MOST SELLING ARTIST OF ALL TIME? wth??

What's there to explain? It's always going to be a debate. Numbers are hard to prove. Those are he numbers they got from credible sources. They've all certainly sold more than what is officially credited to them.
 
This again? I don't know why anybody cares about these lists. Nobody knows how much anybody has sold. Sales are just numbers put out by record companies for publicity purposes. They can't be verified or proven. The RIAA is a sham, they don't track anything and neither does Soundscan.
 
Didn't Michael got some rewords and similar as most selling artist of all time or similar ?

He sold more records than any other artist in world :S

No sense -.-'
 
Please an somebody explain me this :


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_music_artists

I thought MJ sold more record than any other artist in world ???

Em i wrong ???


Much LOVE,
Boris

at the top, it says 'claimed sales'. it's wiki, which is always a place for debate. opinions vary on what is a 'credible' source. and you're right. MJ was the first to make an appearance in Guiness Book, under that category. certain folks are going to keep bringing this up and revising it, hoping to revise history, and make MJ fans miserable. Thriller did what it did, and nothing can take that away. all the artists out there, want to create another 'Thriller'. there's satisfaction enough, in that. I don't see today's artists, wanting to create another some other artist's album, nearly as much and as mass. even the media, is making Thriller the standard bearer, everytime they write their articles, vaunting their latest artist. i don't see them doing that with the Eagles' greatest Hits. the biggest artists out today want to make videos fashioned after Michael's. that should tell you something. obviously, the industry thinks that that is the blueprint to be the best seller, for the last 25 plus years. there's your evidence. who wants a blueprint for second best?. they all must agree on it, then, despite these constant lists. nuff said.

if you ever want unshakeable evidence of who is the best selling at something, watch who the competitors have in their commercials, who is the blueprint, who is the subject of most jealousy-based comments. because it's human nature to make a blueprint for the person you want to overtake. and that person usually is at number 1. in restaurants, it's McDonalds. in music, it's Michael Jackson.

i realized that, when i went to a McDonalds, and tasted their food, and found it to be good(i had no dog in the fight). yet, i would always hear people say bad things about the food. and i wondered why. now, i know why. the only person or company you're ever jealous of, is the person, or company in first place. if people don't want us to know who is number 1, then they should stop acting jealous, stop using them as a blueprint. but human nature will always betray that effort, thankfully.

the outward jealous attacks against Michael, didn't happen, until he surpassed the Beatles and Elvis, in sales, as he said.

plus there are so many other factors: more people of more backgrounds, from more parts of the world, than ever before, uniting to Michael...people buying genres never bought before(and still hating those genres), via Michael albums, more media buying his music, so they can like and then blast it in critiques, than ever before with any artist(s), etc...he's the best selling of all time. he's in a stratosphere that no other artist can be in, as we know...and he breaks all the rules that applies to other artists, including how much radio airplay he needs. that has always been true.
 
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This again? I don't know why anybody cares about these lists..

Well someone, obviously, does otherwise these lists would not have been bothered to be created and compiled in the first place. Just because you may not give a damn about it doesn't mean that you have to question someone else for doing so. As no one is questioning your decision to not give a damn about it.

To answer the question though, Wikipedia is full of shoddy information, at best. Though, prior to Soundscan it was hard to track numbers as such so anything predating it is still questionable, at best, for all parties. For example, there's no hard proof to the Beatles or Elvis sold anywhere near a billion and Abba's numbers are way off. Apparently, some people have been complaining of the fact that they can't update MJ's sales due to the mods over at wiki, but who knows? There are many chart communities across the web who have taken the time to track sales of numerous artists from around the world. Going through some of their research you will get a better perspective of some realistic sales.

But, yes, the Beatles have sold more, but I'm not sure about Elvis. Either way, it's because their sales include singles, as well as the other insane amount of albums they have. Elvis, alone has about 100+ albums to his name. Though, on average, MJ sells more p/unit than they do.
 
Why do I care what other people have bought? These numbers prove nothing. The best of them all is self-evident as such, and his name is Michael Jackson.
 
Well someone, obviously, does otherwise these lists would not have been bothered to be created and compiled in the first place. Just because you may not give a damn about it doesn't mean that you have to question someone else for doing so. As no one is questioning your decision to not give a damn about it.
What something has sold or not has nothing to do with music, just a marketing department and payola. A record company with a lot of money and connections can make just about anything sell a lot, and they do. What difference does it make if somebody sold more than somebody else? If you know anything about how the record industry works, those sales statistics are phony. The record companies have always either under reported, over reported, or not reported sales at all depending on what their agenda is. Sometimes they also buy thousands of their own records to spike the charts. When the record clubs like Columbia Club (12 albums for a penny!) existed, those didn't count as sales and neither did "cutout" albums in stores that were sold cheap. James Brown has said King Records wouldn't tell him what he sold to get out of paying royalties. Prince said he doesn't know what he's sold, only what Warner Brothers told him and that they wouldn't let him look at the books. There's those "mysterious" sales jumps of The Eagles Greatest Hits 1 in the 1990's, RCA claiming Elvis sold a billion, or Sony claiming Thriller has sold 104 million when a few years before it had only sold around 52 million according to them. Anybody can put out numbers that don't mean anything. Nobody can prove what a record has sold. If RCA says Elvis Presley sold a billion, you can't prove that, nor can it be proven that he didn't. You don't know if RCA is telling the truth or not. The RIAA doesn't track sales, they only give out awards based on what the companies tells them. Reporting to them is a voluntary thing, it's not required. When Berry Gordy ran Motown, he never reported what his acts sold to the RIAA. So there's no reason to take these sales statistics seriously.
 
it's logical to assume that if an artist can musically survive the onslaught from media that Michael survived, that he's the frontrunner. fans chasing him, in the midst of his darkest times, to the point where he couldn't go outside, without a fan rush. all the other artists didn't have that musical priveledge toward their later years. both McCartney and Elvis kept putting stuff out, musically without taking a break. Micihael essentially stopped putting out albums in the later years, but he still couldn't go outside without the fans rushing to meet him. the rest of the artists had a much easier time walking the streets in their much later years. the other artists got more help from the media. that says something. the other major artists wish they could get that kind of fan support WITH media support. it obviously got to the point where MJ fans were called 'delusional' on a widespread basis, around the world, for supporting him, no matter what, more than any of the other major artists, in history, even by others who came on the fansites. these fans aren't going to show that kind of support and not buy his music. it's an obvious 9000 pound elephant in the room.
 
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We know MJ is number one. No need to get upset. Also, I see nothing wrong with the numbers provided, but the problem is, many different sources claim many different things. You basically have to guesstimate. Again, no need for anyone to get upset. Michael Jackson is clearly the best selling solo artist of all time. EASILY.
 
well..lol...when MJ fans are pelted with revisionist history as often as they are, it's bound to ruffle a few feathers...i'd think it's understandable..
 
Reason im asking this is cause i kinda have feeling that since MJ is gone they are trying to take credits from him ..... Rihana says : Ill make better album than Thriller ! buahahahahah xDDD RIGHT .....only thing she can do is shake her as*

and so on ....before i could easily find reliable information that MJ sold more records than any other artist ...(Evils or Beatles ) ...and now its like horror ...i cant find that information ....

Something smells bad ....
 
The problem is that no one actually counts the sales of albums and singles...........


...........Of course, I wouldn't want to be the one to actually attempt a such job!!!......


...........But having actual production figures much exist somewhere.......
...........I would think that these companies wouldn't over produce vinyl's and CD's to the extent that the majority of the copies won't sell..........the idea is to make money not lose it.........
...........So production figures should show an indication of demand for the music!!!!!!
 
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Reason im asking this is cause i kinda have feeling that since MJ is gone they are trying to take credits from him ..... Rihana says : Ill make better album than Thriller ! buahahahahah xDDD RIGHT .....only thing she can do is shake her as*

and so on ....before i could easily find reliable information that MJ sold more records than any other artist ...(Evils or Beatles ) ...and now its like horror ...i cant find that information ....

Something smells bad ....

your sense of smell works really well. some people might not want to admit it, but all of us have a sense of things that we can't see. we have that sense in knowing who is the greatest selling artist of all time. we know it in our hearts. but a lot of times, we are beat down by media peer pressure and other sources.
to add to what i said in the previous post, there are other x factors that contribute to Michael being number 1. the rebellion factor. Michael is the most crucified artist in media history. and that's not an exaggerative word. and, also..he is the first artist to get it for NO REASON AT ALL.

so...based on that alone, he is the best selling artist of all time. why? because of his 'overzealous' 'lunatic' 'delusional' fans. there are more of us than the media wants to imagine. and even fellow fans get irritated at that, sometimes. but you know what? those so called overzealous fans have the human nature spirit of rebellion. among all the other factors that can sell records for an artist, there is the need to rebel against the enemies of that artist. and what's the greatest way to rebel? buy the music of that artist. and who is going to buy it the most? the 'overzealous' fans. more of those for Michael than any other artist in history, or else, there wouldn't have been such official complaints about it in mass mainstream media, to the effect it was. and, add to that, that the enemies attacked MJ for NOTHING. that adds fuel to the rebellion fire. so..fans will get multiple copies of MJ music just for that reason alone. i know i did, and i know i am not alone. it's one thing to rebel against the enemies of an artist, when you know that artist did something wrong, to stir controversy, but you love that artist anyway, and you get that artist's music. but when the artist is attacked for no reason? the fans say 'oh no you didn't!!!' and then they spend the money, big time. we know this is true. and MJ's fanbase is so big and great, that a backlash against him from media in the united states, which, admittedly, is full of itself, in relation to the rest of the world..tending to think that there is them and nobody else(and this is NOT a reflection on the FANS in the united states). i know it, unfortunately. i have heard the media talk. this didn't put a dent in Michael Jackson's saleability, because he is loved throuhgout the WORLD. and usa media resented that, and i witnessed usa media looking down their nose at citizens from other countries..saying things like..'well..of course he sells overseas, but not HERE.' now..come on...you can hear the arrogance in that statement. now please, don't blast the usa, itself, because of what i said. i'm just the messenger here, and the usa fans are not at fault for their media's behavior. i'm just stating this for the sake of Michael's legacy. i have to say what really happened. but because of that, i've heard fans who would say, that they became fans BECAUSE of the attacks against him by media. so, when they became fans, they bought his music. that's just one more of many factors that contributed to Michael's sales. so, if you expect the media to release the truth about MJ's sales, you'll have to wait the rest of your life.
meanwhile, like i said..the rebellion factor, alone, makes MJ the greatest selling artist of all time. then there's the money factor. many fans realizing how MJ's enemies used him for money. that's enough for fans to buy an album, HISTory, just to get the song 'Money'.

i could go on. but MJ is number 1 seller, all time. adversity is MJ's greatest friend, when it comes to sales. these other big names aren't getting that flack right now , to MJ's extent, and we all know it.

I really enjoy your comments 144,000, lol

thanks for your kind words. cus i sure got people who don't like me. lol
 
What something has sold or not has nothing to do with music, just a marketing department and payola. A record company with a lot of money and connections can make just about anything sell a lot, and they do. What difference does it make if somebody sold more than somebody else? If you know anything about how the record industry works, those sales statistics are phony. The record companies have always either under reported, over reported, or not reported sales at all depending on what their agenda is. Sometimes they also buy thousands of their own records to spike the charts. When the record clubs like Columbia Club (12 albums for a penny!) existed, those didn't count as sales and neither did "cutout" albums in stores that were sold cheap. James Brown has said King Records wouldn't tell him what he sold to get out of paying royalties. Prince said he doesn't know what he's sold, only what Warner Brothers told him and that they wouldn't let him look at the books. There's those "mysterious" sales jumps of The Eagles Greatest Hits 1 in the 1990's, RCA claiming Elvis sold a billion, or Sony claiming Thriller has sold 104 million when a few years before it had only sold around 52 million according to them. Anybody can put out numbers that don't mean anything. Nobody can prove what a record has sold. If RCA says Elvis Presley sold a billion, you can't prove that, nor can it be proven that he didn't. You don't know if RCA is telling the truth or not. The RIAA doesn't track sales, they only give out awards based on what the companies tells them. Reporting to them is a voluntary thing, it's not required. When Berry Gordy ran Motown, he never reported what his acts sold to the RIAA. So there's no reason to take these sales statistics seriously.

Oh yeah, thanks for your opinion, but that's not really the issue here. The point is that someone cares and you are really in no position to constantly criticize them, b/c you may disagree it. It is their business.

If you don't like it, then do the mature thing & just ignore it. There's nothing more annoying than someone who comes into a thread and tries to dictate what people should & should not be posting based on their own ideals. Also,some of the points you brought up have been explained quite a few times. Example, the Eagles one happened back btwn 93-95 when the RIAA changed their rules which included free bonus shipments and alternative markets. The Eagles weren't the only ones who saw ahuge increase in RIAA shipments when Soundscan sales didn't reflect such numbers. There is proof of this as it was reported on & their were articles published.

Maybe a little research might help every once in a while?
 
The U.S Sales are his downfall. He's outsold both The Beatles and Elvis in the UK and many other places.
 
i have a hard time with the comment about the usa. i'm sure i'm not the only usa citizen who bought multiple copies of Invincible.......and for other usa fans, that, or maybe his other albums..
i know i'm far from the only 'fanatic' in the usa. but i don't expect media to support MJ, here. and quite frankly, i don't expect them to release true figures in this country. anything can be printed on a website, and i'm sure the riaa isn't going to chase the media around in circles to hold them in check. i'm sure they think they got better things to do.

again, i'm sure that i am far from the only fan in the usa, who feels the way i do about Michael. i'm sure, if i confronted many usa fans, and told them, i was Michael's number 1 fan, i'm sure they'd have a hard time, hearing that come out of my mouth.
 
Maybe a little research might help every once in a while?
I have studied the music industry for years, that's how I know that Soundscan (which is not international) doesn't work and about what counts for sales and what doesn't, and the scams the industry runs on their acts, labels used as a front for drug dealing (Rap A Lot), shady bookkeeping, the mafia running a lot of the labels behind the scenes, that the RIAA doesn't track sales, the industry blackballing performers, etc. For example, in the USA, platinum is sales of 1 million copies. But a double CD only has to sell 500,000 to get a platinum award because each disc is counted separately, so it is considered selling a million (500,000x2). A 4 disc box set only has to sell 250,000. Outkast's Speakerboxx/Love Below double CD was certified diamond (10 million) in the USA, but based on reported sales of around 5 million. Prince released an album called Musicology in 2004. Prince gave away the album with every concert ticket to his tour. If a family of four bought tickets, then they got 4 CDs. He had it set up for the album to chart in Billboard to get platinum. There was a version sold in stores with artwork (the giveaway version was just in a plain cardboard cover), but most of the "sales" were the giveaways, that people who attending the concerts had no choice in recieving. But afterward, Billboard discontinued this one time policy.

If you believe whatever the labels say a record sold, that is your business. But if the numbers are real, why don't they let the acts check the books? Why have the labels, managers, & promoters ripped off the acts for decades? Why have acts like Don Henley, Prince, Little Richard, Bonnie Raitt, Teena Marie, B.B. King, Terence Trent D'Arby, and many others have either protested or spoken out on industry tactics? Teena Marie even has a law named after her, after she sued Motown. The record industry is a business like any other, and they're not always known for being honest.
 
thanks for your kind words. cus i sure got people who don't like me. lol

144,000: i like many of your posts too. i found them to be very intelligent. i actually am your follower. you are more liked than you know. :cheeky:

back on topic, we all know deep in our hearts that no one but michael jackson is more beloved by people all over the world. elvis and the beatles are big in the western world. but, michael can unite people of different cultures. my mother, who is 63 year-old, does not speak english. she doesn't listen to pop music. but, she responds to michael. she enjoys watching his concerts and listening to his ballads. she doesn't understand any single word but she feels the emotion. that's the power and magic of michael.

michael's music has uncanny ability to touch people's hearts. that's why it sold so many records and keeps selling.

the media (at least the media in the U.S.) will never give michael his due credit. but, i don't need the media to tell me who's the most successful and best selling. i know who he is. his name is michael jackson.
 
144,000: i like many of your posts too. i found them to be very intelligent. i actually am your follower. you are more liked than you know. :cheeky:

back on topic, we all know deep in our hearts that no one but michael jackson is more beloved by people all over the world. elvis and the beatles are big in the western world. but, michael can unite people of different cultures. my mother, who is 63 year-old, does not speak english. she doesn't listen to pop music. but, she responds to michael. she enjoys watching his concerts and listening to his ballads. she doesn't understand any single word but she feels the emotion. that's the power and magic of michael.

michael's music has uncanny ability to touch people's hearts. that's why it sold so many records and keeps selling.

the media (at least the media in the U.S.) will never give michael his due credit. but, i don't need the media to tell me who's the most successful and best selling. i know who he is. his name is michael jackson.

thanks so much. it warms my heart what you say. ***hugs*** to you people

yeah..and your post..right on target.

i know people would love to say, 'well sure...you MJ fanatics..like we're supposed to go by your emotional attachment and no facts?'

well..normally, on most subjects, people might have a point. but not here. Because Michael embodies qualities that are no threat to any of his fans. and i don't just mean the fans that peers consider to be untouchable..but people that are downtrodden. a downtrodden person might feel scared to meet Elvis Presley, or John Lennon, or Paul McCartney. I saw Paul, once, and how high brow he acted around a fellow producer. How in the world would a downtrodden person feel trying to meet him??

Michael has qualities that represent people that feel like they could never be good enough to meet anyone of any real stature. There are so many of those people in this world. soooo many. And I would venture that Michael is the first artist they truly fell in love with. Because he is them. He represents the insecurity in all of us, better than any other artist, ever before. Other artists just feel like they don't have those qualities. It feels like they're abit above us, which is why we are so shocked if they have problems. But when Michael had trials, it's almost as if we knew he was vulnerable. Not because we thought he was a bad guy..cus we didn't think that...but because he had a vulnerable nature about him. So, that is what makes emotion become evidence, for the first time. Evidence that Michael is the best seller of all time.

Now, when he escaped so many traps, that was just the quality of magic. He had the uncanny ability to mix vulnerability with magic, without seeming above us. But when he died, the way we related to his vulnerability was truly summed up, with what one fan said of people that hate him. 'If you don't like Michael Jackson, you probably don't like puppies or kittens, either'.

You're not going to say that about any other artist, no matter how much you love them. you may grieve greatly, but you're not going to make that kind of comparison with other major known artists. We are all that helpless child. so we all bought his music.

And again, there is that MAGIC. nobody escapes magic. magic makes you buy what you otherwise would not buy, even if you hate him. No other artist had that MAGIC, but Michael. We saw how people reacted every time he went outside. And that includes people who said they would not react that way, because i've seen it in action. you don't have control over that magic. enough people who humbled themselves for a moment enough to say it, have spoken strongly of his 'charisma'. that's the magic. his 'aura'. that's the magic. that's why there are some people who buy the music, or attended the concerts...then, criticized him. If he didn't have the magic, then they would have criticized him, and not buy the music, and not attend the concert. And, of course, not flock passionately to him, when he went outside. It's a no brainer that all those things go hand in hand. flock him, buy the music, attend the concert. IF there is magic. that puppy kitten magic connection, by the way, makes people want to own a piece of him. and the many 'fanatics' actually WANT to buy his music, because they care about doing it right. then there's that little matter about, for the most part, people being detached to other artists, and are to the point where they prefer to illegally download. so...lol....the industry can't go about lying, and saying that all these other artists, sell above Michael, then, in the same breath, as indicated in another thread, just now put in this section...complain about the decline of the industry, and blame it on the consumers pirating music. it's either one or the other, so...gotcha, anti Michael Jackson stats people, in the industry.
 
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This again? I don't know why anybody cares about these lists. Nobody knows how much anybody has sold. Sales are just numbers put out by record companies for publicity purposes. They can't be verified or proven. The RIAA is a sham, they don't track anything and neither does Soundscan.

What something has sold or not has nothing to do with music, just a marketing department and payola. A record company with a lot of money and connections can make just about anything sell a lot, and they do. What difference does it make if somebody sold more than somebody else? If you know anything about how the record industry works, those sales statistics are phony. The record companies have always either under reported, over reported, or not reported sales at all depending on what their agenda is. Sometimes they also buy thousands of their own records to spike the charts. When the record clubs like Columbia Club (12 albums for a penny!) existed, those didn't count as sales and neither did "cutout" albums in stores that were sold cheap. James Brown has said King Records wouldn't tell him what he sold to get out of paying royalties. Prince said he doesn't know what he's sold, only what Warner Brothers told him and that they wouldn't let him look at the books. There's those "mysterious" sales jumps of The Eagles Greatest Hits 1 in the 1990's, RCA claiming Elvis sold a billion, or Sony claiming Thriller has sold 104 million when a few years before it had only sold around 52 million according to them. Anybody can put out numbers that don't mean anything. Nobody can prove what a record has sold. If RCA says Elvis Presley sold a billion, you can't prove that, nor can it be proven that he didn't. You don't know if RCA is telling the truth or not. The RIAA doesn't track sales, they only give out awards based on what the companies tells them. Reporting to them is a voluntary thing, it's not required. When Berry Gordy ran Motown, he never reported what his acts sold to the RIAA. So there's no reason to take these sales statistics seriously.

... so again.... its WIKIpedia and they require the so-called official sources and validity of the entries, but on the other hand they let people add whatever info about never-existing and not officially verified "numbers".

and... if any MJ fan wants to change something in MJs favour based on lets say public statements of Sony or articles, they block or censor the "updates".

Its the conscious censorship.

MJs record sales is based on proved statistics, Id say on the most reliable chart performances... not only estimates.... like in Elvis or the Beatles, or Crosby or Sinatra album sales...

So just try to add these your comments to a discussion or a wiki info page of the best sellers....
 
^^^^I don't use wiki. I don't really get much information from the internet unless it's about something obscure that can't be found in the library or regular bookstores. I read actual books. I also know a person in the music business. If anybody can edit something, what use is it? :D
 
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