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Coroners Report released - GRAPHIC CONTENT (Threads merged)

I read the 51 pages and I do not trust 100% in what is there. And the most bizarre thing is there is that Michael was wearing no clothes at home. (????) I do not think he would be without clothes at home in the presence of a doctor or someone took his clothes. I do not understand why he was without clothes.
 
ashtanga said:
I read the 51 pages and I do not trust 100% in what is there. And the most bizarre thing is there is that Michael was wearing no clothes at home. (????) I do not think he would be without clothes at home in the presence of a doctor or someone took his clothes. I do not understand why he was without clothes.
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It is likely they took them off in the emergency room and gave his belongings to his mother at that time.
 
inregards to the bolus injection a question. we know there was an iv bag etc with no pump. how do we know murray also gave mj a bolus injection aswell?
 
twinklEE said:
Wasn't he wearing a hospital gown at home?
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Honestly, I don't know. I do know they would have had to remove his clothing in order to put all the lines in him (there were some in his groin), and if he had an IV in his leg one would assume he didn't have on long pants.
 
elusive moonwalker said:
maybe its cause i didnt go to bed till 4am but arent u contridicting yourself there. u dont think murrya used the stuff on mj ie there was nothing to wean him off but then u dont think all those 8 bottles were used in one night.


because mj wouldnt have lasted 6 weeks if murray treated him the way he did on the 25th?
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I'm not speculating elusive here , the urine concentraion is very clear, there is non chance in hell these bottles were used that night , 0.15 is nothing , NOTHING compared to 550 urine bladder . I can't say how much exactly but it is VERY LOW , it does not support even an HOUR of propofol . it is much much shorter than that .

as for lorazepam , the same we are not speculating , the numbers are very clear , it was not used prior to that day . that's why I no longer understand what's the point of giving propofol then ?
 
Beachlover said:
Honestly, I don't know. I do know they would have had to remove his clothing in order to put all the lines in him (there were some in his groin), and if he had an IV in his leg one would assume he didn't have on long pants.
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Yea, I think he was either wearing the gown at home, or like you said no pants.
 
Soundmind said:
I'm not speculating elusive here , the urine concentraion is very clear, there is non chance in hell these bottles were used that night , 0.15 is nothing , NOTHING compared to 550 urine bladder . I can't say how much exactly but it is VERY LOW , it does not support even an HOUR of propofol . it is much much shorter than that .

as for lorazepam , the same we are not speculating , the numbers are very clear , it was not used prior to that day . that's why I no longer understand what's the point of giving propofol then ?
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thanks for trying to explain it. i must be just really tired cause i aint getting it at all. guess i dont understand the differences between concentration and bladder.reading that it says to me there was only a small amount 0.15 in his system. whats the 550 urine bladder. is it the amounts in his blood that showed it was a lage amount he was given
 
Soundmind said:
I'm not speculating elusive here , the urine concentraion is very clear, there is non chance in hell these bottles were used that night , 0.15 is nothing , NOTHING compared to 550 urine bladder . I can't say how much exactly but it is VERY LOW , it does not support even an HOUR of propofol . it is much much shorter than that .

as for lorazepam , the same we are not speculating , the numbers are very clear , it was not used prior to that day . that's why I no longer understand what's the point of giving propofol then ?
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It could be possible the actually tried to dump the propofol and felt he ran out of time so he tried to hid the rest. Once he did that, he try to explain away the empty bottles by saying he was given to him for 6 weeks and hope that the tox would not be able to track otherwise.
 
elusive moonwalker said:
thanks for trying to explain it. i must be just really tired cause i aint getting it at all. guess i dont understand the differences between concentration and bladder.reading that it says to me there was only a small amount 0.15 in his system. whats the 550 urine bladder. is it the amounts in his blood that showed it was a lage amount he was given
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The 550 is the volume (amount of urine that was IN the actual bladder). Propofol is a very fast saturating and dissipating drug. It appears it killed him quickly.

The tox reports from the hair would come in very handy here. We can not say whether he used the Propofol before. Actually, Propofol is hard to detect after a certain amount of hours rolls by.
 
Beachlover said:
The 550 is the volume (amount of urine that was IN the actual bladder). Propofol is a very fast saturating and dissipating drug. It appears it killed him quickly.

The tox reports from the hair would come in very handy here. We can not say whether he used the Propofol before. Actually, Propofol is hard to detect after a certain amount of hours rolls by.
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But to my understanding, you can still track it. That is how they know if you die from an overdose of Propofol verses dying usage over time. Also, looks like he most likely died within 5 to 10 minutes of the Propofol usage. Which makes me wonder if Murray left the room right away and why. He could had made the phone calls in the room or maybe he did them on the stool. If this was his first time given Michael Propofol like this, why did he feel safe to leave in the first place? It does seem to boarders on being plan, but it is honestly too stupid to be the case.
 
ok thanks. so if as it appears it killed him pretty much straight out then u can use that evidence to start to pick around murrays stories as to when he found mj. and u can certainly start to imply either he found him and spent time covering it up or mj died and the fool didnt even notice till god knows when cause he was on the phone talking for an hour
 
januska said:
After all the years of being Michael's fan and wanting to know as much as I could about him, to feel closer to him...this is the point where I do realize I've learned too much and too detailed information... Gosh, I didn't need to know how much his heart weighed because I already knew he had a big heart...:teary_eyed:
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I can't find right words in English right now, it made me cry so hard.... :no:

:hug:
 
twinklEE said:
Wasn't he wearing a hospital gown at home?
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Page 5:


85963894.gif



It was not clear to me: the body was not clothed (home? He had no clothes at home?) and there were clothes for review (No clothes in the home? Nothing?)??? :scratch:
 
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ashtanga said:
Page 5:


85963894.gif



It was not clear to me: the body was not clothed (home? He had no clothes at home?) and there were clothes for review (No clothes in the home? Nothing?)??? :scratch:
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If he was only wearing a nightgown, they would had tore it off while trying to save him. In a life or death situation, you have no pride. Being strip naked like that is not an endearing thought.
 
You know instead of Larry King getting all these people on to talk about Michael, why not get a decent panel of doctors on who can answer these questions.
 
hilliver said:
You know instead of Larry King getting all these people on to talk about Michael, why not get a decent panel of doctors on who can answer these questions.
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They will most likely do that once the evident is presented, much like what they do for other cases. Once the DA lay why they are charing him exactly and this is their proof of his guilt, then we will see 100+ 'experts' given their opinion. However, I don't take much weight with talking heads.
 
HeroR said:
If he was only wearing a nightgown, they would had tore it off while trying to save him. In a life or death situation, you have no pride. Being strip naked like that is not an endearing thought.
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I think at least he was in pajamas and Murray would take only a blouse/shirt to do CPR. The clothing is available... There was Michael's clothes in the bedroom and anywhere else in the home?? This is very strange for me... not having Michael's clothes anywhere. :unsure: :scratch: Well, the entire report is strange. :mello:
 
ashtanga said:
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85963894.gif



It was not clear to me: the body was not clothed (home? He had no clothes at home?) and there were clothes for review (No clothes in the home? Nothing?)??? :scratch:
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Page 3 BODY EXAMINATION:

The decedent was wearing a hospital gown.

The fact is there were no clothes found in the room on the floor when they checked the room and it looked like the scene was as is because gloves and other things were found on the floor. In the scheme of things, I feel worse looking at this than the medical aspects. I feel like I am invading his privacy now.
 
Beachlover said:
Page 3 BODY EXAMINATION:

The decedent was wearing a hospital gown.

The fact is there were no clothes found in the room on the floor when they checked the room and it looked like the scene was as is because gloves and other things were found on the floor. In the scheme of things, I feel worse looking at this than the medical aspects. I feel like I am invading his privacy now.
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:unsure:

Ok....
 
Beachlover said:
Page 3 BODY EXAMINATION:

The decedent was wearing a hospital gown.

The fact is there were no clothes found in the room on the floor when they checked the room and it looked like the scene was as is because gloves and other things were found on the floor. In the scheme of things, I feel worse looking at this than the medical aspects. I feel like I am invading his privacy now.
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So he was wearing a hospital gown at home, I can't imagine him laying there butt naked in front of Murray telling him to put him to sleep. I assume it they tore it down, like someone mentioned before. I agree Beachlover it feels wrong. So damn wrong.
 
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hilliver said:
You know instead of Larry King getting all these people on to talk about Michael, why not get a decent panel of doctors on who can answer these questions.
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I second your idea. I guess it wouldn't sell.
But maybe we as fans can ... try to get a professional panel like that?
We don't have all results tho so a lot of that would still be assuming.
 
I think this was TMI, and it doesn't really matter what clothing he was or was not wearing at home, in bed. What MATTERS is if the LAPD have whatever clothing he was wearing, for forensic evidence. They'd look for any blood, spills of medication, and any DNA evidence from Murray and/or anyone else. A single HAIR can sometimes solve an investigation.
 
twinklEE said:
So he was wearing a hospital gown at home, I can't imagine im laying there butt naked infront of Murray telling him to put him to sleep. I assume it they tore it down, like someone mentioned before. I agree Beachlover it feels wrong. So damn wrong.
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That really boarders on nightmare fuel when you put it in that view. But, if he had an IV in his leg he would not be wearing pants. Yeah, not an endearing thought, like I said.
 
Didn't he have a IV behind his knee for propofol and a condom catheter at home? wouldn't that mean he would have no pants and no underwear? If this is the case then I guess naked or wearing a hospital gown makes sense?
 
this brings to mind that bloody shirt that they found..now weather or not that was a hoax ..IDk....I just thought i would throw that out there...it was in the closet???
 
Soundmind said:
I'm not speculating elusive here , the urine concentraion is very clear, there is non chance in hell these bottles were used that night , 0.15 is nothing , NOTHING compared to 550 urine bladder . I can't say how much exactly but it is VERY LOW , it does not support even an HOUR of propofol . it is much much shorter than that .

as for lorazepam , the same we are not speculating , the numbers are very clear , it was not used prior to that day . that's why I no longer understand what's the point of giving propofol then ?
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SO what does the sentence quoted here already relate to?

On page 31 of the autopsy report, last sentence, the anesthesiologist consultant states : "Lorazepam, a long acting benzodiazepine, is present at a pharmacologically significant level and would have accentuated the respiratory and cardiovascular depression from propofol".
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xthunderx2 said:
this brings to mind that bloody shirt that they found..now weather or not that was a hoax ..IDk....I just thought i would throw that out there...it was in the closet???
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If it was anything important, the DA would had collected it. Although, if they was blood when he put the IV in, he would have used a towel or a wash cloth, not a shirt.
 
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