New MoFi 'Off The Wall' Master One-Step Pressing Announced

[Loneman1]

Not everything has to be a "limited edition super deluxe box set". That's emphasizing quantity over quality. I'd rather forget the filler and have the best possible sound quality (ie Dolby Atmos, multichannel, high bitrate). I'm not interested in having a photocopy of a ticket to a concert I didn't attend, and I'm not interested in having a postcard or a ribbon or a guitar pick or a magazine cover or a piece of chalk. That's just gimmicky nonsense.

Not only that, but putting things in a boxset like that means I'm far less likely actually to play any of the discs. Example: Nirvana's eagerly-anticipated boxset - I've got a copy, but it's never been in my car, etc. it's stuck on a shelf, separate from all my other music (because it doesn't fit), and I kinda forget about it.

Oh, and that price, lol.

Another Nirvana example - the recent anniversaries of both Nevermind and In Utero, both came with 4 full concerts on CD/DVD. But the price was so high, and the numbers were so limited that I couldn't get a copy in my local store. If they'd sold each concert separately, at the going rate (ie $15 each), and actually made them available, I would happily have added them to my collection, but alas, they lost the sale.

Same thing with releases from REM and Beatles and GNR. If you're not gonna properly release something, why create it in the first place?

You can buy all the remastered albums separately from my example of Metallica. I posted all that for people that LIKE the bonus stuff like I and many others do as well as getting the best possible sounding remastered version of the album that is features (the Metallica remasters are eye openingly amazing!!). Cool bonus stuff from the era of the album is a favorite of mine, but as you have pointed out its not for everyone. But with an artist like MJ, there should be more out there. At the very least we could have options to buy deluxe versions purchase all that great stuff! Hell, even a big digital download would be great!

 

[R1chard]

The way I see it, it's two separate products.

If you wanna buy the remastered album, you should be able to buy the remastered album without having to buy the outtakes.

If you wanna buy the outtakes, you should be able to buy the outtakes without having to buy the remixes and duets.

If you wanna buy the remixes and duets, you should be able to buy the remixes and duets without having to buy the surround sound.

If you wanna buy the surround sound, you should be able to buy the surround sound without having to buy the live concerts.

If you wanna buy the live concerts...

You see? Bundling things together into a $240 package is always a bad idea.

 

[Loneman1]

The way I see it, it's two separate products.

If you wanna buy the remastered album, you should be able to buy the remastered album without having to buy the outtakes.

If you wanna buy the outtakes, you should be able to buy the outtakes without having to buy the remixes and duets.

If you wanna buy the remixes and duets, you should be able to buy the remixes and duets without having to buy the surround sound.

If you wanna buy the surround sound, you should be able to buy the surround sound without having to buy the live concerts.

If you wanna buy the live concerts...

You see? Bundling things together into a $240 package is always a bad idea.

Not when those $240 sets sell well for the target audience.

 

[innuendo141]

For anyone in the EU looking to avoid charges from the US or UK. €42 before shipping.

https://www.jpc.de/jpcng/poprock/detail/-/art/michael-jackson-off-the-wall/hnum/11959001

I bought the Thriller SACD from here, no issues.

 

[R1chard]

Not when those $240 sets sell well for the target audience.

Yes, but those overblown boxsets have a tiny run (ie very small target audience). It's easy to sell out if you only made 10 copies. Plus, most of the people can't actually play most of the discs (ie the don't have Dolby Atmos, or they have no way of playing the included 7" vinyl or whatever it is).

People want lower prices. You will always sell more copies of you're selling 1 or 2 discs, rather than 12 discs.

Like, I'm in the small target audience for Appetite For Destruction in 5.1. Do I want a copy for $200? Hard pass.

Likewise, I would love a video of the Victory Tour. Would I buy it if the only option was one for $5000 that came with remixes and one square inch of the stage they used? Absolutely not.

 

[Loneman1]

Yes, but those overblown boxsets have a tiny run (ie very small target audience). It's easy to sell out if you only made 10 copies. Plus, most of the people can't actually play most of the discs (ie the don't have Dolby Atmos, or they have no way of playing the included 7" vinyl or whatever it is).

People want lower prices. You will always sell more copies of you're selling 1 or 2 discs, rather than 12 discs.

Like, I'm in the small target audience for Appetite For Destruction in 5.1. Do I want a copy for $200? Hard pass.

Likewise, I would love a video of the Victory Tour. Would I buy it if the only option was one for $5000 that came with remixes and one square inch of the stage they used? Absolutely not.

It comes down to options for you and a lot of people, and I get that all day long. In a perfect world if record companies could just release this stuff separately in a piecemeal fashion with various things like remastered albums, demos, remixes, live stuff, video content, etc all sold separately that would be great for the consumer, but the companies don't think along those lines due to making a box set the only place to buy this stuff, which makes that box set a hot item to have and a bit more profitable since not many are probably as interested in a whole set of remixes versus something like the set of outtakes/unreleased tracks.

I've been saying for YEARS that if an artist/label doesn't want to fund a big elaborate marketing campaign and physical release, smaller digital releases would be the way to go. COULD they do digital releases of everything separately so fans could pick and choose? In this day and age of course and it would probably be easier, but it would hurt their bottom line not having that box set money thats still on the table. Making sets limited to from anywhere from 50,000-250,000 units creates the collector aspect and the FOMO kicks in as well. In a lot of ways the old way of marketing sets is pretty outdated, though many artists do those digital releases to try to keep up. Metallica's sets are also available with almost all the audio contents available digitally for a cheaper price, but I'm one of those fans/consumers that vastly prefer the physical versions of all the stuff included so that digital option is not for me. They actually include a code in each box to download the digital version as well, but that has no bearing on this particular conversation.

 

[DuranDuran]

People want lower prices. You will always sell more copies of you're selling 1 or 2 discs, rather than 12 discs.

$250 for a CD set is much less than what some folks pay for superhero or Godzilla statues or busts, like $500 or more. Or whatever they spend making extravagant cosplay outfits. People also pay hundreds of dollars to see classic rock bands in concert like Eagles or Paul McCartney or a multiple artist festival like Coachella. Some go to multiple shows. How do you think that Taylor Swift tour made a billion dollars? A concert is a one time thing, a CD set is something that a person can continue to use. Some people pay a lot of money for one used album on Ebay if there's a bid on it and not a "pay now". Also some musicians, actors, & athletes charge money for autographs, to take pictures with them, or meet and greets, and fans pay. Just because you don't want to does not have anything to do with other folks do with their money.

People in general today don't buy physical product anyway, they stream it. Even new release CDs by currently hot artists don't sell that much. Stores like Best Buy stopped selling CDs & DVDs altogether, they only have a few vinyl albums that they stock in the stores. Even Walmart only has a very small selection of CDs/DVDs now, but they do sell them online, Best Buy does not. You're complaining about a $250 box set of several CDs and maybe some other merchandise with it, but these MoFi one step records are like $125 for only the original album with no extra tracks, and probably more if it's a double LP or if they do it as a 45 rpm instead of a 33 rpm.

 

[R1chard]

It comes down to options for you and a lot of people, and I get that all day long.

Exactly. I'm a consumer, not an executive in a record company, so I think from the point of view of a consumer. I couldn't care less how much profit Geffen makes.

In a perfect world if record companies could just release this stuff separately in a piecemeal fashion

Exactly. If T40 had been released as a standalone demos disc there's a chance I might have bought it. But ultimately it was a poor version of the album, with too much filler, so I steered well clear.

not many are probably as interested in a whole set of remixes versus something like the set of outtakes/unreleased tracks.

You got it.

It's always worse to force somebody to buy something they don't want.

Making sets limited to from anywhere from 50,000-250,000 units creates the collector aspect and the FOMO kicks in as well.

In theory, yes. But ultimately these runs are usually too short to make any serious money.

Plus, having such a short run means that most people can't get a copy even if they wanted to. There's no point making somebody desperate to own something that was 100% sold out before it was even released.

I'm one of those fans/consumers that vastly prefer the physical versions of all the stuff included so that digital option is not for me.

Same here. I will never pay money for any music that isn't physical.

People also pay hundreds of dollars to see classic rock bands in concert like Eagles or Paul McCartney or a multiple artist festival like Coachella.

Oh, I know. I've seen the Eagles 2 or 3 times, and I must have been to perhaps 20 festivals in 5 different countries.

But imagine how dumb it would be if you could only get the next McCartney album if it was bundled with a $300 concert ticket.

How do you think that Taylor Swift tour made a billion dollars?

It's called greed.

Also some musicians, actors, & athletes charge money for autographs, to take pictures with them, or meet and greets, and fans pay. Just because you don't want to does not have anything to do with other folks do with their money.

Yes.

But bundling stuff is always anti-consumer. That's all I'm saying.

Stores like Best Buy stopped selling CDs & DVDs altogether

As somebody who only buys physical media, I'm well aware of this. I've tracked the demise of CDs for a decade. In fact, a couple of days ago I read an article that it's no longer possible to buy a new car with a CD player. Subaru was the last manufacturer to offer one.

You're complaining about a $250 box set of several CDs and maybe some other merchandise with it, but these MoFi one step records are like $125 for only the original album with no extra tracks, and probably more if it's a double LP or if they do it as a 45 rpm instead of a 33 rpm.

You're proving my point. If somebody doesn't care about sound quality, they don't have to buy the MoFi. To reiterate my example above, it would be dumb if the only way to get the Junior Vasquez Remix of Off the Wall was to pay $125 for the one-step. It would be dumb if the only way to get the home demo of DSTYGE was to buy a live DVD. Its always better if things are separated out for their target audience. I'm sick of this American obsession with "bonus tracks", and Sony's use of filler to sell whole albums/boxsets.

 

[DuranDuran]

Its always better if things are separated out for their target audience. I'm sick of this American obsession with "bonus tracks", and Sony's use of filler to sell whole albums/boxsets.

If the box sets didn't sell enough to make a profit, the record companies wouldn't continue to make them. They've been around since the 1990s. There's deluxe box sets by little known & obscure artists, not only mainstream popular ones. They aren't heavily advertised, yet the target audience knows about their release. It's not like they're releasing box sets of 78s or 8-track tapes. Collectors are more than willing to pay. These aren't for the general public who mostly only cares about an artists radio hits and not their albums. A few years ago there was a CD set of reproductions of USA Beatles 45s, which is 2 songs on each CD, the A & B sides. There was also a box set of the original US versions of Beatles albums.

You're also talking about what consumers won't buy because it costs too much, the same people who pay over $200 for sneakers like Air Jordans. Some don't even wear the shoes, only collect them. Because they don't want to get them dirty. The sneaker buyers are not just a niche group either like the ones who buy album deluxe box sets. There's even a video series on Youtube where celebrities are shown buying sneakers including Janet Jackson. There's also another series (Most Expensivest) where there's really costly things (like ice cream that costs $1,000) hosted by the rapper 2 Chainz.

 

[R1chard]

If the box sets didn't sell enough to make a profit, the record companies wouldn't continue to make them.

Well, they make a tiny profit, by virtue of them being hideously overpriced, but in the grand scheme of things, no they don't.

You really think TUC comes anywhere close to making as much money as Thriller?!

It's not like they're releasing box sets of 78s or 8-track tapes

Some of the ones I've seen literally do have cassettes and 7" vinyls, along with the CDs, DVDs and BDs. They're honestly a mess. And if you're gonna combine formats like that, it's no surprise that most people are not going to be able to play most of the material.

These aren't for the general public who mostly only cares about an artists radio hits and not their albums.

They aren't for most people, lol.

Again, the more you separate stuff out into smaller, themed collections, the more copies you sell. It really is that simple.

There's actually an MJ boxset that contains all the Sony albums from OTT to Invincible. And nobody actually bought it.

There's even a video series on Youtube where celebrities are shown buying sneakers including Janet Jackson. There's also another series (Most Expensivest) where there's really costly things (like ice cream that costs $1,000) hosted by the rapper 2 Chainz.

I still remember the day in the 90s when I read a headline that Pete Waterman bought Kylie Minogue a gold drink costing £18k ($24k).

That was the day I decided that I didn't give a shit about any company in the music industry, the day I stopped listening to radio/pop music, and the day when I embraced piracy.

 

[DuranDuran]

You really think TUC comes anywhere close to making as much money as Thriller?!

Again, the more you separate stuff out into smaller, themed collections, the more copies you sell. It really is that simple.

If the internet/streaming or file sharing existed in 1982, Thriller wouldn't have made any money either. Comparing 2 totally different eras of how people get their entertainment makes no sense. As I mentioned before, most people don't buy CDs at all, even of new releases of whatever is on the charts. Best Buy didn't stop selling CDs/DVDs for no reason, sales continued to decrease, so the store wasn't making any money on them.. Car companies stopped putting CD players in their cars as a default. Why would people buy CDs if they have nothing to play them on? They listen to music on their phones (smart phones are expensive) and pay a subscription fee to Spotify or some other streamer. You know how Drake, Lil Wayne, the Glee cast, & Taylor Swift got so many hits on the Hot 100? Because of streaming, not because of people buying their 45s like decades ago. With streaming every song on an album is technically a single. Back then album tracks could not chart in Billboard even if they got radio airplay, now they can. Record companies stopped releasing physical singles a long time ago, but the singles chart still exists. It's now based on radio airplay & streaming numbers. The radio songs tend to last longer on the chart than the album songs which mostly chart when an album first comes out.

 

[R1chard]

If the internet/streaming or file sharing existed in 1982, Thriller wouldn't have made any money either. Comparing 2 totally different eras of how people get their entertainment makes no sense. As I mentioned before, most people don't buy CDs at all, even of new releases of whatever is on the charts.

I don't know why you insist on trying to turn every reply into a history lesson, but yes, I know, I've been buying music for close to 35 years...

However, I mentioned MJ: The Ultimate Collection - released in 2004, when CDs were still dominant. The point is, it was 5 discs, and was very confused about its target audience. That's why it only sold 0.2 million copies, and that's why the DVD was eventually released as a standalone disc.

 

[DuranDuran]

I don't know why you insist on trying to turn every reply into a history lesson, but yes, I know, I've been buying music for close to 35 years...

However, I mentioned MJ: The Ultimate Collection - released in 2004, when CDs were still dominant. The point is, it was 5 discs, and was very confused about its target audience. That's why it only sold 0.2 million copies, and that's why the DVD was eventually released as a standalone disc.

You're the only person who is confused by anything. You've said you don't know what New Jack Swing is, when me and many other people can identify it. Box sets are not meant to sell as much as a single new release album. They are mostly for collectors, not the general public. The general public also did not buy bootleg albums (which were illegal), but the people who wanted them knew how to find them to buy. The only box set that I can think of that sold a fairly large amount was that Bruce Springsteen (5 records) live album in the mid-1980s. I think it even made number one on the Top 200 albums in Billboard.

Even a reissue of an old album that is not deluxe does not sell as much as a new release of current contemporary music. So your comment still does not make any sense. New albums with new songs by veteran artists also generally don't sell much. Johnny Mathis & Paul McCartney still release new music occasionally. When was the last time Madonna had a hit, she still releases new music too. Stevie Wonder has a just released new track, it doesn't have that many views on Youtube, nowhere near a hot artist like Megan The Stallion.

 

[R1chard]

Box sets are not meant to sell as much as a single new release album.

Yay, I think the penny must have dropped.

 

[DuranDuran]

Yay, I think the penny must have dropped.

You seem to have a hard time grasping the idea of collectors who collect. They are the people who buy a Beatles Monopoly game or a Michael Jackson doll or a Prince comic book or baseball cards. There's people who buy a lot of Funko Pops and never open the box. They just display them on a shelf. They buy a steelbook version of a DVD that costs more than the one in the regular plastic case. This set of red singles came out in the 1980s. I bought it at the time and still have it, I also have the picture disc for Victory. Most people did not buy picture discs, but they were and still are being made. The sound quality of picture discs is not as good as the normal black records.

Going buy your logic record companies should only release stuff that will potentially sell a lot. But only a very small percentage of albums/singles have become popular the entire time the recording business has existed. Bands who release the kind of ancient music that is played at a renaissance faire has never been mainstream popular or sold much, neither has classical music, polka, zydeco or cultural music from different ethnic groups (aka "world music"). A lot of people are music fans, not 'hit singles' fans or whatever is mainstream popular. Literally thousands of records have come out every year all over the world in many languages. They all can't be popular. It's even more today when a lot of people just upload their music straight on Youtube without being signed to a label or they make videos of themselves playing the bass over a recording. But the largest sellers are generally in English. The biggest record sellers in history are mostly white male rock & roll acts, that sold to primarily to a white audience.

 

[Falcon]

Well.. so Off The Wall get`s a double 45RPM release, but they skipped that on the Thriller one? I really enjoy the audio quality on my MoFi Thriller since it sounds so pristine.. but I was a bit bummed by the fact that they didn`t go for a 45RPM release to reach the maximum potential of vinyl.

I am really curious on how this older album is going to sound. Most people know the Grundman story on the original Thriller pressing and how the MoFi compares to it. They are both excellent releases, but different experiences.
Same goes through my mind for the OTW album. The sound of MJ`s 70`s songs is a bit different.. so how will they approach the mix? I think I will wait for the discounted price on this one. I bought the Thriller one on release day at maximum price, only to see it dropping 30 bucks within a month... (and yeah, this was when the digital scandal was still fresh).

 

[R1chard]

So, the best I've found for shipping the SACD to the UK is €40.99 all in. That's from

HHV | Vinyl, Streetwear & Sneakers Online Shop

Buy vinyl, apparel & sneakers online at HHV. Audited shop, in business since 2002. Huge range: over 100,000 items. Fast delivery, fuss-free returns.

www.hhv.de

Any better than this?

 

[R1chard]

There's also £45.50 from

Home 2023

But they seem confused, and refer to the SACD as vinyl, so I'm not sure about them.

 

[MJbr2]

I've been thinking about something.

According to the MoFi page, the source is a digital transfer (in DSD 256) done by themselves of the original master tape(s). In that case, it should contain the original mixes of Rock With You and Get on the Floor, right?

That'd make it the first post-80s reissue of the original release.

 

[Mister_Jay_Tee]

I've been thinking about something.

According to the MoFi page, the source is a digital transfer (in DSD 256) done by themselves of the original master tape(s). In that case, it should contain the original mixes of Rock With You and Get on the Floor, right?

That'd make it the first post-80s reissue of the original release.

I hope not. At least not that that's all they put out.

 

[NeoGardiV8]

I've been thinking about something.

According to the MoFi page, the source is a digital transfer (in DSD 256) done by themselves of the original master tape(s). In that case, it should contain the original mixes of Rock With You and Get on the Floor, right?

That'd make it the first post-80s reissue of the original release.

It should, in the same way Thriller should have had the OG Billie Jean mix, and if iirc i don't think it did.
I don't think we're getting the OG mixes here

 

[MJbr2]

I hope not. At least not that that's all they put out.

I hope so.

It should, in the same way Thriller should have had the OG Billie Jean mix, and if iirc i don't think it did.
I don't think we're getting the OG mixes here

It did actually, bro.
Also, if their source is really the original master, well, I think we're in for the OGs.

 

[Maxym]

I don't really care how they package as long as they take good care of their ****ing mastering!*

Ideally, there may be cheaper and more expensive packages for the same releases.

Those who absolutely want expensive MJ boxsets can still purchase this absolute wonder

https://epicrecords.shop.musictoday.com/product/Y4LPMJ017/michael-jacksons-this-is-it-10th-anniversary-box-set

* Which should be great with MoFi. I was talking "in general".

 

[SmoothGangsta]

I'd think it would be the first mixes if they're using the original master. Either way I'm fine as I think this release will sound great.

 

[NeoGardiV8]

I hope so.


It did actually, bro.
Also, if their source is really the original master, well, I think we're in for the OGs.

Well that fucking sucks lmao

 

[Sawyer Grubb]

I hope so.


It did actually, bro.
Also, if their source is really the original master, well, I think we're in for the OGs.

It did not. I just listened to it and it did not have the quiet “oh no”

 

[MJbr2]

It did not. I just listened to it and it did not have the quiet “oh no”

You're right, mate. Weird.

The official page of the Thriller OneStep on their website says "mastered from the original (1/2", 30ips) analog master tapes" and it's always the case for them to work with the real master tapes (or safety copies/production masters when they're not available).

Wonder what the deal is with this situation.

 

[NeoGardiV8]

You're right, mate. Weird.

The official page of the Thriller OneStep on their website says "mastered from the original (1/2", 30ips) analog master tapes" and it's always the case for them to work with the real master tapes (or safety copies/production masters when they're not available).

Wonder what the deal is with this situation.

I KNEW I WAS RIGHT
do not gaslight me again, Mjbr2 from The Bad Tour Source!

 

[R1chard]

Found it cheaper.

Michael JACKSON - Off The Wall CD at Juno Records.

Buy Off The Wall at Juno Records. In stock now for same-day shipping.

www.juno.co.uk

£37+4

Any advance on that?

 

[SmoothGangsta]

You're right, mate. Weird.

The official page of the Thriller OneStep on their website says "mastered from the original (1/2", 30ips) analog master tapes" and it's always the case for them to work with the real master tapes (or safety copies/production masters when they're not available).

Wonder what the deal is with this situation.

Strange indeed. I guess the estate wanted them to use current mixes seeing as it's the standard versions now? At least it still sounded great.