard is, I know what we do in our firm.” Panish: A professional way would be to itemize your bill, right? Ackerman: I don’t know, I know what our company does. Ackerman estimated the bill for last month to be between $50,000-$100,000, which is on top of the $800,000-$825,000 already billed. (ABC7)

Panish: You were very critical of Erk’s consumption amount, right? Ackerman: I was very critical of it. (ABC7)

“I didn’t come up with specific number, but probably in the $30-$50 million range,” Ackerman testified. (ABC7)

Panish: How much did MJ’s debt increase from 2007 versus 2008? Ackerman: Approximately $1.5 million. Panish: And from 2008 versus 2009? Ackerman: I show the debt going up only a few hundred thousand dollars. Ackerman: Looking at this graph, it’s an average of somewhere between $30-$35 million. (ABC7)

Ackerman said he, himself, did not read all the documents related to the case. (ABC7)

Panish: Who were the officers of Michael Jackson Company, sir? Ackerman: I know Michael Jackson was. Panish: Was it a single liability company? Ackerman: I don’t recall, have to look up. Ackerman: Michael Jackson Company was created on Feb 8, 2007. It’s a Delaware company. (ABC7)

Panish: Was Dr. Tohme sitting on $5 million of Michael Jackson’s money in 2009? “I made aware that Dr. Tohme may had been holding some money for MJ,” Ackerman responded. Panish: Did you testify in your deposition that it was stated by a number of people that Dr. Tohme was incompetent and dishonest. “Some people were of that frame of mind,” Ackerman answered. Panish: $5 million would’ve covered the entire expense at Hayvenhurst in 2009, correct? Ackerman: Yes, sir. (ABC7)

“It appears that he was providing support,” Ackerman said. “I know that Janet Jackson was also providing, so you have to draw the line where life necessities is,” Ackerman explained. Ackerman said Mrs. Jackson testified Janet was giving her $10,000 a month. “Mr. Panish, I’m just trying to say that she was also being subsidized by his daughter,” Ackerman explained. Panish: Do you agree with me that Mr. Jackson was paying for his mother’s life necessities? Ackerman: He was providing the bulk of the support for his mother. (ABC7)

Panish: What was the standard life expectancy for Michael Jackson? Ackerman: I don’t know. Panish: Did you read that MJ had 28.8 year life expectancy? Objection — sustained (ABC7)

-----------------------------------------

Panish told the judge this is a good point to stop. He says he needs to argue with the court. Judge responded: “And you can’t wait!” (ABC7)

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 68 – August 13 2013 – Summary

Katherine Jackson is present in court

Court started this morning with 40 minutes of arguments on William Ackerman’s testimony. Ackerman is a defense witness testifying about Michael Jackson’s finances. Plaintiffs wanted some of his testimony stricken. Plaintiff’s attorneys Kevin Boyle and Brian Panish argued that testimony about Jackson’s debts is prejudicial and should be stricken. AEG’s lawyers Marvin Putnam and Jessica Stebbins Bina countered it was important to this case and how much MJ could have given to his family. “The case law is clear , you can’t give what you don’t have,” Putnam told the judge. Ackerman’s opinion is that MJ was in a precarious financial condition due to debts, including a large loan on his share of Sony-ATV catalog. Panish kept asking AEG Live’s lawyers to provide a case that allowed them to present evidence about MJ’s debts. Stebbins Bina eventually cited one case. That prompted the judge to ask plaintiffs for a case citation if they could find one later. For the time being, Judge Yvette Palazuelos overruled the plaintiff’s objections and declined to strike Ackerman’s testimony from yesterday. (AP)

Ackerman and Panish have also been in some tense exchanges, so the judge admonished Ackerman to not argue with Panish. Ackerman has also had to be told by judge to answer questions with a “yes” or “no” several times. She told him to listen to her instructions (AP)



William Ackerman Testimony


Jackson cross

Ackerman is back on the stand for cross examination. Brian Panish, attorney for the Jacksons, doing the questioning. (ABC7)

One of the first questions Ackerman was asked was about Michael Jackson’s life expectancy _ the judge blocked the question yesterday. Plaintiff’s lawyer Brian Panish complained that Ackerman had testified about Katherine Jackson’s life expectancy, so the judge relented. Ackerman said based on a table used in wrongful death case, Michael Jackson’s presumed life expectancy was 29 years. (AP) Panish asked what was the life expectancy for a 50 year old male based on the table he used to calculate Katherine Jackson’s life expectancy. Ackerman: According to this table a male of 50 years old would be 29.6 years. (ABC7)

There was a lot of back-and-forth about how much money Ackerman projected Jackson could have given Mrs. Jackson, his kids if he’d lived. His big-ticket number from yesterday was more than $21 million over the next 15 years, but Ackerman said it could have been less. Asked by Panish whether he could say how much Jackson would have given, Ackerman said that was for the jury to decide. (AP) “I can’t speculate what he’d give for support” Ackerman said. “I do know he was in very precarious financial situation at the time he died.” “He could’ve been bankrupt within 6 months as far as I know,” Ackerman opined. Panish asked if after bankruptcy MJ wouldn’t have debt left. Ackerman: He would not be able to provide support for his mother and children then. (ABC7)

Ackerman said MJ received $6.2 million in advance from AEG. Panish said MJ received $23 million in 6 months in 2009. Panish: You can’t tell us what support he would be able to provide, right, sir? Ackerman: I think that’s for the jury to decide. (ABC7)

Panish: Did you know MJ gave Mrs. Jackson a $500,000 RV? Ackerman: Yes, it was in my analysis. (ABC7)

Ackerman said there was no record of MJ’s amount of donations over the years. Ackerman testifies he saw on documents that MJ was going to donate the proceeds of “Dangerous” tour to charity. Panish: Did you see he donated over $60 million to charity? Objection, sustained. (ABC7) Panish asked at one point whether Ackerman knew of anyone who donated more to charity than Jackson. Bill Gates, the consultant replied. The lawyer then asked Ackerman whether he was familiar with Jackson being in the Guinness Book of World Records for his charitable giving. Ackerman wasn’t familiar with that distinction. Panish moved on to other topics. (AP) Panish: Do you agree MJ was a very generous person? Ackerman: I absolutely agree with that. (ABC7)

Panish asked if he thought MJ would give the kids everything he thought important. Ackerman responded MJ wanted his children to be humble. (ABC7)

Panish asked about the billings by Ackerman’s firm. He said it was reasonable to expect the firm had billed $900k or more at this point. (AP) The bill for Ackerman’s firm is about $900,000 currently. Panish wrote on a board what other damages expert for AEG charged. Bill from damages experts for AEG: Briggs — $700,000 Ackerman — $900,000 Total: $1.6 million (ABC7)

Ackerman doesn’t recall being qualified as expert witness for plaintiffs in a wrongful death case. Panish asked what percentage of his work is in wrongful death cases. “Very small percentage,” Ackerman responded. (ABC7) The lawyer asked about Ackerman’s experience in wrongful death cases. He’d only worked on “a handful” he said, but never testified in one. (AP)

Ackerman said he reviewed a lot of trial testimony, but even more depositions in this case (ABC7)

Panish asked Ackerman for amount he used for the chart before he applied the 18% discount rate to bring the final number to present value. Ackerman looked at docs in his binders, said he doesn’t have original numbers w/ him. He said the calculations need to be done in software. Panish showed Ackerman Formuzis analysis and the calculation for personal consumption and professional fees. Formuzis used 7% discount rate. Panish asked if Ackerman used the same rate. “It’s an improper rate why would I do that?” Ackerman responded. (ABC7)

MJ had a $320 million debt against the Sony/ATV catalogue. Ackerman said the highest interest rate was 16.85%. Panish asked Ackerman if he read IRS valued of Sony/ATV catalogue at $700 million. “It would not change my conclusion, no sir,” Ackerman explained. Panish said Briggs testified independent appraisal valued at Sony/ATV catalogue at $700 million: $300MM on top of $400MM MJ had in debt. “I’m having a really hard time using that number,” Ackerman said. (ABC7) Panish questioned Ackerman on the value of Jackson’s share of the Sony-ATV music catalog and an IRS appraisal of its worth at $700 million. Ackerman said he thought there was “strong testimony that conflicts with” the $700 million figure and he had a hard time believing it. At around this point, Ackerman mentioned an estate accounting, which was prohibited by the judge. She struck his answer. (AP)

Panish: AEG knew MJ’s financial condition when they entered into an agreement with him, didn’t they, sir? Ackerman: I don’t know that.Panish asked if Ackerman read Randy Phillips’ deposition where he said they were aware of MJ’s finances. (ABC7)Panish also asked whether AEG Live knew about Jackson’s financial condition. Ackerman said he didn’t know and the lawyer pointed to testimony by Randy Phillips that said the company was aware of MJ’s debt and knew he needed to work to avert “financial disaster.” Panish showed Ackerman numerous passages from depositions. Ackerman read them very deliberately. Ackerman: “I’m not here for a memory test.” He said that after Panish questioned his recollection of testimony he had read earlier. (AP)

Ackerman said MIJAC catalogue was same amount of the debts on it. He said the value is about $ 75 million. “There was no equity in that asset in June 2009,” Ackerman said he read in the documents. Ackerman said he did not put a value on the assets MJ had. “Liability exceeded any amount of value of the assets,” Ackerman testified. Sony/ATV catalogue — there’s a value MIJAC catalogue — there’s some value Neverland — there’s some value (ABC7)

Panish asked if Ackerman read Tom Barrack’s testimony that he met with MJ several times to straighten his financial situation. Ackerman said there was some mention to it but doesn’t remember the details of the meeting. Panish showed Ackerman several bills from his firm where they researched Colony Capital and MJ’s deal. Ackerman: Colony Capital came in when Neverland was about to be foreclosed and lent MJ $23 million with a very interest high rate, by the way. Panish: But didn’t you testify yesterday the loan had no interest? Ackerman explained it was high interest loan but he didn’t have to pay it (ABC7)

Panish: Her never liquidated his assets, did he sir? Ackerman: He never did. Panish said MJ didn’t want to liquidate his assets, instead he wanted to go back touring. (ABC7)

Ackerman said Michael Jackson signed the contract with AEG to go back on tour. (ABC7) Panish asked about Jackson’s contract with AEG Live, and the consultant said he didn’t remember who signed it. After a few moments, Ackerman said he believed Michael Jackson signed the agreement. He said he focused “on numbers, not process.” (AP)

Panish asked where Ackerman researched Colony Capital and MJ’s deals. “There’s a really interesting tool called internet, there are a lot of things you can find there,” Ackerman responded. Panish asked if MJ decided to go on tour after meeting with Tom Barrack. Ackerman said it appeared that way. (ABC7)

Panish: Did you do any discount rate of 7, 10 or 15%? Ackerman: No, I did not. I used 18%. (ABC7)

Panish: Have you prepared calculation of personal consumption for MJ per year? Ackerman: I actually calculated something this morning. Ackerman said the bars on the graph he showed yesterday include personal consumption. Panish asked if he came up with numbers after speaking with his attorneys yesterday. “Today is typically after yesterday,” Ackerman responded. Judge struck the answer. (ABC7)

Panish: Do you know if AEG submitted a $300,000 in expense that had been accrued for the the services of Dr. Murray? Ackerman: I have a vague recollection of seeing this number. Panish showed documents to Ackerman to refresh his recollection. (ABC7)

Panish asked a few questions about the “This Is It” expenses that Tohme Tohme signed for before the lunch break. (AP)

Panish asked if Ackerman knows that Erk did not include the interest rate in his calculations of consumption. He said yes. Ackerman said had Erk included interest, the red bar would go much higher, since most of the expenses are interest. (ABC7)

Panish: Did Mr. Briggs give a number for loss of future earnings for MJ? Ackerman said he recalls Briggs saying projections were speculative. Panish: Did Mr. Briggs give an opinion the amount MJ would lose in future earnings? Ackerman: I don’t recall. Panish asked if Briggs said the amount for future earning for MJ would be zero. Ackerman said he doesn’t remember Briggs putting a number. “My fundamental understanding his (Briggs) testimony is that Mr. Erk’s calculations were speculative,” Ackerman said. (ABC7)

“The reality is that Mr. Jackson could lose money,” Ackerman said, pointing that MJ had debts that could offset anything he earned. Panish: Did Mr. Briggs put no figure for loss of income for MJ’s life? Ackerman: That’s correct. Panish: And in your opinion is that the children lost $21.5 millions in future support? Ackerman said that was correct, if you were to believe MJ would continue to give the same support as previous years. “It could be zero support too,” Ackerman opined. “He was in pretty bad financial situation.” Panish asked if support could’ve been zero. “I guess in that situation yes, it could have been zero,” Ackerman responded. Panish: For $1.6 million, it’s your and Briggs’ opinion, that MJ’s loss of future earning could be zero? Ackerman: That’s a possibility. (ABC7)

After the break, Panish didn’t immediately ask about the tour expenses budget again. Instead, he asked about Ackerman’s projections. Panish asked Ackerman whether his opinion was, based on Jackson’s poor financial state, the singer might not have been able to give his mother and three children any support if he had lived. Ackerman said it was a possibility. Panish made the remark that between Ackerman and Eric Briggs’ $1.6 million in fees, they had opinions that Jackson could have left nothing to his mother, children if he had lived. With Ackerman’s acknowledgement that was a possibility, Panish sat down (AP)


AEG redirect

AEG Live defense attorney Sabrina Strong took over, and asked Ackerman about Jackson’s annual spending. He said it averaged about $35 million a year, but fluctuated from $23 on the low end to almost $45 million on the high end. Strong asked whether in 2009, I appeared Jackson had the resources to keep spending like that. The consultant said no. “He dug himself a very deep hole,” Ackerman said of Jackson’s debts by the time he died. Strong asked Ackerman about a couple deposition pages, at which point the consultant read the testimony into the record. Ackerman was supposed to read the passages to himself, not aloud to the jury. That’s not the way it’s supposed to be done, so the judge ended up taking the deposition away from him. “After you read it, you give it to me,” Judge Palazuelos said. “I guess we’re going to have to do it the old-fashioned way. (AP)

Sabrina Strong did re-direct. She asked the witness if there a difference between consumption and spending. He said no. “I believe I shared multiple data points of how much Mr. Jackson spent on the last 8 years of his life,” Ackerman said. Strong showed exhibit with chart Ackerman made regarding MJ’s expenses. Ackerman said the bars show what MJ actually spent. Strong: Does that include business and personal spending? Ackerman said yes, that the bars included interest, business, personal, all that came out of MJ’s checkbook, since he was responsible for all. “He dug himself a very deep hole,” Ackerman explained. “He was tapped out.” Ackerman said there was very strong language in Michael Kane’s deposition that Michael Jackson was tapped out. “Mr. Barrack was in the frame of mind that MJ didn’t have enough income to support his spending and lifestyle,” Ackerman testified. Strong: Were there other outstanding debt for Mr. Jackson at the time Tohme was holding the $5 million for MJ? Ackerman: Huge. Ackerman listed MJ’s debts: Sony/ATV Neverland Condo Hayvenhurst MIJAC. Ackerman said on top of that there were creditors debts in the amount of $100 million. “There were just no shortage of people he had to pay,” Ackerman explained. “As the debt continue to grow, the interest continued to grow,” Ackerman explained. Ackerman: There is a significant issue of doubt whether he (MJ) would be able to continue to provide support. “He couldn’t get an increase in his $50,000 credit card limit,” Ackerman said. “That’s how bad it was.” (ABC7)

Ackerman said the MJ’s income were from Sony/ATV and MIJAC catalogues. “You lose the asset, you lose the income,” Ackerman opined. (ABC7) Strong asked about Jackson’s loan on the Sony-ATV catalog. Ackerman said the creditors were extremely well protected. Sony had guaranteed to repay the loan if Jackson defaulted, Ackerman said. “It was one of the most secure pieces of debt I’ve ever seen.” (AP) Strong asked about IRS’ valuation of Sony catalogue. Ackerman said Briggs’ opinion was that that asset was not that valuable. Ackerman said Briggs did valuation of Sony/ATV catalogue for tax return purposed on behalf of MJ’s Estate. Ackerman said the Sony/ATV catalogue debt interest was 7%. This was the majority of the debt MJ had. Ackerman explained the Sony/ATV loan was very unique in many ways. He said it was collateralized by the catalogue itself. He also said there was a bankruptcy remote trust attached to the catalogue, if asset were to be sold the proceeds would first to repay debt. On top of that, Ackerman said Sony guaranteed they would pay $300 million in case everything else failed. “It was the most secured loan I’ve ever seen,” Ackerman said. “It caused the interest rate to go way down.” (ABC7)

Strong asked about the bill Panish said AEG submitted to MJ’s Estate that included $300,000 for the cost of Dr. Murray’s services. Ackerman read the footnote: the contract is not signed by MJ and such a signature was a condition precedent to any payment obligation. (ABC7)

Strong then asked whether a $35k a month mortgage _ like the one on Hayvenhurst _ was necessary to live. No, Ackerman said. Strong’s questions were meant to rebut questions by Panish about whether MJ had provided his mother the necessities of life, such as housing. The judge stopped Strong from asking her line of questions on this topic, and her questioning concluded soon after that. (AP) Regarding necessities to live, Strong asked Ackerman if a mortgage of $35,000 a month is necessary to live. He answered no. Strong: Do you believe $111,000 a year in repairs and maintenance necessary to live? Objection, lack of foundation. Judge sustained. (ABC7)

Ackerman said Prince drives a Ford truck. He calculated his car to be a BMW. The expert explained his oversight only benefited the plaintiffs, since he calculated more money for support. Ackerman said MJ would have to have enough income to service all the debts, personnel, creditors and to support to plaintiffs. “I think he’d have significant difficulty in continue to provide the support,” Ackerman opined. (ABC7)


Jackson recross

Panish, in re-direct, asked if Barrack testified that, with Colony Capital help, MJ could overcome his debts and he could become a success? Ackerman: I don’t recall that. After reviewing Barrack’s deposition, Ackerman said yes. “I think they all thought and hoped the tour would be successful,” Ackerman testified. (ABC7)

Panish took over, and showed Ackerman the budget attached to the document that MJ’s manager Tohme signed in 2009. One version that the jury’s seen and Ackerman testified about had a footnote on it that $300k set aside for Murray wouldn't be paid because the contract was contingent on Jackson signing it. But the version presented to Tohme on June 28 lacked that footnote. (AP)

Panish: Did you read anything about MJ’s relationship with his mother and children? Ackerman: My recollection it was very loving. Panish: Did you read anywhere that MJ denied his mother or children anything? Ackerman: I don’t recall that. (ABC7)

Panish asked if Ackerman is here to help the plaintiffs. He said he’s here to try to be fair. Ackerman said he came up with a very generous support numbers should the jury decide to award anything. Ackerman said at the end of MJ’s life, he had close to $30 million a year in interest, his total overall expenses was $30-45 million range. Panish: Did you do a calculation for the loss of their father, loss of care, comfort, society, affection? Ackerman: I don’t think I’m qualified to calculate that. (ABC7)

Ackerman was excused. Judge broke for afternoon break.


(( Outside the presence of the jury, there was a discussion with the attorneys whether plaintiffs have formally rested their case. Panish to tell the judge in the morning. She wants to tell the jury and put it in the record. Defendants have filed a motion for non-suit already. Judge said she won’t rule on it right away. (ABC7))



Dr Gordon Hiroshi Sasaki video deposition

Dr. Sasaki graduated from Pomona College in 1964, degree in Bachelor of Arts. He went to Yale University for his medical school, graduated in 1968. Dr. Sasaki served in Vietnam and wore several hats as doctor, including anesthesia and plastic surgery on days off. He laughed at that last comment. (ABC7) The doctor talked about his experience, going to medical school at Yale, then going to Vietnam to serve as a doctor. (AP)

Sasaki performed a few medical procedures on Jackson in the 1990s, including surgery on his scalp to try to repair damage from burns. Jackson’s scalp had been burned in 1984 while filming a Pepsi commercial. Sasaki’s testimony was taped on Feb. 7, 2013. Sasaki performed two scalp surgeries after being introduced to Jackson by Dr. Steven Hoefflin. He also worked with Dr. Klein. (AP) Q: Did you ever provide medical treatment to MJ? A: Yes, I did. Dr. Sasaki said he did two surgeries on MJ’s scalp and 3 on the upper lip for contouring. March 16, 1993 was the first surgery Dr. Sasaki performed on MJ. It was to reduce scar on the scalp, the bald spot. Second surgery was on October 31, 1997 for scar revision to reduce the width of the reduced scar on the scalp. (ABC7)

Dr. Sasaki: The medical care, which included post operation and pain management, were taken out of my hands willingly. Dr. Sasaki said the care was placed into two other doctors that Mr. Jackson thought would be the best. Dr. Sasaki said the other two doctors were Steven Hoefflin and Arnold Klein. At some point Dr. Metzger as well, he said. Dr. Sasaki on how he met MJ: I received a phone call from Dr. Steven Hoefflin, a plastic surgeon. Dr. Sasaki said he was asked to assist him in providing different alternatives to take care of the bald spot on his scalp. The consultation with MJ and Dr. Hoefflin was set up, Dr. Sasazi said. Dr. Hoefflin is a well known plastic surgeon in Los Angeles. The surgery in 1993 lasted about half an hour. Dr. Sasazi explained he put a metal on a side of the defect and a metal on the other side. He then put stitches going from one side of the metal to the other, crank it to put the sides together. Dr. Sasaki said the method results in about 30% more skin from stretching. He then put ballon in the scalp to stretch further to cover scar. Dr. Hoefflin was his first assistant in the surgery. Dr. Sasaki said he knew generically that in 1988 MJ had a burn in his scalp. He said he understands the burn happened during a Pepsi commercial and it had healed, but MJ wanted to reduce the scar. The scar was in the middle part of the scalp, Dr. Sasaki said. (ABC7)

Sasaki was invited twice to Neverland Ranch after the procedures, once with his family when Jackson wasn’t there. The second Neverland trip was a house call to check on his wound after a medical procedure. (AP) Dr. Sasaki: He was kind enough to invite myself and my family to Neverland. Dr. Sasaki: We went up there, he was not there, but he was not supposed to be there. The staff served us lunch and showed us around. Dr. Sasaki said he visited Neverland Ranch twice, once with his family and once at MJ”s request. Dr. Sasaki: I think he just wanted to have me look at his wound, which was healing quite well. “More than talking about him, we talked about the Bible,” Dr. Sasaki said. He said he was there for medical purposes, though, The visits may have been 5 years apart. (ABC7)

Sasaki recalled that he was told that Jackson had a low pain tolerance, and that Hoefflin would take care of managing it. The doctor said that was unusual, since he usually saw patients throughout their recovery process. He said sometimes docs want to keep control of their celebrity patients, but noted he was just speculating that’s what was happening with MJ (AP) Dr. Sasaki prepared a summary of all the treatment of MJ on Feb 7, 2013. He wrote Dr. Hoefflin told him MJ had a low threshold to pain. Dr. Hoefflin strongly suggested he managed the pain medications since he knew the patient better. Dr. Sasaki said that with celebrities, when he doesn’t get to see patients frequently, he prefers not to treat them. Q: Did you provide any post operation pain care? A: None Q: Was that unusual? A: It’s highly unusual. Dr. Sasaki said if he doesn’t see the patient regularly he prefers not to give pain medication. He said he never talked to MJ about the pain treatment. Dr. Sasaki: I think when you’re dealing with high profile clients, some doctors prefer to keep it under control. Dr. Sasaki said he did the surgery but didn’t see the patient until 2-3 months later, which is highly unusual. Q: Did you prescribe any medication to MJ? A: No. Dr. Sasaki said normally a patient who undergoes that kind of surgery has pain lasting for 6 weeks. (ABC7)

In July 1993, Sasaki said he spoke to Klein, who suggested that he prescribe Jackson Percocet to deal with his pain. Sasaki’s notes indicated that he suggested Jackson see a pain management specialist. The doctor said he grew uncomfortable prescribing Percocet after Jackson requested the medicine 3 times between July-Aug. 1993. Each time Sasaki said he gave the singer 45 pills but he was concerned about the frequency of the requests. Sasaki said Klein told him that he would take care of Jackson’s pain needs. On Aug. 15, 1993, the doctor saw Jackson again. This time, Sasaki said he gave Jackson Demerol because the singer complained of serious pain. The doctor said it was the only time he ever gave anyone Demerol because the drug can start to alter a patient’s lifestyle. Sasaki said at the time, Dr. Klein told him that he was concerned about Jackson’s performance on a world tour. The last time Sasaki treated Jackson was in in 1998 and he never saw the singer again after that. (AP)

Dr. Sasaki testified from his record that on June 30, 1993 he had the first post op follow up at the Dr. Klein’s office. He said MJ was experiencing pain due to his work and rehearsals. He had to wear a hairpiece to camouflage the scar. Dr. Sasaki said he told Debbie Rowe that the area should be exposed to air as much as possible to heal. On July 3, 1993, Dr. Sasaki prescribed Percocet for MJ. It was the first time he prescribed pain medication to MJ. Dr. Sasaki said he spoke with Dr. Klein and that Klein suggested Percocet. On July 20, 1993, there was another request for Percocet, due to strenuous rehearsals, prescribed with the knowledge of Dr. Klein. On Aug 10, 1993, Dr Sasaki received a phone call from Dr. Klein that MJ was experiencing extreme pain. Doctor said pain was normal 4-6 weeks after surgery due to the nerves growing back Dr. Sasaki suggested to Dr. Klein that MJ be seen by a pain management specialist. “I was concerned about pain patterns and his use of Percocet,” Dr. Sasaki testified. Q: Was he taking too much? A: Yes Q: Where you the only person prescribing Percocet to MJ? A: I don’t know. Dr. Sasaki said he prescribed 45 tablets of Percocet each time. Dr. Sasaki told Dr. Klein and MJ he would no longer prescribe Percocet to MJ since he was asking for too much. Percocet prescription, 45 tablets each time, were prescribed on: July 3, July 20 and Aug 10, 1993. Q: Was that very frequent? A: Frequent. On Aug 15, 1993, Dr. Sasaki said he saw patient, with Debbie Rowe. He was complaining to pain in scar area, area had healed completely. Dr. Sasaki said he injected site with pain reliever, gave Demerol 100 mg, suggested MJ to see pain specialist. Aug 15, 1993 Dr. Sasaki prescribed Demerol to MJ under Omar Arnold. This was the first and last time Dr. Sasaki gave Demerol to MJ, he said. Dr. Sasaki explained Demerol is for acute pain, not chronic pain, following major surgery. Q: About how often do you prescribe Demerol? A: None. “Because I don’t do that kind of surgery that requires that kind of pain medication,” Dr Sasaki testified. Dr. Sasaki said MJ was the only patient he injected with Demerol. (ABC7)

He testified he is not familiar with MJ’s announcement in 1993 about being dependent on prescription medication. “I’m totally ignorant regarding that,” Dr. Sasaki said. (ABC7)

May 1998 was last time Dr. Sasaki saw and spoke with MJ. He knew doctors Hoefflin, Klein and Metzger treated MJ back then. That ended the video deposition. (ABC7)

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 69 – August 14 2013 – Summary

Katherine Jackson is in court


Debbie Rowe Testimony


AEG Direct

Deborah J. Rowe on the stand. AEG attorney Marvin Putnam is conducting the direct examination. She's testifying pursuant to a subpoena. (ABC7)

Putnam: How are you doing today? Rowe: It's a little warm in here.

Putnam: Did you do anything to prepare for your testimony today? Rowe: I took a shower (people laughed). (ABC7) When Putnam asked if she did anything to prepare for her testimony, Rowe quipped, “Took a shower.” She hadn’t read her deposition or did any of the other steps many other witnesses had taken to prepare for her testimony. (AP)

Putnam named several attorneys for both sides and asked Rowe if she knew them. She knew some by name only, mostly she said no. (ABC7) Putnam also tried to establish her as an independent witness, getting her to states she came to court because of a subpoena, not voluntarily. Rowe was also asked whether she had met most of the attorneys in the room. She said no. He also asked about other plaintiffs’ attorneys. Putnam rattled off the names of Sandra Ribera, Perry Sanders, Kevin Boyle, KC Maxwell, Michael Koskoff and others. She didn’t know them. (AP)

Rowe started out fairly at ease on the witness stand, asking AEG Live’s defense attorney Marvin Putnam to get her testimony done today. She explained that she lives 60 miles away and it was a tough commute. “I sat at a light for 20 minutes. How do you people do it?” (AP) Rowe said she lives 60 miles away. "I sat in traffic at a light for 20 minutes! 20 minutes! " (ABC7)

"He became a patient, that's how I met him," Rowe said about MJ. (ABC7)

Rowe said she breeds and trains quarter horses and paint horses for 10 years. She was born in Spokane, Washington. Rowe's father was a pilot for the Air Force. Her parents divorced, the kids moved to Los Angeles. Rowe was 11. She went to Hollywood High, Valley College, studied to be a nurse tech, EMT, began working with Dr. Klein. Rowe studied to be EMT -- Emergency Medical Technician. She worked for extern time with Shaffer ambulance company. Rowe began working with Dr. Klein in July 1978-79. She said she's not good with dates, but is good with facts. "I hated history," she jokes. She graduated high school in 1977, went to college for a year, EMT class and then began working at Dr. Klein. (ABC7) Rowe was then asked about her personal history. She studied to be an Emergency Medical Technician, then went to work with Klein in late 70s. Rowe repeatedly told Putnam and the jury that she was bad with dates and wouldn't be able to recall them exactly. Putnam asked Rowe a question about Klein’s prominence. “He is a legend in his own mind,” Rowe replied. Rowe stopped working for Klein in 1996 or ’97 _ she couldn’t remember when. She said Jackson pushed her to return to college. Rowe said she ended up going back to school and got a BS in psychology. She then started a horse breeding program in Palmdale. (AP)

One of the girls who studied with her worked in the insurance billing of Klein's office and said the dermatologist was looking for assistant. "He was a legend in his own mind," Rowe said about Dr. Klein. "We had a very high profile clientele." Rowe said Klein is a dermatologist, began working on skin diseases, then specialized on Botox and collagen, which he's most known for now. She worked with Dr Klein until 1997. Rowe said she'd take patients to the room, take their history, find out why they came to see the doctor. She explained the procedure, return call for the doctor, did biopsy reports, scheduled appointments. (ABC7)

"Michael encourage me to go back to college," Rowe said, that's why she left Dr. Klein's office in 97. Rowe did Antioch University for 2 1/2 years. She got a degree in psychology. Rowe left LA and started her horse breeding in Palmdale. (ABC7)

Rowe said Dr. Klein would see high profile patients after hours or weekend. She got a call from Dr. Klein and tried really hard not to go. She said even though they we not registered nurses, Dr. Klein called them nurses instead assistants. Rowe said she opened the door of the room and MJ was there. "I introduced myself, said nobody does what you do better, you're amazing." "And nobody does what I do better, I'm amazing." She said MJ laughed about it and that's when the friendship started. This was in 1982 or 84 . This was the first time, to Rowe's knowledge, that MJ went to see Dr. Klein. Putnam asked what kind of treatment it was. Rowe asked judge if she's allowed to disclose medical information about patient. Judge said yes. "He was there for acne," Rowe responded. MJ was a patient of Dr. Klein until the time he passed away. (ABC7)

Rowe said she met Jackson while working for Klein as an assistant who took patient histories and helped schedule appointments with the dermatologist and other doctors. She said she met Jackson when Klein called her in on a weekend in the early 1980s. "I opened the door to the room and Michael was there. I introduced myself and I said, 'Nobody does what you do better. Nobody. You are amazing, but nobody does what I do better. I am amazing and if we could do these amazing things on regular time, I would appreciate it.'” (LATimes) Rowe described her first meeting with Jackson in the early 1980s, when he came into Klein's office for treatment of acne. She said Klein often met with celebrity patients on weekends and after-hours so they could avoid scrutiny, and in her first meeting with Jackson she asked him to come into the office for future visits at a more convenient time. "That's when our friendship started," she said.Rowe said she would frequently talk to Jackson on the phone and eventually started to accompany him to his treatments with Hoefflin. The plastic surgeon would give Jackson propofol during procedures and the singer would be unconscious for several hours. (AP) Rowe described her first meeting with Jackson, which came outside regular business hours when she wanted to spend time with her nieces. Rowe said she told MJ that they were both at the top of their fields, and said it’d be nice if he came to the office during regular hours. She said she was very casual with patients. “Dr. Klein would call me probably the least professional assistant he had,” Rowe said. Rowe said she was a great hand holder for patients, and that Jackson appreciated her playing that role with his treatments. They met in ’82 or ’84, and the singer started coming into the office more after he was diagnosed with lupus, she said. She and Jackson sparked up a friendship, speaking on the phone often and eventually seeing each other outside the office. (AP)

Rowe said Dr. Klein would call her, but she was probably the worse nurse, not formal at all. She said she's great hand holder but not a good to have scientific discussions. And Michael liked her casualness that way. "He came in more frequently," Rowe said after MJ was diagnosed with lupus in 93. "We would speak on the phone, quite often." They spoke regularly until they were divorced. Rowe said she married MJ in 1996. They were married for 3 years. She said she didn't move to Palmdale until 2002. Rowe said besides acne, they treated MJ for lupus and vitiligo. (ABC7)

She said she doesn't remember when collagen was approved by FDA. I know for sure it was during "Dangerous" tour. Putnam said it was 1992/93. MJ was receiving collagen before the tour for acne scar. Botox was not available yet.

Putnam: Was he being given pain medication or numbing? Rowe: Not in the beginning, I think we did it without anything once or twice. Rowe said they'd give MJ 100 mg of Demerol intramuscular. "I gave him the injection," she said. "Because of the pain of collagen injection." “He had a low tolerance for pain," Rowe said. Putnam: Where there other drugs for pain? Rowe: The only thing was 100 mg of Demerol.

Putnam: How about percodan? Rowe: No P: Valium? R: No. Putnam: How about Vicodin? Rowe: Not for procedures in the office. (ABC7)

Rowe begins to cry. "Michael respected doctors tremendously that they went to school and studied. And meant no harm," Rowe said, crying. "Unfortunately some doctors decided when Michael was in pain that they would try to outbid each other on who could give the better drug" "So he listened to the doctors." Rowe said the doctors were Klein and Hoefflin. MJ asked Rowe to be present to make sure everything was ok. "Michael had a very low pain tolerance," she said. "His fear of pain was incredible," Rowe said, crying. "And I think the doctors took advantage of him in that way” . Rowe: If someone comes to you and say they're the best at what they do and someone else that you see claims the same, who do you listen to? (ABC7)

Rowe described various treatments that Jackson got over the years, including botox and collagen injections for acne scars. She started to break down when she began to describe how Jackson viewed doctors. “Michael respected doctors immensely,” she said. “Unfortunately, some of the doctors decided,” Rowe said, pausing to wipe away tears, “that when Michael was in pain that they would try to outbid each other on who could get the better drug. And so he listened to the doctors.” (AP)

Doctors "would try to outbid" each other on who could give Michael Jackson "the better drug" for his pain, Rowe testified. "Michael had a very low pain tolerance and his fear of pain was incredible," Rowe testified. "And I think that doctors took advantage of him that way." (CNN)

Michael Jackson's doctors: Hoefflin -- plastic surgeon Metzger -- internist Klein – dermatologist

Rowe said Dr Sasaki prescribed Percodan and Vicodin to MJ after the scalp surgery. Sasaki's procedure on MJ was extremely painful, Rowe said. Rowe went to see MJ twice a day and over the weekend when he had the surgery. Rowe said docs Klein and Hoefflin were competing. "I was concerned that he was not getting better, the two doctors were going back and forth and I needed one doctor to talk to me. And I chose Dr. Metzger." Rowe said. She said she called Metzger as a friend, since it was probably not appropriate to call another doctor to rat out the doctor you worked for . "Klein was not doing what was the best for Michael," Rowe testified. "The only physician who ever did anything, who cared for Michael was Dr. Metzger," Rowe said, crying again. Putnam asked if there was any other doctor who treated until he passed. "Dr. Murray got in there and killed him, so I don't know," she said. (ABC7) "The only physician who ever cared for Michael as Michael was Allen Metzger," Rowe testified, referring to the doctor who became his primary care physician for several years. "So Metzger continued as his doctor?" AEG Live lawyer Marvin Putnam asked. "I don't know, because Conrad Murray got in there and killed him," Rowe replied (CNN)

Rowe said she was caught in the middle of Dr. Arnold Klein and Dr. Steven Hoefflin’s conflicting treatments of Jackson. She reached out to Jackson’s general doctor, Allan Metzger. “I needed one person to talk to me and I chose Metzger,” she said. (AP) Rowe said the pop star trusted doctors to prescribe pain medication to him, but they sometimes tried to outdo each other while losing sight of Jackson's care. "Michael had a very low pain tolerance and his fear of pain was incredible," Rowe said. "I think the doctors took advantage of him that way." She said she was with Jackson when he received treatments from his longtime dermatologist Dr. Arnold Klein and from another physician, Dr. Steven Hoefflin. The two doctors would try to out-do each other in the pain medications they gave the singer, she said. "These idiots were going back and forth the whole time, not caring about him," Rowe told jurors. Rowe said she told another one of Jackson's doctors, Allan Metzger, that she was concerned that Klein and Hoefflin were giving the singer too many medications. "The only physician who ever did anything, the only physician who cared for Michael was Allan Metzger," Rowe said, fighting back tears. She said Jackson respected doctors immensely because they went to school and vowed to do no harm to patients. (AP)

Debbie Rowe testified Wednesday that doctors seemed in competition to see who could give him the most powerful painkillers. “Michael had a very low pain tolerance, and his fear of pain was incredible, and I think the doctors took advantage of him that way,” said Rowe, the mother of the singer's two oldest children. Rowe spoke in a folksy, informal manner on the stand, coming across as someone who truly cared about the singer. Rowe said that dermatologist Arnold Klein took over Jackson's pain management but that plastic surgeon Steven Hoefflin would call the singer and say, "I have a better drug." At one point, she said, she found a bottle of the powerful drug dilaudid on Jackson's counter that Hoefflin had prescribed. She said she told Jackson not to take it. “These idiots were going back and forth the whole time not caring about him," she testified. Rowe, who worked for Klein, said she was concerned that Jackson was not getting better.“Klein was not doing what was best for Michael," she said. "The only physician who who ever cared for Michael was Allan Metzger,” his internist, who was treating Jackson for lupus.She said Jackson began receiving pain medication after his scalp was burned during the filming of a Pepsi commercial. (LATimes)

Rowe said that after the burn, his scalp had scars and, because he was black, he developed keloid, thickening, painful scars. He didn't want to wear the hairpiece, Rowe said. They were going in and having ballon expansion surgery every week. "His sensitivity to pain was off the charts at this time," Rowe explained. (ABC7)

Putnam: What was your concern with Dr. Hoefflin? Rowe: Overprescribing medications. "You don't call someone and say here, let's take dilaudid instead of aspirin when you're trying to get off," she said. "These idiots were going back and forth all the time and not caring about him," Rowe said. Dilaudid is a form of morphine, she said. Putnam asked if MJ took the stronger painkiller. "No, because I took it away," Rowe said. "Hoefflin gave it to him and I said no, you're not taking it. So I threw it away." (ABC7)

"He was so afraid of pain because the pain was so great," Rowe recalled. Rowe said she ended up with Michael all the time, until the procedure was over. "I think he had to rehearse for the tour." Dr. Metzger laid out plan to reduce Demerol and substitute medication for non-narcotic. Rowe: To wean him off narcotic to non-narcotic, because he was leaving to go on tour. "I was the one giving the medication to Michael at the time," Rowe said. Rowe: He (MJ) had a place in Century City, I worked in BH, I would be there every day to take lunch, stopped before going home. She would come back if MJ needed. That lasted 6 weeks, until MJ went on tour, she said. (ABC7)

Rowe said she didn't know anything about Propofol back then. She now knows Diprivan is the same as Propofol. MJ was getting Diprivan for procedures. Rowe said she doesn't know if it was at Dr. Hoefflin or Klein's office, maybe for collagen injection . Rowe said Klein had a handful of patients who got Demerol for collagen injections. Hoefflin had an anesthesiologist and surgical suite in his office. Over the years, Rowe said Hoefflin gave Diprivan to MJ probably 10 times (ABC7)

Rowe: However, there were occasions that MJ wanted to have it, he had extensive scarring on his nose that made it difficult to breathe. Rowe said there were occasions Michael asked Hoefflin to do inject steroids on his nose, and Dr. Hoefflin would put MJ out. "He didn't treat him, he would tape him as he had injected him," Rowe testified. "It took him a little while to wake up, 4-5 hours, which I think it's normal for plastic surgeon." Rowe said when anesthetist David Fournier woke MJ up, it was maybe 1 hour for Michael to recover. With Hoefflin, she was there for 4-6 hours. Rowe explained Dr. Hoefflin said he didn't see the scaring in MJ's nose, so he wasn't going to do the procedure. Putnam: But he told Michael he had done the procedure? Rowe: Yes. Putnam asked when Propofol was used in MJ. "Only with the injections for scaring around the nose," Rowe responded. Putnam: Otherwise he would not have Propofol? Rowe: Diprivan. All the time I went to see Dr. Hoefflin he put him under. Rowe: Fournier is a nurse anesthetist, would come to the office with all the equipment to monitor Michael. Rowe: He was allowed to do it until 1996, when law changed and it had to be done at surgery center. Rowe said she doesn't remember who the person giving Diprivan was in Dr. Hoefflin's office. She described Fournier as a very nice man. Rowe said MJ got Diprivan (Propofol) when Dr. Klein injected collagen, if we had to do acne treatments. She said Dr. Klein has 5-6 patients who take Diprivan for collagen injection and Botox. (ABC7)

Rowe said she was with Jackson about 10 times when Hoefflin gave him the anesthetic propofol when he was undergoing various procedures, such as collagen and botox injections. She said Klein also gave him propofol. She said Klein had five or six other patients whom he knocked out when they were undergoing cosmetic procedures. She said there were times when extensive scarring in Jackson's nose made it difficult for him to breathe and that he needed a painful injection of steroids in his nose to bring down the swelling. On at least two occasions, Hoefflin put Jackson out with propofol and didn't do anything other than put tape in his nose, Rowe testified.However, she said she was not aware of Jackson ever going to Hoefflin's office because he was feeling stress or needed sleep. (LATimes)

Rowe said that Hoefflin told her that there were times he gave Jackson anesthesia, but performed no medical procedures. Rowe said the need to manage Jackson’s pain medications became necessary after he had scalp surgery in 1993. The amount of time that Jackson was put under for procedures varied between Hoefflin and Klein’s offices, Rowe said. When Klein performed a procedure, Jackson was often awake within an hour. At Hoefflin’s, he might be in recovery for 6+ hours, she said. Rowe said she wasn’t sure precisely which anesthetic drugs were being used at Hoefflin’s office, but some propofol was involved.(AP)

The "Thriller" singer later developed painful "thickening" keloid scars and decided to try a scalp-expansion procedure meant to stretch his healthy skin for a graft before his 1993 Dangerous tour. She said Michael was going in for weekly injections into a balloon placed under his skin and found the pressure "extremely painful." "His sensitivity to pain was just off the charts at this point," she said, explaining that she had grown close to the entertainer through her job at the office of his Beverly Hills dermatologist Dr. Arnold Klein. Rowe said Dr. Klein and Jackson's plastic surgeon Dr. Steven Hoefflin were "competing" for favor at this time, and she claimed she was at Jackson's Century City residence on one occasion when she had to confiscate a prescription of Dilaudid, a powerful narcotic. "Hoefflin gave it to him, and while it was sitting on the counter I said, 'You're not taking this,'" she testified. "He was so afraid of the pain because the pain was so great. …I ended up being with him all the time until this procedure was over." She said Dr. Klein also used the surgery-strength anesthetic propofol to put Jackson under for collagen injections used to treat his acne scars. Rowe said she also witnessed propofol infusions given in Dr. Hoefflin's office. She claimed that on two occasions, Dr. Hoefflin had Jackson knocked out with propofol but didn't perform the procedures that Jackson requested.She said Jackson believed he was receiving steroid shots to reduce swollen scar tissue in his nose, but that Dr. Hoefflin claimed he didn't see any inflamed tissue. (NYDailyNews) One revelation from Rowe was that a Beverly Hills plastic surgeon faked doing a procedure on Jackson on two occasions, although he told the singer he had done it. Jackson complained about painful scars in his nose and went to Dr. Steven Hoefflin to inject them with collagen, she said. "He put Michael out and didn't do anything but put tape on him as if he had treated him," Rowe testified. The doctor told her he did that because he could not find the scars Jackson thought were there. (CNN) Rowe explained that Dr. Steven Hoefflin would give Jackson Propofol when the celeb would have his burn scars injected, and would only take the drug when having a procedure done."Michael had extension scarring in his nose that made it difficult to breath," Rowe said. "To inject the nose—I can't think of anything more painful." However, Rowe added that there were times she knew about when one doctor would just give Jackson Propofol and put him under for four or five hours without giving him treatment. She told the court that the doctor would tell Jackson that he had done a procedure when in fact he hadn't.

After lunch, Rowe is back on the stand. Putnam: How are you doing, Ms. Rowe? Rowe: I missed you... Everybody laughed. (ABC7)

Putnam asked if MJ talked about going to doctors office to sleep. "He talked with Dr. Metzger about that," Rowe said. She testified that after Hoefflin put him out, it took him 4-5 hours to wake up. Whereas in Klein's office, in one hour he was fine. "He did have trouble sleeping," Rowe said. Putnam: Did he tell you he sometimes went to a doctor to be put under to sleep? Rowe: It was he got sleep after he had the procedure done. Putnam: So he didn't get put under to get sleep? Rowe: No, I misunderstood what you asked (during her deposition). Putnam played video deposition of Rowe. (ABC7)

Putnam: And did you have an understanding MJ would seek help to sleep at doctor's office? Rowe: Not until we became friends Putnam: Did he ever discuss it with you? Rowe: Only when I was there . Putnam: Did he get sleep at doctor's office? Rowe: Sometimes Putnam: Do those include the 3 times he was out of the country? Rowe: Yes. Putnam: Why did you insist on that? Rowe: I wanted to make sure he woke up (crying) Putnam: You were insisted to be there? Rowe: Yes. Rowe: He was put down, procedure didn't take 1 hour, but for some reason the anesthesiologist put him under, he slept longer than Fournier. Rowe clarified that MJ wasn't put to sleep, he didn't have the IV running, he was in the recovery room sleeping. Rowe: For whatever reason, he was in the recovery room for 5-6 hours as opposed to an hour in our office. "I don't know what the difference in how they sedated Michael," Rowe said. Putnam: Did it concern you? "You make it sound like he was going in all the time, but he wasn't," Rowe said crying. "You're talking about a 12 year period." (ABC7)

Rowe said the scalp surgery was different from the time he was having scar tissue on his nose and couldn't breathe. She said MJ would go in sometimes every 6 months, some times sooner than that to see Dr. Hoefflin. Putnam: How often was he seeing Dr. Klein? Rowe: In the early 90s, not that often. Rowe: We tried not using an anesthesiologist, and that's when Klein suggested to use Demerol. Rowe: After his scalp surgery, it's when the issue with his pain became more of a problem. His fear of pain became a bigger issue. "He didn't have that before, the Demerol he got was enough," Rowe explained. (ABC7)

Rowe said MJ didn't come in for collagen unless he had to do a performance or appearance somewhere. (ABC7)

Putnam: Did you believe when he told you he was in pain? Rowe: Klein was injecting him in the lower eyelid, yeah, I believed him. Rowe said in the beginning when they did the collagen they were doing it on the nasal-labial fold. But the pain was closer to the nose area because of the scaring, it was turning black and blue. Rowe: When he'd lose weight, this would come up. He would lose weight because he was rehearsing. He lost 8-9 lbs of water every show he did. Rowe: It's when you get to the eyes and around the eyes, it does hurt. We didn't start doing the center of the face until later. (ABC7)

Rowe said in "Dangerous" tour (92-93) there was collagen for nasal-labial fold, acne treatment and management of lupus. Rowe said she was assigned to MJ. "He was my patient," she said. She was the assistant Michael would have. Rowe said MJ was getting Diprivan with Dr. Hoefflin because it was for surgical procedure. Rowe said after the procedure with Dr. Sasaki in 93, she was concerned with MJ's use of prescription drugs. "I don't remember if it was worse and worse (the pain), or it was just not getting better," Rowe said. (ABC7)

Rowe: MJ had seen Hoefflin, Hoefflin had given him dilaudid and MJ called Klein. Klein didn't understand anything he was saying on phone. "I left the office and stayed with him at the Sheraton," Rowe said. She believes dilauded is a morphine. Putnam: Was this around the time of the first allegations against MJ? Rowe: No. Rowe: He was heavily under the influence of whatever Hoefflin had given him. The bottle on the dresser when I walked in and I took the pills. Putnam: You took them? Rowe: I put them in my purse P: Did you tell him you were taking it? R: Yes. Putnam: What did you say? Rowe: I'm taking this, you're f***ed up, I'm sorry. Putnam: What did he answered? Rowe: He said yeah, and then I asked if he was ok. Then I unplugged all the phones in the hotel room. Rowe: He liked to talk on the phone, you couldn't understand him, I didn't want him to embarrass himself. I was there all night. Rowe said she doesn't know why MJ was at the Sheraton, she thinks he never told her. (ABC7) She also told the jury about an incident in which Hoefflin apparently gave Jackson the painkiller Dilaudid and she had to take it away. Jackson had called Klein after taking the medication and was unintelligible. Klein sent Rowe to take care of MJ at a hotel in Universal City “He was heavily under the influence of whatever Hoefflin had given him,” Rowe said. She said she confiscated a bottle of Dilaudid. Rowe dropped the F-bomb to describe what she told Jackson after taking the pill bottle. “I said I’m taking these, you’re (effed) up,” Rowe said. She apologized for the bad language. Rowe said she unplugged all the phones in the room, since MJ liked to talk on the phone and she didn’t want him to call anyone else. She stayed the rest of the night in the hotel suite to make sure Jackson was OK. She would also live with him after the scalp surgery. (AP)


Rowe said there was Dr. Sasaki in 93, Sheraton going on, MJ was getting ready for a tour, a leg of a tour, I don't know which. Rowe: We couldn't get grip of pain, Sasaki had stepped away, Hoefflin and Klein were having a pissing contest over who gave him better drugs. "Not a contest, a pissing match," Rowe said. Rowe said MJ was fine the next morning, he didn't need anything. "I didn't leave dilaudid with him and didn't leave the medication that Klein sent him," Rowe explained. Rowe said she took meds from Klein's office and she knows Hoefflin's drugs came from his office also, there was no prescription. (ABC7)

Putnam: Was Dr. Klein giving MJ Demerol? Rowe: If he was seeing Klein for acne treatment, yes. Rowe said it started with 50 mg of Demerol, Klein bumped up to 100 mg then 100 mg with 50 mg of disteril. She said the disteril was to give less demerol. Disteril is like benadryl, she explained. Rowe: There were times I'd take the Demerol out and give more Disteril. Because I didn't think he needed that much. Putnam: Did you ever tell Klein you changed the doses? Rowe: No. He was my boss, he was the doctor, he didn't need to know I called Metzger. "We couldn't get a grip on the pain, when tissue expands gets bigger and bigger gets more pain," Rowe said. (ABC7)

Putnam asked about the Fentanyl patch. Rowe said she doesn't know the details of the patch, but knows about the patch. (ABC7)

Rowe said the closer it got for MJ to go on tour, the more often it became (visits to Klein). He'd have to fly Klein and became expensive. Putnam: What were you concerned about? Rowe: It was the Demerol and him going on tour. Rowe: Michael was getting ready to go on tour, he wasn't completely off Demerol, but he was right there. "It was a fight to get him there because he had such fear the pain that would happen if we didn't catch it," Rowe recalled. "He was going so well, I didn't want anything to screw up," Rowe testified. Putnam asked what happened when she arrived at MJ's house and everything is gone. Rowe said she was told MJ's gone on tour. Rowe said she was told 'well they took him, there's nothing we could do.' Rowe: I didn't know he was leaving. I called Dr. Metzger and told how concerned I was. Rowe: I got a call back, said I needed to take all the meds I had to wean him off Demerol and take to this doctor at the Peninsula Hotel. Rowe said Metzger had given specific notes on how to give MJ the meds. "I met this doctor at the Peninsula," she said. "I offered to go over everything with him, he just grabbed the bag, said I know what I'm doing, and left," Rowe recalled crying. Rowe called Metzger and said she was concerned about what had happened. "I found out Forecast had gone 2 Bangkok, 1st thing he did he gave MJ 100mg of demerol, screwed everything up we had done" Rowe said, crying. (ABC7)

Rowe said she got concerned with Jackson’s Demerol usage after the surgery, and worked with Metzger to wean him off of it. Rowe said she lowered his doses without letting Klein know and worked with Metzger to institute a plan to get MJ off Demerol. She said it was working until Jackson abruptly left to go on another leg of the “Dangerous” tour. Rowe returned to Jackson’s condo one day and all his stuff with gone. His assistant said Jackson had left to go on tour. She said Metzger then told her to deliver Jackson’s medications and his treatment plan to a Dr. Forecast, who was going on the tour with MJ. Rowe said Forecast didn’t listen to her while she tried to describe the treatment plan. She said she later learned that “the first thing” Forecast did was give Jackson Demerol on the tour. That led to more problems. (AP) Rowe described efforts to wean Jackson off the painkiller Demerol after he had surgery in 1993 to repair damage to his scalp, which was burned while filming a Pepsi commercial. She said Metzger devised a plan to treat Jackson's pain with different medications before he went on a leg of his "Dangerous" tour. Rowe lived with Jackson for three weeks to ensure he stayed on the regimen. "At that point we were friends," Rowe said. "He wasn't a patient." She said Jackson knew he couldn't take pain medications forever but needed a strong voice to get him off the drugs. "I'm probably one of the only people who said no to him," Rowe said. Rowe said the plan to break Jackson's use of Demerol failed when a doctor who accompanied the singer on tour gave him the drug while overseas. (AP)

(Rowe then points to Jessica Bina, attorney for AEG, and says "She's mad because... what????" Judge said attorneys need to talk sometimes. (ABC7))

Putnam: Were you trying to get him off the drugs? Rowe: At the very end of this time period yes P: Why? R: Because he was going on tour. "He knew you don't stay on, you can't do narcotics forever. He knew that," Rowe recalled. Rowe said Metzger designed a plan to wean him off the drugs. She said she stayed in Century City with MJ most nights. "He was my friend," Rowe said. They were friends, he was not a patient, she said. Putnam: Did you stay to help him with surgery or get off the drugs? Rowe: Both. "He was worried about the pain," she said. "I was probably one of the only people who said no to him." Rowe: He respected the doctors and did what they were told to do by the doctors. I was concerned about what Klein and Hoefflin were doing. Metzger said he was going to talk to Klein and Hoefflin. She heard Metzger on the phone w/ Klein, said they then became using disteril. (ABC7)

Putnam: Do you think Michael was proud of what he had done? Rowe: Michael was a prideful person. Rowe said she told MJ in Mexico City that he had a problem with drugs. During the 3 week period in Century City, she didn't say it was a problem. "I said you're taking too much, you can't take this forever." Putnam: Do you know the amount of Demerol he was taking? Rowe: Dr. Metzger probably did because of the plan he had put together. Putnam: Was it a difficult 3 weeks? Rowe: It was for Michael. The fear of the pain, he was very restless. (ABC7)

Putnam: And when you went to his apartment everything was gone? Rowe: I didn't know he was leaving. That's why I was so upset that Dr. Forecast was not listening," Rowe explained. "Forecast hadn't been in on anything over last few months" "He was taking everything and being an arrogant a** about it," Rowe recalled. Rowe said she was at the Peninsula Hotel for not even 5 minutes. She met Dr. Forecast on the lobby. She said she believes there was some Demerol, Toradol, notes, everything that had been done, Metzger's number, Klein's number. Rowe said Dr. Metzger told her to bring all these to Dr. Forecast. She was told Dr. Forecast was going on tour with MJ.(ABC7)

Dr. Klein treated MJ while on tour. Rowe went with him. She remembered going on the Dangerous and HIStory tours and end of Bad tour. "Bad tour was just acne treatment," Rowe said. Dangerous tour was acne, collagen and vitiligo; HIStory acne, vitiligo, lupus, collagen. Putnam: How about Botox? Rowe: I don't think Botox was approved before I left. Putnam: How do you travel with collagen? Rowe: It's almost like you ship the seed of love from a horse in a thermos. Everyone laughed. Rowe: I'd give Demerol and Disteril and Dr. Klein would treat him. (ABC7)

Putnam: Was there a time on tour you were concerned with MJ misusing Demerol? Rowe: Mexico City. Rowe said MJ was supposed to go to Puerto Rico after Mexico City, but never made it. "He was a hot mess," Rowe said when she saw him in Mexico City. "He was depressed, he had taken something, I don't know what he had taken or he had gotten it from," Rowe recalled. "He was on something, that he was taking something. I thought he was back on Demerol," Rowe said. Rowe: I walked into the room, his suites were never a mess. The suite was a mess. He wasn't kept, he was always kept. Rowe: He wasn't making eye contact, he wasn't speaking, he didn't make sense when he did and he said was having problem with his scalp again. "We got in a fight," Rowe said. "I'm hot headed, I went off on him about Forecast." Rowe: I was angry that Forecast had intercepted Metzger, that Forecast had undermined everything that was done. "I thought Forecast was hurting him not helping," Rowe explained. "He was arrogant." It had only been 6 weeks since Rowe had seen Michael. "Then I went to Mexico City and he was a completely different person," she said. "You go to Puerto Rico is like going to US," Rowe told MJ. "You need to straighten up, face whatever is going on and we will get through it". This fight went on for 2-3 days, Rowe said. "You have to go somewhere to get better or it's not gonna work," Rowe told MJ. He went to some place in England, rehab. Putnam: Did he admit he had a problem? Rowe: He knew that he screwed up. He knew he was messed up. "Michael and I had a few fights and when we had them it was lulus," Rowe described. She said she flew off the handle, asked why he flew off the handle, why got angry. "I'm not about to lose my friend over this," Rowe claimed "I can't make everything better as much as I want to, so you have to do it," Rowe testified she told MJ. She cried on the stand again. "I said it will pass, you haven't done anything wrong, you just need to be strong," Rowe said. Rowe: He felt that he had disappointed me. I told him he hadn't disappointed me, I blamed it on Forecast. "Forecast was yet another doctor who didn't put him first as a patient, as a human being," Rowe expressed. Putnam: Did you confront Dr. Forecast? Rowe: They would not let me see him, the management people. "He foolish trusted a lot of people," Rowe said. "He knew I was going to go and chew his a** out." Rowe: I asked security to talk to the doctor, they said I needed to get it cleared, and was told no. (ABC7)

Rowe said she saw Jackson in Mexico City when he went there for the “Dangerous” tour. He was messy and wouldn't make eye contact. She said she tried to confront Dr. Forecast, but she wasn't allowed to see him. She didn't remember who blocked that effort. “You can’t go looking and acting like this,” Rowe said she told Jackson. She said she told him he couldn't continue on the tour. Rowe: “You need to straighten up, you need to face whatever it is that’s going on.” Jackson agreed with her and went to rehab. Rowe said she blamed Forecast for the issues. She said Jackson often couldn't see who was hurting him. “He foolishly, foolishly, trusted a lot of people,” Rowe said of Jackson. Katherine nodded her head in agreement. After rehab, Rowe said Jackson was much improved (AP)

As far as she knows MJ completed the rehab program. Putnam: Did you see after rehab? Rowe: Yes P: How did he look? R: He looked great. P: Did you talk to him about it? R: No, it didn't interest me at the time. He said he was feeling better and was ok, Rowe testified. Putnam: After that, was there ever a time you were concerned with his use of Demerol? Rowe: Not like that, no. Rowe: No, because he was fine, he was clean. At that time he was really, really busy recording HIStory album. Rowe said MJ needed a driver because he was always on the phone. She would drive him from Klein's office to the studio. There were occasions MJ would receive Demerol, she said. After the surgery the area that was done fell apart and started with the pain again. Putnam: Did he continue to receive Demerol until the time you left Klein? Rowe: He did. "He wasn't in the office an inordinate amount of time," Rowe testified. She said she saw him on set of "Ghost" and he looked great. (ABC7)

Putnam asked about MJ using Propofol for sleep. It happened only in Germany, and it was 2 days, she responded. Rowe said Prince was a baby, it was 1996, 97 during HIStory tour. "There were 2 anesthesiologists and equipment, looked like surgical suite" Putnam: So in Germany during HIStory tour, MJ was taking propofol/diprivan to sleep? Rowe: Only those two occasions. "I believe it was set up through Dr. Metzger," she said. Putnam: And no procedure was being done, just to sleep? Rowe: Yes. Putnam: Two nights in a row? Rowe: You guys haven't seen a concert of his. "There's no way he could ever do concert 2 nights in a row," Rowe testified. "His shows were so physical, usually had 1-2 nights in between" Rowe explained the German tour: Day 1 night before show -- Propofol Day 2 show Day 3 nothing Day 4 Propofol Day 5 show. Rowe said Propofol was not done in Paris and London. In Germany, MJ was in a hotel room, doctors came in and set it up. "I didn't know we were going to have a second time." She said she didn't know there was going to be a first time either. Rowe said MJ had called Metzger and said he didn't sleep. "I called Metzger to find out what we could do," Rowe described. "They had set everything up and Metzger said the doctors were coming." Rowe said she voiced her concerns to MJ and Metzger. She said it was a little drastic to do something like that and they were in another country, she didn't know the name of the medications. Rowe said Dr. Metzger talked to Michael and it wasn't Dr. Metzger's first choice. Putnam: Why diprivan not sedative, sleeping pills? Rowe: I think he tried and it didn't work. And if he couldn't sleep, he couldn't perform. "He said he was at the end of his rope and didn't know whatelse to do," Rowe recalled. P: Did he indicate he had done it before? R: No. Putnam: Did he indicate he was worried about this? Rowe: He didn't seem to be. We sat with the doctors and went over all the risks/concerns. "They said it was the same stuff we had used in the States," Rowe explained. She's familiar with Fentanyl, Diprivan, but not Propofol, never used that word. "They warned him that any anesthesia is dangerous" Rowe said. Putnam: Did you tell him you were afraid he might die? Rowe: No, I said what happens if you die. "He had so many procedures done with Hoefflin I don't think he was worried about it," Rowe said. Putnam: Did he seem worried at all? Rowe: No, he just seemed worried about not sleeping. Rowe said the doctors did a physical on MJ prior. "I was very impressed, I was very comfortable with Michael being under their care." "It was a hard 8 hours period," Rowe said about Diprivan/Propofol. "It was 8 hours and that was it." (ABC7)

Two German doctors treated Michael Jackson's insomnia with propofol 12 years before he died from an overdose of the surgical anesthetic, his former wife testified Wednesday. Dr. Allen Metzger -- Jackson's general practitioner in the United States -- arranged for the German anesthesiologists to infuse the singer with propofol in a Munich hotel in July 1997 after sedatives failed to help him sleep between concerts, Rowe testified. "I think they tried it and it hadn't worked and if he couldn't sleep, he couldn't perform," she testified. Jackson "was at the end of his rope; he didn't know what else to do." He "felt better" after eight hours of propofol-induced sleep and decided to get a second treatment after his second Munich show, she said. (CNN) Rowe said Metzger arranged for two doctors to give Jackson the anesthetic propofol in Germany in 1997 when he complained that he couldn't sleep during his "HIStory" tour. On two occasions, the doctors brought medical equipment to Jackson's hotel suite and monitored the singer while he was under the effect of the anesthetic for eight hours. The doctors warned Jackson about the dangers of using propofol, but Rowe said he disregarded the information. "He was just more worried about not sleeping," she said. Rowe said she would not allow the singer to get similar propofol treatments for sleep issues after the use in Germany. (AP)

Rowe said next day MJ warmed up with his voice coach on the phone and went to the venue, rested voice during the day, did meet and greet. "I asked next day how he was feeling. He said he felt better," Rowe remembered. Putnam: Did you remain concerned he had done this? Rowe: No, it was the one time Putnam: But then he did it again one day later? Rowe: Yes. Rowe: He said he hadn't slept after the concert, I called Dr. Metzger, I believed it was decided this is something you can't do all the time. Rowe: Dr. Stoll and his assistant did it. They did a physical, it was almost exactly the same as the first time. "They were a little more emphatically you can't do this, we are not doing this again," Rowe said. (ABC7)

Rowe recalled this was the end of the tour."I think we were going to address the issue after." "He always had a sleep disorder, but I don't remember why it had kicked in high gear like it had," Rowe said. Rowe said they were going to a sleep facility, she wasn't with him, she believes Dr. Metzger went along. Rowe said that before, MJ had gotten the procedures done and had gotten sleep. "Even with the doctors in Germany, he woke up," she said. "He was not sound asleep like when he saw Dr. Hoefflin." Rowe: In Germany, he was awaken within 1 hour after the drip had stopped. W/ Hoefflin, he was in the recovery room, with oxygen, for 5-6 hrs. "He'd come to Klein's office and sleep," Rowe said. Putnam: With Diprivan? Rowe: No just sleep. Rowe: He slept when he had the procedures at Hoefflin and he slept after Hoefflin had done the procedure. Rowe: But that was the only place that had happened that I had seen Michael have anesthesia, that was only place it happened, at Hoefflin's (ABC7)

Putnam: After second time in hotel room, were you concerned he was going to do it again? Rowe: That wasn't going to happened again. It just wasn't going to happen again. "You don't give someone Diprivan to sleep. It's not appropriate, it's not a labeled use," Rowe expressed. "He never did it when I was around. It would not have happened," Rowe said about MJ using Diprivan/Propofol again to sleep. Putnam: Did security, nanny see him being put under? Rowe: No, I'm not going to let anyone in when he's sleeping. That's rude. She said her and Grace had been in the room while MJ slept. Rowe took notes of the procedure and gave Dr. Metzger to include in his chart. "I'd go to Europe every other week to see Prince," Rowe said. "We were making Paris." (ABC7)

Rowe: After Michael and I decided to separate, Michael got "custody" of the doctors. It was more important for me that he had Metzger. Rowe: Because Metzger cared about Michael as a human being, wanted the best for him, talked to him for hours. Rowe: Michael could be strong for about 10 minutes, then reasonable and he respected Dr. Metzger very much. (ABC7)

Rowe: We were married. When I was no longer working with Dr. Klein, I felt like I had a completely different role in his life. "I couldn't go in to Dr Klein's office and look at his chart, it's illegal. I felt if he wanted me there he'd talk to me about it" Rowe said. "He needed somebody to be there for him, to not take him, to not look at him as a cash cow," Rowe expressed. (ABC7)

Rowe: I wasn't sure how Michael would be when he woke up. We'd stay in different areas of the hotel because fans would keep the baby awake. Rowe said that he told Grace if MJ didn't look ok to not let him alone with the baby.(ABC7)

"Klein at one time was a brilliant physician, and it was very sad what happened to him," Rowe testified. Rowe said they would get together at Klein's office and talk. "Everybody agreed that it was a little too much to have Diprivan to sleep." (ABC7)

Paris was 4 the last time Rowe saw Michael. That would've been in 2003. (ABC7) Putnam asked Rowe about the last time she saw Michael Jackson. She said it was in around 2003, when Paris was 4 years old. (AP)

Putnam: When it came out he died of overdose of Propofol, how did you react? Rowe: I actually called Dr Klein and said 'what did you give him, you killed him' "I thought he was responsible in some way" Rowe testified. Rowe: I didn't know what Propofol was. I still didn't know. I think it was at a deposition I was told it was the same thing (as diprivan). Putnam: Other than Germany, was there any other time MJ used Diprivan to sleep? Rowe: Not that I was aware of, no. (ABC7)


Jackson cross


Deborah Chang, attorneys for the Jacksons, did cross examination at 3:55 pm PT. (ABC7)

Chang asked how Rowe was. "I have a headache to die for, I'm tired," Rowe said. (ABC7)

At the day of the deposition, plaintiffs didn't show up. Rowe said AEG attorneys told her they didn't want to come. Rowe hung up on Mrs. Jackson's assistant when asked to talk to KJ's attorney because she said she didn't want to testify on anyone's behalf. She's here now because of defendant's subpoena, would not come to testify voluntarily. (ABC7) Rowe said she hung up on Mrs. Jackson’s assistant and only came to court because she received a subpoena. (AP)

Rowe is not the legal guardian of either Prince and Paris Jackson. Mrs. Jackson and TJ Jackson are, she said. Chang asked if prior to this year is it true she spent little time with Prince and Paris. Rowe said that was true. Rowe said she reestablished seeing daughter Paris this year. She never spoke to the kids about this lawsuit. (ABC7) Chang asked about Rowe re-establishing contact with Paris this year. Rowe said she had, but she never discussed the case with her. (AP)

Chang: Do you agree you were close friends for 20 years? Rowe: Yes, longer. "It was not like we ever hated each other," Rowe said about MJ. Chang: But communication got complicated because of divorce lawyers? Rowe: There were divorce lawyers/personal assistants that were annoying (ABC7)

Rowe said at Klein's office they did studies of collagen and Botox. She knew Dr. Klein well. Chang: Despite what you think of him now, was Dr. Klein considered a respected dermatologist? Rowe: He was, he was brilliant. (ABC7)

First time MJ went to Dr. Klein he was still in his 20s, and acne caused embarrassment, Rowe said. MJ had discoid lupus, which is a disease in the skin, Rowe said. Discoid lupus is not systemic lupus, which is all over the body. "His scarring was from the burn in the Pepsi commercial," Rowe said. MJ also had vitiligo, which causes discoloration of the skin. Chang wants to show a picture of a black male's hand with vitiligo. Defendants objected, Chang asked for sidebar. (ABC7)

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 70 – August 15 2013 – Summary

Katherine and Trent Jackson is in court.


Debbie Rowe Testimony


Jackson cross

Rowe started out being questioned by Deborah Chang, one of Katherine Jackson’s attorneys. Much of Rowe’s early testimony was explaining the medical conditions Jackson suffered from. Through photos, she explained to the jury what vitiligo, discoid lupus looked like and their effects. (AP)

Jacksons attorney Deborah Chang resumed cross examination. Chang asked if traffic was better today. "It's Palmdale... it was actually worse today," Rowe responded. (ABC7)

Rowe said you couldn't look at it and say it was lupus. Then Chang showed picture of black male with vitiligo. "The thing with vitiligo, the color can come and go and if you go on the sun you can get sunburn," Rowe explained. (ABC7)

Rowe said vitiligo was harder to treat in people with darker skin, and explained that the skin lightening can come and go. She said it became clear that Jackson’s vitiligo wasn’t going to go away at some point, and it caused him tremendous anxiety. Jackson, in consultation with Dr. Klein, opted to de-pigment all of his skin, Rowe said. Vitiligo was one of the reasons that Jackson sought frequent treatment from Dr. Klein, Rowe said. (AP)

"For Michael, it came and went for a good period of the time. It was easy to cover with make-up," Rowe testified. "Everybody said he bleached himself, but he didn't," Rowe said. Rowe: It's easier go lighter color and try to match with make-up. It's hard to match dark skin, they don't make good make-up for dark skin. Rowe said Michael had come to a point it (vitiligo) was going to stay, it wasn't going to get any better. "Each time the pigment disappearead, it got bigger and bigger." She said that cause tremendous anxiety in Michael. Rowe said up until 99 MJ still had issues w/ it. "Vitiligo is seasonal, it'd come and go. Sometimes it'd be better and sometimes it wouldn't. Rowe said Dr. Klein tried different treatments, ultimately tried to de-pigment. "You can't just slap cream around whenever you want, you need to get your skin checked," Rowe said. That's one of the reasons MJ saw Klein. (ABC7)

Chang then asked about the burns to Jackson’s scalp that occurred during the Pepsi commercial shoot. (AP) Michael's burn was very serious, Rowe explained. Rowe: I didn't want him to feel as hopeless as he felt. We may not be able to make it perfect, but let’s see what we can do. "He's very shy, so for him to have all of these going on and being in public it was very hard," Rowe testified. Rowe said MJ cried about it, was embarrassed and felt disfigured. He was worried that people would see disfigurement before he would. Chang asked if there was a comparison to elephant man. She said yes. "He didn't really trust anyone at all," Rowe explained. (ABC7)

Thursday's testimony, however, began with Rowe's description of Jackson's skin problems, which included vitiligo -- a condition in which his pigment disappeared, leaving large white spots on his face, hands and body. "Everyone says he bleached himself, but he didn't," Rowe said. Many of his visits to Dr. Arnold Klein, the Beverly Hills dermatologist where she worked for 18 years as a medical assistant, were to treat the condition, she testified. Jackson compared himself to the "Elephant Man," a 19th-century Englishman who became a circus sideshow curiosity because of severe disfigurements, she said. "He was worried that people would see the disease or the disfigurement before they would see him working sometimes," Rowe testified. He also suffered from discoid lupus, which made his skin tissue "mushy," especially on his scalp, she said. (CNN)

Testifying during a negligence lawsuit filed by Jackson's mother, Debbie Rowe said the singer was treated for scars he sustained when his scalp was burned in a commercial shoot and for the skin-lightening disease vitiligo. Rowe said the injuries as well as the effects of vitiligo left Jackson feeling like he was disfigured. (AP)

Rowe offered perhaps the most detailed public recital of Jackson’s medical ailments, saying he suffered from vitiligo, discoid lupus and keloids from serious burns on his scalp sustained during the 1984 filming of a Pepsi commercial. The conditions, Rowe testified, would be difficult on their own for anyone. For Jackson, she said, it was worse. “He’s very shy. For him to have all this going on and to be in public, it was really really difficult for him,” she said. The singer was embarrassed of his skin conditions, she said, and compared himself to the Elephant Man. Jackson’s vitiligo — where skin loses pigment in patches — “would come and go,” Rowe said, but grew progressively worse. He made a decision to “depigment” his skin because he couldn’t find decent makeup, she said. “Everybody says he bleached himself, which he didn’t,” she said. (LATimes)

Rowe, on her role of accompanying Jackson to procedures: “I didn’t want him to feel as hopeless as he felt and as helpless as he felt.” She said any one of Jackson’s conditions would have been difficult for a person to deal with, but MJ had to deal with it in the public eye. Chang: “He felt disfigured?” Yes, Rowe replied. Chang asked if Jackson felt embarrassed. Rowe said he did feel embarrassed. “He was worried that people would see the disease and the disfigurement before they would see him working,” Rowe said. Rowe was asked whether Jackson compared himself to the Elephant Man. She said he did. (AP)

Rowe said Michael didn't disclose it to his mother. He wanted her to know that he was okay and that she didn't have to worry about him. (ABC7) Rowe was she and Jackson talked about everything, and that he didn’t want to burden his mother with specifics about his conditions. (AP)

Rowe noted she wasn’t a Michael Jackson fan when they met and she told him so. “I apparently have no filter, as my daughter says,” she said. Jackson found her honesty refreshing, Rowe said. She began to accompany him to medical appointments to put him at ease, watch out for him. (AP) Chang: Did you always make him laugh? Rowe: Well, that was our relationship. Rowe said Michael had a really good sense of humor and they tried to find humor in stuff. "And if he was feeling down I'd do something to take his mind off of it," Rowe said. "I apparently have no filter, as my daughter says." Chang: Did he appreciate that on you? Rowe: He did, I think he felt refreshed. Because he couldn't do it, he was happy I could. (ABC7)

“As busy as he was, he wasn’t the best person to think about and organize and keep track of his medical care,” Rowe said. Rowe explained to the jury why Jackson needed two doctors to treat his discoid lupus. She said it needed treatment from a rheumatologist (Dr. Allan Metzger) and a dermatologist, (Dr. Arnold Klein.) Both got extra training in their respective fields. (AP) Rowe: He knew I'd look after him, I wanted him to see the best physician, would find people who would take care of him. Rowe said she told MJ he needed to be organized with his medication, get one of those morning, afternoon, evening pill organizer. (ABC7)

Rowe went with Michael to see other physicians. Dr Metzger is an internist and rheumatologist who treats auto-immune diseases, such as lupus . Chang: So it takes a dermatologist and rheumatologist to treat discoid lupus? Rowe: Yes Rowe said Dr. Metzger was amazing, became MJ's internist. "And he was the best man in our wedding," she said. (ABC7) Chang asked Rowe a few questions about Metzger. She told the jury Metzger was the best man at her and Jackson’s wedding in 1996. (AP)

“He was almost phobic about needles,” Chang asked. “No, he was phobic,” Rowe replied. (AP) Chang: And he was almost phobic to needles? Rowe: Oh, he was phobic. C: And sometimes you'd have to literally hold his hand? R: I always did. Rowe said Michael wanted her present in all procedures. She said he always had problems with scar on burn scalp. Chang: Was Dr. Hoefflin a very prominent plastic surgeon? Rowe: Yes, and very, very good. (ABC7)

Rowe was also complementary of Hoefflin’s skills as a plastic surgeon when he first treated Jackson. She then explained that Jackson had keloids, a series of lumpy bumps on his skin that sometimes happen to burn victims. A couple photos were shown. None of the pictures Chang showed Rowe to demonstrate medical conditions were of Jackson. Rowe said keloids are extremely painful. On Jackson, they started “mid-scalp and went back to the crown,” she said. Keloid tissue is very hard and dense and it requires regular injections to treat. She said an air gun is used for some of the treatments. “It’s horribly painful,” Rowe said. She said in some treatments, you can hear the skin popping while the medication is administered. (AP) Chang: He had painful burn keloids? Rowe: They were keloids, I don't believe there's a different between burn or a cut. A keloid is a keloid. Rowe explained there were areas the scars were linear and elevated, other areas looked like skin had been stretched, other it was very thin. Rowe said Asian skin and Black skin are the worse for trauma. Chang: And do you know keloids can be very painful? Rowe: They are. Rowe said keloid tissue is very dense, hard. To get cortisone in, you don't want it to get around the keloid, you want it to get in the area. Cortisone softens the tissue. "You could hear the skin popping when the medication was going in," Rowe said. "It was horribly painful." (ABC7)

After the treatments on Jackson, there wasn't enough skin for plastic surgeon Steven Hoefflin to do a scalp reduction. That’s why Jackson had to have an implant placed under his scalp to expand the skin. That was done by Dr. Gordon Sasaki. The aim was to get one keloid to contend with on Jackson’s scalp, but it wasn’t successful, Rowe said. It fell apart in 1996 or 1997. In the end, the keloids got “even thicker and lumpier.” Rowe said another surgery wasn't an option. (AP) Rowe: He had such significant scarring, he didn't have enough tissue left, there was no skin to stretch (to do reduction plastic surgery). The burn area couldn't grow hair, baldness also grew. "He hated it," Rowe said. That's when they called Dr. Sasaki, around 1993. Rowe: What they show here is what happened to Michael. They would put saline every 7-10 days and let it stretch it out. Chang: It literally expands, stretches the skin? Rowe: Yes "It was brutally painful," Rowe said. "It required pain medication." (ABC7)

The keloids, she said, were dense, bumpy scars that went from the middle of Jackson’s scalp back to the crown of his head. Klein and other doctors would inject cortisone into the tissue to soften the scars — a procedure Rowe said was “horribly painful.” “You could hear the skin popping when the medication went in,” she said. Ultimately, she said, doctors looked to insert a “tissue expander” to expand what healthy skin was left on the singer’s head. A flap was filled with saline every seven to 10 days to stretch the skin, she said, again describing the treatment as “brutally painful.” (LATimes)


"There are time you cut keloid and you end up w/ bigger keloid," Rowe said. They wanted to have only 1 linear keloid on MJ's head to deal. Around 1997, it felt apart. "Because of the lupus it didn't hold down," Rowe said. He had lumpier, bumpier keloids. Rowe said after cortisone shot, sometimes the keloid would go down, sometime it would get worse. Rowe said after cortisone shot, sometimes the keloid would go down, sometime it would get worse. (ABC7)

Chang: And you saw first hand his fight with pain? Rowe: Yes . Rowe: I wasn't assigned to help him recover, I took care of him when he came to see Dr. Klein. Rowe said, crying, that she went with Michael to other procedures out of love, not because she had to. "Because he was my friend, I wanted to make sure he was ok." (ABC7) Rowe began to break down as Chang asked her to describe her helping Jackson during his medical treatments. She said she wanted to make sure her friend was OK, but it wasn’t part of her job to accompany him to treatments outside of Klein’s office. (AP)


Rowe said she would ask Jackson about his pain on a 1-10 scale, and he would get scared if his pain approached reached level 3. (AP) Rowe developed a pain scale to help measure Michael's pain. She said it was easier to assess the pain that way. Chang: At what number he got scared? Rowe: 3. "I don't know that his pain level went from 3 to 10, I know his fear accelerated because his fear of pain was so bad," Rowe explained. Chang: When he had pain, did he have cold sweats? Rowe: Yes C: Was he pale? R: Yes. Rowe said it was like a blind migraine, he couldn't see, wasn't performing at time, he couldn't do anything. Chang: Do you agree it was debilitating? Rowe: Yes C: And it was real? R: Yes (ABC7) She said she saw him in so much pain, he would have cold sweats, grow pale, and couldn’t see or think clearly when this happened. Chang: “He couldn’t be creative?” “He couldn’t do anything,” Rowe responded. (AP)

Rowe: I didn't want him to unnecessarily take, you don't take vicodin if you can do it with motrin, for example. She said they were doing demerol after surgery, then percocet. Chang: He had legitimate need for pain medication? Rowe: Yes C: You agree MJ wanted to be responsible for pain management? R: Yes. "He didn't want to be loopy," Rowe said. "When he had pain medication, he didn't go out. We stayed in, because he was slurring." Chang: That's not how he wanted to be? Rowe: Correct C: Was he perfectionist? R: Meticulous. Chang: Do you agree he did the best he could? Rowe: Yes . (ABC7)

"His biggest problem was that Dr. Klein and Dr. Hoefflin were trying to overprescribe medication," Rowe opined. Chang: Just to be clear, not at the request of MJ? Rowe: Yes . He did not want pain," Rowe said. She said he had no choice but deal with the doctors. (ABC7)


Jackson was very fearful of pain, she said, noting he was afraid of needles and that she “always” held his hand. The pain would be so intense, she said, he would suffer “blind migraines,” get cold sweats and grow pale. “He couldn’t do anything,” Rowe said. But, Rowe said, she never saw Jackson “doctor shop” in order to get more pain medications. He was very trusting of doctors and “very loyal” to his own, she said. “He said, ‘They take the oath. Do no harm,’” Rowe testified. (LAtimes)

Rowe said Jackson “wanted to be able to focus on his work. She said when he had taken pain medication, they wouldn't go out. Jackson’s struggles with pain medications were well-known on his “Dangerous” tour, Rowe said. Rowe: “It wasn't a secret. I used to hang out with the dancers and the people who worked with him.” Chang asked whether Rowe remembered Paul Gongaware from the “Dangerous” tour. She did not. (AP)

Rowe: After procedure in 93, MJ went on tour and was doing that part of the tour until Forecast, I met him one time I didn't know who he was. "Next time I met Michael in Mexico City and he was a mess," Rowe recalled. Chang: He made an announcement to the world he needed to get help? Rowe: Yes (ABC7)

Chang: Did you ever hear the name Paul Gongaware? Rowe: I don't know why I know the name. (ABC7)

Rowe said they would not allow her to talk to Forecast. Chang asked if she knew Forecast has been hired by the insurance company. Objection. Chang asked if tours caused MJ extreme stress or anxiety. She said yes. (ABC7)

Chang: Did he try to hide any drugs from you? Rowe: Not that I know of (ABC7) Rowe said she felt Jackson was always open and honest with her.Chang: “Did he ever try to hide any drugs from you?” “Not that I know of.” (AP)

Debbie Rowe was also asked about watching Jackson’s shows. She said she would sit on stage so as not to get crushed by the fans. While she wasn’t initially a fan of his music, Rowe said Jackson’s performances were amazing and she wished everyone had seen 1 of his shows (AP) Rowe: When I'd go to a concert and I was fortunate enough to be on stage, I'd see him. "MJ was my friend before anything else," Rowe said. "I'm so freaking lucky." "It was just, it was surreal, because I wasn't a fan, I was his friend first," Rowe explained. Rowe: The show was amazing, the dancers wee amazing, Michael was so physical when he'd do his performance. Rowe: He'd still ask 'how did I do, did I do ok?' Really dude, you didn't hear 55,000 people screaming? I think you did ok. "It was an athletic event to see him perform," Rowe explained. Rowe said on "This Is It" MJ wasn't performing, it was just a run-through of what he would do on the show. (ABC7) She spoke of his concerts, which she described as “amazing,” and watching them from a seat on stage. “I would see him and I would think, is this Michael Jackson? Michael Jackson was my friend before he was anything else,” she said. “I saw him, and I would say, ‘Oh my God, I know him.’ … And I would think, 'I’m so flipping lucky.’” (LATimes)

Chang showed a timeline of Jackson’s accomplishments between 1983 and 2000, when he and Rowe were close friends. Chang had to show the timeline to AEG Live defense attorney Marvin Putnam, who wasn’t shown it before court convened today. There was a little bit of bickering, and Rowe told the attorneys, “But sharing is caring.” Putnam was OK with jurors seeing the timeline. While there were a lot of professional accomplishments, Rowe noted that Jackson became a dad during that time period. (It was on the chart) (AP)

"Most important, he became a dad," Rowe said. "He said they take the oath to do no harm. He was very loyal to his physicians." Rowe: I knew that the only one who had Michael's best interest was Dr. Metzger. He treated him as a patient, human being and a friend. (ABC7)

Rowe said there worse type of medical care is: - very rich: can buy it - very poor: can't afford any - very famous: can dictate it. “ When it came to the pain he wasn't dictating, it was begging for relief," Rowe described. "He trusted what doctors were doing." Rowe said she tried to tell MJ he allowed doctors to control him too much, he should not be submissive. (ABC7)

Rowe reiterated that Jackson trusted and respected his doctor. “He was very loyal to his physicians,” she said. “He always thought doctors would have his best interests at heart,” Rowe said. That was true of Metzger, she said. She was also asked whether Jackson tried to dictate his care. Rowe said MJ wouldn’t question his doctor’s decisions. Rowe: “When it came to the pain, I wouldn’t say it was dictating, it was more begging for relief than anything.” (AP)

“The very rich, very poor and the very famous get the worst medical care,” she said Thursday. “The very rich can buy it, the very poor can’t get any and the very famous can dictate it.” (LATimes)

Rowe, clutching a tissue and breaking down at times, described Jackson as being in debilitating pain throughout the nearly 20 years that she knew him. She said her husband trusted his doctors and depended on them to give him proper medications. Jackson wouldn't specifically demand certain medications but had an intense fear of pain caused by procedures to try to repair his scalp, she said. "When it came to the pain ... it was more begging for relief than anything," Rowe said. "He respected doctors so he wouldn't question what they were doing." (AP)

When asked if she thought Jackson dictated his medical care to his own doctors, Rowe said, “When it came to pain, I wouldn’t say it was dictating. I would say it was more begging for relief.” “He respected doctors and wouldn’t question what they were doing,” she said. (LATimes)

Chang: Was he treated like a cash cow? Rowe: Yes Chang: Was he engaged in doctor shopping? Rowe: No. Rowe: There may have been, I don't know. I had not really heard about doctor shopping, specially at the degree we have today, back then. (ABC7)

Chang said in 2000 MJ was seeing a lot of doctors. Rowe said he had his doctors in LA. Rowe said she always instructed the nannies to have doctors on standby when they travelled and to keep notes of their treatment. (ABC7)

It was around this point that Rowe was asked if she thought Jackson was doctor shopping. She said no. Rowe said doctor shopping wasn’t a term she was familiar with back when she was close to Jackson. Chang asked if she agreed that Jackson never sought out doctors solely to get drugs. “To my knowledge, no," she responded. Rowe was pretty annoyed with some of Chang’s questions, which she said were too general. (AP)

Chang: Did he have to search for doctors to give him drugs? Rowe: No . Chang: In your opinion, when he saw doctors is because he needed it? Rowe: That's very general... Rowe: Not every appointment was 'I have to see a doctor.' It was 'I'm going to have a performance, I need to have collagen.' Chang: Would you agree that MJ never sought after doctors just to get medication? Rowe: Not that I know of. Rowe said she is nosy, so she checked all the medications the doctors gave him. (ABC7)

Attorneys talked over each other objecting. "I feel their pain," Rowe said pointing to the jurors. (ABC7)

Regarding Hoefflin putting MJ down and not treating him, Rowe said: "I didn't think I saw it, I saw it! I was there, I saw it!" Rowe said that when she worked with Dr. Klein, MJ's vitiligo got progressively worse. (ABC7)

Chang then moved into questions about Rowe’s relationship with Jackson. She said they’d watch movies together, in person and on the phone. Rowe hadn’t seen “To Kill a Mockingbird,” so Jackson called her one time when it was on TV. They didn’t know what a word meant, so Rowe said Jackson called up Gregory Peck to answer questions about the film. “Michael was tickled,” she said. (AP)
Rowe said she would watch movies with MJ all the time. Some times they went to the movie theater, even though MJ had a theater at Neverland. Rowe said MJ would call her and say "To Kill a Mockingbird" is on. "He was great friends with Gregory Peck," she explained. They didn't know what schiferella was, so MJ told her lets call Gregory Peck. Peck explained a bunch of things of the movie to them. Rowe said when MJ was very contemplative, they went to Forest Lawn (cemetery) over Griffith Park. "Michael loves sculpture," she explained. "I never realized that's a place he could go and it was quiet, and just be himself. It was nice, it was nice," Rowe recalled. She said there wasn't a bunch of people, he could go and hang out. (ABC7) The jury seemed to hang on every word of Rowe's testimony, which included the singer's medical conditions, and the time they were watching "To Kill a Mockingbird" and called Gregory Peck with a question about the movie he had starred in.(LAtimes)

There were very few places where Jackson could go in public and not be mobbed or noticed, she said. One place where he took Rowe was Forest Lawn Hollywood Hills, where they looked at the sculptures and artwork in peace. Jackson’s body was kept for several weeks at the cemetery after his death, and he’s interred at another Forest Lawn cemetery. Rowe said one way she and Jackson would sneak around was she would pick him up in her Toyota Celica. They went to Tower Records one day. No one noticed them, Rowe said, until Jackson spoke up and asked about a particular artist. Then everyone recognized Jackson’s voice. Rowe said they had to hide out in the store’s bathroom until Jackson’s security detail arrived.She said she got in trouble for the trip. (AP)

Rowe said that when he was feeling depressed, she took him out. There were a lot of impersonators in the 80-90s. Rowe: I drive a Celica, really, MJ in a Celica? She said at one time they went to tower records without security. She said there were only a few people in there, MJ was looking at CDs. Rowe: Then I hear from across the room 'Debbie, do you know this? Then everyone knew who he was, the store was packed in 20 minutes. Rowe locked herself in bathroom at Tower Records with MJ and called his security to pick them up. "I got in so much trouble," she recalled. (ABC7)

Rowe: He said you should incorporate horses with your love of animals. He paid for me to go back to school. "He helped whoever he could" Rowe said. (ABC7)

Rowe: In concerts, those girls will kill you to get near the stage -- fans laughed in overflow room. Rowe said security would give watches and rings. MJ would pick a girl to dance with him. "I thought that was so sweet."Chang showed video of woman on stage hugging Michael during "You're Not Alone" song. Rowe cried watching it. (ABC7) Chang played a clip of Jackson performing “You Are Not Alone” in Germany. A woman came on stage, clung to Jackson and refused to let go. The jury was in stitches laughing at the woman clinging to Jackson. She gave a leg kick when security took her off stage. Chang also played the music video for “Remember the Time.” Rowe pointed out one of Jackson’s camels from Neverland was in the video. (AP)

Rowe asked if Jackson was easily manipulated. “He could be,” Rowe replied. Chang asked if it happened when he was scared; Rowe said yes. Rowe told the jury that Jackson had so much adrenaline after shows that he couldn’t sleep afterward. (AP)

Chang asked some questions about Jackson received propofol to help him sleep in Munich, Germany on the “HIStory” tour. Rowe was asked more questions about the propofol treatment in Germany. She said she was worried it would affect him. She said Jackson was clean, and she was concerned that getting the anesthesia would trigger some sort of relapse. In response to questions from Chang, Rowe said the German doctors brought their equipment in through the hotel’s front door. Chang was trying to make the point that Jackson’s propofol treatment in that instance wasn’t totally hidden. (AP)

"He had difficulty to sleep anywhere, it wasn't just a tour problem," Rowe said. Rowe: "I'd see him go 4 days without sleep because he was thinking of a song or a project he wanted to do." Chang: Fournier never gave MJ anesthesia for just sleep, right? Rowe: Correct . Around 1997, near the end of tour, he uses Propofol to sleep in Munich. Chang: MJ never sought out anesthesiologist just for the purpose to sleep prior to that, correct? Rowe: Yes. Rowe: After HIStory he couldn't sleep, he talked to me and I said he had to talk to Metzger. Chang asked about the conversation Rowe and MJ had with Dr. Metzger about him not sleeping while in Germany. There were 2 anesthesiologists that came over, Rowe said. They brought in heart monitor and equipment to the hotel, didn't hide anything. Chang: Based on your observations, he never asked for medication to sleep? Rowe: Not that I knew of. Rowe: I discussed with, I can assume that Dr. Metzger had a discussion with these doctors about what they were going to do. Chang: Outside the US, do they use Propofol to treat insomnia? Rowe corrected: It was Diprivan. Rowe: Metzger had conversation w/ MJ. Apparently it was decided these doctors were going to give him anesthesia to put him to sleep 8 hrs. Rowe said she spoke with the doctors to make sure she knew what they were doing. The doctors spoke English. Rowe: I spoke to Metzger to make sure it was the same medication. "I knew they were anesthesiologists, they had practice in Munich. I don't know if they had gone to hotels to do this," Rowe said. In 1996, the law prohibited the use of any anesthesia outside a surgical center. Chang: You would not allow any illegal procedure in the hotel room, correct? Rowe: Yes. Not knowing. Rowe said the doctors had physicians desk reference book with them. They told Michael there was risk, including death. Rowe: My fear in addition to harm, it was because he was clean, this was after he went to rehab. "I didn't want anything they were giving him to affect his addiction to demerol," Rowe testified. Rowe said doctors were very detailed kept medical records. If she didn't feel comfortable, she wouldn't have allowed treatment to take place. This was 5 months after Prince was born, Rowe recalled. "They told me that anything more than 4 hours they had 2 physicians." It took some planing to put the equipment together, Rowe said. Chang: Did he ever say bring the equipment in the dark in the middle of the night through an alley? Rowe: He came through the front door. Chang: And secutity brought them up? Rowe: I don't believe anyone ever come up without security. The doctors were there on 2 occasions, with all the same equipment. Sometimes Michael would get IV for dehydration after shows, Rowe said. Chang: He used IVs for fluids, vitamins while on tour, right? Rowe: Yes. Chang: Based on your observations on that tour, Mr. Jackson wasn't asking medication to get high? Rowe: No. "He didn't like being high," Rowe testified. Chang: During the 20 years you were friends not habit of diprivan or any anesthesia to sleep? Rowe: Not that I know. (ABC7)

Rowe was then asked about her children with Jackson. She said he was devastated after his divorce from Lisa Marie Presley. She said she asked Jackson why, and he mentioned that he didn’t have children. Rowe said she told her friend that he could still be a father. Rowe said she told Jackson, “Let me have a baby with you. You can have the joy of being a parent.” Jackson thought about it for a couple of weeks before agreeing to have a child with her. (AP) Chang: Did you have discussions he wanted to be a father? Rowe: He loved kids, he did. Rowe: He was devastated after the divorce, I was trying to help. What does make you the happiest? 'I want to be a father' he said. Rowe said she told him he could still be a father. They talked about it and then... it happened. (ABC7) On another matter, Rowe said Jackson was devastated by his divorce from Lisa Marie Presley and because he didn't have any children. Rowe said she told him they should have a baby together. By that time, she and Jackson had been friends for more than a decade, with Rowe holding the singer's hand as he received injections for numerous medical procedures and talking with him several times a week. "I wanted him to be a father," she said. "I wanted him to have everything he didn't have growing up. I wanted him to experience it with his own child, with his own children." (AP)

Chang then showed a photo of Jackson, in makeup for his short film “Ghost,” riding on the back of her Harley-Davidson motorcycle. Rowe said she told Jackson and he was so excited, he ran onto the tarmac of the airport where they were filming “Ghost.” (AP) Chang showed Rowe and MJ in a Harley motorcycle, he was with make-up on. He always had crews with him to document stuff, Rowe said. She took him for a ride and took him to a tarmac and said I need to talk to you. "I said you're going to be a dad," Rowe said, sobbing. "He was so excited, he ran out in the tarmac screaming." Chang asked if he bought all the books around. Rowe said he was a big reader anyway. "He wanted to be the best dad he could be" she recalled. Rowe said she asked Michael to make two cassettes for Prince, she wanted the baby to hear his voice. "I had a headset over my stomach so baby could hear him, so the baby knows who you are," Rowe described. "They knew his voice." Chang showed pictures of Dr. Metzger and Rowe/MJ in Sydney during wedding, MJ, Debbie and kids. "He was amazing," Rowe said about MJ as a father. Rowe told Michael Paris was going to have him around her little finger. Rowe: Before anybody knew I was pregnant with this baby, he was shopping for clothes, would donate some times. "I was pregnant, he was picking clothes for his own children," Rowe said. Chang: Did you make a decision to leave the children with Michael? Rowe: Yes C: Ever regretted it? R: No. Rowe: Michael wanted to be a father. I didn’t sign on to be a mom. I loved him very much, and I still do. Rowe: I wanted him to be a father, to have everything he didn't have growing up, to experience it with this own children. Chang: To have a full childhood? Rowe: Yes Chang: Did you think MJ would be a good father? Rowe: I never questioned that he wouldn't be. Chang: Do you still love them? Rowe: I'm so proud of them. (ABC7)

She said the "Thriller" singer was "devastated" when Lisa Marie Presley filed for divorce in 1996, and she wanted to ease his pain. Rowe said she asked him what made him "saddest," and he said it was the fact they never had kids. "I said, 'Let me have a baby with you,'" Rowe told the Los Angeles jury. "It took him a couple weeks going back and forth, thinking about it, and we talked about it." Rowe never elaborated on how they pursued conception, but she described in intimate detail the afternoon she rode her Harley Davidson motorcycle across the San Fernando Valley to meet Michael on the Van Nuys Airport set of his 1996 short film "Ghosts" and break the baby news. Michael was getting ready to do a shoot, she recalled, but she convinced him to hop on the back of her Harley so they could find a private spot to talk."I said, 'You're going to be a dad!' I was pregnant," Rowe recalled. "He was so excited, he ran around the tarmac screaming."She said Michael recorded cassette tapes that she would play on headphones over her pregnant belly so the baby would know his voice. (NYDailyNews)

Rowe said Michael was equally over the moon when he learned that Paris was on the way. "I told him, 'You're going to be so whipped,'" Rowe testified. "Before anyone knew I was pregnant with this baby, he was shopping for clothes." Rowe said she had no regrets about "leaving" the kids with Michael when their 3-year marriage ended in divorce in 1999. "Michael wanted to be a father. I didn't sign on to be a mom. I loved him very much and I still do," she said, breaking down in tears. "I wanted him to be a father, I wanted him to have everything that he didn't have growing up, wanted him to experience it with his own child, his own children."She agreed with Katherine's lawyer that she "never" would have left the kids with Michael if she thought he was "a drug addict." (NYDailyNews)

Chang showed several pictures of Jackson’s oldest children when they were babies, some with the four of them together. Rowe said when she told Jackson he was going to have a daughter, she told him he was going to be in big trouble. Rowe: “I told him, ‘You’re going to be so whipped. She’s just going to have you around her finger.’” Rowe’s was asked about her decision to leave the children with MJ when they separated and divorced. She said she didn't regret that choice. “I loved him very much and I still do,” Rowe said. “I wanted him to be a father. I wanted him to have everything he didn’t have growing up.” Rowe said she was very proud of Jackson’s three children, including Blanket. She said she wouldn’t have left them if Jackson was an addict. (AP)

Chang asked how MJ looked in the This Is It movie. "He looked horrible," she responded. Rowe learned about MJ's death on the radio, she was driving home. (ABC7) Chang asked whether Rowe saw the “This Is It” film, and how she thought Jackson looked. “He looked horrible,” she said. (AP)

Rowe was then asked about her relationship with Prince and Paris. She said she was closer to Paris than Prince. (AP)

Rowe said she saw Prince at least once after MJ died. "We don't hate each other," she said. But she's closer to Paris. Rowe said at the end of March, April started seeing Paris, talked on the phone every day. "She stayed weekends with me," Rowe testified. (ABC7)

Asked about her relationship with 16-year-old Prince, who attends a private high school in the San Fernando Valley, she shrugged. "We don't hate each other, if that's what you mean," she said. "I'm closer to my daughter." Rowe said she and Paris, 15, began seeing each other at the end of March. She said they talked on the phone and texted frequently and that Paris stayed with her on weekends. Rowe, who raises quarter horses in Palmdale, sobbed as she explained how Jackson’s death has affected Paris, referring to a June 5 suicide attempt that sent her to the hospital. “I almost lost my daughter,” Rowe said. “She is devastated. She tried to kill herself.… She doesn’t feel like she has a life anymore.” (LATimes)

Rowe said before Paris’ hospitalization, she and Paris were communicating daily and she was spending weekends at Rowe’s ranch. Chang asked how Paris had been affected by their father’s death. Rowe broke down and stayed silent for several moments. “Their father is dead,” she said in a raspy voice, and then started to mention Jackson’s schedule. AEG Live’s attorney objected. Rowe covered her face with her hands and he objection was sustained. She told the jury, “I almost lost my daughter.” Chang asked if Rowe had spoken to Paris about her father’s death. “She is devastated,” Rowe said. “She tried to kill herself.” “She is devastated. She has no life. She doesn’t feel she has a life anymore," Rowe said of her daughter, Paris Jackson. Chang concluded her examination. Rowe was incredibly upset by this point. The court took a short break before resuming. (AP)

Their father is dead," an emotional Rowe said. "When I saw the tour come out, the schedule..." "I almost lost my daughter," Rowe said, sobbing on the stand. "She is devastated, she tried to kill herself, she is devastated. She has no life, she doesn't' feel like she has a life anymore," Rowe said "My children were never a sacrifice," Rowe said. Rowe left the courtroom sobbing. Judge broke session for a couple of minutes. (ABC7) When a lawyer for Katherine Jackson suggested that Michael's death wasn't something Rowe contemplated when she made the "sacrifice" of giving him full custody of their kids, the former dermatologist's assistant snapped back."My children were never a sacrifice," she said, breaking down to the point that she needed time to compose herself outside the courtroom (NYDailyNews)

The mother of Michael Jackson's two oldest children broke down in tears when she was asked to describe the impact of the singer's death on his daughter Paris. "Their father is dead," Debbie Rowe responded. "I almost lost my daughter! She is devastated. She tried to kill herself. She is devastated. She has no life. She doesn't feel she has a life anymore." (CNN) Rowe broke down when describing her recent relationship with her daughter Paris. She said she had been in daily touch with the teen until she had to be hospitalized on June 5, when paramedics were summoned to the Jackson family home in Calabasas. Rowe was asked how Jackson's death had affected his only daughter. "She is devastated," Rowe said. "She tried to kill herself. She is devastated. She has no life. She doesn't feel she has a life anymore." (AP) Michael Jackson's ex-wife wailed in anguish on the witness stand Thursday as she described the "devastation" that nearly claimed her only daughter with the King of Pop. "Their father is dead…I almost lost my daughter," Rowe said through loud sobs when asked about the fallout from Jackson's fatal overdose in June 2009."She is devastated, she tried to kill herself," Rowe moaned, describing 15-year-old Paris. "She doesn't feel she has a life anymore." (NYdailyNews)


AEG redirect

AEG Live attorney Marvin Putnam took over questioning. He was relatively brief. (AP)

In re-direct, Rowe said Dr. Klein treated MJ for acne, lupus, scaring and vitiligo. Rowe said she wasn't present when Michael had Botox because when she worked at Dr. Klein it had not been FDA approved yet. Putnam: Did he use Diprivan for collagen procedure? Rowe: Yes. Rowe said it was just demerol when collagen was injected around the mouth area. "But when injection was under the eye, it was painful, that's when we started the anesthesia," Rowe explained. (ABC7)

He asked Rowe about her concerns that Jackson was coming into Klein’s office for more than just collagen treatments. “I didn’t understand why he would come in twice in one week,” Rowe said. Putnam: “You were concerned he might be coming in for the drugs?” Yes, Rowe replied. (AP) Rowe said she asked Michael Jackson are you here because you really need collagen, or why are you here. "I didn't understand why he would come twice for collagen when he just had it done," Rowe questioned. This was early 90s. She was concerned MJ was coming in for the drugs. Putnam: You grew concerned about diprivan intake, approached Klein? Rowe: That was demerol, I called Dr. Metzger, I was concerned about demerol. Dr. Metzger said up disteril, lower demerol. Putnam: Did you asked Dr. Klein Michael was addicted to diprivan because of frequency he was using it? Rowe: Yes. Late 80s, early 90s. (ABC7)
Michael Jackson's ex-wife acknowledged Thursday that she was concerned that some of his frequent medical visits were motivated more by a desire for drugs than by the treatments he received. Debbie Rowe testified during the trial of a lawsuit that she told Jackson about her concerns when he would go to his longtime dermatologist more than once a week in the 1980s and early 1990s."I didn't understand why he would come in twice in one week," Rowe said, adding that she was concerned he might be in search of drugs rather than treatments for blemishes with collagen injections. "I didn't necessarily see what he wanted to have done."Rowe has offered a conflicting portrait of Jackson's medical treatments during her testimony, saying earlier that she never saw him engage in doctor shopping or request specific pain medications. She said many of the visits were legitimately tied to treatments for the skin-lightening condition vitiligo and scars he sustained after being burned during a Pepsi commercial shoot. (AP)

Rowe said Michael called her while he was in rehab in England. She said she told him she was working, since normal people worked. She told him he had to stop everything. He said he was working on it. Putnam: Including Diprivan? Rowe: Yes, everything P: In 1993? R: Yes (ABC7)

HIStory tour was 96-97, Munich. Putnam: Metzger had Jackson's interest in mind? Rowe: Yes. Rowe said Dr. Metzger directed her to bring a bag of medication to the Peninsula Hotel for Dr. Forecast. Dr. Klein went to HIStory tour to do collagen touch ups, acne treatment. He gave MJ demerol. (ABC7)

Putnam also asked whether Rowe was concerned that Jackson might be addicted to propofol. She said she asked about it, but was told that it wasn’t possible to become addicted to propofol. She did say she told Jackson to stop taking all drugs when he was in rehab. (AP) "I was told you can't become addicted to diprivan," Rowe testified. She said it was an anesthesia. Before you go to sleep, there's a bit of loss of control, she explained. "I was worried that sensation might trigger an addiction." "He was a bit of a control freak, he didn't like to be high," Rowe said. Rowe: I was just worried that part of the anesthesia would kick in. I was told you can't become addiction to it. Rowe: Dr. Metzger wanted to try Xanax and Michael said that hadn't work. I said you need to talk to each other and let me know what to do. (ABC7) Putnam asked about Metzger’s role in arranging the propofol treatment in Germany. She said the doctors came after she & Jackson talked to the Metzger. The German docs brought lots of monitoring equipment. Metzger initially suggested Jackson take a Xanax pill, but Jackson said he had tried that and it hadn’t worked. (AP)

Putnam asked about the video of Jackson performing in Munich and whether that was before or after the propofol treatment. Rowe didn’t know when the video was shot and said she couldn’t tell if it was before or after the treatments. (AP) "The shows were all the same, just the girls were different," Rowe said. And joked: "Uah, that sounds so cheap!" Everyone laughed. (ABC7)

After the divorce, Rowe never talked to the doctors about Michael's treatment anymore. Putnam: After 2000, whatever happened to Mr. Jackson you don't have first knowledge? Rowe: Correct (ABC7) Lastly, Putnam asked whether Rowe had any firsthand knowledge of Jackson’s care after the couple was divorced. She said no. (AP)


Jackson recross

In re-cross, Chang questioned: When you asked Dr. Klein if anyone could be addicted to diprivan, he said no, correct? Rowe: Yes. Chang: Was the bag of medication to wean MJ off demerol before 1993 rehab? Rowe: Yes Chang: Did he do everything he could to be the best? Rowe: He did (ABC7)

Chang asked one last final question, about whether Jackson did the best he could with his medications. Yes, she said, very faintly. (AP)

Rowe was excused.


David Slavit Video Deposition

(source : ABC7)

Dr. David Hal Slavit is a board certified otolaryngology. He's licensed to practice medicine in New York and New Jersey. He's never been suspended. Dr. Slavit performed physical exams in hundreds of patients. He has performed physical for purposes of insurance, he said. He explained the difference of physicals: problem-focus, more complete and comprehensive.

Dr. Slavit has performed physical for performance cancellation insurance. He said he checks vital signs, ear, nose, throat, neck, eyes, examination heart, lungs, abdomen and peripheral pulses. Q: Who typically contact you for performance cancellation insurance? Dr. Slavit said it's usually insurance broker or artist management. He said he's done approximately 30 physicals for performance cancellation insurance, mostly for singers, but not all. The majority of times, check comes from the insurance broker. He's done physicals in hotels, rehearsal studios, artist's home, office Dr. Slavit said he's done approximately 20 times for Robertson Taylor, insurance broker.

On Feb 4, 2009, Dr. Slavit conducted a physical on Michael Jackson in connection with a performance cancellation insurance. Bob Taylor contacted Dr Slavit somewhere in the months prior to the physical. "He basically asked if I would agree to do the physical on MJ" . "It was my understanding he was going to perform," Dr. Slavit said. "Yes, I requested to review the prior 5 years of medical records," Dr. Slavit said. He wanted to be as accurate as possible. "I'd say it's not typical," Dr. Slavit testified about getting 5 years prior of medical history, but he had done before other than MJ. Dr. Slavit said this is done if there were prior questions of medical health. "There were questions that had been raised by the broker," Dr. Slavit said. He doesn't know specifically what was asked. Dr. Slavit said insurance broker questioned MJ's breathing capacity, his pulmonary status and overall health. Q: Nothing about prior drug abuse? Dr. Slavit: Not that I recall. The doctor did not ask anything else other than 5 years medical history. He said he was not limited in MJ's examination at any time. Dr. Slavit never received any MJ's medical history, other than what the artist told him during examination.

The physical was done at MJ's house in Los Angeles, the doctor said. Attorney showed documents doc prepared during and after the physical. Patient's name on blood work request: Mark Jones. It's an alias, Dr. Slavit said, just to protect Michael Jackson's privacy. Q: Did you find MJ to be in great physical condition? A: Based on the information I had, yes. Note on form says "today's found Mr. Jackson to be in excellent condition." It also says MJ had allergy and a bit of cold. He was on short course of antibiotics, Dr. Slavit said, he's not on any other medication.

Q: Did he tell you he was taking painkillers? A: He told me he was not taking any painkillers. "He stated he was not taking any medications other than antibiotics," Dr. Slavit testified. Dr. Slavit didn't see anything that suggested MJ was not telling the truth. He didn't find any typical signs of narcotic intoxication.

"Dr. Conrad Murray follows Mr. Jackson on a regular basis," the form said. Dr. Slavit explained Murray was identified by Mr. Jackson as his personal physician and reported seeing him as needed. Dr. Slavit: He reported seeing him a couple of months prior to the physical just for check-up.. "It was a routine check-up," Dr. Salvit said. MJ didn't discuss the details of the visit. Other than Dr. Kantor no one else was mentioned as providing care, Dr Slavit said. Q: Did he tell you MJ said he liked Dr. Murray? A: Yes Q: Did he say he was a good doctor? A: I don't know if used that word. "That he was caring for him, that he was satisfied with the care he was getting, that's basically what he said," Dr. Slavit said.

Dr. Slavit's form said MJ's vital signs were normal. Heart sound was normal, no murmurs. Dr. Slavit: I assessed his pulmonary status with stethoscope, no further pulmonary test done. Q: Did you have difficulty drawing blood? A: I had a little difficulty drawing blood. He used MJ's left arm, and took the specimen himself to the laboratory. Blood work result was normal consistent with MJ being in good health.

Form notes MJ was mature, open and candid with Dr. Slavit. Q: Was he capable of making decisions? A: Yes. Q: Capable of control of his health? A: Yes Q: Why candid? A: That's the perception I got. Q: Was he lucid? A: Yes Q: Speech slurred? A: No Q: Tired? A: No. Q: Did he say he had trouble sleeping? A: He didn't say he had trouble sleeping, he didn't say he had insomnia.. Dr. Slavit: He denied any prior medical problem except for the cold.

Dr. Slavit wrote MJ was in good health, good diet and exercise. He interacted with his doctor for routine check ups. MJ visited his laryngologist for minor issues, seemed proactive and attune to his health. There was an acknowledgment of the need for rest or avoidance of exhaustion. Q: Did MJ ask you to prescribe any medication? A: No

Michael Jackson signed the forms. Dr. Slavit said he saw MJ sign it. At the time of the examination the form was filled out with Michael Jackson. We reviewed the form before he signed it. There are questions on the form that were filled out during the physical. Dr. Slavit said MJ was the only source of the responses. Q: Was there any significant change of weight? A: No The question regarding excessive use of drugs or alcohol was circled 'no'. MJ told Dr. Slavit he was last examined a couple of months prior for routine. Dr. Murray was identified as personal physician. When asked if he felt in good physical condition, Dr. Slavit said MJ responded yes. "That was his answer." Temperature was 98 degrees. Weight: 127 lbs - MJ told him that's what he weighed. Q: Based on your examination, it appeared accurate? A: Yes . Height was self reported also. He told Dr. Slavit he was 5 foot 9. Dr. Slavit received full payment for the physical on Michael Jackson. Q: Did you notice any track mark on MJ when you examined him? A: There were none Q: Did you look his arms? A: Yes Q: His legs? A: Yes. "In the course of reviewing his past medical history there were no surgeries reported," Dr. Slavit said.

Dr. Slavit gave copy of the record to the Coroner pursuant to legal subpoena. Feb 2009 was the only time Dr. Slavit talked to MJ.

Dr. Slavit charges: $6,000 for service $3,000 lab and supply $5,849 for travel and hotel . Dr. Slavit: My understanding my job was to find out if he was able physically to perform. "I was never provided records," Dr. Slavit said. He never contacted Dr. Murray directly to get medical record. "I would require permission from MJ to do that (test for opiates or drugs)," Dr. Slavit said. There was no need at the time to test him.

Dr. Slavit had been working with Bob Taylor for about 10 years prior to doing physical with MJ. Q: Did Mr. Taylor tell you MJ was being badly mauled in the press in England and that it was getting difficult to obtain insurance? A: No. Dr. Slavit did not know where the rumors came from.
Q: Was it clear to you that MJ had plastic surgery? A: Yes.
Dr. Slavit said he examined inside MJ's nose and how it looked.
Q: And did it look ok? A: Yes. Dr. Slavit was at MJ's house between 2.5 and 3 hours for the physical.
Q: If you had any suspicion that MJ was using opioids or other drugs improperly, you'd you have tested him? A: I may have.
Q: Did Mr. Jackson deny anything you requested of him? A: No

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 71 – August 16 2013 – Summary

In addition to testimony, one development this morning was that the plaintiff's rested their case. Attorney Brian Panish didn't want to but Judge Yvette Palazuelos told him she would tell the jury the plaintiff's case was done if he didn't. The judge said it didn't foreclose Panish from calling additional witnesses during his rebuttal case. Plaintiff's resting will allow for argument on an AEG motion to dismiss the case at some point. No word on when those arguments will happen. Panish told the jury that the plaintiff's case officially ended after Kenny Ortega's testimony was done. Judge called it a "formality." (AP) After jury entered the room, plaintiffs attorney Brian Panish announced he has rested their case in chief, subject to conclusion with Ortega


Dr. Gary Green Testimony


(Source : ABC7)


AEG direct


Attorney Jessica Stebbins Bina is doing direct examination.

Dr. Green is a doctor board certified in internal medicine and sports medicine. He's currently the head team physician for Pepperdine University and is the medical director performance enhancement drugs for MLB. He oversees medical care of athletes both in minor and major leagues of baseball, also sees general students at Pepperdine, not just athletes. The doctor conducts research on behalf of MLB at UCLA pathology department regarding enhancement drug use. He's also a clinical professor at UCLA and a partner at primary care group, sees general patients as well. Dr. Green is the team physician for the US Soccer team and Pepperdine, worked in Olympic Games of 2002, MLB, NCAA, was UCLA team physician.

Dr Green said sports medicine is somewhat like regular medicine. "Doctors should do no harm; doctors should do what's best for the patient" He said he always wanted to be a family doctor and treat patients for all their lives. Dr. Green said before athletes know what medical problem they have, they want to know when they can play next.

Dr. Green said he has similar or greater experience that Dr. Gordon Matheson, since Dr. Matheson doesn't have private practice. Dr. Matheson testified earlier in the trial on behalf of plaintiffs.

Dr. Green worked with O'Melveny & Myers before in a case involving Manny Pacquiao and Floyd Mayweather, Jr. The expert said he was surprise being called in this case, since it has nothing to do with athletes. Dr. Green reviewed extensive material, deposition and trial testimony in this case. The doctor said he spent about 115 hours in this case, bills $500 per hour. He said he's billed approximately $20,000 to $25,000 up-to-date. There will be about $25,000 to $30,000 to be billed, total approximately $50,000.

Bina asked if he agrees with Dr. Matheson this is a conflict of interest case. "I disagree with Dr. Matheson completely," Dr. Green said.

Dr. Green's opinion:
1- Sports medicine is the wrong analogy
2- Facts don't support conflict of interest alleged by Dr. Matheson
3- Conflict of interest alleged did not lead to poor medical care
4- Dr. Matheson disregarded key principles to reach his conclusions

Dr. Green said this case is much closer to regular doctor-patient medicine than sports medicine. Doctors have ethical obligation to do no harm to the patient," he said. "There's conflict of interest on a daily basis between doc/patient" Dr. Green said through experience doctors learn very quickly how to manage conflicts and have the patient's best interest first.

1- Sports Medicine is the Wrong Analogy

A: Who selects doctor?
Team Sports: Team/School
Primary Care Practice: Patient
This Case: Patient

Dr. Green said in team sports, the team or school chooses the doctor. In primary care practice and in this case, MJ chose the doctor. "In my private practice, I'm selected by the patient." Dr. Green said. "They choose whether they want to come see me or not." Dr. Green: MJ brought Dr. Murray to the attention of AEG Live and MJ insisted to bring the doctor on tour. At one point, AEG explored other options and MJ wanted his physician, Dr. Green testified. The expert said there's no evidence Dr. Murray has been asked to treat anyone else but MJ and perhaps the children.

Doc said in team sports player, coach, team, public have the right to information from doctor. In private practice/this case only patient. Dr. Murray was not allowed to share any information wit AEG Live or anyone else, the doctor testified. There's no release form to share info.

Dr Green said plaintiffs hired Dr Matheson to say that this was a sports medicine analogy. "It's just not the correct analysis in this case" Dr. Green said one of the articles Dr. Matheson used is entitled "The Unique Aspects of Sports Medicine," and this is not the same. Dr. Green explained the Jackson family claim there was conflict between AEG and Murray to influence the type of medical care used with MJ.

Dr. Green explained that in order for conflict of interest to exist, each party had to have different interests. "MJ wanted to remain healthy to do the tour," he said. "Dr. Murray wanted MJ to be healthy, it's his ethical obligation and he wanted him to complete the tour," he said. "AEG Live needed a healthy MJ to be in good health, this was a long tour," he expressed. Bina: If there were no tour, do you have any reason to believe Dr. Murray would be paid $150,000 a month? Dr. Green: No, I do not. "It was Dr. Murray's interest to keep MJ healthy to have him perform the shows," Dr. Green opined.


2- Facts Don't Support Alleged Conflicts

- Health interests of MJ, Dr. Murray and AEG Live were aligned
- - No secret arrangement
- Jackson requested Dr. Murray
- Dr. Murray demonstrated independence from AEG Live
---- Advised MJ not to go to rehearsal
---- Told tour personnel to "stay in their lane"
---- Refused to provide medical records to insurers
---- Requested contract changes to increase independence
- Evidence does not support claim that AEG Live directed medical care
- Timing of contract drafts doesn't support Matheson's claims

"There's no secret arrangement," Dr. Green said. "In this situation, everything was out in the open." Dr. Green: It was to be signed by Dr. Murray, MJ and AEG Live. There was nothing hidden. Dr. Green: Dr. Murray knew AEG Live would be advancing the money on behalf of MJ, MJ knew AEG would advance the money. "That was selected by Michael Jackson," Dr. Green opined. "There was no secrecy, he requested Dr. Murray to go on tour." "If there was any secrecy was between Murray and MJ," Dr. Green opined. "There's no evidence AEG was aware Murray was giving MJ Propofol." "AEG was not controlling Dr. Murray," Dr. Green said. "He acted independently from AEG." "If Dr. Murray were taking orders from AEG Live, he'd not have told people to stay in their lane," Dr. Green opined. Dr. Green said Dr. Murray refused to provide his own medical records of MJ to insurers. MJ denied releasing the medical history. The expert said Dr. Murray requested Kathy Jorrie to change the contract to have more independence. "He asked to keep money for the entire money should he be discharged mid-month," Dr. Green testified. Dr. Green pointed out Dr. Murray asked to change the contract to limit him to perform services requested by artist, not producer. "I believe that it further demonstrates Dr. Murray's independence from AEG Live."

Dr. Green said that it's not unusual for family/friends to call him to talk about a patient he's about to see. He said family/friends may tell him things that the patient wouldn't. The expert said that in all the meetings, there were several people present, which supports the fact there was no secrecy.

First draft of the contract was June 16. "Dr. Murray's behavior in this case and care to MJ began way before that," Dr. Green explained. "If Dr. Matheson is correct and terms of contract influenced Murray's behavior, he started treating him way before contract draft" he said “There's no evidence of Michael Jackson use of Propofol to AEG," Dr. Green opined. Timeline per Dr. Green: 2006 -- Dr Murray begins treating Jackson family January 2009 -- Dr. Murray treated Prince and Michael in LA. Dr. Green: MJ had a physical in 2009 with Dr. Slavit. He asked who was his personal physician and MJ said Dr. Murray. Kai Chase testified Dr. Murray was frequently at Carolwood house in April, May and June 2009. On April 6, 2009, Dr. Murray ordered Propofol to be shipped to LA, the expert said. Dr. Green pointed out that all of that happened before AEG Live had any knowledge of Dr. Murray. Dr. Green: I think it's very clear the relationship of Murray-MJ pre-date AEG being involved. Furthermore, his use of Propofol pre-dates AEG. Dr. Murray re-ordered Propofol on April 28, 2009, Dr. Green said.

"Not only do I disagree with Dr. Matheson's conclusion but the manner of which he came to his conclusion," Dr. Green said. "Patients and competent adults have the right to choose their own physician," Dr. Green testified. "In this case, MJ chose Dr. Murray as his own physician and wanted him to go on tour," Dr. Green opined. Dr. Green: AEG Live looked at other possibilities and in response MJ, a competent adult, said no, I want my own doctor. "Continuity of care is a very important principle," Dr. Green explain. That way the doctor knows the history of the patient. Dr. Green said Dr. Matheson wanted AEG to go around MJ and find another physician for him.

Dr. Green: Physician's duty to the patient is paramount, and that's the number one priority and what doctors should always be concerned. "Physicians are under the obligation, regarding any interest, to put their patients first," Dr. Green expressed. Dr. Green said Dr. Murray disregarded the Hippocratic oath, standard of care and probably violated prescribing rules.



Jackson cross


Jacksons' attorney William Bloss did cross examination.

Bloss: Would you agree large incentives can create conflict of interest? Dr. Green: Yes, financial incentive can create conflict of interest. "Regardless financial incentive, it does not take away from physician's obligation to the patient," Dr. Green explained.

Code of Ethics of American Medical Association. Bloss showed opinion of "Financial Incentives and the Practice of Medicine." a) Large incentives may create conflict of interest that can in turn compromise clinical objectivity. AMA says: "It's important to recognize that sufficient large incentives can create an untenable position for physicians."

"Financial rewards do not obligate physicians to compromise their medical judgment," Dr. Green opined.

Bloss: Is $150,000 a month a large incentive? Dr. Green: It depends on the situation. Bloss asked how about a doctor whose house is about to go on foreclosure, $600,000 in outstanding debt, behind child support payment? "I'm sure many doctors have great deal of debt, possibly more than that, and still practice medicine in an ethical manner," Dr Green said

Bloss showed Kai Chase's testimony, where she said she didn't see Dr. Murray as much in April, was there about 3 times a week. Dr. Green said he was not accurate when he mentioned Chase said Dr. Murray was at Carolwood in March of 2009.

Dr. Green said on April 19, 2009, Dr. Metzger went to Carolwood to meet MJ. He said MJ asked for sleep medication. Bloss: Do you recall MJ asked Cherilyn Lee to give him sleep aid? I don't recall dates, need to see the testimony. Bloss: If a nurse says there were no equipments at the house 4 Murray to inject MJ w/ Propofol on Apr19 is that inconsistent? Dr. Green: No. Bloss: Do you have information MJ was seeking Propofol from people other than Dr. Murray? Dr. Green: Yes, Dr. Metzger and Cherilyn Lee. On Apr 19, MJ asked Cherilyn Lee to find someone to give him Propofol, Bloss said. He asked if it'd be consistent w/ Murray there same day. Dr. Green: We see addicts and they go to multiple sources, I could only speculate why MJ was seeking Propofol from more than one person. "It's not inconsistent somebody seeking drugs from several sources" Dr Green said. "Particularly with that drug which wasn't easy to obtain"

Bloss: Was Dr. Murray giving MJ Propofol on April 19th and 12th at Carolwood? Dr. Green: Yes. Dr. Green said he cannot testify to the exact date because Dr. Murray kept no records to maintain it secretive.

Dr. Green charges AEG $3,000 per half day of work, $6,000 for full day.

Bloss showed email from Ortega to Gongaware on Jun 14, 2009 saying "Are you aware MJ's doctor didn't permit him to attend rehearsals today?" "This just shows Dr. Murray independence to advise MJ not to attend rehearsal," Dr. Green said. Email from Gongaware: "We want to remind him that it's AEG, not MJ, who is paying his salary." Dr. Green said the best person to ask about this email is who wrote it/received it. Since he's neither, it'd speculation to interpret it. "I believe Mr. Gongaware didn't recall this email," Dr. Green said. "Mr. Ortega said he didn't understand what it meant." Bloss: Is this email material to your opinion? Dr. Green: Yes, I feel that it supports my opinion. Bloss: Even the part that says "AEG, not MJ, paying his salary?" Dr. Green: Yes. Dr. Green said in his deposition that nothing in the email supported his opinion. He said he testified differently at deposition. Bloss asked in deposition whether "AEG, not MJ, paying his salary" email did not influence his opinion, correct? "Yes," Dr. Green responded. Dr. Green: Now that I responded differently is because I had additional information. Dr. Green: One is Mr. Gongaware's testimony, and further reviewed evidence this was never communicated to Dr. Murray. "The fact that it was never communicated to Dr. Murray let me believe it was not influencing," Dr. Green explained. Dr. Green said he doesn't believe either Gongaware or anyone else at AEG told Dr. Murray "it's AEG, not MJ, who's paying his salary." "You need to look at the context of this email, you can't just pull out a word here or there," Dr. Green said. Bloss asked if "we want him to understand what's expected of him" mention in the email influenced his opinion. "No, it would not sway my opinion one way or the other," Dr. Green said. Dr. Green said he did not ask to meet with Gongaware or Phillips to try to get more information about the email and their intent.

Bloss asked about the meeting at Carolwood's house on June 16, 2009, which they called "intervention." He asked if Chase said Dr. Murray bursted out of the meeting and said "I can't take this s**t anymore." "I read the testimony of of Ms. Chase and that was her perception," Dr. Green said. Mr. Gongaware had a much different account of the meeting than what Chase testified, Bloss said. Dr. Green said Chase wasn't present for the entire meeting, but Gongaware was. He would give a little more weight to Gongaware since he was present for the full meeting. "Assuming that Chase's recollection is correct, I think there are many interpretations of Dr. Murray's outburst," Dr. Green said. Bloss asked if it could be that Dr. Murray was feeling pressured by AEG. Dr. Green: It could be that Dr. Murray could be feeling pressured he was giving unethical and illegal drugs. "That certainly could create pressure in Dr. Murray to make an outburst like that," Dr. Green said. "There was nothing to suggest in the meeting that Dr. Murray was in danger of losing the gig." Dr. Green said.

Dr. Green didn't receive the "Trouble at the Front" email chain until after he was involved in the case. Bloss showed Bugzee's email saying MJ was basket case. "Only information that MJ was not in good health on June 19," Dr Green said about it. "Dr. Murray wasn't keeping records at this time, but I believe MJ was under his care," Dr. Green said. Bloss showed the email where Ortega said "now that we brought the doctor in to the fold." Dr. Green said this email showed Ortega was concerned with MJ's health. He doesn't know what the director meant by "doctor in to the fold." Bloss: Because you didn't understand what this meant, this email didn't influence you, correct? "I think you have to put this entire thing in context and the context is that he was concerned with Mr. Jackson's health" Dr Green explained. Dr. Green said several people raised questions about MJ's psychological situation.

Dr. Green said he believes Dr. Murray was board certified but it had lapsed in 2008. Murray does not have psychiatry training.

Bloss talked about the lengthy conversation Randy Phillips with Dr. Murray. He asked if he knew for sure what they talked about. He said no. Bloss asked about another Phillips' email.

Panish laughed out loud when Dr. Green responded he recalls testimony but preferred reading again. Judge called Panish out, he apologized. Judge ordered all the attorneys in her chambers for quick sidebar. Back in the courtroom in front of jury: Panish: Your honor, I'd like to apologize to Dr. Green for that laugh. Dr. Green: Apologies accepted. Panish: I'm sincerely sorry Dr. Green: No harm, no foul

Bloss talked about "this doctor is extremely successful, we checked him out." Dr. Green said he thought Phillips meant that based on Kathy Jorrie's testimony regarding the check she did.

"I do not see anything to change my opinion of conflict of interest in this case," Dr. Green said. Bloss showed another part of the "Trouble at the Front" email with Phillips saying "Tim and I are going to see him tomorrow." Bloss asked if that statement was material to his opinion. "Only that AEG was concerned about what was going on and were doing something about it," Dr. Green said.

Dr. Green said he considered all the evidence in the case, since everything is important. Dr. Green sad he's not sure what Phillips meant when he asked "is it chemical or physiological." "I can only speculate."

Dr Green said he was asked to analyze if this is a sports medicine case and whether or not conflict of interest led to his poor medical care

---------------------------------

Judge adjourned trial. Attorneys ordered back at 10:45 am PT on Monday, jurors at 1:30 pm PT. Dr. Green returns then.

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 72 – August 19 2013 – Summary

Jackson family is not in court


Dr. Gary Green Testimony


Jackson cross

Green is an expert on medical conflicts of interest who is testifying for AEG Live. He is refuting testimony by a plaintiff’s expert. (AP) Dr. Green said over the weekend he reviewed his testimony from Friday, reviewed materials provided earlier and met with AEG attorneys. (ABC7)

Bloss: Do you remember Dr Matheson testifying that it didn’t appear Phillips had full recollection of phone call between Phillips-Murray? Dr. Green: Yes, it appears from Mr. Phillips’ testimony he does not have a full recollection of the phone call. Dr. Green: Phillips wasn’t able to recall the specifics content of the phone call, but he wrote email that could indicate of what was spoken. “There’s no evidence that Mr Phillips put any pressure on Dr. Murray in that phone call,” Dr. Green explained. Dr. Green said he has not seen any evidence showing Phillips put pressure on Dr. Murray. (ABC7)

Bloss asked Green about the 20+ minute phone call that Phillips had with Murray before the June 20, 2009 meeting. Green was asked to assume that Phillips threatened or pressured Dr. Murray, and whether that changed his opinions in the case. “Assuming he made that threat, that does not change my conclusions,” Green said. (AP)

Bloss asked how Dr. Green reconciled any inconsistency in testimonies. He said he looked if any of them relate to his opinion in the case. “In this case, my opinions are the same as I stated the other day,” Dr. Green expressed. Bloss: Was there any fact inconsistent with your opinion? Dr. Green: Not that I can recall at this time. Bloss: You said your opinion was based on Phillips, Ortega and Gongaware, correct? Dr. Green: That was part of it. (ABC7)

Bloss: Is the basis of your conclusion that AEG Live did not direct Dr. Murray’s action the testimony of Phillips, Gongaware and Ortega? Dr. Green: Part of it yes, but I may have seen other evidence leading me to that conclusion. (ABC7)

Bloss showed email chain “Trouble at the Front” and meeting on June 20, 2009. (ABC7) Bloss showed Green several emails the jury’s seen throughout the case, including one of AEG Live CEO Randy Phillips’ emails to Kenny Ortega. That message told Ortega not to be any amateur psychiatrist or physician and try to diagnose Michael Jackson’s health issues. Bloss asked Green whether that email changed his opinion that AEG didn’t create a conflict of interest for Conrad Murray. Green said no. (AP)

“There were several accounts of that meeting,” Dr. Green said Bloss: Do you recall Dr. Murray telling AEG to “stay in your lane” and that it showed independency? “There’s a little bit of dispute as to what really happened at that meeting,” Dr. Green testified. (ABC7) Green was asked about his recollection of the testimony about a June 20, 2009 meeting between Ortega, Phillips, Murray and Jackson. The doctor initially said he thought Murray had told Ortega and Phillips to stay out of Jackson’s medical care, but Green recalled after some additional questions by Bloss that Murray’s comments were directed only at Kenny Ortega. (AP)

Dr Green: In my opinion in this case the health interests were aligned and there were no conflict of interests that led to poor medical care (ABC7)

Dr Green said when Phillips asked what was wrong with MJ it could be Murray was following privacy laws not disclosing MJ’s medical condition. Bloss asked if Dr. Murray said ‘sorry, I can’t tell you what’s wrong because of HIPPA privacy laws’? “There’s not requirement that Dr. Murray would have to say that,” Dr. Green opined. (ABC7)

“There’s seems not to be any evidence that Dr. Murray was pressured,” Dr. Green said. “It was ultimately up to Dr. Murray to make decisions in the best interest of his patient and he didn’t do that,” Dr. Green opined. Bloss: Even if Mr. Phillips threatened to cancel the tour, that doesn’t change your opinion? Dr. Green: It still does not take away Dr. Murray’s responsibility with the patient. (ABC7)

Bloss played video depo of Dr Green. He said he accepted as true Phillips’ accounting of what happened in that meeting to issue his opinion. “Mr. Phillip testified under oath, I credited his opinion,” Dr. Green said. He said he also credited other testimony as well, such as Ortega “I have no way of resolving which way is true,” Dr. Green explained about different accounts of the meeting. (ABC7)

Dr. Green said he’s aware of two people feeling MJ needed psychiatric help and some people being afraid MJ could die. Bloss asked about Phillips saying it was not the right time to introduce a new person into MJ’s life after psychiatric help was suggested. Bloss showed email from Hougdahl saying he has watched MJ deteriorate for the past 8 weeks and the singer needed a shrink to get thru all. Dr. Green said he’s not sure if he was given copy of this email to review before or after his deposition. After reading his depo, he recalled he had not received it until after the depo and did not consider this email in his conclusion. (ABC7)

Dr. Matheson brought an article entitled “Conflict of Interest in Medical Research, Education, and Practice” to his deposition. The definition Dr. Matheson testified about conflict of interest is not the same formal definition Dr. Green relied upon. “Conflicts of interest are defined as circumstances that create a risk that professional judgments or actions regarding a primary interest.. will be unduly influenced by a secondary interest.” Bloss asked if the agreed with the definition above. “I agree that it’s a reasonable definition but not the only one,” Dr. Green said. Another article Dr. Matheson brought to his deposition: Conflict of interest refers to a “set of conditions in which professional judgment concerning a primary interest (patient’s welfare or the validity of research) is unduly influenced by a secondary interest (financial gain)” Bloss: Do you agree with that? Dr. Green: Yes, that’s a reasonable definition. (ABC7) Green agreed that many were valid definitions of conflicts of interest, but that he didn’t agree that money always created a conflict issue. (AP)

Bloss showed another article "Principles for Identifying and Assessing Conflicts of Interests." Bloss: Do you agree that financial interest is the most powerful corroding force in a conflict of interest? Dr. Green: In my experience, however, I've seen physicians do all sort of things for reasons other than financial. Dr. Green said he's not aware there's way to rate the most powerful conflict of interest. He believes financial interest can create conflict. Bloss showed a report, which summarizes physicians' statements. "When individuals stand to gain by reaching a particular conclusion, they tend to unconsciously and unintentionally weight evidence is a biased fashion." Dr. Green said psychologically speaking, he agrees with the statement above. "I agree money can corrode professional responsibility but I'm not sure it's the most corroding thing in conflict of interest" Dr Green said. Dr. Green said he agreed that the greater the value the more probable its influence is. He highlighted the word 'probable,' though. (ABC7)

Bloss showed Dr. Green MLB's policy on assessment and management of concussion on ballplayers. Policy was adopted in 2010 or 2011. Since then, MLB has to review team physician's actions before an athlete is allowed to return to play. Dr. Green said his position is more of an administrative position with MLB, he doesn't see the patients. He is responsible to make sure the latest rules regarding concussion is followed. He said it's a very controversial area. Bloss asked if the reason team does not have unilateral power to have athlete return to play is because of potential conflict of interest. Dr. Green responded the reason is because there's competition. "It's not about trusting the team's physician, it's about the competition." Dr Green testify he/MLB can deny a team physician's request to put a player back on the field after a concussion. The union doc also opines. Bloss asked if the reason is because there could be conflict of interest between team physician and his responsibility with the player. "Yes, in very small part," Dr. Green responded. "Part of my responsibility is to return athletes to play," he said. (ABC7) Bloss asked about Green’s work with Major League Baseball, specifically its concussion policy. Green reviews team doctors’ decision when a player suffers a concussion. He said a team doctor cannot return a player who has a concussion to a game without outside review. Green said the MLB policy isn’t about conflict of interests, but making sure no team had a competitive advantage “We have rules for everything, how you wear your socks, how you do everything,” Green said. “It has to do with the competitive balance.” (AP)

Bloss said on Jun 14 Gongaware's sent email saying "we need to remind him it's AEG, not MJ who's paying his salary"/"what's expected of him". Then on June 16 Dr. Murray received first draft of the contract agreement with provision that if tour were canceled the agreement would too. Dr. Green said that everyday after June 16, 2009, Dr. Murray knew about that provision. And that included June 24 and 25, the say MJ died. (ABC7)

Bloss asked about meeting nurse Cherilyn Lee had w/ MJ at some point. She testified on April 19 MJ complained of having trouble sleeping. MJ asked Lee to find a doctor who would give him Propofol. Dr. Green said this happened 13 days after Dr. Murray ordered Propofol. (ABC7)

Dr. Green is a clinical professor at UCLA, approximately 16 hours/week. He said there are clinical and tenure tracks. Dr. Green has no experience in the music business, has never worked in concert or for promoter of concerts. (ABC7)

"There could be conflict of interest in any case," Dr. Green said. Bloss asked if having a sole patient increases the risk. He said it could. Bloss: Does Dr. Murray's financial status matters at all to your opinion? Dr. Green: No, it does not. "I had a general impression that he was in debt," Dr. Green said. He believes his understanding was based on media reports on Dr. Murray. (ABC7)

Bloss asked if Detective Martinez suspected financial motive for Murray to violate Hippocratic oath. Dr. Green said that's what he testified. Bloss asked if getting easy money, $150,000 a month, created an incentive to bend the rules. "Yes, and I believe he (Det. Martinez) testified it was Dr. Murray's decision," Dr. Green said. (ABC7) Bloss also asked about testimony by LAPD Det. Orlando Martinez, who said he believed Murray needed money and that influenced his actions. (AP)

Bloss: Is that true you cannot say why Dr. Murray acted ethically in this case? "Not knowing Dr. Murray and not hearing his testimony, I cannot say with certainty why Dr. Murray committed this crime," Dr. Green said. (ABC7) Green: “I cannot say within a reasonable degree of medical probability why Dr. Murray committed this crime.” (AP)

The doctor was asked whether he’d ever seen an agreement similar to the one between AEG Live, Jackson and Murray. Green said no (AP ) Bloss: Have you ever seen a three-way relationship between a physician, a patient and a third party? Dr. Green: No, nothing like this. Dr. Green testified his understanding is that AEG Live was going to advance money to Dr. Murray on behalf of Michael Jackson. Dr. Green agreed Dr. Murray's contract termination could be done by MJ and multiple ways by AEG Live unilateral. "I agree that the longer the tour went on, the more financial gain Dr. Murray would have," Dr. Green testified. (ABC7)

Based on MJ's physical condition in June 2009, Dr. Green said he has no reasonable opinion whether the tour should've been postponed or not. (ABC7)

Bloss concluded his questioning, and AEG Live defense attorney Jessica Stebbins Bina took over on re-direct. (AP)


AEG redirect

In re-cross Dr Green said he was retained in the case on March 4, 2013 to consider his expertise in sports medicine and conflict of interest . He was also asked to review Dr. Matheson's testimony. Dr. Green listed the depositions and declarations he reviewed prior to his own deposition. Dr Green attended almost all of Dr Matheson's deposition. He said he wanted to hear him saying his opinion as opposed to reading it on paper. Dr. Green: I have a great deal of respect for Dr. Matheson. If I had agreed with Dr. Matheson's opinion, I'd have communicated it to AEG. Dr. Green said there has been cases where he gave opinion that the attorneys ended up not using in their cases. Dr. Green: I considered the evidence and I came to my own conclusions. Dr. Green: My practice is that I present them to the attorneys and whatever they want to do with that is their business, not mine. "The more information I found, the more it strengthen my opinion," Dr. Green testified. (ABC7) She asked Green what he would have done if his opinion was the same as a plaintiff’s expert. He said he would have told AEG Live’s lawyers. Green said when that’s happened in other cases, the lawyers haven’t used him as an expert witness. “I look at opinions like I would a medical diagnosis,” Green said. He said new info sometimes changes his opinions. (AP)

Stebbins Bina asked Green about some of the conflict of interest definitions that Bloss asked about. Green said about one document that it was guidance for physicians only, not for third parties or patients. “Patients must be informed of financial incentives that could impact the level of care they receive,” one of the documents read. Green said Jackson was aware of incentives to Murray. “Not only was Michael Jackson informed of the financial incentives, he created them.” (AP) Bina asked about a doc shown on Friday about conflict of interest. Dr. Green said the document is a guidance for physicians on what to do. Bina asked about the article: "Patients must be informed of financial incentives that could impact the level or type of care they receive." Dr Green said the statement further proves his opinion. "Not only was MJ the patient informed of financial incentive, he created it as well" The expert said MJ requested Dr. Murray and suggested the payment of $150,000 a month. (ABC7)

Stebbins Bina asked Green about emails he reviewed in the case expressing concerns about Jackson’s health and whether they changed his opinions in the case. Green said they didn’t, because they didn’t indicate AEG was directing Michael Jackson’s care. Green said his interpretation of the the emails from AEG executives was that they were showing concern about Jackson’s health. (AP) Dr. Green said email Phillips wrote showed they were very concerned about MJ's health, proved his opinion that parties shared same interest. The expert said the fact that Dr. Murray told Ortega to "stay in your lane" proves the doctor was independent. (ABC7)

Dr. Green testified that, as a competent adult, you can't make anyone go see a doctor. Dr. Green said Dr. Klein saw MJ on June 22. He reviewed the medical records. He said Dr. Klein had seen MJ about 30 times between March and June and in no case he mentioned psychological problems. Dr. Green: The emails I reviewed really showed concern on behalf of AEG and I did not see anything AEG was directing the type of care. (ABC7)

Dr Green said he reviewed testimony Murray was off on Sundays. Apr 19 when MJ asked Lee to find a doctor to give him Propofol was Sunday. (ABC7)

Stebbins Bina wrapped up, and Bloss was able to ask a few concluding questions before court adjourned for the day. (AP)


Jackson recross

In re-cross, Bloss asked if $150,000 a month is large incentive, is it not? Dr. Green: In general, yes. "That's more than I make at Pepperdine as the team's physician," Dr. Green said. "By a lot." But he pointed out it's not his only job. (ABC7)

Bloss asked whether Green had any information about what Phillips and Murray discussed on their June 20, 2009 phone call. He didn’t. Green said he didn’t know whether they discussed drug use, medical treatment or any other topics. He only knew what Phillips testified about. (AP)


Bloss pointed out that when Dr. Murray told Ortega to "stay in your lane" if Phillips said anything. He said no. (ABC7)


-----------------------------------------

Next witness is Rhoma Young, HR specialist as AEG's expert.

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 73 – August 20 2013 – Summary

No Jackson family members are in court today.

The judge laid out a schedule on when certain motions will be argued in the next couple weeks. Katherine Jackson wants to amend her lawsuit. AEG Live is seeking a dismissal of the case, claiming the plaintiffs haven’t shown enough evidence to send the case to the jury. AEG’s motion won’t be heard until Sept. 5 so that all the lawyers who need to argue it can be present. (AP)



Rhoma Young Testimony



AEG Direct

AEG called their next witness, Rhoma Young. She's a Human Resources consultant. (ABC7) She was questioned by AEG Live attorney Jessica Stebbins Bina. (AP)

Young said she was asked to look at the practices and policies of AEG Live, their independent contractors and testimony to see if consistent (ABC7) She has testified in detail about the differences between an employee and an independent contractor. (AP)

Young explained she's been in the business going on 40 years. She has her own consulting company in the Bay area. She has worked with Facebook, Microsoft, IBM, LinkedIn, Roche, UC Med Centers, private hospitals, Kaiser, Chevron. She also worked with small organizations with less than 100 employees. In the music industry, Young said she worked with the Symphony, Ballet and Opera in the Bay area. (ABC7) She has been a consultant for 30+ years. Young has consulted on HR issues with the U.S. government and large tech companies including Facebook, Microsoft and healthcare companies. (AP) Young described her extensive background in the business, the different places she has worked and education. (ABC7)

Young said she looks at the whole policy and procedures, all documents and how the company operates. Young explained part of her job is to help the organization to develop a plan to perhaps be more consistent with the written word. (ABC7)

Young reviewed an extensive list of documents in this case. She’s worked in this case close to 200 hours. Her hourly rate for research is $350 per hour and $450 and hour for testimony and deposition. Young said her bill is close to $70,000 as recent as yesterday. In court, she said she testified 95 times, or maybe more. She said she tried to testify half and half for plaintiffs and defendants and has refused work when the balance is off. “I’m not an advocate,” Young said. “Because I testify for both sides, I can’t contradict myself. My reputation is about being balanced.” (ABC7)

She also does investigations and has helped companies hiring employees. Young said an employee is an individual hired by a company. General there’s a defined way to find the employees, the screen process, layers of screen to determine who’s more qualified and who is not. When you’re hired there’s a supervisor, job title, set of expectation, training, how they are paid, employee benefits, insurance, Young said (ABC7) Employees, Young told the jury, typically apply for jobs, have supervisors, are entitled to some benefits and have a pay range. (AP)

Young explained there's are different levels of human resources. One aims for perfection and the basic, which includes reasonable practices. In the world of HR, there are certain basics that are covered in workshops, since there always is confusion. (ABC7)

One is issue between exempt and non-exempt, independent contractor and employee, Young testified. (ABC7)

Application process is the initial screening process of a potential employee, Young said, if person meets the basic qualification. Young said there could be several interviews and done by different ways, like by one person or group of individuals. (ABC7)

Young explained independent contractors are usually sourced through different method and different way. The expert said you can get personal referral or look for professional organizations to find independent contractors. There’s no application. Young testify for independent contractors you talk about price, timing, scheduling, license and there’s contract prior to beginning of work. (ABC7) Independent contractors aren’t employees, Young said, and aren’t entitled to insurance or other benefits and don’t have a supervisor. Independent contractors also are typically referred to a job, and don’t get on-the-job training as an employee might, Young said. Young made a point of telling the jury that her definitions of employees and independent contractors aren't legal ones. (AP)

In order to obtain a medical license, Young said the doctor submits to a fingerprint scan, which goes thru Department of Justice. They also go thru very thorough education background. The State of California does not check financial background of applicants to issue medical licenses, Young said. (ABC7)

Stebbins Bina showed Young a chart that Shawn Trell and plaintiff’s expert Jean Seawright testified about related to AEG Live’s practices. The chart spelled out in bullet points the company’s practices for checking out employees versus independent contractors. Young said the chart was consistent with HR-established practices for checking out employees and independent contractors. she also described appropriate background check policies. She said financial checks are expected for people working in financial roles with a company, but not necessarily for other workers. Other licenses (driving, medical) would be verified. (AP)

Bina showed chart of AEG Process to Check Out People. (ABC7)

Employees:
- Job posted
- Interview and resume
- Verify employability
– Check reference and work history
– Criminal background check is warranted
– Credit check if hired for financial position
– Obligation based on employment relationship

Independent Contractors:
– Previous Working Relationship with AEG Live or Known to the Artist or Known in the Industry
– Required licenses or permits
– Fully insured
– Indemnification provision
– Obligations laid out in contract

Employees have deductions and benefits, such as taxes, insurance, unemployment insurance, disability insurance, etc, Young explained. There’s no payroll taxes deducted from pay of independent contractors, the expert said. (ABC7)


“An employee is brought in with the expectation the person will be with the company for a while,” Young said. Thus the training is different. Independent contractor is supposed to have the expertise right now, she explained. For employee, there’s job description and a set of responsibility very defined. They are usually going to have an employee handbook she said. Handbook details the expectations from the company and what employee can expect from employer, the expert explained. Independent contractors’ duty are worked out in advance and generally with a contract. Young: Generally in my opinion, independent contractors supply their own: their insurance, equipment, etc. They are normally self-contained. (ABC7)

Young said there’s nothing inconsistent in the way AEG check people out with what’s used in the business. (ABC7)

Young said in looking at the content of Dr. Murray’s contract, she said it’s consistent with an independent contractor agreement. “That agreement signed by Dr. Murray did contain things I usually would encounter in independent contractor agreements,” Young opined. (ABC7)

Young: This is little bit of different 3-way agreement. This is AEG acting on behalf, helping MJ getting the doctor he wanted to go on tour. Bina asked who she understood asked for Dr. Murray to be hired. “Michael Jackson,” she responded. Young: My understanding is AEG was to advance funds for other personal staff on behalf of MJ at his request ultimately to be paid back by MJ. “My understanding these choices were being made by MJ. The children chose Kai Chase, but the choices were ultimately MJ’s,” Young testified. (ABC7)

From an HR point of view, background checks could be part of both, but the way of which they are done are different, Young said. The gathering of initial information includes everything you do to find out about the person or organization you’re thinking of bringing on. For employee, Young said the check would include application, talk to prior employers, check driver’s license. Depending on the type of job, there should be a determination on whether a background check is needed or not, Young said. (ABC7)

“For independent contractors, in my opinion, you don’t do background check or criminal check,” Young said. “You have a different set of knowledge, referrals,” she said. You may ask them to provide necessary licenses, their own insurances. She said it may all be included in the agreement. (ABC7)

In an interview, the questions have to be job-related, Young said. Bina: Can you ask about how many children someone has? Young: No! Bina: Can you ask if a person anticipates to get to work on time? Young: You can say ‘the job is schedule to be performed between 8-5. Is that going to present a problem? Young said the rules are in place because you can have privacy issues, you can be asking inappropriate question not fair and equitable. (ABC7)

Young said AEG does basic checks for employees, such as is the person eligible to work, do they have driver’s license if needed for the job. She said they also do credit checks for people who have fiscal and fiduciary duties and criminal background check on some specific employees. (ABC7)

Young said that background check is much less frequently done for independent contractors than it is for employees. Young said many licenses go thru detailed background check. There’s also a possibility to do a check during the interview, if needed. She explained licenses check skills, experience. Professionals are to adhere to standards of expected performance from the issuer of license. Independent contractors give you different kinds of assurances when they are self-insured, Young explained. (ABC7)

Bina: Do you agree or disagree that a credit check was job related for MJ’s physician? Young: I absolutely do not agree. Young: The process for someone to get a medical license is fairly thorough. Secondly, I have worked in health care w/ all different settings. “As fair as I know, they do not do credit checks,” Young said. She checked places hiring, saw no reference as credit check as a requirement. “It’s not common, it’s not frequent, in fact it’s very rare,” Young testified about credit check in the healthcare industry. (ABC7)


Plaintiffs’ HR expert Jean Seawright testified earlier she relied on a study that 3% of healthcare companies did credit checks of employees. Young said 97% of healthcare company did not conduct any credit check. And that included more than just physicians, she said. Young: I helped organizations conduct recruiting, approximately 280, 300 times. Young has done only one credit check for a CFO. Young said the person was going to be making decisions of the financial and fiscal health of the organization. “It’s more of a judgment issue, how they dealt with, for the health of the organization,” Young explained. “In the professional experience I had, it is not common to do credit checks on physicians,” Young opined. (ABC7)


She disagrees that Dr. Murray’s job was high risk or sensitive. High risk is when a person performing the work has more likelihood of fatality or injury to the worker, Young explained. Bina: Is there anything here that you considered Dr. Murray’s job high risk and sensitive? Young: No, I do not. (ABC7)

Young: There were multiple occasions Ms. Seawright seemed to have ignored basic HR standards. Young: When she said there’s no difference between independent contractor and employees, for example. “How she described job relatedness, it was totally at odds from what I’d have expected from a seasoned HR professional,” Young opined. (ABC7)

Bina finished her direct examination.



Jackson cross


Jacksons’ attorney, Brian Panish, did cross examination. (ABC7)

Young said she started tracking cases she’s testified about 15 years ago. She had been testifying about 20 years, 5 years were not tracked. Young came to LA Friday evening. She met with the attorneys Saturday, Sunday and Monday, lunch today. “I don’t bill until I get in this chair,” Young said. She bills different rate when sitting around, which is at $350/hour rate. “It’s true I’m a full-time HR consultant,” Young said, adding she also has another business. Young has an antique business and jewelry design. She works 30-50 hours in HR per week, which she considers full time. (ABC7)

Panish: Do you know what a CMC certification is? Young: Yes P: And that’s something you don’t have? Y: Correct . Panish asked if she has worked with concert promoters. She said no. Panish: Ma’am, you don’t specialize in the music business? Young: No. (ABC7)

Young worked at General Motors. There were labor issues and Young represented the company. Panish: During that time, GM was laying off tens of thousands of jobs? Young: At the end of my time there, yes. (ABC7)

Panish asked if she has ever seen a 3-way party involving a doctor, patient and someone else. “I’ve worked with some clinics and going thru personnel files I saw some 3-way agreements,” Young said. There were some independent contractor situation and 3 party agreements, she explained. This was over 10 years ago. Panish: And the agreement said the doctor took directions from someone else other than the patient? Young: I didn’t read the agreements. (ABC7)

Young said she has not seen a contract between a concert promoter, doctor and patient. Panish: You’re not familiar with physicians traveling with musicians on tour? Young: Only what I read in this case. She said she’s familiar with a doctor going on “This Is It” tour and that a doctor was present in an earlier MJ tour. Panish: You never dealt with a producer/promoter trying to hire a doctor for an artist? Young: That’s correct. Young said she’s never hired a physician on behalf of anyone. She has helped in the process but was not the person to have the last say. (ABC7)

Young has not looked at Nevada’s medical license requirements prior to issuing a medical license. There was one child support situation that was late, Young said. She read in the case that Dr. Murray has 6 or 7 children. (ABC7)

Panish: You’re not disputing AEG could’ve made Dr. Murray sign a authorization for background check, are you? Young: No. Panish: Did AEG have a written policy of what they had to do to supervise an independent contractor? Young: No. Panish: Is there a written policy regarding hiring and retaining independent contractors? Young said that as far as she knew, AEG has a template of draft contract. Young explained there’s a draft, in writing, of template for dealing with independent contractors. She said she could consider that a policy. Panish showed the independent contractor template and what Young said it would be a policy and procedure. Panish: Does it say what they should check out before the employment? Young: No P: Does it say check references, prior employment? Y: No. Panish: It’s important to have clear policies and procedures to hire independent contractor in order for everyone to follow the same rules? Young said it helps. “My understanding is that all went thru legal,” she added. Panish asked what document applies for written policy/procedure for AEG Live hiring/retaining/engaging an independent contractor. “To my knowledge there isn’t one,” Young said. “As far as I know, there are no criteria in writing before hiring an independent contractor.” “I look for effectiveness not correctness when doing my audits,” Young said. Young explained she was not asked to to assess if AEG Live appropriately supervised Dr. Conrad Murray. (ABC7)

Panish asked what AEG Live did to check Dr. Murray’s license. Young said Kathy Jorrie searched the doctor’s medical license. Panish pointed out that insurance was never provided to AEG. “And the agreement was never completed,” Young responded. (ABC7)

Panish: Finding someone is different from checking them out, isn’t it? Young: Yes. You may be doing both things at the same time. Panish: In your opinion, AEG didn’t have to do anything? Young: In terms of background check and supervising Dr. Murray, no. (ABC7)

Young said she does not consider physician’s job dangerous. She said industry considers the danger to the person doing the job not 3rd party. Panish asked if one example of dangerous profession is crocodile’s keeper, wild animal holders. She said yes. “Crocodiles are dangerous creatures,” Young testified. “Have you trained a crocodile before?” Panish asked. “Not recently,” she responded. And Young took a jab at Panish: “I’ve been cross examined by one.” Everyone started laughing. (ABC7)

Young is donating the trial testimony money to the American Cancer Society. Panish said if he keeps her tomorrow there will be more money to ACS. Defense attorney objected. Everyone laughed again. (ABC7)

Frasco Profiles does background check for AEG. Panish showed provision that says “Disclosure and Authorization to Conduct Background Check”. Panish: In 2009, AEG Live had the ability to do background check on a person if they wanted to? Young: Yes. Panish: Frasco charges between $40-$125 for background checK? Young said she based her opinion on a competitor of Frasco. The answer is yes. Young is familiar with credit check in general. She doesn’t do them herself. (ABC7)

Panish: Did you see any evidence in this case that AEG Live did a background check on Dr. Murray? Young said Jorrie checked Dr. Murray’s medical license, whether it was current and if there had been any complaints against him. (ABC7)

Panish asked Young about Det. Martinez’ assertion that Dr. Murray was in desperate financial troubles. “I learned that he was late in the mortgage payments, I don’t know how far it was in the foreclosure process,” she said. Young said in her deposition that she has no idea how Randy Phillips determined Dr. Murray was extremely successful. (ABC7)

Young explained she’s familiar w/ State of California’s criteria to issue licenses to physician, but she’s not an expert in physician hiring. (ABC7)

Panish asked if 10 mins is thorough, detailed background check on someone. Young said it could be, even Seawright said it only takes 5 mins. (ABC7)


AEG Redirect

In re-direct, Bina showed “Disclosure and Authorization to Conduct Background Check.” It says “Credit history may be requested, but only where such information is substantially related to the duties and responsibilities of the position to which you’re applying.” (ABC7)

Young said she thinks the salary discussion alone proves that’s what MJ wanted at the time. (ABC7)


Jackson recross


In re-cross, Young said there was an agreement that called for the engagement of Dr. Murray. Panish: If AEG came to you in 2009 and asked if they should hire a doctor on behalf of 3rd party, you would’ve said no? Young: I don’t know. “No, there’s not a chance I’d advise that,” Young said in a deposition, laughing out loud. (ABC7)


AEG redirect

Bina asked if the reason she said that was because she’s not a lawyer. She said yes, she doesn’t advise on contracts. (ABC7)

Young is excused.


----------------------------------

AEG Live plans to play three video depositions tomorrow, Jeffrey Adams, Dr. David Adams and Dr. Stephen Gordon.

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 74 – August 21 2013 – Summary

No Jackson family members are in court today.


Jeffrey Adams video deposition



Adams was a security guard for Michael Jackson who introduced him to Conrad Murray in 2007. He later worked for Murray. J. Adams worked with Murray from the day after Jackson died until the day he was convicted of the singer’s involuntary manslaughter (AP)

Adams said he completed third year of college at Long Beach State University in 1993. He worked school security for 8 years. After 1999 Adams moved to Las Vegas, worked at Burlington Coat Factory as loss prevention, looking at cameras, shoplifters for about 4 years. He also worked at Neiman Marcus during same time, left in 2007. After Adams said he worked as personal security for an attorney in Las Vegas (ABC7)

Adams testified he traveled with Dr. Conrad Murray everywhere. "I wasn't paid as his security, but I was his security," he said. "It was just understood that I'd be. There was no contract or anything of that nature or a job." "I started with Dr. Murray the day after Michael Jackson passed," Adams explained. (ABC7)

Adams' relationship with the singer was a bit confusing. He said he worked security at special events for Jackson, but also said he "didn't officially work for Michael, I orchestrated his staff." (LATimes)
Q: At a point, didn't you work for MJ?
A: I didn't officially work for MJ, I orchestrated his staff. I didn't actually officially work 4 him (ABC7)

Adams had his own security company called "Knockout Security," started in 2004. He said he met Dr. Murray in early 90s through mutual friend
Q: What was your impression of Dr. Murray when you first met him?
A: Tall, cardiologist. She told me he was a cardiologist. That's about it.
From the time Adams met Dr. Murray to when he moved to Las Vegas, he saw the doctor 3-4 times at barbecues in Los Angeles. Adams became a patient of Dr. Murray in Las Vegas, and so did Adams' father.
Q: Are you still his patient?
A: Oh, he's locked up now. No, not now. (ABC7)

Adams: The day after MJ passed I called Dr. Murray. He was in California. And I asked him was it true what I was hearing. He said yes. Adams: And I asked him if he was ok and needed me, and he said yes. And at that time my father told me to go to him. Adams said Dr. Murray told him he needed help because MJ had passed. "I told him he had taken care of my father for me and that I'd be by his side in this situation until it was completed," Adams recalled. "We went to eat together, we went to movies together, we went to criminal proceedings, meetings lawyers, we took walks together... Adams also travelled with Dr. Murray to Las Vegas, Houston, San Diego, Philadelphia, Boston, Miami. Adams said Dr. Murray's pastor in Houston was also his patient, as well as a number of other pastors and people he went to church with. Adams stayed in Dr. Murray's office when he was in Vegas and Houston seeing patients. Adams learned through TV reports that MJ had died. He called Murray, who was in Santa Monica. He traveled to LA next morning. "I made statements, you know, but he never discussed with me how Michael passed," Adams recalled. "He never clarified anything with me." We lived together, we had an apartment together, we did everything together," Adams said. Adams went everywhere with Dr. Murray from the day after MJ's death to Murray's criminal conviction. The last time Adams spoke with Dr. Murray was the day he was convicted. Adams said Dr. Murray never described what kind of treatment he was engaged in with MJ. (ABC7)

Adams testified that he met Murray in the 1990s through a mutual friend and remained his patient until Murray was convicted for involuntary manslaughter in the Jackson case. He testified that when Jackson died on June 25, 2009, he called Murray and asked if the doctor needed him. “I told him that he had taken care of my father for me and that I would be by his side in this situation until it was completed,” Adams said. He said he arrived in Southern California the next day and lived with Murray until his conviction, providing security and traveling with him to Philadelphia, Las Vegas, Houston, San Diego, Boston and Miami. He said Murray would see patients in Las Vegas and Houston. Murray never discussed the details of Jackson's death with him, Adams said. (LATimes)

Jeffrey Adams testified he was "positive" the first time Jackson and Murray met was in February 2007. (LATimes) Adams orchestrated security for MJ in December of 2006. He said his friend, Basheier Muhammad, who was MJ security, called him offering work He said he was positive that was the first time the two met. "Mr. Muhammad called me one evening in 2007, I want to say maybe February.. He did periodic work for MJ. "I introduced Dr. Murray to Michael Jackson," Adams said. It was in early 2007, as he recalled. "He said that MJ's children were sick and needed to go to the hospital and that MJ didn't want to take them to public hospital," he said. Adams explained it was due to the fact that they didn't have anything to cover their faces. Adams: And I told him I could reach out to my doctor, Dr. Murray, and see of he would be willing to come over and take a look at them. Adams said MJ wanted resume of Murray, if he could be trusted. "I said he's been my doctor, he's my friend, he definitely can be trusted." Adams: I told Murray I needed a huge favor from him, had a high profile client, couldn't give name but once he got there he'd know who was. Adams asked if Murray could check out MJ's children since they couldn't go to regular hospital. Dr. Murray told Adams that he would go at least to assess the situation. The doctor went that night, Adams wasn't there. Adams asked Mr. Muhammad next day if Murray showed up. He said yes, but never discussed anything further. "Other than Michael thanking me for bringing him over to see the children, that was the only conversation we had," Adams testified. Adams said MJ told him "I want to thank you very much, he was a very professional doctor, and I appreciate it." Adams said he wasn't going to ask for a resume because Murray was doing a favor. (ABC7)

The security guard didn’t recall the exact date he introduced Jackson to Murray, but meeting came about through another MJ security guard. That guard called J. Adams and asked him if he knew a doctor who could treat Jackson’s children. Adams recommended Murray. J. Adams knew Murray because he had treated him and his father. He asked Murray to do a house call at Jackson’s home, and the doc agreed. Jackson thanked J. Adams for introducing him to Murray, but they otherwise didn’t discuss the doctor or his treatments. (AP)

Adams said that one of Jackson's security staff members, Bashier Muhammad, called him and told him that Jackson's children were sick and he didn't want to take them to the hospital "due to the fact that they ... weren’t made up or didn’t have anything to cover their faces.” Murray was Adams' doctor and had also treated Adams' father. Muhammad asked if the doctor could be trusted. “I said he’s been my doctor," Adams testified. "He’s my friend. He definitely can be trusted.” Adams said he called the doctor within 10 minutes. “I told Dr. Murray that I needed a huge favor from him, that I had a high-profile client that I was working with -- I couldn’t give him that name, but that once he got there he would know who he was -- would he mind going over there" and examine his children, Adams testified. Adams declined a request from Muhammad to provide Murray's resume: "We were doing him a favor," Adams said. Muhammad told him the next day that Murray had visited Jackson's Las Vegas home. "Everything's fine," Muhammad told Adams. Adams said he did not know how many times Murray treated Jackson or his children. (LATimes)

Adams testified he would come over at the house and see Dr. Murray there sometimes after that. But he doesn't know how the relationship went
Q: Did you ever feel that Dr. Murray tried to hide his interactions with MJ?
A: No. (ABC7)

Jeff Adams knew Murray was at Jackson's house because he would sometimes see his car there. Likewise, Jeff Adams, said when he worked for Murray, they never discussed Murray’s treatments on Jackson. (AP)

Adams said he only saw Mr. Jackson and Randy Jackson come to the house one time while he was there. (ABC7) Adams was also asked about which Jackson relatives he saw visit MJ while he lived in Las Vegas. He only saw Randy and Joe Jackson. (AP)

"It was discussed what happened, what was he going to do from there" Adams recalled. He doesn't remember if Murray told cause of MJ's death. Dr. Murray told Adams he would need a lawyer. Adams was with the doctor in his unofficial position during the criminal trial. (ABC7)

Jeffrey Adams had known Murray for years and the cardiologist had treated his father's heart ailment in 2007. He testified that he called Dr. Murray to offer his help after he saw on television that Jackson had died."I told him he had taken care of my father for me and I would be at his side until this situation was complete," Adams testified.Murray told him that night "he was going to need a lawyer," he said.He and Murray "did everything together" from June 26, 2009 --a day after Jackson's death -- until November 7, 2011 -- the day Murray was convicted of involuntary manslaughter, he said.Jeffrey Adams said he served as Murray's bodyguard for more than two years without pay.Despite his close relationship to Murray, Adams said he has not spoken to the doctor since he was put in handcuffs in the courtroom and taken to jail. (CNN)


Dr. Stephen Gordon, plastic surgeon from Las Vegas, video deposition


He said his records are electronically saved. He located the "Michael Jefferson" file. He said MJ chose to use this name to protect privacy. Dr. Gordon saw MJ professionally 3 times, never socially, spoke on phone maybe twice. (ABC7)

Dr. Gordon detailed his education background and experience. He is board certified in general surgery and plastic surgery. Doctor said he teaches plastic surgery to medical students and physicians' assistants students from Touro University. That started 3 yrs ago. Dr. Gordon does cosmetic surgery in his office, which is elective surgery intended to improve the appearance of a person. Dr. Gordon said he probably does more breast surgery than anything else, followed by body contour and facial rejuvenation. The doctor has an accredited surgery center her performs the procedures called Surgery Unit at ACCSC, A Complete Cosmetic Surgery Center. (ABC7)

He said if the surgery is major, the patient is always under general anesthesia. Only for minor things it's local anesthesia. Botox is generally done under local or no anesthesia, Dr. Gordon said. Filler usually has a local anesthetic component of some sort. Dr. Gordon: They have to get an UV started first. Then they're usually given some type of hypnotic that puts them to sleep, Diprivan. Dr. Gordon said he does not tell the anesthesiologist how much drug to give. (ABC7)

Gordon never saw Jackson socially. He met the singer after receiving a call directly from him, seeking an appointment. (AP) Dr. Gordon said Michael Jackson called him and the answering service transferred the call to his cell phone. This was in 2002. "At first I thought it was somebody playing a prank," Dr. Gordon said. "I really thought it was one of my friends just fooling around." "It was very pleasant sort of flattering experience," Dr. Gordon said. The doctor said he didn't believe it was Michael Jackson on the phone. Dr. Gordon testified he asked MJ which hotel he was staying. He said Four Seasons. The doctor called the hotel back. MJ told him to ask for Michael Jefferson. "I got the impression he was going to be interviewing me, as much as I might be interviewing him" (ABC7) Gordon said he initially thought it was someone messing with him, but Jackson gave him a callback number and he was convinced. "It was a very pleasant sort of flattering experience," Gordon said.The doctor said Jackson told him he really wanted to see him. (AP) Jackson appeared to be capable of dealing with doctors on his own, Gordon said. "He gave me the impression that he was used to telling doctors what he wanted them to do." Jackson personally called him in 2002 when he was looking for a doctor in Las Vegas to give him collagen and Botox treatments, he said. "At first I thought it was somebody playing a prank, one of my friends fooling around," Gordon said. He realized it really was the pop star when he called him back at his hotel -- asking for him under his alias "Michael Jefferson," he said. (CNN)

The doctor said MJ wanted to come after hours, when the office was closed and nobody was around, which doctor thought was a reasonable idea. Dr. Gordon said MJ came with 2 or 3 people entourage. He said his ex-wife and anesthesiologist, Dr. Virgil, were in the office. He said Dr. Virgil was there because MJ gave an indication he may wanted something done. The doctor testified he doesn't recall exactly what MJ wanted done, but it was some adjustment of some sort on his face. (ABC7)

On October 2, 2002, Dr. Gordon did first procedure, collagen injection of upper nasolabial folds. The Botox injection in Michael Jackson's lower eyelid area was for crow's feet, the doctor testified. First page of record was an agreement as to what will be done and what the itemizes charges for that service will be, including anesthesia . Collagen was administered under general anesthesia. Gordon said MJ expressed needle phobia, didn't want 2 see needles sticking on his face "It didn't seem an unreasonable request," Dr. Gordon said. Once MJ got into building, the entourage left. "He just wanted to have a little bit of collagen, nothing dramatic," Dr. Gordon explained. He said MJ requested to go under general anesthesia, was vey specific as to what he wanted. Putnam: How long was he there? Dr. Gordon: Couple of hours, probably. Prescription was under the name of Michael Jefferson. Dr Gordon said they were homeopathic medications: Arnica Montana, Bromelain, Vitamin A. "The patient desired correction of an unattractive area in his nasolabial folds bilaterally," the chart said. Dr Gordon wrote on the chart that he examined the patient, MJ, and he was found to be in good health, no obvious contraindication to surgery. Propofol was used in the induction of anesthesia in 2002, isoflurane, nitrous oxide and oxygen. Doctor also used Lidocaine to numb the skin. Under allergies, there are a few medications listed. Demerol and morphine cause nausea, it says. Dr. Gordon said the chart shows anesthesiologist doing his job from 9:00 to 9:20. (ABC7) Jackson went to his office on Oct. 2, 2002 for the first procedure, which was done after hours. MJ got some collagen injections. The injections were both in Jackson's face, some near his nose and he got Botox on at least one of his lower eyelids. He got anesthesia. Gordon said having a patient get anesthesia for those types of procedures wasn't typical. "He expressed a significant needle phobia." It was a short procedure _ about 10 minutes and Gordon said it wasn't a notable visit and nothing out of the ordinary happened. (AP)

Gordon’s medical records indicated Jackson returned two days later, but the doctor didn’t have any notes of what was done. (AP) Dr. Gordon said MJ visited 2-3 days later. He wasn't really happy with the collagen injection. He said he had a very small injected again. Surgery was on Oct. 2, 2002 and next appointment was Oct. 4, 2002. Dr. Gordon said he does not remember this visit. "It wouldn't surprise me if he came back 2 days later and wasn't happy with something," he explained. Dr. Habashi was the anesthesiologist. The surgery was from 8:25 to 8:55, longer than the first one. "This was in his record, and it's got his name on it." Dr. Gordon: These might be longer than they really were only because there may have been conversation in the operating room for all I know. Propofol was used again as anesthesia. Dr. Gordon said he knew he'd have trouble explaining it. "I can't even tell you exactly what we did." "The only thing that makes me think this is MJ is because it has his name on it," Dr. Gordon said. There's anesthesia record but not surgery record. Dr. Gordon said he knew this would be difficult to explain. The doctor said this record could be for another person. "I'm a little embarrassed to admit that, but it could be another patient," he said. Kathryn Cahan said in court the parties stipulated there was no procedure done that day. (ABC7) The anesthesiologist had notes that a 45-minute procedure was done, but the doctor doesn’t remember what happened. Gordon said it’s possible the procedure was a touch-up from the previous one, or the anesthesiology chart was for another patient. “I knew I’d have a little trouble explaining this to you,” Gordon told AEG Live defense lawyer Marvin Putnam on the video. While Gordon’s records were unclear, the attorneys agreed to read a note to the jury that a procedure did happen on Oct. 2, 2002. (AP)

Dr Gordon said he remembered trying to speak w MJ after surgery, but it was difficult to get hold of him post-op. "He'd come then disappear" (ABC7)

"I thought he was healthy," he opined. "He was pretty robust. He was taller than I thought he would be. And he seemed physically healthy." "Michael was a little bit of a whiner, having an IV started and about, you know, having Propofol injection," Dr. Gordon recalled. Dr. Gordon: He made the remark that it burned. And he actually referred to Propofol as milk, which I thought was a little unusual. "He just seemed to be more familiar with Propofol than other people," Dr. Gordon recalled. "He knew it was white and looked like milk." Dr Gordon doesn't know if MJ asked whether Propofol, "milk", was going to be used. He didn't recall MJ asking for medication after 1st visit (ABC7) The doctor also said Jackson appeared more familiar with anesthesia than other patients, and referred to propofol as “milk.” “Most people really don’t relate to it like that,” Gordon said. He noted he just overheard the conversation with the anesthesiologist. (AP)

The physician said his first encounter with Michael Jackson was in 2002 when he administered collagen and Botox injections for the star. “Did he specifically ask for the general anesthetic?” Gordon is asked. “Yes,” he replied. Gordon testified Jackson was unusually familiar with the anesthetic propofol, which his office used for general anesthesia.“He made the remark that it burned, and he actually referred to propfol as milk,” Gordon said. “He gave me the impression he was used to telling doctors what he wanted them to do.” (CBS)

On Mar 25, 2003 Dr Gordon's office sent MJ's bill-paying-people copy of investment analysis. Doctor sent it twice since no payment was made. Dr. Gordon: Normally, we're paid in advance. We took his word that he would honor his financial responsibilities. (ABC7) Gordon testified that he had trouble getting paid for the October procedures. He described Jackson as a “phantom” and difficult to reach. (AP)

"Well, he gave me the impression that he was used to telling doctors what he wanted them to do," Dr. Gordon said. Q: And how did he give you that impression? A: Well, just his specificity about what he wanted and where he wanted it and how much he wanted, how he wanted it done. (ABC7)

Dr. Gordon testified MJ was familiar with Propofol and that's what he wanted to go to sleep. (ABc7)

In July 2003, Jackson returned for another procedure. This time he asked Gordon to cut a “foreign body” out of his abdomen. (AP) Next MJ visit was on July 30, 2003. It was a procedure to explant foreign body from abdomen area. Dr. Gordon: MJ had claimed he had fallen and had sustained an injury to his abdominal area. Dr Gordon: He believed that there was still some glass or some other foreign body in his abdomen. He said it was painful, wanted removed. The surgery was under general anesthesia to cut out the whole thing and sewed the margins back together. Q: Did you remove anything from Mr. Jackson's abdomen? A: I didn't remove any foreign body that I could recognize. Dr. Gordon: There wasn't any glass, there wasn't any metal, there wasn't any wood. There wasn't anything that was inorganic. "So as far as I could tell, it was a negative exploration," Dr. Gordon said. "It didn't show any material thing." Dr. Gordon said he saw a small scar of some sort on MJ's abdomen. He performed this exploratory procedure and Botox on MJ. "I cut around what was supposed to have a foreign body in it, which was presumed to be wound packing, which, again, I saw no evidence of." (ABC7) Gordon removed scar tissue, but said he didn’t find anything inorganic in Jackson’s abdomen. MJ had a wound, but it had healed. (AP)

"He was getting ready to go and he said he wanted me to give me as shot of Demerol for the road" Dr Gordon said. "Michael I don't do that" MJ wanted 300 mg of Demerol. The doctor said no, didn't hear from MJ for 4 years. Demerol is a painkiller after surgery. "That's not something I prescribe," Dr. Gordon said. If patient is at the hospital, doctor said ok. Putnam: And he asked for a shot? Dr. Gordon: Yes, he asked for a shot. He said the normal dose of Demerol s 100 mg. MJ was asking for 300 mg, the doctor explained. "That's just too much," Dr. Gordon said. His impression was that favors like that has been done before. (ABC7) The doctor said as Jackson was leaving, he asked for a shot of Demerol “for the road.” Gordon said he was surprised by the request. Gordon said he wasn’t going to give it to Jackson, but asked him how much he wanted. 300mg the singer replied. Gordon said that a high dose and he refused to give it to Jackson. The singer didn’t argue, but did say he could handle it. “I got the impression that he had favors like this done for him before,” Gordon said of Jackson’s request for Demerol. (AP)

Dr. Gordon had a preoperative procedure. MJ wanted him to explore "I remember him saying he he had injury," Dr. Gordon said. "He said he could feel it it and it hurt," the doctor said. Dr. Gordon said reading the report it seemed someone did something to him. "I cut and looked at it and couldn't see anything," Dr. Gordon said. Dr. Gordon prescribed some pain medication, but not Demerol. He didn't see MJ for 4 years, until 2007. (ABC7)

The doctor said MJ reached out to see him but he was out of town and referred him to someone else. This was between 2003-2007. Dr. Gordon said it may have been a hand injury. Dr. Gordon referred him to Dr. Stephen Weiland. (ABC7)

He didn’t see the singer again for another four years. The next time he came to the office, Conrad Murray was with him. Murray presented himself and Jackson’s doctor and “spokesperson to some extent,” Gordon said. Gordon found the visit odd. He said Jackson acted like he hadn’t been there before, and he had never had a patient bring their own doctor to a visit. Murray had driving Jackson to the office and sat through the procedure. Jackson received a cosmetic injection, but didn’t get propofol. Gordon said he didn’t give Jackson any pain medication after that visit. His impression was Murray was taking care of MJ’s needs, he said. “There was nothing usual or customary about what he was doing, at all,” Gordon said of the 2007 visit. He never heard from Jackson again. (AP)

Dr. Gordon spoke with Conrad Murray. He said MJ was doing a show or something and wanted some more fillers on his face. "He wasn't too secretive abut being a cardiologist or anything," Dr. Gordon said about Dr. Murray. "He presented himself as being Mr.Jackson's personal physician and spokesperson to some extent" Dr. Gordon testified. It was on May 14, 2007. Dr. Murray arrived with MJ at Dr. Gordon's office. "He walked in with MJ, introduced himself and were there for Juvederm," he said. Dr. Gordon said he found very odd that MJ acted like he hadn't been at his office before, but it was not his first time. "He certainly tried to be the spokesperson for MJ. I never had a doctor feel like they needed to... this was a little different." Dr. Murray wrote a personal check to Dr. Gordon for MJ's procedure. Murray was present during the procedure. He said it was unusual. Dr. Gordon said he had never seen a personal physician pay for the treatment of a patient. Dr. Gordon: Because they had a very close relationship and Conrad made it very clear that he was taking care of his needs. Dr Gordon said he had a feeling that Murray was trying to wear two different hats, being MJ's personal physician and continuing his practice "They might have been there for quite a while that day, fussing with the appearance," Dr. Gordon said. 'He required a fair amount of codling," Dr. Gordon said. "At least he wanted to do under local anesthesia, which was a progress." Dr. Gordon said he wasn't sure if MJ didn't remember being there before or pretending to not remember. He said there wasn't really a doctor/patient because Dr. Murray was kind of the intermediary. The doctor said MJ looked healthy in 2007, didn't change much in his appearance. He never contacted MJ after that. (ABC7)

Dr. Gordon wanted to make more difficult to someone else, other than himself, to get their hands on MJ's records, used different last name. Dr. Gordon has an accredited surgery center. He never asked how many plastic surgeries MJ have had. He said he uses tricks so the patients don't get apprehensive with the procedure. (ABC7)

Dr. Gordon: He expressed he definitely wanted to do under general anesthesia since he didn't want to put up with many needle sticks. It was Dr. Gordon's decision to use general anesthesia. He did not think it was inappropriate. Dr. Gordon doesn't recall whether MJ inquired with drug was going to be used to put him under. (ABC7)

There were 3 contacts between 03-07. Every time was hard to find a vein in MJ, Dr. Gordon said. "Just absence of usable veins." It usually implies vein damage, he said. He doesn't remember seeing track marks on MJ's arms. He said it's unusual not to find vein in males. (ABC7)

In the July 30th, 2003 procedure, Dr. Gordon said he removed scar tissue and whatever else was there subcutaneous. The anesthesiologist used Fentanyl since MJ reported getting nauseated with morphine and Demerol. Regarding MJ requesting a shot of Demerol for the road, Dr. Gordon said MJ told him 'That's ok, I've done this before, it's fine'. "He said 300 mg was not excessive for him," Dr. Gordon testified. "He wasn't sufficiently nauseated that kept him from asking for it." (ABC7)

The check to Dr. Gordon that Murray wrote was for $1,300. Dr. Gordon was kind of skeptical of Dr. Murray. "He just seemed odd. There was nothing usual and customary what he was doing." Dr. Gordon said he never heard of cardiologist Dr. Conrad Murray before, and he knows several other cardiologists in Las Vegas. "He'd have me believe he had successful invasive cardiology practice in Las Vegas and Houston," Dr. Gordon said. "But if it he was that successful, why would he be someone personal physician?" Dr. Gordon questioned. "It seemed something he was telling me wasn't true" Dr Gordon said. "It's fair to say the whole situation was very odd and didn't add up." "I felt that a successful cardiologist doesn't go around being somebody's personal physician and speaking for them," Dr. Gordon testified. (ABC7)

"He presented himself as being Mr. Jackson's personal physician and spokesperson to some extent" when Murray accompanied Jackson on an appointment to have cosmetic filler put in his face on May 14, 2007, Gordon said. Gordon had treated Jackson several times four years earlier, but not when Murray was with him -- and he even wrote a $1,300 check to pay for the procedure, he said. "The whole situation seemed very odd and it didn't add up and that caused me not to fully trust the person," Gordon testified. "I felt like a successful cardiologist doesn't go around being somebody's private physician and speaking for them, in my experience." (CNN)


Dr. David Adams video deposition

Dr. Adams is a anesthesiologist in Las Vegas. He works independently with surgeons or medical providers. (ABC7)

Dr. Adams administered propofol to Jackson on four occasions during dental procedures. He said MJ never specifically requested the drug. The doctor said he and Jackson never specifically discussed propofol. Dr. Adams said Jackson appeared thin, but healthy. (AP)

Putnam: Did you ever administer Propofol to MJ?
Dr. Adams: Yes
P: How many times?
Dr. A: Four (ABC7)

Dr. Adams met MJ through Carlos Letilier, who's an oral surgeon in Vegas. Dr. Mark Tadrissi said he had a VIP patient coming in for a few procedures and if he was interested in doing anesthesia. This was in June of 2008. Dr. Adams scheduled a physical exam and the procedure happened a week later, he said. "I realized the magnitude of who I was working with, I wanted to make sure he was healthy and there wouldn't be any problems" Dr Adams said. Dr. Tradissi scheduled the physical with MJ. "They were cosmetic implants, dental implants, had a root canal," Dr. Adams said. "I never discuss really the drugs I'm going to use with the doctor," Dr. Adams said. Propofol is still the drug of choice. Dr. Adams said MJ was going to have a procedure and didn't want to know about it or feel anything. Dr. Tradissi introduced MJ to him. "He said he had them (anesthesia) before and he didn't have any problems." "He seemed thin, pale, but otherwise no medical problems," Dr. Adams said. "I don't believe they weighed him." The entourage and bodyguards were never in the room when MJ was being examined. It was just Dr. Adams and MJ. He checked his chest, lungs and looked inside the mouth. Q: How did he look? "Thin but muscular, healthy" he said. "Just pale." MJ had an abnormally large tongue, which concerned Dr. Adams because they were going to perform work on his mouth with an unprotected airway. Dr. Adams said he explained all the risks to MJ. The artist said he wasn't taking any medication, only vitamins. Dr. Adams checked to see if there was a crash cart in the room, basic emergency equipment in case something goes wrong. (ABC7)

Temperature was steady at 97 F and stable all the way thru. 100 by 60 blood pressure. Procedure took about 2 hours. Dr. Adams gave MJ Propofol. "I want to get this procedure done as soon as possible because of the unprotected airway." "I'm not trying to put him to sleep, I just want him not to remember," Dr Adams said. Dr Tradissi gave him anesthetic like Lidocaine as well. Dr. Adams said the amounts of Propofol he gave was the lowest he gives to patients. (ABC7)

Dr. Adams said he didn't bill MJ for any of the 4 procedures. He said if MJ referred Dr. Adams to other people would be more valuable. He said he also didn't know what to say when asked for how much it would cost. He normally bills the insurance company about $400/hour. (ABC7) Dr. Adams didn’t charge Jackson for his services, but told the singer that he wanted him to refer other patients to him. (AP)

The first time Dr. Adams gave met Jackson, he said he noticed the singer had a large tongue. He was worried that could be a problem. Sure enough, Jackson’s tongue blocked his airway during each of the four procedures, Dr. Adams said. He was able to quickly remedy it. Moving Michael Jackson’s chin would open up his airway and restore his breathing, Dr. Adams said. (AP)

There wasn't anything unusual about the first procedure, Dr. Adams said. When Dr Adams administered Propofol, MJ's tongue blocked the airway. They had to position MJ in a different way in the dentist chair to unblock the airway. Other than that, there were no other issues he said. The second procedure was a month later, also at Dr. Tradissi. Dr. Adams said it was pretty much the same procedure as before. Dr. Adams said he's done about 4,000 anesthesias, including colonoscopy. In about 500 times the tongue blocks the airway. Dr. Adams said MJ was perfectly happy with what had happened. First procedure was to take impression of dental. Second procedure was 6/3/08. Third procedure was on 6/18/08. Dr. Odabashian performed root canal. About 2 hours after the first procedure, MJ called to let Dr. Adams know he was ok. He said he was surprise MJ himself called. MJ said he was going to buy the house the sultan used to live. Dr. Adams said MJ was very pleasant, polite, personable and very quiet. The 4th procedure Dr. Adams performed was with oral surgeon Carlos Letilier. It was for screwing the 2 implants into MJ's jaw. (ABC7)

Dr. Adams: In the previous 3 procedures, Michael asked me not to give him narcotics. He just said he had had a problem w/ them in the past. Dr. Adams: So if you looks at my records, you won't see any narcotics. I didn't give him any, as requested. Dr. Adams: After it was over, he asked for something for the pain, and I remember saying are you sure? Dr. Adams: And we had mentioned Toradol, which is a nonnarcotic pain reliever, and he requested something stronger. The doctor said MJ told him Toradol wasn't going to work. Dr. Adams ended up giving MJ Versed an morphine for the pain. (ABC7)

Dr. Adams said he never discussed with MJ the use of Propofol and never discussed about the other doctors MJ had. (ABC7)

Dr. Adams recounted meeting Conrad Murray. The cardiologist called him on a Sunday afternoon in March, asked him to come to his office. Dr. Adams was getting ready for church when Murray called, and he went to the cardiologist’s office thinking Jackson needed medical care. (AP) Dr. Adams met Murray in late March, early April 2009. "After MJ died, I kind of went back through my mind and looked at what I was doing" Dr. Adams: I was up getting ready to go to church. Q: And why did you go anyway? A: If you're having heart attack or heart problem, I'm a doctor. This is MJ. I mean, if he says he needs something I'm going to go. This was at Dr. Murray's office. "Michael and Dr. Murray got out of the car, I got out of my car, we introduced ourselves to each other." Dr. Adams: I told Michael how ridiculous he looked because he had a scarf and he was all dressed in black and it was 1000 degrees outside. Dr. Adams: Usually he had a very relaxed look, maybe even pajamas, but this time he had on a suit coat, a scarf, a hat. (ABC7) Jackson accompanied Murray to meet with Dr. Adams. Despite being extremely hot, Jackson was wearing a suit coat and scarf, he recalled. (AP) Dr. Adams: We started talking and I believe Michael started talking about this tour. Michael explained why he was doing the tour. "He says the only reason I'm doing this tour is because I want to prove to my kids that I'm the best entertainer in the world," he recalled. "And I'm not doing it for any other reason," MJ told him. Dr. Adams said he was wondering why MJ wanted to talk to him. "I'm waiting for him to hold his chest or tell me he's short of breath or he's got chest pain," Dr. Adams said. (ABC7)

Instead, Dr. Adams said Jackson talked to him for about 90 minutes about his life, his practice, and other topics. Murray had left the room. (AP) Dr. Adams: I'm sitting in a cardiologist's office with Michael Jackson on a Sunday afternoon, and I'm just sitting," Dr. Adams testified. "He asked me to go on tour with him," Dr. Adams said. He explained Dr. Murray excused himself and MJ talked to him like an interview. "And he was telling me a little bit about him and how he felt and his family and different entertainers, we talked about an hour and a half" Dr. Adams said MJ told him he wanted to build a children's hospital. He talked about his family, kids, everything. "We talked about Steven Spielberg, Bono, the tour. He didn't have good things to say about those people either." (ABC7) Dr. Adams said he was anxious to find out what was going on, but Jackson and Murray conferred in another room. Adams finally told them he had to leave, and they asked him to hold on. Jackson and Murray came back into the room after a few more minutes. (AP) Dr. Adams described how Murray returned and was in the back of the office for 15 minutes talking to MJ. "I go back to the office, MJ and Murray walk back in and Murray really looked like he had just lost his best friend," Dr. Adams said. (ABC7) Murray looked upset by that point. Jackson asked Adams to accompany him on the “This Is It” tour, which took Dr. Adams by surprise. (AP) That's when MJ tells Adams he'd like him to go on tour with him. "And do what? I don't sing, I really can't dance so to do what?" he told MJ. "I'd like for you to help me get rest," Dr. Adams said Michael told him. "Every once in a while I need an IV, and he said I just need you to help me get my rest.". Dr. Adams: I'm thinking the guy's having a heart attack and they're asking me about going on tour. I couldn't even begin to fathom that. Dr. Adams said he had no idea what MJ meant by helping him get his rest. He said he told them he didn't have license to practice in England. (ABC7) The anesthesiologist said he couldn’t understand why he would be needed. Neither Jackson nor Murray ever mentioned propofol. Dr. Adams said Jackson would only tell him he wanted him to help him rest. Adams said Jackson didn’t want an immediate answer. (AP)

Adams, who administered propofol to Jackson during cosmetic dental procedures in Las Vegas four times in 2008, said Jackson and Murray never told him what his duties would be if he took a job with the tour. "I said 'I don't sing and I really can't dance, so to do what?" Adams testified. "He says 'Well, you know, I'm entertaining, I'm jumping around, I'm doing this. Every once in a while I need an IV," Adams testified. "And he says 'I just need you to help me get my rest.' They were pretty vague, but on hindsight I know what they were talking about." Jackson and Murray, however, never mentioned that administering propofol or treating his insomnia would be one of his responsibilities on tour, the anesthesiologist testified. Jackson never asked him to do anything medically inappropriate, Adams said. Adams hinted that there was jealously on Murray's part when Jackson courted him for a tour job. "Murray really looked like he had just lost his best friend" when Jackson was discussing it, Adams said. "Oh, he was truly upset." (CNN)

Dr. David Adams is a Las Vegas anesthesiologist who had put Michael Jackson under four times for dental procedures. There were no complications, and the two had engaged in small talk.Then on a Sunday in late March 2009, as he was getting ready to go to church, Adams received a call from someone he had never heard of, cardiologist Conrad Murray, Jackson’s personal physician.Murray asked that he meet them in his office on East Flamingo Road. Adams arrived first, Murray drove up soon after, with the singer sitting in the back seat.Jackson was dressed in black, with a scarf, “and it was about a thousand degrees outside,” Adams said. He told the singer how ridiculous he looked. They walked into Murray’s office and Jackson started talking about his planned comeback concerts in London. “He says, 'The only reason I’m doing this tour is because I want to prove to my kids that I’m the best entertainer in the world,' ” Adams recalled. Jackson and Murray went to the back of the office for 15 minutes.When they returned, “Murray really looked like he had just lost his best friend,” Adams said.Jackson said he wanted Adams to go on tour with him. The anesthesiologist thought it was an odd request, since he couldn’t sing or dance.Then, he testified, Jackson said, “I would like for you to help me get my rest.” That didn’t make sense to Adams. When Jackson told him that after all the action in his show he sometimes needed an IV, Adams told him that was Murray’s purview. Neither Jackson nor Murray mentioned propofol or that the singer had difficulty sleeping, Adams testified.Jackson said he wanted Adams to come to London with him but that they might take the show to other countries. He asked him how much money it would take for Adams to shut down his practice for a year.“I still wasn’t under the impression I was going to be practicing medicine,” Adams said, adding that he wondered if his job would be to sing Jackson to sleep. “It was sort of mind-boggling that someone would be asking me to go anywhere.”After the 2½- to 3-hour meeting, Adams went home to think about the proposition. He said he had three short conversations with Murray and told him he needed $100,000 a month for three years.
He sent a text to Murray, “What’s going on? I’m on board.”He said he never heard from either of them again. (LAtimes)

The doctor said Murray was truly upset with MJ's request. MJ asked that Dr. Adams didn't give an answer right away, think about it. "I never discussed Propofol with Dr. Murray or Michael Jackson," Dr. Adams testified. Dr. Adams said they didn't know how long the tour was going to last, they thought it might go to other countries after London. "I told them I needed enough money to shut my practice down and make it feasible," Dr. Adams recalled. "I think it was $100,000 a month." Dr. Adams asked for a 3 year contract, because he couldn't do it for just a year and then try to reopen his practice. He said he text Dr. Murray back asking what was going on and there was no response and no further communications at that point.(ABC7) The anesthesiologist agreed to think about it, and traded calls and texts with Murray. He was willing to go on the tour. Dr. Adams wanted $100,000 a month, and a three-year contract to accompany Jackson on the tour. He said he never heard back. (AP)

Adams said that after he offered to take the job for $100,000 a month guaranteed for three years, Murray stopped communicating with him. "I texted basically, you know, 'what's going on, I'm on board," Adams said. "And no response." (CNN)

The day MJ died, he texted Murray, never heard back.(ABC7) On the day Jackson died, Dr. Adams said he texted Murray his condolences. He never heard anything back from the cardiologist. (AP) Adams was in a Las Vegas operating room on June 25, 2009, when he learned Jackson had died. "I texted Murray 'I'm sorry to hear what happened. Take care,'" he said. Murray never responded, he said. (CNN)

Q: Did MJ ever ask you to do anything you thought was medically inappropriate?
A: Never (ABC7)

Dr. Adams said he never saw needle marks on MJ's arms. "Very difficult veins to stick to," he said. "Very muscular arms, very small veins." Sometimes Dr. Adams had to try 2-3 times to get an IV started, he said. (ABC7)

And that concluded his video deposition.

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 75 – August 27 2013 – Summary

No Jackson family members are in court today.

(source : ABC7 unless otherwise indicated)


Dr. Petros Levounis Testimony


AEG direct

Dr. Petros Levounis the head of the Psychiatry Department at Rutgers Medical School in New Jersey is testifying. He is an addiction expert.

Michael Jackson suffered a "quite extensive" drug addiction the last 15 years of his life, according to an addiction expert. Jackson's drugs of choice were opioids, painkillers given to him by doctors repairing scalp injuries suffered in a fire and during cosmetic procedures to make him look younger, Levounis testified. (CNN)

He testified the MJ was addicted to Opioids - in particular Demerol from 1993 to his death in 2009. Dr. Levounis said MJ doctor shopped to keep his supply of medications when his doctors expressed concern with the amount he used. MJ was secretive about the amount of medication he was taking and kept that information from his doctors.

Dr Levounis testified the 5 criteria were

1. he show evidence of tolerance for Demerol so he took more.
2.The Doctor also testfied that MJ would take more than the dosage recommended and there was evidence he was renewing prescriptions often.
3. The Doctor testified that MJ was Doctor shopping - that if he couldn't get the medication he wanted he could go to another doctor. MJ tried to cut down on his drug use but relapses. In 1993 goes to rehab in England - evidence of demerol use in 2003 and in 2009.
4. MJ showed evidence of physical and social consequences - he passed out at a meeting and his brother Randy tried many times to intervene.
5. Finally, MJ couldn't stop despite the fact he knew he was damaging his health..the desire was too powerful.

Levouni said addiction happens when a chemical "hijacks the pleasure-reward pathways" in your brain. "You remain addicted for the rest of your life," Levounis testified. "Michael Jackson's addiction was quite extensive and I have very little doubt that his pleasure-reward pathways had been hijacked and he suffered from addiction," he said.(CNN)

The last point Dr. Levounis made is that MJ and several of his Doctors had very close friendships and that was a problem. The close relationships made it easier for MJ to ask for medications and it is harder for the Doctors to say no. (ABC7) "A very close friendship between an addicted patient and a doctor is problematic," Levounis testified. "It makes it much easier for a patient to ask for drugs and it makes it more difficult for a provider to resist." (CNN)


Jackson cross

Under Cross examination Dr. Levounis went over the time that he reviewed the materials sent to him for his expert testimony.

Dr. Levounis testified that one of the symptoms is secrecy and yet MJ announced to the world that he had an addiction and sought treatment. (ABC7) "If he announced it to the world it's not very private, is it?" Jackson lawyer Michael Koskoff asked Levounis.
"At that moment, he was not secretive," Levounis replied. (CNN)

The final point under cross was that addiction is no longer used as a term to diagnose because not specific and the negative connotation. Now, people are diagnosed with substance use disorder!

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 76 – August 28 2013 – Summary

No Jackson family members are in court today.


Dr. Petros Levounis Testimony


Jackson cross

The first hour had Dr. Levounis going over all the records of Dr. Conrad Murray had his treatment of MJ and his children back from 2009. Dr. Levounis questioned by Jackson Attorney said there is no evidence MJ ever self injected Demerol. No evidence took drugs for a euphoria. After the morning Break, Dr. Levounis was asked about MJ opioid use in 2009. Was there any evidence Dr. Murray was giving MJ demerol? No. Was anyone else? Yes, Dr. Klein. Dr. Levounis also said that a person can be addicted to opiates without having to take them every few hours. Still have withdrawal symptoms. He said the term Addiction is widely used in the field. On recross, Dr. Levounis was asked if MJ is an addict despite no drugs, no symptoms, no sign of use? Dr. say addict with no evidence.. (ABC7)


Dr. Christine Quinn Testimony


AEG direct

She is a Dental Anesthesiologist from UCLA school of Dentistry. She treated MJ about 10 times from 1997 to February 2009. She would administer the anesthesia for MJ's dentist because MJ had anxiety. (ABC7)

Quinn didn't know the exact date of her meeting with Jackson, but said she knew Paris Jackson was an infant at the time. Paris was born in April 1998. Quinn didn't see her _ the baby was in another part of the hotel suite where Jackson was staying. (AP) She said in about 1998 (couldn't remember exact date) she received a call from MJ. She returned the call and spoke to his assistant. She was told Mj did not return phone calls. Dr. Quinn finally did speak to him and set up a meeting at the Beverly Hills Hotel. In her deposition she misidentified the hotel as the Bel Air Hotel. She called it the hotel on sunset today in court and the pink hotel. Under cross examination she realized it was actually the Beverly hills hotel. (ABC7)

Quinn said she brought her sister to the meeting because she didn't feel it was "prudent" to go by herself. Quinn said her sister stayed with Prince Jackson in one part of the hotel suite while she and Jackson went to another room to talk. (AP) She agreed to meet MJ at the hotel and brought her sister because she did not think it prudent to meet someone at a hotel suite. The meeting was brief. She and MJ stepped into another room to talk while Dr. Quinn's sister watched Prince who was about 2 years old. MJ told Dr. Quinn he was having trouble sleeping. Asked if he called Propofol by name, the Doctor needed to refresh her memory. After checking her notes, she said he did call it propofol. She said he asked her to administer propofol outside of a dental setting. She told him that was an inappropriate use of the anesthesia. He should talk to his doctor about the sleep problem. She told him that anesthesia induced sleep is not restful sleep but he told her it was the best sleep he ever had. MJ told Dr. Quinn he had tried other remedies but nothing worked. She said propofol not for insomnia and not outside a medical setting. She said he never asked for propofol again from her. She never spoke about the encounter except in the deposition and in court today. she said it was no one's business. (ABC7) Dr. Catherine Quinn, a dentist who specializes in giving anesthesia during dental procedures, said Jackson asked her to infuse him with propofol in 1998. "He told me that he has trouble sleeping," Dr. Quinn testified."I said that's inappropriate use of anesthesia," Quinn said. "He needs to speak with his physician about sleep aids. I told him that the sleep that you get with anesthesia is not real sleep, it's not restful sleep. He told me that it's the best sleep he ever had." (CNN)

Dr. Christine Quinn said Jackson summoned her to a Beverly Hills hotel in 1998 or 1999 and asked her to give him propofol. The request came after she met the entertainer while he was undergoing dental procedures. She said she refused the request and told Jackson it wasn't appropriate to use anesthesia as a sleep aid."I told him that the sleep you get with anesthesia is not real sleep, not restful sleep," Quinn said.Jackson responded by saying his time under anesthesia was the best sleep he had ever had, she testified. (AP)

Quinn said she gave Jackson anesthesia for procedures done after the meeting at the hotel. He never asked for propofol after the meeting or requested that he be kept under for longer than was medically necessary, she said. (AP) She continued to treat MJ with his dentist. The last appointment was February 2009. She remembered because there were paparazzi outside in the parking lot standing on their cars talking pictures of MJ when he got out of limousine. (ABC7)

She read about MJ's death from the propofol overdose in news accounts.(ABC7)


Jackson cross

On cross examination she told the Jackson attorney that MJ's dentist used and anesthesiologist because of his anxiety. (ABC7)


Cherilyn Lee Testimony


AEG direct


Cherilyn Lee - a Nurse Practitioner and Holistic healthcare practitioner. She treated MJ from February 2009 to April. At the first consultation on Feb 1, 2009 she asked MJ about 200 questions including drug use where he said no, no smoking, and no alcohol. The paperwork had his name as David Mich and his chief complaint was fatigue in the middle of the day. Lee thought it might be red bull. He claimed he had some problems sleeping and for that he took Tylenol PM. Claimed he used Zanax, Atavan, and Ambien 12 years ago not since. Testified that with her natural products MJ would only sleep about 5 hours a night. Continued to complain of fatigue. (ABC7)

My concern was that he was drinking Red Bulls," she said. He drank several cans of the energy drink during their first meeting. "I was thinking his tiredness and fatigue was related to that." Jackson "started to feel really great" and "looked healthier" after a month of her IV treatments of Vitamin C and other nutrients, she testified. But he still couldn't sleep more than five hours a night and with rehearsals for his "This Is It" tour cranking up in April "he needed something a little more," she testified.Jackson rejected her recommendation that he have a sleep specialist visit his home to study his insomnia -- or that he cut down the lights and music in his bedroom, she said. (CNN)

On April 18th, MJ talked to Lee about Diprivan - the commercial name for Propofol. He told Lee he just needed a good night sleep. She consulted a friend, a medical doctor, who told her it was an anesthetic used only in a medical setting. Lee went to her office to get her Physicians Desk reference to show MJ the side effects of propofol use and only in medical setting. MJ kept insisting his Drs had told him it was safe as long as he was monitored and that all he wanted was a good night sleep. She kept insisting to MJ and getting more and more upset in her testimony that it wasn't safe. He had been assured by his doctors its safe. (ABC7) Jurors heard from Cherilyn Lee, a nurse practitioner who said Jackson said he needed propofol to help him sleep in April 2009, a little more than two months before his death. Lee said she warned Jackson that propofol was unsafe for home use and he might not wake up, but the singer insisted that doctors told him he would be fine as long as he was monitored."His demeanor was, 'I have to have this. I have to have this to sleep. You don't understand, I have not had a good night's sleep,'" Lee said.Lee did not give propofol to Jackson. (AP)

Jackson was apparently still looking for a doctor to give him the propofol when Lee visited his home the morning of April 19, 2009. "He wasn't quite himself," she testified. "He just seemed really stressed or something. He said at certain points he was under a lot of pressure to finish rehearsals and he said 'I've got to get my sleep so I can do this.'" Jackson told Lee he wanted her help in getting propofol infusions instead of the vitamin cocktail IVs, she said. Lee didn't know about the drug, so she looked it up in her Physician's Desk Reference manual. "I remember telling him that it wasn't something he wanted to use at home," she said. "It wasn't a safe medication. It was definitely not a medication for insomnia." Lee's handwritten notes from that day described their conversation: "I went as far as to say I understand you want a good night sleep -- want to be 'knocked out' -- but what if you don't wake up," she wrote. "He said 'I'll be ok. I only need someone to monitor me with equipment while I sleep.'" Jackson "kept telling me 'You don't understand, doctors are telling me it's safe just as long as I am being monitored,'" Lee testified.It was then that Lee collapsed on the witness stand. "It's so unfair," she cried. "I am so sick." I can't do this anymore! I can't do this anymore," Cherilyn Lee cried at the end of Wednesday's testimony in trial to decide if concert promoter AEG Live is liable in Jackson's death. As she broke down, she was assisted by others in the courtroom including one of the lawyers. Lee broke into tears after telling jurors that she believed people, including Jackson and her own mother, have died because they listened to bad advice from doctors who overprescribe drugs (CNN)

Lee's testimony for the day ended on an emotional note. She broke down sobbing on the stand. The judge excused the jury for the day. Lee was being asked by AEG Live defense attorney Kathryn Cahan about the April '09 meeting where Jackson asked for propofol. Lee recounted showing Jackson the specific side effects of propofol and asking him what would happen if he didn't wake up. She said Jackson kept telling her that doctors had told him he'd be safe as long as he was monitored. Lee said he wouldn't say which docs. Lee started talking about how all medications have side effects and how doctors tell patients that they'll be safe on certain medications. Lee started to break down, saying it was a difficult subject because her mother had died in 2010 and she'd tried to warn her about all the medications that she'd been prescribed. Lee said she told her mom that she couldn't take all those medication. Her mother died, Lee said "because she believed her doctor." She started bawling, at one point putting her head in her hands. She said testifying was "so stressful for me because of what I have gone through." Cahan suggested they recess and the judge agreed. Lee continued to talk and cry as the jury shuffled out of the room. "I can’t do this anymore. I really can’t do this anymore," she said. "It is so unfair," Lee said. "I'm so tired." At this point, AEG Live defense attorney Sabrina Strong went up to witness box. Strong had been sitting in the audience, and she brought up two of Lee's relatives who had accompanied her to court. At least a couple jurors were still walking out, and plaintiff's lawyer Brian Panish complained about Strong trying to comfort Lee. Panish said it wasn't appropriate for a lawyer to comfort a witness while the jury was in the room. He argued the point for several minutes. Judge Yvette Palazuelos pointedly asked Panish what he wanted her to do. Panish said Strong should be admonished. Palazuelos told Panish that if he wanted an admonishment, his team would have to write a brief to show it was appropriate. By this point Lee had been taken out of the courtroom and was being comforted by her relatives in the hallway. Lee was composed within a few minutes of leaving the courtroom and said she would return and be OK for tomorrow's testimony (AP) "That's not appropriate," Jackson lead lawyer Brian Panish protested. "Lawyers don't do that. It's not appropriate for lawyers to come out of the audience in front of the jury.""Appropriate or not, it happened," Judge Palazuelos said. Panish argued that Strong was trying to "curry favor" with the jury by appearing compassionate. He demanded that the judge admonish her in front of the jury. The judge suggested he put his request in writing for her to consider. (CNN) At this point, a very upset Lee cries that it is the same with her mother who died in 2010 because mother believed doctors about chemo. Testimony ended and Lee was in tears. As the last of the jurors were leaving the courtroom an AEG attorney got up to comfort the witness. The Attorneys for Mrs. Jackson were upset with that telling the judge it was inappropriate in front of Jury. Judge said write a brief.(ABC7)

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 77 – August 29 2013 – Summary

No Jackson family members are in court today.


Cherilyn Lee Testimony


AEG direct

Lee apologized for being so emotional yesterday. (ABC7)

Lee brought the Physicians Desk Reference to MJ home to show him the side effects of Propofol. They include memory loss. She tried to convince MJ by saying what if he forgot his lyrics? MJ kept saying it was all that helped him sleep and he was told safe. MJ wanted to be knocked out quickly and other medications that Lee had took time to work. (ABC7)

On April 18th Nurse Lee stayed with MJ. He took the herbal medication to sleep at about 12:30a. He slept until about 4 or 4:30a. MJ stood up on the bed when he woke up. He just stared at Lee then went to the bathroom. When he came back he said he needed Diprivan. (ABC7) Lee testified after Jackson awoke after just four hours of sleep after one of her treatments on April 19, 2009, he became "very agitated." "He stood up on the bed and he looked at me and at 4:30 in the morning, it kind of scared me," Lee said. "It really startled me when he stared at me with his big brown eyes." "I told you I cannot sleep all night," Lee said Jackson told her. (CNN)

He was agitated about rehearsal and said he needed to sleep. He again assured Lee he had been told it was safe if he is monitored. MJ gave her a hug and escorted her Security who would take her home at that early hour. She never treated him again. (ABC7)

Lee testified she tried to convince him to stay away from the powerful anesthetic, also known as Diprivan, and the day she refused was the last day she worked for the late King of Pop. “I said, ‘I understand what you want… You want to be knocked out to go to sleep but what if you don’t wake up,’” Lee testified she told Jackson. “How did he respond to that?” AEG attorney Kathryn Cahan asked the witness. “He continued to tell me… ‘You don’t understand… I will be safe as long as I’m monitored,” she said. Lee testified Jackson asked her to stay to watch him sleep inside his bedroom in the his Carolwood mansion. She testified he startled her when he suddenly stood up on top of the bed at 4:30 in the morning.“(He) stared at me with those nice big round eyes… he said, ‘I told you I cannot sleep all night. All I need is something to sleep, I just need Diprivan to go to sleep,’” she testified Jackson pleaded. “When I said it is only used by anesthesiologists (he said), ‘Why don’t you bring one, you can bring an anesthesiologist and you can come too… so I could be monitored.’ He wanted me to know that he was going to be safe,” she continued. Lee testified she did not give propofol to Jackson (CBSLA) She testified he was frantic. He said, "This is not going to be a good rehearsal day." That was the last time Jackson invited Lee to his home for an insomnia treatment. (KABC)

On Father's Day 2009 (June 21) she got a call from MJ's security person. She heard MJ in the back ground saying one side of his body is cold. He said the other side of his body is warm. Lee told Security to take him to the hospital. He died 4 days later. (ABC7)


Jackson cross


Under cross examination, Lee said she first met MJ on January 28, 2009 when she went to the house to see the children who had colds. She told the jury how impressed she was the the close relationship she had with the children. She said you could feel the love in the house. MJ decided he would like her to treat him. She said MJ really wanted to be healthy. He followed her holistic plan and felt better. She said from the time she started treating him January 28 to her last visit at the house early April 19 she never saw any medical equipment. She never saw evidence of another Doctor treating MJ. She never saw Dr. Murray. (ABC7)

MJ went to London for a press conference about his tour and when he came back he changed. He wasnt' as jovial. She made a note in her medical records that March 24 was a very stressful day for MJ. She got to the house and there were many cars. MJ said he was stressed because of rehearsal and had to get a full night sleep. He wanted Diprivan (propofol). Said he took it before. He did not tell Lee who gave it to him. He asked her to find someone who would give to him at the house. She said no. She told MJ that any Doctor that would do that would only do it for money. On April 19th he said it would not be a good day - long rehearsal. And he hadn't had a good night's sleep. Lee gathered her things, MJ hugged her and she left. She never saw him again. (ABC7)

Jackson allegedly asked Lee, who had been treating him with vitamins since early February, to find an anesthesiologist who could put him to sleep him with the surgical anesthetic propofol. Lee refused, warning him it was unsafe. She testified that she told Jackson that any doctor who would give him propofol at home didn't care about him and was just doing it for the money. That April 19, 2009, session was Lee's last time with Jackson. (CNN)

After MJ died, she heard so many terrible things about MJ drug use so she came forward. (ABC7)

She was shown a picture of MJ days before he died where he looked very thin. She asked if they were sure it was him? Dr. Lee said if she were treating him she would be beyond concerned. (ABC7) When she was shown a photo of Jackson six days before his death -- two months after she had last treated him -- she appeared shocked at his deterioration.
"Oh, my goodness," Lee said. "That's horrible!"(CNN)

Dr. Lee wears a button that says she is so grateful that she attracts miracles. That is her mantra. MJ wrote it down as greatful. (ABC7)

Lee had glowing words for Jackson "I haven't really met anyone who was so caring and so giving," she said. "After his passing, a young lady walked up to me at an event and she just stared crying," Lee said. "She said, 'I wouldn't be here today if Michael hadn't come to the hospital and paid for my brain surgeries and he didn't want anyone to know. (CNN)

Lee attacked AEG lawyers' contention that Jackson was "doctor shopping" for drugs. "All he was doing was looking for the best doctor to help with his insomnia," Lee said. "It just breaks my heart for people to label someone as doctor shopping when they're only trying to find the best doctor to give them the best care." (CNN)

------------------------------------------------------

Lee finished her testimony shortly after 12 noon. Testimony will continue next Tuesday September 3rd at 9:45a.

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 78 – September 3 2013 – Summary


No Jackson family members are in court today.


Dr. Paul Earley Testimony


AEG direct


In the opening minutes – he talked about scant info on propofol and propofol abuse. In the summer of 2012 he told AEG he would like to do a study. By October he had a budget of $53,000 that AEG funded. CORRECTION – The budget was presented in the summer of 2012 for 6 months work. AEG Funded the project.The final draft was ready to be published in January 2013. Dr. Early testified that AEG had no information of study conclusions. Also in January 2013 Dr. Earley’s status changed from consultant to AEG to an expert witness. Now he could review MJ’s and court records. (ABC7) One of the issues the lawyers argued about this morning was related to Dr. Earley’s testimony about a study he published on propofol. Earley published a study based on more than 20 case studies of people addicted to propofol (they were all medical professionals.) AEG Live paid to have the study completed. Earley said he compiled some of the materials before his involvement in the case. After he began testifying, AEG Live defense attorney Kathryn Cahan asked about the study and how much AEG Live paid for its completion. Earley said in all, AEG paid about $53k for the study to get completed, including money to pay for a writer, statistician. AEG wasn’t shown an advance copy of the article, which was published in March 2013 in a medical journal, Earley said. Earley said he had treated about 25 cases of propofol addiction during his 30-year career _ all were medical professionals. Earley said AEG Live agreed to pay for the study because there wasn’t a lot of literature about propofol addiction. (AP)

Earley said despite AEG payments, he was giving an independent opinion. (AP)

Despite his 2009 blog titled "Michael Jackson: Addiction in the Privileged," Earley testified Tuesday that there "was insufficient evidence that he was addicted to propofol." "He was given propofol initially for appropriate medical procedures, but at some point he began seeking out physicians who would administer propofol to him," (CNN) Earley testified.Earley said he couldn’t offer an opinion on whether Jackson was addicted to propofol, but he saw signs of abuse of the anesthetic. (AP) Dr. said there was not enough evidence that MJ was addicted to propofol but he was seeking out doctors for the medication. And, the propofol was having negative effects on his life and on a medical scale of life expectancy he said MJ condition was grave. He used a slide in court to show the 4 reasons he felt MJ was grave. 1. inappropriate use of propofol. 2. Opioid Addiction 3. Drug synergy between the propofol and other drugs he used. 4. Obstacles for a successful recovery. (ABC7)

He also talked about Propofol used properly in a medical setting. Small changes in the dose can one can go from unconscious to death. That is why there must be a medical setting with and Anesthesiologist monitoring. If breathing stops adjust dose and no harm to patient. (ABC7)

Earley said he did believe that Michael Jackson’s life expectancy was reduced, but he couldn’t estimate by how much. He said Jackson’s prognosis for survival was grave due to his drug use, including propofol and use of opioids, other medications. The doctor said with propofol, small changes in the dose can make a big difference in the impact on the person, so caution was necessary. Earley was shown a slide contrasting how people receive propofol versus how they take an opioid medication. Propofol required 13 items for safe administration, versus a glass of water or a syringe for receiving opioid drugs. Earley reiterated that as long as the doctor knows what you’re taking and you’re monitored, receiving propofol is safe. (AP)

After Lunch, Direct Examination continues. Dr. Earley is asked about his work with propofol addiction with medical professionals. Even an Anesthesiologist can’t always control the dose themselves on themselves? True. They can be found blue on the floor. (ABC7)

After the lunch break, AEG Live defense attorney Kathryn Cahan asked Dr. Earley a few more questions about his AEG-funded study. Cahan asked Earley if he thought AEG funding his study was a conflict of interest. The doctor said no. (AP) The first version of his study was ready to submit the the medical journal in October 2012. The final version was 3 revisions later. The Journal Editors questioned Dr. Earley who AEG Live was after the submission. He responded an entertainment company he was doing work for. He testified no conflict of interest because he was doing research…on medical pros who were addicted to propofol, not MJ or his case. The research and the study were done by January 2013 when he was an AEG consultant. He became an expert witness in Feb 2013. That is when AEG sent Dr. Earley evidence to read in the Jackson case. (ABC7)

Throughout his testimony, Earley was shown a large timeline showing the various times MJ asked for or received propofol in non-med settings. One of the instances noted was the time Jackson received propofol in a German hotel room in 1997. Earley said one could argue that while that wasn’t an appropriate use of the medication, it was administered properly because of the supervision, equipment used. The chart also included four times Jackson sought out propofol for sleep: in 98/99 from Dr. Christine Quinn, in 2002 from Dr. Van Valin and two instances in 2009 from nurse practitioner Cherilyn Lee and Dr. Allan Metzger. Dr. Earley said Dr. William Van Valin II testified that in 2002, Jackson brought him a box of propofol and asked him to give it to him. Earley said this was evidence that Jackson had the drug. Van Valin refused, saying propofol was dangerous, according to the slides. (AP) The next exhibit showed a Propofol Timeline 1998 or 98 – Dr. Quinn asked and refused. Dr. Van Valin in 2002 or 2003 asked and refused. Finally, Nurse Cherylin Lee the morning of 4/10/2009 asked to find an anesthesiologist for MJ and she refused. Earley says he continued to seek. (ABC7)

Earley said there were several risks to Jackson receiving propofol in his home, including his risk to stop breathing due his large tongue. Jackson’s tongue could block his airway, as it did several times when Dr. David Adams gave Jackson propofol during dental procedures. Dr. Earley also said Jackson had a high risk for blood clots because, at least on the day he died, propofol was being given in a leg vein. The doctor said there’s a higher risk of clots or embolism anytime a leg vein is used to administer a drug such as propofol. (AP ) Earley said the size of MJ’s tongue also could play a role. He had a large tongue and with Propofol the tongue could cover wind pipe. Earley saw the autopsy report. There was no sign of a breathing tube on his body or at his house. He also talked about inexperienced administrator of the propofol with the IV in his leg that is greater risk for air bubbles to the lungs. (ABC7)

Dr. Earley likened Jackson receiving propofol in his home to playing “Russian Roulette” each time he did it. (AP) Michael Jackson's drug addiction gave him "a grave prognosis" for a long life, and each dose of an anesthetic his doctor gave him to help him sleep was like playing "Russian roulette," an addiction expert hired by AEG Live testified. (CNN)

Finally Dr. Earley talked about MJ addiction to opioids from 1993 until his death. He did go to rehab in 1993 but there was no real follow up. He spoke about his own battle with addiction 30 years ago and his medical license and the legal system became more important than drug. He outlined 7 factors obstacles MJ faced – duration of addiction – no evidence of him saying no to pain medication- failed attempts - secrecy – hard for celebrities to get into treatment and then have the support after rehab – continued pain and available prescriptions. Finally it was MJ’s access to drugs with his relationships with doctors and his continued medical problems…. (ABC7) Earley was asked about Jackson’s opioid use, and he said Jackson had legitimate pain issues and that had to be considered. However, Earley said he didn’t see evidence that Jackson had appropriate follow-up treatment for his addiction. “Unfortunately because of his pain related problems, he was re-exposed to the drugs over and over again,” Earley said. Earley told the jury he wasn’t “saying that it’s Mr. Jackson’s fault that he became addicted to drugs.” (AP)

The doctor said he is himself a recovering opioid addict, and that it was a challenge to keep the disease in check. For instance, Earley said when he had surgery, he had to explain to the doctor not to give him opioid medications. Giving opioids to an addict, Earley said, turns on a switch in their brains and makes it very difficult for them to refuse the drug.(AP)

Just after the afternoon break Dr. Earley said he is surprised when someone is addicted to both opioids and propofol. The propofol is not easy to get and not easily administered. He said although about 70% of addicts have insomnia propofol is not a cure. (ABC7)


Jackson cross

Cross examination begins. Jackson Attorney Kevin Boyle asks Dr. Early about a blog he wrote on his website several weeks after MJ died. Dr. Earley titles his blog MJ: Addiction in the Priviledged. Dr. Earley claims it was not written about MJ but used to open discussion. He also wrote that because MJ was taking propofol – he wrote that they were mainlining at the Jackson home. Bad connotations. Dr. Earley claimed there were many terms in the addiction field that had bad connotations when it came to drug use. (ABC7) Boyle’s questioning was quite spirited _ he pointedly questioned Earley on AEG funding the propofol study and his writings on Jackson. Earley wrote a blog post in 2009 titled, “Michael Jackson: Addiction in the Privileged.” Boyle showed the post to the jury. Boyle questioned if Earley had already made up his mind about Jackson before AEG called him to be an expert in the case. The doctor said no . Earley said he wrote his blog in the hopes that the Jackson family would see it and use it to underscore the dangers of addiction. (AP)

Boyle also used a modified timeline that AEG used during its examination, adding the date of May 6, 2009, when AEG exec Paul Gongaware wrote that Conrad Murray’s deal was “done at $150k a month.” That was a couple weeks after Jackson asked for propofol from Lee, Metzger. Boyle asked if there was any evidence MJ asked for propofol after May 6. “No evidence,” Earley said. “Sounds like he got it.” (AP)

Boyle then asked Earley to confirm that MJ found his propofol from “the doctor hired by AEG Live.” The question was immediately stricken. Several of Boyle’s questions and comments were stricken by the judge as argumentative throughout his 45-minutes of questioning. For instance, Boyle asked if Earley was glad Mrs. Jackson wasn’t in the audience today. The question was stricken. Earley said that his blog (still just a Google search away...) doesn’t imply that Jackson was an addict. Boyle was incredulous and asked Earley if he was really saying that with a straight face. That comment was stricken. (AP)


Dr. Earley was also questioned about the propofol study he conducted. He said he did not think it was a conflict of interest. Earley was contacted by Mr. Punam at O’Melveny and Meyers because they wanted more information about Propofol addiction. Dr. Earley told him there wasn’t much written about propofol. The law firms need for information and how own curiosity got him to do study. The Law Firm agreed to fund it. He said he did not see the conflict or a disclosure problem because the subjects were in healthcare. Dr. Earley continued to stress though under tough questioning that he was doing research for the law firm, not the MJ case. (ABC7) Boyle also showed the jury Earley’s article that was paid for using AEG Live’s support. The attorney asked several questions about it. He noted that the first page states the authors didn’t have a conflict of interest. Earley re-iterated he didn’t think one exists. Boyle questioned Earley on whether he told his research partner (another doctor) that he was being paid as an expert in a lawsuit. Earley said he told his research partner that he was doing research for AEG Live and may have mentioned it was a case. The doctor said his partner didn’t express any concern about Earley’s role in the case or AEG Live’s payments to get the article done. (It's important to note that Earley's discussion with his research partner would have come before AEG designated the doc as a trial witness.) AEG apparently didn't inform Earley he would be called to testify until March 2013. Article was accepted for publication 2 months before. Boyle asked Earley how many medical journal articles are funded by concert promoters. Earley said he wasn’t aware of any others. (AP) Earley insisted in his testimony that AEG Live's funding did not influence the conclusions of his study or his testimony in the trial. But the Jackson lawyer hammered the doctor about the lack of disclosure to the scientific journal and his collaborator that he was being paid to be an expert witness in the trial. He informed them that he was doing research for the company, but the trial aspect was "irrelevant," Earley said. "It's irrelevant to health care professionals," he said. "It wouldn't affect their understanding of the paper." (CNN)

Around this time, the court recessed for the day.

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 79 – September 4 2013 – Summary


No Jackson family members are in court today.


Dr. Paul Earley Testimony


Jackson cross

Boyle started out by asking Earley about his experience writing articles for medical publications and any conflicts of interest. Earley said he had written two or three peer-reviewed articles. He said some were published in European journals. Boyle then showed Earley the conflict of interest policy for the journal where the AEG-funded article ran. The policy states potential conflicts of interest should be disclosed on the cover sheet when the article is submitted. Earley said he did disclose that AEG Live paid for the research funding as spelled out in the policy. AEG’s payments were listed on the article’s seventh page. Earley said he had no control over where the disclosure was listed, that was the journal’s decision. (AP) Dr. Earley cross continued. The first item was the Propofol Study that he published at the beginning of 2013. Dr. Earley said the published report had a different format so it was not on the front page of the report. Under tough questioning, he insisted that he did not have a conflict of interest as an AEG consultant with having AEG pay for the study. He testified he was not trying to hide the AEG connection saying that was ridiculous. He was asked if the 22 medical pros in the propofol study funded by AEG are still alive? Dr. Earley did not know. Wasn’t part of study (ABC7) The journal article focused on case studies of 22 medical professionals who had propofol addiction. Boyle asked if they were all alive. Dr. Earley said didn’t know and he couldn’t contact the people in the study due to medical privacy laws. (AP)

Jackson lawyer Kevin Boyle also grilled Earley over his nondisclosure that he was working as a paid consultant in AEG Live's defense when he submitted the study for publication in a medical journal. He said the concert promoter did not try to influence his findings, which were published in March in the Journal of Addiction Medicine. (CNN)

Boyle also showed Earley the ethical guidelines of the American Society of Addiction Medicine, which state members should only provide general information about addiction and not offer diagnosis on celebrities or other public figures. Boyle questioned whether Earley’s blog posts on Michael Jackson violated those guidelines. Earley said he didn’t think they did. (AP) As yesterday, he was questioned about the blog he wrote a few weeks after MJ died. He restated he did not characterize MJ as addict. (ABC7) Boyle this morning also showed Earley a second blog post he wrote in Dec. 2011 that had the headline: “Murray Convicted -- Addiction Wins.” Earley said he wrote the post to draw attention to an article written by friend and journalist William C. Moyers (AP) Earley wrote another blog on his website 12/5/2011 titled, Murray Convicted Addiction Wins. Despite title, says not saying MJ addict. At the time on the blog, Earley was an AEG consultant. He said the title had Addiction winning not MJ and Addict. Asked about a line in the blog – another superstar going to oblivion – Earley said purpose of blog is talk about addiction. When he posted blog did he ask AEG permission? No. Consult AEG? No. After more AEG questions Earley exasperated said he was tired of this! (ABC7)

Boyle pressed Earley on his use of the term addiction, again asking whether he’d made up his mind about Jackson’s case by then. Earley said he hadn't made up his mind about Jackson and was merely trying to draw attention to the problem of addiction. Boyle: “You were referring to Michael Jackson.” “I was referring to the addiction problem, so the answer is no,” Earley said. (AP)

By this point, Earley was already doing research for AEG Live, although the company hadn’t agreed to fund his study by then. Boyle asked about Earley’s payments on the case. The doctor estimated he’d been paid $80-90k on the case, not including his testimony. (AP)

Earley had overcome a drug addiction about 30 years ago. He was asked details. He used several drugs including oxycodone and heroin. He was almost homeless and had his medical license suspended. He was in treatment for 9 months and got clean. (ABC7) Earley spoke extensively today about his own addiction to opioids and how he was able to be rehabilitated and keep his medical license. Boyle asked if Earley was relying on his own experiences as the basis for his opinions in the case. The doctor said only to a small extent. Earley was very candid about his addiction, saying he was at one point nearly homeless and had to relinquish his medical license. He was criminally charged with writing prescriptions to himself under false names and went into treatment. His work in the addiction medical field grew out of his recovery and rehabilitation. His issues were in the early 1980s, he said. Earley said his drugs of abuse were oxycodone, heroin, codeine and hydrocodone. Boyle repeatedly commended him on his recovery. The attorney asked Early whether in the depths of his addiction, his prognosis was grave. “Yes it was,” Earley responded. Earley said in response to one question about his recovery that while he survived, many of his colleagues with addiction have not. The doctor said it was a miracle, by the “grace of God” that he survived. Many of his patients have been addicted physicians. (AP)

Boyle asked the doctor whether during his addiction, he had a concert promoter involved in his life, med care. Earley said he didn’t. Boyle asked about the role of a family’s love in the recovery of an addict. Earley said it was important in his early stages of recovery. “Michael had a lot to live for,” Earley said of Jackson and his love for his children, which could have aided in a recovery. Boyle asked whether Jackson having full time access to a doctor like Conrad Murray would be a trigger for his addiction. Earley said Jackson had access to the doctor, but it was the doctor’s responsibility to be a gatekeeper to drugs and medications. (AP)

Asked about the Physician Desk Reference (PDR) Earley checked and propofol was not in the book. Can’t get drug with prescription. PDR’s are for General Practitioners not some specialized fields like Anesthesiologists or some cancer drugs. One last from the morning session, according to Jackson attorney a common name for Propofol is “Milk of Amnesia” even in wikipedia!!! (ABC7)

During morning session PDR did not have propofol in the book. In the courtroom Boyle handed a note. The page with propofol had been torn out in a dramatic moment earlier in the trial. Laughs in the courtroom (ABC7)

In general, there were a lot of delays in testimony today. Lots of sidebars and objections and some charts that had to be quickly redone. One such delay happened when Boyle asked Earley to find the entry for propofol in the 2009 edition of the Physicians’ Desk Reference. The Physicians’ Desk Reference, AKA PDR, has detailed entries on many drugs. It’s the book Cherilyn Lee used to discuss propofol with MJ. Earley couldn’t find the entry in the PDR so Boyle asked partner Brian Panish to locate it. He couldn’t find it either. It turns out another lawyer, Michael Koskoff, had ripped out the pages on propofol while questioning another witness, Dr. Levounis. (AP)

They continued about the drugs that were found at MJ house. The list of drugs found at the house but not in MJ’s body according to Coroner report was Lidocaine and Ephedrine. Used to try to help MJ. From there they moved on to Demerol. Dr. Earley said he was only aware of 3 cases that a person died of an overdose given by a doctor. Attorney Boyle tried to make the case that dying of Demerol administered by a doctor was more rare that trampled by elephant or hit by tsunami. With a graph showing MJ Demerol Injection from Dr. Klein, in the last couple months of MJ life. He went only 4 days until May 5th. (ABC7)

Attorney Boyle made the point that on May 6th AEG Exec Paul Gongaware sent Dr. Murray the email “Done” $150,000. (ABC7)

Boyle’s examination after lunch focused on the times that Jackson requested propofol over sleep _ they said in court it was four times. That wouldn't include anesthesiologist Dr. David Adams, who Jackson approached in 2009 but didn’t discuss propofol by name. Boyle showed a chart listing those requests by Jackson, adding the May 6, 2009 date that AEG exec Paul Gongaware said Murray’s deal was done. Boyle’s point was that Jackson didn’t request propofol from anyone else after Murray was working with MJ on the “This Is It” tour. (AP)

Then Earley was questioned if Propofol can mask the symptoms of Demerol withdrawal. He said it can mask some of those symptoms (ABC7)

On to MJ’s general health. No evidence heart, kidney, diabetes? No. Blood Pressure – Early says Coroner report no pressure! (ABC7)


AEG redirect


On redirect Earley says he didn’t see the Gongaware email until court Tuesday. They put back up the Propofol slide with info added. Added: Jan 2006 MJ starts to see Dr. Murray. 2/4/09 MJ tells Dr. Salvit Murray is his personal physician. 4/6/09 Dr. Murray makes the first order for propofol. 4/28 Murray orders more. 5/12 More. 6/6/09 More. (ABC7)

AEG’s lawyers point to Murray ordering propofol before that date. Boyle later noted Gongaware’s testimony about talking to Murray about working on the tour and his request for $5 million. That happened 3 to 5 weeks before the May email indicating Murray’s deal with done. Cahan showed Earley and the jury a chart that listed Murray’s first treatments of MJ in 2006, and propofol shipments from April-June ’09. (AP)

Earley said in response to a question by Cahan that before Jackson’s death, propofol addiction was virtually unknown by the public. Cahan asked him the doctor about his blog posts. He said he didn’t think they were an issue because he wasn’t making any diagnoses. (AP)

Dr. Earley checked his first Blog in 2009 that was brought up Tuesday. He wrote it 6 weeks after MJ died. He said he learned of the propofol toxic in news reports. He said he had begun seeing propofol cases in medical pros in 2008. He started cataloging cases to look at them at a later date and possibly do a study at a later date. Study funded by AEG. Asked if AEG support for the Study Dr. Earley said no. Started before lawsuit filed. AEG could have influence of if he was time traveler. (ABC7)

A second blog was brought up that Earley posted when Dr. Murray was convicted. The first line written by another addiction doctor. It was attributed him in the second line of the blog. That was read to the jury. (ABC7)

Earley was asked whether MJ should have avoided doctors. He said no _ he needed treatment _ but he needed to disclose all his conditions. (AP)


Jackson recross


On recross Dr. Earley was questioned about the Study. He is asked about a conflict of interest with AEG funding he says didn’t affect result. Findings were very uncommon addiction for medical pros. 1.6% are addicted. Half use other drugs. More women are addicted and there is a rapid decline. Addicts commonly are depressed and have had child trauma. (ABC7)

Earley told the details of his addiction. Used for about 5 years. Wrote prescriptions with other names for self and was arrested. He went to drug court and was sentenced to the program where he is now. His license was suspended but he got it back. Program is why he is alive. (ABC7)

On Re Cross Dr. Fivner was brought up. After a 5 minute sidebar in chamber Earley testified that Fivner had a suspended license at the time. (ABC7) Boyle took back over and asked some questions about Earley’s co-author on his AEG-funded propofol study. It turns out Earley’s co-author had his medical license suspended due to some addiction-related legal problems. He wasn’t working in medicine at the time the study was written. Earley said his co-author has since had his license reinstated and is working in New York (AP)

Boyle also asked Earley about whether he had any control over how AEG used his study in the case. The doctor said no. Earley said he also didn’t have control over how the plaintiff’s used his research, or any other research that’s been published. Boyle likened AEG’s payments to Earley’s research as similar to private money turning into a nuclear weapon. “This is a small study. I’m not building the atom bomb,” Earley responded. (AP)

At the end of his questioning Boyle asked Earley about his opinion that you can’t blame an addict for their addiction. “In medicine, we don’t talk about blame,” Earley said. This opinion was played earlier in the case for the jury . (AP)


AEG redirect


On direct testimony he said Finver was between jobs. Finver in the program for drug addiction and his medical license suspended. He was in between a pizza job and driving a truck for Good Will. He did not need license to work on the Study. AEG and Journal not told. Got his license back earlier this year. (ABC7)

The co-author of a study on propofol addiction funded by AEG Live and used in their defense in the Michael Jackson wrongful death trial lost his medical license for writing illegal drug prescriptions, according to testimony. Dr. Torin Finver was hired to help with the AEG Live study after he lost his job at a pizza parlor and took a job driving a Goodwill truck, said Dr. Paul Earley, who testified Wednesday as an expert witness for the concert promoter. Finver was "destitute, dead broke, and I wanted to help him," Earley, himself a recovering heroin addict, testified. Earley testified that he never disclosed to AEG Live lawyers that his co-author had lost his medical license. (CNN)

In his blog he characterized MJ prognosis as grave. Earley says he treats many grave patients. That is why he is good. Never gives up. (ABC7)


Jackson recross

Last question on recross was did Dr. Earley see Dr. Murray had ordered 4 gallons of propofol. Dr. Earley answered I did. (ABC7) Boyle ended by asking Earley if he was aware that Murray ordered more than four gallons of propofol for Jackson. The doctor said he was. (AP)

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 80 – September 6 2013 – Summary

No Jackson family members are in court today.

(source : ABC7 unless otherwise indicated)


Dr. William B Van Valin Video Deposition

Dr. William B Van Valin’s video deposition is played for the Jury. He treated MJ in the early 2000′s when MJ lived at Neverland. In 2001, MJ came to the office and wanted a Doctor to make house calls. Dr. Van Valin did. MJ invited the Dr. to Neverland that night. He went with his son, Mason. He describes the interior of Neverland. A friendship started. He remembered one time he got up for work and opened the door to leave and there was MJ on the door step. MJ said he just got there but Dr. Van Valin asked MJ’s driver who said they had been there for 35 minutes. Dr. Van Valin invited him in, got his wife up to entertain MJ and off her would go to work. MJ would play monopoly, eat pizza, play. By the time Dr. Van Valin got home, the house would be a disaster… (ABC7) Jackson "would just show up" at Van Valin's home every week or so without warning, he said. The doctor would open his door to leave for work in the morning "and he would just be standing there." His driver told him once that Jackson had been waiting at his door for 35 minutes, not wanting to knock because he thought that was impolite.Van Valin's children would stay home from school some days Jackson visited. "I'd come home from work and there's Michael there at the house and they're watching cartoons or, you know, eating pizza," Van Valin said. At first it was a novelty, but after several years it was routine, he said. (CNN)

Dr. Van Valin said he believed MJ was an insomniac. MJ would lay down, Dr. would read him a book and when he thought MJ asleep slip out. Sometimes MJ was not asleep and would say “goodnight Barney” (nickname). Dr. gave MJ 6 zanax tablets. MJ took all 6 and didn’t have reaction. (ABC7) Before Michael Jackson asked a doctor to treat his insomnia with propofol, he tried falling asleep to the physician reading him bedtime stories.(CNN)

MJ did discuss Diprivan (propofol) with Dr. Van Valin. He said he used it between shows on his world tour. Dr. on the tour give to him. That Dr. would give to MJ and monitor him not like the guy who gave it to him and left the room! Putting him to sleep like a dog. MJ said he hadn’t slept for 4 days. Dr. told MJ he didn’t do IV. Dr. talked to anesthesiologist who said only used in a hospital. Dr. said he never heard of propofol. Dr. Van Valin went back and told MJ it was dangerous. MJ had a box of Diprivan in his bedroom. The medication was from Florida but Dr. Van Valin did not know the doctor who gave it to MJ or sent it to him. Dr. describes the box. MJ never asked Dr. Van Valin for Diprivan again. (ABC7) Dr. Barney Van Valin, whose video testimony was shown to jurors Friday, refused Jackson's request for propofol infusions in 2003, but six years later -- in Dr. Van Valin's words -- another physician "put him to sleep like a dog." (CNN)

Another incident that disturbed Van Valin was when Jackson showed him a box of the anesthetic propofol, which he said he used to sleep while on tour. (KABC) AEG Live called on Van Valin to testify that he refused Jackson’s request for propofol during one of their appointments. He said Jackson didn’t seem angry about it. “For a guy used to getting his way, he was pretty complacent about it,” van Valin said. (CBSLA)

"Sometimes, he'd say, 'Barney, do me a favor, see if I can sleep, I'm going to get under the covers on that rollout couch,' and he said, 'Just read me out of a book,'" Van Valin testified. "I'd find a book that looked interesting and I'd just start reading or I'd tell him stories. That didn't work because often times he got excited about the story and say, 'That really happened?' or something. Anyway, I'd read to him -- and when it seemed like he was asleep I'd slip out, you know, kind of hard because the door made a little noise. If I thought he was asleep I'd leave, and once in awhile he'd say, 'Good night, Barney,' and when I got to the door, he wasn't asleep at all." Dr. Van Valin also tried to help Jackson sleep with sedatives, including Xanax, without success, he said. Jackson, however, revealed to him in 2003 that he had a stash of propofol in a closet of his Neverland Ranch bedroom, Van Valin said. "He said, 'Would you put me to sleep, I haven't been able to sleep for four days,' and I said, 'With what?' And he goes, 'Well, I have this stuff,' and I said, 'Mike, I don't do I.V. sedation. You need an anesthesiologist to do that.' And he said, 'Oh, it's safe, man, I used it for all those years between shows and I got put to sleep.' I said, 'I can't imagine that was good sleep." You know, he said, "No, it works really well."
He said Jackson told him that during his world tours him a doctor "would put in the I.V. and put me to sleep, and he'd stay there for eight hours and wake me up 'cause I would go -- if I had three days between shows, I would have three days I didn't sleep and, you know, that I couldn't put on the show I wanted to have, you know, I mean, I want my shows to be, you know, as high end as possible."
"Sounds like a doctor who did his job, not like this other guy, who just started the drip and left the room and basically put him to sleep like a dog," Van Valin said. Jackson was "pretty complacent" when he rejected his request for help with propofol and he never asked for it again, Van Valin said. (CNN)

Dr did continue to treat his back pain. He remembers going to MJ house and gave Demerol that time he noticed a drop of blood on MJ’s shirt and a band aid. He asked MJ if another Dr. was giving him pain meds. MJ said no but Dr. Van Valin knew he was lying. He told MJ that more Demerol could kill him. He told MJ he couldn’t but did anyway. Dr. talked to MJ about developing a tolerance and concern for addiction in 2003. He backed off giving MJ demerol for pain. Dr. continued his concern for MJ demerol use. Several time he would give MJ dose, and MJ would wooooo, sing and dance. Then same dose fine. He was sure MJ had gotten a shot from another Doctor just did not know who. When asked MJ’s house man he said no. Dr. Van Valin used the name Phil Sanders for MJ on his chart. There was a note that he wrote a script in houseman’s name for MJ

Van Valin said he warned the King of Pop that taking too much of the painkiller Demerol would be risking death. The physician said he first began treating the pop star in 2001, often visiting the singer at his Neverland Ranch in Santa Barbara County and at the doctor’s home. Van Valin said he prescribed Demerol because Jackson complained of pain. But he became suspicious that Jackson was seeing another doctor for Demerol when he noticed the singer showed signs of receiving an injection before visiting Van Valin. “Michael, if you’re doubling up…that could kill you,” Van Valin said he told Jackson. (CBSLA)

Jackson's use of painkillers was medically justified by chronic pain suffered in a 1997 stage accident, Jackson lawyers said. The doctor said Jackson showed the "classic symptoms of lower back pain" and an MRI study confirmed a bulge in a disc in his lower spine consistent with where his pain was.
Dr. Van Valin said he never suspected Jackson was faking his pain to get painkiller shots.
"I looked for that because there are plenty of people that come in and try to scam me, so I'm always looking for that," he testified. (CNN)

It was the collapse of a stage bridge in 1999 that injured Jackson's back, according to Dr. William Van Valin, who treated him for pain two years later. In a video shown in court, Jackson kept singing as if nothing had happened, but that's not what Jackson told Van Valin. In a video deposition, Van Valin testified that Jackson's injury was real. For a year, he made house calls to Neverland Ranch to give the singer injections of the painkiller Demerol in growing amounts. But doubts began to build. Van Valin suspected Jackson was getting Demerol from someone else at the same time. Jackson appeared high. "It was a bit scary. I sat there with him until it went away," said Van Valin. One day, the doctor saw a band aid on Jackson, covering a needle mark. "I said, 'Michael, you have another doctor that gave you a shot. You realize what risk you put yourself and me at by doing that? Who came and gave you a shot?'" said Van Valin. According to Van Valin, Jackson's response was that he didn't get a shot from another doctor. "But it was. He was lying," said Van Valin. (KABC)

While the doctor said "nothing implied" that Jackson was abusing painkillers, there was one incident during house call in 2002 that caused him to suspect Jackson might be getting additional shots of the powerful opioid Demerol from another doctor. He noticed "a little blood spot" on Jackson's T-shirt after he gave him a shot, he said. "I lifted it up and there's a little Band-Aid over it and I said, 'Michael,' I said, 'you have another doctor that gave you a shot.' I said, 'You realize what risk you put yourself and me at by doing that? Who came and gave you a shot?' 'Oh, no, I didn't -- it was not a shot.'" Van Valin said. "But it was. He was lying." "I told him, I said, 'You know what, I can't do this, okay, 'cause if you're doubling up, you know, I give you a shot and then you've already had one,' I said, 'I could kill you,'" Van Valin testified. Van Valin remained close friends with Jackson even though he stopped treating him soon after that incident, he said.(CNN)

Dr. Shannon was another Doctor at Van Valin’s practice. There were notes in MJ’s file from him. Shannon notes MJ dental work and pain. Shannon injects MJ with demerol for the pain but notes that MJ brought his own medication to the office. Scripted by Van Valin. Odd

Dr. Van Valin has another talk with MJ about concern for demerol use on 10/10/01. MJ said he knew the risks. MJ never told Dr. Van Valin about his prescription drug dependence and going into treatment in 1993. Dr. Van Valin didn’t think MJ had a problem because he would get Demerol every few days or even weeks. Most addicts it is every few hours. Eventually he stopped treating MJ. They would just hang out together. No conversation he just stopped asking for treatment.

Note 2/28/2002 MJ told he needed a break from his Demerol because his use was excellerating. He needed more and I couldn't give to him. 10/25/02 MJ called with an infection on his abdomen. He had a device placed under his skin about one week ago to decrease demerol use. Dr. in Florida had inserted a narcan plug that would deaden the affect of a narcotic. It had gotten infected. Dr. Van Valin cleaned out. He described Narcan as a med used in ER's when a patient comes in comatose and the doctors do not know what was used. Wakes right up. Dr. Van Valin knew MJ must have been getting demerol elsewhere because he hadn't given it to him in a while. MJ didn't come back

Asked if MJ was a good father. Dr. said he was a great father. Patience was gentle with kids. Talked about how shy Paris was as a child. She would get in MJ's lap at dinner and MJ let her eat dinner there. Very attached to her Dad. Went to MJ house for dinner with his wife. She spotted the stroller and knew there was a new baby in the house. They went up to nursery and MJ introed the to Blanket. Said that is what they call him now but he wants all his kids to be named MJ. (ABC7) "No, he is an amazing father," he answered. "Because I'm a good father and he was better than me. He respected them and as they respected him and he would correct them gently." (CNN)

Dr. Van Vilan said he thought he an MJ were best friends. He said he never had a better friend and he didn't think MJ did either. He said he really didn't know the Pop Star - he knew MJ the man, the father. He still misses him. (ABC7) "In my opinion, and I think in Michael's too, we were best friends. I didn't have a better friend, and I don't think he did," Van Valin said.(KABC) "We were best friends, you know," Dr. Van Valin testified. "I didn't have a better friend and I don't think he did." (CNN)

He said he treated MJ as he treated all his patients. He also said he did not believe MJ was his friend so he could get demerol. He said it was possible he gave MJ demerol and did not write in chart. From 10/2001 1/2002 he gave MJ Demerol on 6 days - 2 shots one day. He said possible he gave MJ demerol and did not get into chart. 10/00 to 1/01 He gave him a shot 6 days and one day twice. In 2001 6 times according to the chart. 2002 twice. Then, he never gave MJ another demerol shot. Dr. Van Valin never treated MJ again after 10/02. He realized MJ was getting medication elsewhere and he told MJ he couldn't give Demerol

MJ said no sleep was his biggest complaint. MJ told Dr. on tour he had a Dr. who gave him propofol between shows. Wake feeling refreshed.


Dr. Neil Ratner Video Deposition


Next video deposition played is Dr. Neil Ratner and anesthesiologist from New York. He no longer practices medicine...stopped in 2002. Treated MJ from about 1990 to early 2000. MJ told him to call Dr. Hoeffler Bev Hills Plastic Surgeon. He had good experience and wanted same. Ratner said he treated MJ for surgeries.

Asked if he treated for Pain? Don't recall. Sleep? Don't recall. Treat outside US? Don't recall. Said he travelled outside US twice with MJ. Treat him? don't recall. Treat at house? don't recall. Asked if he went on tour with MJ. No. Where did he go with MJ? Germany, South Africa, and Korea. Were you on the tour? No Asked if he knew MJ was on tour? Yes. Did he bring Medical equip? Don't recall. Treat MJ? didn't recall. The only time he was concerned for MJ's health was the fall in Germany. Asked if there were any other Doctors there - at ER. He said he asked for payment to travel with MJ because he had to leave his practice. Asked if he ever treated MJ for pain that was not surgery related? Didn't recall. Or Drug addiction? Not that he specifically recalls. Travelled with MJ once not on tour. They went to South Africa to give a check for charity raised at a concert to Nelson Mandela


Dr. Allan Metzger Video Deposition


Last video is Dr. Allan Metzger who was MJ's primary Doctor from about 1984 to April of 2009. MJ was referred to him by Dr. Klein. Metzger was Rheumotogist and Internist. Klein concerned MJ might have discoid Lupus but with tests he did not. He thought he was MJ's primary but MJ doctor shopped. He would go to other places in the world and have doctors there and not share info.

He also had personal relationship with MJ but Dr. Klein was closer. Called "Arnie" a mother hen with MJ. He said Klein sidewalk consult. Sidewalk consult is when the patient calls doctor who will call another doctor instead of patient told to call right doctor himself!

Primarily Metzger treated MJ for back issues over the years and sleep problems. Saw insomnia first hand when joined MJ on tour. Traveled with MJ to Australia as a pseudo-physician and companion. Were you compensated? I was not.

When he did the curbside consultation, that information never got into MJ chart. Happened a few times a year.

He was a social friend of MJ. Went to Neverland 6 to 8 times. Was invited to MJ wedding to Debbie Rowe and went.

Last time he saw MJ was April 18, 2009 where he prescribed a sleep medication. they talked about cafeine usage, no news shows before sleep

Jury will hear the remainder of the Deposition when they are back in court on Wednesday.

 

[ivy]

Deposition Transcripts


Jeffrey Adams Deposition Transcript

http://www.scribd.com/doc/167778085/Jeffrey-Adams-Deposition-Transcript


Dr. David Adams Deposition Transcript

http://www.scribd.com/doc/167778726/Dr-David-Adams-Deposition-Transcript


Dr. Gordon Sasaki Deposition Transcript

http://www.scribd.com/doc/167779144/Dr-Gordon-Sasaki-Deposition-Transcript


Dr Stephen Gordon Deposition Transcript

http://www.scribd.com/doc/167779410/Dr-Stephen-Gordon-Deposition-Transcript


Dr David Slavit Deposition Transcript

http://www.scribd.com/doc/167779761/Dr-David-Slavit-Deposition-Transcript


Dr Neil Ratner Deposition Transcript

http://www.scribd.com/doc/167780058/Dr-Neil-Ratner-Deposition-Transcript


Dr. William Van Valin Deposition Transcript

http://www.scribd.com/doc/167780304/Dr-William-Van-Valin-Deposition-Transcript


Randy Jackson Deposition Transcript

http://www.scribd.com/doc/167780511/Randy-Jackson-Deposition-Transcript

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 81 – September 18 2013 – Summary

Judge Yvette Palazuelos ruled that closing arguments and possibly verdict will take place in a much larger courtroom. The trial will move to the same courtroom where jury selection was done in order to accommodate whoever wants to see the proceedings live. The ruling came with objection of AEG’s attorneys who wanted to keep everything in the small courtroom the trial took place over last 5 months. During deliberation, the jurors will be partially sequestered. They will have special arrangements for arrival and departure. Jurors will have a room to eat lunch that doesn’t require them to mingle with anyone else. Judge said minimum of 3, up to 4 hours for closing for each side. Closing arguments to begin Monday at 10 am with plaintiffs. Closing for defense Tuesday at 10 am. Rebuttal on Wednesday — not sure how long Panish will take. Best envision to finish pre-instruction Friday by noon, closing Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday, concluding instruction after rebuttal. Judge: After it’s done, staff and security will need 1 hour and 1/2 with the jurors prior to the commencement of deliberations. According to this plan, jury could get the case late Wednesday or Thursday of next week.Court staff gave jurors October calendar, they are to check it and bring back tomorrow.


Allan Metzger Video Deposition

Transcript of Metzger Video Deposition: http://www.scribd.com/doc/170494973/Dr-Allan-Metzger-Deposition-Transcript

Video deposition of Dr. Allan Metzger resumed. He said he doesn’t recall if he treated MJ for insomnia in the 80s, needed to look at records .

He doesn’t think Doctors Klein or Hoefflin were present in the HIStory tour. Putnam asked about Dr. Neil Ratner. Dr. Metzger: Ratner was an anesthetist from NY. I don’t remember how he got involved with Michael. Michael would seek out avenues of sleep helpers, Dr. Metzger said. “That’s was another aspect of the secrecy.’ Metzger: I never knew what he was doing at times that he wasn’t in LA, and probably he did things in LA I don’t know or Klein doesn’t know

Michael had several aliases for confidentiality, one was Omar Arnold, Joe Michaels, there might be others I forgot about, Dr. Metzger said.

Dr. Metzger first met MJ in 1993, treated him for lupus, medical issues, back issues or leg issues. He said he doesn’t remember anything particular unusual or remarkable, except helping him sleep.

There were many surgeries related to the injury with fire, Dr. Metzger said.

Karen Faye was the most constant person who was around MJ all the time, Dr. Metzger said. “To me she was the most constant companion.”

MJ was mostly vegetarian, except for fish, the doctor testified. “He was adamant about proper nutrition.”

I was aware he was given Demerol for procedures in the office, Dr. Metzger said. He said he became concerned because of the pain threshold, knew something needed to be done. Metzger: I heard concerns from Karen, Debbie, Hoefflin, Klein, Michael was doctor shopping and took pain medication a normal person didn’t. Dr. Metzger: I think I told MJ this pain threshold was not average. I do recall prescribing something in Faye’s name, I don’t remember what. Dr. Metzger: There was so much anonymity in MJ’s world. This was not around the time of MJ’s passing.

Medical record from 8/18/93- Dr. Metzger saw MJ at Century City house for temperature over 100 degrees. He had viral influenza complaint and severe scalp pain and headache. “I remember he was very sick,” Dr. Metzger said. Elavil was used for sleep, raise the pain threshold, the doctor said.

Aug 21, 22 and 23 of 1993: no communication from MJ or doctors, Dr. Metzger wrote on chart. 8/24/93: Dr. Metzger said the message was that he was in pain. “I don’t know if medication was given to him.” 8/25/93: MJ called, sleeping problems, depression, beginning of tour. “He wasn’t able to sleep” Metzger said. 8/26 to 8/29/93- no contact. Dr. Metzger said there are several medications that are analgesics but not narcotics. 7/17/95 – seen in the office as emergency for severe chest and upper back pain, anxiety, shortness of breath. Somewhat tearful at times related to severe pain, the doctor wrote on the chart. There were many times he came in as emergency or at the end of the day, Dr. Metzger said.

Dr. Metzger: His neuro receptors, his brain, would detect a grade 7, 8, 10 when average individual would have 3, 4, 5. Clearly it’s a neurochemical issue, but I don’t know exactly, he said.

Dr. Metzger said MJ had a documented arrhythmia after he collapsed during the HBO special in NY. I don’t think it was a pain thing, I think it was exhaustion and dehydration thing.

8/25/96: patient seen/examined for world tour. The doctor said MJ needed a physical for the people in charge of the tour. Sometimes they would want a note, or form, or check list. Medications MJ was taking at the time: Low dose of Xanax – depression and helps sleep, Ambien – sleep only , Dalmain – very mild sleeping med.

Dr. Metzger said MJ asked him to come on tour to be in his wedding.

After MJ collapsed during the HBO special, Dr. Metzger went to NYC for 3 or 4 days to be with Michael. He was dehydrated, he had a gastroenteritis (stomach inflammation with diarrhea), Dr. Metzger testified. Dr. Metzger said MJ lost 7 or 8 pounds after each performance, he weighed him to prove MJ needed to drink more fluids.

7/13/1997: letter from Dr. Christian Stole from Munich with lab data of Omar Arnold from 7/5/97 saying Dr. Metzger talked to professor Peter. I recall the stationary and the letter, but I don’t remember professor Peter, Dr. Metzger said. He claimed he never discussed with the German doctors treatment for MJ.

I believe I never gave him Demerol, Dr. Metzger said. Putnam: Did you prescribed it to him? Dr. Metzger: That’s the same thing, no Dr. Metzger: Demerol is addicting if used in high doses for a period of time, usually used after surgery. People who are in constant pain require Demerol or its cousins, the doc explained. I believe on one occasion I prescribed Vicodin, don’t remember Percocet, no Demerol, the doc recalled. He said he prescribes Demerol in hospital setting. He had 2-3 chronic pain patients on oral Demerol. “It’s good for post-operative pain.” Dr. Metzger said Demerol produces sedation, lethargy, could suppress their breathing, could get a rash and dependency.

I recall Hoefflin trying to get more involved in his care, Dr. Metzger testified. Dr. Metzger: Debbie was in constant assistance when MJ was under the care of Dr. Klein. That was the beginning of their relationship.

Dr. Metzger said he didn’t have any conversation with Mrs. Jackson about MJ’s drug use. But he said he recalled discussion with Janet once. Janet was concerned MJ’s back was going out too much and be was taking pain meds.

Dr. Metzger never discussed addition with MJ. He said he expressed he wished MJ didn’t use pain medication when he saw Drs. Arnie or Steve. Dr. Metzger: I think I heard from Arnie he was also trying to reduce the pain meds, but he just accommodated the situation, I guess.

Dr. Metzger never participated in any intervention to help MJ quit drugs. “He liked painkillers when he was in pain,” he said. I saw that with back issues, knee issues, headaches, he said. “It worked, he was a big baby, he didn’t want any pain.” Dr. Metzger is not aware of MJ seeing pain specialist, never recommended one.

The doctor was never aware of MJ’s use of Propofol. “I was never aware of anyone using that medication other than Murray.”

Sept 18, 2002: insurer sent somebody to Dr. Metzger’s office to see him draw MJ’s blood for lab test. MJ was taking no meds except MS Contin for severe back pain. It’s a narcotic, cousin of Demerol, the doc explained.

Dr. Metzger: Over the years, MJ had numerous plastic surgeries, some a, some b, some nasal. Dr. Metzger: I didn’t know in advance about the great majority of his nasal surgery.

June 2003: MJ to have anesthesia for collagen injection, pre-op examination by Metzger. Dr Metzger: That was the first time to my knowledge that he was given anesthesia for collagen. They must’ve planned major amount of collagen. Dr. Metzger does not recall any other patients needing clearance for collagen injection. Putnam asked if that happens frequently: “Virtually never,” Dr. Metzger responded.

Dr. Metzger said he would often ask MJ who was prescribing him drugs. He was secretive about medicine, secretive about procedures, secretive about all that stuff. Dr. Metzger: I was worried someone would give something that would mix with something else. Dr. Metzger: He took great joy in making it a surprise to everyone. I don’t think he thought it was serious. The doctor said MJ’s knowledge about medications was not really sophisticate. He knew what he wanted done, though.

June 12, 2008: Dr. Metzger said he did not see MJ for 5 years. MJ called. The doc said he sounded alert and when not under stress he takes Tylenol pm for sleep. I was shocked to hear from Michael, that he was in Vegas, Dr. Metzger said. I don’t recall him calling for a prescription, I was really happy to hear from him, the doc said. Dr. Metzger: I personally missed him, liked seeing Michael and dealing with him. Dr. Metzger: He was great, a little more boisterous than his normal self, sounded great. Normally he could sleep with Tylenol pm, Dr. Metzger explained. “Under stress, God only knows what he needed to sleep.”

Next time they spoke was Feb 26, 2009. That’s when MJ told him about upcoming major events in Europe and London. I think it was more of an anxiety call, how he was going to deal with all the 30-50 shows, the doc said. Dr. Metzger: I think he was fearful because this is it, he needed to do something he had never done before. Dr. Metzger: He had a lot of pressure from himself, media and people who he was working for. He wanted to redeem MJ, the doctor explained. “To redeem his image, he felt this was it, and he wanted to go out with a flash.” Dr. Metzger: I think he was still terribly hurt about the criminal trial and accusations. Dr. Metzger: He was one of the most recognized names in the world and I think he wanted to stay that way . T he doctor said MJ was excited and scared about “This Is It.” It was a positive call, an informational call, he remembered. The doctor said they talked about some different maneuvers. “I suggested hypnosis, he tried acupuncture years ago and it didn’t work.” Dr. Metzger said it was nutritious and hydration concern.” I was really reminding him about the ordeal he was about to face.” Putnam: When you saw the announcement, what did you think? Dr. Metzger: He looked great! Dr. Metzger: He seemed in good shape, it seemed very exciting to him. Metzger said MJ would be in London, maybe he should look for a sleep physiologist there to help him. He said MJ didn’t think he needed one.

MJ never mentioned Dr. Murray to Dr. Metzger, never met him until the criminal trial. Dr. Metzger: I do remember saying ‘we’re going to help you find someone to help you sleep during these performances.’ The doctor said MJ had some chronic back pain off and on. There was no discussion about Demerol.

April 18, 2009- Dr. Metzger visited MJ at Carolwood home. “Michael called me, and said he wanted me to come visit him. I was ecstatic!” I missed him, wanted to see the kids and how they were growing up, was very close to the children when young, the doc testified. Dr. Metzger said he recalled they let MJ sleep late, began rehearsal at 11/11:30am. But worked late and MJ had trouble sleeping afterwards . He was excited and stressed, it was a huge task, Dr. Metzger said. He was excited to do a great job, excited to come back into the public arena in good light. The doc said MJ joked about getting older, 49. Dr. Metzger: He looked great, he looked trim. You can’t say skinny because he was muscular. He was ready to go. The doctor said he expected MJ to have a profound sleep issue during the tour. We talked about someone in London, he never mentioned he already had someone on board, he explained. Dr. Metzger said he talked to some doctors at Cedars, asked if anyone had recommendation of sleep physician in London. He wanted some intravenous medicine that would put him to sleep, Dr. Metzger testified. “I can’t sleep without something special. The doctor alerted him about potential life threatening: he could overdose, allergic reaction in a hotel, could be given wrong medication. It just isn’t the right thing to do Dr Metzger told MJ. He said it was a 5-10 minute talk, and he had no concept whether he was successful This was the last time Dr. Metzger saw MJ. He had great fears about responsibility of tour: dehydration, back injury and sleeping. Dr. Metzger: I had used the expression “juice” because MJ would use that, it was a nickname he used for sleeping meds. Dr. Metzger: It was definitely a word he made up years ago. He used the word not often but when things got difficult.

The doc told MJ he was going to find people to help then drove off putting the top of his convertible down. He said the kids loved his car

Putnam read names of several physicians and asked Dr. Metzger if he knew them. “I told you he was a doctor shopper,” Dr. Metzger said. The doctor said he purges records after people don’t go back for 3, 4 years. He said he never altered MJ’s medical records. Dr. Metzger said Dr. Hoefflin wrote a plan, 20, 30, 40 pages long, to help MJ with his nutrition and medication. “I think I threw it away.”

Dr Metzger said he had a very close relationship with Michael and the children. “Whenever I was with them, I have seen a lot of interaction” Q: Did he love his children? A: Immeasurably Q: His children loved him? A: Same thing. He loved his mother greatly, Dr. Metzger said. “I’ve seen him generous to strangers, to hospitals, institutions, people on the street…” MJ has been generous to me, cordial to my family, a real compassionate human being, the doctor said. Q: Was he generous to his children? A: Definitely Q: Generous to his mother? A: I think so

Dr. Metzger: MJ was shy, but yet not really shy, I think the shy was an act. Fun to be around most of the time. Dr. Metzger: I know his love and care for humanity. I just viewed him as a very wonderful, special person. Dr. Metzger: I never saw him be demeaning to anybody, always trying to be generous and kind.

Dr. Metzger said he was surprised Dr. Forecast going along on tour with MJ then Dr Ratner on HIStory tour and yet another doctor on TII tour

That concluded video testimony of Dr. Metzger. After the break, Marvin Putnam told the jurors AEG has rested their case.


Jackson Rebuttal Case


LAPD Detective Scott Smith

Jackson direct

Brian Panish did direct examination.

Det. Smith is employed by LAPD. Currently assigned to Robbery Homicide Unit. He has been there for approximately 3 years. He knows Det. Orlando Martinez, within the same department. He has worked on more than 200 homicide investigations. He was working the day MJ died. He was notified to go to UCLA MedicalCenter along with Det. Martinez. Det Smith brought a large binder with him. He said at UCLA he met with Jackson’s security team, police officers then went to Carolwood house.

Panish: At this point, was it a death investigation or homicide? Det. Smith: It was a death investigation.

Det. Smith said about two months later the coroner determined the death was a homicide. He said he served subpoenas to find out motive. He got together with the District Attorneys office to investigate further. Det. Smith: In Dr. Murray’s car we found a contract between him and AEG that also had name of Michael Jackson. Det. Smith interviewed Kathy Jorrie. He said she had contact with Murray in regards to the contract, may had been responsible for drafting it. Det. Smith had a search warrant from the Coroner’s office to enter Dr. Murray’s car. “It was going to motive,” he said. He said he was looking into Dr. Murray, who was more than a person of interest, he was a suspect in this case. Det. Smith: Information that was obtained revealed that Dr. Murray financially was in ruins. The detective said Dr. Murray’s house was about to be foreclosed, he was in rear of child support for multiple children by multiple women.

The detective interviewed Jorrie on Feb. 22, 2001, took notes. Putnam was present. “I believe he was there to see what we had to say.” Panish showed picture of Kathy Jorrie. Det. Smith recognized her and Putnam for the record. Det. Smith said Jorrie answered most of the questions. Putnam was standing at the back of the room. Panish reads transcript from Jorrie’s testimony where she was asked if she told LAPD that MJ was going on a 2 to 3 year world tour. Panish: Ms. Jorrie denied making the statement, correct? She did state that there was going to be a world tour that would last 2 to 3 years, Det. Smith testified. Det. Smith said he wrote the information down as part of the statement and still has it, brought it to court. Panish: Is there a question in your mind that she said that? Det. Smith: No question whatsoever. Ms Jorrie and Mr Putnam stated this was only the beginning that MJ would go on a world tour that would last 2 to 3 years, Det. Smith wrote. Mr Putnam and Ms. Jorrie said the European tour was just the beginning… Det. Smith typed in the police log. He also typed: “MJ was going to do a world tour that would last 2 to 3 years.” Det. Smith said he takes notes contemporaneously as the interview is being taken. He types the notes once back at the office. Jorrie agreed to meet with the police, Det. Smith said. He said she was very cooperative.


AEG cross

Jessica Bina did cross examination then.

Det. Smith said he writes down a summary of the interview, not like a court reporter. “I’d imagine some things are missed,” he said.

Bina: Do you recall word for word what Ms. Jorrie said?
Det. Smith: I do not.
Bina: Was that in any way relevant to your investigation into Dr. Murray?
Det. Smith: None whatsoever.
Bina: People with financial problems could follow the law?
Det. Smith: Yes

Jackson redirect

Panish, in re-direct, asked if contract between AEG and Murray drew his attention to the figure the doc was going to be paid. Det. said yes.
Panish: You had serious concerns about that contract and Dr. Murray’s financial issues?
Det. Smith: Yes.
Panish: You didn’t know anything about how much money Ms. Jorrie had been paid by AEG, right, sir?
Det. Smith: No.
Panish: They didn’t tell you that, right?
Det. Smith: No, they did not.
Panish: You have no recollection whatsoever of Jorrie or Putnam saying it was a *potential* world tour?
Det. Smith: No, sir.

AEG recross

Bina, in re-cross: Does it matter to you it was MJ was paying Dr. Murray?
Det. Smith: No, ma’am
Bina: You were not investigating AEG Live?
Det. Smith: No, ma’am
Bina: It wasn’t who was paying, just the amount?
Det. Smith: Definitely the amount

Interview was approximately an hour, Det. Smith said. He said he was given copy of the contract.

Bina: Between you and Ms. Jorrie, who would know the contract better?
Det. Smith: Of course Ms. Jorrie

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 82 – September 19 2013 – Summary

Judge Yvette Palazuelos told the jury she’s allowing Jacksons attorneys to reopen their case briefly.


Allan Metzger Testimony

Jackson direct

Attorney Deborah Chang did direct examination. He said he was traveling, returned 2-3 weeks ago. He gave his deposition in September of 2012, about 3 years after Michael Jackson died. He worked with MJ for 25-30 years. The doctor explained he didn’t have all the medical records when he gave deposition, they were spread around to coroners, attorneys.

When Chang asked if Dr. Metzger reviewed trial transcript of Debbie Rowe, AEG attorneys objected and asked for a sidebar. ( Side note: Dr. Metzger and Debbie Rowe have the same attorney, Eric George, the son of former California Chief of Justice Ronald George.)

Dr. Metzger treated other celebrities during his 46-year medical career. He said it’s not unusual for them to use aliases. The doctor said he became very close to Michael Jackson. He started seeing him in 1983 for discoid lupus. After, there was the burn incident. “His pain became unbearable,” he explained.

Dr. Metzger’s daughter was the first one to visit Neverland. She went as part of a charity organization visit, DreamStreet Foundation. The doctor said Neverland was a place of peace. He visited it 12-15 times, sometimes with friends, family, help feed the kids. MJ supervised. Dr. Metzger: MJ dealt with a lot of adversity with generally a positive attitude. I don’t know anyone can share his degree of charity, the doctor said. Dr. Metzger said sometimes MJ would ask about a disease he wanted to know about, but generally didn’t discuss with him the charities.

Normally, Michael was very protective of his short films. But he trusted some people, and Dr. Metzger was one of them.

Over the next several years, he had a terrible burn, issues with his back and neck, he said. The discoid lupus was very scary to him, Dr. Metzger said, and the burns came on top of the discoid. The discoid could travel from his scalp to his face, leading to disfigurement.

Dr. Metzger said Lionel Richie approached MJ and ion one day he wrote “We Are The World” song. Richie did the music. He and Lionel were able to put so many influential people for charity, Dr. Metzger said. Chang played part of “We Are The World” video clip, with major music stars singing it. The song raised money for humanitarian efforts.

Dr. Metzger worked together with Dr. Klein, Sasaki and Hoefflin. MJ’s diseases were incurable (lupus and vitiligo). He said he did pre-operative examination before MJ’s surgeries. I always liked to review what kind of medications he was taking to make sure there was no interaction, Dr. Metzger testified.

Chang: Would you say the first 10 years you saw him were very difficult?
Dr. Metzger: Yes, very difficult

Chang asked about Metzger’s reference that MJ was “doctor shopping.” He explained it was a slang doctors used by the doctors who treated MJ. Dr. Metzger: When he was out of our presence, because he travelled so much, he would use hotel doctor. Dr. Metzger: MJ had to shop around in the city for quality physicians for himself and his children. Dr. Metzger said he was always involved in MJ’s medical care because he wanted to make sure MJ was safe.

Michael was very private, Dr. Metzger opined. He said often he wanted to know about his medical care, but often didn’t. He’d rely on others and had faith in the medical profession, Dr. Metzger said. “He often bounced things off me.”

Chang: Was your belief he looked for doctors to get drugs?
Dr. Metzger: No
Chang: Do you believe he was your friend so he could get prescription drugs from you?
Dr. Metzger: Absolutely not! I never gave him Demerol or any hard narcotics.
Dr. Metzger: I worked with Karen Faye, Debbie Rowe, Grace Rwamba.
Dr. Metzger: I was in touch, not as spies, but wanted to have fingers on the pulse of what was going on with my buddy.

On numerous occasions, Debbie Rowe would talk to Dr. Metzger when she thought other doctors were giving MJ too many painkillers. He said he thinks it’s because Rowe thought he could do something about it.

Dr. Metzger: No. I saw him groggy but never drunk.
Chang: Did you personally ever see MJ under the influence?
I did not ever ever see him intoxicated with too many pain medications, he said.
Dr. Metzger: I wasn’t concerned about anesthesia, I was always concerned about too many surgeries.
Dr. Metzger said he would agree that MJ needed the majority of the surgeries he underwent, specially after the burn.

Dr. Metzger said he did several examinations of Michael for insurance prior to tours. Metzger: I was informed he’d (Forecast) be taking over the medical role, and I would not be needed because of the distance.

Dangerous tour: Dr. Metzger got a call during the tour. There were couple of issues related to dehydration and Dr. Forecast administering Demerol. Sleep issues: That was the first time I was aware of the issue, didn’t have problems in Bad tour, the doctor said. Dr. Metzger: I think we had 2-3 discussions on how to lower the dose of Demerol. Chang: Did you try to work with Forecast to resolve the issue? Dr. Metzger: I don’t know if he didn’t follow my recommendations or it didn’t work.


Dr. Metzger said he watched MJ’s short video “Ghost.” Chang showed photo of Dr. Metzger and Michael Jackson as the white mayor. Chang: Did he enjoy going out incognito? Dr. Metzger: Oh, he loved it!.

The doctor said MJ always had a message in his short film, that humans should be human beings to each other. Chang played clip of “Heal the World” film and “Earth Song.” Dr. Metzger watched them with somber face, shook his head to the beat at times. It’s hard to see that, Dr. Metzger expressed after movies were played, somewhat emotional.

Metzger said MJ approached him to go on “HIStory” tour. He thought it would be fun, wanted doc to be best man on his wedding to Debbie Rowe. Chang showed letter from Metzger to insurance company that he’d be accompanying MJ, cast members and crew (180-190 people) in HIStory tour Dr. Metzger: I basically asked for nothing (payment). I knew this would be an honor, would bill based on being needed. He said he would’ve charged his normal house call rate, if they needed him during the tour. In the tour, his main responsibility was with Michael Jackson. He said he was never approached by a promoter/producer with a contract. Dr. Metzger said he never had the issue where he had to put MJ in danger to continue the tour. I never put in jeopardy his health for performance, he said.

Chang showed Murray’s contract to Metzger and asked if he was ever given a contract that says doctor could be terminated by the producer. I’ve never seen a document like this, Dr. Metzger said. He said he would’ve never signed a document that had that clause in it, it’s a conflict of interest. Chang: Were would your allegiance fall, with the producer or patient? Dr. Metzger: Of course the patient, regardless if it was MJ or not

Dr. Metzger said he knew MJ was going to get married to Debbie Rowe during the HIStory tour. During the tour he found out Rowe was pregnant. Chang: Did he enjoy being a father? Dr. Metzger: Very much so. The doctor said MJ always wanted to be a father.

Dr. Metzger: The relationship was extremely loving, non fearful. Dr. Metzger: I see he did a wise thing over the years of not exposing their faces, so they could go out and not be recognized. It was a beautiful, caring, solid relationship, Dr. Metzger explained.

The doctor said he saw several MJ shows, but nothing like what he saw in Sydney, Australia. Chang played snippet of the show. Dr. Metzger saw all the shows in Australia. He said MJ would lose 7-8 pounds after each performance.

In his deposition, Dr. Metzger said he didn’t remember who Paul Gongaware was. He said he didn’t have all his records with him.

Chang: As the HIStory tour doctor, were you concerned with MJ’s sleeping disorder during the second leg of the tour? Dr. Metzger: Yes, I was

The doctor wrote a letter detailing a plan to help MJ sleep. He said he sent a copy of it to the producer, MJ, Karen Faye, Debbie Rowe. I know that Michael can’t sleep when he’s creating, or after he was creating, he always wanted to make it better, Dr. Metzger recalled. The doctor said he didn’t think there was a plan for Dangerous tour. He didn’t think a good job was done then. Dangerous was cut short so MJ could enter rehab. Dr. Metzger said Dr. Forecast gave MJ too much Demerol. I wanted to be proactive and ready, the doctor said about HIStory tour. He testified he sent a copy of the plan to Gongaware, as producer. MJ was really tired and very frustrated, he felt he wasn’t performing well, Dr. Metzger said about his sleepiness.

Chang: In the 26 years you worked with MJ did he ever ask you for Propofol before the HIStory tour?
Metzger: Those words were never said by MJ
Chang: Did MJ ever ask you to find someone to infuse anesthesia in him?
Dr. Metzger: No

When not under stress, the doctor said MJ could sleep on Tylenol PM, which generally worked.

Dr. Metzger: I had one phone conversation in 2009 and I visited him in April 2009.
Chang: At that time, did MJ ask you for any narcotic or prescription drugs?
Dr. Metzger: No
Chang: Did he ever seek painkillers to get high?
Dr. Metzger: No, I don’t believe this was in any way recreational

Dr. Metzger said MJ was more stressed when he saw him in April 2009 than during the phone call in Feb. 2009. The doctor said the stress was related to “Can I do 50 shows?” MJ indicated he could not sleep, the doc said. “This time he was in a totally different place,” Dr. Metzger said. The doctor said he had free access to the house and the children. “I was ecstatic to see the children,” the doctor said. He was allowed upstairs at Carolwood, did not see any locked doors, medical equipment or oxygen tanks. I had a feeling that any IV given in a home is potentially precarious, Dr. Metzger explained. After leaving the house, Dr. Metzger said he called a few colleagues to see if there was any other medication or avenues to help MJ sleep. He spoke with the head of anesthesia at Cedars Sinai, since anesthesiologists have to manage pain and sleep. I needed advice getting him to sleep and I also asked about a doctor in London, Dr. Metzger explained. I don’t remember if I called back or just relay the message I couldn’t help, the doctor said. Dr. Metzger: Basically he said any IV treatment is potentially dangerous, that he didn’t know anyone who would administer IV anesthesia. April 18, 2009 was the last time Dr. Metzger saw MJ alive.

Dr Metzger: One of the things he discussed was Diprivan.
Chang showed Dr. Metzger the picture of MJ during fitting on June 19, 2009.
Chang: Did he look like this?
Dr. Metzger: Oh no, not at all
C: Would you’ve been concerned?
Dr. M: Oh yes, oh yes

(During lunch break: Outside the presence of the jury, Deborah Chang argued she doesn’t think it’s appropriate for the court to sanction. Chang gave 38 pages of Debbie Rowe’s testimony to Dr. Metzger to read. Judge had ruled that non-retained expert witnesses should not be given copies of other witnesses’ testimony. Chang: I don’t think it was intentional violation of court’s order. I believe we acted in good faith. Judge: The good faith exception, huh? Judge then precluded plaintiffs from asking anything related to the issue German doctors and Propofol used to sleep. Bina: He already testified without the taint of someone else’s testimony. Even if she acted in good faith, it irreparably tainted his memory. Bina said she’s asking for fair remedy here, which is keep this part out of Dr. Metzger’s out. Bina said Chang corrupted the witness by giving another witness’ version of the events so he was able to taylor his answer according to hers Cahan said the 38 pages of Rowe’s testimony detailed the set up the anesthesiologist in German, logistic, what drugs have been provided. There’s no other way to fix this other than keep it out, Cahan urged the judge. Panish: What we did, show him the testimony, is appropriate. Non-retained experts can be refreshed. This is about refreshing his recollection with someone else’s memory, Bina argued. Panish: Defense will argue MJ had long history of use of Propofol. The evidence here is that Propofol was used in connection with surgeries. Bina: We can never get back what Dr. Metzger’s memory actually was. Judge: Ok, I’m ready to rule. I’m excluding it. )
Chang: Do you recall having a conversation with Paul Gongaware about MJ’s inability to sleep?
Dr. Metzger: Yes, I do.


AEG cross

Cahan inquired about the time of deposition whether Dr. Metzger had MJ’s medical files. Dr. Metzger: Some of my records were given to my attorney at the time, didn’t keep medical records. There may be an insurance file and one major file, the doctor said. His counsel did not give his medical record prior to his deposition. Dr. Metzger said that at the time of his deposition, he received a great amount of the file back, but it was out of order and missing pages.

I told the truth to the best of my ability, Dr. Metzger said about his deposition and his trial testimony.

The doctor said he looked at some of MJ’s medical records over the past several days. “I did not look at 26 years of medical records.” Dr. Metzger said he had, in bits and pieces, taken care of other Jackson’s family members, including MJ’s children. The doctor was very close to MJ and moderately close to the children.

Q: And it seems like you also had a very close relationship with Michael’s children, correct?
A: Yes

In depo Dr. Metzger’s said: Dr. Metzger said he had a moderately close relationship with the children in comparison with his relationship to MJ. He said there were times the children went to his house for dinner, went to the movies.

Dr. Metzger met Katherine Jackson many years ago, he said. He provided some medical care to her last summer. He gave Mrs. Jackson advice about traveling because of her health. Dr. Metzger: I advised her to fly to Arizona for a concert. I do not know where she was in Arizona, I did not advise her to go to a spa. Janet and Randy asked me to evaluate her health, Dr. Metzger said. “I’ve previously taken care of Janet many years ago.” I’m well acquainted with the immediate Jackson family and some other members, the doctor said.

I viewed Michael as a very good friend of mine and I think it was vice-versa, Dr. Metzger testified.

Dr. Metzger said he spoke with Chang on the phone about 2 weeks ago and met her in person with his attorney 2-3 nights ago for an hour. Doctor said he was out of town from middle of July until mid-Aug. Early July he advised plaintiffs’ counsel about his absence. Dr. Metzger first spoke with plaintiffs’ attorneys about testifying back in April or May. He has been subpoenaed. Dr. Metzger said Chang told him she had an attorney to refer that she thought would suit his needs. She recommended Eric George.
Cahan: Did plaintiffs’ counsel help you find an attorney?
Dr. Metzger: Yes
C: How much does he charge?
Dr. M: I don’t know
Cahan: Are plaintiffs’ paying for your attorney in this case?
Dr. Metzger: I believe so.

The doctor said he reached out to Debbie Rowe after seeing in the media that she testified in this case. He wanted to give her some support. At that time, Rowe also said Eric George was a good attorney.

Cahan asked if the doc is charging plaintiffs anything to be here today.
Dr. Metzger: I’ll be sending a bill at the end of the trial.
Dr. Metzger: I believe it’s reasonable for my time reviewing the records, giving deposition and testimony in this case.

The doctor said he’s spent about 6 hours of his time. Cahan asked how much he charges and he said he was not comfortable disclosing his rate. Cahan asked the judge to order him to answer, which judge did. He said he charges approximately $1,000/hour. There were no negotiations, I basically said this is my fee and they said ok, Dr. Metzger explained. As to his attorney, Metzger said he knows there’s an arrangement for payment by the plaintiffs and there’s also an arrangement between the two

Cahan: Have you spoken with Jackson’s family members about this lawsuit?
Dr. Metzger: Basically no

My recollection I did not speak with any single member of the family about this lawsuit, Dr. Metzger testified.

The doctor said his relationship with Michael Jackson was the closest he has ever had with any patient. He went to Neverland 12-15 times. He went to MJ’s CenturyCity house, saw MJ at Dr. Klein’s house and office, saw him in NY, Australia, best man of his wedding to Ms. Rowe. He was both, Dr. Metzger said about MJ being a friend and patient. “I always had his best interest at heart.” I don’t believe I ever crossed any ethical boundaries with Michael Jackson, Dr. Metzger said. The doctor said he understands the Hippocratic Oath to have his patients first, do no harm. Dr. Metzger: In my view, I always maintained proper boundaries. A lot of physicians would not socialize with patients. Dr. Metzger: MJ was the most social I was with my patients.

He really didn’t like taking medicine Metzger said. “I think he needed medicine because he had low pain threshold when undergoing surgery” He needed it, he didn’t take it for joy, Dr. Metzger said. Dr. Metzger said he believes he never gave MJ Demerol. “Absolutely not,” he responded to the question. Dr. Metzger: At some juncture on that tour (Dangerous), I believe I arranged for Karen, Debbie or security team to bring some medicine to MJ

Cahan: Was that in Aug 1993?
Dr. Metzger: I don’t recall.
Cahan: Do you remember sending pain medication?
Dr. Metzger: Yes, there was some form of pain medication
Cahan: Do you remember sending some Demerol?
Dr. Metzger: I don’t personally believe I prescribed MJ Demerol. It could’ve come from Dr. Klein if it was in the package.
I don’t remember ever writing a prescription for Michael about Demerol, Dr. Metzger explained.
Dr. Metzger admitted he used Karen Faye’s name to prescribe medicine for MJ.
I’ve done it on rare occasions, almost exclusively for MJ and Janet, Dr. Metzger said.
Cahan: Even though you knew it’s illegal?
Dr. Metzger: Yes
C: Why?
Dr. M: To protect their anonymity
Cahan: Have you ever been reprimanded or disciplined for writing prescriptions on someone else’s name?

( Chang asked for a sidebar. Outside jury’s presence there was discussion about Cahan asking if Metzger was reprimanded for writing prescription under other people’s name Bina: Dr. Metzger pled no contest to a misdemeanor for misconduct. There’s a petition for suspension of Dr. Metzger’s medical license. Bina argued the appropriate remedy should be to strike the question and bar the line of questioning. Cahan apologized saying she misunderstood the court order. She said she thought it had to do with other patients other than MJ and KJ. Panish: She did it intentionally, was setting him up. It was a premeditated plan. It’s not admissible, she severely prejudiced this witness. Panish wants an admonition read and wants to be allowed to talk about the German doctors. Chang argued Cahan did it in bad faith. “The jury is left with the idea that he’s a criminal, that he’d do anything for MJ,” she said. I honestly don’t know what to do to fix it, Chang said. “I just want to throw myself on the floor and cry.” Judge will read an instruction to the jury that Cahan’s question was improper and they should disregard it or anything implied by it. Judge admonished Cahan not to ask anything about it. )

Dr. Metzger said he travelled to Australia with Debbie Rowe, was there for about 2 weeks. This was HIStory tour. Dr Metzger never rejoined the tour after he came back to LA. “My schedule and MJ particularly wanted me there for the wedding and Australia” He didn’t need me and I didn’t need to be there, he said. Dr. Metzger recalled treating MJ for mild dehydration while in Australia. The doc talked about the plan he wrote to help MJ sleep. He said MJ gave permission for him to share plan with Rowe, Faye and security guards. Michael needed to be told what to do, Dr. Metzger said. The plan detailed what to do before flights and after performances. He was uncomfortable and a little fearful of flying, Dr. Metzger explained.

Cahan: Did doctor shopping included Mr. Jackson segregating physicians?
Dr. Metzger: Often I’d not hear about other physicians. I’d hear from security or the ladies if it was serious. At times, I think he probably did keep things from me because he didn’t want me to worry, Dr. Metzger testified.
Dr. Metzger: I always asked him to go thru the hotel, because the hotel had responsibility to hire competent physician.
Cahan: Do you think MJ wanted to keep information from one doctor to another so he could more or less do what he wanted?
Dr. Metzger: No

Cahan played video deposition in the insurance company lawsuit where Dr. Metzger said MJ would segregate his doctors. Dr. Metzger on depo: I think he didn’t want to appear he was doctor shopping. Dr. Metzger: I think he didn’t want one medical group to know about another medical group so he could, more or less, do what he wanted.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Plans as of now ALL SUBJECT TO CHANGE: – Witness done tomorrow morning, arguments and
motions in the pm – Jury to be instructed on MONDAY. Closing plaintiff – TUESDAY – Closing defendant – WEDNESDAY – Rebuttal plaintiff – THURSDAY

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 83 – September 20 2013 – Summary


Dr. Allan Metzger testimony

AEG cross

Kathryn Cahan, attorney from AEG, did cross examination.

Cahan asked if the doctor met with Jacksons attorneys and other things he did last night to prepare for his testimony. Tried to sleep and chilled out, Dr. Metzger responded. Dr. Metzger said he will bill the plaintiffs $1,000/hour for testifying today. He’ll bill 6 or 7 hours for the time on the stand yesterday. Cahan asked if Dr Metzger were to do this for 8 hours/day he’d make $240 thousand a month. “I’d never do this 8 hours a day,” he answered. The doctor said he retired earlier this year from seeing patients.

Metzger: I told MJ I wanted to have as much information as I could about his health wherever he was. Sometimes I got it, sometimes I didn’t
Cahan: Did you ever discuss with MJ your concerns about doctor shopping?
Dr. Metzger: Yes

Dr. Metzger said he explains to all of his patients he wants to know all the doctors they are seeing due to potential harm of medications.

Cahan: Michael didn’t take your warnings seriously, did he?
Dr. Metzger: At times he did.
Cahan: Regarding the risks of taking medication this way, was it your impression he didn’t take you seriously?
Dr. Metzger: I believe he took it seriously, but I believe he forgot it at times since he was too busy.

Cahan played video deposition of Dr. Metzger where he said he was frustrated that other doctors were giving MJ medication he didn’t know. I don’t think he took it very seriously because he trusted doctors to take care of him, Dr. Metzger said in the depo.

I think he really didn’t take it seriously he could have a reaction from taking different medications, Dr. Metzger testified.

Cahan: You said MJ took great joy in making it a secret to everybody and that it was part of his mystique, correct?
Metzger: It was part of his privacy, his mystique perhaps. There were concerns of MJ seeing several doctors. I’d not call it doctor shopping

Cahan played Metzger’s video deposition where he said he heard concerns from Debbie, Karen, Hoefflin, Klein that Michael was doctor shopping. He took pain medication the average person wouldn’t, Dr. Metzger testifies in his deposition. Metzger said privacy and secrecy played a role in MJ’s medical care. He didn’t recall seeing pill bottles with doctor’s name he didn’t know At times, MJ was secretive about the doctors he was seeing, the medications he was taking and the procedures he was having, Dr. Metzger said.

Dr. Metzger said he had no restrictions of where to go in MJ’s Carolwood home during the April 18, 2009 visit. Cahan played video of deposition where the doctor said he never went upstairs at Michael’s house. But he said in court he went to the second floor’s landing to get a cat and saw into all the rooms. Cahan asked which one was the truth, whether he went upstairs or not. Dr. Metzger said he did not go upstairs with Michael. Dr. Metzger: I went up to the landing where you could see the room where the kids said Michael was and the doors were wide open.

Dr. Metzger claimed he didn’t see any medical equipment in MJ’s house. “He was certainly anxious and desperate over sleep,” he said.
Cahan: How MJ looked on April 18, 2009?
Metzger: He looked fit, he was bouncing, the same Michael I knew, lucid
There was no suggestion of medication I could detect, Dr. Metzger recalled.

He said Michael was always trim and muscular. “He was ready to go, except worried about sleep,” Dr. Metzger testified. I think he was handling stress better than I thought he would he said. “I’ve seeing him before other tours, he seemed more anxious” He seemed in charge and ready to go, the doctor said. “He was excited, anxious.”


Jackson redirect

In re-direct, Dr. Metzger said that on April 18, 2009 he was not aware of MJ having any intravenous medication.. Chang asked if on April 18, 2009 MJ looked skeletal like the picture from June 19, 2009. “Absolutely did not look like that,” he responded.

Regarding Chang’s recommending Eric George to be his attorney, Dr. Metzger said Chang was enthusiastic about him. In fact, he said, Chang didn’t even recommend that the doctor talked to anyone else. Dr. Metzger and Chang met with George for about 1 hour. Chang: Is it terrifying to testify in front of the entire world? Metzger: Yes. I wanted to make sure I knew how to answer properly about MJ. Chang said she wanted to clear up that her firm is not paying Dr. Metzger’s attorney Eric George. Dr. Metzger: I have not received any bills from Eric George yet. She asked if he had any reason to believe that was not true. He said no. Dr. Metzger said $1,000/hour is the standard rate he charges any attorney when he does depositions or testifies in court. Dr. Metzger charged AEG $9,000 for 9 hours of deposition in this case. He said he charged the same hourly rate for the Lloyds of London depo. Chang: In the 46 years you’ve practice medicine, it the rate pretty standard for doctors? Dr. Metzger: It’s standard in my office. Dr. Metzger said the fee he charges does not influence his testimony in any way.

He said Paul Gongaware was the producer at MJ’s tour in Sydney, Australia. Chang: Did you believe it was any secret in Australia that Michael could not sleep after the performances? Dr. Metzger: No, I think everyone understood that. He was a perfectionist, Michael could not sleep after the shows. Whatever he did it, no matter how magical it was, he wanted to make it more magical, Dr. Metzger opined. Chang: Was it for the fans? Dr. Metzger: Yes and for himself, he was a perfectionist. Chang: When someone cannot sleep, does it make someone more anxious? Dr. Metzger: Yes, and it lowers the pain threshold.

Chang: During the Dangerous tour in 1993 did you come to learn that too many prescription drugs were given to MJ? Dr. Metzger: Absolutely!

Regarding prescribing medication under Karen Faye’s name, Dr. Metzger said it was Latisse for eyelashes, Rogaine and cold medicine.

As to doctor shopping, Metzger said his concern about it was in the early 90′s. He said he never prescribed Demerol under Faye’s name for MJ. I’m not aware of any doctor shopping and use of drug that was not appropriate from 1995 and later, Dr. Metzger testified. Chang asked if Dr. Metzger had any proof MJ was taking meds from different doctors. “The only proof I had was word of mouth,” he answered. Michael never told me about many doctors and many medications, Dr. Metzger testified. Chang: And you didn’t have any real evidence? Dr. Metzger: I did hear bits and pieces of medication being prescribed by other doctors in LA. Chang: You agree that you were MJ’s long time doctor and friend for 26 years? Dr. Metzger: Yes

Chang: You met Paul Gongaware in the HIStory tour? Metzger: Yes.

I was concerned about sleep issue and him being groggy, Dr. Metzger said. As to using intravenous medication to sleep, Dr. Metzger repeated he told MJ it was dangerous and he should not do it.

Chang: Paul Gongaware never offered to pay you $150 thousand/month? Dr. Metzger: Correct


AEG recross


Cahan, in re-cross: If Paul Gongaware offered you $150 thousand/month it would be less than what you’d get for being a witness at $1,000/hr? Dr. Metzger: Yes, the math is correct, but I also said I’d not do this full time.

Dr. Metzger recalled overuse of Demerol and some sleep drug issues as being a problem during the Dangerous tour. In 1993, when MJ went to rehab, Dr. Metzger said he learned about it either though Debbie Rowe or Karen Faye or maybe the press. Cahan played video deposition of Dr. Metzger where he said he treated MJ after he went to rehab and never discussed it with Michael. Cahan: Did you discuss MJ’s addiction to painkiller even after learning from the press he entered rehab and continued as his physician? Dr. Metzger: I discussed that in the late 90′s a few times. Cahan: Did he say he had an addiction to painkillers? Dr. Metzger: Yes, he said that in the Dangerous tour he was addicted.

I believe I prescribed mild opioids, vicodin, for significant pain, Dr. Metzger said. This was after MJ had left rehab. As to Latisse, the doctor said the prescription was for both MJ and Faye. He believes this was during the Dangerous tour. Metzger said he was more involved in the 90′s than 2000′s. From 03-09, he was involved only by phone, asked about kids, minor medical issues

Dr. Metzger is excused.


Attorney Eric George Testimony


Jackson direct


George is an attorney for 20 years. He practices civil litigation matters involving businesses.

Panish: Have you ever socialize with me, had dinners with me? George: Not once. I’m very careful the company I keep. Everyone laughed.

He represents Debbie Rowe for the past 8 years. Panish asked how George became Dr. Metzger’s attorney. He said he received a phone call asking if he would be willing to represent him. Panish inquired if he was being paid by Panish’s firm to represent Dr. Metzger. George said no, nor would he accept it. George: It would be inappropriate. I’m here to represent the witness, to tell the truth and let the chips fall wherever they may.


AEG cross


Putnam, in cross: When did you decide you were going to testify? George: It was discussed yesterday after an incorrect answer was given. George said it was suggested that he was being paid about one side. “It concerned my reputation and I wanted to clear that up.” It was something I’d never agree to, he testified.” I was glad to do it and get the record straight.

P: Did you charge him? G: Yes. Putnam: Do you work for Dr. Metzger for free? George: No. P: Are you being paid less than the regular rate? G: Much less. Putnam: Your regular rate? George: No

George never met Dr. Metzger before his case, but said he heard about him from Debbie Rowe. Putnam asked if he thought it was a conflict of interest to represent Rowe and Dr. Metzger. George said there’s no conflict of interest. I’m proud of saying that I’ve never been accused of conflict of interest or unethical conduct and I want to keep it that way, George said. Putnam asked why George agreed to represent Dr. Metzger. One of the most important issues of this time is corporate accountability and responsibility, George said.

Putnam: You made a determination about the outcome of this case? George: I do have strong feelings about this case, yes.

George was then excused.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Plaintiffs told the court they are resting, pending some issues that are not resolved yet.

Both sides stipulated that the total attendance in the U2 concert at the Rowe Bowl on Oct 25, 2009 was approximately 97,000.

After jurors left, Kevin Boyle tells judge in order to not lengthen the trial even further they’ll not show Sony’s raw footage of This Is It

Attorneys argued plaintiffs’ motion for direct verdict on issue of Katherine Jackson being dependent on MJ. Judge: My tentative would be to grant it. Boyle said he agreed with judge’s position. Plaintiffs want the judge to rule that Katherine Jackson was dependent on MJ for necessities of live. If Mrs. Jackson is considered not to be dependent of MJ, she has no standing in bringing in this lawsuit. Mrs. Jackson didn’t need her son’s money for necessities of life Bina argued. “For 3 years she was getting $120K/year from daughter Janet” Standing is not established if the money from the child only enables the parent to have niceties they might otherwise afford Bina opined. It’s a jury question as to whether the chid’s money is needed, Bina said. Bina argued it’s not contribution to some extent, it’s whether the parent needed the money for the necessities of life. Boyle said the support that MJ was given to Mrs. Jackson was not really disputed. Ackerman testified that Mr. Jackson was paying for many expenses at Hayvenhurst, such as utilities, transportation, food, mortgage. Judge asked if there was record of how money Janet gave Mrs. Jackson was spent. Her money could be for the niceties. Bina said the law is to protect a parent who depends upon a child for necessities of life. Bina: Jury could find Mrs Jackson was not dependent upon MJ for the necessities of life but accepted generous gift to have nicer things. Judge: The fact that he contributes it some way, it doesn’t have to be how much. Boyle argues that the word “need ” is not in any of the case laws. It’s whether they were dependent, to some extent, for necessities of life Judge: The fact in this case is Mrs. Jackson is an 83 year old woman, she doesn’t work, she’s dependent on her children to take care of her. Boyle said defendant’s expert admitted MJ paid Mrs. Jackson’s necessities of life. Bina: A reasonable person could determine that earning $120 thousand a year is enough for food, clothing and shelter. If there was no Michael Jackson at all, Mrs. Jackson would still have $120 thousand a year, Bina said. Notwithstanding how generous MJ was to his mother, the fact is she did not need him to live, Bina argued. Judge to rule within the hour if Katherine Jackson has standing or not. If judge denies motion, jury will have to determine if KJ has standing before they can award her any money — what defense wants. If judge grants it, jury won’t have to make that decision — what plaintiffs want. Big victory in court today for Katherine Jackson. The judge just ruled the matriarch is entitled to seek compensation for the death of MJ.

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 84 – September 23 2013 – Summary

Jury Instructions was read today.

Final Jury instructions can be found at the link below

http://www.scribd.com/doc/170454633/Jackson-vs-AEG-Live-Final-Jury-Instructions

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 85 – September 24 2013 – Summary

Closing arguments started, it was Jacksons turn.

Source: HLN is live-blogging closing arguments. Read below for minute-by-minute updates from the trial

1:24 p.m. ET: Katherine Jackson and daughter Rebbie have entered the courtroom. Grandchildren Taj and TJ Jackson (the sons of Tito) are now sitting with their grandmother.

1:34 p.m. ET: Jackson family attorney Brian Panish begins his closing argument by thanking the jury for its service. Jurors have been listening to this case for five months.

1:37 p.m. ET: Panish says Michael Jackson “danced, walked, moon walked on this earth for nearly 50 years… someone like that only comes around every so often. We may never see the likes of Michael Jackson ever again… That gift came at a huge price.”

1:39 p.m. ET: “The whole world stopped when the King of Pop died and everyone grieved,” said Panish.

1:42 p.m. ET: "He had abused prescription medications during times of pain, anxiety, stress," said Panish.

1:45 p.m. ET: Panish says AEG wanted Jackson to perform so badly "they would do whatever it took to get him on stage and they told that to Dr. Murray."

1:47 p.m. ET: An AEG exec had to throw Jackson in a shower and slap him before the press conference that announced his "This Is It" tour, according to Panish. Executives exchanged e-mails after saying, "We can't back off now, it would be a disaster for the company.

1:51 p.m. ET: Dr. Murray broke his Hippocratic oath and AEG Live is responsible, according to Panish.

1:53 p.m. ET: Panish is walking jurors through what needs to be proven in this case and who has the burden of proof.

1:55 p.m. ET: "If the scale [of justice] tips ever so slightly, we have met the burden of proof," said Panish, who must show AEG Live negligently hired, supervised or retained Dr. Murray.

1:58 p.m. ET: On the issue of whether AEG Live hired Dr. Murray, Panish says the evidence overwhelming shows that they did.

2:04 p.m. ET: Panish is still going over the first jury question: "Did AEG Live hire Dr. Conrad Murray?" He says a contract can be written or oral, partially written or partially oral and that oral contracts are just as valid as written contracts.

2:13 p.m. ET: Panish is showing e-mails between AEG Live and Murray that he says prove they had a contract.

2:19 p.m. ET: Why would AEG let Murray have control over Jackson's rehearsal schedule if he wasn't hired by them, asks Panish.

2:22 p.m. ET: Panish says Murray was included on AEG Live budgets.

2:27 p.m. ET: Panish moves on to the second question on the verdict form: "Was Dr. Conrad Murray unfit or incompetent to perform the work for which he was hired?" Panish says it's obvious Murray is unfit and incompetent because he killed the King of Pop and wasn't trained to treat insomnia.

2:36 p.m. ET: Murray had two obligations: One to the entity paying him money (AEG) and one to his patient (Jackson), according to Panish.

2:39 p.m. ET: "Was Dr. Murray swayed by the conflict of the money vs. the patient?" asked Panish.

2:40 p.m. ET: Panish says Murray swore to do no harm but did it anyway: "Why did he do it? For the money."

2:42 p.m. ET: Panish shows this e-mail to the jury, sent between AEG execs: "We want to remind him that it is AEG, not MJ who is paying his salary."

2:47 p.m. ET: Video being played in court shows AEG executive Paul Gongaware being asked about the e-mail he sent (mentioned in previous entry). He says he doesn't member sending it or what it means. "We weren't paying his salary," Gongaware said. He then says he doesn't know whose salary he's even talking about.

"It would be funny, but for somebody who has lost his life... I don't think it's funny," Panish said.

2:50 p.m. ET: Panish says AEG Live wanted complete control over Murray and that some people do things they normally wouldn't do because of a need for money.

2:52 p.m. ET: Conrad Murray asking for $5 million to go on tour was a red flag showing he was "unfit, incompetent and outrageous," according to Panish.

2:55 p.m. ET: A detective working for the LAPD was easily able to determine Murray was financially "a mess," which was a motivation for what he did, according to Panish.

2:57 p.m. ET: "It's not a stretch that he was unfit and incompetent -- come on," Panish said, in reference to Murray.

2:59 p.m. ET: The judge has recessed the court for lunch. Closing arguments will resume at 4:30 p.m. ET.

4:38 p.m. ET: Jackson family attorney Brian Panish has continued working his way through the jury verdict form, addressing question #3: "Did AEG Live know or should it have known that Dr. Conrad Murray was unfit or incompetent and that this unfitness or incompetence created a particular risk to others?"

4:41 p.m. ET: Panish warns the courtroom not to laugh as he replays testimony by a few AEG executives who are edited together to say "I don't know" or "I don't remember" several times.

4:48 p.m. ET: Testimony from earlier in the trial continues to be played by Panish.

4:52 p.m. ET: Panish says everyone knew Jackson had problems sleeping and needed help to treat his insomnia.

4:56 p.m. ET: The director of the show, Kenny Ortega, was supposed to monitor Jackson's health, according to Panish. "The pressure was on," said Panish. Jackson and Ortega then put the pressure on Murray, according to Panish.

4:59 p.m. ET: E-mails Panish reads in court show there were concerns about "trouble at the front" when it came to Jackson's health and his tour.

5:01 p.m. ET: The director of Jackson's show e-mailed AEG executives, telling them Jackson was in trouble and needed a mental evaluation, according to Panish.

5:04 p.m. ET: One AEG employee said Jackson was so thin, he could see his heart beating in his chest. Another employee expressed fears Jackson was going to die and needed to be hospitalized, according to Panish.

5:10 p.m. ET: Jackson was described by a witness earlier in the trial as "very, very underweight... like someone who was at the end stage of a -- of a long disease process."

5:15 p.m. ET: Panish moves on to question #4, saying the answer is "obviously" yes: "Did Dr. Conrad Murray’s unfitness or incompetence harm Michael Jackson and the Jackson Plaintiffs?"

5:16 p.m. ET: Panish tells jurors they don't need to spend much time on question #4 and moves on to question #5: "Was AEG Live’s negligence in hiring, supervising, or retaining Dr. Conrad Murray a substantial factor in causing Michael Jackson and the Jackson Plaintiffs’ harm?"

5:19 p.m. ET: A timeline of Jackson's medical treatments is displayed on a slide. Panish says Jackson survived 50 years of procedures with "never a single issue." He says the one thing that changed was AEG and Murray.

5:22 p.m. ET: Panish is moving on to the next set of questions, which address compensatory damages.

5:25 p.m. ET: "Unfortunately nothing can bring Michael Jackson back… in our society there’s a tremendous value placed on human life," said Panish. He has started talking about Jackson's mom, Katherine, saying there is no word for a parent who has lost a child because it's "an indescribable loss that no parent should ever experience."

5:27 p.m. ET: When deciding how much to award Katherine Jackson and Michael's kids, Panish tells jurors they have to use common sense to decide "what is just and fair."

5:31 p.m. ET: Panish said Katherine Jackson should be awarded less money than his children, because her life expectancy is much shorter.

5:34 p.m. ET: Panish just played a clip from "This is it" with Kenny Ortega saying that Jackson could have sold out 200 shows on his final tour.

5:36 p.m. ET: AEG's own accounting figures indicate that Jackson was going to earn close to $1.5 billion on his final tour.

5:38 p.m. ET: Panish is playing a video of Jackson's performances for the jury so they can see he could have still earned a substantial amount of money if he lived.

5:42 p.m. ET: The video of past performances shows Jackson performing with the Jackson 5 as a child, and also shows him performing to sold out crowds as an adult.

5:48 p.m. ET: The video also showed Jackson's first moonwalk at the 25th Anniversary of the Grammy's.

5:52 p.m. ET: The video of past performances has been playing for more than 10 minutes now.

5:57 p.m. ET: The video is over, and Panish said the video of past performances was the best evidence that Jackson could have still sold out shows if he had lived. Court is now in a 15 minute break.

6:19 p.m. ET: Panish has picked back up with his closing argument. He says AEG wanted Jackson to perform, because his tour was going to make a large profit. He also says Jackson invested in his family.

6:23 p.m. ET: Panish is now discussing how the Jackson family has suffered loss besides monetary losses. He is explaining that Jackson family will no longer feel MJ's love or comfort.

6:25 p.m. ET: "Death lasts forever," said Panish. "This will never be replaced."

6:27 p.m. ET: Panish is showing the jury some pictures of Jackson with his family.

6:29 p.m. ET: This is a picture of the Jackson family home in Gary, Indiana.

6:33 p.m. ET: Jackson wrote poetry for his mother.

6:36 p.m. ET: Panish is now detailing the non-monetary losses Jackson's children have suffered from his death.

6:42 p.m. ET: Prince was very close to his father, and he was like his father's little assistant according to Panish.

6:47 p.m. ET: Panish said Paris was there when her father overdosed, and it was very traumatic for her.

6:50 p.m. ET: Panish is playing a song Jackson wrote for his children, while video plays of Jackson with his children.

6:55 p.m. ET: Panish said he believes each of Jackson's children should be awarded $85 million dollars for past and future losses.

6:59 p.m. ET: Panish has ended his closing argument. He thanked the jury, and told the jury he will give a shorter rebuttal argument Thursday. AEG's attorneys will give their closing argument tomorrow. The judge told the parties to report to the courtroom tomorrow at 12:30 p.m. ET.

-----------------------------

some videos

[video=youtube_share;Ti5d3a7EWfY]http://youtu.be/Ti5d3a7EWfY[/video]

[video=youtube_share;Xn6qA_nu-FY]http://youtu.be/Xn6qA_nu-FY[/video]

-----------------------------

another set of videos

[video=youtube_share;YebCm_OrLZA]http://youtu.be/YebCm_OrLZA[/video]

[video=youtube_share;60Ho-1e8nXE]http://youtu.be/60Ho-1e8nXE[/video]

 

[ivy]

Jacksons vs AEG - Day 86 – September 25 2013 – Summary

Closing arguments started, it was AEGs turn.

Source: HLN is live-blogging closing arguments. Read below for minute-by-minute updates from the trial

1:11 p.m. ET: The judge is taking the bench.

1:14 p.m. ET: AEG Live attorney Marvin Putnam will deliver the closing argument for the defense. He begins by thanking the jurors for their service.

1:18 p.m. ET: Putnam says AEG Live isn't responsible for Jackson's death because "This was a choice Mr. Jackson made, not somebody else. He was a grown man… he is responsible for his own health -- certainly his own healthcare. And his is responsible for his own choices, no matter how bad those choices might be."

Putnam also says AEG Live tried to talk Jackson out of bringing Murray on the tour.

"Mr. Jackson would not take ‘no’ for an answer. If he wanted something, he got it," said Putnam.

1:22 p.m. ET: Jackson was about half a billion dollars in debt, according to Putnam. Jackson also "spent decades shopping for doctors to give him the pain killers he wanted," said Putnam.

1:25 p.m. ET: "They never told the truth to AEG Live," Putnam said about Jackson and Murray. "When Michael Jackson’s bedroom was searched, his secrets were revealed."

Putnam also said AEG Live never would have agreed to finance the tour if it knew Jackson was playing "Russian roulette" every night in his bedroom.

1:29 p.m. ET: "He was never hired by AEG Live to go on tour. If they hired him, they would have paid him," Putnam said about Murray. If jurors don't find that Murray was hired by AEG Live, then they can't find AEG Live liable for Jackson's death.

1:30 p.m. ET: "The truth here is a tragedy, make no mistake about that… it’s incredibly sad. But it’s not a tragedy of AEG Live’s making. You can’t point the finger at them and you shouldn’t," said Putnam. "Mr. Jackson chose this doctor, years before. And Mr. Jackson chose the drug that killed him. Mr. Jackson, like every adult, is responsible for his own choices."

1:34 p.m. ET: Putnam is starting to go through the jury verdict form and the questions jurors have to answer "yes" to in order to find AEG Live liable.

1:38 p.m. ET: "This case is about Dr. Conrad Murray," says a slide Putnam has displayed. He gives some examples of when an employer is negligent in hiring an employee, such as: If the employer knows the employee has a violent history and is hired to work with weapons.

1:40 p.m. ET: Michael Jackson's death "would have happened no matter what -- with or without AEG Live," said Putnam.

1:45 p.m. ET: "You can’t save someone, they have to save themselves. And more importantly… the law doesn’t say you have to," said Putnam.

1:47 p.m. ET: Putnam is now addressing question #1 on the jury verdict form: "Did AEG Live hire Dr. Conrad Murray?" He says no because Jackson hired Murray and things "never even got that far" -- there wasn't a contract. "There was never a done deal."

1:48 p.m. ET: When it comes to who hired Murray, Putnam says there are four options (and all the evidence points to the first): Michal Jackson hired him, AEG Live hired, they both hired him or neither one hired him.

1:52 p.m. ET: Jackson introduced Murray as "his doctor" to AEG Live executives, according to Putnam, and he insisted the doctor come on tour and he wouldn't take no for an answer.

"It was not for AEG Live to interfere with that longtime doctor-patient relationship... Dr. Conrad Murray was Michael Jackson's choice."

1:54 p.m. ET: Putnam says Jackson always paid Murray -- AEG Live didn't give him any money -- and that Jackson would have his kids hand the doctor stacks of hundred dollar bills, wrapped with elastic bands.

1:58 p.m. ET: AEG was going to loan a broke Jackson money to help pay Murray, according to Putnam. He also says Jackson agreed to be responsible for anyone he brought on the tour with him.

2:05 p.m. ET: The only reason AEG Live ever spoke to Murray was because Jackson had asked them to advance money to pay the doctor, according to Putnam.

2:10 p.m. ET: Putnam is showing copies of Murray's draft agreements.

2:14 p.m. ET: The judge has recessed court for 15 minutes.

2:37 p.m. ET: Court is back in session and Putnam has resumed his closing argument.

2:40 p.m. ET: E-mails sent between Murray and AEG Live prove there was no contract between the two, according to Putnam.

2:42 p.m. ET: Murray and AEG Live agreed there would be no oral agreement, only a signed contract, which never happened, according to Putnam.

2:50 p.m. ET: Putnam says that, despite this e-mail, AEG Live co-CEO Paul Gongaware never had a conversation with Murray about who was paying him. Gongaware says he doesn't remember seeing this e-mail or what he meant.

2:55 p.m. ET: As far as AEG Live knew, Murray was a general doctor for Jackson, according to Putnam. If Jackson wanted an anesthesiologist and hired Murray, that would have raised a red flag.

2:56 p.m. ET: "Mr. Jackson thought enough of Dr. Murray to let him provide medical treatment to his own children," said Putnam. AEG didn't know Murray was treating Jackson with propofol “behind his locked bedroom doors.” If Murray was hired to administer propofol, then he would have been hired by Jackson for this purpose, according to Putnam.

2:58 p.m. ET: The judge has recessed court for lunch until 4:30 p.m. ET.

4:41 p.m. ET: Putnam has resumed his closing argument. He says Jackson's attorneys didn't proved that AEG Live knew or should have known that Dr. Murray posed a risk to Jackson.

4:45 p.m. ET: Putnam said AEG Live did not know anything about propofol or should have known about the anesthetic being administered to Jackson and thus should not be held liable.

4:49 p.m. ET: There was nothing that should have notified AEG Live that Dr. Murray was incompetent according to Putnam.

4:54 p.m. ET: Putnam said that AEG was not required to supervise Murray. They were never supposed to supervise him, because they have no medical knowledge.

4:57 p.m. ET: "Nothing in Dr. Murray's background would suggest he might be dangerous," said Putnam.

5:01 p.m. ET: "AEG Live believed Jackson was perfectly healthy," said Putnam. "He was healthy. He was ready to perform."

5:08 p.m. ET: Putnam showed pictures of Jackson to show that his weight was normal shortly before he died.

5:15 p.m. ET: Putnam just played a video of Jackson rehearsing on June 5 about a week before his death. The video shows that Jackson was healty right up to his death according to Putnam.

5:21 p.m. ET: Jackson appeared sick on June 19, but Putnam said nobody knew why he was sick.

5:27 p.m. ET: Representatives with AEG met with Jackson to see if he was okay after he appeared to be sick in June 2009.

"Mr. Jackson a 50 year old man told his business partners that he was fine," said Putnam.

5:32 p.m. ET: Putnam said Jackson had "incredible" performance in rehearsal just two days before he died. He is now playing a part of "This is It" documentary that shows Jackson's rehearsal on June 23, 2009. Jackson died June 25, 2009.

5:37 p.m. ET: The video shows Jackson dancing all over the stage two days before his death.

5:40 p.m. ET: Putnam played another video of Jackson singing two days before his death.

5:47 p.m. ET: Putnam is playing a video of Jackson singing and dancing 12 hours before he died. Court has now recessed for a 15 minute break.

6:10 p.m. ET: Putnam has resumed his closing argument for AEG Live.

6:13 p.m. ET: Putnam is detailing Jackson's history with propofol. Jackson told multiple people that he used it multiple times from different doctors.

6:16 p.m. ET: "Adults are responsible for their own choices," said Putnam.

6:18 p.m. ET: Debbie Rowe told Jackson propofol was dangerous, but he did it anyway according to Putnam.

6:21 p.m. ET: Putnam said multiple doctors refused to give Jackson propofol, because it was such a dangerous drug.

6:23 p.m. ET: "Jackson was good at shopping for doctors," said Putnam.

6:26 p.m. ET: "Jackson cut uncooperative doctors out his life permanently," said Putnam.

6:28 p.m. ET: "Adults are responsible for their own choices," said Putnam for the second time.

6:33 p.m. ET: Putnam said Jackson asked another doctor to administer propofol to him in April 2009 just a few months before he died.

6:37 p.m. ET: "Mr. Jackson was bound and determined to get propofol," said Putnam. "Adults are responsible for their own choices."

6:40 p.m. ET: Putnam said the amount of damages the Jackson family is asking for is "ridiculous."

6:45 p.m. ET: Putnam said you have to base damages on "reality," and the amount of money the Jackson family is asking for is just "speculative."

6:50 p.m. ET: Putnam is explaining to the jurors that if they find Jackson himself was negligent and was a substantial factor in his own death then AEG Live should not be held liable.

6:53 p.m. ET: AEG Live never paid Murray according to Putnam. It seems like Putnam is wrapping up his closing argument.

6:57 p.m. ET: "Mr. Jackson was taking propofol long before Dr. Murray," said Putnam.

7:00 p.m. ET: Putnam finished his closing argument by asking the jurors to not find AEG Live responsible for Jackson's actions. The judge has told the parties to report back to the courtroom at 12:45 p.m. ET tomorrow.

-----------------------

some videos

[video=youtube_share;A5CWMWTtdd4]http://youtu.be/A5CWMWTtdd4[/video]

[video=youtube_share;sdCoAciUcQk]http://youtu.be/sdCoAciUcQk[/video]

[video=youtube_share;JGBo0VjI9RY]http://youtu.be/JGBo0VjI9RY[/video]

--------------------------

another set of videos

[video=youtube_share;y7F3X9J3fok]http://youtu.be/y7F3X9J3fok[/video]

[video=youtube_share;qzzSMO01Wtk]http://youtu.be/qzzSMO01Wtk[/video]