Harry Connick, Jr. upset over MJ and Jackson 5 "racist" stage act

[DuranDuran]

that's interesting. i'm offended by the beer ad, myself, and i haven't even seen it. as far as ur neice is concerned, it would be interesting how she saw it, if she broke up with her boyfriend.

i'm just wondering if anybody ever really saw a black person who looks like what those guys were portraying. it was very dramatic portrayal, to put it kindly.

so...the reason why i am convinced that the perspectives are really the same is because..well...let me use just one line...

Jay Leno gets a lot of laughs at jokes that don't seem funny. not just because they may or may not offend someone, but, just because.....they're just not funny. even if they were not offensive..they just...didn't seem like they came from a person with the talent to make people laugh. yet..they laughed all the time. yet..the show was declining greatly in ratings, and went off the air. and now the network says they are in trouble. so...the question is..did those audiences really find the stuff funny...or...were they just laughing because of the hate in their hearts?

Jay Leno has a new show. The Tonight Show still comes on, but is hosted by Conan.

 

[Goodbye Michael]

i'm not offended by the beer ad myself, to tell you the truth i never even thought of it in the way you describe. I just see fitzy and know it's not going to be serious. I wouldn't think many people would really think it was a legitimate charity but i don't have a disabled child so i haven't viewed it from your perspective.

so i guess what you say is true. If i were in your shoes i would probably be more sensitive to that kind of humour. now that you have explained the way you see it, i might be able to see it from that perspective next time it airs, but until you pointed it out i was ignorant as to how it made those with disabled loved ones feel.

your post was a good one.

 

[144000]

Jay Leno has a new show. The Tonight Show still comes on, but is hosted by Conan.

yeah..i know. the network refuses to get rid of him, but that doesn't reflect how he is doing.

 

[000cozzie000]

Was there this much talk about this skit when the same blokes did the same skit 20 years ago on the same show?

They won the show apparently..

 

[DuranDuran]

yeah..i know. the network refuses to get rid of him, but that doesn't reflect how he is doing.

Leno isn't that bad. I've never understood the appeal of Howard Stern. But he makes a lot of money with his act. Andrew Dice Clay doesn't say anything funny either, just uses profanity a lot.

 

[Crisstti]

As a Black American, I feel the need to comment on this performance.

I watched the video and I did not see racism. I saw ignorance and insensitivity. The fact that their faces were painted did not bother me, it was the fact that the faces were tar black that bothered me. It wasn't that they were dancing around that bothered me, it was the fact that the dance moves were horrible.

The point is, the performance was very reminiscent of minstrel shows done in the 1800s and even the 1900s that showed Blacks in an overly stereotypical and degrading way. I understand that they may have been just trying to be humorous, but it wasn't. I'm not sure how blacks are viewed in Australia, but in America, we've fought tirelessly to move away from blacks being portrayed as stupid, inferior, ignorant people.

If they were going to do a real MJ tribute and wanted to dress up and have afros and make themselves look black, they could've done it in a tasteful manner. Robert Downey Jr. played a white actor playing a black man in the the movie Tropic Thunder. It was not offensive, yet it was hilarious. There is a way to be edgy without being offensive.

If you do not understand why someone may find this offensive, I understand. At the same time, I ask you to read this post which I have quoted.




Black face and minstrel shows were done at a time when race relations in the U.S. were horrible and blacks were seen as inferior. To see this type of stuff still being done is upsetting, yet understandable. Some people really just DON'T KNOW.

I agree so much with your post.
That is a calm and objective way of speaking, trying to understand what they might or might have been trrying to do and why... instead of being so judgemental.
Indeed not everyone would have thought it could be considered racist. I mean, Whoopy Goldberg didn't think so, what makes people think that these otehr people in Australia just must have known?.

 

[Crisstti]

I'm sorry, but if one kid -- even ONE kid -- in this world does not know about slavery, she or he needs to be taught. it's one of the blackest marks in WORLD history. it should be on everyone's top reading list in grammar school.

not knowing history compels us to repeat it, or reduce it to skits like this.

I felt even worse after I found out the the lead in the skit is originally from India. HE should know better! horrific.

You know, slavery is not tought at all in Chile. At least it wasn't when I was in school. They didn't even mention it.
For quite a few years the only thing I knew about it was from reading Gone with the Wind...

 

[144000]

You know, slavery is not tought at all in Chile. At least it wasn't when I was in school. They didn't even mention it.
For quite a few years the only thing I knew about it was from reading Gone with the Wind...

"I agree so much with your post.
Good that someone can speak about it in a calm and objective way, trying to understand what they were or were not trying to do and why... instead of being so judgemental.
Indeed noe everyone would have thought it could be considered racist. I mean, Whoopy Goldberg didn't think so, what makes people think that these otehr people in Australia just must have known?."
..................................................................................
so, you have an innate feeling that says that certain people are being judgemental? well, there you go..everyone can take offence to something. but you say people can be totally ignorant of something? Whoopi and Danson broke up shortly after that, and Whoopi took great offence to many things on behalf of MJ when the women of The View were debating about MJ.

speaking of Gone With The Wind, education can come from anywhere.
did you think the depiction in Gone With The Wind was positive?

....just saying.

the objective thing is, this...that everyone can take offence at something, but apparently, some people think that certain people can be completely ignorant of something...even be without an innate feeling...even though, apparently, you were not.

 

[000cozzie000]

I'm sorry, but if one kid -- even ONE kid -- in this world does not know about slavery, she or he needs to be taught. it's one of the blackest marks in WORLD history. it should be on everyone's top reading list in grammar school.

not knowing history compels us to repeat it, or reduce it to skits like this.

I felt even worse after I found out the the lead in the skit is originally from India. HE should know better! horrific.

And I'm sure you wouldn't be saying this unless you have done your research on Australian history, especially aboriginal history..... or else that would just be hypocritical.

Right?

 

[000cozzie000]

Jackson Brothers Respond To Australia’s ‘Jackson Jive’ Blackface Controversy
FIRST PUBLISHED: October 8, 2009 6:05 PM EDT
LAST UPDATED: October 8, 2009 6:17 PM EDT
LONDON, England, U.K. --
On Thursday, Access Hollywood Guest Correspondent Tim Vincent spent the day with Marlon, Tito and Jackie Jackson in London. And it was across the pond that Tim broke the news about the Jackson Jive scandal from down under.

As previously reported on AccessHollywood.com Harry Connick Jr. was left stunned while serving as a guest judge on an Australian Variety show, “Hey Hey It’s Saturday,” when an act came out and performed a sketch called “The Jackson Jive.”

The white act performed in blackface with afro wigs. They sang and danced behind a Michael Jackson impersonator wearing white makeup. Connick gave the group a zero score and said if he had known about the skit he “definitely” would not have appeared on the show.

When Tim recounted the news to the Jackson brothers about the performers, they were shocked.

“Wow, and you want a comment from us about that?” Marlon said. “Man, if they turned up looking like that in the United States!

“They probably weren’t trying to be offensive about it or anything of that nature with the family,” Marlon continued. “We thank Harry for [speaking out], but we also understand that they weren’t trying to be disrespectful for the family.”

While the controversy was news to the Jackson brothers, the one surrounding Dr. Conrad Murray rages on. A Las Vegas court recommended a bench warrant be issued for the doctor after he missed a child support hearing recently.

Meanwhile, the case against him in the homicide of Michael Jackson continues to heat up.

“The LAPD is going to present their case against Dr. Conrad Murray to the D.A. as early as next week. What are your thoughts about this?” Tim asked.

“I think that we have a great police department in Los Angeles, and so you know whatever findings they come up with then that’s what we’ll go with,” Marlon said.
Copyright 2009 by NBC Universal, Inc. All rights reserved.
This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.


http://www.accesshollywood.com/jackson-bro...y_article_23983

 

[DuranDuran]

Slavery isn't "history". It still exists. Much of the world's chocolate is picked by slaves in Africa. There's child sex slaves in places like Tailand. A lot of those overpriced sneakers that people like in America are made by women & children in sweatshops for little or no pay. There is even still slavery in the USA, they're usually immigrants. They might not be picking cotton, but they're here.

 

[Crisstti]

"I agree so much with your post.
Good that someone can speak about it in a calm and objective way, trying to understand what they were or were not trying to do and why... instead of being so judgemental.
Indeed noe everyone would have thought it could be considered racist. I mean, Whoopy Goldberg didn't think so, what makes people think that these otehr people in Australia just must have known?."
..................................................................................
so, you have an innate feeling that says that certain people are being judgemental? but you say people can be totally ignorant of something?

did you think the depiction in Gone With The Wind was positive?

....just saying.

the objective thing is, this...that everyone can take offence, but apparently, some people think that certain people can be completely ignorant of something...even be without an innate feeling...even though, apparently, you were not.

I'm sorry, but I don't think I understand what you're saying...

I don't have an innate feeling that certain people are being judgemental. I think so from reading the posts here. I'm not saying people shouldn't be offended by that sketch, but that to just assume and insiste that they must have known many people would see it as racist... really, if Whoopy Goldberg didn't think so (and ther's no ignorance there) then maybe these people didn't think so. Maybe. They could indeed have been totally ignorant about it.

I kinda find more offensive that they showed Michael white... what were they trying to do?.

NO, I don't think the depiction of black people on Gone with the Wind was positive, but I didn't notice about it until years later (I read the book when I was 10 or 11), when I got into reading about slavery. I was for a time a huge fan of the book, read it like 3 times, so when I read about slavery, and about the stereotypes that were presented in literature, I remembered and thought about some specific scenes that showed that very clearly... there's one especially that is really offensive.

 

[shimar]

Another reason to love Harry Connick, Jr. more.

1) New Orleans Native
2) HOT HOT HOT & not just FINE, he's FOINE
3) Very talented
4) Knows the real roots of jazz & blues
5) Married to fierce Jill Goodacre
6) Good dad
7) Did I mention he's HOT

and...

8) Stood up for MJ, the Jackson Family & Black people everywhere around the world.

I agree that the skit was not done with malice, but there is a very ugly history in the United States particularly with white actors/vaudeville performers doing "blackface" - which perpetuates very negative stereotypes.

But the rest of the world may not be that culturally attuned to US History - and that's the only reason why this issue didn't register to anyone, until Harry (HOTNESS) stepped in.

 

[144000]

I'm sorry, but I don't think I understand what you're saying...

I don't have an innate feeling that certain people are being judgemental. I think so from reading the posts here. I'm not saying people shouldn't be offended by that sketch, but that to just assume and insiste that they must have known many people would see it as racist... really, if Whoopy Goldberg didn't think so (and ther's no ignorance there) then maybe these people didn't think so. Maybe. They could indeed have been totally ignorant about it.

I kinda find more offensive that they showed Michael white... what were they trying to do?.

NO, I don't think the depiction of black people on Gone with the Wind was positive, but I didn't notice about it until years later (I read the book when I was 10 or 11), when I got into reading about slavery. I was for a time a huge fan of the book, read it like 3 times, so when I read about slavery, and about the stereotypes that were presented in literature, I remembered and thought about some specific scenes that showed that very clearly... there's one especially that is really offensive.

i guess no one really has to assume. if you saw the video, you saw that the host of the show was very trepidatious about introducing the act. he knew something wasn't right, but he was going to present them, anyway. and he didn't protest about the idea of apologizing. he knew there was reason to apologize. if he didn't know that something was wrong, then he would have protested when asked to apologize, because he wouldn't be able to understand that anything was wrong, even if people disagreed. by the way, like i posted earlier, Whoopi was offended. she just put on a front, earlier, but, later, it proved to be the undoing of her relationship with Ted Danson, and she started getting edgy on the View in defense of MJ, about a lot of things, later on.

 

[Naytobes]

They won the show apparently..

Really? So 20 years ago Australians thought it was funny, and now they don't? Odd. (No, that's not me saying i thought it was funny, just an obsevation)

I don't know why there is focus on harry sticking up for the Jackson's though, I don't think his comments had anything to do with them personally at all.

At the end of the day, the skit was stupid, for many reasons.

I can only wonder if we'd be talking about this if Harry hadn't have said anything at all??

 

[Goodbye Michael]

yeah 20 years ago nothing was off limits.

it wasn't neccessarily considered funny, but this was a variety show on every saturday night, a family thing, with stupid contest, skits, a pink ostrich, a crazy duck, musical guests etc. this segment was a talent contest, 3 contestants (individuals or teams) who perform an act and try to finish it before being "gonged" by the angry judge. the other judges are guest judges, like HC Jr. the acts are usually stupid, occasionally funny, rarely serious. This was the reunion show, it hasn't been on for a while.

20 years ago aussie humour use to pick on everyone, including our bogan selves. As the world has progressed and things like racism and bigotry are not tolerated and jokes about it are no longer considered harmless we, as well as the rest of the world, have had to learn to be more sensitive to others feelings.

there wasn't has much political correctness back then.

 

[callmerose]

I kinda find more offensive that they showed Michael white... what were they trying to do?.

.

I found the whole skit offensive. Not just for the black face but for the lampooning of the Jackson Five. This was not a tribute. And like Crisstti, I was really offended by Michael's white face. This is the kind of sh*t he had to put up with all the time. Making fun of someone with a horrible skin disorder would not be tolerated unless of course, you are making fun of Michael and then it's ok. The whole lot of them should apologize for that tasteless mess.

 

[Daniel.San]

I'd like to know what Harry Connick Jr. thought about Robert Downie Jr's performance in Tropic Thunder? You could also say the same about the Wayans brothers performance in White Chicks...

It's a sensitive issue which surely wasn't meant to be seen as racist. The real sad issue here is the Australian media, who blew it up into something it really isn't and has now become a global headline. The result from this is that it makes Australian's as a country look racist when in reality we're one of the most multicultural societies in the world.

 

[Daniel.San]

I found the whole skit offensive. Not just for the black face but for the lampooning of the Jackson Five. This was not a tribute. And like Crisstti, I was really offended by Michael's white face. This is the kind of sh*t he had to put up with all the time. Making fun of someone with a horrible skin disorder would not be tolerated unless of course, you are making fun of Michael and then it's ok. The whole lot of them should apologize for that tasteless mess.

They have apologized. I found it more "offensive" to Michael Jackson as a person than to any race in particular.

 

[Crisstti]

I found the whole skit offensive. Not just for the black face but for the lampooning of the Jackson Five. This was not a tribute. And like Crisstti, I was really offended by Michael's white face. This is the kind of sh*t he had to put up with all the time. Making fun of someone with a horrible skin disorder would not be tolerated unless of course, you are making fun of Michael and then it's ok. The whole lot of them should apologize for that tasteless mess.

Yeah, they were probably hinting at him supossedly not wanting to be black or something...

YOu'd be amazed at the amount of journalists here who, when he died, and when making tribute progams (showing his videos and staff) would call him "the black man who wanted to be white". Such an awful thing to say (and often they were not even trying to be offensive)... isn't it an established fact that he had vitiligo?. IT's incredible the amounts of people who just don't believe it.

 

[*MissChanel*]

Acts on those segments are not to be taken seriously. It's a segment not about talent or tributes but about people with the guts to make fools of themselves so Aussies can laugh at them! It's about ridiculous acts so when people says "It wasn't a tribute". That is not the nature of the segment. You really have to understand the show to know that. Now, I'm speaking about the segment show here and not about the act, just to make that clear.

Here is a quote from an aussie on another forum about the act:

honestly i don't believe they thought about what they did. in no way were they thinking racism but i totally get how it could be perceived that way

jackson 5 aren't even black, they are brown and they could of just had the wigs and outfit and we would of recognized who they were impersonating... but to me cause those acts aren't really tribute acts, they are comedy and really people can be stupid on their and embarrass themselves and get away with it. i think because of that, they wanted to hide their identity (seeing as they are doctors) and painting their faces was a way to kinda put a mask on and not identify themselves. so i don't believe it was intentional but it was really stupid and i can see how it was perceived as racist especially considering the black face history which i had no idea about.

 

[callmerose]

Yeah, they were probably hinting at him supossedly not wanting to be black or something...

YOu'd be amazed at the amount of journalists here who, when he died, and when making tribute progams (showing his videos and staff) would call him "the black man who wanted to be white". Such an awful thing to say (and often they were not even trying to be offensive)... isn't it an established fact that he had vitiligo?. IT's incredible the amounts of people who just don't believe it.

Yes, it is an established fact. Even if you didn't know him, anyone could look at the pictures on youtube and other places now where you can clearly see it. People believe what they want to believe.

 

[Dimity]

This may be quite off topic, but I watched "Norbit" for the first time last week, and I didn't feel comfortable with many of the stereotypes that it portrayed. To some degree there were elements of racism, sexism and stereotypical views on body-image. I love Eddie Murphy and I usually find his style of humour funny, but this show just made me feel uncomfortable. Was it OK for an African American man to dress up as an overweight, overbearing African American woman? Hmmmm. It missed my "funny spot." I found it in bad taste also.

 

[indranee]

the thing is, if they wanted to show "the Jacksons", the could have used a lot of other imagery/props/etc. they didn't HAVE to use the black/white faces.

they said that they even TALKED about it. then they decided to go ahead with it anyway. niiiice.

NOT.

they're doctors. intelligent, supposedly well-read. they did this 20 years ago. they're telling me they didn't keep up with how the times have changed and how the internet and youtube is EVERYWHERE and America now has a Black prez?

ugh. ugly and scandalous and just plain stupid is what it is.

I have no sympathy. they had it coming.

 

[.Butterflies.]

Let me explain the typical Australian mindset to the 'humour'.

Most of us (myself included) thought the skit was meant to be mocking Michael's vitiligo alone, seeing as there was only one person with a WHITE painted face. It was meant to be the contrast of Michael's skin to his brothers in the background that was 'funny.' In other words, the punchline was meant to be vitiligo and how 'weird' and different Michael is to everyone else, not African Americans as a whole.. not at all. In the original skit, all the performers INCLUDING Michael had black faces and now Michael has a white one - 'haha'. That was the joke fullstop. That's why they came back on air to share the punchline. That was exactly what the vast majority of Australians saw humour to. Nothing more, nothing less. Don't get offended or think I'm patronizing your views because your reactions are valid. I'm just being honest, that's how it was taken to the vast VAST majority of us.

In spite of that, it is STILL offensive. Had there been no black paint at all and only 'Michael' in stark white paint. It would STILL have been offensive to Mj whose message was that race is irrelevant, but yet they payed a 'tribute' to him zooming in on his skin color alone and how he has physically changed. His vitiligo has been joked about over and over and over and people have become desensitized to the fact that it's offensive to make fun of. I doubt even most Americans (other than Mj fans) would haven given a shit if like I said, there was no black face and only a stark white painted faced Michael to stand out. Think of it like that if you can't understand the Australian mindset. It was just another lame vitiligo joke to most of us...

Until I learned about the history aspect of the black face paint I honestly can't say I saw any form of racism with that bit -- just stupidity, and like I said, like most Australians I thought it was there ONLY to highlight how they were mocking MICHAEL. Had the lead 'singer' like me and the majority of Australians, claimed he had no idea of the negative implications of the paint and it's use in history, people might have felt completely different, but seeing as he and the network were completely aware of it, they should never have aired it.

I think their logic of thinking behind it was that even though they 'knew' about the racist aspect to Americans, *Australians* wouldn't generally see it as racism and seeing as it's an *Australian* show, they went ahead. I'm not saying it's right to have done so, but I think that was what the lead performer was insinuating in his response to the ordeal and although I CAN see where they are coming from, at the end of the day they shouldn't have gone there. They shouldn't have even touched the subject with humor.

In all honesty, if Harry Connick Jnr wasn't there i highly highly doubt this would have ever been a scandal. Australians would have laughed and moved on for the reasons I said... just another lame vitiligo joke to highlight how 'weird' and different Michael jackson is to everyone else. Ha.ha. At the very least, I for one have learned a lot about something I would have otherwise been completely ignorant about and I hope if anything, the message will spread.

 

[indranee]

yeah except THEY didn't say they wanted to do that. they said they were all HUGE fans of the KOP and wanted to do this as a tribute to him.

depicting him as "wierd and different" doesn't quite jive with that, ya know?

 

[.Butterflies.]

yeah except THEY didn't say they wanted to do that. they said they were all HUGE fans of the KOP and wanted to do this as a tribute to him.

depicting him as "wierd and different" doesn't quite jive with that, ya know?

I'm not defending them. It wasn't a tribute, it was a MOCK. Huge fans my fat ass!

 

[8701girl]

They have apologized. I found it more "offensive" to Michael Jackson as a person than to any race in particular.

I feel the same way.

 

[indranee]

I'm not defending them. It wasn't a tribute, it was a MOCK. Huge fans my fat ass!

oh okdoke.

agreed. 'twasn't a tribute.

 

[8701girl]

Let me explain the typical Australian mindset to the 'humour'.

Most of us (myself included) thought the skit was meant to be mocking Michael's vitiligo alone, seeing as there was only one person with a WHITE painted face.

thats what i thought it was bout too.