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How the media portrays MJ's fans

analogue

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Does anyone else here hate the way the media potrays Michael Jackson fans? They potray us as these bunch of insane raving lunatics who think of Michael as our lord and savior. This makes it hard for us to defend Michael againts people who thinks he's guilty because alot of reactions you get is ''Oh your just an insane Michael Jackson fan, so listening to you is a waste of time''

Does this frustrate anyone else?
 
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Re: How the media protrays MJ's fans

If they dismiss your arguments because you are a fan and not address the arguments themselves then they are the irrational ones.

Obviously a lot depends on what kind of fan they are facing. If a fan says "Michael was innocent because I like his music/because he did a lot of charity/because I know it in my heart" etc. then those are obviously not very good arguments for the public and in that case they are right to dismiss you as someone who is basing his judgments on emotions rather than facts. But the facts are also on our side, fans can educate themselves about them and show through facts and with logical arguments why Michael was innocent. If they dismiss those kind of arguments just because you are a fan then they are the irrational ones and those who base their judgment on emotions, not wanting to hear any argument contrary to their prejudiced opinions. Therefore they attack the messenger instead of addressing the points of your argument. It's basically a logical fallacy called ad hominem attack.
 
Ah the media's wrong. They're the real lunatics, not us and they just wanna brush us the wrong way. I'd just spit right at their faces for disrespecting us.
 
You know the media bullied Michael for over 30yrs call him all kind of names, and now they are doing the same thing to Michael fans, and we should be afaird to speak out because they might call us out of our names. I say speak out, speat up and speak loud. the media are BULLIES and thats how we should refer to them as BULLIES.
 
I find fascinatingly hypocrit how the madia are making nowadays campaigns worldwide againsts bullying when they were and still part of the most monstuous crusade to bully and vilify Michael! :puke:
They think we are out of our minds for being passionate and defend Michael with tooth and nail againts bullshit spread by them but to me is even sicker and vile to make up the most twisted, weirdest stories to make look that person like a freak.
 
respect77;3724391 said:
If they dismiss your arguments because you are a fan and not address the arguments themselves then they are the irrational ones.

Obviously a lot depends on what kind of fan they are facing. If a fan says "Michael was innocent because I like his music/because he did a lot of charity/because I know it in my heart" etc. then those are obviously not very good arguments for the public and in that case they are right to dismiss you as someone who is basing his judgments on emotions rather than facts. But the facts are also on our side, fans can educate themselves about them and show through facts and with logical arguments why Michael was innocent. If they dismiss those kind of arguments just because you are a fan then they are the irrational ones and those who base their judgment on emotions, not wanting to hear any argument contrary to their prejudiced opinions. Therefore they attack the messenger instead of addressing the points of your argument. It's basically a logical fallacy called ad hominem attack.
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You are absolutely right. I agree with you 100%. But the sad fact is we hear everywhere MJ fans saying "I know it in my heart" ... Every time I hear or read it online I despair, saying : Michael would be still misunderstood because of their sentimentalism/irrationalism that lead to nowhere but misunderstanding if not contempt… Who could correct misunderstandings and misjudgment if not the fans? But if the majority remains in their sentimentalism/irrationalism, Michael will be still misjudged, misunderstood in the future as he was and he is. We should learn to think and express logically and efficiently.
 
laeticia.fr;3724482 said:
You are absolutely right. I agree with you 100%. But the sad fact is we hear everywhere MJ fans saying "I know it in my heart" ... Every time I hear or read it online I despair, saying : Michael would be still misunderstood because of their sentimentalism/irrationalism that lead to nowhere but misunderstanding if not contempt… Who could correct misunderstandings and misjudgment if not the fans? But if the majority remains in their sentimentalism/irrationalism, Michael will be still misjudged, misunderstood in the future as he was and he is. We should learn to think and express logically and efficiently.
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Exactly. Those fans take it for granted that everyone knows how wonderful Michael is. If you are going to defend him by saying "I know Michael would never do something like that, he's not that kind of person!" you might as well say nothing. We don't know Michael is innocent - we can't possibly know this unless we were in the same room with him when the alleged molestations occured - we believe he is innocent because all the evidence points to that direction. It's important to make this distinction because no rational person is going to be convinced by sentimental arguments. People don't care about how "nice" Michael was to his fans, that is no reason to believe he couldn't have molested those boys. If we truly want to convince people of Michael's innocence, we need to stick to rational, evidence-based arguments and leave out our personal feelings regarding Michael because they are irrelevant. Also, we shouldn't assume that everyone who thinks he's guilty is a "hater". In my experience, many of them are just misinformed and will change their mind in light of better arguments, they were just never invested enough to look for the evidence themselves. You will accomplish nothing by calling people "jealous" or "haters" or talking about how sweet and sexy Michael was, people will just dismiss you as a rabid fan and rightly so. We have the evidence on our side, why not use it to our advantage? If the overwhelming evidence for Michael's innocence doesn't convince them, it is clear that they are the irrational ones and there is no point in arguing with them.

“If someone doesn’t value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide that proves they should value evidence? If someone doesn’t value logic, what logical argument would you invoke to prove they should value logic?” - Sam Harris

However, you might still convince people who are not actively participating in the conversation so it is always good to correct misinformation when you see it!
 
There's a couple glaring reasons for the unflattering portrayal of Michael Jackson fans. One reason being that there are many fans who just make it too easy for others to label them as "raving lunactics" by, at times, presenting themselves as such.

Another reason would be the fact that the fans are among the most threatening to those seeking to perpetuate the various fallacies and falshoods pertaining to Michael. The dedicated fans are the ones who have consistently educated themselves on Michael Jackson by doing something as deceivingly simple as actual research into actual facts.

Opposers of Michael (and the media, by and large) can and will use anything against him (and by proxy, you) that they can. Always be conscious of that when you're out there presenting yourself as a Michael Jackson fan.
 
i smirked when i saw the thread title before i entered the thread, because i knew what you were going to say and that you are right. the media acts like any envious person, because that's what they are, so there's no reason to change who you are. They are like people who bully Paris. Nuff said.

There's nothing you can or should do about an envious person. And, after all, if they're envious, it's always because the subject of envy has a good thing that the one doing the envying, wish they had.
 
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Because the most vocal fans, the ones that draw attention to themselves, are pretty much all complete idiots, making the rest of us look bad. It's that simple, really. That's how stereotypes come to be.
 
MJelboo said:
Because the most vocal fans, the ones that draw attention to themselves, are pretty much all complete idiots, making the rest of us look bad. It's that simple, really. That's how stereotypes come to be.
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i don't think that's a fair statement. after all, throughout history, stereotypes were made based on racism and many other things, without merit.

There isn't a successful artist who doesn't have overly vocal fans, which is a harmless thing. And there are acts that have dangerous fans..like Guns and Roses, who once had fans throw things at the stage. Michael's never had fans throw things on stage at him. Only MJ's enemies did things to him. Jarvis Cocker was an enemy.

So, there's only one reason for the media verbally bullying MJ fans....jealousy. The media has always been jealous. They could never remove the one thing that is important to an artist. The fans. They could never stop Michael's fans from being Michael's fans. And that is the sole reason for the unmerited negative moniker the media gives the MJ fans. I've never seen in the history of music, a greater attempt to remove every advantage from an artist, as the media has attempted to do from Michael(and, for no reason)...radio airplay, lying about sales to attempt to discourage people from buying MJ's music...slander, bullying..and finally the travesty of a trial based on a tabloid tv show. Any fan that doesn't hurt because of that, doesn't have a pulse. And that's all the fans did...hurt. And for that, the media calls them crazy?

That's Bull****

The law of the universe is every action causes an equal and opposite reaction..whether that reaction is one nation hitting back at another nation in war, or the resolute stallwart peaceful stance of never moving from their position, of Martin Luther King Jr. and his followers.
Why was King shot? Because he wouldn't move from his position of standing for what he believed in. Yet he was peaceful throughout his life. His enemies were frustrated, and obviously went overboard with what they thought of him. Yet he wasn't crazy.

That's MJ fans. They're not crazy. It's just impossible to change their minds. They are peaceful. They just can't get their minds changed. That's what makes the media go overboard. Nothing else.

If the media were successful at changing the minds of fans, then the media wouldn't call them crazy, because the media would have accomplished their goal, no matter what kind of personality the fans had.

Sometimes it's easy to forget what horrors Michael was put through, and therefore easily dismiss his resulting human-with-a-heart grieving fans as 'crazy'.

If Michael wasn't as successful as he was/is, then, no matter how fans behaved, the media wouldn't call them crazy.

"The bigger the success, the bigger the target" -Michael Jackson

and that includes his fans(an extension of him)being a bigger target.

And that doesn't let the media/MJ-MJ fan haters off the hook.

The hateful effort launched against MJ and his fans would have removed any other group of fans from any other artist. But MJ's fans are still MJ's fans, despite it all. Hence the media's horrible unmerited attitude toward MJ's fans.
 
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I don't really care. At least online when it comes to defending Michael, you have the option of not revealing you're a fan. And yes, there are a fair few fans that don't represent the fan community very well or they simply fail to defend their points with facts.
 
cmstrike said:
There's a couple glaring reasons for the unflattering portrayal of Michael Jackson fans. One reason being that there are many fans who just make it too easy for others to label them as "raving lunactics" by, at times, presenting themselves as such.

Another reason would be the fact that the fans are among the most threatening to those seeking to perpetuate the various fallacies and falshoods pertaining to Michael. The dedicated fans are the ones who have consistently educated themselves on Michael Jackson by doing something as deceivingly simple as actual research into actual facts.

Opposers of Michael (and the media, by and large) can and will use anything against him (and by proxy, you) that they can. Always be conscious of that when you're out there presenting yourself as a Michael Jackson fan.
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This.

In some cases the criticism is valid, in other cases it's the media's way to dismiss valid arguments by suggesting just because you are a fan you cannot be right. Diane Dimond does the latter a lot. She can never dismiss fans' arguments with facts, so she often brings up the "MJ fans are crazy and rabid and therefore their arguments shouldn't be listened to" card. When in fact it's her who is the irrational and biased one in these discussions.
 
Well, sometimes fans or..should I say obsessive creeps behave in such ways that they give other people reasons to portray all of us that way.. I've read stuff from such people and heck, even I want to punch them. But, for the majority of the really educated MJ fan community the nickname of raving lunatics isn't quite fitting. As for myself, I've done quite a few assignment papers explaining and giving my point of view as to why I believe Michael was innocent (with facts) and explaining how much of an inspiration he's been..the most rewarding thing is having teachers telling me that they agree with me and that they enjoy my work. So, Michael fans should use known FACTS as arguments when it's time to defend themselves from media and/or general public attacks, not just subjective stuff because if they do so, then they (we) will always be the target for anyone who put Michael through hell..something he, for sure, hated.

"Insult me all you want. Judge me as much as you want. Say what you think. Everything you want but one thing: Don't touch my fans.”-
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