Controversial MJ Documentary Leaving Neverland [GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD]

Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

I didn't follwed the Me too movement much but as far as I understood it, MJ is the first and only dead (absolutly defeceless) man who is accused of a sexual crime since this movement exists.
Or were there other dead men who were accused since the movement existed?

Its also intresting that MJ was accused since 2013 puplicly from Wade (and James) before the movement even existed and had its name.

please search more about this allegations before posting this comment, at least read the communicated from the Estate .
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

I didn't follwed the Me too movement much but as far as I understood it, MJ is the first and only dead (absolutly defeceless) man who is accused of a sexual crime since this movement exists.
Or were there other dead men who were accused since the movement exists?

Its also interesting that MJ was accused since 2013 puplicly from Wade (and James) before the movement even existed and had its name.

If you are replying to my post then please go back and read it again. There has been TONS of men who have been accused of all kinds of thing due to the #MeToo movement. Some are legit accusations, I'm sure, but I have seen a LOT of EXTREMELY RIDICILOUS cases, which have sadly lead to people losing their jobs and their reputations being destroyed anyhow. I am for JUSTICE, period. And that includes men's rights too. Their right to be protected from ANY random person being allowed to make any kind of ridicilous claims, often untrue claims, and destroying their careers and reputations. That is making bullying and extortion acceptable and I won't stand for it. In Michael's case the difference is that he is dead and unable to defend himself. And that he is more famous than anyone else on this planet, so there is a huge public interest in anything MJ related, the more scandalous, the better. I would never defend anyone if there was evidence that they harmed another person. There has been not ONE piece of evidence to prove MJ did anything wrong. And I've been around since 1987. I've done my research. There's nothing. There is however a lot of evidence against the accusers showing how unreliable and shady they are.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

If you are replying to my post then please go back and read it again. There has been TONS of men who have been accused of all kinds of thing due to the #MeToo movement. Some are legit accusations, I'm sure, but I have seen a LOT of EXTREMELY RIDICILOUS cases, which have sadly lead to people losing their jobs and their reputations being destroyed anyhow. I am for JUSTICE, period. And that includes men's rights too. Their right to be protected from ANY random person being allowed to make any kind of ridicilous claims, often untrue claims, and destroying their careers and reputations. That is making bullying and extortion acceptable and I won't stand for it. In Michael's case the difference is that he is dead and unable to defend himself. And that he is more famous than anyone else on this planet, so there is a huge public interest in anything MJ related, the more scandalous, the better. I would never defend anyone if there was evidence that they harmed another person. There has been not ONE piece of evidence to prove MJ did anything wrong. And I've been around since 1987. I've done my research. There's nothing. There is however a lot of evidence against the accusers showing how unreliable and shady they are.
Hm..... I think you the person above absolutly understood my post wrong or the point I wanted to make.
Maybe because I am not the best in english...
I simply wanted to know: Were there any other dead persons besides of MJ who were accused in the Me Too movement?
Cause when MJ is the only one until today I think its something special.
 
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Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Michael may be the first dead celebrity that has been attacked under the #metoo movement era (maybe not) but for sure the first with this type of name behind him. let's just not forget that it isnt then first time in history and never forget the story of Emmet Till speak loudly with paralels To michael.

The media has been playing it safe with Michael since #metoo considering the sensitive nature of his death.. Everyone looking at everyone else to "break the seal". Now that this director broke it, others are jumping on like leeches.. almost like when people want to make jokes but it's not In good taste because its "too soon?" (Looking around the room to see if its ok)

(Now it's ok again to defame Michael Jackson) and that's thanks to Dan Reed!
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

I see this so called Jermaine "defence " and i utterly cringe every time i see it. He made MJ out to be a "weirdo" AGAIN. I detest this man with a passion and imo all he cares about is the money drying up if people boycott MJ's music. Never mind Word to the Badd he was also quoted saying he thinks the allegations could possibly have been true. I do not believe they are true of course but this man is a leech of the highest order. He is a has been or should i say a never was . Adopting the same mannerisms and speech patterns , things if you look back in time he was NOT like. I support a rebuttal but its only going to be called biased . Especially in this new movement. Any "rebuttal" has to come from NON family members because lets face it MJ hated his family apart from his mother.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

p.s i was talking about the recent interview with Piers Morgan
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

The rebuttle documentary will help for sure, while there will be people that say its bias.The majority will see the non family members speak, evidence will actually be presented and will squash any "story".

When Dan Reed presents a note as a molestation grooming tool and others show the same note sent to them and wasnt sexual at all.. it will only highlight that THEY lied.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Taj explained it yesterday in the long episode of the MJcast (which more people should listen to) why they want to make this documentery themself.
They simply won't trust any journalist!
In the past when the family gave interviews for the tv or documenterys the jounalysts mostly edited the interviews, twisted their words and in 99 percent the MJDocumentery turned out to be a bad one which was not suportive for MJ or his legecy.
Last year I watched many of the documenterys which camed out in the last years and I didn't like a single one cause they always seamed to make MJ look bad as much as possible and to carry on the strange picture in some kind of way the media always tried to crate of MJ.
I really can understand the family and I am glad that they do the documentery on their own where they have the full controle of the footage the puplic will see.
This documentery is very important and they can't risk to give it in hands which turned out to be the wrong ones like it was in 2003 with Bashit!
Imagine something like this whould happen now again!
 
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Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

The rebuttle documentary will help for sure, while there will be people that say its bias.The majority will see the non family members speak, evidence will actually be presented and will squash any "story".

When Dan Reed presents a note as a molestation grooming tool and others show the same note sent to them and wasnt sexual at all.. it will only highlight that THEY lied.

That's why I said we should start collectng every single note us fans ever got from MJ and put them on one website so that we are ready to immediately fight back once it airs. Take the notes from the film and put them next to the notes we got to show MJ wrote the same things for everyone and it was just him being loving and kind and it's nothing "shockng" or "sinister". We got plenty of faxes through MJProductions from Michael as well. If anyone saved those, please post. Maybe we could start a thread with only notes and faxes from MJ that he sent to fans?

Taj explained it yesterday in the long episode of the MJcast (which more people should listen to) why they want to make this documentery themself.
They simply won't trust any journalist!
In the past when the family gave interviews for the tv or documenterys the jounalysts mostly edited the interviews, twisted their words and in 99 percent the MJDocumentery turned out to be a bad one which was not suportive for MJ or his legecy.
Last year I watched many of the documenterys which camed out in the last years and I didn't like a single one cause they always seamed to make MJ look bad as much as possible and to carry on the strange picture in some kind of way the media always tried to crate of MJ.
I really can understand the family and I am glad that they do the documentery on their own.
This documentery is very important and they can't risk to give it in hands which turned out to be the wrong ones like it was in 2003 with Bashit!
Imagine something like this whould happen now again!

There are a lot of really great and talented fans that could help Taj with the documentary. There are tons of things fans can help him with, but especially with research. There are so many of us with a common goal, that's our biggest asset. All of us make great observations and can point out flaws and contradictions or something that is important and relevant if someone else didn't notice or forgets to mention it. There's strength in numbers.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

I just got done finishing that mjcast podcast about the allegations.. my favorite part (aside from hearing taj saying hed going big with this docuseries) is that we need to approach this by not proving Michael's innocence but proving the allegations to be lies.

It's TRUE what they said, we cant prove a negitive - we can only prove a positive.. we cant convince people what we all cant see but we can prove what we can.

I'm really going to try to take this approach, even going as far as saying "I'm listening, since I cant prove Michael is innocent, proved me that he isnt"..

Than rebuttle being killing each story that person says one by one. Just proving them wrong instead of proving ourselves right.
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="de"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">One of the most requested birthday party themes is a Michael Jackson themed Birthday Party. &#128519; You can try to bring him down all you want <a href="https://twitter.com/danreed1000?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@danreed1000</a> but from the age of 4 to 84 <a href="https://twitter.com/michaeljackson?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@michaeljackson</a> IS TRULY GLOBAL AND TRULY FOREVER &#10084;&#65039;&#10084;&#65039;&#10084;&#65039; and children love him the most &#128522;&#128519;&#129395; <a href="https://t.co/r2PfTSr7iw">pic.twitter.com/r2PfTSr7iw</a></p>&mdash; TheWigSnatcher (@TheWigSnatcher1) <a href="https://twitter.com/TheWigSnatcher1/status/1090715950125600768?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">30. Januar 2019</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="de"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">RT DEBUNKING Leaving Neverland Bullsh*ttery - Lie by Lie .. Lie #1 &quot;It's Not About the Money&quot; <a href="https://t.co/cwoVh6blBr">https://t.co/cwoVh6blBr</a> The MJ Innocent Project -- <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/MichaelJackson?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#MichaelJackson</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/WadeRobson?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#WadeRobson</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/LeavingNeverland?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#LeavingNeverland</a> EXPOSED <a href="https://t.co/VhRhYrEKYW">pic.twitter.com/VhRhYrEKYW</a></p>&mdash; MJJJusticeProject (@MJJJusticePrjct) <a href="https://twitter.com/MJJJusticePrjct/status/1092192344617545728?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">3. Februar 2019</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="de"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">If defending <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/MichaelJackson?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#MichaelJackson</a> doesn't make you a warrior at heart nothing will because this is one of the toughest things that we may ever do. But it's ok, stay strong. our voices united are more powerful than any faked evidence that they claim to have. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/warriorsforMJ?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#warriorsforMJ</a> <a href="https://t.co/mhbA8kIu03">pic.twitter.com/mhbA8kIu03</a></p>&mdash; misstee cotton (@missteecotton) <a href="https://twitter.com/missteecotton/status/1091520747393167360?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">2. Februar 2019</a></blockquote>
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Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Theres enough evidence on sneddon from back during the mjjf days when they did several interviews with gary dunlop dr sundaram. Two sisters that were set up by sneddon and a couple of other men also several independent witness who heard sneddon making several racist comments about mj and what he was going to do to him during a political fundraiser.

Back in the day matt tiabi (sp) who worked at i think nbc was planning on doing a big investigational peice (documentry) on sneddon. Not just concerning mj but all the other people he has persecuted in santa B. The big wigs at the channel stopped him from doing it. Maybe worth looking him up?
I think the documentary should deifinetely include this as well because I think atleast some people think it was credible because the 2005 case went to trial and they were not interested enough to check it up for them self.
 
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Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

I find it sad, sad, sad, that young journalists of today or the young social justice warriors are nothing like the people I grew up admiring in the 70's. When I came of age, everyone wanted to be a journalist because of the great work they were doing. Now it's only opinionated blogs and no research.
Unfortunately "respectful media" also failed MJ even in his lifetime, they often printed so blatant (and even illogical) lies copying word by word from tabloids, there was basically no difference (except for only a few).

Though it's not only about MJ, let's take the trial for example: mass media traveled there to report on the case, and although they could find the sings that several cases of malicious prosecution could had happened there (apart from MJ's), none of them took the opportunity to investigate the situation further and break a story which is much more important and bigger than a simple celebrity case (talk about journalistic responsibility...).

Her article was biased embarrassment to herself, "let go" "got off"
If she really believes it then why doesn't she challenge the authorities who were responsible by letting this happen? There goes her credibility...
 
ozemouze;4239787 said:
Unfortunately "respectful media" also failed MJ even in his lifetime, they often printed so blatant (and even illogical) lies copying word by word from tabloids, there was basically no difference (except for only a few).

Though it's not only about MJ, let's take the trial for example: mass media traveled there to report on the case, and although they could find the sings that several cases of malicious prosecution could had happened there (apart from MJ's), none of them took the opportunity to investigate the situation further and break a story which is much more important and bigger than a simple celebrity case (talk about journalistic responsibility...).


If she really believes it then why doesn't she challenge the authorities who were responsible by letting this happen? There goes her credibility...
Exactly. I attempted to give Aphrodite Jones the opportunity to break that story but she wasn&#8217;t interested but ofcourse what I actually sent her was a email with examples from William Wagner and he wasn&#8217;t that credible. I&#8217;m guessing Trish did the interviews for mjjf.
 
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="de"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Thank you <a href="https://twitter.com/ChingyFulldekk?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@ChingyFulldekk</a> for these kind worlds about Michael Jackson! Cc <a href="https://twitter.com/tajjackson3?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@tajjackson3</a> <a href="https://t.co/itjYQyRQdO">pic.twitter.com/itjYQyRQdO</a></p>&mdash; Spooky Black&#128065;*&#128488; (@EpicL86) <a href="https://twitter.com/EpicL86/status/1091006973053673472?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">31. Januar 2019</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="de"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Ryan White's mom's memories of Michael Jackson in 2009 disprove just about every lie told in Leaving Neverland. Please RT. <a href="https://t.co/M0pwPRB4Tn">https://t.co/M0pwPRB4Tn</a></p>&mdash; andjustice4some (@andjustice4some) <a href="https://twitter.com/andjustice4some/status/1092472178480603136?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">4. Februar 2019</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="de"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">I wonder if <a href="https://twitter.com/Channel4?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@Channel4</a> and <a href="https://twitter.com/HBO?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@HBO</a> will be providing councillors to households nationwide for Leaving Neverland’s ‘distressing content’ or are those theatrics only reserved for journalists at Sundance to help you push this trash film’s ‘must see’ agenda?! And the Oscar goes to...</p>&mdash; Pez Jax (@Pezjax) <a href="https://twitter.com/Pezjax/status/1092471374055124992?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">4. Februar 2019</a></blockquote>
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In these depressing and frustrating times, where it feels like it&#8217;s 1993 as the same old lies are trotted out again and again but journalists who refuse to listen to facts or carry out any reasearch I got into my car at 7.10am to go to work. Turned on bbc Radio 2 breakfast show (the number one radio show in th UK) and there&#8217;s Michael singing Off The Wall. And you know what, all of this shit will fade, the media will find new click bait, the journalists who lie will pass away, but Michael and his music will go on forever.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Although it's early in this fight, it was pleasing to see Michael Jackson's music booming out to a packed stadium in Atlanta and a television audience of 170 million yesterday.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Just some thoughts about the proposed documentary - I was thinking about the Netflix series The Making of a Murderer. What I thought was clever about that series was how it set up a cliff hanger at the end of each episode. I never would have believed that I would have been so hooked on a documentary series but certain techniques such as the cliff hanger will ensure people will keep watching.

In fact I would even suggest borrowing the title of that series as it has become a euphemism for needing to question the apparent truth. It could almost be marketed as a sequel to that successful series - The Making of a Child Abuser.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Isn't there any sort of nice clean website out there with links to each item that MJ was attacked with? 1 website you could always direct the incompetents to?
 
ChrisC;4239793 said:
Although it's early in this fight, it was pleasing to see Michael Jackson's music booming out to a packed stadium in Atlanta and a television audience of 170 million yesterday.

It really is a testament to MJs talent that through it all his music and gift is still enjoyed by so many.

Other artists would have been destroyed by this, as was Evan’s original plan, but MJ is still stood strong.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Well this documentary will fit well on Channel 4. Remember this is the station that bought you Married to the Eiffel Tower, My Granny the Escort and The Man with the 10 stone testicles. Yep the Channel that made a documentary about Jonny Kennedy who had a tragic skin condition that caused his skin to detach. And what was this show sensitivily and compassionately titled?.....The Boy Whose Skin Fell Off. Says it all really.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

I still cant get over how anyone could buy that these stories.. to believe that two guys didnt know through therr adult life 18-20s that anal rape is sexually immoral is WAY too unbelievable to me. Especially considering its Michael Jackson, we've seen wade get questioned about if he's been touched sexually and so on.


Come the f on man.. really? Someone in there mid 20s not knowing? I mean they were asked about it in a sexual tone..

Lol its laughable but crazy stupid.. I just cant comprehend how anyone can believe that...
 
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Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

The Daily Mail's new article about the 1996 deposition, "unearthed by the Daily Mail." That deposition has been on YouTube for years, how the hell is that 'unearthing'. Brilliant journalistic investigations, there.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

APPARENT innocence.

The ugly reality is that Michael Jackson did not get off because he was innocent. Chances are, he was guilty of every single one of the charges and actually did deserve to pay for the damages he caused. THE REAL REASON MICHAEL JACKSON GOT OFF WAS BECAUSE HE WAS MICHAEL JACKSON, an icon who somehow attained a larger than life status that absolved him of any wrongdoing. "

I am so sick of them.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Although it's early in this fight, it was pleasing to see Michael Jackson's music booming out to a packed stadium in Atlanta and a television audience of 170 million yesterday.
It is still being played on a credit card commercial as well.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

Regardless of what some people think about MJs family its important that they come together against this nonsense. It was a good thing jermaine has spoken out IMO.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

I see this so called Jermaine "defence " and i utterly cringe every time i see it. He made MJ out to be a "weirdo" AGAIN. I detest this man with a passion and imo all he cares about is the money drying up if people boycott MJ's music. Never mind Word to the Badd he was also quoted saying he thinks the allegations could possibly have been true. I do not believe they are true of course but this man is a leech of the highest order. He is a has been or should i say a never was . Adopting the same mannerisms and speech patterns , things if you look back in time he was NOT like. I support a rebuttal but its only going to be called biased . Especially in this new movement. Any "rebuttal" has to come from NON family members because lets face it MJ hated his family apart from his mother.
MJ did NOT hate his family (you sound like the tabloids). Did they have issues, YES just like ALL FAMILIES (I do not know why some people want to act like the Jacksons should be different than any other family. They are just famous and their business, truth or lies, get talked about. That is the ONLY difference.). Like him or not, Jermaine always is the one to speak when it comes to MJ. In that interview, I see a brother who was hurt by what going on and it is easy to sit back and judge him but when someone is lying on your family member, it is hard for some people to remember everything to say in a certain amount of limited time (they better be Glad it is the Jacksons, I know families with a lot more drama than the Jacksons and if you bother a family member, they will cut, fight, or use gun fire on someone messing with their family member. They can talk noise to each other but an OUTSIDER better not say or do nothing. As for the money, I rest for MJ's family to make and get money than a bunch of strangers with their own motives.
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

IDK if everyone else comes from perfect families or what but why we still harbor the level of resentment for things like Jermaines song would be (well for me) hypocritical. That song is decades old, same with Latoyas statements in 1993.. While it did have damaging effects than even last today, they can't take it back.

The reason I say hypocritical is because if I held hate for things my family members did to me or each other from 2-3 decades ago, I'd have no one to talk to lol! People fall short of what they are supposed to do all the time, does that make you a bad person?

maybe you've cheated on someone before, maybe you've stolen something from your mother, maybe you went behind a family members back and did something that would hurt them. If you've hurt someone in your life or you still love someone that has hurt you.. Let that be the understanding that Michael (while there was issues that went as far as him keeping his distance) still loved his family.

Michael was a JACKSON before he was the King Of Pop and IS a JACKSON by legacy forever.


the family just lost there father, mother is not doing well and this documentary comes up and just adds stress.. stress that would only weaken Katherines heart!

Think of those things when you're talking about her children... Think what you want about whoever you want but each of these Jacksons are loved ones of Michaels.


Even if I make fun of them some times or they give me reason to get frustrated.. I still have love in my heart..
 
Re: Sundance Festival 2019 - Controversial MJ Documentary "Leaving Neverland"

I see this so called Jermaine "defence " and i utterly cringe every time i see it. He made MJ out to be a "weirdo" AGAIN. I detest this man with a passion and imo all he cares about is the money drying up if people boycott MJ's music. Never mind Word to the Badd he was also quoted saying he thinks the allegations could possibly have been true. I do not believe they are true of course but this man is a leech of the highest order. He is a has been or should i say a never was . Adopting the same mannerisms and speech patterns , things if you look back in time he was NOT like. I support a rebuttal but its only going to be called biased . Especially in this new movement. Any "rebuttal" has to come from NON family members because lets face it MJ hated his family apart from his mother.

What a nonsense comment. Jermaine's interview with Piers Morgan was that of a brother who was tired and hurt by these allegations. Clearly you are blinded by your hate that you couldn't see that. Word to the Baad was nearly thrity years. MJ forgave Jermaine so I don't understand why some fans still go on about it. As for MJ hating everyone in his family apart from his mother, you clearly have no idea what you are on about. Do some research and you will know that MJ loved his family. Sure he had issues with them at times, but he most definiteliy didn't hate them.
 
MJ didn’t like his family this is obvious he did a lot of things for Katherine

But still they should defend their brother and have every right to
 
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