We're all here for the same reason

AG5050

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and thats Michael, we're all here to remember and honour him and we are all looking forward to new projects whether that is the new album, the new game, the new DVDs or even any further future projects. Lets keep this a place of positivity, thats the example Michael always set and we should follow, its all for L.O.V.E Love remember :)
 
Sunflowers or roses? Love when the going get rough.

Somehow my heart hurts. I even cried tears feeling the disrespect with which Michael's fans treat another. I'm that melodramatic.

"And with your pen you torture men, you'd crucify the Lord." Yes, indeed. Because we are all too willing to crucify one another with never ending loads that are firing from our pens.

So much talk about Love and upholding what all sides in this call "Michael's legacy". What is Michael's legacy? Healing the world with music? Or "winning" an argument by "MAKING THE 'OPPONENT' UNDERSTAND" your point of view at all cost? Until they weep before you pleading with you that they now see things your way?

Wars start this way. Exactly this way.
We look across this planet and shake our heads in disbelief why it is that countries are at war with one another, why it is possible that neighbor A seems to turn into an animal by walking over to neighbor B and slashing him to death. And we do this over and over again.

Not only do we disagree with one another- no, we fight 'til the very bitter end, feeling entitled to all actions to MAKE THE 'ENEMY' SEE THINGS OUR WAY, as if we were in a war.

That mindset makes wars possible. Because those neighbors who might have lived next to each other for years also feel they are entitled to take all 'final' action.

So, one side accuses those who are alright (or even support the tracks in question) with certain tracks of being naive sheep that need to rinse their ears, who are being blind sided by evil forces.

Side A on the other hand accuses Side B of being naive sheep and being easily susceptible to mass hysteria- and of being kill joys on top of that.


Both sides (with exceptions everywhere) are unified by feeling they are in the possession of truth and that they are both motivated to uphold what they call 'Michael's legacy' which again begs the question- what is his legacy?

Michael Jackson was sued frivolously countless times. Again and again and again, no mercy in sight.
Imagine the anxiety, pain, hurt and disappoint he must have felt rising inside of him each and every time his lawyers would inform him- 'Mr. Jackson, I hate to be the bearer of bad news, you are being sued by x,y and z.'
Who would ever want to pick up the phone yet again, turn the TV on or read another newspaper?

Yet how often did he actually sue somebody in return? Compared to the countless lawsuits and depositions he endured? In the wake of the most horrifying and searing pain he personally endured- his own personal pain, a pain that NOBODY could endure for him?
Did Michael Jackson stand up and say, now buddy, I am going to make you feel the same amount of pain that I had to endure until YOU scream the way I screamed inside and out?
Did he go out in the world looking to "avenge" his pain?
Or was he aware that the damage was done, that the pain was already inflicted- and that no amount of rage or action was going to take the pain from him?

Or was he looking for ways to help people heal themselves and thus the planet by seeking ways to love another as 'brothers', as he often said? Was he hoping that people could understand his pain and exercise true compassion by ceasing all action that would deliberately cause another pain?

This singular being left an imprint on my very essence that NOBODY has left. I read in books about them, I read in book about Gandhi- but this dude called Michael Jackson- he made me UNDERSTAND to a degree that freaks me out.
That is why people are here, beyond the music, beyond the dance. I could get 5 whole body tattoos (okay, I got one little one)- that's nothing compared to the way he got UNDER my skin to make me understand.
Not just his life and his light- but my very own. Your very own life and light.
Through his life and his music I learned more than any book could teach me.
His death left me standing at the edge of the swirling black hole, until this day. But it served a purpose. There's work to be done here.

True Peace does not mean having to "give into" the other side of an argument.
Peace simply means to be aware of the damage that that could or is being inflicted on someone if one insists with all might to MAKE the other one see your point. And it means being able to stop the firing so that nobody, bystander or involved, 'collateral damage' (how that word makes me hurt) or soldier- gets killed or hurt. It means stopping before it's too late to stop.

Side A is convinced that certain tracks are 'fake' and thus action is not only justified, but necessary, all in Michael's name- standing up and defending a man who did not receive the respect in life that he deserved.

Side B is convinced that certain tracks are real despite it's production and that supporting this album is not only justified, but necessary, all in Michael's name- standing up and defending a man who did not receive the respect in life that he deserved.


Both sides are convinced the other side is not standing up to "defend the legacy of Michael Jackson".

I do dare to ask the question- aside from seeing his fans think for themselves (both sides are claiming to do just that!)- would he want us to torture one another with our pens over of a bunch of songs- or would he rather see us treat one another in the kindness that he himself never experienced?

Giving somebody the benefit of the doubt does not have to mean you're agreeing, or admitting weakness- it is the strength to simply assume that the other one might have come to their conclusion not because they are feeble minded, have no ears or are susceptible to mass hysteria- but that the other one might have arrived at their conclusion based on thinking and listening for themselves- just as you have.

Giving somebody the benefit of the doubt simply means to allow the other person to be a decent human being just as you assume yourself to be the same. And that the difference of opinion does not mean being less of a person.

Side A ('fake tracks') feels the deep need to act- that is a need from deep inside that needs to be respected. People need to act according to their conscience. By all means, write Sony, call Sony, organize yourselves. Do what you feel is right.

Side B ('real tracks') feels the deep need to act- that is a need from deep inside that needs to be respected. People need to act according to their conscience. By all means, buy the album, support the album, organize yourselves. Do what you feel is right.


But no side has the moral standing to shred somebody to bits and pieces the way Michael Jackson was shred to pieces, with a mind set that makes all these wars possible. If Michael Jackson fans are willing to tear one another to shreds over music (!!!)- imagine how easy it is to incite wars all over this planet.

Divide and conquer at it's best.

Diplomacy and Peace simply mean being able to disagree without violently forcing one another to see the world through the same eyes. It doesn't mean giving up, being lovey dovey without ability to put your money where your mouth is, or not taking a stand.
It simply means acting by listening to yourself, to your conscience without denying those that disagree with you the very same right.

While I am all for living peacefully in Michael's "Army of Love", I understand Michael's "Army of Love" to feature one major rule that no other army would ever feature: That the ability to think for yourself is not only welcomed, but exercised on a regular basis.

'The Army of Love' should pride itself on difference of opinion, of being the biggest group who march to the beat of their own internal drummer that makes them respect those that rave all night, while you and I may look like the last bastion of mikegasmic freaks in a circle with a big a** MJ shirt, blissfully punch drunk on a particular pair of pants, HD videos with great audio and carrying the seed of actually living the LOVE Michael spoke about.
While maintaining the respect for those, who chose to exercise the same right, maybe in a mosh pit ("We could put chairs there- they want festival seating") or square dancing.

I might not like your freakin' sunflower you carry because I might prefer roses, thistles or violets or Japanese Beetles- but they are all bleepin' plants we're waving around and the Japanese Beetles eat holes into any leaf, no matter how pretty. (hm, maybe thistles then...)

Michael spoke of 'Hope': "And without Hope, we are lost. See, that's a sign of Hope right there. " (Exeter Speech, UK, 2002)

MJholdingEarth.jpg


Makelovetoovercomeevil.jpg
 
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Re: Sunflowers or roses? Love when the going get rough.

Thank you for this. It's just what I needed right now.
 
Re: Sunflowers or roses? Love when the going get rough.

Side A ('fake tracks') feels the deep need to act- that is a need from deep inside that needs to be respected. People need to act according to their conscience. By all means, write Sony, call Sony, organize yourselves. Do what you feel is right.

Side B ('real tracks') feels the deep need to act- that is a need from deep inside that needs to be respected. People need to act according to their conscience. By all means, buy the album, support the album, organize yourselves. Do what you feel is right.
I guess in the end this part right here is simply what's got to happen. I also want to say that for some it's an ego thing and desire to lash out, but I think for many of us there's a feeling of betrayal by the others who aren't seeing (or hearing) what seems obvious to us. I know I sure feel that way. And that really hurts. We were all united in joy together at the thought of new music, after all we've been through together, and with this one act that joy has been torn apart. And that sucks. :(

I know this paragraph might get a little weird for some people :)giggle:), but what else is an Army of Love? It's also an Army of Light. How do you break apart and destroy a force of Love and Light, one that has the potential to take down shadow and darkness with positive energy? Well, or course, the best way is to divide them. Make them hate each other. Make them suspicious of each other. Get them to fight. Do whatever extreme is necessary to dissolve the glue that holds them together, that's what. From a 'spiritual warrior' viewpoint, this has been happening since Thriller... powers trying to pull us away from Michael, destroy him, confuse us, make us distrust him and each other, make us believe terrible things. And now, since... since you know when :cry:... we've become bigger targets without Michael here. Are we doing this to ourselves? Or is there a "they" out there encouraging it? It feels like that latter, but we're certainly playing into it of our own free will. And the more "they" can divide us, the more angry they can make us at each other, the more distrust and fear and hate (at each other, at everyone!) they can stir up, the smaller and smaller groups we break into and the weaker our force becomes until it's powerless to change the world. We can't let that happen! And now even Michael's music (the last sacred thing, so we thought) is the weapon. There wasn't much else to tear us up with at this point, so music was the last resort (I hope). And it really hurts. Especially in the past year and half, we've all needed each other SO MUCH. I couldn't have gotten through this without all of you. I'm guessing most of you feel the same. And there's more to come, unfortunately. :better:

As I write this I honestly still feel very angry about this situation. Really. And just like what Pace wrote above (the part I quoted), I have very strong belief about my "side" and yes, I will certainly continue with actions that I feel are right, that I feel I must do, because my conscience can't bear not to! And that's that. But I feel just as strongly that I don't want to lose all of you! We can't break apart yet again, into even more camps. :no: Truth runs marathons, so someday things will come out into the open. We can hope for next month, but it might be next year or even 10 years from now. But someday. So in the meantime I think we need to really focus on things that unite us. Maybe bite our tongues a bit more, muster up as much maturity as we can, continue with the actions our consciences guide us to do and remember the goal of healing the world... despite it all.

There are things we can do for LOVE upon which our opinion about the Cascio tracks doesn't come into play at all: We can enjoy hearing Michael (!!!) in HMH on Monday. We can hang out in the Legacy Team threads, or even write to those still slandering MJ as needed. We can think of buying toys for underpriviledged kids with Christmas rapidly approaching. We can do the Major Love Prayer (thread) that puts ALL these differences entirely aside and focuses on uniting as a force of love to send it through the world. (And this November 25th, lawdy do we need it!) I don't see what other choice we have as a community. As Michael also said at Exeter: "We must learn to live (with) and love each other before it's too late". Is it easy? No, lol, not always. And this is obviously a HELL of a test. Ouch. But then, nothing worthwhile is ever easy...

:group:
 
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Re: Sunflowers or roses? Love when the going get rough.

"Don't let no one get you down, keep moving on higher ground. Keep flying until you are the King of the hill. No force of nature can break your will to self- motivate. She said this face that you see is destined for history."

I agree. Michael stood for Light. By refusing the see the light in each other we extinguish it, period.

By denying one another the right to be off different opinion we deny each other our humanity. We're all the same.

It might seem like outer an outer force trying to break apart the glue that holds us all together- but we're doing an excellent job ourselves if it becomes so easy to sink into hatred.

If we can't overcome it now- when will we?
 
Re: Sunflowers or roses? Love when the going get rough.

Somehow my heart hurts. I even cried tears feeling the disrespect with which Michael's fans treat another. I'm that melodramatic.

"And with your pen you torture men, you'd crucify the Lord." Yes, indeed. Because we are all too willing to crucify one another with never ending loads that are firing from our pens.

So much talk about Love and upholding what all sides in this call "Michael's legacy". What is Michael's legacy? Healing the world with music? Or "winning" an argument by "MAKING THE 'OPPONENT' UNDERSTAND" your point of view at all cost? Until they weep before you pleading with you that they now see things your way?

Wars start this way. Exactly this way.
We look across this planet and shake our heads in disbelief why it is that countries are at war with one another, why it is possible that neighbor A seems to turn into an animal by walking over to neighbor B and slashing him to death. And we do this over and over again.

Not only do we disagree with one another- no, we fight 'til the very bitter end, feeling entitled to all actions to MAKE THE 'ENEMY' SEE THINGS OUR WAY, as if we were in a war.

That mindset makes wars possible. Because those neighbors who might have lived next to each other for years also feel they are entitled to take all 'final' action.

So, one side accuses those who are alright (or even support the tracks in question) with certain tracks of being naive sheep that need to rinse their ears, who are being blind sided by evil forces.

Side A on the other hand accuses Side B of being naive sheep and being easily susceptible to mass hysteria- and of being kill joys on top of that.


Both sides (with exceptions everywhere) are unified by feeling they are in the possession of truth and that they are both motivated to uphold what they call 'Michael's legacy' which again begs the question- what is his legacy?

Michael Jackson was sued frivolously countless times. Again and again and again, no mercy in sight.
Imagine the anxiety, pain, hurt and disappoint he must have felt rising inside of him each and every time his lawyers would inform him- 'Mr. Jackson, I hate to be the bearer of bad news, you are being sued by x,y and z.'
Who would ever want to pick up the phone yet again, turn the TV on or read another newspaper?

Yet how often did he actually sue somebody in return? Compared to the countless lawsuits and depositions he endured? In the wake of the most horrifying and searing pain he personally endured- his own personal pain, a pain that NOBODY could endure for him?
Did Michael Jackson stand up and say, now buddy, I am going to make you feel the same amount of pain that I had to endure until YOU scream the way I screamed inside and out?
Did he go out in the world looking to "avenge" his pain?
Or was he aware that the damage was done, that the pain was already inflicted- and that no amount of rage or action was going to take the pain from him?

Or was he looking for ways to help people heal themselves and thus the planet by seeking ways to love another as 'brothers', as he often said? Was he hoping that people could understand his pain and exercise true compassion by ceasing all action that would deliberately cause another pain?

This singular being left an imprint on my very essence that NOBODY has left. I read in books about them, I read in book about Gandhi- but this dude called Michael Jackson- he made me UNDERSTAND to a degree that freaks me out.
That is why people are here, beyond the music, beyond the dance. I could get 5 whole body tattoos (okay, I got one little one)- that's nothing compared to the way he got UNDER my skin to make me understand.
Not just his life and his light- but my very own. Your very own life and light.
Through his life and his music I learned more than any book could teach me.
His death left me standing at the edge of the swirling black hole, until this day. But it served a purpose. There's work to be done here.

True Peace does not mean having to "give into" the other side of an argument.
Peace simply means to be aware of the damage that that could or is being inflicted on someone if one insists with all might to MAKE the other one see your point. And it means being able to stop the firing so that nobody, bystander or involved, 'collateral damage' (how that word makes me hurt) or soldier- gets killed or hurt. It means stopping before it's too late to stop.

Side A is convinced that certain tracks are 'fake' and thus action is not only justified, but necessary, all in Michael's name- standing up and defending a man who did not receive the respect in life that he deserved.

Side B is convinced that certain tracks are real despite it's production and that supporting this album is not only justified, but necessary, all in Michael's name- standing up and defending a man who did not receive the respect in life that he deserved.


Both sides are convinced the other side is not standing up to "defend the legacy of Michael Jackson".

I do dare to ask the question- aside from seeing his fans think for themselves (both sides are claiming to do just that!)- would he want us to torture one another with our pens over of a bunch of songs- or would he rather see us treat one another in the kindness that he himself never experienced?

Giving somebody the benefit of the doubt does not have to mean you're agreeing, or admitting weakness- it is the strength to simply assume that the other one might have come to their conclusion not because they are feeble minded, have no ears or are susceptible to mass hysteria- but that the other one might have arrived at their conclusion based on thinking and listening for themselves- just as you have.

Giving somebody the benefit of the doubt simply means to allow the other person to be a decent human being just as you assume yourself to be the same. And that the difference of opinion does not mean being less of a person.

Side A ('fake tracks') feels the deep need to act- that is a need from deep inside that needs to be respected. People need to act according to their conscience. By all means, write Sony, call Sony, organize yourselves. Do what you feel is right.

Side B ('real tracks') feels the deep need to act- that is a need from deep inside that needs to be respected. People need to act according to their conscience. By all means, buy the album, support the album, organize yourselves. Do what you feel is right.


But no side has the moral standing to shred somebody to bits and pieces the way Michael Jackson was shred to pieces, with a mind set that makes all these wars possible. If Michael Jackson fans are willing to tear one another to shreds over music (!!!)- imagine how easy it is to incite wars all over this planet.

Divide and conquer at it's best.

Diplomacy and Peace simply mean being able to disagree without violently forcing one another to see the world through the same eyes. It doesn't mean giving up, being lovey dovey without ability to put your money where your mouth is, or not taking a stand.
It simply means acting by listening to yourself, to your conscience without denying those that disagree with you the very same right.

While I am all for living peacefully in Michael's "Army of Love", I understand Michael's "Army of Love" to feature one major rule that no other army would ever feature: That the ability to think for yourself is not only welcomed, but exercised on a regular basis.

'The Army of Love' should pride itself on difference of opinion, of being the biggest group who march to the beat of their own internal drummer that makes them respect those that rave all night, while you and I may look like the last bastion of mikegasmic freaks in a circle with a big a** MJ shirt, blissfully punch drunk on a particular pair of pants, HD videos with great audio and carrying the seed of actually living the LOVE Michael spoke about.
While maintaining the respect for those, who chose to exercise the same right, maybe in a mosh pit ("We could put chairs there- they want festival seating") or square dancing.

I might not like your freakin' sunflower you carry because I might prefer roses, thistles or violets or Japanese Beetles- but they are all bleepin' plants we're waving around and the Japanese Beetles eat holes into any leaf, no matter how pretty. (hm, maybe thistles then...)

Michael spoke of 'Hope': "And without Hope, we are lost. See, that's a sign of Hope right there. " (Exeter Speech, UK, 2002)

MJholdingEarth.jpg


Makelovetoovercomeevil.jpg
Great post.
 
Re: Sunflowers or roses? Love when the going get rough.

Thank you. Amazing post.
 
Amen.

We're here to support Michael's legacy, to show the world love and peace. I wish Michael was here to give the example, but he's not. And it's time for us to stand up and take over. We're his army of L.O.V.E. and we should act like it.
There's so many of us and together we have huge power. We need to support eachother, not slander eachother. We don't have to agree on everything, but we have the same goal. Fight for it!!! Make Michael proud of his army.

Hugs for all of you!!
 
I think we should rename this thread 'L.O.V.E.'....looks like this place needs a little more of it :heart:
 
The thread with love and michael in our heart

I just wanted to make this thread. Because we the fans are forgetting we must
enjoy this moment. I was dissapointed myself in Sony and the fake( vocals)
True of not true. I think we must think like michael. What do i mean with this. With LOVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!LOVE!!!!! LOVE!!!!! LOVE!!!!!
Take a look at This is it and take it in yet again!!!! With love we will break Sony at one moment when they indeed tricked us with michael the truth will come out at one Point.

BUT WHAT CAN WE DO!!!!!

LOVE!!!!!!!!!

ENJOY HIS MUSIC

BEST OF JOY
MUCH TOO SOON
BEHIND THE MASK
ANOTHER DAY
I LIKE THE WAY YOU LOVE ME
HOLLYWOOD TONIGHT

AND HOLD MY HAND!!!!!! SO MJ FANS UNITE AGAIN AND ENJOY THE MUSIC
DON'T HATE LOVE AND ENJOY HIS MUSIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
To all MJJC members (lovers and haters)

--SORRY FOR MY ENGLISH---

I am not going to make a thread to talk like everyone else says, but I think we should end this "war" and fell to rest and enjoy the new music we got and the old music.

To all the haters of this album, who even thinks to hire a expert to analyze the songs. Sorry guys, I understand the frustration if ya don't think it's michael.
I was thinking the same when it leaked. But now I actually think it's him, but just some EXTREMELY edited on the voice (Monster and Breaking News), but now I am thinking: WHO CARES?

We got a MJ album, is it good? Hmm, depends who you ask, but I think it's good. Not good enough if it was Michael who produced the CD (Because he is dead and if he was alive these songs whould never been released or at least, like this) But we got something NEW and I think we should enjoy ourself about that. This album will make more MJ fans on the younger generation, that means MJ music will continue in the future.

So to all haters: Maybe the next album will be better ? :) can we please end this stupid war? for Michael's sake? you think he wanted this? Fans vs. Fans? gosh
 
Re: To all MJJC members (lovers and haters)

I feel you, thx! We are all MJ fans. Can you feel it?

Love
 
Re: To all MJJC members (lovers and haters)

No, he didn't want fans vs fans. I never dreamed a day will come when the FANS who stood by a trial would bicker over these things...

We need to say "I love you" a little bit more..
 
Re: To all MJJC members (lovers and haters)

I agree with this
thanks for your point!
 
Re: To all MJJC members (lovers and haters)

Yes I agree also there have been a lot of statements on both sides saying Michael would not want this or Michael would not want that but really there is only one thing that we can all say we know that Michael would want 100% and that is for his children to be taken care of emotionally, physically and financially, and realistically with the alleged debts and creditors crawling out of the woodwork the only way to provide for them financially is to release previously unreleased material to put money into the estate to benefit them. It may not be how we want to hear it or how he would want to hear it but as a businessman he must have known that it would be that way.

I am sure I read or heard last year that he had left over 100 songs to be used for the benefit of his children, of course that may or may not be true but it would make sense. At the end of the day what is important are his children, not whether songs are completed to our approval, I for one am grateful to be hearing new music from him although I would prefer if there were songs fully completed by him ready to be released.

These are just my thoughts please dont flame me.
 
Re: To all MJJC members (lovers and haters)

Thankyou! And I agree with all of what you said. The worst part is that its some of Michael's fans that are going against it. I'm dont want to start anything but fans especially the ppl. from TINI need to stop saying the ALBUM isnt Michael cuz it clearly is!

Stop this craziness..


L.o.v.e.
Romi
 
Let's try to be willing to help and support other fellow fans, not to win any battles. This and no other place where fans gather should be a battle field.
Division and hate are the last things we need.
We need to stop talking and posting about L.O.V.E. and star writing and sharing our opinions in a way that shows that L.O.V.E. without even using the words. As 144,000 used to say in the forum months and moths ago: the phrase L.O.V.E. is being overused.
 
Let's try to be willing to help and support other fellow fans, not to win any battles. This and no other place where fans gather should be a battle field.
Division and hate are the last things we need.
We need to stop talking and posting about L.O.V.E. and star writing and sharing our opinions in a way that shows that L.O.V.E. without even using the words. As 144,000 used to say in the forum months and moths ago: the phrase L.O.V.E. is being overused.

I agree with you and 144,000. The word "love" and the word "hate" have been overused.

@PCR, It's very intelligent of you to say we should start sharing our views and expressing our opinions that shows love and respect. This is exactly what we need.

At the end of the day, this is a forum - a very diverse one indeed. Take a look to the flags people are flying. People are from different corner of the world. Some are typing in their second language. I'm typing in my second language myself. We bound to have different opinions. Just because we are debating doesn't mean we are arguing. Expressing our views without putting down each other is the key.

Writing the phrase "L.O.V.E" is meaningless if it doesn't come from our heart.
 
Because we love Michael. (I hope so)

Those of us who don't believe the cascio songs are him singing, are only trying to DEFEND Michael. Other fans are acting like we want to destroy things or rain on the 'michael' parade or something. We are simply DEFENDING from these three mysterious tracks all coincidentally from the same person, that's all.
 
I know we are here for Michael but people should understand how differently people handle their love for him and his passing. I think we should just get used to that still in 2040 and later there will be fans who say 'they wish he was here', and everytime a new material comes out 'it's so sad', and that 'i can't listen it because he didn't finish it'. Or there will be fans who believe Jason Malachi is hired to sing some songs until he is 90 years old. It's just a fact there will be fans like that. But if you just ignore it and focus on his music and think positive, his communities are much better places. Keep your head up, not down.
 
Re: To all MJJC members (lovers and haters)

No, he didn't want fans vs fans. I never dreamed a day will come when the FANS who stood by a trial would bicker over these things...

We need to say "I love you" a little bit more..

agree lets enjoy michael album other things at christmas
peace wish you all a merry christmas
 
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