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What sells 20 million plus albums instead of 5 to 10 million

I love pizza said:
I'm not sure he wants it either, but nothing would wash away all the bad press like a mega seller and the only way he's going to get that beside great music (a given) is targeting the right age groups and like I said before, he can peform in a basement and the diehards will buy the albums. The target market to sell big is not us, the automatic, always will be there fans.
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True, but to be honest, selling 5 mil worldwide would be a stand out these days.
 
I love pizza said:
I think all of you make sound points. I just see every appearance as an opportunity. Dance wise I think we haven't seen 50% of what he's capable of doing and I think all of us can agree on that.

The recent news about Lavelle Smith being in Vegas. Yeah thats good in the sense that things are happening, but I'd more impressed if he pushed himself outside of the box and say hired Lavelle, Savion Glover and a top broadway choreographer. I really don't think its hard for him dance the way he does, its natural, but I want him to feel unnatural and push himself. Case in point, when it did the live Dangerous stage performance on the American Music Awards and then repeated essentially the same thing on the Dick Clark special, I was let down because the pedestal I put him on as an entertainer is extremely high. Its like Fred Astaire doing the same dance routine in two movies. Its not something you would expect.

All this being said, whatever he comes out with I know will be great, I guess I want him to be the modern day Fred Astaire, see him dancing in movies, doing more couple dancing in videos and performances. Just like going back to my original post of doing something we've never seen before. I know he has the talent and ability to do this stuff, but in a modern way.
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I can see your point. Yes, I do think he's capable of much more. I'd like to see him do some ballroom dancing or like they have them do on Dancing with the stars. I know he would be amazing, and I'd love it!
 
I do not think no one can sell that number anymore with the creation of the internet. As for Michael and his brothers, I think some fans have to remember that Michael has the era of the late 70's (I go ahead and put 1969 in this era since it is so close), the 80's , the 90's, and even fans in 2000 that have thier own desire to see him sing about. It is not a matter of "needing" his brothers but it is matter of just enjoying HIS BEGINNING and there are a group of the population who would love to see that. I liked Michael in the 70's but it was the late 79 and the 80's (when I started to notice boys period and how good looking they can be) that Michael got my LOVE. SO when I hear OTW, Thriller, BAD, my heart go to another place of joy. Yes, I love the new stuff but everyone have thier own picks of what era of Michaelmania they love even if the like the present.
 
MY honest guess would be anywhere between 13-18 million..

But it's not impossible to reach 20 million.. I there have been a few albums since the year 2000 that have reached into the 20 mill. range.. A good amount in the mid teens range..

So it's not IMPOSSIBLE.. It would definatly be ground breaking, since it's such a rarity. But don't count Mike out yet.. Not saying he WILL, not saying he SHOULD.. But he COULD..

he'll hit over 10 million NO PROBLEM.. teens with ease.. Now higher than the teens will be the tough part.
 
Raylo said:
I think it's too much to ask to have Michael try and reach a certain target market. He's always appealed to everyone, that's why he's the king. It also would not be right to take the diehard fans for granted in order to appeal to a different group of unpredictable people. Yes we would buy the album and MJ knows that, but I would think that he actually wants us to enjoy it too and therefore keeps us in mind as well as what the general public might like. All he needs to do to reach people who aren't diehard fans, is to make really good music and to promote it. His talent and persona is larger than life and the more he pushes that, the more he will sell imo - like with History.

It's amazing how much the music industry has changed, even in just the last few years. In 2001 when Invincible came out we were already talking about how artists can't sell the huge numbers anymore. Now it's even worse, numbers seem to have dropped even more. So my question is (if it's not too off topic) how much can Michael sell? If the new album is amazing, if he pulls out all the stops to promote it etc - how much could he sell? Or what if only the fans bought the album, how many would he sell then? About the same as Invincible? These are just hypothetical questions, I'd like to know what people think.

EM: I think your MJ unplugged idea is fantastic. I would love to see something like that. Only problem is I would also love to see one of MJ's more typical performances since I haven't yet.
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I agree with you Raylo. But I will say this though: if anyone has the potential to pull mega numbers, it's Michael Jackson. But he has to go thru all of the right doors in a row for it to happen.
 
think it's too much to ask to have Michael try and reach a certain target market. He's always appealed to everyone, that's why he's the king.
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exactly. mj has always appealed to everyone. he has fans of all ages and generations. so it makes no sense saying you must appeal to a certain group.appeal to a certain group and alienate others? makes no sense. mjs music has always been universal.

EM: I think your MJ unplugged idea is fantastic. I would love to see something like that. Only problem is I would also love to see one of MJ's more typical performances since I haven't yet.
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he can do both types i wont mind lol
 
terrell said:
I do not think no one can sell that number anymore with the creation of the internet. As for Michael and his brothers, I think some fans have to remember that Michael has the era of the late 70's (I go ahead and put 1969 in this era since it is so close), the 80's , the 90's, and even fans in 2000 that have thier own desire to see him sing about. It is not a matter of "needing" his brothers but it is matter of just enjoying HIS BEGINNING and there are a group of the population who would love to see that. I liked Michael in the 70's but it was the late 79 and the 80's (when I started to notice boys period and how good looking they can be) that Michael got my LOVE. SO when I hear OTW, Thriller, BAD, my heart go to another place of joy. Yes, I love the new stuff but everyone have thier own picks of what era of Michaelmania they love even if the like the present.
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:clapping::clapping::clapping:There are millions of jackson fans out there who would LOVE to see the Jackson brothers reunite if only for one last time. There were important part of their lives and that is why they would love it. Those fans have followed and supported Michael throughout his career, but the J5 was their first love. Fans need to realize that before there was a Michael Mania, there was a Jackson mania and every last one of the brothers were loved.
 
Datsymay said:
That is the absolute truth. What some fans seem to forget is that MJ has done it all. Every popstar out there want to be where MJ is. He has nothing to prove anymore. Furthermore, he is really where the real money is. he is the boss now. Ask Akon, Emenem and all the bigtime postars out today, who is really making the money in music and they will say it is MJ.
Music catalogue is where the real money is, not making records or record sales. Mj making music is like a little hobby for him now. He is taking his time over it too. Fans need to have patience and stop worrying about MJ's success., He has already made it. Read MJ's thank you to john Branco in the Ultimate collection. He has already done all there is to do in music. More than any other popstar in music history. just because the press denies it, doesn't make it less true.:yes:
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Well, the money in the music industry is also in songwriting (and publishing)--biiiiiiiig money. MJ doesn't seem to write songs for other people, so maybe he should get into that. Really, that would be awesome. A song written for someone else by MJ. :D
 
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There are millions of jackson fans out there who would LOVE to see the Jackson brothers reunite if only for one last time.
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well that happened in 2001 so tbh i cant see it happening again on any grand scale.
 
well if 20 of us buy a million albums, he'll get there for sure.. lol!

what's that like $280 million??? lol! Well that's only 14 million each person.. HA HA!
 
Today's audience has a short attention span and isn't going to purchase a CD. If they do, they listen to it a couple of times and then trade it in for credit to get something else. A lot of record stores have a large used section. In the US, currently the average number 1 album only sells about 50,000 a week. A lot of younger people either download songs or buy $4 bootlegs on the street. There's people where I work and in the neighborhood that burn CDs (and movies) for people for a few bucks, rather than spending $15-20 elsewhere. I still like buying a product, with the packaging. But there's too much product. Hundreds of CDs are released a month, this hurts the music business also.
 
LovelyOne said:
Well, the money in the music industry is also in songwriting (and publishing)--biiiiiiiig money. MJ doesn't seem to write songs for other people, so maybe he should get into that. Really, that would be awesome. A song written for someone else by MJ. :D
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Songwriters do not usually own catalogues. Also with songwriting, you still need a publisher otherwise nobody will hear your song. A publisher owns thousands of songs. Songwriters may own a few. I doubt it pays as well as publishing. That is where the money is.
 
to reach a high number Mike will have to release multiple variations of the album, at different times.. each one with more features..

lets just say his album sells 14 million (Very possible)

once it reaches that, he releases another version with a few bonus tracks.. That will up the sales a couple million. Now lets say 16 million

Then he releases a DVD with the videos from the era and some bonus footage.. Taking it to 18 million..

Then he releases a fan-pack with everything the other ones have PLUS a new concert, bonus footage, big booklet and other stuff.. Taking it to 20 million..



I'm just saying they COULD do it, if that were the goal.. Also most artists releease and album every year or two.. Meaning after ONE year goes by, they are all ready working on promoting a new album, forgetting the potential of that first album..

Michael releases an album and promotes it untill it runs dry.. He took Thriller promotions mostly from 1982-1984.. Bad 1987-1989.. Dangerous 1991-1994.. HIStory 1995-1999..

When you spend 3-4 years on promoting and backing that ONE album it continues to sell for a long period off time.. the Thriller video was released in 1984, and it boost album sales.. When you take an albums promotion plan and spread it over a long period of time it hightens the albums potential.. instead of cutting it short.. Michael releases singles and more singles.. Videos and more videos.. and does it in a time span that is really long.. That keeps the album selling.
 
mello1 said:
But I will say this though: if anyone has the potential to pull mega numbers, it's Michael Jackson. But he has to go thru all of the right doors in a row for it to happen.
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Definitely. He would have to pull out all the stops. Whether he will (or wants to) do that is another matter. Until very recently I would have been very pessimistic, but lately there seems to be something in the air so who knows.

I'm not a big fan of the idea to rerelease the same album with a few extras. I think it's better to draw attention to the original product again and again with a new single release off the album, with a good video, a performance, a concert, an interview or whatever.
 
KOPV said:
When you spend 3-4 years on promoting and backing that ONE album it continues to sell for a long period off time.. the Thriller video was released in 1984, and it boost album sales.. When you take an albums promotion plan and spread it over a long period of time it hightens the albums potential.. instead of cutting it short.. Michael releases singles and more singles.. Videos and more videos.. and does it in a time span that is really long.. That keeps the album selling.
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There was no internet then, or CD burning. If you wanted music you had to buy a product such as a LP, cassette, 8-track, or 45 single. You could tape music off the radio, but it wouldn't be the complete song and it had the DJs talking on it, lol. Nobody today releases an actual "single". The singles charts today are based on radio play and not someone buying a 45, as was the case in the 1980s and before. There's a few released as remix singles, but they're rare and you have to go to certain stores to buy them. They're not counted on the main chart, but the dance/club chart.
 
^ Napster came out in 1999.. Since then eligal downloads have been going on.. and IDK about you but I know several of people that burned albums in the 90's... It was not JUST THRILLER Mike did that for.. It was almost EVERY album. even Dangerous and HIStory.

The Beatles '1' album came out in 2000 and sold almost 30 million

Linkin Parks 'Hybrid Theory' was released in 2000 and sold 22 million

Eminems 'Marshal Mathers LP' was released in 2000 and sold 21 million

Norah Jones 'Come Away With Me' was released in 2002 and sold 20 million

Eminems 'Eminem show' was released in 2002 and sold 20 million


Before the eligal downloads Michael sold in the 30 million range on average.. Since the download era began sales have went down on average 30%.. Meaning if MJ's average sales were in todays market he would sell an average of 21 million.. that's with a 30% decrese..

NOW!! Keep in mind Michaels fans are all over.. downloads are not everywhere believe it or not.. only 10% of the worlds music is bought through via download..



Just give this some thought..

If Michael releases an album and sells 11 million.. That's a big number.. But what happens if later he releases another edition?? then another?? then another??

sales will continue..
 
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Those high record sales were during the beginning of the 2000s. The latest WW albums sales for 2008 has Coldplay barely over the 2 million mark and they are at the top right now...
 
well 2008 is not over.. most big sellers get in 8-10 million range..

From the High SCHOOL MUSICAL album to AMY WINEHOUSE..

coldplays being at 2 million does not say much at this point, it was just released 25 days ago in the U.K and 20 days ago in the U.S..

I mean come on Thriller 25 sold 3 million.. and it was released 5 months ago. a RE-RELEASE with a few remixes..

I'm sorry but if T25 can sell 3 million.. a FULL NEW, FULLY PROMOTED album could reach a very high number..

Can anyone tell me what other (RE-RELEASE) has sold that well??

I'm not saying he WILL sell 20 million or more.. But in no ways is it impossible.. Michaels albums sell ALL OVER.. the MOST global entertainer.. He was more global than these artists are today WITH the enternet, and all the share to share that goes on... NOW MICHAEL JACKSON taking on this SHARE TO SHARE WORLD??? He'll be bigger than these other ppl out today..

He'll have to do something unique and different with the project to make it.. But it CAN be done..

I wont under estimate him or his album.. in 1982 you tell someone that an album is going to sell 34 million in 2 years.. They would think your crazy..

Michael has shocked me enough to know to never under estimate him..
 
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T25 is just now hitting the 2 mil mark and Amy's figures are not based on one year KOPV.

I don't underestimate MJ. I do look at what the industry as a whole is doing today.
 
where did I say it was one year?? It was released in 2006, and did not reach 10 million untill SOMEWHAT recently..

ya sales go over time..

That's all albums.. If AMY released an album last year, her 2006 album would have not sold as much as it did.. because she would have not released as many singles, and her promotion would have been for her new album..

That's a part of my point.. People release an album and sell 5 million then release another album a year or 2 later.. that's dumb in many ways.

The reason why AMY sold 10 million is because she did not release another album since, she released a few different versions of the album etc..

Mike can sell over 10 million without the 'other versions' etc.. So WITH it, it would sell much more..


like I said before, he'll have to be creative.. Do things not done before.. he'll have to put things on the 'special editions' versions that are not available for download etc.. Things in there that cannot be shared..

He'll have to figure out, WHAT would people want, that cannot be downloaded and shared.. so probably even away from video and audio.. Have it be web saterations, a numaric code that people will type in on his website to win something, and/or go into a page that is un eccessable to anyone else.. Inside the page could have games, trivia, and there they could put a couple songs and videos that cannot be ripped..

U know??? CREATIVE with it..


Basically when the suply is there for free it does not matter how strong the demand is, because they can get it.. But if THEY suply something that would have a strong demand and could not get it free.. People will buy..
 
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KOPV, my only point to you is that CDs don't sell like they used to. I'm sure that over time, those CDs released in 2007 that sold over over 5 mil will be up to 8 mil in a few years. The numbers you gave earlier were 10+ million figures in about 2 years time, meaning that they were high sellers out of the gate.

I think that I also said that if anyone sell phenomenally, it would be Michael Jackson. In any case, it doesn't matter to me if he sells 5 or 10 million or 1 million. If it's good, not only will I buy it, I will play it despite what else the world may think about it.
 
well ya I know.. they don't sell the same.. not at all..

and all I am saying is, albums have always hit higher numbers than the average.. Especially Michaels..

MAYBE if Michael could sell 30 mill in the late 80's and early 90's.. maybe he can reach 20 million now..

It was not a commen thing to hit the 30 million mark then... INFACT throughout history only 17 albums have reached in the 30 million mark.


To me 30 million again is out of the question.. But 20, ya it's MAY be a far fetch goal, but those goals are possible.. And they are only possible if you BELIEVE they are.
 
I love pizza said:
I agree 1000% too, but having lived through the good times, its was something else. Its just about wanting the mass magic back. The kids born in the 90's don't have a clue how great it was and no amount of youtube videos will get you there. Remeber what MJ said to Quincy when Bad came out, he told him it would be bigger than Thriller (I think he said something over the top like 50 or 100 million sales, I might be wrong), but thats the killer instinct, thats mass appeal. Thats the mindset of MJ. I just want him to push himself to places where he hasn't been before, mostly in dance to appeal to that larger audience the 40, 50, 60 year olds. Thats why Dancing with the Stars is such a big hit, its mass appeal across age ranges. Thats the audience MJ should go after, us fans on this board will buy the album no matter what, we're automatic sales, we're not the target market.
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Thats totally cool if Mr.Jacksons mindset is at the mass appeal...he's got the gift, talent, and the experience, all he needs to do is relax a bit and let it flow naturally...and the rest will take care of itself..!

Smiles~~~

Heal The World~~~"Education Is The Key"
 
Correct me if I am wrong, but it seems to me that the top sellers of 2007 averaged around 5 mil. But the top sellers of 2008 so far have averaged only 2 mil. This tells me that the music industry is totally in trouble. People are either downloading specific songs like crazy OR they are downloading entire cds from their friends. But what they aren't doing is BUYING MUSIC. And they are getting more and more prolific with it.

Oh, and another thing that is affecting record sales negatively is the fact that the record labels are not supporting and promoting their artist like they used to. Look at what is happening to Janet? She is used to being promoted heavily by her label, but now they are just tossing her out there and demanding a tour. They want these artists to tour to make that money themselves while they sit back and wait for their portion. And I am sure Michael knows this very well. That is why I know that Michael is gonna do something different this time.

So where does that leave Michael? Well, given the current numbers, I would say Michael is doing good if he sells 3 or 4 million of his new CD within 2 months of its release. That's 375,000 to 500,000 cds per week. I would say that is pretty good.

And as far as worldwide goes, I expect him to sell close to 15 mil.
 
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if any1 sells over 15million copies of 1 album n this day n age ill shave my head
 
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