MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro - Settlement reached

Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

I really dont think they care. all they see is $ signs. Look how they have treated mj and the kids inreturn for money
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

^ Exactly. To them 25% of something is still better than nothing.

ivy said:
In an interesting note: Mann also got Joe and Katherine to sign some statements saying that Vaccaro is the owner of the assets and they give their support and endorsement to anything that'll be released by Vintage Pop including music masters.

It's scary how they would rather have mj's assets belonging to mann/vaccaro rather than to his estate, just so they can get their 25%. To me that's fraud against mj's children.

Thanks ivy for the summary.
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

All these shady deals were cooked before Michael was buried or right after, and they all involved members of his family.
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

Nothing like a grieving family eh!
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

Mann has filed his response to the Estate's motion for partial judgement

- Mann says Jackson's (Joe, Katherine) had formed "Jackson Communications Inc" (Jermaine was president) and was planning on opening restaurants called "Jackson Street" and they granted memorabilia including music and video recordings to be used in those restaurants.

- Mann states therefore the assets and their intellectual property in question are owned by Joe & Katherine and not Michael. They state Joe and Katherine also claimed ownership of the assets.

- Mann furthermore argues that Joe is the owner of Jackson variety show - as he was the producer and Michael and his siblings were under contract to work for Joe and Joe owns the concert photographs as he hired the photographers.

- Mann and Vaccaro in their declarations mention sworn statements they got from Joe and Katherine saying that they owned the assets & intellectual property and those were rightfully transferred to Vaccaro during bankruptcy sale. (see it at the very end)

- They argue that Michael did not make any ownership claims and did not try to buy any assets during bankruptcy sale.

- They continue to claim that as Michael did not make claims during the bankruptcy sale and as he didn't follow through with the 2004 lawsuit, they are protected against this claims.

- Mann state that Estate is over-reaching in regards to the Smooth Criminal in their logo as Estate has not trademarked it or used it for any of their products.

- Mann's lawyers argue that any other copyright infringement (such as putting TII picture, Opis None and Thriller 25) was done by mistake and Estate is only entitled to get a $200 penalty for it.

- Mann is asking for a summary judgement on his behalf in regards to the assets, ownership and use of it.


Some more tidbits

Multiple lawyers that had represented Vaccaro in the older lawsuits (bankruptcy case, 2004 MJ - Vaccaro case) has been deposed in regards to those lawsuits and the assets. The depositions are mostly business related and is focusing on intellectual property rights. There are a few interesting topics mentioned in those depositions.

Edgar Pease - the lawyer that previously represented Henry Vaccaro and represented HTWF- has been deposed. At one part of his deposition he mentions some actions by Brian Oxman.

Ed Pease says " I BELIEVE THAT THE ATTORNEYS AT THE TIME REPRESENTING MICHAEL JACKSON HAD COMMITTED FRAUD ON THE COURT THROUGH BRIAN OXMAN BECAUSE BRIAN OXMAN HAD REPRESENTED TO THE COURT THAT MICHAEL HAD TOLD HIM TO FILE THIS PARTICULAR DECLARATION. AND I SUSPECTED THAT IT WAS FRAUDULENT, THAT MICHAEL HAD NEVER SEEN IT. MICHAEL WAS OUT THE COUNTRY, OUT OF THE STATE. AND BRIAN OXMAN WAS FILING DECLARATIONS AS IF MICHAEL HAD WRITTEN THEM OR HAD -- BUT THEY WEREN'T SIGNED BY MICHAEL. I SUSPECTED THAT THEY HAD NEVER EVEN DISCUSSED WITH MICHAEL."

Don't you find it funny that HTWF's one of main defense evidence was an affidavit from Brian Oxman telling that Michael told him this and that and Ed Pease under deposition portrays history of fraudulent declarations by Oxman?

Pease is asked about HTWF lawsuit but doesn't comment much due to attorney-client privilege and confidentiality & sealing of the documents. He mentions about his replacement and the lawyer got to replace him said "I SAID, "WHAT ARE YOU DOING? YOU ARE NOT SUPPOSED TO BE FILING THINGS OVER ME." BUT HE SAID SOMETHING THAT I HAD MADE A DEAL WITH THE ESTATE OF MICHAEL JACKSON FOR MONEY OR BEEN BOUGHT AND PAID FOR OR SOME RIDICULOUS, LUDICROUS STATEMENTS. "

This had been mentioned by Melissa Johnson in multiple documents that Pease hadn't looked for her best interest, he's denying such accusations.

Another past lawyer of Henry Vaccaro is also deposed in regards to the previous lawsuits. William Pigg mentions his May 2010 meeting with Howard Mann and his impressions of him. This is quite interesting.


A Two topics that I recall. One was a documentary film project involving Katherine Jackson that he was -- told me he was working on. The other was some book of photographs of Michael Jackson that was being prepared for publication in Japan. He told me he had a deal with the Wolper Brothers to produce a documentary film, the focus of which I understood to be Mrs. Katherine Jackson and her reminiscences about Michael Jackson and the Jackson family, I think, in general. He told me that it was going to be budgeted at $25 million, and that's all that I recall about the film.

Q Do you know why Mr. Mann wanted to meet with you about these two projects?

A Because he knew that I was involved in film production and one of the potential financiers of this documentary is a person I know.

Q Who is that?

A His name is GR Morris.

Q did you discuss meeting again or where did you leave it with him in terms of these two projects?

A I said it was nice to meet you and left. I did not have any anticipation of meeting Howard Mann again after that meeting.

Q Why not?

A Mr. Mann didn't make a favorable impression on me.

Q In what way?

A He was over an hour late for the meeting. He made some representations that upon my vetting him turned out not to be true.

Q Anything else?

A I'm not an expert so I can't answer, I had the feeling he was under the influence of something. What he told me of his background raised warning flags for me. So overall I did not have a favorable impression of Mr. Mann.

Q Okay, let's go back through some of these. You mentioned that he had made some representations to you that on further review by you you found out to be untrue. What were those representations?

A About his association with the Wolpers.

Q What did he tell you and what did you learn of to be untrue?

A He told me that the Wolpers had committed to this film project and that he was late because he was picking up Mark Wolpers' Mercedes Benz to drive from the valley to meet me in Beverly Hills and that he got a ticket and then he got a flat tire and that's why he was late. I don't know the Wolpers, but Mr. Morris does, like, talk to Mr. wolpers, asked him what he knew about Howard Mann. And Mr. Morris said he has nothing to do with the Wolpers -- Wolpers.

Q I understand you're not an expert, but you believed him to be under the influence of something. Can you be any more specific about what you think he might have been under the influence of?

A He looked like a guy who was on coke. He behaved like a guy who was on coke.

Q All right. When you say that you believed he looked like somebody who was on coke, can you be a little more specific?

A He was sweating. He was what I perceived to be overly animated for the context of the meeting, very quick talking, fidgety.

Q his background raised some warning flags for you?

A Uh-huh.

Q Can you be more specific about that?

A He told me he had made and lost a fortune in online -- either online poker or online gaming, I don't recall which. He told me that he had been involved in the adult film industry in Canada. Those were the two things that raised warning flags for me.

Q Okay. And based on the accumulation of all of these things, you formed the view that you did not want to be in any further way involved with Mr. Mann; is that fair?

A Correct.



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Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

Thanks ivy. intesting to say the least.

are they talking about the jacksons varity show that was on t.v? joes claiming he owned them? and hows the varity show connected to lawsuit
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

I don't want to seem mean or disrespectful towards the Jackson Family, but geez..seems they only care about getting cash instead of MJ's estate and MJ's kids.
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

Thank you Ivy.

To say I am surprised that the Katherine & Joe are aligning themselves with crooks, over their dead son's estate would be a lie.
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

Thanks ivy. intesting to say the least.

are they talking about the jacksons varity show that was on t.v? joes claiming he owned them? and hows the varity show connected to lawsuit

Variety show masters - video and audio- were in the storage room and now in the possession of Henry Vaccaro. Opis None (remix of destiny) was included in those masters. Vaccaro is claiming ownership on them including intellectual rights and they have plans to release and/or use them.

Mann / Vaccaro claims Joe owns the rights to Jackson Variety show masters because he was the producer of the show and Michael and his siblings were under contract to him and they were legally "work for hire" meaning they didn't personally have any rights to it.

Edited to add: I have to check but I vaguely remember like CBS made a claim to those masters. I might be mistaken though. I'll let you know if I find anything.
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

And to think they were doing deals with mann in sept 09 is sad beyond belief. poor michael. seems all they were bothered about was how to make money now that he was gone. was mj even burried before they started the discussions? *smdh*
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

Variety show masters - video and audio- were in the storage room and now in the possession of Henry Vaccaro. Opis None (remix of destiny) was included in those masters. Vaccaro is claiming ownership on them including intellectual rights and they have plans to release and/or use them.

Mann / Vaccaro claims Joe owns the rights to Jackson Variety show masters because he was the producer of the show and Michael and his siblings were under contract to him and they were legally "work for hire" meaning they didn't personally have any rights to it.

Edited to add: I have to check but I vaguely remember like CBS made a claim to those masters. I might be mistaken though. I'll let you know if I find anything.

thanks ivy. yeah i was just going to say you would think cbs would have something to say about this as personally i would presume they would own the rights to the shows.and the jacksons seem to make a habit of claiming to own things they dont for the purpose of making money
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

The ownership of the items is a bit confusing. Regardless of who owns the items, the intellectual property belongs to the estate right? Therefore, Mann/Vacarro can not use ANY of these items for profit, is that correct?


Ed Pease says " I BELIEVE THAT THE ATTORNEYS AT THE TIME REPRESENTING MICHAEL JACKSON HAD COMMITTED FRAUD ON THE COURT THROUGH BRIAN OXMAN BECAUSE BRIAN OXMAN HAD REPRESENTED TO THE COURT THAT MICHAEL HAD TOLD HIM TO FILE THIS PARTICULAR DECLARATION. AND I SUSPECTED THAT IT WAS FRAUDULENT, THAT MICHAEL HAD NEVER SEEN IT. MICHAEL WAS OUT THE COUNTRY, OUT OF THE STATE. AND BRIAN OXMAN WAS FILING DECLARATIONS AS IF MICHAEL HAD WRITTEN THEM OR HAD -- BUT THEY WEREN'T SIGNED BY MICHAEL. I SUSPECTED THAT THEY HAD NEVER EVEN DISCUSSED WITH MICHAEL."

Don't you find it funny that HTWF's one of main defense evidence was an affidavit from Brian Oxman telling that Michael told him this and that and Ed Pease under deposition portrays history of fraudulent declarations by Oxman?

I can't remember correctly, what is this affidavit?
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

Edited to add: I have to check but I vaguely remember like CBS made a claim to those masters. I might be mistaken though. I'll let you know if I find anything.

thanks ivy. yeah i was just going to say you would think cbs would have something to say about this as personally i would presume they would own the rights to the shows.and the jacksons seem to make a habit of claiming to own things they dont for the purpose of making money

forget that. the only claims is recently from Sony in regards to Opis None being Destiny song.

The ownership of the items is a bit confusing. Regardless of who owns the items, the intellectual property belongs to the estate right? Therefore, Mann/Vacarro can not use ANY of these items for profit, is that correct?

well that's what the court and/or a jury will decide. What you wrote is what the MJ Estate claims. Mann/ Vaccaro claims they also own the intellectual property.


I can't remember correctly, what is this affidavit?

Pease is mentioning older Vaccaro cases from 2001 to 2004, he mentions at those lawsuits he believed Oxman was filing fraudulent declarations.
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

And to think they were doing deals with mann in sept 09 is sad beyond belief. poor michael. seems all they were bothered about was how to make money now that he was gone. was mj even burried before they started the discussions? *smdh*
it's the sad reality some would rather want to be swept under the rug
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

I really don't get this family at all. And people wondered why Michael kept his distance from them at times. The sad thing is too that Michael always took care of everybody and is expected to still do that now.
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

Pease is mentioning older Vaccaro cases from 2001 to 2004, he mentions at those lawsuits he believed Oxman was filing fraudulent declarations.

I know, but what I was asking is if we know the content of this declaration and of this HTWF affidavit. What the HTWF affidavit that Brian Oxman presented was saying... I can't remember.
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

I know, but what I was asking is if we know the content of this declaration and of this HTWF affidavit. What the HTWF affidavit that Brian Oxman presented was saying... I can't remember.

Oxman had said that in 2005 during his criminal trial Michael told him to give the control of the HTWF to Melissa. Estate had challenged the declaration saying that it was written in the end of 2010 and such authorization had only been mentioned more than a year into the case. They had basically called it a fraudulent declaration on Oxman's part. The reason that I posted Pease's statement about Oxman in 2001 -2004 period is that he also thought Oxman to do fraudulent declarations and now we all also know that Oxman is disbarred for similar actions.
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

- Mann furthermore argues that Joe is the owner of Jackson variety show - as he was the producer and Michael and his siblings were under contract to work for Joe and Joe owns the concert photographs as he hired the photographers.

I dont understand how the variety show is irrelevant since that show was like many many years ago
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

I dont understand how the variety show is irrelevant since that show was like many many years ago

You mean relevant?

Like I said the masters were in the storage and now in Vaccaro's possession. There's I think close to 200 songs - all recorded and played on the show- multiple takes, alternative mixes and so on. Vintage Pop has a music company and have plans to release it.
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

And to think they were doing deals with mann in sept 09 is sad beyond belief. poor michael. seems all they were bothered about was how to make money now that he was gone. was mj even burried before they started the discussions? *smdh*

I tried to look for dates, but I could find anything Sept 09. Where did you see that they were doing deals in Sept 09?
There seems to be some much s..t going on that I cannot keep up with dates:-(
I saw Katherine confirmation letter was dated in 22nd Nov 09, Michael was buried 3rd Aug 09. Obviously they have been talking before the letter was signed, it didn't leave much time for her to ..........(I have to leave this bit open, I don't know what to write there, what was she thinking?)
4 months after that she signed forever binding kids agreement with Mann.
What is the scary part that these are not the only agreements that she signed with Mann!
Howard Mann tells TMZ, "This is one of several agreements with Mrs. Jackson. This was a starting point in our relationship."
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

- Mann says Jackson's (Joe, Katherine) had formed "Jackson Communications Inc" (Jermaine was president) and was planning on opening restaurants called "Jackson Street" and they granted memorabilia including music and video recordings to be used in those restaurants.

Those 3 always start some sort of scheme that usually ends belly up and they end up in troubles.

- Mann states therefore the assets and their intellectual property in question are owned by Joe & Katherine and not Michael. They state Joe and Katherine also claimed ownership of the assets.

and to think Joe and especially Katherine go with that statement is so sad.

- Mann furthermore argues that Joe is the owner of Jackson variety show - as he was the producer and Michael and his siblings were under contract to work for Joe and Joe owns the concert photographs as he hired the photographers.

Was Joe producer the same way as Jermaine was producer for The Jacksons: An American Dream?


- Mann state that Estate is over-reaching in regards to the Smooth Criminal in their logo as Estate has not trademarked it or used it for any of their products.

I thought MJ's SC lean was trademarked? Anyway, they have odd logic regarding not using it for any of their products.
If I own a car, and don't use it for a year, by their logic, they can take it as I haven't used it for a long time:)

- Mann's lawyers argue that any other copyright infringement (such as putting TII picture, Opis None and Thriller 25) was done by mistake and Estate is only entitled to get a $200 penalty for it.

I hope the estate gets tons of penalty money. It was no mistake, are they stupid or what?
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

forget that. the only claims is recently from Sony in regards to Opis None being Destiny song.

thanks. im surprised CBS havnt got involved

ike I said the masters were in the storage and now in Vaccaro's possession. There's I think close to 200 songs - all recorded and played on the show- multiple takes, alternative mixes and so on. Vintage Pop has a music company and have plans to release it.

so hes claiming he owns those songs aswell? which again i would presume CBS would have something to say about it.

bubs i think ivy mentioned further up the thread that the deal with mann was signed in september
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

I tried to look for dates, but I could find anything Sept 09. Where did you see that they were doing deals in Sept 09?
There seems to be some much s..t going on that I cannot keep up with dates:-(
I saw Katherine confirmation letter was dated in 22nd Nov 09, Michael was buried 3rd Aug 09. Obviously they have been talking before the letter was signed, it didn't leave much time for her to ..........(I have to leave this bit open, I don't know what to write there, what was she thinking?)
4 months after that she signed forever binding kids agreement with Mann.

I can help with the dates.

Vaccaro on his deposition said that Mann approached to him telling that he has a deal brewing with Katherine Jackson.

Mann / Vaccaro signs an agreement for a documentary on September 29, 2009.

Mann / Vaccaro joint company agreement is signed on October 19, 2009.

Mann gets Joe and Katherine to sign sworn statements in November 22, 2009.

Mann signs the deal with Katherine on February 3, 2010.

So if what Mann told Vaccaro was true and he had a deal brewing with Katherine that puts the start of talks to September 2009 (at the latest), if he's lying and it happened later it can't be later than November 2009 as it's the date of the sworn statements by Katherine and Joe.

What is the scary part that these are not the only agreements that she signed with Mann!
Howard Mann tells TMZ, "This is one of several agreements with Mrs. Jackson. This was a starting point in our relationship."

this latest documents show that there's at least two other projects - a documentary and selling/ release of the masters from the Jacksons variety shows

so hes claiming he owns those songs aswell? which again i would presume CBS would have something to say about it.

yeah he is. his argument is that Joe was the producer of the show and Michael and his brothers were under contract to Joe which makes them work for hire with no intellectual rights.

But honestly I don't see their logic. Even though we are to agree that Joe owns everything related to Jacksons variety show and it transferred to Vaccaro I don't think they can get the rights of the songs.

For example we know that "Destiny" was reworked, rerecorded, remixed for the Variety show but it doesn't change the fact that "Destiny" is still an officially released song and copyrighted by Sony. So having "Opis None" shouldn't give them the rights over "Destiny" or invalidate Sony's copyright of the song.
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

Thanks Ivy.
So practically she could've started dealing and wheeling with Mann even before Michael was buried. I think I'm going to throw up.
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

I agree. i fail to see how they can claim rights over songs. the songs are copyrighted to CBS or who ever. just because they were used in a tv show that for arguments sake joe does own doesnt mean joe now owns those songs. going by that logic any song thats used for example in a film or t.v show is now owned by the people who made the film or t.v show
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

What a mess. I will never understand those conspiracists(family fans) wanted the Jacksons to control michael's estate, that will be the huge disaster and a suicide act. Thank god Michael knew his business better. The estate provided Katherine a fancy rich life and spent tens of millions dollars on her and children, it's still not enough to her. she kept making shady deals to earn some quick bucks and brought troubles to the estate. Doesnt it sound so familiar? When Michael was alive he paid the Jacksons living and fed the whole family but it's not enough. they brought shady deals or signed fishy contracts to give Michael troubles and lawsuits. Nothing changed. I am sorry for Michael. His name shouldn't be put in the same sentence with the scumbag porn producer.
 
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Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

His family's behaviour disgusts me. I don't understand how a mother could have been consumed by so much greed for money even in the midst of a family tradegy with the loss of a child, when money isn't even an issue. What about those tears she continues to shed everytime she's interviewed? Is it sadness or guilt?

I just want this ugliness to end and I want all the perpetrators to lose hard, including Katherine.
 
Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

Thanks Ivy.
So practically she could've started dealing and wheeling with Mann even before Michael was buried. I think I'm going to throw up.

The wheeling and dealing started immediately. What with jermaine appearing with thome at the hospital on 25 june and in the days following pushing for mj to be buried at colony captial controlled neverland, the appointment of lawyers a couple of days after death for mrs j to take control of the estate. I don't think joe's declaration at BET on the sunday after of a new record company was totally random - he knew mj had unreleased music and wasn't under contract to sony and so was probably making sure he was in pole position to control the new music.

- Mann says Jackson's (Joe, Katherine) had formed "Jackson Communications Inc" (Jermaine was president) and was planning on opening restaurants called "Jackson Street" and they granted memorabilia including music and video recordings to be used in those restaurants.

Lol, i remember jackson communications - i think it was first set up by jermaine for that jackson family honours in 1994 that ended in a 3 yr lawsuit as none of the crew of the prod company hired to put on the event got paid. So the memorabilia supposedly stored to use in these restaurants included soiled underwear and sex aids - slightly unusual decoration.

Thanks ivy for looking over these docs.
 
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Re: MJ Estate Sues Howard Mann and business partner Henry Vaccaro

Michael was buried 3rd SEPTEMBER 2009

Sorry, my mind was some place else while I was typing it. I was thinking Sept but wrote Aug for some reason:bugeyed
I blame Mann, his fishy dealings upsets me.
 
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