PSA- Empathizing With One Another (instead of trying to convince one another).

SmoothCollins

Proud Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2011
Messages
3,642
Points
0
Location
Oregon, USA
Although I have made a personal choice about buying the album (or not buying it), and my choice is respectfully evident in my previous posts, I'm not going to state my opinion in this post. All you need to know is that I'm a fan, I have been for a long time, and I support Michael the best ways I know how :) .

I'd really like to see each of us use empathy when we talk about other members' choices and opinions.

For example: we have two sides on the album- A) people buying the album, and B) people not buying the album:

A) If you are buying it, that's great :) - I trust you are wanting to support MJ in the best way you know how. I noticed some of you said you are buying the album even though you believe they messed with MJ's vocals. You're doing that because you don't want the press to manipulate poor album sales into articles that call MJ a flop. We can, and should, all understand and empathize with that assessment because it's true. Even if you are of the other opinion, you can still put yourself in someone else's shoes and understand that they're still supporting MJ.

B) If you are NOT buying it, that's great too :) - you are also wanting to support Michael and fight for all the injustices that seem to happen to him. You personally believe that they've either messed with the vocals, have added too much of James Porte, or have added in too many samples from other MJ songs. You feel that by not buying the album, you are sending a message to Sony that you won't tolerate MJ songs that have been meddled with. Even if you are of the other opinion, you can still put yourself in someone else's shoes and understand that they're still supporting MJ.


I'm making this its own seperate thread because I see this continuing undercurrent of snarky remarks coming from both sides of the opinion. I know the staff of MJJC have taken care of the personal attacks, but I'm talking about the subtle snide remarks that have been in almost every thread I've read recently. Things like calling people "stubborn", "non-supportive", "wanting Michael to fail", "not using your ears", etc is so disrespectful and not what this board is all about.

We are ALL fans, and we are all following our own personal beliefs as to what we think is right. So before you post your opinion or try to convince someone else of your opinion, just re-read your post and make sure you're not subtly putting down people who are supporting MJ in a different way than you.

At this point, is it even necessary to try to convince someone else of your opinion? I think it's time we just trust that each one of us have learned as much as we can, and made the decision that's right for ourselves.

Let's try to empathize with one another instead of trying to convince one another. We're all fans, and we all are doing what we think is right to support MJJ.

That's what Michael taught us, and we can show it here and now.

:flowers:
 
Last edited:
Re: PSA- We're all fans here.

Five-star post, Smooth Collins! :flowers:

As much of an optimist as I am...and as much as I agree with you, I honestly don't see this happening. Why? Because for some of the fans who are opting out, this isn't about vocals being messed or "fake" songs. It's about thinking Sony is an accomplice to a crime. There's no way these folks are going to sit quietly by and empathize with fans who want to enjoy the release. Their MAIN goal is to cause chaos and disruption for the sole purpose of making a corporation suffer. Everything and everyone else is considered collateral damage, IMO.

However, I AM hopeful...as a true optimist should be. :) Rep for you!
 
Re: PSA- We're all fans here.

Let's try to empathize with one another instead of trying to convince one another. We're all fans, and we all are doing what we think is right to support MJJ.

That's what Michael taught us, and we can show it here and now.

:flowers:

I support this 100%.
 
Re: PSA- We're all fans here.

Thanks Layth, Annie, and Wendy :) ~ I see what you're saying. I hope we're both right- I think we can. I was about to state my side as a reason why it can happen, but I'm going to try to leave that out since it's more important to just keep it focused.

I'd be interested to see if everyone who replies in this post can do it without the rest of us knowing which side you're on :D .
 
Re: PSA- We're all fans here.

I try to empathize as much as possible with those who do not share my opinion, but it's difficult sometimes because, of course, to me it seems that my opinion is the one that people "should" reach when they use common sense.

You make a very good point though, and I fully support your proposition. Ever since the 'Breaking News' situation I've consciously been trying to, at the very least, formulate my arguments around a basis of respect for the other side's opinions. Empathy seems a natural extension of that.
 
Re: PSA- We're all fans here.

Five-star post, Smooth Collins! :flowers:

As much of an optimist as I am...and as much as I agree with you, I honestly don't see this happening. Why? Because for some of the fans who are opting out, this isn't about vocals being messed or "fake" songs. It's about thinking Sony is an accomplice to a crime. There's no way these folks are going to sit quietly by and empathize with fans who want to enjoy the release. Their MAIN goal is to cause chaos and disruption for the sole purpose of making a corporation suffer. Everything and everyone else is considered collateral damage, IMO.

However, I AM hopeful...as a true optimist should be. :) Rep for you!

isn't that the putdown the o.p. was talking against?

having said that...i agree with the o.p. except for the part about press calling Michael a flop.

when Invincible came out, did any MJ fans decide they were disputing that that was Michael? no. did they buy the album? yes. did the press call him a flop? yes. so, what the press does, doesn't make a difference.

everybody's inner knows that MJ can never ever be a flop. no matter what.

as far as the sony corporation goes...anybody who practices corruption, destroys themself. nobody helps them in that. those who do not practice corruption help their legacy. nobody can help them in that.
 
Last edited:
Re: PSA- We're all fans here.

I try to empathize as much as possible with those who do not share my opinion, but it's difficult sometimes because, of course, to me it seems that my opinion is the one that people "should" reach when they use common sense.

You make a very good point though, and I fully support your proposition. Ever since the 'Breaking News' situation I've consciously been trying to, at the very least, formulate my arguments around a basis of respect for the other side's opinions. Empathy seems a natural extension of that.

you missed your opportunity for empathy, in this post, APOM

as for the o.p., i think you are buying the album.

i think you know i'm not buying it. i don't think that people figuring out what you're going to do, has to stop you from being empathetic.
 
Re: PSA- We're all fans here.

you missed your opportunity for empathy, in this post, APOM
Huh? How did I do that? The part of my reply that you emphasize merely describes how I have been formulating my opinion in the past few weeks, and that to me empathy seems a natural extension of that, hence, I will strive for respect as well as empathy from now on.
 
Re: PSA- We're all fans here.

I try to empathize as much as possible with those who do not share my opinion, but it's difficult sometimes because, of course, to me it seems that my opinion is the one that people "should" reach when they use common sense.

You make a very good point though, and I fully support your proposition. Ever since the 'Breaking News' situation I've consciously been trying to, at the very least, formulate my arguments around a basis of respect for the other side's opinions. Empathy seems a natural extension of that.

:flowers:

It is very difficult sometimes, I completely agree, but it's natural to feel that way. It definately takes more effort and being the better person to go out on a limb to try and understand someone else's view.

Sometimes the negativity seems to spread: if one person attacks an opinion, that person feels it necessary to attack back. Maybe if we take the high road, but still speak up and say things like "I disagree, but understand and respect your views" they might extend that courtesy back.


you missed your opportunity for empathy, in this post, APOM

I disagree, but it's okay if you feel differently. This thread is just about spreading that awareness and reminding us to try our best- no one's perfect.

as for the o.p., i think you are buying the album.

i think you know i'm not buying it. i don't think that people figuring out what you're going to do, has to stop you from being empathetic.

The reason I'm not discussing whether I'm buying it or not is because it simply doesn't matter in this thread- we're here to recognize that both sides are supporting Michael in their own way and that both sides should extend empathy to the other.

But yes, you can definately have an opinion and be kind and empathetic at the same time.
 
Last edited:
Re: PSA- We're all fans here.

you're right to have posted this thread, smooth collins. i referred it in the mj france thread. you'll get reps for this.
 
Re: PSA- We're all fans here.

Agreed. Especially with what is happening with that French MJ site, i've had the feeling that people are trying to cause trouble on here on purpose.

It's now more important to treat each other with respect if someone has an opposite view from your own.
 
Re: PSA- We're all fans here.

you're right to have posted this thread, smooth collins. i referred it in the mj france thread. you'll get reps for this.

Thank you- it came from a personal place in me and took me a while to write it. I love MJJC and have been posting here for so long. I've met some of my best friends here.

However, I was starting to feel like I wanted to leave MJJC because of all the snarky comments- even if they weren't refering to me, it still stings for some reason when you see one member calling someone a "so-called fan" or something like that when what's driving us all to argue is that we ARE such big fans and we all love MJ and want to do our best to protect his legacy. So I wanted to maybe help spread some pOsItIvIty :) - thanks for helping spread it.
 
Re: YES!.

:flowers:

It is very difficult sometimes, I completely agree, but it's natural to feel that way. It definately takes more effort and being the better person to go out on a limb to try and understand someone else's view.

Sometimes the negativity seems to spread: if one person attacks an opinion, that person feels it necessary to attack back. Maybe if we take the high road, but still speak up and say things like "I disagree, but understand and respect your views" they might extend that courtesy back.




I disagree, but it's okay if you feel differently. This thread is just about spreading that awareness and reminding us to try our best- no one's perfect.



- we're here to recognize that both sides are supporting Michael in their own way and that both sides should extend empathy to the other.

But yes, you can definately have an opinion and be kind and empathetic at the same time.
:angel:all this ....:huggy:...this thread is what we need i think...so ty for it. respect & love to you:yes: and all of us:wub:
 
Re: YES!.

:angel:all this ....:huggy:...this thread is what we need i think...so ty for it. respect & love to you:yes: and all of us:wub:

i felt lost...thought you went away and weren't coming back. blessing to see you back :huggy:
 
Re: PSA- We're all fans here.

I completely agree with this.
I've been trying to do the same ever since the whole thing started.
I have said from the beginning that we as fans should respect eachothers opinions.
We are all trying to do what in our opinion is best for Michael (or his legacy) because we love and care for him.
There really is no need for fans (on both sides) to attack other fans. It doesn't help the situation and only makes it worse imo.

Other than that, you pretty much said it all in the first post. :)
 
Re: PSA- We're all fans here.

I agree. We used to be a family and we have to bring the love back...
 
Re: PSA- We're all fans here.

Although I have made a personal choice about buying the album (or not buying it), and my choice is respectfully evident in my previous posts, I'm not going to state my opinion in this post. All you need to know is that I'm a fan, I have been for a long time, and I support Michael the best ways I know how :) .

I'd really like to see each of us use empathy when we talk about other members' choices and opinions.

For example: we have two sides on the album- A) people buying the album, and B) people not buying the album:

A) If you are buying it, that's great :) - I trust you are wanting to support MJ in the best way you know how. I noticed some of you said you are buying the album even though you believe they messed with MJ's vocals. You're doing that because you don't want the press to manipulate poor album sales into articles that call MJ a flop. We can, and should, all understand and empathize with that assessment because it's true. Even if you are of the other opinion, you can still put yourself in someone else's shoes and understand that they're still supporting MJ.

B) If you are NOT buying it, that's great too :) - you are also wanting to support Michael and fight for all the injustices that seem to happen to him. You personally believe that they've either messed with the vocals, have added too much of James Porte, or have added in too many samples from other MJ songs. You feel that by not buying the album, you are sending a message to Sony that you won't tolerate MJ songs that have been meddled with. Even if you are of the other opinion, you can still put yourself in someone else's shoes and understand that they're still supporting MJ.


I'm making this its own seperate thread because I see this continuing undercurrent of snarky remarks coming from both sides of the opinion. I know the staff of MJJC have taken care of the personal attacks, but I'm talking about the subtle snide remarks that have been in almost every thread I've read recently. Things like calling people "stubborn", "non-supportive", "wanting Michael to fail", "not using your ears", etc is so disrespectful and not what this board is all about.

We are ALL fans, and we are all following our own personal beliefs as to what we think is right. So before you post your opinion or try to convince someone else of your opinion, just re-read your post and make sure you're not subtly putting down people who are supporting MJ in a different way than you.

At this point, is it even necessary to try to convince someone else of your opinion? I think it's time we just trust that each one of us have learned as much as we can, and made the decision that's right for ourselves.

Let's try to empathize with one another instead of trying to convince one another. We're all fans, and we all are doing what we think is right to support MJJ.

That's what Michael taught us, and we can show it here and now.

:flowers:
:clapping:


Thanks for that! :)
 
Re: PSA- We're all fans here.

I don't know what to say. I'm pretty conflicted about what is going on with the fans. I thought his first album in 9 years would unite his fans like never before, But alas! look what has happened. Very sad. I never thought this would happen in a million years, then again I never thought Michael would be gone this soon.

By nature I'm very positive, but I don't feel it anymore. I still feel this album will be huge, but it's not the same will all the fans not united. I've lost the faith Michael, sorry. Sad, sad. :(
 
Re: PSA- We're all fans here.

Great post. I personally just wish we could have a peaceful environment. And I wish that we could all be able to celebrate MJ and his music and just enjoy the fact that he was with us on this earth for 50 years. It gets harder and harder to be an MJ fan because it feels like you are constantly "at war" with everyone. It would be nice to be "at peace" at least with other fans. It's okay to discuss and disagree, just do it respectfully. Let's stop the fighting....
 
Re: PSA- We're all fans here.

Such a great thread to have right now!

Both sides of this spectrum believe their motives are for the best in Michael. We all want to have his best interests at heart and we all must realize and respect this.

Practice what you preach.

We MUST stick together as a family! It's simply too cold to go at this alone. I miss Michael so much these days and I want a place where I can talk about it. MJJC is the ONLY place I can do this. I love this forum so friggin much sometimes!
 
Re: PSA- We're all fans here.

Great post, well said...
Michael wouldn't want fans arguing with each other... Michael wanted fans to unite and be as one... That's what makes us strong and our voices heard..

We All Have One Thing In Common, We All Love Michael Jackson...
 
Re: PSA- We're all fans here.

Such a great thread to have right now!

Both sides of this spectrum believe their motives are for the best in Michael. We all want to have his best interests at heart and we all must realize and respect this.

Practice what you preach.

We MUST stick together as a family! It's simply too cold to go at this alone. I miss Michael so much these days and I want a place where I can talk about it. MJJC is the ONLY place I can do this. I love this forum so friggin much sometimes!

This is SUCH a good point. I initially needed to take some time off after June, and now I've come back because I need people around me who understand what I'm going through. The kind of grief we are dealing with is so rare, unique, and I think a lot of us don't really know what to do with it.

Michael, to us, was probably one of the closest people and one of the most (if not the most) important person in our lives, yet most of us hadn't even met him. So the friends and family in our lives aren't usually understanding of what we're going through, and we're not able to express our feelings.

Having MJJC is going to be crucially important to all of us in the next years- grief like this doesn't ever completely go away, and we really need a safe haven for us to remember, love, have fun, enjoy, and share with other fans.

As you post at MJJC, notice other fans' "mood" smileys that they've chosen. Most are sad, confused, etc. Most of us are still feeling the effects, and it's really important that we love one another right now- to show that understanding and empathy. If someone attacks, it's possible that they're feeling really frusterated and alone. As Michael said in his Heal the Kids speeches- those are the people who need love the most :flowers: We could all use it.

Thanks for bringing that up :) .
 
Last edited:
SmoothCollins: Respect darling!!! Fantastic post.

We have to find our way back to the family we once were, because as you said, for most of us, our heart is in the right place even though our actions may conflict with each other.
We all L.O.V.E. Michael, that is our bond, and that love that Michael tought us must come first and foremost when we treat eachother, that's what he would have wanted. If we make such efforts to protect his musical legacy, we must also make the extra effort to protect his human legacy; WE are that human legacy, his teachings need to shine through us, so empathy (at least) is top priority.

I too would like to ask everyone to remember that we have a common love, we share something with eachother that very few people understand. Every single day we are faced with ignorance and hate directed at the object of our affection, it bothers, it annoys, it hurts; why bring the hate into OUR home, into our safe place? Makes no sense.
 
WE are that human legacy, his teachings need to shine through us, so empathy (at least) is top priority.

I too would like to ask everyone to remember that we have a common love, we share something with eachother that very few people understand. Every single day we are faced with ignorance and hate directed at the object of our affection, it bothers, it annoys, it hurts; why bring the hate into OUR home, into our safe place? Makes no sense.

I L.O.V.E this- very wise thoughts :flowers: .
 
Back
Top