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Geraldo On Fox News now

It appears to me that Geraldo is taking the accidental angle. Think about it. Who would benefit from an accidental death and how....

AEG. And it would come through insurance.

I think what Geraldo is getting at is that if the stories about Michael missing rehearsals was true, then maybe AEG started doubting that Michael would make it through the 50 dates and whether this doctor was hired by them, I don't know, but nevertheless, Michael ends up dead. If the doctor is implicated in any way, he will say it was an accident, then AEG will get money from the insurance company. But why would they go through all of this just to get money? I don't think they needed money that bad. I really do believe that Phillips really wanted this tour. I don't feel Geraldo on this.

I think the doctor just dropped the ball. And oh, how big that ball was. It costs Michael his life.
 
prismsagainst5live said:
did they say there were any needle marks in his arm veins or other veins?
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They did say that was something which would be included as part of "trauma" to the body but none was found. hmmm.... I wonder if the coroner looked closely enuf in both autopsies. I would guess they did. If they did and no needle marks were found, then we can safely rule out injections of any kind. I wonder if the Jackson family's autopsy report will be different than the first.

Anyway, for now, IF there's no injection marks and no newly digested pills in his stomach...I would guess any medication situation would have come from the night before. Medically aware fans, please step up if you have any speculations to offer.
 
somebody is straight LYING! Now you got the ppl who saw michael in rehearsal the last days of his life. He's happy and healthy dancing great. Then you got fragil sad michael that you can break with a hug. Now miss castaway dude said that he last saw michael 2 months ago. Yet 3 months ago (march) when dermot 02 intro guy said michael was stronge and it surprised him. Somebody STRAIGHT LYING. Also...
Im take supposed leaked autopsy mess with a grain of salt. Also if michael would invite ppl over and when you got there the guard refused you, then WOULDN"T michael be wondering and looking for you to come? Wouldn't he call you and be like where you at? When you didn't show.

Im tired of the lies right about now. Also what I WANT to get cleared up once and for all is....

Did michael collapse? or did you just fourtinately FIND him on the bed with a light pulse? I really need that doctor to answer that. Where did collasping come from. i know frank told that story to marlon but where or who did frank get that from. Matter fact...where was frank when all this went down?

And don't get me started on cpr on a bed.
 
AllTheLovelyFlowers said:
It appears to me that Geraldo is taking the accidental angle. Think about it. Who would benefit from an accidental death and how....

AEG. And it would come through insurance.

I think what Geraldo is getting at is that if the stories about Michael missing rehearsals was true, then maybe AEG started doubting that Michael would make it through the 50 dates and whether this doctor was hired by them, I don't know, but nevertheless, Michael ends up dead. If the doctor is implicated in any way, he will say it was an accident, then AEG will get money from the insurance company. But why would they go through all of this just to get money? I don't think they needed money that bad. I really do believe that Phillips really wanted this tour. I don't feel Geraldo on this.

I think the doctor just dropped the ball. And oh, how big that ball was. It costs Michael his life.
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He did address your points about AEG being the beneficiary of an accidental death.

However, he also felt there were some ppl out there who could benefit from MJ being deceased...as well as some who felt he might be worth more deceased than alive to them. I cannot believe I'm having this conversation. :( This is so strange and unreal.
 
AllTheLovelyFlowers said:
It appears to me that Geraldo is taking the accidental angle. Think about it. Who would benefit from an accidental death and how....

AEG. And it would come through insurance.

I think what Geraldo is getting at is that if the stories about Michael missing rehearsals was true, then maybe AEG started doubting that Michael would make it through the 50 dates and whether this doctor was hired by them, I don't know, but nevertheless, Michael ends up dead. If the doctor is implicated in any way, he will say it was an accident, then AEG will get money from the insurance company. But why would they go through all of this just to get money? I don't think they needed money that bad. I really do believe that Phillips really wanted this tour. I don't feel Geraldo on this.

I think the doctor just dropped the ball. And oh, how big that ball was. It costs Michael his life.
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How do you figure AEG would get any money? If anything the insurance would pay AEG back the money for the refunds they'll have to give. So nobody gains anything, it's just in place so they don't actually lose that money.
 
wendy2004 said:
They did say that was something which would be included as part of "trauma" to the body but none was found. hmmm.... I wonder if the coroner looked closely enuf in both autopsies. I would guess they did. If they did and no needle marks were found, then we can safely rule out injections of any kind. I wonder if the Jackson family's autopsy report will be different than the first.

Anyway, for now, IF there's no injection marks and no newly digested pills in his stomach...I would guess any medication situation would have come from the night before. Medically aware fans, please step up if you have any speculations to offer.
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This what i want to see. I'm glad they got a second one and it took much longer to complete.
 
wendy2004 said:
He did address your points about AEG being the beneficiary of an accidental death.

However, he also felt there were some ppl out there who could benefit from MJ being deceased...as well as some who felt he might be worth more deceased than alive to them. I cannot believe I'm having this conversation. :( This is so strange and unreal.
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one word:

CATALOG:bugeyed
 
wendy2004 said:
They did say that was something which would be included as part of "trauma" to the body but none was found. hmmm.... I wonder if the coroner looked closely enuf in both autopsies. I would guess they did. If they did and no needle marks were found, then we can safely rule out injections of any kind. I wonder if the Jackson family's autopsy report will be different than the first.

Anyway, for now, IF there's no injection marks and no newly digested pills in his stomach...I would guess any medication situation would have come from the night before. Medically aware fans, please step up if you have any speculations to offer.
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Injection marks could also be from intramuscular injections, usually far less visible than intravenous marks; or even subcutaneous injections with very small gauge needles. But the whole "prescription meds" things leaves room for discussion, if toxicology reports come back showing meds that had been legitimately prescribed, be it pain meds or muscles relaxers, where does that come into play?

Plus surely there must have been at least a few if not many punctures sites found when emt's at house/in ambulance, or in ER by docs trying to gain IV access. How would the coroner be able to identify one puncture site from another and for what reason, especially considering the time lag between resus and autopsy?
 
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wendy2004 said:
He did address your points about AEG being the beneficiary of an accidental death.

However, he also felt there were some ppl out there who could benefit from MJ being deceased...as well as some who felt he might be worth more deceased than alive to them. I cannot believe I'm having this conversation. :( This is so strange and unreal.
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I read on newspaper that MJ told some friend that if he didn't perform, someone would kill him. could you verify this????????
Could the nations of Islam be the beneficiary?
-_-
 
^bologna to highest power. Michael was ret set and rearing to go. Crew members from rehearsals stories prove that. I believe it to. All those happy tweets from kenny. Please michael knew this was HIS time to shine and take the world by storm.
 
bgz said:
Injection marks could also be from intramuscular injections, usually far less visible than intravenous marks; or even subcutaneous injections with very small gauge needles. But the whole "prescription meds" things leaves room for discussion, if toxicology reports come back showing meds that had been legitimately prescribed, be it pain meds or muscles relaxers, where does that come into play?
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Maybe MJ was given something different than he would normally take. If he was complaining of not feeling well the night before, I'm wondering what DID the doctor do for him or give him, if anything, to help? And was it something MJ had taken before? Could this have been a "bad reaction" situation and not an overdose situation? Also, did the fact that MJ had not eaten work negatively against him in taking anything?

lilsusie said:
I read on newspaper that MJ told some friend that if he didn't perform, someone would kill him. could you verify this????????
Could the nations of Islam be the beneficiary?
-_-
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They didn't talk about that, but right now I say EVERYBODY is suspect. That's just me. They did mention the NOI but as far as I know the Nation has been around since the trial and have never kept MJ from seeing ppl he wanted to see. Even the fans who used to complain about not having access eventually had it...so I dunno. Who really knows. As far as whether someone killing MJ if he didn't perform...I may have missed it if they mentioned it. However, after reading an article that turned up last month where all MJs peeps were running their mouths, I can't say I'd blame him if he felt that way. After reading one of the articles, I was hearing the Godfather soundtrack in my head, that's how threatening it came across to me. I joked about it then, but thinking back on it now....wow. Question is this tho...why would MJ NOT perform? Why would they think he wouldn't? And why would Kenny and all the other ppl be twittering as to how great it was working with MJ if he honestly wasn't around to work with them?
 
I am becoming more open minded, bracing myself for the addiction theory to be true, it won't influence how I feel about Michael, he was so easily influenced and if someone said you need this pill he would have taken it, not knowing it could be addictive.

I always thought the Arvizo case was an elaborate set up, the mother talking to a civil lawyer 8 months before she even met Michael, Gavin's miraculous recovery from weeks away from death to cure, enter Bashir, the scene was set but they didn't bargain on the integrity of the jury or the Arvizo's lack of ability to keep the story together. And some of us feared that another, more efficient set up could happen in the future.

And here we have it, was Michael wanting to do this with the lure of enough money to pay off debts and be set for life? Enter Thome and suddenly people like Raymone and Grace terminated, good friends like Michael Stoller excluded, a doctor ingratiating himself and getting into his life, and if Michael needed some pills to help him have the energy to perform in front of Ortega well he took them.

This has a nasty smell about it, possibly, and I am bracing myself for the worst outcome, Michael ending up being blamed for his demise. Please god it will turn out to be a heart attack that nobody could have predicted, but I fear it could be shown that drug abuse caused it and he will be blamed and not people who may have deliberatly got him hooked.

I know Geraldo is all about creating cliff hangers and intruige, but when you see people like Grace, Oxman and Stoller who clearly loved and cared for Michael coming out now with their concerns you have to wonder. Pity they didn't go public before.
 
wendy2004 said:
They didn't talk about that, but right now I say EVERYBODY is suspect. That's just me. They did mention the NOI but as far as I know the Nation has been around since the trial and have never kept MJ from seeing ppl he wanted to see. Even the fans who used to complain about not having access eventually had it...so I dunno. Who really knows. As far as whether someone killing MJ if he didn't perform...I may have missed it if they mentioned it. However, after reading an article that turned up last month where all MJs peeps were running their mouths, I can't say I'd blame him if he felt that way. After reading one of the articles, I was hearing the Godfather soundtrack in my head, that's how threatening it came across to me. I joked about it then, but thinking back on it now....wow. Question is this tho...why would MJ NOT perform? Why would they think he wouldn't? And why would Kenny and all the other ppl be twittering as to how great it was working with MJ if he honestly wasn't around to work with them?
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I just realized I used the wrong smiley in my previous post. :/
okay, I'd rather his death be linked to his addiction than him being killed. :( I'm angry still thinking that no one is there to help him overcome his addiction!!!!
peeps running their mouth? you mean the AEG guy?
things is confusing...
 
I honestly was thinking "Murder" because so many people wanted Michael's money and wanted to profit from him and he was beginning to be worth lots more than he already was. I just can't see Michael making an accident like this. I can accept a nateral death better cause that would mean thai it was just his time to go but some how I feel like he was snatched form us.
 
the only thing that would make me me think it was something dodgy would be the whole timing of it. it just stinks so bad like it was all planned
 
ithink geraldo was getting to the point of mj was missing dates. only the f irst ten were really insured so if something were to happen, they'dbe covered. now they can dotribute concerts and make more money. so hence, he's worth more dead than alive.

im starting to deviate from the addition theory. how can he pass a physical, take care of his kids, practice and perform, and be as strong as the coroner said he was if he was an addict since the 80s?
 
Soso, I think you're right in deviating from the addiction story. There may have been some issues there - but there is no way that it could have been anything to the magnitude that alot of press are saying
 
cause he wasnt an addict. we all know he took painkillers and he was having issues with them through 93 and the early 00's but for the most part it was obviously controlled.he just took them regualry because of his health issues but this time something happened. maybe because of all the physical outgoings from rehearsal
 
Elusive, thank you for saying what I have been thinking. This is the only thing that makes me cry when it comes to Michael's death - this willingness to keep digging at him, trying to find something wrong with him. It's like even in death he cannot be because we have to keep picking away him. God!!
 
how and y would so many of his friends support this theory? even liza? if he was an addict and got clean for the shows or did have a problem but was clean now, then that would explaineveryone's stories BUT y seven bring it up?

so called friends want to be the ones who told the world about michael jackson and that's pathetic. they 'protected' him in life only to backstab him in death?
 
elusive moonwalker said:
cause he wasnt an addict. we all know he took painkillers and he was having issues with them through 93 and the early 00's but for the most part it was obviously controlled.he just took them regualry because of his health issues but this time something happened. maybe because of all the physical outgoings from rehearsal
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yeah - I think that's pretty much it. something just went wrong
 
how many were actually friends though. i mean how many times in a year did liza she mj. theres to many ppl who say they are friends and they are lucky if they saw mj once every 3 years. i call ppl like mark friends who talked to him all the time on the phone and would fly out and see him every few months
 
wendy2004 said:
Maybe MJ was given something different than he would normally take. If he was complaining of not feeling well the night before, I'm wondering what DID the doctor do for him or give him, if anything, to help? And was it something MJ had taken before? Could this have been a "bad reaction" situation and not an overdose situation? Also, did the fact that MJ had not eaten work negatively against him in taking anything?



They didn't talk about that, but right now I say EVERYBODY is suspect. That's just me. They did mention the NOI but as far as I know the Nation has been around since the trial and have never kept MJ from seeing ppl he wanted to see. Even the fans who used to complain about not having access eventually had it...so I dunno. Who really knows. As far as whether someone killing MJ if he didn't perform...I may have missed it if they mentioned it. However, after reading an article that turned up last month where all MJs peeps were running their mouths, I can't say I'd blame him if he felt that way. After reading one of the articles, I was hearing the Godfather soundtrack in my head, that's how threatening it came across to me. I joked about it then, but thinking back on it now....wow. Question is this tho...why would MJ NOT perform? Why would they think he wouldn't? And why would Kenny and all the other ppl be twittering as to how great it was working with MJ if he honestly wasn't around to work with them?
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Kenny Ortega is not some shady director/Hollywood hanger on. He is someone who has worked extensively with Michael before; therefore, he knew Michael's behavior in planning for concerts and he stated that he was going full force with this project. He didn't just start saying this. His blog made reference throughout. AEG stood to make millions from these concerts; they were going to take care of Michael. And even if they thought Michael wasn't going through with the concerts, a lawsuit would have put them in better position than insurance claims because they would have had the standing with a signed contract. But, there is nothing but silling rumors from the same people who have always put out silly rumors that Michael did not want to do these concerts.

The other thing that is weird is this "he was not eating" bit. Again, not jiving with those who were credible and actually in the know.

I wonder why the doctor even went into the bedroom in the first place; was it routine for him to go check on him or had he checked on him during the night?
 
Shouldn't everyone just wait to see what Michael's family find out via the autopsy that THEY'VE requested on their own?

And about MJ possibly missing some rehearsals...

Michael his been a professional entertainer since he was five years old. Many of the songs that were going to be included in "This Is It" Michael has danced to many times before. He knows his routines. If anyone would have to get up to speed, it would be the backup dancers. Before Michael would be able to get in there and practice with them, they first would have to learn most of the routines. It would not make since for Michael to immediately start rehearsing with them if they are not prepared to keep up with him. Get it?

Spare yourselves the additional hurt. Do not try to work with information that is coming for those that do not have access to MJ's body. Wait for real answers.

Also, wait to see how MJ's family is reacting. If it turns out that MJ is gone due to natural causes, his family will show signs of that through their demeanor. They will still miss him very much, but will also be able to accept his leaving a little better.

If it turns out that it was not natural causes, their demeanor will possibly reflect that and I am saying possibly, because the Jacksons are a very private family and they have worked very hard to have some privacy because they have spent much of their lives in front of cameras. They are trying to stay strong not only for themselves, but also for Michael.

Also, be selective while following the news coverage. Guard your minds and grieving hearts by not taking in too much. When it comes to the panel discussions, you have to tune out some of them. If certain individuals are on them that you know always make you feel miserable, change the channel.

Take care of yourselves. Be good to yourselves.
 
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I'm not doubting some people's friendship but there is a difference in seeing Michael and talking to him perhaps on the phone. I think that what could be happening is knowledge of some use of painkillers or medications combined with a previously admitted dependency (though long ago) combined with media reports.

What's interesting is that Lionel Richie never once seemed concerned or mentioned concern about him doing the concerts and he talked about him being in contact with him recently. I don't think Richie would have spent time talking him into getting back on stage if he had an inkling that he was abusing; perhaps a get your act together first and then get on stage but he never alludes to that.

Elizabeth Taylor was one that apparently had not problems confronting him about such things. Wasn't it her that helped him previously? I have a hard time believing that she couldn't just look or just hear his voice and not know. And I have a hard time believing that she wouldn't have went after this if a problem.

I think what the media has to acknowledge is the rate that prescriptions are given out now; I've heard of people taking 6-10 different prescribed medications because a prescription is given for almost everything now. So, responsibly, he could be taking lots of medicine but could be for reasons other than he had to fulfill his addictive cravings. Also, Michael had vitiligo; some of these pharmacy costs that they keep dangling out there could have been related to what is needed for that. There are some conditions that require medicine that is extremely expensive and we have no idea in terms of insurance;so if he was paying full price, it would be easy to see these costs for medicines.
 
AllForMJ said:
Shouldn't everyone just wait to see what Michael's family find out via the autopsy that THEY'VE requested on their own?

And about MJ possibly missing some rehearsals...

Michael his been a professional entertainer since he was five years old. Many of the songs that were going to be included in "This Is It" Michael has danced to many times before. He knows his routines. If anyone would have to get up to speed, it would be the backup dancers. Before Michael would be able to get in there and practice with them, they first would have to learn the routines. It would not make since for Michael to immediately start rehearsing with them if they are not prepared to keep up with him. Get it?
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Exactly. And again by accounts of those actually there, Michael was busy with all aspects of this so every moment or day would not have been spent dancing.
 
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