MsCassieMollie
Proud Member
Based on what he said about women, his marriages, etc....
Oh yes. I know in my heart he was marriage material. He had alot of love in him. IMO, Michael's problem was his CHOICE in women. It seemed he wasn't to good in his pick of a woman.
I do not agree that Lisa Marie was the love of his life. I believe they did fall for each other BUT it was a total mismatch.Michael needed a strong woman, a GENUINELY strong woman. Not a woman who had the 'appearance' of strength: you know the typical confrontational, combative, brash, potty-mouth, controlling and domineering. But a woman who had the honesty, fierce protectiveness, and who would respect him as her husband and as a man and whom Michael would respect and who would want to be with. Not to mention a woman who was spiritual and who want him to be the father of her children and who had no doubt he was the one for her.
She also had to be strong enough to deal with the life that was involved in being with him. And she also had to know how to deal with Michael as a person. Michael was the type that didn't take to harshness and brashness NOR dominance not clingyness. He seemed like the type that would get stubborn the minute he sinced a person was trying to control him. That's one of the reasons why he and Lisa Marie got into arguements alot. Michael had a stubborn streak, and was used to being a single man and had to adjust to being married. Lisa was a spoiled, pampered, rebellious princess who was used to having her way and expected Michael to say "how high?" when she wanted him to 'jump' so to speak.Not to mention a mother who hated him.
Lisa Marie was not the one for Michael at all.
What do you mean 'what he said about women'?
I don't think of marriage as being anything more than merely a tool to advance one's political, social, and/or financial position (as history has proven throughout the ages--this idea of "love" having anything to do with it is so 20th century...)With that said, I know he wanted it, but he was one of those hopeless romantics, for better or for worse. In reality, these things don't really exist, and I think he had a difficult time realizing this. It's a shame, because he was a great person, and I think he would have made a suitable partner.
I think his marriages failed because of circumstances and events outside his control, as some have said, and general lack of compatibility between himself and the women he chose. Sharing similar values and holding a certain amount of respect, if not downright camaraderie, is essential for any two (or more) people living together (just ask college kids). Whenever disharmony exists between point A and point B, things will not work out, and this can be observed in Lisa Marie's attempts to use and control Michael, and later on in Debbie Rowe's entire nature (she's truly a vile woman, IMO). No matter what, if one of the two parties is seeking to profit from the other in a parasitic manner, conflict will inevitably ensue, and rightfully so.
With that said, I think Michael wanted to form a union with a woman very badly, but also very much on his own terms (he did have a certain stubbornness...), and I think a large part of his own vision of how this should be carried about was formed by the fantasy our current culture/society conditions us to believe in.
Ultimately, I think he missed nothing. He seemed a lot happier being a single dad than having to deal with the pettiness of marriage.
I think the reason why he spent so much time with families (eg. the Cascios and so on) because he was really longing for a family like that. I think he wasn't happy alone, but he felt very lonely. And had he found the right woman he was the kind of person who could have been a very happy married man.
Other people's rejection and views of marriage as 'new romantic construct devoid of reality' has absolutely nothing to do with Michael himself. In fact, all of us are speculating.
Marriage does not have to be a fruitless endeavor for people forcing themselves into an 'illusion of forced monogamy'- marriage is whatever you make it out to be and however YOU understand it to be. It is time we stopped condemning another's search for what makes them happy in life. And I really don't care if you're gay, swinging through the clubs or have been married for 30 years.
Other people's view on marriage has absolutely zero to do with Michael- who most obviously had his own understanding of marriage- as he more or less demonstrated.
Unless we all agree on what "marriage material" is, this is going to remain pretty shallow.
*happily married and very much understanding WHY Michael spent so much time with other families such as the Cascios*
...
I only really wish more parents were like Michael. He was unique in that he came from a home where abuse was the norm, and he succeeded in completely breaking the pattern in his own experience. In most cases, the pattern successfully continues down the line, which is why it is not uncommon to see that an abusive parent was abused as a child, so on and so forth up the line of ancestry. Kind of sad, really.
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Sometimes I do think "If only he'd had a devoted wife...maybe he would be here?", tho.
Although he was a hopeless romantic in some ways, his one true interest was to have a family--the marriage would then be a tool with which to achieve this, and in and of itself, I think it would be quite extraneous and irrelevant. However, he was not entirely immune to the modern cultural idealization of marriage as a union of "love" or whatever. Since monogamous lifetime union is quite deviant behaviour amongst mammals such as ourselves, I daresay none of us are really "marriage material," Michael included.
Edit: I hope this makes sense. I apologize in advance if I'm incoherent--I'm under the influence of my pain meds at the moment, so I keep forgetting the things I wanted to talk about.
However, you are ultimately right--all the posts in this thread, including yours and mine, are all speculation.We are all just giving our opinions on the matter.
this is such a weird conversation
The helpless, cure less romantic in me kinda loves that vision. Because of Christian morality i used to think love, sex and marriage were three inseparable things.
I always find it interesting when people attribute these ideas, and also monogamy to Christianity. In fact, if you read the Bible it doesn't say anywhere that marriage should be between one man and one woman or that it should be based on love and romance! In the Bible you see lots of people with several wives - eg. King Solomon had as many as 700 wives and 300 concubines! I bet that wasn't based on love and romance. Abraham, Jacob, David etc. etc. - they all had several wives and concubines. It wasn't about love and romance but about fertility. The more offspring a man had the better it was - and this was the most important thing, more important than such abstract ideas as romance. According to the Bible when Abraham's wife, Sarah couldn't give children to Abraham she gave him her female servant to sleep with him and have kids with him. There's no love and romance involved, just the need of having offspring. Also in Moses' law you will see things such as if a man dies and leaves behind a wife without offspring, his brother is required to marry her and make her babies. Again, where is the love and romance? It wasn't about that at all!
You might say the New Testament is different, but the New Testament does not forbid polygamy either - expect for the elders of the church. Otherwise it doesn't say anywhere it's forbidden to have several wives. Of course, by the time of the New Testament was written generally monogamy was more wide-spread in the world, so men had one wife in the NT too. But it wasn't because of religious rules and orders. It was probably more because of economical reasons (you had to be rich to provide a living for many wives and children).
So basically "Christian morality" is not monogamous at all. It's a modern misconception that it is. Also marriage isn't necessarily built on love and romance. The Bible talks about marriage more like a contract (in which women are not equal parties, by the way, they are required to be submissive).