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Controversial MJ Documentary Leaving Neverland [GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD]

Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

KOPV said:
Yes well of course that's the argument, that a victim could just not have come to term with..

My argument is an individual cannot be "unaware" and have "no perspective on it" yet be "coached" and live in "fear"..

Humans dont feel pain over events they are oblivious to.. he had no perspective and was unaware that it was "abuse "until 2012.

So what was Michael coaching him about?
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Clearly you are talking to an internet troll or hater who just want to believe MJ was guilty (too bad. That poster view will never make it so).
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

^ either way people would make it about Michaels 'guilt'.. The film got a standing ovation because it was THAT good, and people left because it was THAT horrifying and hard to deal with.

They will not report it as, they thought it was BS so they walked.
 
G-B_24;4241316 said:
Looks like people walked out during that Sundance premier. Wonder why it was never reported lol:

https://thecurvyfilmcritic.com/sundance-19-finding-neverland-unearths-mj-sexual-allegations/
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Good article and great questions in the comment section:
Whilst at the Sundance Fest, did you perhaps see the film ‘Untouchable’ about Harvey Weinstein? HW who has been accused of sexually abusing a person whilst at Sundance a few years before and is a friend of the Sundance founders. Where you aware that Leaving Neverland was brought in at a last-minute submission? Only to detract from the HW film is my guess… I mean who is talking about that? A film about a man accused of abuse by dozens and dozens of women and whereby it’s BEEN PROVEN.
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Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

How come I have not even seen ONE mention of this Doc lol.

That is crazy.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

The amazing thing in the US.

Actors and actresses all knew what was going on with Harvey. They would even crack jokes on air before it all came out about Harvey.

YET NOBODY DID ANYTHING ABOUT IT.

It's ok to attack Mj though.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Harvey Winestine, Woody Allen, Jerry Lee Lewis... The list continues!


The selective attacks and selective "muting" is the biggest evil behind it all.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

KOPV said:
Harvey Winestine, Woody Allen, Jerry Lee Lewis... The list continues!


The selective attacks and selective "muting" is the biggest evil behind it all.
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It's different if you're black. And like the quote said, he turned too many tables.
 
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ozemouze;4241318 said:
Good article and great questions in the comment section:

Whilst at the Sundance Fest, did you perhaps see the film ‘Untouchable’ about Harvey Weinstein? HW who has been accused of sexually abusing a person whilst at Sundance a few years before and is a friend of the Sundance founders. Where you aware that Leaving Neverland was brought in at a last-minute submission? Only to detract from the HW film is my guess… I mean who is talking about that? A film about a man accused of abuse by dozens and dozens of women and whereby it’s BEEN PROVEN.
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If they are purposefully using MJ to detract attention from Weinstein, then maybe we should make some noise about that. Let's bring attention back on Weinstein every time he tries to use MJ, let's make sure people know they're just trying to use MJ to cover the real abusers. Let's make sure people realize how absurb it is to focus on someone who has been dead for 10 years and is unable to harm anyone while there are real pedophiles out there, abusing children right now as we speak, but nobody is talking about them, because everybody is too busy talking about Michael Jackson.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

ChrisC said:
It's different if you're black. And like the quote said, he turned too many tables.
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That's exactly the point I was trying to make! And its issues like this when someone white says "slavery is over, get over it" shows the true ignorance to what racism has done, does, and to the fact it still exists.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

KOPV said:
That's exactly the point I was trying to make! And its issues like this when someone white says "slavery is over, get over it" shows the true ignorance to what racism has done, does, and to the fact it still exists.
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Yes and remember MJ said something like " The bigger the celebretie the bigger the target."
MJ is a much bigger Celebretie then Harvey AND he is black AND he can't defend himself with telling his part of the story.
Additionally there will never be a courtcase where he can be aquitted from the accusations.
 
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Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

etoile 37 said:
If they are purposefully using MJ to detract attention from Weinstein, then maybe we should make some noise about that. Let's bring attention back on Weinstein every time he tries to use MJ, let's make sure people know they're just trying to use MJ to cover the real abusers. Let's make sure people realize how absurb it is to focus on someone who has been dead for 10 years and is unable to harm anyone while there are real pedophiles out there, abusing children right now as we speak, but nobody is talking about them, because everybody is too busy talking about Michael Jackson.
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I've been tempted to do that also....tweet about Weinstein. BUt I have refrained from doing so because we could end up shooting ourselves in our own foot. Remember that right now, there are "just allegations" against Weinstein. He's gonna have a trial, but he hasn't been convicted yet. So if we start a campaign against him, how can we demand people to treat MJ "innocent until proven guilty" if we judge Weinstein ourselves based on things we have read and heard in the media? I'm pretty sure Weinstein's guilty and will be found guilty but to be honest...I haven't done any research really....so all I know is what I have read in the papers. And we know how that goes.....So as tempting as it is...we need to be careful. We can mention that there are allegations and that he will have a trial, but we shouldn't judge. And I was tempted to say how the media isn't talking about him or the upcoming trial....but then did a Google search...and yes they are talking about him. However, to us it may seem like they aren't because all we search for is MJ related news and tweets. You will find what you focus on. That's why it seems to us that EVERYONE and ALL media is talking about the mockumentary and bashing MJ but that's not true. Also, a lot of peple don't even know about the mockumentary. That's why I said that we shouldn't do more PR for it by posting the name in a hashtag and dates when it will air and anything like that. The less we can mention it, the better. Just keep posting facts and keep posting MJ's music and pictures and videos and nice stories about him and anything else pro-MJ you can think of. Positive stuff.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

summer said:
I've been tempted to do that also....tweet about Weinstein. BUt I have refrained from doing so because we could end up shooting ourselves in our own foot. Remember that right now, there are "just allegations" against Weinstein. He's gonna have a trial, but he hasn't been convicted yet. So if we start a campaign against him, how can we demand people to treat MJ "innocent until proven guilty" if we judge Weinstein ourselves based on things we have read and heard in the media? I'm pretty sure Weinstein's guilty and will be found guilty but to be honest...I haven't done any research really....so all I know is what I have read in the papers. And we know how that goes.....So as tempting as it is...we need to be careful. We can mention that there are allegations and that he will have a trial, but we shouldn't judge. And I was tempted to say how the media isn't talking about him or the upcoming trial....but then did a Google search...and yes they are talking about him. However, to us it may seem like they aren't because all we search for is MJ related news and tweets. You will find what you focus on. That's why it seems to us that EVERYONE and ALL media is talking about the mockumentary and bashing MJ but that's not true. Also, a lot of peple don't even know about the mockumentary. That's why I said that we shouldn't do more PR for it by posting the name in a hashtag and dates when it will air and anything like that. The less we can mention it, the better. Just keep posting facts and keep posting MJ's music and pictures and videos and nice stories about him and anything else pro-MJ you can think of. Positive stuff.
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First, there is a tape where Weinstein is with a woman in New York. Second, the point is about accusation and yet Weinstein is not treat no where near the way MJ was treated. MJ has been through the system, given a verdict, FBI investigation yet MJ is the one still talked about on the front page while Weinstein is not and MJ is dealing with two proven liars and MJ is gone . That is what the problem.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Hey when did wade start working with the 'Children's Justice Center' again? Wasnt it after he started allegations?


PS. it may have been shared but I overlooked it if it has been shared but in Dance Teacher magazine there is a whole article dedicated to Wade and his 'journey' and it discusses Michael of course.


And obviously he incrimnates himself again with sentiments of Michael pushing him, training him in dance.. meanwhile we have chains of letters his mother pushing Wade on Michael and so on.
 
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Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Was this posted already? I have tried to go through each page. I send this to people who don't know much. Feels like the absolute best video I have seen in regards to Wade. Well done video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgSbSotJgUY
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

G-B_24 said:
Was this posted already? I have tried to go through each page. I send this to people who don't know much. Feels like the absolute best video I have seen in regards to Wade. Well done video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgSbSotJgUY
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It has a thread of its own and surely have been mentioned in this thread - but it can not be posted too many times :)


http://www.mjjcommunity.com/forum/threads/142396-Wade-Robson-The-Real-Story-(Documentary)
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

G-B_24 said:
Was this posted already? I have tried to go through each page. I send this to people who don't know much. Feels like the absolute best video I have seen in regards to Wade. Well done video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgSbSotJgUY
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I hope the team behind this will produce a part two soon. It whould be great when they whould pin a few other good videos under this video or a playlist/collection.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Good to hear so many people left during the film. I think atleast Wade has made what will in the long run turn out to be the biggest mistake in his life. They talk trash about a dead man, draw the attention away from real cases of abuse, have their 15 minutes of fame and then... nothing. People will be very sceptical to work with him in the future.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

La74 said:
Good to hear so many people left during the film. I think atleast Wade has made what will in the long run turn out to be the biggest mistake in his life. They talk trash about a dead man, draw the attention away from real cases of abuse, have their 15 minutes of fame and then... nothing. People will be very sceptical to work with him in the future.
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Wade careers was going downhill already. It wont make a difference. I think most people will believe he is a true victim as well, and get sympati. In the end I dont think this will affect his career in a negative way, unless we have a bombshell discovery of his fraud by the mainstream media.

And the mainstream media uncovering something in Michaels favor is as likely as falling out a of boat at sea without hitting the water.....
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

I am encouraged by Taj's update about the documentary in terms of it being bigger and better than what we expect. That may of course be him trying to big it up as much as he can but we'll see. It has got me thinking about what it could include that makes it more than just an extended version of the Real Wade Robson YouTube doc. We know Michael had lots of home videos. I wonder if these would be incorporated into it. Maybe there is even footage of Michael talking about the allegations himself. If Taj lived with Michael during the trial maybe he has some footage himself?
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

terrell said:
Like I said, they know it a lie but they do not care because they are hoping it brings in $$$$ Neflix is whipping them.
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Yep! Gotta love that little reference the estate makes to competitors of HBO, haha. Apparently the documentary division of HBO used to be proper, well that has ended here.

Erandi said:
I think that, sooner or later, his conscience will catch up with him. I don't know why, but I have a feeling that his future will turn out very sombre, everything will go downhill for him. And he did this to himself...I can understand Jordy to a certain degree, say he was a kid and his parents brainwashed him into doing it, but Wade and the other idiot are adults who invented this whole story themselves. Will the money they get out of this satisfy them in the end?!
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Maybe, but never believe for a second he's gonna back down now. This asshole is going to milk this cow as much as possible now. Both aren't dumb guys I would assume, and they know damn well wtf they are doing to Michael as a person in the general public's opinion and his legacy. They know damn well under how much scrutiny MJ was for years on end, they know damn well how it absolutely devastated MJ from inside and how it eventually got him killed basically.

Yet they press on with this. I hope karma really exists. I hope they rot in hell. Not sure if there's a hell so realistically speaking I hope they fail to have a decent career after all this.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

The Estate should hack MJfacts and wipe them/he/she of this earth for good! Its a travesty they get like a million views on youtube spreading false information and purposely misleading the public! Whoever is behind them is disgrace to humanity and must be very sick individuals. There is no meaning in engaging with them, as their primary purpose in life is hating Michael Jackson and mocking his fans!
 
Staffordshire Bullterrier;4241367 said:
Yep! Gotta love that little reference the estate makes to competitors of HBO, haha. Apparently the documentary division of HBO used to be proper, well that has ended here.



Maybe, but never believe for a second he's gonna back down now. This asshole is going to milk this cow as much as possible now. Both aren't dumb guys I would assume, and they know damn well wtf they are doing to Michael as a person in the general public's opinion and his legacy. They know damn well under how much scrutiny MJ was for years on end, they know damn well how it absolutely devastated MJ from inside and how it eventually got him killed basically.

Yet they press on with this. I hope karma really exists. I hope they rot in hell. Not sure if there's a hell so realistically speaking I hope they fail to have a decent career after all this.
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In my opinion what it takes for people to beleive them is that it is a person who knows very little or nothing to begin with. That is a person who is not very interested in Michael Jackson but still interested enough to watch a 4 hour "documentary" but not interested enough to take a few minutes googling. So people who are atleast over 50 years old (don´t mean to offend anyone) and had their mind made up a long time ago, people who are very narrowminded or already hate Michael Jackson or real victims who just can`t image that somebody would lie about something like this. People in the industry though must know that Wade testified for the defense at the age of 23 and only "realized he was abused" at age 30 after he didn´t ge the job for a tribute show or if they don´t know it then you are going to hire somebody for a job then you must do some recearch about that persons background.
 
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Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Could someone give me a link to the Safechuck case and his credability
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

I've just watched the 1993 Oprah interview and they mention and show a bed in the Neverland cinema, is this what Wade was refering to as "secret bedrooms"
 
terrell;4241349 said:
Second, the point is about accusation and yet Weinstein is not treat no where near the way MJ was treated. MJ has been through the system, given a verdict, FBI investigation yet MJ is the one still talked about on the front page while Weinstein is not and MJ is dealing with two proven liars and MJ is gone . That is what the problem.
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Yep, the point is not about Weinstein being guilty or not, but why the focus suddenly shifted almost entirely to MJ instead of a media mogul still living and waiting for his trial.

Makes you wonder why LN was a last-minute addition at Sundance where Untouchable had been already scheduled (Leaving Neverland was a surprise late addition to the lineup, announced only two weeks before the festival kicked off. observer.com), as it's a bit too convenient.

Isn't it strange that you don't hear a lot of talk about Untouchable, while tabloids having a field day with LN that has been already sold to a lot of TV channels.

And there's the fact the Weinstein does have the power and relations to generate distraction from his case - he had done it before (and he's particularly used MJ among others before):
Keeping the Media Close
Shortly after the news investigations of Mr. Weinstein’s alleged abuse were published, A. J. Benza, a former New York Daily News gossip columnist, received a two-word text from the producer: “Help me.” [...]

Mr. Benza, then between jobs, had a suggestion. “I could supply your P.R. girls with a lot of gossip — a lot of stories — and if people come at them with the ‘Harvey’s having an affair story,’ they can barter,” Mr. Benza recalled telling Mr. Weinstein. “He said, ‘A. J., it’s got to be good stories,’ and I said, ‘Don’t you worry about it.’”

Collecting a monthly retainer, Mr. Benza said, he reported items on Roger Clemens, Michael Jackson and others and sent them to Mr. Weinstein’s communications team, though he didn’t know whether they were used to trade away stories about the producer.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/12/05/us/harvey-weinstein-complicity.html
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Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Lightbringer said:
The Estate should hack MJfacts and wipe them/he/she of this earth for good! Its a travesty they get like a million views on youtube spreading false information and purposely misleading the public! Whoever is behind them is disgrace to humanity and must be very sick individuals. There is no meaning in engaging with them, as their primary purpose in life is hating Michael Jackson and mocking his fans!
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I really wonder that a site like this and its YouTube channel could exist since over 5 years now.
It seames that the estate and the Jackson Family (or friends of Michael who are preseted there as Michaels lovers and liears like Mac C. or Bread B.) did nothing seriously against it. It semed that they don't care about this in the last years
(I think with copyright strikes or other activities it whould have been easy to delate the videos).
Now this mistake takes its revange in 2019 in the time of LN.
But its not the only channel who did such videos in the last years or is active in this now. There are other channels, videos, (and sites) linked on the channelpage from MJfacts.
 
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