The 1993 case. [Threads merged, All discussion in this one thread]

Some FACT/TEXT about the 93 case

Allegations don't make an evidence. Jackson had 150 persons working daily on Neverland, something like 80 cameras in his house in all areas of it, and not a single evidence in 20 years?

Plus, Jackson had a total of 8 trials against him. He was proved innocent in all of them,including the trial of Chandler (yes, the trial happenned, just shows how people are misinformed). When he was supposed to have done the thing with Arvizo, he wasn't even in Neverland - He was in Miami. The trial was a joke, everyone who really followed real informations known he was going to be proved innocent easily, only medias I pretend he was going to go into jail to sell their newspapers.

Facts is, all those who launched those trials were people living thanks to money of Jackson, and accused him once he got bored of being robbed by them.

Sony forced him to the arrangment back in 1993, trials are public in the US and it would have been horrible for Sony who spend 2 years earlier a gigantic amount of dollars to get him to see their superstar judged on tv, even worst knowing police took pictures of him nude and such.
He was still judged, the difference being accusation wasn't Chandler family, it wasn't a civil trial and couldn't be aired on tv. Jackson was proved innocent in 1994 after 8 months of investigations and trial.

Oh & btw, on 1994 criminal trial authorities contacted several hundreds of other childrens who have been in Neverland, not a single of them had something to say against Jackson behaviour with them. Jordan Chandler himself refused to testify and after his previous accusations appeared to be more than doubful during investigations, the case fall appart and Jackson was recognized not guilty.

Next came the accusers -- Jackson's former employees. First, Stella and Philippe Lemarque, Jackson' ex-housekeepers, tried to sell their story to the tabloids with the help of broker Paul Barresi, a former porn star. They asked for as much as half a million dollars but wound up selling an interview to The Globe of Britain for $15,000. The Quindoys, a Filipino couple who had worked at Neverland, followed. When their asking price was $100,000, they said " 'the hand was outside the kid's pants,' " Barresi told a producer of Frontline, a PBS program. "As soon as their price went up to $500,000, the hand went inside the pants. So come on." The L.A. district attorney's office eventually concluded that both couples were useless as witnesses.

Next came the bodyguards. Purporting to take the journalistic high road, Hard Copy's Diane Dimond told Frontline in early November of last year that her program was "pristinely clean on this. We paid no money for this story at all." But two weeks later, as a Hard Copy contract reveals, the show was negotiating a $100,000 payment to five former Jackson security guards who were planning to file a $10 million lawsuit alleging wrongful termination of their jobs.

On December 1, with the deal in place, two of the guards appeared on the program; they had been fired, Dimond told viewers, because "they knew too much about Michael Jackson's strange relationship with young boys." In reality, as their depositions under oath three months later reveal, it was clear they had never actually seen Jackson do anything improper with Chandler's son or any other child:

"So you don't know anything about Mr. Jackson and [the boy], do you?" one of Jackson's attorneys asked former security guard Morris Williams under oath.

"All I know is from the sworn documents that other people have sworn to."

"But other than what someone else may have said, you have no firsthand knowledge about Mr. Jackson and [the boy], do you?"

"That's correct."

"Have you spoken to a child who has ever told you that Mr. Jackson did anything improper with the child?"

"No."

When asked by Jackson's attorney where he had gotten his impressions, Williams replied: "Just what I've been hearing in the media and what I've experienced with my own eyes."

"Okay. That's the point. You experienced nothing with your own eyes, did you?"

"That's right, nothing."

(The guards' lawsuit, filed in March 1994, was still pending as this article went to press.)

Note: The case was thrown out of court in July 1995.

Next came the maid. On December 15, Hard Copy presented "The Bedroom Maid's Painful Secret." Blanca Francia told Dimond and other reporters that she had seen a naked Jackson taking showers and Jacuzzi baths with young boys. She also told Dimond that she had witnessed her own son in compromising positions with Jackson -- an allegation that the grand juries apparently never found credible.

A copy of Francia's sworn testimony reveals that Hard Copy paid her $20,000, and had Dimond checked out the woman's claims, she would have found them to be false. Under deposition by a Jackson attorney, Francia admitted she had never actually see Jackson shower with anyone nor had she seen him naked with boys in his Jacuzzi. They always had their swimming trunks on, she acknowledged.

To resume, in France there is an expression that says "there is no smoke without fire", people often use it to say that if Jackson was accused, then he was guilty. The expression is correct, but people never wondered what fire was - It wasn't a supposedly Jackson incorrect behaviour, but yes the fire here was Jackson's fortune.
 
Re: 1993 settlement documents

I think it is important to discuss. People often speak of MJ fans as being irrational and deluded. The only way to have a chance to combat this is by having facts and being able to speak intelligently on a subject. I for one am interested in knowing what actually is the case in order to be able to speak on the subject at a later time if need be. So, Thanks.

This is so true. I think many fans mean well and feel they need to uphold his image but don't realize that in doing so they are, in fact, blinded by the truth. Michael WAS a good person and as I have said so many times, he was human. Humans make mistakes sometimes and humans are not perfect.

I never thought he did anything so terrible except there was one time I saw him on a show with his brothers and he was older and he was performing and I thought he actually looked silly but I don't hold that against him. I think it was more a question of feeling like a duck out of water performing with them again.
 
Re: Recent news reporting on 1993 allegation

UPDATE

Important -- either way, it does not reflect badly on MJ, to be clear. It was critical he get through the ordeal to be able to do his work.

Exactly.
 
Re: Some FACT/TEXT about the 93 case

Great to read, I have always known all these cases were a bunch of crap. MJ was too naive and didn't see what was happening to him. His love for children backfired against him and people need to see the truth.
 
Re: I have some questions about the 1993 case.

I just realized belatedly that you had two threads on this topic, dancemaster. Don't understand why no one mentioned this thread, when I kept asking questions...
 
Re: Some FACT/TEXT about the 93 case

When asked by Jackson's attorney where he had gotten his impressions, Williams replied: "Just what I've been hearing in the media and what I've experienced with my own eyes."

"Okay. That's the point. You experienced nothing with your own eyes, did you?"

"That's right, nothing."
And there you have it! The double-speak of his accusers ONCE AGAIN. It was all through the various testimonies of those who took the stand for the prosecution in the 2003 trial.

I LOVED how Messeraeu pinned them down on the witness stand, and I WISH, WISH, WISH that Jordie Chandler had made an appearance, just so he could've been exposed too. His friends would've been called as rebuttal witnesses as well...the ones who said Chandler told them that Michael Jackson never did anything to him (Chandler).
 
Re: Recent news reporting on 1993 allegation

Cochran was the reason MJ settled , and yes MJ went along with the settlement . the one who wrote the motion was Brian Oxman not Mez.

the insurance paid, the insurance negotiated , but mj eventually agreed . it was not against his wish .

MJ did not want to settle , else he would have given Evan what he wanted in July1993 , before anyone heard anything .

MJ wanted it to go to trial and Weizman advised him to do so, along with Bret Fields , only when Feldman's buddy joined MJ's team , MJ was told no one can guarantee him anything and he better pay and move on .cochran told him , white people hate him because of racism , black people hate him becuase he bleached his skin, and there is no defense against child molestation , "pay and move on , you'll probably be convicted ".

cochran got millions for doing absolutely nothing but destroying MJ's reputation , Feldman got $ 5 millions , jordan got $ 15 millions, June $ 1 million, Evan $1 million , MJ lost his deal with Pepsi, lost his reputation, and majority of the people who first believed he was innocent were left shocked and later switched to the other side , because frankly no one could defend or understand how come someone reward the family who accused him of the most heinous crime with $ 20 millions .

I know mj had no choice back then per his attorney's advise, but it was a very BAD advise, the settlements were the worst decisions mj ever made in his live .


look what happened in 2003, all the brainwashing from the media , " blue, red, white, blond" jury with alleged three victims did not convict , 9 of them were convinced he was completely innocent of everything in 1993 and 2003, the other three had other motives to feel he was guilty. one of them was an O'riley fan, so everything he said was gospel to her, he said he was guilty, so he was guilty .

the other two negotiated a book deal even when they were jurors , and eventually got it but later everything cancelled due to lack of interest .

my point is even when everything seemed very bad for mj , a good lawyer sorry AGREAT AND HONEST lawyer made mj a free man .

all mj needed in 1993 , someone like Mez .
 
Re: 1993 settlement documents

Where, because that's not what I read! lol

I'M right! lol

No, I'M right! lol

lol -- how about someone actually backing up something they say instead of this silliness, lol
 
Re: Recent news reporting on 1993 allegation

That's true... when I look at comments on most sites, they're pro-MJ. Good work, fans!!! :clapping:

What's up with you guys in the UK? Get going! :)
Yes, but its not just fans, people are not that stupid, i mean i remember when i first started to discover Michael, the press would do anything to destroy him, but they could not fool me, and many people are like that too, they wont believe everything, specially when its SO obvious that on Michael Jackson matters they totally lose control and just write all wrong!, i mean they are like complete lunatics when they write about Michael is like they just, i dont know, its sad that they are so limited, and even jelous...
 
Re: Recent news reporting on 1993 allegation

Cochran was the reason MJ settled...
You're already participating in this debate in the two sites I've linked to upthread, where this is being sorted out. This is not the site for detailed analysis of this subject, as I've said. I don't want this thread to be used to short-circuit that debate. Lengthy opinions without links aren't helpful here. All we want here is the pithy short answer with citations.
 
Re: Recent news reporting on 1993 allegation

That article is disgusting. Stuff like this needs to stop being written, it's pure lies.
 
Re: Recent news reporting on 1993 allegation

You're already participating in this debate in the two sites I've linked to upthread, where this is being sorted out. This is not the site for detailed analysis of this subject, as I've said. I don't want this thread to be used to short-circuit that debate. Lengthy opinions without links aren't helpful here. All we want here is the pithy short answer with citations.

what links ? what are you talking about ?:scratch:
 
Re: Recent news reporting on 1993 allegation

yes, but its not just fans, people are not that stupid, i mean i remember when i first started to discover michael, the press would do anything to destroy him, but they could not fool me, and many people are like that too, they wont believe everything, specially when its so obvious that on michael jackson matters they totally lose control and just write all wrong!, i mean they are like complete lunatics when they write about michael is like they just, i dont know, its sad that they are so limited, and even jelous...

?

...
 
Re: 1993 settlement documents

Butterflies, I don't get it either. We're not getting much help, though, are we? We're getting a) documents without explanation, b) explanations without documents, and c) an attitude, as of there's something wrong with wanting to defend MJ armed with facts. I see you're on the Project Legacy Team, so you understand, no doubt, that you can't just send a complaining letter without a short, simple explanation with supporting documents.

Personally, I'm throwing in the towel on this one.

Nawww don't give in. I agree with your sentiments. It's really crucial that fans are able to tackle these questions with legitimate answers AND have the goods to back it up. The 93 settlement is really the main thing people use to determine Mike's guilt (ok that and the 'he shared his bed with kids' thing which i've been meaning to ask questions about). But at the moment it's the 93 case that is going to be thrusted into the spotlight again, so it's pivotal we as a fan base are fully informed about what REALLY went down and that means whether we like it or not. Evan Chandler's death may give us a platform to make a difference to public opinion

Spouting facts means nothing unless you are basing them on a credible source and have the source to direct people to. Without this, we are not going to help Michael, we are just going to be looked at as his nutty fan base who will twist things to make him appear more victimized than he was. It's important we don't stuff this chance up by doing that.

I think people get really defensive when some of us question if Michael in fact did pay the Chandlers. Remember though that suggesting or asking if Michael was willing to sign and settle himself, does NOT mean we inherently view this action as him being guilty and I think that's the prob. People are associating this suggestion with us thinking it's an action of guilt, hence the various 'BUT BUT the insurance co. paid not Michael!!!' responses. So what if they did? I want to understand why he signed and agreed to settle and not the insurance company then? We all need to understand this to defend him properly.

At the end of the day we have 2 very conflicting legal documents that both seem valid, but don't totally make sense as far as I'm concerened. Could t-mez have lied to make the 2005 trial easier? I don't know. I think the 'under protest' thing means something a bit different in legal terms than what we understand 'under protest' to mean in every day speech. ? ? ?

Oh and Bo G. If I get a straight answer, I will pm it to you if you decide to disappear :(
 
Re: I have some questions about the 1993 case.

I dunno if this has already been answered here.. but I didn't see any post about it (or perhaps I didn't search thoroughly enough) so.. here goes: I heard that chandler contacted mj and asked him to negotiate three scriptwriting deals on his behalf. If mj didn't agree, he said, he would accuse him of molesting his son. Mj didn't agree and so chandler went ahead with the accusations.
What I'm wondering about is; if this is true, why didn't mj just charge them with extortion?

True, Chandler did do that! But, MJ wouldn't give him the money nor buy him a new house that he ask MJ for and MJ stop talking to him all together an din the tapes he says Mj didn't need to stop talking to him lol, and he was jealous of the relationship Jordan had with mike saying he was seduced by MJ's money and chandler didn't like that June (Jordan mom) told him to "F*Ck Off!" MJ only sued Chandler for extortion when chandler came of with the allegations about MJ to the public! That's why MJ's investigator had Jordan step-Father record Evan Chandler on tape talking about his "Plans", they knew he was up to something, but, I don't think they knew that he was gonna do this! His plan was to show them a piece of paper that was written by his lawyers to hand to MJ and June if he doesn't get what he wants he will them go public with some crap! He said they will have to think about it and then talk to him about it and if he get's another F*uck Off by June, then he will tell his lawyer to make a phone call and do what he has to do! Saying that after that it's out of his hands and it will be bigger then him and take on a life of it's own!

He said "THEY" will be "destroyed" forever on the tapes, he didn't just say MJ this man was after all of his family including MJ, all because he was annoying the shit out of them and ask for money so his ex- told him to "F*ck Off!" And he said he hated that she told him that! His son was Having attitude with him too and he didn't like that Jordan was treating him that way! This man was not in Jordan's life much only until MJ came into the picture! I have the transcripts of the Covo between Evan and David Shwartz the step-father, but, only part 1 to 3 I'm missing part 4, but, I have read the whole convo before and heard the audio yrs ago!
 
Re: Recent news reporting on 1993 allegation

the daily mail is such a low site, i mean, they talk as if Michael did molested that kid, then they say Michael had SEX with the Arvizo kid, and that was not even the case, he said Michael touched him in a wrong way (which is easier to accuse), but having sex??? come on that was so stupid to say, and i hope the Arvizo kid one day realizes what he did, cause Michael helped him when he had cancer, Michael did help him, and the Arvizo kid was i mean , i dont know if hes the bad one, i blame his mother, not him, he knows Michael never did anything wrong and he knows, his mother knows it, but from this family, i mean, what can i hope?? nothing...

And why was nodody there when they creamted Evan Chandler, of course thats a point to discuss, i mean, why he and jordan fall apart.... it is strange, very strange, anyway, that article has more fiction then New Moon... i just laugh at that, i cant discuss when they lie so openly, dont even go to that site, thats promotion for them dont go there, its a waste of time
 
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Omg we all stil on bout this case!...when will it end :(
 
Omg we all stil on bout this case!...when will it end :(

Well hun, there are people who are genuinely interested in the facts of the 1993 settlement. A lot of newer members are and I understand their interest.

However, a lot of us who were around at the time of both cases have been ready to move on from it for a long time now. Living this nightmare again is like ripping the scab of of a wound... it hurts.

I suggest that if you don't wish to read or participate, simply ignore it. I also request that the newer members stop spamming the forum with the 93 case (different threads, etc).

Thanks!
 
The long "Recent News" thread on Evan Chandler's suicide, that I've been working so hard to keep on-topic so we could find all the links easily... has now been merged with analyses of 1993 documents? And those of us trying to quietly discuss the documents will be inundated with a batch of new "why are we rehashing this" comments...

Can this be undone?
 
Re: 1993 settlement documents

I'M right! lol

No, I'M right! lol

lol -- how about someone actually backing up something they say instead of this silliness, lol

But, that's the thing here, people already provided links to the 93 settlement Docs so we can read the and the one from T-mez too! Legal docs that Two different Judges looked through and approved them....what more do yall want?

In the 93 docs it both says MJ insurance carrier paid the settlement as well as it says MJ elected to settle as well has it says the Chandlers excepted that and it was for distress and not molestation and can still proceed to a criminal case if they choose too!

So take it for what it says and that's it! There is nothing else to discuss when it's right there in writing! We are not lawyers to explain every detail that's in the documents because it sounds contradicting to some!

All I know and will repeat is that they are LEGAL Documents!
 
The head moderator felt that the threads were repeating the same information. Either they were going to be merged or one or more deleted. Sorry! Something had to be done.
 
The head moderator felt that the threads were repeating the same information. Either they were going to be merged or one or more deleted. Sorry! Something had to be done.

Nothing will be findable anymore.

Goodnight.
 
Again, I'm sorry you feel that way but there were over 4 threads on the exact same topic. Now if you would like to ask MJJC to work on a project developing a complete timeline of the 1993 case and the 2003-2005 case, please leave a request in Ask Us, and Gary will get back to you. Otherwise the forum was getting very cluttered with the 1993 case.

Goodnight to you too.
 
The long "Recent News" thread on Evan Chandler's suicide, that I've been working so hard to keep on-topic so we could find all the links easily... has now been merged with analyses of 1993 documents? And those of us trying to quietly discuss the documents will be inundated with a batch of new "why are we rehashing this" comments...

Can this be undone?

No, Sorry. Any threads of the same nature get merged. This is no different..
I can't very well let yours run seperately and not others? That wouldn't be fair would it?
It's all the same discussion in the long run and best to be in one thread, It can be looked through and commented on. What you have posted if members read through won't get missed.
 
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